Hidden Type

Honestly, there's not that many non-Dark Pokemon that prefer Poison typing to Steel typing, since the only advantages is actually has are...

-Not vulnerable to Fire (Instead vulnerable to Psychic)

-Resists Fighting instead of being vulnerable

-Absorbs Toxic Spikes (Instead of ignoring them)/makes Toxic 100% accurate/heals off Black Sludge

-STAB on Poison moves. (Which most Pokemon don't actually run as coverage -Steel is more popular)

Of course for Dark types adding Steel is a double Fighting weakness vs adding Poison leaves you with only one weakness out of the two type's weaknesses. (Ground, specifically) So Dark types like Poison. But for most Pokemon you reeaaally need to hate Fire and/or Fighting for Poison to be worth considering -and in Conkeldurr's case, it leaves it with a double weakness to Psychic. Normally even strong Psychic attackers struggle to OHKO Conkeldurr due to its sheer bulk, but with a double weakness it's pretty trivial to destroy it. The main thing it has going for it is that people will be leery of tossing out a Psychic at Conkeldurr for the possibility of Dark or, less extremely, Steel, but Fighting/Dark is doubly weak to Fairy, which is bad, and the least risky option for attacking Conkeldurr is always going to be Earthquake. (It's extremely difficult to argue for Flying typing on Conkeldurr -about the only nice thing one can say about it is that it screws with people assuming Ground is a good option. Among other points, losing Stealth Rock resistance sucks. Grass and Bug make even less sense)

Even getting STAB for KOing Grass Manaphy seems an iffy utility, since Poison Jab is, without STAB

252+ Atk Conkeldurr Poison Jab vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Manaphy: 204-240 (56.5 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

vs STAB being

252+ Atk Conkeldurr Poison Jab vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Manaphy: 306-360 (84.7 - 99.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

still inadequate without Poisoning Manaphy. (This is the calc's standard OU Tail Glow Manaphy) And Steel and Poison both resist Energy Ball, while Steel alone resists Ice Beam and neither resists Scald. And either way you end up vulnerable to Ground, hampering you against Gliscor among others, so it's not like Poison has an advantage there. Plus Steel provides Sandstorm immunity, which is nice because of Hippowdon and Tyranitar's popularity.

I'm skeptical of Poison Conkeldurr, is what I'm saying.
 
All right, so when these viability rankings were first being discussed I had pretty much settled in my mind 3 S Rank mons. Those are: Steel Dragonite, Steel/Fire Mega Altaria(either works) and finally Grass Manaphy. All 3 of these mons are absolutely incredible in the meta and can sweep through almost anything if given 1 turn. Getting that "free turn" to boost is also not difficult when they all have such great bulk and typing to protect them.

Starting with
Steel Dragonite
:

I agree with Ghoul King on Dragonite. Adding Steel Typing patches up so many weaknesses(leaving it only x2 weak to Ice), and Multiscale makes it basically impossible to OHKO. Regular Dragonites are normally handled by a good STAB Ice type move, even with Multiscale unbroken, but when you add Steel typing not even some of the strongest Ice attacks in the game can reliably KO.

252+ SpA Teravolt Kyurem-B Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Dragonite: 306-362 (94.7 - 112%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

+3 252 SpA (Ice)Manaphy Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Multiscale Dragonite: 306-361 (94.7 - 111.7%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

Meanwhile offensively Dragonite gets new STAB in Iron Head to get around the various Fairies in the meta. While some mons like Heatran and Skarmory might boast that they can stop Dragonite, all they can really do is click "Roar/Whirlwind".

+1 252+ Atk Dragonite Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 262-310 (68 - 80.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

+1 252+ Atk Dragonite Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 158-186 (47.3 - 55.6%) -- 21.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery


Next up is
Fire/Steel Altaria:

Altaria was the first thing I tried out in ORAS and it was as monstrous as it sounded. In the XY HT meta, a lot of us wanted a Fairy/Steel/Dragon type, but we didn't think we'd be getting one until gen 7 came out. And then ORAS released and gave us a Fairy/Dragon/Steel with DDance, 75/110/105 bulk, 110/110 offenses, and Pixilate.

Altaria has 2 equally viable third typings in Steel/Fire, which creates mind games as to what type you are running since both variants resist different things. Betting on it being Steel type Altaria and went for a Wisp? Well jokes on you, it was Fire Altaria and it just set up to +1! Went for a Sludge Wave? Well it was Steel Altaria the whole time and it just set up to +1! Unless you had Rocks up, there's not really a way for you to know which type it is until you've mispredicted and lost the game because of it. The only weakness shared by both of the Altaria variants is a Ground weakness, which is pretty easy to live with because Ground coverage is so niche in this meta. There's very few things to nail with an Earthquake other than Altarias and other Fairy/Steels since Flying type is thrown on anything weak to Ground.

The Steel variant has nice resists and immunities over the Fire variant and generally has an easier time taking hits. Fire Altaria has the nice ability to get around Wisp users like Mew and Heatran and proceed to set up on them, as well as 2HKOing any Skarmory type with uninvested Fire Blast.

0 SpA (Fire)Altaria Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD (Dragon or Water)Skarmory: 171-202 (51.1 - 60.4%) -- 92.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Anything else not named Heatran gets nuked by Pixilate Returns.


Last and certainly not least,
Grass Manaphy
:

I'm surprised nobody here has nominated Grass Manaphy for S rank, because it's easily the strongest special wallbreaker in the meta. Unresisted coverage, great defensive and offensive typing that simultaneously nails all of the nasty Water/Grounds while only being weak to some of the worst offensive typings around: Poison/Bug/Flying(not really great in a Steel meta). Coupled with 100/100/100 bulk it can set up to +3 with ease and proceed to destroy everything in sight bar something like AV Steel Tornadus-Therian.

Manaphy is also the perfect partner to the above physical sweepers, and should really be on any offensive team in general. I could post some calcs, but I think this replay will be enough to show the force of Manaphy. My match vs unfixable in the HT mini-tour:

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/hiddentype-206834950


I think if anything is deserving of S it's Water Gliscor.

