Tournament LCPL XII: Commencement

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This is the commencement thread for LCPL XII. Feel free to post your predictions, power rankings, or really anything else related to the tournament. However, please do keep this thread civil and refrain from any personal attacks. With that out of the way, feel free to post!​
 
So, if my memory serves correctly, the tournament format (slots) have not been released yet. There was some discussion on it on discord, so I'll try to bring the topic and my opinions here even though I have little knowledge of whats best. Pretty much everyone wanted either 8 or 10 slots if I remember correctly, with the 8 slot format being 3 SV LC, and 1 of DPP LC, BW LC, ORAS LC, SM LC, and SS LC, and the 10 slot format being the same, only with 4 SV and another slot with no real agreement on which would be the best if LCPL was a 10 slot format. Because I do not know if a 4th SV slot would be helpful or not, I have no opinion on whether 8 or 10 slot is better, however I do have an opinion (though entirely unqualified) on the best 10th slot if the tour goes that route.

Of the options for the 10th possible slot, I think ADV and LCUU are underdeveloped, and ADV in particular has too small a player base but that probably also applies to LCUU. I have no expertise of Doubles LC so I won't comment on its meta, but I've yet to talk to a player who plays it and dislikes it, and if it were added it would bring the largest new player base to LCPL, with some LPL staples as well as maybe Doubles OU players maybe tho I don't know if that happens. Its easily the most different slot and most difficult to support because of that, but the options aren't nonexistent. I've also heard options such as SV 5, LCWL om's, bo3, etc being thrown around. I don't think SV 5 is necessary but I'm not vehemently against it, of the LCWL metagames tera preview was fine but its just sv5 but slightly different, tera banned isn't tiered for independently with the ban list and is therefore bad, 1tpt is terrible. I've never played with bo3 slots so no comment.

imo its either 8 slot or 10 slot with doubles LC.
 
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10 slots is doable (and I think it is finally time that we expand the tour) with 4 SV, 1 SS, 1 SM, 1 XY, 1 BW, 1 DPP + 1 special slot

Some options for the last slot (w/ some short reasonings):
BO3 (SV/SS/SM) - Have been in PLs for many of the other tiers + Would be interesting to see the top players compete in this spot
Suspect slot (that rotates each week) - Was kinda fun to prep for in LCWL + A good way to see new stuff each week
SV 5 - Equality between current gen + old gen (although 5 of any single tier is a lot)
SV LC UU - LC UU was in LCPL before
SV DLC - Ig this is like the best way to bring a new playerbase in?
ADV LC - Tier is sus but it could be another old gen that is interesting to watch like DPP
 
I don't think there's any need to expand the tour to 10 slots. Every player who deserves to get into LCPL does, and for those who don't, LCSL exists to let them prove otherwise. Keeping the number of slots lower keeps the standard of play higher, which is ideal considering LCPL is the one prestigious team-tour we get a year.

If you insist on expanding to 10, there aren't many appealing options anyway. 3 slots of CG is the gold standard even for fun metas, and adding even more of shit-ass SV seems undesirable. Even worse however, would be adding any of the joke "side-metas", which for the most part are extremely under-developed with a low level of play, which I experienced first-hand when I dabbled in LC UU in SS. I find these tiers are a lot of fun when I play them, and I mean no disrespect, but even in LPL we see otherwise average players completely farm them, so please, keep them in LPL.

The only good option is an SV + BO3, or what I prefer, a BO3 worth 2 slots to promote exciting high-level sets between top players, but Bo3 seems largely unpopular among said players from what I've heard, so IDK how desirable that is either.
 
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Drifting said:
I don't think there's any need to expand the tour to 10 slots. Every player who deserves to get into LCPL does, and for those who don't, LCSL exists to let them prove otherwise. Keeping the number of slots lower keeps the standard of play higher, which is ideal considering LCPL is the one prestigious team-tour we get a year.

If you insist on expanding to 10, there aren't many appealing options anyway. 3 slots of CG is the gold standard even for fun metas, and adding even more of shit-ass SV seems undesirable. Even worse however, would be adding any of the joke "side-metas", which for the most part are extremely under-developed with a low level of play, which I experienced first-hand when I dabbled in LC UU in SS. I find these tiers are a lot of fun when I play them, and I mean no disrespect, but even in LPL we see otherwise average players completely farm them, so please, keep them in LPL.

