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Gen V Initial UU
- Thread starter JabbaTheGriffin
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Can someone show me where the hell it says that Drought is banned? O.o
You gotta remember that Tornadus will be focusing on Sp.Attack and Speed normally. And Hammer Arm is UnSTAB'ed, and not exactly the strongest fighting move out there. Most Steels also have VERY high defense.
Basically, none of those steels except the quad weak ones will be OHKO'ed.
And Aggron has Sturdy, so can Magnezone, two Steels that are possible OHKO's [Too lazy to run calcs atm]
Azumarill also exists in UU, and a Rain-boosted Aqua Jet is a clean OHKO.
Hammer Arm lowers Tornadus's speed, meaning it must switch out, letting SR piles up with more Life Orb, or be revenged. It's also less than perfect accuracy.
Let's assume that, for once, I didn't fuck up the calcs on a Gen V Pokemon. Taking that into account, a set of 40 Atk | 220 SpA | 252 Spe Tornadus with the moveset Rain Dance | Hurricane | Taunt | Hammer Arm does 42.3% - 50% to the standard Gen IV UU Tank Registeel. The retaliatory Iron Head that you mentioned does 31.1% - 36.5%. So, on average, you're going to be beating Registeel far quicker than it will be beating you, supposing you don't fuck up and Taunt an Iron Head by accident. I happen to like those odds since, with two layers of Spikes down, you can easily get the 2HKO on Registeel with two Hammer Arms, switch out to get rid of the -2 Speed, and come back later to wreck shit with STAB LO Hurricane.
Very, but I'm betting that it'll get banned. Christ, we couldn't even handle Kyurem in UU without everyone shitting their pants, you think Latias is going to have a shot at staying?
http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3448775
The standard Mixed/Wallbreaking Tornadus set from UU runs the EVs that I listed above, 40 Atk | 220 SpA | 252 Spe. Already mentioned all the points I had to say about Registeel above. Aggron can't switch in for dick, has to have the field cleared of entry hazards just to keep Sturdy active. Basically, it's a one time check, and even then, it isn't reliable. As for Azumarill, I obviously wouldn't be leaving Tornadus in on it knowing that every Azumarill carries Aqua Jet. Switch out to Kingdra (the other big hitter in Gen V UU for Rain) or Ludicolo, absorb that Aqua Jet, rampage for a few turns, set Rain back up later. Foresight + Rapid Spin Hitmontop fixes SR issues, and if LO is such a hindrance, run Expert Belt or something. Hell, even Damp Rock might not be such a bad idea, to increase Rain turns.
Thanks Forte.EXE, thought it would be on the UU page. Fail. ^^;
With Tornadus down here, rain will dominate. Tornadus with Rain Dance, HP Water, Hurricane, and anything (Water+Flying is only resisted by Lanturn and Empoleon, so I guess Grass Knot) literally kills the whole metagame. In addition, there are powerful swift swimmers (we're looking at you, Kingdra), priority abusers (Azumarill), sweepers (Speed Boost Sharpedo), Electric abusers (Zapdos and Jolteon), and unkillable pokemon (Escavalier won't die in the rain). Rain. Will. Kill. UU.
As much as I love Rain, the fact that there's no Politoed severely hinders Tornadus's sweep, especially since it will probably being the one setting up rain, forcing it to hold Damp Rock. And while 125 sp. atk is great, you're kidding yourself if you think you'll be able to take out tanks like Registeel, Gastrodon, or Chansey, or OHKO even some pokes that aren't heavily defensive, so what do you mean it kills the whole metagame?. Yes, in those 8 turns you will be able to bash a few skulls, but then another rain abuser (such as Azumarill or a Swift Swimmer) can come in and ruin your fun. Scarfed pokes as well can come in and do serious damage. While Rain is still great, it's not going to dominate that heavily.
inb4 Rain gets banned from UU too. Apparently, we're all taking on a very strong "fuck weather" approach. I'm just waiting for all weather to be banned from all tiers but Uber, so we can essentially play Gen I with held items, abilities, and more Pokemon.
Weather is disproportionately strong compared to every other strategy, massively centralizes the metagame, and creates support conditions that essentially turn the game into rock-paper-scissors. Why are you surprised it's getting so much attention from a balance perspective?
Not massively surprised, really. If there's any surprise, it's probably leftover from when people were claiming that Gen IV Rain was broken in UU. I just think that we're jumping a bit too quick from ban to ban to ban. Just my opinion.
With Kingra and Tornadus down here, yeah, i can see Rain becoming suspect, but Tornadus has a problem since if he is lead he needs he needs Damp Rock (so he doesn't hit as hard and doesn't has Focus Sash), and Taunt (for opposing leads) Hurricane and coverage (probably HP water), then there is Ludicolo, Kabutops, Shell Smash Omastar and ShellPass SS Gorebyss, etc...
If rain is so good now, it's time to bring out my rain dance electrod again.
Edit: I'm not serious
Edit: I'm not serious
Only reason to use Electrode would be a suicide lead Rain Dance. For that, why not use something like Azelf, which can set up Rain Dance, Stealth Rock, while having Thunder and Explosion? I mean, Explosion got nerfed, sure, but Azelf still has a far higher Attack stat than Electrode. Other than Speed, I don't see much point in Electrode usage.
Straying from the rain topic for a moment, Blaziken is ranked at 214. I thought Blaziken got the boot to ubers?
Well, if you're running Tornadus with max Speed and they're running Tornadus with max Speed then it comes down to a Speed-tie. And, considering that other Rain Dance Pokemon like Kingdra and Ludicolo beat Tornadus pretty handily (Hurricane isn't a OHKO on Ludicolo, IIRC), then it isn't that difficult to beat opposing Tornadus.
I'm dying for UU to be updated with Tornadus.
But Tornadus is a terrible lead for RD, wasn't it? At least, that was the impression I got when I was looking through the thread.
It got the boot, and so it dropped to UU again in terms of stats. Confusing, yes. I am confused, too.
huh
Tornadus is still OU, guys
Tornadus is still OU, guys
All the Latias chatter made me think that it maybe easily handled than Kyurem. Keep in mind that Latias has that pesky Psychic typing.
A 252 Atk CB Megahorn from Heracross deals 190.3% - 224.3% to the Wish Support Latias.
Take into account that Heracross is no where near as bulky as Escavalier but considering how common Esca is, Latias should be easily taken care of. Esca has superior bulk and attack to Heracross.
Esca maybe mandated but due to how common it is already, it should not affect it too much.
A 252 Atk CB Megahorn from Heracross deals 190.3% - 224.3% to the Wish Support Latias.
Take into account that Heracross is no where near as bulky as Escavalier but considering how common Esca is, Latias should be easily taken care of. Esca has superior bulk and attack to Heracross.
Esca maybe mandated but due to how common it is already, it should not affect it too much.
Losing to Heracross and Escavalier didn't stop Kyurem from getting banned. Latias is faster, with a much better movepool and better typing which negates the loss in bulk (no SR weak either!). And to top it off, she has good boosting move and Trick to ward off Chansey. She'll be a nightmare in UU.
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