Water/Ground/Flying is an amazing typing with only weaknesses to ice and grass, the latter being very uncommon to begin with in OU and arguably becoming even worse seeing as everything can be part steel now. Poison Heal only makes it even harder to take down, and with the ability to run a ton of possible moves such as Knock Off, Taunt, Stealth Rock, Roost, Earthquake, Aqua Tail, Roost, and even Swords Dance + Baton Pass, it's almost impossible to guess what it's running at first glance. As if this utility wasn't enough, it also serves as a very good scald/lava plume switch-in and specially defensive versions stop Rotom-W cold.

When Hidden Type had a ladder it was by far both the best member of my team, allowing me to peak and the most annoying Pokemon to face. Immunity to status, amazing passive recovery and a fantastic typing make it by far the best Pokemon in hidden type in my opinion.
While Gliscor is a great physical wall, it is setup fodder for Manaphy and lacks the ability to phase mons out, which Hippowdon does have. Hippo also takes hits a little better and suffers less from 4mss. A rank should be fine for Gliscor.

Dragon Skarmory itself might deserve S Rank as well, being an all-around amazing wall that now only has one weakness, to a type that, though offensively powerful, is less popular in Hidden Type and lacks an equivalent to tossing out a Fire Blast -Blizzard is less accurate and much more rarely run. I'm less certain of this one though, in part because I fought it rather than running it -I'd rather someone who actually used it provide a picture of its utility and quality.
Dragon Skarmory is OK, it's just that it lost a lot of power because offensive mons are gaining new STAB to help get around the things that used to wall them, Skarmory included. Skarmory can't even switch into a Crawdaunt because +2 Superpower will deal 110%+. It sounds like it would do fine somewhere in the A rank though.

Lastly, I can see an argument Ground Gyarados, though I suspect it's more A Rank material. Regardless, it's very good, with multiple immunities, acceptable bulk supplemented by Intimidate and potentially leftovers, a hilariously powerful Earthquake, and access to Ice Fang for doing solid (not great) damage to the likes of Steel Dragonite. Since Ground and Electric are excellent offensive types, and Electric in particular is an excellent add for a number of Pokemon, it can be surprisingly easy to switch Gyarados in for free, and either dish out solid damage or Dragon Dance. The latter possibility puts a lot of pressure on the enemy to not let Gyarados get that free switch in, and to respond immediately if it does get in. It is marred by a lack of good recovery, vulnerability to Toxic, and the fact that Grass is actually a popular attacking type in Hidden Type, between Manaphy existing and the general commonality of good Pokemon being weak to Grass (eg Water Gliscor), and it's weakness to Ice can be a problem.
Ground Gyarados is strong, but the downsides you noted are real enough to keep it out of S rank and more along the lines of A+.
 
Jack Dalton said:
I'm surprised nobody here has nominated Grass Manaphy for S rank
Actually, I did, albeit in an edit. I just didn't provide much backing because I've never gotten around to using it and have tended to destroy it when I've fought it, so I knew it was good but didn't have a strong handle on how good.

It's also worth commentary that one limitation on Grass Manaphy is that its 100 base Speed, while enough to outspeed tons of things, still leaves it outsped by "actually fast" Pokemon, whom are usually carrying something that can hit at least neutrally. And since Tail Glow is the entire point, you can't Scarf Manaphy, because then it's just sort of mediocre, so it's not a reasonable plan to Scarf Manaphy for the surprise factor.

Pertinent examples include Mega Beedrill, Mega Lopunny, Crobat, Weavile, Mega Pidgeot, Hawlucha, Serperior now that Contrary has been released, Scolipede (Megahorn), Gengar, Mega Pinsir, Mienshao (U-Turn), and a number of Pokemon I haven't bothered to list because I've never seen them used/have doubts about their usability.

while only being weak to some of the worst offensive typings around: Poison/Bug/Flying(not really great in a Steel meta)
Talonflame is hugely popular, and with good reason, since so many things that aren't vulnerable to Brave Bird are things it will still outspeed and kill with Flare Blitz, and since it can add Fighting/Ground/Steel (I usually saw Steel) to provide Stealth Rock resistance it's much easier for it to get switch-ins, even if hazards are up. Otherwise I do agree with the basic sentiment -I've seen people use Mega Heracross, and that's about it for Bug offense other than U-Turn, while Poison is a bit more popular but risky to use, and I can't actually recall a non-Talonflame example of killing things with Flying moves in Hidden Type. (I saw an Electric Tornadus carrying Hurricane once?)

252+ Atk Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 80 HP / 0 Def Manaphy: 314-372 (86.9 - 103%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

This is with no Life Orb or Band (Heck, a Muscle Band raises it to a 75% chance of a OHKO) against Grass Manaphy. (Almost every Talonflame I saw was Banded) Even with an Agility pass, Manaphy is still gonna die or switch out if Talonflame comes in.

Skarmory can't even switch into a Crawdaunt because +2 Superpower will deal 110%+
Fighting-type Crawdaunt has to fear Drill Peck carrying sets though, and regardless I've never actually seen Swords Dance Crawdaunt -I ran Assault Vest myself, and saw Banded and Dragon Dance variants a lot. This also seems an odd argument to make given that Crawdaunt is realistically going to slap Skarmory with Knock Off first on the assumption of Leftovers+Sturdy, and then use other moves. Superpower is just weakening you to no real gain, unless you've got Stealth Rock up to break Sturdy.

