Suspect Formemons Suspect #1: Mega Rayquaza

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:SV/Rayquaza-Mega: MEGA RAYQUAZA SUSPECT :SV/Rayquaza-Mega:

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Mega Rayquaza has easily been the most controversial presence in Formemons despite not benefitting much from the mechanics of the tier. As such, the council has decided to suspect it.

Mega Rayquaza is by far the strongest offensive Pokemon in the tier thanks to its absurd offensive stats, excellent Flying STAB complemented by coverage options like Earthquake, setup options like Dragon Dance, and a very powerful Extreme Speed. This leaves it with very few defensive answers, especially considering the several options it has. Bulky Arceus formes that can live a +1 Dragon Ascent from full are outsped and 2HKOed by Choice Band variants, while fast Arceus formes are OHKOed by boosted DD sets. Other would-be checks Skarmory and Corviknight can get incinerated by mixed Overheat. Mega Rayquaza also boasts useful defensive utility, capable of soft checking dangerous threats like Primal Groudon, Primal Kyogre, and numerous frailer Pokemon like Mega Mewtwo Y thanks to Extreme Speed. Terastallization further amplifies its potential, with Mega Rayquaza being one of, if not the best user of the mechanic. Tera Normal boosts Extreme Speed to obscene levels, Tera Flying turns Dragon Ascent into a nuke while offering Mega Rayquaza no weaknesses, Tera Ghost prevents opposing Mega Rayquaza and Arceus from revenge-killing it, and other miscellaneous Tera types such as Ground and Water can boost its coverage options to bypass would-be checks.

However, this is not to say Mega Rayquaza is perfect. Defensive checks to it do exist. Very bulky Flying-resistant Pokemon, such as Mega Tyranitar, Necrozma-DM, and Arceus-Steel are capable of taking Dragon Ascent comfortably while the former two can live boosted Earthquake even without Shuca Berry. Other physically bulky Pokemon such as defensive Primal Groudon, Giratina-O, and Arceus formes can tank boosted Dragon Ascent and neutralize it with Will-O-Wisp or hitting it hard. Skarmory and Corviknight resist every common move on physical sets and can combat Dragon Dance with Iron Defense. Offensive teams can use checks like Zacian-C, Arceus, and Air Balloon Mega Diancie to prevent sweeps. Terastallization also works against Mega Rayquaza, as setup sweepers like Mega Mewtwo Y and Koraidon can use Tera Ghost to be immune to Extreme Speed, while other Pokemon like Giratina-O and Primal Kyogre can use types like Tera Steel defensively. Lastly, Mega Rayquaza is also vulnerable to Stealth Rock, reducing the opportunities for sets like Choice Band to repeatedly come in.

Requirements:

Create a new account on PS. You do not have to follow any specific naming convention, but your suspect account must have never played a game in Formemons before this suspect test went up or you will not receive valid requirements (resetting W/L does not count for this - the account you use must never have played Formemons before the test, full stop.)
At any point on your new account, use the command /linksmogon on Pokemon Showdown! You will receive instructions on what to do once you run this command.
Double check that you're listed as a voter here! If you aren't listed as a voter despite having valid reqs, please contact KaenSoul, Giagantic, dhelmise or a member of staff.

The requirement to vote in this suspect test is a COIL value of 2850. The deadline for getting requirements will be <t:1745812740:f>

Voting:
Once the suspect period is over, everyone who has obtained reqs will be tagged. The post will then outline a process of blind voting, which will be clarified once the time arrives. For now, follow the above "Requirements" subheading to ensure that you have achieved requirements and linked your account

A supermajority (>=60%) of implement votes is required to ban Mega Rayquaza from Formemons

TL;DR:
- The COIL value is 2850
- You must ladder on a newly-created alt of any name
- You must link your suspect alt with your smogon account using /linksmogon
- The suspect test will run conclude on <t:1745812740:f>
 
Just finished reqs, quite easy barring the two Scarf Rayquazas I found and rando Screens.

