ORAS OU Hyper Offense Char-Y

[Millionsunz]

Hyper/Hazard Offensive Mega Charizard Y Team



What's up everyone, I've been getting into competitive battling and I realized that I enjoy the Hyper Offense w/ Hazards style a lot more than anything else. I decided to build my own team from the ground up and starting working my way up the OU ladder. Although I peaked at around 1400, I cannot seem to get past that point. Any pointers or suggestions to improve the team will be greatly appreciated.

Klefki @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
IVs: 0 SpAtk
- Spikes
- Thunder Wave
- Foul Play
- Magnet Rise
Klefki is my usual lead Pokemon, and is usually sacrificed after it gets as many Spikes up as it can, unless the opposing team has a Defogger or a Spinner. With Lando-T leads running amok, I decided to add Magnet Rise to check them. Thunder Wave is also good for speed control and Foul Play is just there to do damage.

Charizard-Mega-Y @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Air Slash
- Solar Beam
- Roost
Mega Charizard Y is one of the most prominent wallbreakers in the OU tier. This thing hits like a truck. As with most people, I choose my mega before building the rest of the team, and Mega Charizard Y fit the bill I was looking to fill. Fire Blast in the sun destroys a lot of Pokemon period. Solar Beam is to cover its water weakness and I decided to run Air Slash to hit the Mega Venusaurs I encounter. Roost is there for longevity as Charizard is one of my most common Win Conditions.

Latios @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Defog
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Hidden Power [Fire]
Latios is the Defogger of the team, usually with the sole purpose of getting rid of stealth rocks for both Charizard and Weavile. Draco Meteor is always a must on a Lati, and Psyshock is for any Mega Venusaurs out there, and is a guarantee OHKO on Keldeo. Hidden Power Fire is a move used to hit the Steel Types that Latios lures in, with the exception with Heatran.

Weavile @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Low Kick
- Icicle Crash
- Ice Shard​

Weavile is one of the scariest revenge killers in the OU tier, and an absolute must on Hyper Offense Teams. Nothing save Choice Scarf users enjoy being in against this Pokemon. Knock Off is a great move in general, and Dark STAB for Weavile. Icicle Crash is also strong STAB, and Ice Shard is for priority. Low Kick is used to punish Pokemon like Heatran and Bisharp who think they can check this beast.

Landorus-Therian @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 80 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD / 168 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
Landorus-T is very good at filling multiple roles. My Lando-T is a sort of bulky yet offensive Stealth Rock setter, as SR is arguably the best hazard in the game. The EV set is used to take less damage from hits that would otherwise be detrimental. It also outspeeds all Jolly Base 70s, like Breloom and Metagross. Earthquake is STAB and Stone Edge is coverage, while U-Turn is used for momentum. Lando-T is also a good check for Heatran, who walls a majority of my team.

Serperior @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Leaf Storm
- Dragon Pulse
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Glare
For the final slot on my Hyper Offense team, I decided to choose Serperior, as I learned that I struggled with strong Water Type Pokemon that outspeed Charizard, like Keldeo and BD Aqua Jet Azumarill. Leaf Storm is obvious for Contrary Serperior, Dragon Pulse is for dragon type coverage, Hidden Power Fire is for Steel Types that Serperior baits in (not named Heatran). Glare is there to slow down Pokemon faster than Charizard that can KO it, like Scarf Ttar and Scarf Lando-T.

Any pointers/tips are appreciated and well wanted!​

 

[Cenamazing]