Anyway, regardless, having talked with Kl4ng I'm of the opinion at this point that Dragon Skarmory is primarily useful if for some reason your team desperately needs a Physical wall against Water types. Overall Electric is probably superior. Water also has some uses. (Though I think Kl4ng underestimates how useful/popular Thunderpunch/Fang is)

There's very few things to nail with an Earthquake other than Altarias and other Fairy/Steels since Flying type is thrown on anything weak to Ground.
Not really. Tyranitar usually runs Ghost (With Flying variants running around just to screw with people assuming Ghost), and tons of Pokemon will add a Ground vulnerable type because they're adding Steel (Because Steel is awesome) or adding Fire (Burn immunity, STAB on Fire moves -I ran a Fire Clefable for a while) or adding Poison (It's amazing for plenty of Dark types, and can also provide STAB on Poison coverage if you have that, such as Scrafty) or adding Electric (STAB on Electric moves is really useful, and it only adds one weaknesses vs three potentially crucial resistances) and there's a fair number of Pokemon for whom covering some other weakness is more important or they desperately want some STAB more. (I've seen Nidoking a few times, and it was never Flying -my best guesses are Fire or Ice for STAB, but I never had an opportunity to pin it down) Even considering how many cases are Flying or Levitating Pokemon (eg Steel Zapdos and Fire Zapdos are both things, as is Steel Cresselia), there's still tons of Pokemon that either remain weak to Ground or become weak to Ground in Hidden Type.

If a non-stall team isn't carrying Ground coverage, it's stupid, full stop.

I would also like to add that Hippowdon checks it reliably, and is a fantastic wall in general.

+1 252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 204-241 (48.5 - 57.3%) -- 46.9% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

So it switches in on the Dragon Dance (Or you just hit it with a Return like a moron, whatever) and then laughs off a hit and Whirlwinds you out -or it does this

0 Atk Hippowdon Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Altaria: 218-258 (74.9 - 88.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage

and Steel or Fire Mega Altaria is pretty screwed. Want to Fire Blast it? Yeah no, it's Water typed

0 SpA Altaria Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Hippowdon: 84-99 (20 - 23.5%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery

not happening in a million years. (This is Fire Altaria, for reference) And of course Hippowdon has got a Sandstorm going, so if you're Fire typed you're on the clock even if what happens is Hippowdon Earthquakes and you KO it, somehow.

Mega Altaria is great stuff, I just think you're overselling it a bit -Ground weakness is bad, for starters. It also is competing with other Megas, including the likes of Mega Charizard X (Dark is awesome and is unimpressed by Flying or Grass Heatran), Mega Blastoise (Steel and Fighting variants have horrifying damage output), Mega Pinsir (Worse than your average new player thinks, but it still has out-of-the-box nastiness), Mega Gardevoir (Out-of-the-box firepower, and has more utility moves like Will O Wisp, and with Electric typing counters important threats like Flying Heatran), and other ORAS Megas.
 
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To be fair, Hippo laughs at any physical attack regardless of who is throwing it. It's hardly a reason to discredit Mega Altaria for having trouble against it when not even the mightiest physical force in the meta can OHKO it at +2. Not even Alomomola can boast that kind of bulk.

+2 252+ Atk Adaptability Crawdaunt Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 348-410 (82.8 - 97.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
 
True, but for instance Dragonite isn't afraid of being almost OHKOed by a Physically Defensive Hippowdon. My point was less the "laughs at your damage" thing -because, yeah, that's true even of ridiculous Physical attackers- and more "survives and can do horrifying damage back", which can lead to a KO if you're already damaged -say from switching in on Stealth Rock. Most of the things in the tier that Hippowdon walls are things Hippodown Roars out, or causes to leave through the futility of hitting it (Especially if it's carrying a Rocky Helmet, which can turn that calc I provided up there into "it hits you with Earthquake and you hit it with Return and die") while it sets Stealth Rock, or whatever. Most Physical attackers aren't actually scared of Hippowdon -just frustrated by it. It also illustrates -well, lemme show off Gyarados

252+ Atk Gyarados Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Altaria: 320-380 (109.9 - 130.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Ground Gyarados against Steel Mega Altaria)

meanwhile

252+ Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Frustration vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Gyarados: 256-303 (77.3 - 91.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery (Fairy Mega Altaria against that same Ground Gyarados)

(I'm assuming that Altaria uses Dragon Dance on the switch-in but loses the Attack boost to Intimidate)

So basically that's another prominent Ground Pokemon that, in fact, can switch in on Mega Altaria and destroy it. And this is a Gyarados with nearly no bulk, no boosting, etc. (With Leftovers it will still usually be 2HKOed by two Returns back-to-back [95.7% chance], but it doesn't take much bulk to remove that problem) I'm not even going to bother calcing Landorus-Therian or Incarnate (And remember: while Fighting Incarnate is one popular option, so too is Poison Incarnate, which resists Return!), both of which were quite popular. (I will readily admit most Therian were Steel-typed and thus vulnerable to a Fire Blast, or more bizarrely Bug typed under the assumption of U-Turn abuse, but I also saw a fair number of Fire examples, providing Burn immunity while reducing the Ice weakness -it was quite good, too!)

So yeah, that Ground weakness is actually a factor. That's my point. (The fact that Hippowdon laughs at damage just ensures it will survive to attack/Roar)

Also we totally need to have our tournament match at some point. pls respond on your profile or something.
 
I could see Ground Haxorus being very high rank due to the prevalence of steel types and dragon types, partnered with mold breaker's ability to hit shedinja as well as other pokemon who will use levitate to get to no weaknesses. (Dark Weezing, for example.)
You are Flying.
Thank you, that clears things up. Although I can't honestly think of a scenario where this would come in handy.
 
Yea, moldy grounds are terrific here, as most levitators won't hesitate to add steel. I've toyed with ground kyu-b with moderate success and ofc excadrill is wonderful for that role as well.
 
Ok I've been a little busy, but I'd like to start working on the A rank pretty soon here. It seems unanimous that Steel Dragonite is S rank material, being able to set up on basically anything and sweep. Grass Manaphy is also looking like S rank for similar reasons. Both mons share incredible typing, powerful boosting moves and great coverage(Manaphy's being unresisted outside of niche things like Fire Ludicolo and Steel Toxicroak, but who even uses those). Are there any objections to these two being the pioneers of Hidden Type S rank?

If not, then we can start talking about A (+/-) rank.

I feel like A rank will have a lot of Water/Ground types since they've been very strong in the meta. Ground Gyarados is easily A+, being able to rip through any team lacking Grass coverage. Water Gliscor performs very well as a defensive pivot for balance teams, while Water Hippowdon is the bulky wall that stall loves and adores, so I think they've both earned a place in A rank.

Feel free to start nominating for A rank, and if you have concerns with the S rank starting lineup don't be afraid to post either.
 

