I should probably mention that gravity only lasts for 5 turns. While it is zero trouble for lando-I to set it up for himself on a forced swap (phenomenal tactic as it counters darn near every air balloon mon ever), ttar will only be able to take advantage of it very situationally (basically, he has to swap into something that threatens lando like a bulky knock off user or an ice type attack) while keldeo pretty much only gets to use it when he revenges for lando, so take that into account when making your decisions.
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Pokémon Landorus-Incarnate
- Thread starter SuperWumbology
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I should probably mention that gravity only lasts for 5 turns. While it is zero trouble for lando-I to set it up for himself on a forced swap (phenomenal tactic as it counters darn near every air balloon mon ever), ttar will only be able to take advantage of it very situationally (basically, he has to swap into something that threatens lando like a bulky knock off user or an ice type attack) while keldeo pretty much only gets to use it when he revenges for lando, so take that into account when making your decisions.
Is it worth running a Modest nature on the all-out attacker LO set? The main reason would be this:
252+ SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 283-335 (40.1 - 47.5%) -- 54.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
A Timid nature misses out on the 2HKO instead:
252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 260-307 (36.9 - 43.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
Another nice 2HKO a Modest nature can achieve is this:
252+ SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mandibuzz: 233-274 (54.9 - 64.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Considering this set is typically used as a wallbreaker and most walls are still slower it sounds really tempting. I'm pretty sure it could 6-0 a stall team by itself this way.
252+ SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 283-335 (40.1 - 47.5%) -- 54.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
A Timid nature misses out on the 2HKO instead:
252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 260-307 (36.9 - 43.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
Another nice 2HKO a Modest nature can achieve is this:
252+ SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mandibuzz: 233-274 (54.9 - 64.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Considering this set is typically used as a wallbreaker and most walls are still slower it sounds really tempting. I'm pretty sure it could 6-0 a stall team by itself this way.
No, you get outsped by a ton of shit like base 100s such as Charizard so I don't think Modest is really worth it n_n.
or instead of giving up precious speed you could give it Knock Off or Calm Mind, and still beat stall
Or U-turn, which still fucks over Chansey while also letting you beat the Latis.
I find hard to fit a physical attack on the LO set. Earth Power (STAB), Sludge Wave (fairies), Psychic (M-Venusaur, AV Conkeldurr) and Focus Blast (Ferrothorn, Skarmory, Air Balloon Heatran) are all necessary.
Its job is getting rid of walls anyway, and last time I checked there are no walls in the 100 speed range.
Its job is getting rid of walls anyway, and last time I checked there are no walls in the 100 speed range.
You don't need Sludge Wave. It hits what, Clefable, Sylveon and that's it?
It also hits Mandi neutrally, but yeah that's it.
Focus Blast already does that. And the only way you can get through Mandi is if you're running Calm Mind cause Focus Blast barely 2HKOs (plus it's Focus Shit. And Mandi can spam roost. And it can run the spread in its analysis which uses 108 SDef EVs to avoid a 2HKO. And it can Knock Off your Life Orb. Mandi just beats it lol.)
Oh yeah, also Clefable is 2HKOed by Earth Power so Sludge Wave is not that useful here. So literally the only target that Sludge Wave allows you to 2HKO is Sylveon, who is a). Not really notable enough to run a coverage move for, and b). Beaten by CM. So there's literally no reason to use Sludge Wave.
It's been awhile since I've been on this topic, so I want to start a discussion. CM vs Gravity, which do you think is better?
Gravity Pros
1. Makes Focus Blast very reliable.
2. Removes flying immunity, giving a psudo CM boost thanks to STAB and general lack of ground resists.
3. Can support teammates such as stone edge ttar and sleep powder venu
4. Makes enemy flyers vulnerable to spikes
5. EP becomes the BEST MOVE EVEH!
Gravity Cons
1. Makes lando vulnerable to EQ
2. Evasion Drop can sometimes benefit the enemy too
3. Only lasts 5 turns
4. Does not affect certain matchups that CM can benefit in such as Lando V Hippo and Lando V mega venu
5. Makes your flying types vulnerable to spikes
CM Pros
1. Helps with all lando-i matchups (though not always as much as gravity, but CM still helps)
2. SP def boost helps vs mega venu and a few other walls
3. no turn limit
CM Cons
1. Focus Blast still sucks
2. EP cannot be spammed due to immunities
So basically, gravity is riskier, but when pulled off it almost removes prediction from the game because you can basically spam EP and win. CM is guaranteed to not backfire (at least not any more then any other setup sweeper), but it removes fewer checks (for starters, air baloon mons can still check).
Gravity Pros
1. Makes Focus Blast very reliable.
2. Removes flying immunity, giving a psudo CM boost thanks to STAB and general lack of ground resists.
3. Can support teammates such as stone edge ttar and sleep powder venu
4. Makes enemy flyers vulnerable to spikes
5. EP becomes the BEST MOVE EVEH!
Gravity Cons
1. Makes lando vulnerable to EQ
2. Evasion Drop can sometimes benefit the enemy too
3. Only lasts 5 turns
4. Does not affect certain matchups that CM can benefit in such as Lando V Hippo and Lando V mega venu
5. Makes your flying types vulnerable to spikes
CM Pros
1. Helps with all lando-i matchups (though not always as much as gravity, but CM still helps)
2. SP def boost helps vs mega venu and a few other walls
3. no turn limit
CM Cons
1. Focus Blast still sucks
2. EP cannot be spammed due to immunities
So basically, gravity is riskier, but when pulled off it almost removes prediction from the game because you can basically spam EP and win. CM is guaranteed to not backfire (at least not any more then any other setup sweeper), but it removes fewer checks (for starters, air baloon mons can still check).