The first thing I want to say is that hazard stacking teams are almost never hyper offense. This is because they usually have 2 defensive pokemon to set up hazards, and Hyper offensive teams are limited to one. Your team isnt hyper offensive, its just offensive.
Number one rule of hazard-stacking: NEVER RUN DEFOG. Defog gets rid of all your hard work stacking hazards, and rapid spin is basically made for these teams. So the first order of business would be to swap out Latios. I could have easily gone with Starmie, but then you still would have had problems checking the threats of the tier. The choice I made may sound strange, but you will soon see how it improves your team.
I would swap Latios with Excadrill
Excadrill @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rock Slide
- Rapid Spin
This choice sounds very strange. You already have a steel type and ground type, neither of whom I will be changing. So why make this change? I'll explain with my next change, which is this.
Replace Weavile with Banded Tyranitar
Tyranitar @ Choice Band
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stone Edge
- Crunch
- Superpower
- Pursuit
Let me be the first to introduce you to one of the most dominant cores in ORAS OU: Mega Charizard Y, Banded Tyranitar, and Sand Rush Excadrill. This offensive core transformes your team into an offensive powerhouse. Excadrill under sand checks some of the most prominent threats in the tier, including Weavile, Mega Altaria, Latios, Fast Electrics, the list goes on. Banded Tyranitar works especially well with Mega Charizard Y. It excels at pursuit-trapping Latios and Latias, the two best checks to Mega Charizard Y in the game. It also hits incredibly hard on the physical side, perfectly complementing Mega Charizard Y's special wallbreaking abilities.
Run Focus Blast over Air Slash on Mega Charizard Y
Air Slash provides no useful coverage compared to focus blast, which let's you hit mons like Heatran that otherwise wall you.

That's all I would change. With this new team, Serperior will have its work cut out for it, as Keldeo and Azumarill are even more threatening, and I would also reccomend keeping Klefki around later in the match to continually set up spikes and use T-Wave. I wish you good luck in the future.

 

[zbr]

eh. nice cookie cutter ho team that utilises zard y in an interesting way. first off, i want to just say that in a ho team that centers around hazard stacking, perhaps defog is not the best way to go about it. however, on your team, you want too many things done. you're running hazard stack with a team that doesn't have a lot of mons that properly abuse it bar serp. zard y is one of those mons that limit switch ins by nature of it's offense and since hazard stacking team try not to stack up on too many mons that are weak to hazards, i think i have a few suggestions to change for your team.

cenamazing did a fair job of redoing your team such that it doesn't cause you to lose your hazards but it doesn't address the natural weakness to offensive waters like keldeo who are often paired with something like lando or chomp who don't rly fear the twave. your aim should be to start fast and end fast so let's center the changes around that. right off the bat, i think that we want this team to be a lot more fluid hence, my first suggestion is to run choice specs raikou over serperior is better simply because it helps you hit hard right off the bat, deters offensive waters like keldeo and is also able to gain momentum back with moves like volt switch. it also helps that it keeps pressure up and forces switches since that's the main focus of games when you're using hazard stacking teams.

now that you have a fast mon, i recommend you try something more sturdier and helps with just the general pace of the game and that is to run jolly SD LO crawdaunt over weavile. this is because crawdaunt is a generally underlooked mon when it comes to team building because of it's lack of speed. however, it's powerful boosted ajets and knock offs can easily force games into your favor esp when this team's aggressive nature allows it to come in multiple times due to lando-t and raikou's constant momentum gaining. next, some generally small and minor changes would include running earthquake + flamethrower with a mild nature over air slash + fire blast on zard y. this helps solve your heatran issue as well as just allowing you to gain more consistency since let's be honest here, truth is fire blast rarely hits. lando-t should also opt for this spread of 248 HP / 232 Def / 28 Spe with an impish nature to allow you to deal with physically oriented mons more easily once your keys keel over.

lastly, this might be the most uncomfortable and unorthodox change for you but i feel that hazard stacks klefki can opt for heal block + dazzling gleam over foul play + magnet rise. this is because heal block actually forces stall mons to break down more easily since they are unable to heal up, forcing them to either invoke their regenerators or force them out which you in turn gain momentum from. latios can also opt for heal block but is largely unnecessary since keys with heal block already do quite a great job at breaking stall teams up. if you want to be cheeky and ruthlessly aggressive, run memento over defog on lati to give your set up mons a nice switch in so that they can run ham on opposing teams. hopefully my suggestions help you climb up the ladder more and improve your team so that it rectifies some of the weaknesses that are present. good luck and have fun in the game! /cheers/

 