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Hey Jack Dalton, can you post descriptions of Steel Dragonite and Grass Manaphy for S Rank so that I can link to it from the viability ranking list? Something like this (but I prefer separate posts).

And for future stuff as well :).
 
So in my team I was trying to figure what to give to a specs magnezone, and I decided to go with the worst defensivly:
Ice.
And to my surprise, it nets so many surprise KO's its not even funny, as it seems many people tend to assume fire.
Granted this turns the little guy into a glass cannon but hey, it still seems to work for breaking through some steel walls that usualy attempt to patch their weaknesses but still stay 2x to ice.
Honestly I'm kinda surprised I dont see much use for magnezone as people tend to add steel typing to nearly everything.
 

OLD GREGG (im back baby)

old gregg for life
Steel Zapdos for A rank. Having passable bulk, good support move pool, and one weakness is a huge boon to this bird. It can defog, agility pass, pressure stall, etc...
Watch out for EQ or CC on the roost and you are good to go.
 
As requested, a proper introduction to the first god of Hidden Type:

For S Rank:




/
|

Reiterating what has been said so far, Steel Dragonite is incredible in Hidden Type, having its Rock, Dragon, and Fairy weaknesses patched up while the Ice weakness is alleviated. This allows it to set up a Dragon Dance on practically anything in the meta and go to town, hitting hard with its new STAB in Iron Head as well as other coverage options such as the Elemental Punches and EdgeQuake. With all of that, Dragonite is capable of beating anything your team needs it to and cleaning up the late game. Just seeing this monster in the team preview is enough to put a ton of pressure on the opponent to plan for its arrival onto the field.
 
Ground Gyarados is easily A+, being able to rip through any team lacking Grass coverage. Water Gliscor performs very well as a defensive pivot for balance teams, while Water Hippowdon is the bulky wall that stall loves and adores, so I think they've both earned a place in A rank.
Absolutely agree.

Steel Zapdos for A rank. Having passable bulk, good support move pool, and one weakness is a huge boon to this bird. It can defog, agility pass, pressure stall, etc...
Watch out for EQ or CC on the roost and you are good to go.
I think the way the ranks are defined Steel Zapdos might be a B rank. It's a good Pokemon, but there's nothing really good it does/anything it does really well.

Anyone, some nominations on my part...

-Poison type Scrafty. It's an amazing Pokemon, suddenly able to survive random High Jump Kicks and Close Combats without dying and enabling it to Drain Punch its way to victory, it can't be hit with Toxic to slow it down, it has STAB on Poison Jab and thus can explode any Fairy type foolish enough to appear before it without Steel typing, it's no longer doubly weak to Fairy anyway which often lets it make a mistake (Such as Poison Jab into Clefable -oops! It's Steel type) and survive the experience and possible keep contributing substantially. (Drain Punch the aforementioned Clefable, survive its next attack therefore, and then KO it if it stays in and trigger Moxie) The only trade-off is the weakness to Ground, which is manageable, even with how many other excellent Pokemon are Ground types that like their Ground STAB. (And I haven't even mentioned the acquirement of Bug, Poison, and Grass resistances, which are useful)

-Dark type Mega Charizard X. Replacing Earthquake with Crunch and laughing at the idea of Flying Heatran laughing at it, (+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Crunch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Heatran: 196-232 (50.7 - 60.1%) -- 86.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery) it's still a really nasty threat, just like in standard OU. There are certain type combinations -all centered around Fairies- that are both viable and a bit difficult to push past, such as Fire Togekiss, but there's nothing that I'd call a hard counter after it's gotten just one turn of setup. Its still a manageable threat for several reasons -it hates Stealth Rock, it has 4MSS if it wants recovery, its hardest hitting attack is ineffective against several of the tier's best Physical walls, and most damning of all it's weak to both Fighting and Ground, which everybody is carrying to deal with Steel- but it's really good, like I'd probably recommend it as the default Mega if Mega Altaria hadn't come along.

-Electric type Mega Gardevoir. It places enormous offensive pressure on anything slower than it (And it's surprising how many of Hidden Type's favorites are slower than it) with just Hyper Voice and Thunderbolt (I don't even run a Psychic move on it), it has Will O Wisp to screw with Physical attackers of most stripes (A gutsy player can stay in on Bisharp, anticipating a Sucker Punch or a Swords Dance, and Will O Wisp it, or do the same to a Tyranitar that intends to start a Dragon Dance sweep) including most notably Dragonite, and the Electric typing provides two major defensive advantages: firstly, it renders Mega Gardevoir no longer weak to Steel. Since Steel is the preferred anti-Fairy type, not Poison, it's not actually unusual for an entire team to lack Poison coverage, whereas Steel is everywhere. Secondly, it provides Flying resistance -Banded Talonflame will OHKO it most of the time if it's not Flying resistant, but cannot do so unless it's already half-dead with Flying resistance. Among other points, Dragonite cannot safely switch in on at all. Not only that, but it can reliably kill Flying Heatran (Grass Heatran is an issue, though), most Skarmory (Electric presents a bit of a problem), any form of Talonflame except Ground (Which, surprisingly enough, I've never seen), Azumarill... the list is quite long. Its primary flaws are that it's fragile, that its only healing is Wish, and that its Speed tier is merely 100. Before you ask, I'm not nominating Steel because Steel renders it vulnerable to Fire (Compromising its ability to deal with Flying Heatran and allowing Talonflame to just Flare Blitz it to death without a Band, among other problems) and provides no STAB, substantially reducing its offensive pressure.

-Speaking of Flying Heatran, Flying Heatran. It's really really good. I'd also want Grass Heatran slashed with it, personally -it doesn't cover the Fighting weakness and is less protective against the Ground weakness, but not only is it a nasty surprise for anyone who brings in Electric assuming that it's Flying, but it also covers the Water weakness, while throwing in Spore/Leech Seed immunity, which is surprisingly relevant, while its only particular disadvantage is that you no longer resist Flying -but Heatran is sufficiently bulky that Flying threats still struggle to take it down. Neither Heatran is S material, but I think A is probably solid.

