Hail Team (First RMT)

[Lord Gubbins]

Right, i'm pretty new to this team planning lark, but I wanted a hail team, so here it is:

Lead - Articuno @ Charti Berry
Pressure
Quiet Nature (+spec attk, -speed)
180 Def - 180 Spec attk - 108 Hp - 42 speed
- Toxic
- Substitute
- Roost
- Ice Beam

This guy is damn annoying! Basic stalling lead who attempts to disrupt enemy leads by poisoning them and subroosting til they die. Ice Beam is a reliable STAB that allows articuno to damage steel types. Charti Berry is a slight defence against 'Cuno's crippling weakness to Rock type attacks.

EV's were chosen to maximise sturdiness and allow for retaliation quick kills with Ice Beam. Articuno have naturally great special defence, so i didn't see the need to put any EV's in that location. Pressure also works well on a staller, as with the right timing, can soak up offensiivel dangerous moves to allow for an easy KO.

Abomasnow @ Occa Berry
Snow Warning
Naughty Nature (+Attk,-Spec Def)
200 Attk - 200 Def - 54 Spec Def - 54 HP
- Wood Hammer
- Leech Seed
- Ice Shard/Avalanche
- Brick Break/Swords Dance

Abomasnow is one of my few Physical attackers, and is relatively sturdy. Wood Hammer gives Powerful STAB, whilst Ice Shard/Avalanche gives secondary stab to cover types. Leech Seed recovers HP lost from Wood Hammer, whilst Brick Break gives type coverage and a neutral moce for hitting fire types, and Swords dance gives it the ever wanted sweep factor, if combined with Ice Shard.

EV's give it some special defences whilst making it relatively tanky in physical, although Naughty Nature really wasn't ideal. I am still unsure of which of the two last moves to give it, so suggestions would be appreciated. I was also considering giving a Focus Sash to him, in case of avalanche.

Walrein @ Leftovers
Ice Body
Modest Nature (+ Spec attk,-attk)
172 Spec Attk - 168 Def - 168 Spec Def
- Blizzard
- Hail
- Surf
- Aqua Ring

Walrein is a general all round special attacker, leaning towards the tankier side of things. In singles, this will take up 2 turns to set up, generally only one in doubles. With Leftovers, Aqua Ring and Ice Body, a large roportion of HP is being restored each turn, combined with the general sturdiness of walrein makes it a tough customer. Blizzard contains a powerful, 100 accuracy STAB in a hailstorm, and surf is there as a second powerful STAB.

EV's focus on Spec Attk whilst making walrein slightly tougher. The only thing this doesnt hit super or normal on is Grass, which may be its downfall.

Froslass @ Life Orb
Snow Cloak
Timid Nature (+Speed,-Attk)
252 Spec Attk - 252 Speed - 4 HP
- Shadow Ball
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Destiny Bond

My Special Sweeper. She has several strong special moves which, combined with life orb, will usually OHKO or 2HKO most things. "Bolt-Beam-Ball" provides excellent coverage, including 2 powerful STABs, whilst Destiny Bond is a wildcard, if something comes in and is likely to kill me, I can remove a powerful member of their team in an instant.

Basic Special sweeper EV set up. Not much to say, just let loose.

Lapras @ Icy Rock
Water Absorb
Relaxed Nature (+Def,-Speed)
200 Spec Attk - 252 Spec Def - 52 HP
- Blizzard

- ThunderBolt
- Hydro Pump
- Hail

Special Wall/ Hail Supporter. The Water Absorb allows this to work well in a tag team with Walrein, countering its inability to attack waters effectively and absorbing any surfs used by the walrus. Bolt-Beam Combo again, with Hydro Pump to compliment as a powerful STAB. Very defensively sound.

EV's ignore physical, as it has naturally high defence and HP.

Mamoswine @ Quick Claw

Snow Cloak
Adamant Nature (+attk,-spec attk)
172 Attk - 168 Def - 168 Spec Def
- Ice Shard
- Avalanche
- Earthquake
- Attract


Pretty self explanitory, a very powerful physical attacker, one of which I am lacking. Good STABs, attract for protection. EVs chosen to try and make it more sturdy.