The only good option is an SV + BO3, or what I prefer, a BO3 worth 2 slots to promote exciting high-level sets between top players, but Bo3 seems largely unpopular among said players from what I've heard, so IDK how desirable that is either.
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Lets Make the Bo3 between the managers, being one game in SV + the other 2 pm their prefered gen. We Will have most me out best players deciding every weeks being mother Lily, Ace, Tazz, Laro, Tko it is Just way more entretaining for the viewers having high profiles matches everyweek
 
regarding the format, i dont care if its 8 slots as we all know it or 10 slots, but if we end up doing 10 slots w sv5 + other tier, i wanna give my opinion on the possibilities:
i think there are only 3 reasonable tiers to play in the 10th slot, those being lc uu, dlc and adv lc. i dont think we need to care about the “quality” of the playerbase because id a tier doesnt get played, it wont have mainers of course! i think we need to look at the relevance of each tier.
lc uu has been a thing since oras if im not mistaken, but i think the tls have never wanted to make it anything more than a fun side tier only played in unofficials. id they still want that approach (which i think is the case), i think we dont add it.
adv lc is weird bc people didnt play it for the longest time just because. now its reviving and people do in fact like it (shoutouts grape tylenol). i think its fair we give this tier a chance, and its only fitting the 10th slot is another oldgen, as we would keep this tour consistent with just the main tiers from every gen. it just makes sense, but i can see the hosts or tls or whatever not wanting to make adv lc much more than what it is (i wouldnt agree w that, but what can i say).
the third option is dlc. i think this is another good option, and id fully support it. dlc started back in sm i believe, so its younger than lc uu, but its become much more prominent over the years, thanks to a surprisingly amazing tl (shoutouts jcbc for doing exactly one thing well in his entire life). dlc has a dedicated playerbase full of mainers, consisting of 50% lc players which we do know very well like ace jc pigwarrior or voltix, and 50% adopted dou mains like actu or para), and its lcpl addition would likely attract more dou mains to it, improving its average level. dlc has only been getting bigger lately, having its own circuit and being added to dou teamtours like maushold cup and one upcoming tour idr the name of. i think its just fair we add it to lcpl too for all of these reasons.
i think adding any other om isnt really serious and i would not do it. dlc and lc uu already feel like an om, and thats kind of why i support adv lc the most. also suspect slots without actually mattering for an actual vote are just gimmicky oms too, and i dont support that
 
As much as I prefer ADV and UU to Doubles. Does the existence of a Showdown ladder for Doubles not make it is the clear include if the aim is to have the highest level of competition for active playerbases.

You can argue all you like about effective playerbase, but I think at the end of the day the standard should really be to include applicable tiers that are easily practicable and honeable to highten the level of play. Doubles LC got a perma ladder, is Current gen, and really should get a place over old gen rotating ladders on a by design basis no?
 
I think the better option is 8 slots with no debate about any of these frankly marginal tiers. LCPL is our most prestigious and competitive tour of the whole year and we should prioritize a higher level of play over tacking on more tiers. Adv LC especially seems like a long-time untier that is almost certainly not ready for primetime. Stick to CG and the established oldgens.
 
goldenghost said:
I think the better option is 8 slots with no debate about any of these frankly marginal tiers. LCPL is our most prestigious and competitive tour of the whole year and we should prioritize a higher level of play over tacking on more tiers. Adv LC especially seems like a long-time untier that is almost certainly not ready for primetime. Stick to CG and the established oldgens.
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Feels kinda wrong to complain about keeping it prestigious, when this is what OU mains do as well to keep us out of officials and how annoyed so many of us have been with that.
 
France (3) vs (5) Canada
SV LC: Lokifan vs aleaniled
SV LC: ProDigeZz vs Elfuseon
SV LC: Welli0u vs Fc
SS LC: CMDoge vs wesh papillon
SM LC: Toadow vs Acehunter1
ORAS LC: Wait2Seconds vs Corporal Levi
BW LC: Hurtadoo vs Potatochan
DPP LC: Alkione vs Heysup


Brazil (4) vs (4) US Central + West
SV LC: be7 vs kythr
SV LC: westSasori vs babyboyblues
SV LC: Always Edgy vs Greedy_eb
SS LC: STarsAma vs Colin
SM LC: Thiago Nunes vs tazz
ORAS LC: Ampha vs Luthier
BW LC: vndrevc vs tko
DPP LC: Beraldo vs Melon
 
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I'll advocate for DLC as a slot, if LCPL is to be expanded.

For some background on me and what my stake is in this, I'm a Doubles main, who plays DLC on the side, because I enjoy it. Most of the time. (IMO the tier needs some tiering action ASAP due to Home :totodiLUL:) I was on the Gothitas in the current LPL playing DLC for the past couple weeks.

In terms of where DLC "belongs" currently, it doesn't and most likely won't get representation in Doubles Premier League (DPL). People in the Doubles community, myself included, view it as more of an LC tier, at least that's the impression I get from the people I talk to. There's a lot of overlap among the people who are good at the tier. Anyways, it will be featured in the upcoming Doubles Derby however, which is a side team tournament that features tiers such as DPP and ADV that were not in DPL. Maybe if DPL gets expanded to 8x10 it could be, but I have a really really hard time seeing it.

I agree with the idea that it would bring new players to the league, but it depends if anyone cares about that since it's kind of external. You definitely would be able to field an extremely competitive 6 or 8 slots, though, depending on how many teams there are. It's definitely not a "coinflip tier" either as I've heard some other tiers referred to as, lots of room for skill expression, teambuilding is reasonably diverse as LC can be, and I think the viewing experience is pretty good!
 
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