[Millionsunz]

eh. nice cookie cutter ho team that utilises zard y in an interesting way. first off, i want to just say that in a ho team that centers around hazard stacking, perhaps defog is not the best way to go about it. however, on your team, you want too many things done. you're running hazard stack with a team that doesn't have a lot of mons that properly abuse it bar serp. zard y is one of those mons that limit switch ins by nature of it's offense and since hazard stacking team try not to stack up on too many mons that are weak to hazards, i think i have a few suggestions to change for your team.

cenamazing did a fair job of redoing your team such that it doesn't cause you to lose your hazards but it doesn't address the natural weakness to offensive waters like keldeo who are often paired with something like lando or chomp who don't rly fear the twave. your aim should be to start fast and end fast so let's center the changes around that. right off the bat, i think that we want this team to be a lot more fluid hence, my first suggestion is to run choice specs raikou over serperior is better simply because it helps you hit hard right off the bat, deters offensive waters like keldeo and is also able to gain momentum back with moves like volt switch. it also helps that it keeps pressure up and forces switches since that's the main focus of games when you're using hazard stacking teams.

now that you have a fast mon, i recommend you try something more sturdier and helps with just the general pace of the game and that is to run jolly SD LO crawdaunt over weavile. this is because crawdaunt is a generally underlooked mon when it comes to team building because of it's lack of speed. however, it's powerful boosted ajets and knock offs can easily force games into your favor esp when this team's aggressive nature allows it to come in multiple times due to lando-t and raikou's constant momentum gaining. next, some generally small and minor changes would include running earthquake + flamethrower with a mild nature over air slash + fire blast on zard y. this helps solve your heatran issue as well as just allowing you to gain more consistency since let's be honest here, truth is fire blast rarely hits. lando-t should also opt for this spread of 248 HP / 232 Def / 28 Spe with an impish nature to allow you to deal with physically oriented mons more easily once your keys keel over.

lastly, this might be the most uncomfortable and unorthodox change for you but i feel that hazard stacks klefki can opt for heal block + dazzling gleam over foul play + magnet rise. this is because heal block actually forces stall mons to break down more easily since they are unable to heal up, forcing them to either invoke their regenerators or force them out which you in turn gain momentum from. latios can also opt for heal block but is largely unnecessary since keys with heal block already do quite a great job at breaking stall teams up. if you want to be cheeky and ruthlessly aggressive, run memento over defog on lati to give your set up mons a nice switch in so that they can run ham on opposing teams. hopefully my suggestions help you climb up the ladder more and improve your team so that it rectifies some of the weaknesses that are present. good luck and have fun in the game! /cheers/

Hey zbr, thanks for the suggestions. I like the idea of having Specs Raikou over Serperior, but I'm not sure about switching out Weavile for Crawdaunt. Crawdaunt does not have the speed to really function in my opinion, but I'll give it a shot and let you know what I think about it after battling. I do like the idea of running Earthquake on Charizard instead of Air Slash, but wouldn't Flamethrower miss out on OHKOs that Fire Blast would have? I also agree with you in the fact that my Lando-T EV spread needs a change. Heal Block Klefki/Latios seems a bit strange for me, as hyper offensive teams like mine are supposed to tear down Stall teams with heavy hits, like those from Charizard. If I was to run Memento over Defog on Latios, what would you recommend for hazard removal on my side of the field? Charizard Y is worn down to much by Stealth Rocks to function on a switch-aggressive team without a spinner or defogger. Thanks so much for the suggestions, and I'll get back to you on the Crawdaunt/Weavile suggestion.