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https://pokepast.es/7ca61b3e91b3b19b

Played around with different teras to cover minor things (certain ditto matchups, offense, etc.). The teams being used on the ladder were incredibly unserious, and I dont find this team amazing either but workable cause of all the mickey mouse stuff being loaded. Going to be voting dnb cause I dont think this mon is broken in the way people describe even if strong. More people should be using Zacian, Gira-O (saw 0 of these ?????), defensive teras, Multiple Arcs, etc. and should not be leaving room for things like M-Ray to set up or fire off shots for free, which is very hard to do as the M-Ray user at least for Ddance variants. The stronger set funnily enough I think is the mixed set but it's a good breaker and not a broken set either.

I believe we should have tackled Tera first because the mechanic itself is what increases M-Rays strength but also plenty others to suspect territory. Stuff like my team only works because the mechanic completely flips certain matchups from winnable/manageable to a loss or vice-versa depending on point of view. This would nerf a lot of the power level that things like Ray, Don, Zacian-C could fire off while allowing things M-Ray to be picked off by something like an Ekiller without losing to Tera Ghost.
 
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First to get reqs using this https://pokepast.es/619af70a21e5ba01
Uhh ima save my rant for the other forum but I will be voting dnb ray and tera is fine in this tier. Ig Ray is broken if ur team has zero mons faster no switch ins and no way to revenge kill it. Mixed is annoying asl yea but also like prolly around 6+ mons outspeed it and ur either lacking setup or coverage. Tera is fine and not really broken on it anyways but I’ll also save that for the long detailed rant. It’s not even the best mon in the tier. Every alt of mine that’s 1370+ got there without using mega ray

Also w Altairia set fr I got a maxed out stall box so u can rearrange some mons if u like like adding Corv over pdon but the Altairia set is like really really good into stall forces Tera ghost on mons that can’t break it

https://pokepast.es/370271100aedee6d
 
:giratina-origin: :ho-oh: :mewtwo-mega-y: :rayquaza-mega: :groudon-primal: :arceus-dark: got reqs with this team

The gira didnt feel like it was doing alot so you could put anyone there. Mons always evil when i fight opposing ones though so maybe a skill issue
Mewtwo is a beast. Im modest specs here to have fun but life orb/ebelt/literally anything also works. The damage is disgusting as is the bulk and speed.
Darkceus shores up alot of various scary guys like opposing mmy, necrozma, blanket physical check, beats ekiller/rayquaza/groudon*


Ray is def the best guy in the tier but he doesnt feel soo much better than the next best guys. Plenty of mons can like come in after and deal with it. Fast arc (depends on set etc etc.), zacian, tera ghost guys. P-groudon/tyranitar/ho-oh/giratina can live one hit usually. But dragon ascent is pretty damn free into most of the tier soooo. Life orb is pretty disgusting ngl tho. And scarf ray is very good

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Perfect run haha. Stole magikarp's team right up there

I think it's fine honestly. It's weirdly slow so it's not hard to revenge kill with arceuses or zacian or really any scarfer. Espeed never seems to hit as hard as you need it to, and def drops from dragon ascent leaves it open to priority or your own scarf mray. Mixed lorb is probably the best set but again lots of the meta can eat at least one hit.

Anyways ban Salamence
 
people love to luck on this ladder lol ruined my perfect run. anyway echoing the sentiments of many others on this thread, mray is strong but not really broken. it's a positive presence in the meta's system imo, we need strong revenge killers. i understand it's stupid to switch into but it's really limited by rocks, arceus formes, thunder wave, opp mray etc and the bulk / speed level in general is high enough to keep it in check. oh yeah corv and skarm suck btw stop running those. legit faced more trouble against MMY but let's save it for another day.

DeepFriedMagikarp ur team is goated
 
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Hey guys, I don't really understand why we are underestimating the pressure that M-Ray puts on the tier, the 2 losses that I got on my suspect run were because I was playing a team without M-Ray and "just one" check, you need to have more than one check to avoid auto-losing vs M-Ray and that is not healthy for the metagame, it constricts the team building, and the games become boring and uniform. So with the ban of M-Ray I think we will be able to see more diverse teams!

DeepFriedMagikarp your team is amazing, but I think is heavily built around stopping opposing M-Rays while your own is dealing a good amount of damage to the opponent, and that is a perfect example of why I think we must ban M-Ray.
 
:eternatus::Arceus-dark::zacian-crowned::Groudon-Primal::Rayquaza-Mega::Kyogre-Primal:

I am now realizing I used hasty nature on m-ray this whole run by accident, whoops. This team has an absolutely horrendous mu into too many things but it got the job done so.

