How does the justice system work?

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never_again

Ive always heard the phrase, innocent until proven guilty

Anyways, I have a court summons tommorrow, I dont think the details are necessary as I checked that my offenses arnt anything above a violation.

So at the court, I dont want to pay a fine or do time or anything, so I might plea not guilty.

If I do so, would the court hold me or throw me in jail until my innocence is proven, or will they let me go and come back another time?

P.S. this isnt a simple question, I'll have more to add/edit and I dont want to make multiple threads, so Mods please dont lock it just yet

Also, if they do prove that Im guilty, I would probably be fined or sentenced to community service.

In the case of a fine, would the court seriously expect a 16 year old to have the necessary funds?

And if I get community service, will the hours be flexible, as you know, I have places to be and things to do...
 
Most likely they're gonna let you go and come back another time. I'm pretty sure they'd only keep you if it's a felony charge. What exactly did you get charged with though? I'm curious.
 
well If it were a felony charge, I wouldnt be here typing to you behind a computer right?

If you are so curious, it is for hiding a kitchen knife

and disorderly conduct. I dont even know what the disorderly conduct thing is about but who knows
 
No need to be a dick when you're the one asking a stupid question... If the answer was so obvious that you felt the need to make a smartass remark then why even ask it in the first place?
 
I didnt mean to be a dick
It just seemed as though you assumed me to be someone with like 8 felonies on my record

And so now that I've told you what the summons are for, what is the answer exactly?
 
What in my post made you think I was assuming you had 8 felonies on your record? All I stated was that they'd let go as long as it wasn't a felony charge... That's your answer.
 
OK now as promised, part 2 of my question

If I get fined or sentenced to community service, will they expect a 16 year old to have the money to pay a fine (altho it will be amusing to me if they made my parents pay it, in addition to being quite the irony)

and as for community service, will the hours be flexible because I dont want it to dictate my schedule
 
If you don't have the money I'm pretty sure they're gonna make your parents pay it, since you're a minor and they're liable. And I'm not sure about the second question. I think it depends on the judge.
 
you might as well give me ur screenname or something because it doesnt seem like anyone else is responding. but hopefully they will.

Anyways, If I plea not guilty but Im found to be guilty in the end, is the punishment ultimately greater than If I pleaded guilty in the beginning?
 
You should probably be consulting a lawyer if you want to be 100% sure of what is going to happen.

Like orangekows said, it is considered a minor charge and as long as you are deemed to be not a threat to society they'll let you go. Plus the fact that you are a minor and assuming you do not have a criminal record the judge should be fairly lenient in terms of sentencing.

How exactly do you not know why you have a disorderly conduct charge? If you really don't know then you should probably find out before you plead...
 
alright since you see to be more involved on smogon forums than on ur messaging, I have another question.

I think it might be too late for me to hire an attorney now as the summons is tommorrow

So is appearing by myself fine, I mean as you can see here, I am clueless when it comes to the means and ways of the legal system.

and as lincoln said, "representing urself in court means you have a fool for a client"

or something along those lines
 
I don't mean hire an attorney, just give one a call and explain your situation, I'm sure you could find one that would be more helpful than me with your questions.

It depends on the charge man, you should be okay but I am not sure...you really should check this out before appearing tomorrow.
 
Plead however you want. If you want to keep your record clear hire a lawyer.

I have been charged with disorderly conduct three times. I got off once. I received a 150 dollar fine the first time and 40 hours community service plus 100 dollars the second. Mine were all for making a scene when I thought cops/people were stepping on my rights. I don't know about the knife though, sometimes judges flip out over weapons.
 
Where exactly did you take the knife and how did they find out?


Don't worry if it's minor.

However, I suggest you consult a lawyer or at least should have. Even some advice might be useful.
 
you're asking the day before...?

not much time to help, so here are some quick things....

look, in addition to what has been said about you being allowed out on your own recognizance, you have may have to show you aren't a flight risk, which should be easy considering you are a minor.

if you wanted a lawyer, you should've asked the state for one, as they are required to assist you if you cannot afford one.

did you consider a plea deal before? you might be able to get just some community service with a guilty plea to disorderly conduct and get all the other charges dropped (depends on the strength of your case though).

and to answer your question about community service;you will be assigned a certain number of days a week, where at a specific time you will basically be doing whatever they want you to do (in my area its usually a couple hours, once or twice a week on weekends, picking up trash around the highways/busy streets or just some landscaping work).
 
I have no idea why I'm answering this, I'm bored I guess.

xxflyingsoloxx said:
If I do so, would the court hold me or throw me in jail until my innocence is proven, or will they let me go and come back another time?
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You're a 16 year old charged with what you call a "violation", no sane judge would actually hold you; they'd just release you into the custody of your parents. Regardless, it doesn't even sound like your case is going to be a something substantial so it wouldn't even come to that.

Also, if they do prove that Im guilty, I would probably be fined or sentenced to community service.
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Well, did you actually do it? If you actually did it and it's obvious you did to the court, just plead guilty. The judge will hand down a lighter punishment.

In the case of a fine, would the court seriously expect a 16 year old to have the necessary funds?
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The judge may allow your parents to pay, but if it's a judge typically working in juvenile cases they'll force you to get a job and pay the court back yourself.

And if I get community service, will the hours be flexible, as you know, I have places to be and things to do...
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Outside of school hours, after-school activities, employment, or religious services etc. If it's not during those time periods, the court doesn't recognize that as being "busy". They don't care if you "have places to be and things to do." Normally though, particularly in juvenile cases, a judge will impose a community service requirement, give you a reasonable due date, and tell you to figure it out yourself.

well If it were a felony charge, I wouldnt be here typing to you behind a computer right?
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Depends on the felony, most juvenile judges would just release you into the custody of your parents.