The first thing I want to say is that hazard stacking teams are almost never hyper offense. This is because they usually have 2 defensive pokemon to set up hazards, and Hyper offensive teams are limited to one. Your team isnt hyper offensive, its just offensive.
Number one rule of hazard-stacking: NEVER RUN DEFOG. Defog gets rid of all your hard work stacking hazards, and rapid spin is basically made for these teams. So the first order of business would be to swap out Latios. I could have easily gone with Starmie, but then you still would have had problems checking the threats of the tier. The choice I made may sound strange, but you will soon see how it improves your team.
I would swap Latios with Excadrill
Excadrill @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rock Slide
- Rapid Spin
This choice sounds very strange. You already have a steel type and ground type, neither of whom I will be changing. So why make this change? I'll explain with my next change, which is this.
Replace Weavile with Banded Tyranitar
Tyranitar @ Choice Band
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stone Edge
- Crunch
- Superpower
- Pursuit
Let me be the first to introduce you to one of the most dominant cores in ORAS OU: Mega Charizard Y, Banded Tyranitar, and Sand Rush Excadrill. This offensive core transformes your team into an offensive powerhouse. Excadrill under sand checks some of the most prominent threats in the tier, including Weavile, Mega Altaria, Latios, Fast Electrics, the list goes on. Banded Tyranitar works especially well with Mega Charizard Y. It excels at pursuit-trapping Latios and Latias, the two best checks to Mega Charizard Y in the game. It also hits incredibly hard on the physical side, perfectly complementing Mega Charizard Y's special wallbreaking abilities.
Run Focus Blast over Air Slash on Mega Charizard Y
Air Slash provides no useful coverage compared to focus blast, which let's you hit mons like Heatran that otherwise wall you.

That's all I would change. With this new team, Serperior will have its work cut out for it, as Keldeo and Azumarill are even more threatening, and I would also reccomend keeping Klefki around later in the match to continually set up spikes and use T-Wave. I wish you good luck in the future.

I'm a little unsure about your suggestions Cenamazing, because then my team feels a bit Keldeo weak. I do like the idea of Rapid Spin Excadrill instead of Defog Latios, so I'll give it a try and see how it pans out. Thanks for the suggestions!

 

[zbr]

Hey zbr, thanks for the suggestions. I like the idea of having Specs Raikou over Serperior, but I'm not sure about switching out Weavile for Crawdaunt. Crawdaunt does not have the speed to really function in my opinion, but I'll give it a shot and let you know what I think about it after battling.

the reason why i opt for the crawdaunt change is simply because it's a heavy hitter that is largely underprepared for. weavile is something that is largely expected and i think that for offense to do well you need to shake things up and force your opponent into extremely uncomfortable positions which are capable with mons that normally unexpected C:

I do like the idea of running Earthquake on Charizard instead of Air Slash, but wouldn't Flamethrower miss out on OHKOs that Fire Blast would have?

fortunately, iirc there's not much that you miss out legitimately and with ft, it just generally helps with the consistency which is what i feel that HO teams are lacking with teams that go high power low accuracy.

I also agree with you in the fact that my Lando-T EV spread needs a change. Heal Block Klefki/Latios seems a bit strange for me, as hyper offensive teams like mine are supposed to tear down Stall teams with heavy hits, like those from Charizard.

imo, heal block helps against switches like chans, that your team has a harder time to deal with (daunt over weav breaks this issue) and like i said earlier, ho teams should be constantly forcing opponents into an uncomfortable position so heal block helps. cause mag rise is the norm to run.

If I was to run Memento over Defog on Latios, what would you recommend for hazard removal on my side of the field? Charizard Y is worn down to much by Stealth Rocks to function on a switch-aggressive team without a spinner or defogger. Thanks so much for the suggestions, and I'll get back to you on the Crawdaunt/Weavile suggestion.

menento over defog means that you don't run any hazard control at all which is the general idea of the team. which is why i opted out weavile since memento didn't rly add on to it's usefulness but a mon like daunt appreciates the memento. however, if you wanna try memento, then i suggest running memento defog draco psyshock on latios and then opting for hp ice on zard y.

keep in mind that my suggestions are tried and tested for me personally, meaning they are more tailored to my personal preferences. but go ahead and give them a shot if you want [:

 

[Cenamazing]