-Skarmory of some stripe. At this point I think Electric is probably its overall best (The more I dig around the more I realize Dragon has major flaws -ie Mega Gardevoir is perfectly happy to melt you with Hyper Voice), but it is most certainly the case that Skarmory is an excellent Pokemon.

Hopefully I'll remember to cover more later.
 
Hidden Type is looking like a good contender for March's OMotM, so let's get things rolling here.

First off, I would like to nominate something I've been trying out a bit for A- rank. That is none other than Steel Tangrowth. With Steel typing, you take on all the resistances and immunities of a vanilla Ferrothorn while also getting to abuse RegenVest. This thing is almost a full stop to any Water/Ground that threatens to sweep, and also checks things like Electric Gardevoir(lacking focus blast).

Second, Fighting Crawdaunt is still the best physical wallbreaker I know of, being capable of OHKO'ing most physical walls after one SD. People really underrate how absurdly strong this thing is, and I'd like to see it somewhere in A rank. Boasting the most powerful Knock Off in the meta, Crawdaunt crushes stall, while having hard hitting Aqua Jets to help vs offense. You can opt for more power in Life Orb to OHKO Hippowdon, or you can opt for Lum Berry to set up on things like Heatran that would try to Wisp/Plume you.


-Poison type Scrafty. It's an amazing Pokemon, suddenly able to survive random High Jump Kicks and Close Combats without dying and enabling it to Drain Punch its way to victory, it can't be hit with Toxic to slow it down, it has STAB on Poison Jab and thus can explode any Fairy type foolish enough to appear before it without Steel typing, it's no longer doubly weak to Fairy anyway which often lets it make a mistake (Such as Poison Jab into Clefable -oops! It's Steel type) and survive the experience and possible keep contributing substantially. (Drain Punch the aforementioned Clefable, survive its next attack therefore, and then KO it if it stays in and trigger Moxie) The only trade-off is the weakness to Ground, which is manageable, even with how many other excellent Pokemon are Ground types that like their Ground STAB. (And I haven't even mentioned the acquirement of Bug, Poison, and Grass resistances, which are useful)
I saw this in action a bit and I wasn't super impressed. Scrafty is very slow, and still doesn't even 2hko SpDef Flying Heatran with High Jump Kick(can't even set up on it). It just feels very easy to wall, getting destroyed by Heatran, Skarmory, Gliscor, and Hippowdon. Even with Poison typing it can't revenge kill Manaphy without a weird EV spread that hinders its ability to be a DDance sweeper. It's just not in the same league as other offensive threats like Mega Gardevoir, Keldeo, Gyarados, and Mega Altaria.

-Dark type Mega Charizard X. Replacing Earthquake with Crunch and laughing at the idea of Flying Heatran laughing at it, (+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Crunch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Heatran: 196-232 (50.7 - 60.1%) -- 86.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery) it's still a really nasty threat, just like in standard OU. There are certain type combinations -all centered around Fairies- that are both viable and a bit difficult to push past, such as Fire Togekiss, but there's nothing that I'd call a hard counter after it's gotten just one turn of setup. Its still a manageable threat for several reasons -it hates Stealth Rock, it has 4MSS if it wants recovery, its hardest hitting attack is ineffective against several of the tier's best Physical walls, and most damning of all it's weak to both Fighting and Ground, which everybody is carrying to deal with Steel- but it's really good, like I'd probably recommend it as the default Mega if Mega Altaria hadn't come along.
I just don't feel like Char X is good in this meta. Auto-losing to Fairy/Dragon which is very common(not just because of Mega Altaria), 4x weak to rocks, loses to common offensive types, etc. Dragonite just outclasses it as a Dragon Dance sweeper without taking a mega slot. As powerful as Tough Claws is and such, I think B+ would suit this thing better.

-Electric type Mega Gardevoir. It places enormous offensive pressure on anything slower than it (And it's surprising how many of Hidden Type's favorites are slower than it) with just Hyper Voice and Thunderbolt (I don't even run a Psychic move on it), it has Will O Wisp to screw with Physical attackers of most stripes (A gutsy player can stay in on Bisharp, anticipating a Sucker Punch or a Swords Dance, and Will O Wisp it, or do the same to a Tyranitar that intends to start a Dragon Dance sweep) including most notably Dragonite, and the Electric typing provides two major defensive advantages: firstly, it renders Mega Gardevoir no longer weak to Steel. Since Steel is the preferred anti-Fairy type, not Poison, it's not actually unusual for an entire team to lack Poison coverage, whereas Steel is everywhere. Secondly, it provides Flying resistance ...
Electric Gardevoir hits like a truck and a half, easily 2HKO'ing SpDef Flying Heatran with just one Tbolt. 100 is a fine speed tier for Hidden Type since it's a bulkier meta and usually the only thing outspeeding that is something that's already set up a Dragon Dance. I could see this thing in A+.

-Speaking of Flying Heatran, Flying Heatran. It's really really good. I'd also want Grass Heatran slashed with it, personally -it doesn't cover the Fighting weakness and is less protective against the Ground weakness, but not only is it a nasty surprise for anyone who brings in Electric assuming that it's Flying, but it also covers the Water weakness, while throwing in Spore/Leech Seed immunity, which is surprisingly relevant, while its only particular disadvantage is that you no longer resist Flying -but Heatran is sufficiently bulky that Flying threats still struggle to take it down. Neither Heatran is S material, but I think A is probably solid.
Heatran has been great since day 1 of Hidden Type, the fact that it's still so prevalent in the meta after ORAS is a testament to how solid it is. A+.

-Skarmory of some stripe. At this point I think Electric is probably its overall best (The more I dig around the more I realize Dragon has major flaws -ie Mega Gardevoir is perfectly happy to melt you with Hyper Voice), but it is most certainly the case that Skarmory is an excellent Pokemon.
Skarmory isn't as strong in Hidden Type as it is in regular OU or other metas, but that's simply because offensive threats can opt for new STAB to help get around this thing. I still think it's good though. At least good enough to find a home in A rank.
 
