(Little) Things that annoy you in Pokémon

Strictly speaking all they'd need to do is disallow PLA moves from going into SWSH (something Bank already did with ORAS in gen 6 & USUM in gen 7)
The thing is, it's not practical. One thing is when you are disallowing on "forward only" movement. Different is, when you need to disallow on games that have to keep separate data between each other AND need to be able to transfer to each other.
This is expecially problematic for TR / egg moves that may not be in a given game: what do you do with a pokemon that knows a egg move in BDSP that doesn't exist in SwSh/SV? Do you constantly force the player to delete moves (potentially, non relearnable ones like limited TMs in BDSP or legacy moves if carrying from older games) every time they want to move a pokemon to Home?
Sure you "can" but it's extremely annoying.

The separate moveset was the obvious choice. I'm still on the assumption that SV will "keep" the SwSh data and BDSP/LA will just be their own exceptional thing, but I mean, that's just speculation as we know, and with the "update rate" of Home, I doubt we'll be seeing compatibility with SV until at very least early 2023.
 
The thing is, it's not practical. One thing is when you are disallowing on "forward only" movement. Different is, when you need to disallow on games that have to keep separate data between each other AND need to be able to transfer to each other.
This is expecially problematic for TR / egg moves that may not be in a given game: what do you do with a pokemon that knows a egg move in BDSP that doesn't exist in SwSh/SV? Do you constantly force the player to delete moves (potentially, non relearnable ones like limited TMs in BDSP or legacy moves if carrying from older games) every time they want to move a pokemon to Home?
Sure you "can" but it's extremely annoying.

The separate moveset was the obvious choice. I'm still on the assumption that SV will "keep" the SwSh data and BDSP/LA will just be their own exceptional thing, but I mean, that's just speculation as we know, and with the "update rate" of Home, I doubt we'll be seeing compatibility with SV until at very least early 2023.
That specific part of the post was meant for things like the actual new moves, in a scenario where they were fine with the others
 
I had another contribution to this thread in mind today, but considering the current topic...

I really don't like how they've haphazardly cut a bunch of moves.

It doesn't seem too bad late-game, even though some important coverage options got axed, since most of the reliable STAB options are available. (RIP Normal though.)

But man, it really hurts the mid-game. You'd be surprised at how many mons got put in a terrible situation just for losing a couple of 65-70BP moves.
 

DrCoeloCephalo

Banned deucer.
Pokemon's room for skillset variety and "creativity" is already not even that good, so it's kinda ironic you would have to pay for that just to get certain skills with the possibility of not even being able to use them at all.
 
I had another contribution to this thread in mind today, but considering the current topic...

I really don't like how they've haphazardly cut a bunch of moves.

It doesn't seem too bad late-game, even though some important coverage options got axed, since most of the reliable STAB options are available. (RIP Normal though.)

But man, it really hurts the mid-game. You'd be surprised at how many mons got put in a terrible situation just for losing a couple of 65-70BP moves.
It's definitely haphazard though the haphazardness means its kidn of localized to certain types

Looking over the list of moves the big "mid power" moves lost are Feint Attack (though dark types can uuuusually get bite), Signal Beam, Silver Wind (which...), Ominous Wind (eh....), Flame Burst and hten oddly a lot of fighting moves. Jump Kick, Wake Up Slap, Karate Chop and Sky Uppercut.

imo the bigger problem was the haphazard removal of TM/TRs from level up move sets (or even breeding), which was inconsistent and arbitrary at the best of times and became wildly annoying based on when you even got access to the dang move.
 
It's definitely haphazard though the haphazardness means its kidn of localized to certain types

Looking over the list of moves the big "mid power" moves lost are Feint Attack (though dark types can uuuusually get bite), Signal Beam, Silver Wind (which...), Ominous Wind (eh....), Flame Burst and hten oddly a lot of fighting moves. Jump Kick, Wake Up Slap, Karate Chop and Sky Uppercut.

imo the bigger problem was the haphazard removal of TM/TRs from level up move sets (or even breeding), which was inconsistent and arbitrary at the best of times and became wildly annoying based on when you even got access to the dang move.
Those too, but I can't remember an example off the top of my head rn.
 

Coronis

Impressively round
is a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
There is no point in any game where you take a boat to Cianwood, Cianwood's in Johto.
Are confusing it with Dewford in Hoenn?
Um, the point was people are making Johto maps with Cianwood connected to Olivine by land, rather than being across the sea.
 
Doesn't Altaria not get Dragon Dance in BDSP because it was changed to be TR-only in SwSh, and then they just copied its moveset from there?
Yes there's a lot of fascinating edge cases that happened in BDSP because of this. Both from the "copied to SWSH but didnt account for not having the TR/TM available" side andd the "copied from USUM, but didn't account for the tutors not being available or the egg chains for the moves" side
 
Um, the point was people are making Johto maps with Cianwood connected to Olivine by land, rather than being across the sea.
AztecCroc isn't refuting the original point, just... correctly pointing out that you never take a boat there, making it slightly less unreasonable for someone to think that Cianwood is connected to the mainland. HGSS also confuses the issue; the addition of an extra route leading to the Safari Zone means the map is a little more ambiguous:
View attachment 443502
I could see someone thinking that's a river rather than a narrow stretch of ocean, although reading it as an island still makes more sense to me.