Hey zbr, thanks for the suggestions. I like the idea of having Specs Raikou over Serperior, but I'm not sure about switching out Weavile for Crawdaunt. Crawdaunt does not have the speed to really function in my opinion, but I'll give it a shot and let you know what I think about it after battling. I do like the idea of running Earthquake on Charizard instead of Air Slash, but wouldn't Flamethrower miss out on OHKOs that Fire Blast would have? I also agree with you in the fact that my Lando-T EV spread needs a change. Heal Block Klefki/Latios seems a bit strange for me, as hyper offensive teams like mine are supposed to tear down Stall teams with heavy hits, like those from Charizard. If I was to run Memento over Defog on Latios, what would you recommend for hazard removal on my side of the field? Charizard Y is worn down to much by Stealth Rocks to function on a switch-aggressive team without a spinner or defogger. Thanks so much for the suggestions, and I'll get back to you on the Crawdaunt/Weavile suggestion.




I'm a little unsure about your suggestions Cenamazing, because then my team feels a bit Keldeo weak. I do like the idea of Rapid Spin Excadrill instead of Defog Latios, so I'll give it a try and see how it pans out. Thanks for the suggestions!

Let me clarify a few things. For one thing, I also agree on changing your Landorus-T spreads but I would instead go for a max defense spread, like this:
Landorus-Therian @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 8 SpD / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- U-turn
- Stone Edge
This spread allows it to best take defensive hits, which is what it's meant to do in the first place

I know you're worried about Keldeo and Azumarill, but I would still say swap Weavile for Tyranitar, because Weavile can't do anything against either of those pokemon anyway.

You could go for specs Raikou over Serperior if you want, but in that case you should definetely run Tyranitar with Excadrill for more sweeping potential.

I've run both flamethrower and fire blast with Mega Charizard Y, and I would say that while fire blast doesn't land more kills, it is 100% the better choice. This is because fire blast better weakens checks that think they can switch in on Charizard. For example, Fire Blast does over half to Latios, while flamethrower is only a 3hko.

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Latios in Sun: 144-171 (48.1 - 57.1%) -- 91.8% chance to 2HKO

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Latios in Sun: 118-140 (39.4 - 46.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

I would say always run Fire Blast on hyper offense to nab extra kills.

As for Earthquake... DON'T. Seriously, if you only listen to one thing I say in this entire post, DON'T RUN EARTHQUAKE ON MEGA CHARIZARD Y. Focus Blast only has 70% accuracy, but it should ALWAYS be run over Earthquake because it hits everythink Earthquake hits (Heatran, Tyranitar, etc.) but it's a special attack, which means it actually does damage since it's using Charizard Y's broken special attack. Earthquake is just going to hold it back, if you don't trust me on anything ever, then please just trust me on this.

With Heal Block, I'd say go for it. Magnet rise is useful, but Klefki is a support pokemon, and you'll see that in higher tiers, people begin to expect it. Heal Block helps you deal with stall and pokemon who can use their healing moves to stall out low PP moves like Mega Charizard Y's Fire Blasts or Tyranitar's Stone Edges. As for Dazzling Gleam, you should probably run that too to better deal with fighting types

Running CB Crawdaunt is pointless when CBS Tyranitar does the exact same job AND deals with flying tyes AND turns Excadrill into a powerfull sweeper. I'd say you should just run Tyranitar and Excadrill instead of Latios and Crawdaunt.

Finally, definetely swap Latios for Excadrill, you really do need hazard control on a team with Mega Charizard Y, I don't know why zbr thinks you don't. It's an absolute nessessity for a team with a pokemon that takes 50% from rocks on switch in. Just use Excadrill with rapid spin, it's so much more useful for a Hazard Stacking Team.

Well, there's my two cents on the team. No matter who's way you go, Keldeo and Azumarill will always be a threat to your team, as both of them can 2HKO everyone on your team (Keldeo can even KO Latios if you still go that route With Icy Wind), so I see no reason not to use Tyranitar. I hope that whatever choice you make, you still do well with your team

 

[zbr]

I've run both flamethrower and fire blast with Mega Charizard Y, and I would say that while fire blast doesn't land more kills, it is 100% the better choice. This is because fire blast better weakens checks that think they can switch in on Charizard. For example, Fire Blast does over half to Latios, while flamethrower is only a 3hko.