If you are so curious, it is for hiding a kitchen knife

and disorderly conduct. I dont even know what the disorderly conduct thing is about but who knows
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Obviously the circumstances matter here. Were you arrested for disorderly conduct and then they found the knife on you etc? Does the knife fit into your disorderly conduct (please don't tell me you got drunk and started showing off a knife you had with you in public)? Why would you be carrying a kitchen knife anyway?

If I get fined or sentenced to community service, will they expect a 16 year old to have the money to pay a fine (altho it will be amusing to me if they made my parents pay it, in addition to being quite the irony)

and as for community service, will the hours be flexible because I dont want it to dictate my schedule
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Answered above; however, can I give you some advice for court. Do NOT ask that to the judge. He'll just think you are so arrogant, asshole kid and give you more community service then you probably deserve. Your sense of entitlement is kind of amusing though, you commit a crime (it doesn't sound like you deny it, rather you just want to get out of it) and you are worrying about the court inconveniencing you.

Phantom_IV said:
IIRC, I don't think u get a lawyer for disorderly conduct. Although I'm also rather sure that that'll vary by state.
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It depends whether where he lives "disorderly conduct" (or whatever he is charged with) is classified as a criminal infraction or a criminal offense. It's it's something like disturbing the peace, he isn't entitled to a public defender since that's an infraction. If he is actually charged with a crime, then the court must appoint one if he requests it and is indigent; no matter how minor of a crime.

edit: I was just flipping channels and Gideon's Trumpet was playing. Coincidental eh (for those curious it's the story of landmark supreme court case Gideon v. Wainwright which greatly expanded the public defender system).
 
Posting to say I really hope they whack the biggest fine possible on you, give you as much community service as they can, and make sure you pay the fine.
 
I kinda agree with akuchi here. Arrogant? A knife? Disorderly conduct?

You sound like one of those kids who prowl around the streets at 3AM getting smashed. You're not telling us what you did because you know that you're guilty.

I'll admit that I'm assuming the worst. Everyone is prone to it. This is why you need to make a good impression at your appearance. You don't sound like a good liar either, so for your own sake, tell the truth.

It strikes me as odd that you're asking this stuff here, one day before your appearance. Did you have an arraignment? Talked to your parents about it?
 
Phantom_IV said:
IIRC, I don't think u get a lawyer for disorderly conduct. Although I'm also rather sure that that'll vary by state.
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i wasn't thinking the disorderly conduct, i was think of the possible charges he might have against him for the knife. concealing a weapon can be serious based on what state you are in, and can lead to a conspiracy to commit a crime charge if the prosecution has enough evidence (if others new, and believed that it would be used).
 
I don't give a shit what he's done mind, just his whole fucking attitude stinks. You do the crime, you take the chance of getting caught and you take the fucking consequences. If you're 'mature' enough to go drinking and stupid enough to get caught carrying a weapon (why the fuck? trying to look hard in front of your little friends, were we?) then you take the fucking community service and you pay your own damn fine, you don't hurr durr about how 'lol im poor but it'd be good if my parents got fined' or 'community service might not fit into my schedule :('. Your attitude is appalling. You're seeing yourself as a big tragic victim when you did the crime.

I've done things that would warrant much larger charges, as I expect quite a few people here have. But if I got caught by the police with, say, a quantity of MDMA on my person I wouldn't go 'oh :( poor me poor me I hope my parents get punished for it, that would be funny oh but I don't wanna do community service IT'S NOT FAIR' because it is bloody fair. That's how it works. Do crime, take chance of doing time, don't fucking bitch about it and certainly don't use it as a chance to show off your own arrogance, frankly revoltingly spoilt attitude and sense of entitlement.
 
lol akuchi, a regular on these forums as always

still as sympathetic as always

Anyways for your information, I wasnt carrying around anything trying to look all 'hard' in front of my little friends

I took it to threaten my parents and then I was walking around by myself listening to an ipod when some undercover cops rolled by, responding to a call that my parents made

Of course, at that time, I no longer had the knife with me, I threw it into some bush. When the cops searched my bag and didnt find anything, they asked where did the knife go, I responded with, "what knife"

eventually they made up some story about their only concern is that if some little kid pokes his head into the wrong bush and finds it, something serious could happen. So i lead them to it and they gave me summons

back to the matter at hand, As ive told you the court date was today

I showed up at summons court and the clerk scanned my summons and told me the knife charge was thrown out of court because the NYPD made a mistake on filling out the ticket

I also told them that I sent a letter in to postpone the court date, and the clerk was like alright w/e we'll send you a letter telling you to come back for the disorderly conduct ONLY.

So I ask, since I did not see a judge today, will the bench issue a warrant against me, or should I take the clerk at his word and just think that its all taken care of, even though the court hasnt sent me a letter back telling me their decision.

And for the record, theres no chance in hell Im paying 150 dollars for an incident that my parents started up.

This whole mess is my parents fault anyway, their only type of punishment happens to be calling the police, which they've done about 5 or 6 times now in the past 4 years. they can give me a direct command and I can refuse with no consequences to speak of, and these summons are the first real thing to come out of the police coming to my house all those times.

If I do get fined, I will probably laugh inside because my parents will probably have to pay the fine, as someone told me that my parents are legally liable, altho Im not sure how true that really is
 
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