Lower Tiers GSC Ubers Viability Rankings

[Zaptoad]

My opponent and I play competitively on Pokémon Stadium 2, and our teams have evolved significantly over the course of our battles. As a result, our mini-metagame seems to have stagnated. Here are our teams:

My team:

Lugia (Leftovers)

Aeroblast

Surf

Safeguard

Recover


Raikou (Leftovers)

Rest

Thunder

Hidden Power Grass

Sleep Talk


Marowak (Thick Club)

Earthquake

Rock Slide

Fissure

Body Slam


Suicune

Surf

Rest

Rain Dance

Mirror Coat


Mew

Swords Dance

Explosion

Shadow Ball

Surf


Houndoom

Crunch

Pursuit

Fire Blast

Sunny Day



Opponent’s team:

Mewtwo

Psychic

Ice Beam

Submission

Recover


Zapdos

Thunderbolt

Thunder Wave

Light Screen

Rest


Rhydon

Rock Slide

Earthquake

Fissure

Body Slam


Blastoise

Surf

Fissure

Body Slam

Counter


Ho-oh

Sacred Fire

Curse

Earthquake

Sunny Day


Exeggutor

Leech Seed

Sleep Powder

Psychic

Explosion



Many of the Pokémon in our teams have emerged over time as a result of our battles, and only a few were present from the start (such as Mewtwo and Lugia). Others were clearly added to counter specific threats—for example, my Houndoom exists solely to counter his Mewtwo, and his Mewtwo runs Submission just to deal with Houndoom. My Mew carries Surf specifically to counter Rhydon, and so on.

Overall, his Mewtwo is by far the biggest threat in our mini-meta.
It's been a long time since I've been able to win a match...
(Yes, I know OHKO moves are allowed.)

Please help me find Pokémon or moves to add to my team!
I am not allowed to use Pokémon from his team (Mewtwo, Rhydon, Ho-oh, etc.), and Snorlax is banned in our meta.

 

[BigFatMantis]

GSC Ubers 2025 VR Update ​

I'd like to give a big thanks to everyone who put in the time to help contribute to these VRs this year - I know we all have things to do and so the fact that you all dedicated a piece of your availability to help this cause is much appreciated. And a huge thanks to Wanted in 49 States for spending nearly 2 hours with me trying to fix the Vapicuno script while inputting this all in.

I'll start by thanking all of the contributors: ExguardiaN entrocefalo Gallinova DAWNBUSTER Fear Chiles Habaneros pixie909 vani Elian Iguana Charmriah AhmedxWaleed

Next, here is the NEW Official VR:

S1:
S2:
A1:
A2:
A3:
B1:
B2:
B3:
C1:
C2:

And the raw data and graphs for enjoyment:

Aggregate Rankings

01 Snorlax
02 Mewtwo
03 Mew
04 Cloyster
05 Tyranitar
06 Zapdos
07 Celebi
08 Raikou
09 Steelix
10 Forretress
11 Ho-oh
12 Jolteon
13 Golem
14 Lugia
15 Gengar
16 Vaporeon
17 Quagsire
18 Exeggutor
19 Heracross
20 Skarmory
21 Marowak
22 Misdreavus
23 Umbreon
24 Blissey
25 Rhydon
26 Machamp
27 Starmie
28 Shuckle
29 Jynx
30 Omastar
31 Suicune
32 Houndoom
33 Tentacruel
34 Smeargle
35 Muk
36 Miltank
37 Corsola
38 Mr. Mime
39 Aerodactyl

Dendogram across Snorlax to Aerodactyl

From Isa 's post last year:

"To read the dissimilarity matrix, note that zero (the darkest value) corresponds to equal number of people voting in favor and against the Pokemon on the Y axis > X axis, and the higher the value, the more one-sided the voting becomes. In other words, the darker, the more indistinguishable the Pokemon on the X and Y axis become, and a well-defined tier would be a fully dark square."

Dissimilarity Matris

For rank improvement, ignore that it says Fall/Spring, this is comparing the values from last year's VR to this one:

Rank Improvement

per Isa: "A better way to understand how significant these changes are so as not to mistake changes occuring as due to pure chance is to plot the z-score, where the Y axis means number of standard deviations away from zero. To recap, 0.5, 1 and 2 standard deviations are about 69%, 84%, and 98% significant (one-sided), meaning roughly that for a z-score of 1, we expect that this change to have occurred due to chance 100%-84% = 16% of the time. Therefore, trust the data on the left than on the right."

Voter Dendograms

And finally, the voter similarity graph, which helps show how voters opinions differ from each other:

voter similarity graph

Here is the spreadsheet with the votes also.

Happy Memorial Day everyone

 

[Conflict]

Hi!

After winning GSC Cup I have decided to have a look at how i tier mons. Here's my personal VR:

Mons are put in tiers where i deem them viable and I also tried to order them in their respective tiers by viability. Overall pretty happy how this looks though certain individual placings can be discussed.

If anything wonders: Yes the shit NU mons in D are better than the E mons because they fulfill a certain niche function in the meta whereas the E mons usually dont and/or have higher ranked mons that do their job better (see: Aero being done better by Lugia/Skarm and even Ho-Oh and also being outshined as a MonoLax-Answer by all the other Rocks because those other Rocks also tend to check TTar/Lugia/others).
If one wonders why a certain Mons is placed in a certain tier feel free to ask and i shall provide an explanation.

Let me get ahead of some of my "weird" rankings:

- Zapdos: lately I dont really like using Zapdos much because it offers little defensively and even offensively has some drawbacks. Defensively its duties are done better by Ho-Oh, Lugia and even Mew2/Raikou tend to be able to fulfill the same defensive qualities but also offer more. Offensively Zapdos is sadly kinda abused by Growth-Jolt and that is freaking scary + still walled by a lot (Lax/Cele/Kou). Unless one runs WW over Resttalk which improves Zapdos Jolt-MU but then one has to wonder why one is even using Zapdos over Ho-Oh/Lugia which tend to be better WWer's (thx to having access to Recover). I find myself hard pressed to get a Rest off w Zapdos without Sleeptalk (especially vs Offense and vs Stall Ho-Oh just performs better). Zapdos not being a good Mew2-Check anymore due to Mew2-Sets diversifying is another issue - the uber birds and Raikou just do that role better.

- Muk: Yup im a firm Muk believer. Muk is one of the best anti-leads in the current Meta. Muk is never ohkoed by Mew2 Psychic (so u can potentially Boom/Thief/Sludge T1 vs Mew2), is never 2hkoed by Mew EQ or ohkoed by +2 Mew EQ (so can trade w Mew), can boomtrade vs. Lax and has potential moves to punish the Spikers (Fireblast for Forry, Thunder for Cloy) as well as misecellaneous coverage options to hit whatever u want (Fire Blast, DPunch for TTar, Giga Drain). Muk also acts as a solid check to non-Psychic Mew2 (especially good vs 4-Atk-Mew2) and while it doesnt 1v1 Barrier-Mew2 it can switch in on it and force PSN on it (Sludge Bomb rules!). I believe it to be better than Exeggutor mainly because unlike Eggy it has more defensive switch-ins (non-Psy-Mew2, Cloy, Forry and can come in on the uber birds + Mew as well). Its stronger Explosion actually ohkoes the uber mons and can force trades (example: Exeggutor Explosion vs. Ho-Oh: 379-446 (91.3 - 107.4%) -- 46.2% chance to OHKO vs. Muk Explosion vs. Ho-Oh: 405-477 (97.5 - 114.9%) -- 87.2% chance to OHKO). And Sleep is usually done better by Snorlax in Ubers too which makes Egg less desirable.