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I saw this in action a bit and I wasn't super impressed. Scrafty is very slow, and still doesn't even 2hko SpDef Flying Heatran with High Jump Kick(can't even set up on it). It just feels very easy to wall, getting destroyed by Heatran, Skarmory, Gliscor, and Hippowdon. Even with Poison typing it can't revenge kill Manaphy without a weird EV spread that hinders its ability to be a DDance sweeper. It's just not in the same league as other offensive threats like Mega Gardevoir, Keldeo, Gyarados, and Mega Altaria.
+3 252 SpA Manaphy Scald vs. 60 HP / 0 SpD Scrafty: 241-285 (84.2 - 99.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

This is the exact amount of HP I run on my Scrafty, and it requires a lucky Burn on the enemy's part to take Scrafty down in one hit if they even have a Tail Glow up. If they don't have a Tail Glow up, I cleanly 2HKO them.

252+ Atk Scrafty Poison Jab vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Manaphy: 224-266 (55.4 - 65.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

In fact, if events play out as Scrafty Dragon Dances while they switch in Manaphy, Scrafty Dragon Dances again while Manaphy does whatever, Manaphy has to get a lucky Burn to not then be outsped and OHKOed by Poison Jab. (And it'll still be 2HKOed by a Burned +2 Scrafty, it's just that it's permanently crippled Scrafty if Scrafty doesn't have Shed Skin)

Scrafty isn't a counter to Manaphy or even a check, but it's not trivialized by Manaphy like you're saying it is.

Hippowdon and Gliscor are legitimate problems for Scrafty if they realize they can slam it with Earthquake for heavy damage, but Gliscor is risky to switch in on Scrafty until its Toxic Orb has actually triggered and Hippowdon still won't be happy to lose its Leftovers. Skarmory, too, resents losing its Leftovers or Rocky Helmet. Heatran has to be carrying Earth Power or Will O Wisp to present a real problem, the latter can be mitigated with Shed Skin while the former is unpopular (With good reason), which leaves the most realistic scenario being that Heatran Roars it out having taken either two hits of more than 25% apiece from Drain Punch (If Specially Defensive Heatran -I'm not sure what the most common Hidden Type Heatran is) or taken one hit off one or more Dragon Dance boosts, or worse yet lost its Leftovers to Knock Off, which can remove just under 40% of its health on a high roll with no boost. That's a lot of pain for Heatran to suffer to achieve a pretty limited result.

No, Scrafty isn't going to be sweeping a wall-heavy team, but it certainly annoys them, and more offensive teams can be 6-0ed by Scrafty if you bring it in with good timing. It's also difficult to wear down due to Drain Punch and its surprisingly excellent bulk, it tears off items from walls, and it's great at sounding out the enemy team's typing. It can even take down Steel Dragonite if it's gotten just one Dragon Dance off (If Dragonite is fresh and Stealth Rock is not up, it won't work if they're carrying Earthquake, but otherwise it can absolutely happen), and even Earthquake isn't necessarily good enough to stop it.

252+ Atk Dragonite Earthquake vs. 60 HP / 0 Def Scrafty: 218-258 (76.2 - 90.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

(It does have a major flaw: Ghost Mega Tyranitar is free to set up in its face, even if it's at +3 Attack!)

I'm also not clear why you'd even run High Jump Kick on Scrafty. Drain Punch is far superior for keeping Scrafty in the game to take advantage of either Moxie or Shed Skin, and doesn't risk random 50% recoils because you missed or the enemy Protected. (Which, for instance, Heatran often runs so it can get more Leftovers healing)

I just don't feel like Char X is good in this meta. Auto-losing to Fairy/Dragon which is very common(not just because of Mega Altaria), 4x weak to rocks, loses to common offensive types, etc. Dragonite just outclasses it as a Dragon Dance sweeper without taking a mega slot. As powerful as Tough Claws is and such, I think B+ would suit this thing better.
...? I guess Azumarill sometimes runs Dragon? There's not many Fairies for whom adding Dragon is even slightly worthwhile, honestly, and even though I've seen Azumarill run Dragon that's also sort of irrelevant because Water/Fairy is completely identical to Fairy/Dragon for the purposes of trying to wall Dark Mega Charizard X. I also suspect you're assuming a set of Flare Blitz/Dragon Claw/Crunch/Dragon Dance, and if you are, really probably best thing to do with Dark Mega Charizard X is take the OU set and replace Dragon Claw with Crunch, keeping Earthquake, at which point Mega Altaria (Whether Fire or Steel) is not a hard stop to it.

Yeah, there's still things that present a problem for Dark Mega Charizard X with that set -it struggles badly against Fire Togekiss for example- but the only thing off the top of my head that's pretty excellent and a giant FU to that set is Flying Tyranitar, and even then it takes an uncomfortable amount of damage from Flare Blitz on the switch-in if it's not Mega-d already.

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyranitar: 132-156 (38.7 - 45.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Not enough for X to 2HKO it without luck (Crit and/or Burn), no, but Tyranitar doesn't have recovery either, so it's not thrilled to be taking this kind of a hit.

I can be persuaded that Dark Mega Charizard X is merely B+, but the the Fairy/Dragon thing is a strange objection to bring up, honestly. The double weakness to Stealth Rock also isn't a big deal if you lead with X and/or have adequate hazard management. About the only thing I can agree with is that being weak to both Fighting and Ground isn't a fun thing to be, and even then Ground is a tricky offensive type in Hidden Type since literally anything can be lolrandom immune to it, even though it's also one of the types that hits Steel super effectively and therefore is important. Same for Fighting due to Ghost, even though it also has the Steel thing going on.

I have no comment on Steel Tangrowth (I've not been impressed when I saw it, personally, but I also haven't seen it much), but I can agree with Fighting Crawdaunt. Used well, it's utterly ridiculous.

Also it's occurred to me: does Ghost Chansey fit in here? It's Chansey, but replacing Fighting weakness with Dark weakness and gaining a free immunity, but Hidden Type is a different meta from OU.

I'm also torn on Ghost Porygon-Z. It's a really nasty customer (Excellent STAB Adaptability coverage), but even aside from how it struggles against its fellow Normal/Ghosts, it's still got all its usual problems, so even though it's a fantastic wallbreaker I'm not sure whether it actually qualifies for an A.