I am pretty confident on most, but some movesets are still a bit iffy, suggestions?
Thanks in advance
(all credit to images goes to www.arkeis.com)

 

[Michurro]

Attract on mamoswine in a little gimmicky. If its not reliable I suggest superpower or stone edge to get blissey, tar, umbreon, or gyarados. Quick claw, is that legal? As with most hail teams, mix ape plays around with this team. Your only option is frossglass but if he launches a fireblast on the switch, its over. But wait there is hope! Starmie, everyones best friend not only gets rid of the stealth rocks that your team hates, it checks nape and other who abuse the inherited fire/fighting weakness of hail teams. Whichever member seems to be doing the least for you (abomasnow maybe if you give mamoswine super power) replace it with a starmie set. Leftovers for longevity or expert belt

Lapras is not very bulky so dumping some evs into hp instead of sp. Atk would be nice, especially since starmie will take over its sweeping job.

I'm not a hail team rater, so bear with my mistakes. But if this is your first rmt, maybe a standard team should come before this hail squad to get a feel of the ou metagame

 

[jynx KB]

Stall teams are notoriously cookie cutter, and Hail is no different.

I assume you're going for Stall, but you seem to be going a more offensive route in the meantime. Not necessary. Let Hail do most of the work for you, all you have to do is stay alive, and chip away while you can.

First of all, you need Abomisnow as your lead. It gets Hail up right away, there's really no point in waiting.

Most of your movesets aren't going to last. Stallrein is almost obligotory in a team like this, so get the moveset and EVs changed up. Trust me, that thing can last for quite awhile.

Stalling Arcticuno is a wonderful Stall addition to a team like this, but it shouldn't be your lead.

Froslass could use Spikes as a backup hazard for passive damage that Leftovers and Ice-Types get around in the Hail.

You need some control for Tyranitar, and to a lesser extent, Hipowdon. Sand Steamers are going to be your biggest threat, as they shut down Hail completely.

There are some good ideas here, but you need a few patches.

First off, I recommend a Tentacruel somewhere, most likely over Lapras. Hail/Toxic Spikes is bound to inflict some damage, and it also has access to Rapid Spin and Blizzard, and works well as a Special Wall. Black Sludge also helps recover damage taken from Hail. Starmie is also an option, but it's frailty makes it less appealing on a team like this

Good idea on including Hail on a second Pokemon, as Abomisnow can't be around forever, but I think he should be your Primary source of Hail, and have the attack on one other Pokemon as a backup. Set Up just takes too much time.

Another nice option on the team here is Rotom-F, even if it doesn't necessarily have Blizzard, it's easy to bluff, and you get some bulk, coverage, and a Spin Blocker.

Check out the article on Hail teams, and see if that helps as well. Hope I was of some assistance.

 

[Venetian Masque]

Is your team for WiFi or Shoddy Battle? I'm going to assume Shoddy Battle.

Personally, I don't really bother on all-out Hail stalling with Walrein as it is often too slow for my tastes. If you feel similarly, I suggest you take some of my hopefully useful advice into consideration. First and foremost, a Hail team absolutely does not need every single member of it to be of the Ice-type. In fact, you put yourself at a huge disadvantage due to it. Right now, your team suffers from a whopping four Fighting/Fire/Steel weaknesses and five Rock weaknesses, the latter being especially bad due to how common Stealth Rock is.

Your Abomasnow's EVs are not very optimized for a Leech Seed user, in my opinion. Perhaps you should try something like 252 HP/4 Attack/252 Special Defense with a Sassy nature and Leftovers using Blizzard/Leech Seed/Protect/Wood Hammer. The EVs allows it to come into Water and special attacks more easily, such as from the ever-so-annoying Calm Mind Suicune. You can simply setup Leech Seed on it while alternating between Protect and Wood Hammer to hit its unboosted physical Defense. Sassy nature to ensure that it is slower than Tyranitar (which you won't likely stay in with anyway) and Hippowdon so that your weather overrides theirs in the case of both entering the field at the same time. Occa Berry will rarely save Abomasnow with his below average HP and defenses, especially from the likes of Heatran or Infernape. Typically, after summoning the Hail with Abomasnow, you'll want to reserve it for later on in the battle rather than risk it perishing. If all goes well, you won't need another Hail user.