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Latios in Sun: 144-171 (48.1 - 57.1%) -- 91.8% chance to 2HKO

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Latios in Sun: 118-140 (39.4 - 46.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

I would say always run Fire Blast on hyper offense to nab extra kills.

you're using the wrong spread fam. fire blast should use timid spreads but flamethrower should use modest spreads.
252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Latios in Sun: 130-153 (43.4 - 51.1%) -- 5.9% chance to 2HKO
not too much of a difference if you ask me since ya know, you wont stay in on a latios anyway and chances are it will roost up.

As for Earthquake... DON'T. Seriously, if you only listen to one thing I say in this entire post, DON'T RUN EARTHQUAKE ON MEGA CHARIZARD Y. Focus Blast only has 70% accuracy, but it should ALWAYS be run over Earthquake because it hits everythink Earthquake hits (Heatran, Tyranitar, etc.) but it's a special attack, which means it actually does damage since it's using Charizard Y's broken special attack. Earthquake is just going to hold it back, if you don't trust me on anything ever, then please just trust me on this.

252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 188+ SpD Heatran: 244-288 (63.2 - 74.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Heatran: 318-376 (82.3 - 97.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 Atk Mega Charizard Y Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 284-336 (73.5 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

i'd say once again, consistency is better for the long run. again it's personal preference and i've found eq more effective in the long run since fblast has a tendency to miss and i don't like to risk your attacker vs ttar anyway.

Running CB Crawdaunt is pointless when CBS Tyranitar does the exact same job AND deals with flying tyes AND turns Excadrill into a powerfull sweeper. I'd say you should just run Tyranitar and Excadrill instead of Latios and Crawdaunt.

LO SD daunt was the one i was referring to :x since ya know, with access to LO SD boosted adaptability jets and knock offs, it helps break past stallier teams that rely on skarm as their primary hazard controller

Finally, definetely swap Latios for Excadrill, you really do need hazard control on a team with Mega Charizard Y, I don't know why zbr thinks you don't.

see the thing about running drill + ttar is that it makes you incredibly wisp weak and drill reliant. LO drill going for spin is a "worse case scenario" thing because it's simply an inferior move to go for on an offensive mon that is meant to break apart teams. if you meant to run this squad with cb tar and lo drill, then you'd have to suggest another hazard controller since drill as a spinner is something that causes you to be walled by skarm and that forces you out into the zard y (since you didn't suggest the serp switch). ultimately, going this route would provide a lot of kinks on the team and would result in an entire revamp of the team, which is not what raters should end up doing to the team. minimum changes for maximum results.

 

[Cenamazing]

you're using the wrong spread fam. fire blast should use timid spreads but flamethrower should use modest spreads.
252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Latios in Sun: 130-153 (43.4 - 51.1%) -- 5.9% chance to 2HKO
not too much of a difference if you ask me since ya know, you wont stay in on a latios anyway and chances are it will roost up.

252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 188+ SpD Heatran: 244-288 (63.2 - 74.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Mega Charizard Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Heatran: 318-376 (82.3 - 97.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 Atk Mega Charizard Y Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 284-336 (73.5 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

i'd say once again, consistency is better for the long run. again it's personal preference and i've found eq more effective in the long run since fblast has a tendency to miss and i don't like to risk your attacker vs ttar anyway.LO SD daunt was the one i was referring to :x since ya know, with access to LO SD boosted adaptability jets and knock offs, it helps break past stallier teams that rely on skarm as their primary hazard controllersee the thing about running drill + ttar is that it makes you incredibly wisp weak and drill reliant. LO drill going for spin is a "worse case scenario" thing because it's simply an inferior move to go for on an offensive mon that is meant to break apart teams. if you meant to run this squad with cb tar and lo drill, then you'd have to suggest another hazard controller since drill as a spinner is something that causes you to be walled by skarm and that forces you out into the zard y (since you didn't suggest the serp switch). ultimately, going this route would provide a lot of kinks on the team and would result in an entire revamp of the team, which is not what raters should end up doing to the team. minimum changes for maximum results.

