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Latias [QC 0/3]

Starmie also had rain and Analytic. The two are incomparable.

252 SpA Starmie Hydro Pump (120 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mew in Rain: 246-289 (72.1 - 84.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Latias Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 189-223 (55.4 - 65.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

"slower dragons" is an interesting term which I take to mean "Garchomp and Mega Charizard X before a DD" because Goodra survives easily and Dragonite should always be at Multiscale or be faster than Latias because otherwise there's no reason for Dragonite to have come out. wow, killing Thundurus is a huge feat that not many Pokemon can achieve.

The fact is that you're not threatening to offensive teams with 252 SpA Leftovers Latias.

252 SpA Latias Psyshock vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Lucario: 130-154 (46.2 - 54.8%) -- 59% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Latias Draco Meteor vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 256-303 (85.9 - 101.6%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO (not that this calc is wholly relevant because Latias dies to CB BB after Rocks anyways, but just as an idea of how fucking weak Leftovers Latias is)
252 SpA Latias Draco Meteor vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Greninja: 250-295 (87.4 - 103.1%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

if you're not OHKOing the frailest shit in OU with Draco Meteor, idk what to tell you. I don't even believe that Leftovers is worth a set, but if I'm going to add it, I would much rather see Dragon Pulse than Draco Meteor on the set.
 
Analytic was mostly used on LO sets, with Natural Cure being the way more common ability in 5th gen. I don't understand why you think that a Defog user has to be able to OHKO offensive Pokemon neutral to its attacks. Latias has great bulk and many useful resistances, giving it a lot of switch-in chances, great Speed, and the ability to threaten common SR setters, such as Terrakion and Garchomp. Add to this reliable recovery, allowing it to check some offensive Pokemon for an extended period of time, as well as act as reliable anti-SR support. All those are more than enough to give it a main set, so i don't get why you make the inability to OHKO offensive Pokemon neutral to its STABs such a big deal. You are acting as if you haven't seen other bulky Defog users that are meant to last long, such as Defog Mandibuzz, Defog Mega Scizor, and Defog Zapdos. As if those Pokemon are not easy to take advantage of.
 
I don't think that it should have to OHKO neutral things (I'd rather see Dragon Pulse on a bulky set if we were to go through with that!!!!!!! :OOOOOOOOOOOOO)

but the fact that a fully invested Draco Meteor cannot always OHKO shit like Talonflame and Greninja is pathetic. Dragon Pulse does everything that you want anyways (killing slower Dragons, threatening frailer stuff) without making Latias the biggest setup bait in OU after using it. Leftovers Draco Meteor is trash, and if you guys want to put it on the analysis, have someone else write it.
 
Treecko said:
Leftovers Draco Meteor is trash, and if you guys want to put it on the analysis, have someone else write it.
Click to expand...

Seriously Treecko... that's a pretty childish thing to say. -__-

Anyway, I think it's a good idea for Latias to have two Defog sets, an offensive and defensive one as alexwolf suggested. However, I do agree with Treecko that Leftovers Draco Meteor isn't that good (I've used it actually and I didn't like how it played), so I think Dragon Pulse is way more reliable and consistent. Just a basic set of Dragon Pulse | Psyshock / Surf | Roost | Defog @ Leftovers should probably suffice. I guess we can get more input on whether to slash Draco Meteor or to give it a comment. I'd rather give it a comment, though.
 
I think a bulkier LO Latias set with Roost could work. Personally I've been finding Roost to be better after my test vs. Healing Wish if only because CHARIZARD-Y! I often find that 112 Hp is more than enough to invest (although I'm not sure what that accomplished it did something in BW2 but I've found that the bulk has been satifactory in test). However, you can either run 252 Spe (which should be the standard) or 216 speed if you wish to invest a bit more in special attack (that can be AC'd: 216 speed hits Jolly Pinsir and Jolly Garchomp). The speed highly depends on how threatening Keldeo / Terrakion / opposing Lati@s are to the team, and if you can afford it (like on balanced teams) than you can sometimes afford to not run maximum speed for a power boost.

Also, Thunderbolt deserves EDIT: an AC mention for Azumaril seriously. Mention that Psyshock obliterates Venusaur.

Also I have personally hated the Leftovers set. It's just so weak. I don't even think Lefties Psyshock OHKOs M-Venusaur (don't quote me on that, since no Damage Calc, but I just know that Lefties is all kinds of weak: Thunderbolt does misses the 2HKO on Azu without SR too IIRC).
 
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It's not even childish. It's as simple as I'm not willing to write an analysis with a bad set. If someone can actually prove to me that I'm wrong and that it's good (which I don't see happening because I've used it and hated it, and no one has made any effort to do so up to this point), then I'll concede that I was wrong and include it.

I also agree that Thunderbolt is good but that Psyshock is usually better because of Mega Venusaur. I'd also run at least enough Speed for Timid Keldeo and Jolly Terrakion personally.
 
If you are spamming Draco Meteor you are doing it wrong. You have Psyshock for a reliable STAB attack, and this is what you use against the majority of offensive Pokemon that you check (such as Thundurus, Sheer Force Landorus, Mega Venusaur, Mega Charizard Y, and Terrakion). You use Draco Meteor only when you absolutely have to, such as against Garchomp and Kyurem-B. If used with caution, Draco Meteor is just fine. Dragon Pulse is ok, but then you miss on OHKOing very important Pokemon:

- 252 SpA Latias Dragon Pulse vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Garchomp: 284-336 (79.3 - 93.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252 SpA Latias Dragon Pulse vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Garchomp: 258-306 (72 - 85.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252 SpA Latias Dragon Pulse vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Kyurem-B: 270-320 (68.8 - 81.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

If you are stupid enough to use Draco Meteor even if this means that the opponent's Mega Char X will set up on you after while you have no good checks to it alive, then this isn't the set's fault but yours. That's just an example to show that you should weight the pros and cons of DM before using it. I guess Dragon Pulse could be slashed after DM, but the power drop sucks. Also, with DM, you can afford to use some HP EVs, as Draco Meteor still OHKOes comfortably the offensive dragons.
 
If you're using Leftovers Draco Meteor, you're doing it wrong.

"Psyshock for a reliable STAB attack"

lol

also the problem with your amazing calcs is that no one is going to keep any of those Pokemon in against Latias to begin with. have fun clicking Draco Meteor against Garchomp when they're just going to switch out into any of the hundreds of Pokemon that don't care about taking it at all and then watching your Latias sit around as setup fodder.

Just reassign this analysis. I have no desire to argue about this anymore, and I don't want to be the author of an analysis with a set that I have tested and don't agree with at all.
 
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