Oh, and since I incidentally brought it up earlier: Ghost or Flying Tyranitar, both of which are really excellent and the fact that Tyranitar can be either one makes it easy to slip up and use the wrong move for a given Tyranitar. I don't think I really need to cover why it's so excellent in detail, though I will say it can 6-0 teams on its own. (If I need to cover why it's so amazing, I will though) Honestly, I'd probably propose it as S rank if Steel Dragonite wasn't much the same, but overall even better.
 
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So after I've battled a few battles and tried out some stuff, one thing Immediately got my attention:



Lopunny-Mega @ Lopunnite
Ability: Limber
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 Def / 30 SpD
- Fake Out
- Frustration
- High Jump Kick
- filler

When I first thought about threatening Megas ORAS introduced, this thing immediately came to mind. Although it doesn't really gain much by adding a third type onto it, it still gets the threatening unresisted coverage it gets in OU. In Hidden type, it also has the nice bonus of completely demolishing walls that added a ghost type to dodge fighting attacks (most notable Chansey) and the steel type being really common. For secondary types, I've found ghost and electric the most useful ones. Ghost let's you dodge Mach Punchs and allow you to switch in on predicted Seismic Toss from Chansey's without taking damage. Electric makes flying attacks neutral, so Skarmory can't Ko you if you happen to mispredict and more importantly, it makes Thunder Punch stronger (if you happen to use it). For filler moves, you have many options. One option would be Healing Wish, which can be a nice support move to have for HO teams, exspecially on a fast mon like Lopunny. Other options include Toxic (although it's not as good due to the pure amount of steel types), Thunder Punch (isn't really worth it tho, stab normal or fighting attacks are almost always stronger) and Encore (useful when someone protects because he/she predicted Fake Out or High Jump Kick). So yeah, have fun using this monster. :D I'll probably add some promising calcs when I have the time.
 
So after I've battled a few battles and tried out some stuff, one thing Immediately got my attention:



Lopunny-Mega @ Lopunnite
Ability: Limber
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 Def / 30 SpD
- Fake Out
- Frustration
- High Jump Kick
- filler

When I first thought about threatening Megas ORAS introduced, this thing immediately came to mind. Although it doesn't really gain much by adding a third type onto it, it still gets the threatening unresisted coverage it gets in OU. In Hidden type, it also has the nice bonus of completely demolishing walls that added a ghost type to dodge fighting attacks (most notable Chansey) and the steel type being really common. For secondary types, I've found ghost and electric the most useful ones. Ghost let's you dodge Mach Punchs and allow you to switch in on predicted Seismic Toss from Chansey's without taking damage. Electric makes flying attacks neutral, so Skarmory can't Ko you if you happen to mispredict and more importantly, it makes Thunder Punch stronger (if you happen to use it). For filler moves, you have many options. One option would be Healing Wish, which can be a nice support move to have for HO teams, exspecially on a fast mon like Lopunny. Other options include Toxic (although it's not as good due to the pure amount of steel types), Thunder Punch (isn't really worth it tho, stab normal or fighting attacks are almost always stronger) and Encore (useful when someone protects because he/she predicted Fake Out or High Jump Kick). So yeah, have fun using this monster. :D I'll probably add some promising calcs when I have the time.
Fire is an incredible addition to any Physical Attacker for whom you don't have a very good idea what to add. Thanks to its Fighting type, it'd still be neutral to Rocks.

Being immune to WillOWisp will help you deal with walls that you can only 3HKO on switch and can also be momentum-turning in a pinch.
 
The meta game seems really cool so I have a few things I would like to talk about.

Firstly I think its really cool that an extra type you make make far more 2 pokemon cores that resist or are immune to every type. Rather than just Hydreigon + Doublade.
I've come up with a few thus far but I know there are likely plenty more and that most of these pokemon can probably benefit more from a different Hidden Type.
Here are the ones I've thought of:
Steel Chandelure / Ghost Heatran + Fighting/Steel Hydreigon
Steel Chandelure / Ghost Heatran + Dark Breloom/Chesnaught/Virizion
Steel Chandelure / Ghost Heatran + Fighting Shiftry/Cacturne
Steel Chandelure / Ghost Heatran + Grass Pangoro/Scrafty

Steel Mismagius + Dragon / Dark

(Poison/Electric)Hydreigon + Ghost / Steel

Steel Jellicent + (Poisons/Electric)Hydreigon
Steel Jellicent + Grass Houndoom

Steel Gengar + Dark / Dragon
Steel Gengar + Dark Lanturn with Volt Absorb
Steel Gengar + Dark Gastrodon, Seismitoad, Quagsire

Dark Heatran / Steel Flash Fire Houndoom + Psychic Breloom/Chesnaught/Virizion
Dark Heatran / Steel Flash Fire Houndoom + Fighting Celebi/Executor
Dark Heatran / Steel Flash Fire Houndoom + Fighting Whimsicott
Dark Heatran / Steel Flash Fire Houndoom + Grass Gallade/Medicham


Next I'd like to bring up one of my favorite pokemon which will finally have a decent niche in this meta, Steel Mantine.
With the addition of Steel typing Mantine is left with only one weakness (x4 electric) and resists Normal, Grass, Ice, Flying, Psychic, Dragon, Steel and Fairy, while being immune to Water, Ground and Poison. It also loses its SR weakness. Combine this with it 140 SpD and you know the Remoraid can rest easy.

Likely the most appealing thing about Steel Mantine is that it is one of the greatest checks to Grass Manaphy thanks to its typing, bulk and access to Haze.
252 SpA Manaphy Energy Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mantine: 35-42 (10.4 - 12.5%) -- possibly the worst move ever
+3 252 SpA Manaphy Energy Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mantine: 87-102 (26 - 30.5%) -- 4.6% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
+6 252 SpA Manaphy Energy Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mantine: 139-164 (41.6 - 49.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Game Freak y u no give this thing recovery Q_Q


Lastly I'd just like to ask a question regarding the viability of Gravity in this meta game.
Honestly practically all Levitators and Flying types don't hesitate to whack on Ground weak types and any pokemon that is initially weak to ground seems to just slap on Flying type and call it a day. As a result literally 90% of ground immune pokemon would be weak to it with Gravity active.
I'm definitely going to try gravity this month just asking if anyone else thinks it would be as potent as I do.
 