Generally, I would say you should never run modest/mild Zard Y on a Hyper Offensive team, or you'll be outsped by the things you're supposed to check.

This whole Zard Y argument is a matter of consistency vs power. From what I can tell, zbr has lost games because of misses and thinks that if you ever use a move that can miss you are 100% guaranteed to lose. I will admit, I have lost games because of misses, but the extra power and speed of Timid, Fire Blast, and focus Blast are incredibly important on an offensive team. Without Timid, pokemon Zard Y normally destroys like Excadrill suddenly become threats. Charizard is one of the best checks to sand, why throw that away? And even if the Latios roosts off the damage on your switch, then you get a free switch in to Tyranitar. If he switches on your Tyranitar switch, then Latios will be KOED on the next switch. It's all about perspective: Zard Y heavily damages counters and the threat of Tyranitar forces them out, meaning that next time they switch in, they will no longer be counters.

As for Crawdaunt, it basically comes down to Millionsunz choice on whether or not he wants to run Excadrill. If he wants to use it, Tyranitar is undoubtedly the better choice, but if he goes with something else, then Crawdaunt is probably a superior pick.

PS: I don't know why you're so worried about burns. He literally has one of the best burn absorbers, Charizard Y on his team, I don't think he needs to be that afraid. He shouldn't be going up against something like Mega Sableye with Excadrill in the first place.

 

[zbr]

Generally, I would say you should never run modest/mild Zard Y on a Hyper Offensive team, or you'll be outsped by the things you're supposed to check.

This whole Zard Y argument is a matter of consistency vs power. From what I can tell, zbr has lost games because of misses and thinks that if you ever use a move that can miss you are 100% guaranteed to lose. I will admit, I have lost games because of misses, but the extra power and speed of Timid, Fire Blast, and focus Blast are incredibly important on an offensive team. Without Timid, pokemon Zard Y normally destroys like Excadrill suddenly become threats. Charizard is one of the best checks to sand, why throw that away?

As for Crawdaunt, it basically comes down to Millionsunz choice on whether or not he wants to run Excadrill. If he wants to use it, Tyranitar is undoubtedly the better choice, but if he goes with something else, then Crawdaunt is probably a superior pick.

PS: I don't know why you're so worried about burns. He literally has one of the best burn absorbers, Charizard Y on his team, I don't think he needs to be that afraid. He shouldn't be going up against something like Mega Sableye with Excadrill in the first place.

so what are the things that are outsped if you run mild over timid? Celebi, MGarde, Manaphy , Kyurem-Black , MChomp , Lando-T , Lopunny, Pinsir (Mega), Sharpedo (Mega), Lucario , Excadrill , Thundurus-Therian , Latias (Mega). out of these mons, most of them run +spe nature, putting them above base 100 +spe. so idk what you are missing out. all of the aforementioned mons are mons that zard naturally can't check bar drill and even then who switches in zard y on a drill when you have lando-t? he has a straight up counter to sand so why opt for the check? ._. you're assuming that zard y is coming in without hazards up. and for hazards to not be up, drill needs to come in to spin. perhaps if you opted for air balloon drill, this would've been less of an issue but LO drill with spin is naturally a bad offensive spinner since you lose out on the turn that you spin on.

 

[Cenamazing]

so what are the things that are outsped if you run mild over timid? Celebi, MGarde, Manaphy , Kyurem-Black , MChomp , Lando-T , Lopunny, Pinsir (Mega), Sharpedo (Mega), Lucario , Excadrill , Thundurus-Therian , Latias (Mega). out of these mons, most of them run +spe nature, putting them above base 100 +spe. so idk what you are missing out. all of the aforementioned mons are mons that zard naturally can't check bar drill and even then who switches in zard y on a drill when you have lando-t? he has a straight up counter to sand so why opt for the check? ._. you're assuming that zard y is coming in without hazards up. and for hazards to not be up, drill needs to come in to spin. perhaps if you opted for air balloon drill, this would've been less of an issue but LO drill with spin is naturally a bad offensive spinner since you lose out on the turn that you spin on.