Charizard is probably the one base 100 that doesn't outspeed Lando because it usually runs Adamant and the max ATK max Speed spread has gotten kinda rare... But still, your point remains. Also, a 2HKO with Focus Blast is a very shaky 2HKO to give up Speed for.
Gravity should only be used over calm mind if what needs to be removed for your other team mates are mostly flyers or levitators. I've found swords damce Mscizor to be a valuable gravity Lando partner, as Lando removes akarmory, rotom wash, gliscor, Yzard, balloontran, and the rare non-mega gyarados.
In the past I've always felt gravity had invaluable offensive benefits yet it was almost worthless for offensive teams because it was too brief and robbed you of momentum to set up. But Lando's ability to set it up and abuse it at the same time makes him a perfect user for it.
In the past I've always felt gravity had invaluable offensive benefits yet it was almost worthless for offensive teams because it was too brief and robbed you of momentum to set up. But Lando's ability to set it up and abuse it at the same time makes him a perfect user for it.
I found Magnezone to be a wonderful partner, hear me out.
Magnezone @ Light Clay
Magnet Pull
252 HP/252 Sp.Atk
Thunderbolt
Reflect
Light Screen
HP Fire
The premise is pretty simple, set up screens by coming in on Ferro/Skarm who can't do anything to it, kill them then die, bring in Lando and set-up. I prefer CM to Gravity, as you can sometimes nab 2 boosts + the Sp.Atk boost is extremely welcome, and you don't need gravity to take out Skarm due to Swagnezone. It worked pretty well for me.
Magnezone @ Light Clay
Magnet Pull
252 HP/252 Sp.Atk
Thunderbolt
Reflect
Light Screen
HP Fire
The premise is pretty simple, set up screens by coming in on Ferro/Skarm who can't do anything to it, kill them then die, bring in Lando and set-up. I prefer CM to Gravity, as you can sometimes nab 2 boosts + the Sp.Atk boost is extremely welcome, and you don't need gravity to take out Skarm due to Swagnezone. It worked pretty well for me.
Rotom takes a huge chunk from a CM boosted Psychic anyway, so I feel that's not too much of an issue for me, but I can see what you mean. I was amazed at how easily Zone set up screens and behind them Lando was amazing as Ground/Flying typing finally came in handy. One calm mind and you're good to go.
Also: 252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Landorus through Reflect: 187-221 (58.6 - 69.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Bulkier than you'd think.
Any Ice Shard ever. You mean one. The only one anyone uses. So Mamoswine?
y'know, I was thinking of mamoswine when I made that post, and I completely forgot that there aren't any other OU users of ice shard (sorry Weavile)...
ehh heh heh, oops. The fact that lando can survive mamo's ice shard from behind reflect is darn impressive though.
However, Lando can KO Mamoswine back if it sponges an Ice Shard: 252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mamoswine: 344-407 (81.5 - 96.4%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock - and that's before a CM.
I've used U-turn Lando-I and it's completely legit. Luring out counters like Lati@s and Cresselia and checkmating them with Scarf/Band T-Tar (can't calc atm but I believ Scarf Pursuit can OHKO Latios even if it stays in after U-Turn damage) is glorious on top of the momentum grabbing you can do thanks to how easily you force switches.
For partners, I'd recommend using Specs Keldeo instead of Scarf (Specs doesn't outrun much of note and you want TEH POWER) and Bisharp if you still want to have a powerful Knock Off user that can also Pursuit trap (and because it's friggin awesome).
If you're planning on running U-turn I'd advise against RP simply because you need that 3 move coverage to maintain your sweep. Gravity might be worth running with u-turn if you have other mons that benefit from gravity like TTar, Keldeo, and
Ahhhh. I guess it depends on how much you value to ability to do absolutely nothing but spam EP and get away with it. With gravity, all you really need is ground-fighting coverage (you lose out on 2hko on SP defensive calm megasaur without psychic and that's about it), so u-turn is totally an option with gravity.
If you are looking to choose between the two, I guess it depends on what you'd rather do with your forced switches, setup vs pivot.
Has anybody tried a sub set? I really hated how it was pretty easy to switch around earth power, and focus blast predicting is really stupid thanks to the annoying accuracy. I wanted something to ease prediction and seeing as sub worked very well on Mega Heracross for the exact reason I tried it on lando. Simply put, I wanted a way for lando to deal with offence better and I dislike rock polish. I'm running sub/earth power/focus blast/sludge wave and it's surprisingly effective. You can get subs up pretty easy vs heatran, tyranitar, scarfed lando, non balloon excadrill, stall breaker mew (knock off doesn't get the 1.5 bonus if behind a sub, so it won't break) etc. I chose to run sludge wave over psychic for the lati twins and annoying ass fairies. I rarely find myself missing psychic because earth power smacks a lot of the things psychic is for anyway.
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