The meta game seems really cool so I have a few things I would like to talk about.

Firstly I think its really cool that an extra type you make make far more 2 pokemon cores that resist or are immune to every type. Rather than just Hydreigon + Doublade.
I've come up with a few thus far but I know there are likely plenty more and that most of these pokemon can probably benefit more from a different Hidden Type.
Here are the ones I've thought of:
Steel Chandelure / Ghost Heatran + Fighting/Steel Hydreigon
Steel Chandelure / Ghost Heatran + Dark Breloom/Chesnaught/Virizion
Steel Chandelure / Ghost Heatran + Fighting Shiftry/Cacturne
Steel Chandelure / Ghost Heatran + Grass Pangoro/Scrafty

Steel Mismagius + Dragon / Dark

(Poison/Electric)Hydreigon + Ghost / Steel

Steel Jellicent + (Poisons/Electric)Hydreigon
Steel Jellicent + Grass Houndoom

Steel Gengar + Dark / Dragon
Steel Gengar + Dark Lanturn with Volt Absorb
Steel Gengar + Dark Gastrodon, Seismitoad, Quagsire

Dark Heatran / Steel Flash Fire Houndoom + Psychic Breloom/Chesnaught/Virizion
Dark Heatran / Steel Flash Fire Houndoom + Fighting Celebi/Executor
Dark Heatran / Steel Flash Fire Houndoom + Fighting Whimsicott
Dark Heatran / Steel Flash Fire Houndoom + Grass Gallade/Medicham


Next I'd like to bring up one of my favorite pokemon which will finally have a decent niche in this meta, Steel Mantine.
With the addition of Steel typing Mantine is left with only one weakness (x4 electric) and resists Normal, Grass, Ice, Flying, Psychic, Dragon, Steel and Fairy, while being immune to Water, Ground and Poison. It also loses its SR weakness. Combine this with it 140 SpD and you know the Remoraid can rest easy.

Likely the most appealing thing about Steel Mantine is that it is one of the greatest checks to Grass Manaphy thanks to its typing, bulk and access to Haze.
252 SpA Manaphy Energy Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mantine: 35-42 (10.4 - 12.5%) -- possibly the worst move ever
+3 252 SpA Manaphy Energy Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mantine: 87-102 (26 - 30.5%) -- 4.6% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
+6 252 SpA Manaphy Energy Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mantine: 139-164 (41.6 - 49.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Game Freak y u no give this thing recovery Q_Q


Lastly I'd just like to ask a question regarding the viability of Gravity in this meta game.
Honestly practically all Levitators and Flying types don't hesitate to whack on Ground weak types and any pokemon that is initially weak to ground seems to just slap on Flying type and call it a day. As a result literally 90% of ground immune pokemon would be weak to it with Gravity active.
I'm definitely going to try gravity this month just asking if anyone else thinks it would be as potent as I do.
I remember that Gravity Landorus was all the hype the last time this was OMotM, but it kind of died out when Grass Manaphy took over.
 
I'm just naming some common threats I've seen over the threads and rank them based on my opinion.


Water Gliscor -> A

Water Gliscor should be at least A. With only two weaknesses being Grass and Ice, Gliscor can be deadly without its old *4 weakness [to Ice]. Poison Heal with a decent moveset (EQ, Knock Off, Aqua Tail, Swords Dance, Roost, Protect, Substitute) and two *2 weaknesses that aren't very common should get this wall to at least A. However, I don't think it isn't S material because it can be killed by Special Grass and Ice types easily (like the common Manaphy).

Does pretty well aganist Heatran too -
0 Atk Gliscor Aqua Tail vs. 180 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 176-210 (47.8 - 57%) -- 34.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Gliscor Aqua Tail vs. 180 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 248-294 (67.3 - 79.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery (with STAB)
252+ SpA Heatran Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Gliscor: 124-147 (35 - 41.5%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Poison Heal (dat bulk though)

Grass Manaphy - 252 SpA Manaphy Energy Ball vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Gliscor: 308-366 (87 - 103.3%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

Fighting Pinsir (Mega) -> B

Once on a roll, Fighting Pinsir can be deadly. Close Combat is a very powerful other STAB that can beat pokemon that resist flying (rock, steel). It is walled by a very common threat nowadays, Flying Heatran, and then OHKO.

Aganist Flying Heatran - 252 Atk Mega Pinsir Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 213-252 (55.1 - 65.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Aganist Steel/Fire Altaria - 252 Atk Mega Pinsir Close Combat vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Altaria: 207-244 (70.8 - 83.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

However, it can dispatch Steel Dragonite and the aforementioned Water Gliscor pretty well as it has decent bulk (65/120/90 is OK).

Aganist Steel Dragonite - 252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Multiscale Dragonite: 129-153 (33.4 - 39.6%) -- 17.7% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Aganist Water Gliscor - 252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Gliscor: 204-241 (57.6 - 68%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Poison Heal

It deserves B at the least but I dont see how it can be super good.


Electric/Ground Kyurem-Black -> B+

Kyurem-Black
is a powerhouse with 170/120/95 offenses. It can be electric to gain STAB from Fusion Bolt, one of its strongest moves other than dragon/ice STABs. It can also be ground and use Earth Power to beat Levitaters. The only niche it has over Excadrill with ground type is that it can run a mixed set and Earth Power is special.

The most important thing is the fact it beats Multiscale Steel Dragonite with Choice Band.

252+ Atk Choice Band Teravolt Kyurem-B Outrage vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Dragonite: 411-484 (106.4 - 125.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Life Orb - 252+ Atk Life Orb Teravolt Kyurem-B Outrage vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Dragonite: 356-421 (92.2 - 109%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO

Even with good bulk, its typing isn't very good. I think B+ is a good start for it.

I will post more...but this is my start.
 

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