Actually, air balloon drill is probably a better choice over LO. I would honestly reccomend that instead.

However, Timid Nature is still far superior to Mild. All the pokemon you mentioned above can't be OHKOed by Zard, but they can be 2HKOed. The problem is that these pokemon can revenge kill Zard when he isn't running max speed, which makes it much harder to use it properly. Zard can counter a lot of pokemon with Max speed, and running anything less than that simply because you're too scared to miss a fire blast every once in a while is dumb. Missing attacks is part of pokemon, and running an inferior Zard set just to fix that is counterproductive. And finally, mild + flamethrower is STILL much weaker than simply running fire blast + Timid. And Earthquake, a 4x super effective move, doesn't even OHKO Heatran

0 Atk Mega Charizard Y Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 284-336 (73.5 - 87%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

I just don't see the point of limiting yourself, forcing yourself to be outsped by tons of common pokemon and yet STILL doing minimal damage is worth it just because your afraid of missing something 15% of the time.

Missing attacks is part of pokemon. There's a reason everyone higher on the ladder uses attacks that miss: it's because the power makes up for reliability. Why do you think Latios is superior to Latias? Because you're sacrificing defensive reliability for power. Power is always the most important element for an offensive team.

Running Flamethrower only really makes sense on a defensive Balance team, a semi-stall team, where landing kills isn't as important. But the entire point of an offensive team is to do damage, so why limit the damage you can do?

 

[Millionsunz]

Alright zbr and Cenamazing, what do you guys think of this team where I took all of your suggestions into hand and changed them around to compromise for decisions I agree with and disagree with.

Revised Team?

Charizard-Mega-Y @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
- Focus Blast
- Roost

Raikou @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Extrasensory

Excadrill @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Rapid Spin

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Aqua Jet
- Knock Off
- Crabhammer

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 8 SpD / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
- Stealth Rock

Klefki @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spikes
- Thunder Wave
- Flash Cannon
- Heal Block

Feedback or changes?

 

[Cenamazing]

Alright zbr and Cenamazing, what do you guys think of this team where I took all of your suggestions into hand and changed them around to compromise for decisions I agree with and disagree with.

Revised Team?

Charizard-Mega-Y @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
- Focus Blast
- Roost

Raikou @ Choice Specs
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Extrasensory

Excadrill @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Rapid Spin

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Aqua Jet
- Knock Off
- Crabhammer

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 8 SpD / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
- Stealth Rock

Klefki @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spikes
- Thunder Wave
- Flash Cannon
- Heal Block

Feedback or changes?

It's alright, but the problem is that Excadrill is kind of useless on that team. If you're going to run Excadrill without Tyranitar, use the defensive spinner variant with mold breaker.

You should also run play rough on Klefki to deal with Weavile.

Finally, be careful when playing against Mega Altaria, as your team has a bit of trouble killing it. Other than that, I'm fine with it.

sets

Excadrill @ Leftovers
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rapid Spin
- Toxic

Klefki @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Spikes
- Thunder Wave
- Heal Block
- Play Rough

 

[Millionsunz]

use the defensive spinner variant with mold breaker.
[/hide]

Does Excadrill have any use as a bulky Pokemon at all? Excadrill looks to have very bad defensive stats besides a good HP stat. Would I be better off just changing its ability to Mold Breaker?

 

[Cenamazing]

Does Excadrill have any use as a bulky Pokemon at all? Excadrill looks to have very bad defensive stats besides a good HP stat. Would I be better off just changing its ability to Mold Breaker?

A Scarfed Spinner isn't effective at all, the scarfed set is only ever run on teams where rapid spin isn't nessessary. Excadrill is actually a pretty decent pokemon, the bulky set isn't meant to be a wall, more a bulky attacker that deals with threats like the Latios (can use earthquake due to mold breaker), fast electrics, clefable, ect. I don't think it does paticularly well in the current meta, but if you refuse to use Tyranitar then it's the only viable set.