Mamoswine should get rid of Attract as the move is too situational. If you're that intent on keeping it safe, you're likely better off using Protect or Substitute. I would personally go with a more offensive set such as Earthquake/Ice Shard/Stone Edge/Superpower for much better type coverage, with an EV spread of 252 Attack/4 Defense/252 Speed. Frankly, his Ice/Ground typing does not lend itself well to being a defensive Pokémon, while it consequently benefits it greatly offensively, as STAB Ground/Ice alone is a great attack type combination. Another thing to note is that Quick Claw is banned under standard Shoddy Battle rules, if I recall correctly.

Much like jynx KB mentioned, I, too, would highly suggest that you include a Tentacruel into your team. Not only does it have a competent Special Defense stat, but it adds a valuable Fighting/Fire/Steel resistance for your team. It is also capable of using Rapid Spin to rid of those cumbersome Stealth Rocks while also providing its own entry hazard (Toxic Spikes) to add to your residual Hail damage. Just be careful not to use Toxic Spikes too soon until you dealt with some of the appropriate threats with some other statuses first (see paragraph below). Also watch out for enemy Poison-type Pokémon who can absorb them or Pokémon with the Guts ability. Calm nature with 252 HP/120 Defense/136 Special Defense and Leftovers should be enough to keep him around for a while. Articuno would probably be the one to remove for this as he is especially susceptible to the ever common Aerodactyl leads, and his role is pretty much done better by Tentacruel, in my opinion.

Rotom-H can provide your team with the same Fighting immunity as Froslass, but with an added Ground immunity and Electric/Steel resistance as well. It also offers status support with Discharge (30% Paralysis) for those fast Pokémon giving you trouble as well as Will-o-Wisp (Burn) to put those physical sweepers such as Tyranitar, Metagross, Lucario, etc. at bay. As for its other moves, you could either give it a combination of Rest + Sleep Talk to work as a status absorber, or my personal favorite, Substitute + Pain Split with a Life Orb. The reason for swapping Froslass out in favor of Rotom-H is because despite its respectable Speed, its other stats are very much lackluster. Even with the Life Orb, the recoil from this item along with Froslass' naturally meager Special Attack stat will rarely be worth the risk, often instead aiding in its own downfall without eliminating more than one Pokémon at most, generally.

Heatran is another good addition to the team, giving you a Fire immunity coupled with a Steel resistance. Something like 4 HP/252 Special Attack/252 Speed with Timid nature should suffice. Moveset being Earth Power/Explosion/Fire Blast/Stealth Rock. Intercepts a Fire attack, lays down a Stealth Rock, and proceeds to decimate anything it can until you feel you are cornered or that it has already served its purpose, thus allowing it to go out with a bang. It should probably replace either Walrein or Lapras.

The last slot is up to you, but if you chose to keep Walrein, the traditional stalling set is as follows: 220 HP/252 Defense/36 Special Defense with a Bold nature and Ice Body ability, using Leftovers. It regularly uses Protect/Roar/Substitute/Surf. Also, you say that your current set cannot hit Grass types for super effective which is incorrect as Blizzard (Ice) does exactly that.

I highly encourage you to give this team a try to get a better feel of a Hail team, and from there you can decide whether you wish to make anymore changes or not. Also, no offense, but it seems like you don't have a very good understanding of maximizing your EV distribution. You should check out some of Smogon's articles here or looking up the recommended spreads for specific sets of each individual Pokémon you plan to use via the Strategy Pokédex here.

Apologies for the long read, but I hope that some of my input was of some use to you. Good luck and have fun!

 

[-Lux-]

first of all why abomasnow has access to earquake witch in this team is more usefull than brickbreak.
secondly as froslass being the fastest pokemon in your team it would be the better hail user giving room for a DD lapras witch easily counters fire types.
Now that Lapras has taken the role of Physical sweeper mixspert would replace mamoswine perfectly as a counter to skarmbliss.

hope this helped

 

[Daniel Craig]

Ice Beam is a reliable STAB that allows articuno to damage steel types

LOLwut?