M-ray is prob fine? Guy reminds me of dnite on steroids. If I ran into more competent builds w m-ray I would prob feel differently since there is so much jank here but idk. I do think despite there already being quite a bit of set variety, the mon still feels under-explored/utilized, and what would prob send it over the edge in the future is tera sets (similar to what is seen with other set-up dragons in OU).

Though I can't ignore the fact of how centralizing it is even now, especially in conjunction with primal-groudon, it feels like 2/6 slots are pre-determined. I also think that it being a good revenge option is being overvalued, as other options could/will be explored if it were gone (something I reckoned with after my beloved dnite was banned in AAA), and there is so much tera ghost running around anyway espeed felt like a weird click esp in end-game. It also forcing teams to have multiple 361+ and espeed answers makes the meta more fast pace, frailer, and leaves less room for exploration of other slower set-up options.

Tera itself is fine, the more concerning thing to me in this meta is last respects, why is that here? Should prob change something to tera normal on the above team but like that move is troll asl either way.

Finally, always read the FAQ section of a meta
Screenshot 2025-04-23 at 2.22.09 PM.png


EDIT: Yea I think I'm gonna vote ban
 
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Read my name
There really isn't anything I'd say differently from The Dark Kelpie, we pretty much have the same opinion. Mega Ray is an incredibly limiting force on team building. It doesn't auto win thankfully but that doesn't mean it can't be broken. I've seen comments on this meta saying "it's boring", or "it feels like AG" from anonymous people (I've come to the former conclusion too, to a degree). I really wonder what limits teams to be more homogeneous and also makes the tier feel like AG. Could it be the 190/190 attacking stats threat that was the single Pokemon that created Anything Goes? The world's top scientists are still researching this question.
My stance on tera since its been brought up: Tera is also dumb but Mega Ray is a huge abuser of it so I'd rather see Ray gone first. Tera is also a good way of checking it since tera steel Gira-O pretty much walls physical sets and can Wisp and or D-tail them.
 
I put off finishing reqs until now but saw that there were only two days left so I rushed to complete them.
Screenshot 2025-04-25 5.03.07 PM.png

:rayquaza-mega: :groudon-primal: :arceus-fairy: :giratina-origin: :arceus-steel: :arceus-dark:

Mega Rayquaza is incredible, absolutely no denying that. It along with Primal Groudon are the clear top two mons in the meta. But I really don't think it's broken. Setup sets (Adamant DD LO to be specific) are the only ones I can really see the argument for but they're not hard to prevent from setting up on pretty much every good mon in the meta. As for stuff to check it after a boost we've got defensive Arceus formes, Tyranitar, defensive Gira-O, physdef Primal Groudon, Tera Steel Gira-O, NDM, and a few more I can't remember off the top of my head. As for Band sets, any bulkier team can pretty handily deal with them with any solid flying resist (even offensive steelceus works because it outspeeds) while more offensive stuff can get away with using Zac to pivot in because they hardly give Band Ray any opportunities. Mixed sets are scary but very prediction-reliant and vulnerable to chip damage.

I think M-Ray adds a lot to the metagame. The value of a strong priority user cannot be understated, and it's bulky and strong enough to handle very dangerous Calm Mind users like Arceus-Dark in a way that I think opens up the teambuilder massively. And yes, it forces a lot of offensive pokemon to run Tera Ghost to avoid getting revenge killed by Extreme Speed, but I personally don't see this as an issue. Extreme Killer Arceus notably puts a lot of the same pressure on offensive pokemon with its Extreme Speeds, and frankly the fewer sweepers who get to make use of offensive teras, the better.

Also on the topic of Tera, I definitely think it's broken. It's also the only annoying part of Ray because Tera makes otherwise solid counterplay shaky in a very unfun manner. I've seen people try to make a counterpoint by saying that if Ray is the only broken Tera abuser, then it should be Ray that's banned, but it's far from the only offender. I personally found Zac-C, MMY, and even fucking Ultra Necrozma to all be equally bad offenders as Mega Rayquaza when it came to Tera being utter bullshit, but I don't see people complaining about them nearly as much because Ray is more splashable and thus you have to deal with it more often than those other threats.

Also banning Ray doesn't even open up builder much because Mence just fills in its role as a breaker / sweeper.
 
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