Lapras @ Icy Rock
Water Absorb
Relaxed Nature (+Def,-Speed)
200 Spec Attk - 252 Spec Def - 52 HP
- Blizzard

- ThunderBolt
- Hydro Pump
- Hail

Special Wall/ Hail Supporter. The Water Absorb allows this to work well in a tag team with Walrein, countering its inability to attack waters effectively and absorbing any surfs used by the walrus. Bolt-Beam Combo again, with Hydro Pump to compliment as a powerful STAB. Very defensively sound.

EV's ignore physical, as it has naturally high defence and HP

Firstly you dont need to run Hail on lapras as you already get infinite hail everytime abomasnow switches in so swap it out for a different move





My honest suggestion for this team is to get rid of Mamoswine and try and use Old UU rules which allow for the use of BL's but besides that i cant see any hope for this team, you are overly rock and fire weak.
my advice start again & that not every member of a Hail team has to be ice type :///

 

[Lord Gubbins]

Yea, I agree that my crippling weaknesses to Fire, Rock, Steel, Electric etc, an addition of a Rotom variant or possibly a Cloyster as a rapid spin / spikes producer.

Also, I intend to give Walrein some respect as a tanky special attacker, not attempting to stall, as articuno is all the stall i really need.

Possible options: Rotom
Physical Lapras
Cloyster

Any suggestions?
Thanks for previous advice :D

 

[TubaKing]

First off, you absolutely must read this article if you're going to continue trying to use hail stall: http://www.smogon.com/dp/articles/art_hail_stall
Secondly, six ice types on a hail team is a big no-no and is by far the biggest common mistake among people who attempt Hail stall.
You have zero Rock, Fire, or Steel resistances and only one fighting resistance on your entire team.
Honestly, the only ice types that a good Hail team really needs are Abomasnow and Walrein and possibly Mamoswine or Froslass. You can maybe get away with three Ice types depending on the other half of your team, though in most cases this is unwise. All six of your Pokemon need not be immune to Hail to be effective on a Hail team.
Standard walls can prove to be just as effective in Hail as Ice Pokemon do. For example, simply replacing your Articuno with Zapdos and your Lapras with Swampert would give you valuable Fire, Rock, Fighting, and Steel resistances that this team direly needs.
Having Hail on your Lapras and Walrein is made unnecessary with the use of Abomasnow (who has no reason to not be in the lead position on this team).
This team is lacking two things that just about every stall team needs: entry hazards and a rapid spinner (five of your current Pokemon are weak to Stealth Rock). Tentacruel is probably the most fitting potential Rapid Spin supporter for this team and can either replace Mamoswine or Articuno, and could contribute Rapid Spin support, Toxic Spikes support, and Fire, Fighting, and Steel resistances to your team (note that Tentacruel absorbs your opponent's Toxic Spikes and Leech Seed).
If you keep Froslass, she can serve as a spin blocker, Spikes supporter, and maybe even be put in the lead position, if you are so inclined. Replacing Froslass with a Rotom-F with Blizzard is another thing to consider, due to a 100% accurate Blizzard in Hail (which hits through Protect 30% of the time) and better resistances than Froslass (most notably to Steel).
Replacing Swampert with Lapras grants you access to Stealth Rock, as well as key resistances to Fire, Steel, Rock, and Electric.
All of your items, movesets, and EV spreads are extremely random and, I'd wager, probably very unsuccessful on Shoddy Battle. Please read the Smogon analysis of each Pokemon you wish to add to your team and keep in mind the roles of each team member, as well as the synergy between all six of your Pokemon, making sure that each Pokemon's weakness is covered by the resistance of another.
Each Pokemon's analysis is created and continually updated by the Smogon community with the help of the experts of the Quality Control team. The sets listed in the Strategy Pokedex have proven tried and true by the best of the best and there is little reason to deviate too much from them until you get into the higher levels of competitive play.
Your team shows to me that you might not be all that familiar with the way that stall works. Here is a guide to stall that should help you out a bit:
http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64226
Although your team needs a lot of changes, it is definitely not the worst team in the world and this is your first try. Stall is a really difficult play style to master, but is really rewarding for patient people who are willing to give it a try.
I hope I helped.
Good luck!