On a different note: I've been playing through ORAS again (mono-Fairy) and while I generally don't mind HMs that much, I DO mind them in conjunction with a midgame full of mons with phazing moves and trainers who love to spam them, especially since they always seem to shuffle in my HM user. Also, as someone who tries to avoid overlevelling in any kind of challenge run, the forced switches put me at risk of overlevelling certain mons in a game that's already pretty generous with experience (even with the Exp Share turned off).
 

DrCoeloCephalo

Banned deucer.
On a different note: I've been playing through ORAS again (mono-Fairy) and while I generally don't mind HMs that much, I DO mind them in conjunction with a midgame full of mons with phazing moves and trainers who love to spam them, especially since they always seem to shuffle in my HM user. Also, as someone who tries to avoid overlevelling in any kind of challenge run, the forced switches put me at risk of overlevelling certain mons in a game that's already pretty generous with experience (even with the Exp Share turned off).
Playing many other monster collectors, it's ironic how Pokemon has such fast overall level growth that even EXP given to one monster at a time still makes it easy to overlevel.

I finally got the chance to play Coromon for the past few weeks. The slower level growth makes it way harder to overlevel, they still give you options like Ber Fruit so "being grindy" is a complete non-issue and even if you did, it doesn't automatically make the game any easier since it has actual bosses, so you end up actually incentivized to actively put in time to "train" your monsters to get stronger.
 
Something that bugs me Gen 1-4 (maybe 5?) are how most movements are done separate from text. What I mean is, events are structured like this

[Movement a]
[Wait movement to finish]
[Text]
[Close text]

This can notably slow down a scene, or just feel robotic. Understandable in the 8 bit era, not so much later
The funny thing, in Gen 3/4 at least, GF CAN have simultaneous text/movement in scripting. Here's an example I did for a, of the Rivals mom complaining while walking

Granted, this is a pretty awkward case
To do this, you just put the msgbox command before waitmovement 0, then closemessage after
1659317396960.png
 
Something that bugs me Gen 1-4 (maybe 5?) are how most movements are done separate from text. What I mean is, events are structured like this

[Movement a]
[Wait movement to finish]
[Text]
[Close text]

This can notably slow down a scene, or just feel robotic. Understandable in the 8 bit era, not so much later
The funny thing, in Gen 3/4 at least, GF CAN have simultaneous text/movement in scripting. Here's an example I did for a, of the Rivals mom complaining while walking

Granted, this is a pretty awkward case
To do this, you just put the msgbox command before waitmovement 0, then closemessage after
View attachment 443671
Interesting. What would have happened if you had ended the conversation before the movement had finished? I am guessing that the messagebox wouldn't be able to be closed until waitmovement had seen that applymovement had finished executing.
 
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Interesting. What would have happened if you had ended the conversation before the movement had finished? I am guessing that the messagebox wouldn't be able to be closed until waitmovement had seen that applymovement had finished executing.
If I do closemessage before waitmovement, the movement will simply continue until it finishes, then advance forward to the next script command

Never tested multiple msgboxes before waitmovement, but eh. A bit late for me to mess with it
 
The fact that there is no way to turn off the exp share in all the Nintendo Swith Pokemon games. I didn't realise just how annoying this feature was until the game felt far too easy after the 2nd gym. It's a shame because Sword/Shield are some of my favourite Pokemon games in general. I enjoyed the areas to explore, new moves, being able to cook new flavour stews. But the exp share always being on kind of ruins the gameplay a bit.
 
The fact that there is no way to turn off the exp share in all the Nintendo Swith Pokemon games. I didn't realise just how annoying this feature was until the game felt far too easy after the 2nd gym. It's a shame because Sword/Shield are some of my favourite Pokemon games in general. I enjoyed the areas to explore, new moves, being able to cook new flavour stews. But the exp share always being on kind of ruins the gameplay a bit.
This is genuinely one of the biggest things that stops me from wanting to get those games.
 

ScraftyIsTheBest

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The fact that there is no way to turn off the exp share in all the Nintendo Swith Pokemon games. I didn't realise just how annoying this feature was until the game felt far too easy after the 2nd gym. It's a shame because Sword/Shield are some of my favourite Pokemon games in general. I enjoyed the areas to explore, new moves, being able to cook new flavour stews. But the exp share always being on kind of ruins the gameplay a bit.
Hopefully they'll be removed in the gen 9 games.
In all honesty, I'm sorry to break it to you, but I honestly feel at this point that there just isn't ever going to be a game that doesn't have the EXP All mechanic baked in anymore. It's been nearly four years since the first Switch Pokemon game, Let's Go Pikachu and Eevee, and all of the mainline games on the Switch thus far have had the EXP All mechanic baked in and unable to be turned off, as even Legends: Arceus has it, and even the minor one-off remake BDSP did too. LGPE, Sword and Shield, and Legends: Arceus have all had it, and given this I think the permanent EXP All mechanic is here to stay in every mainline Pokemon game going forward.

Gen 9 likely isn't going to remove it in any of its games either. In other words, given we've had four different games that have permanent EXP Share over the span of four years, I think you should fully submit yourself to the expectation that it's going to be the norm from here on out. In other words, for Scarlet and Violet? Fully expect that baked-in, permanent EXP Share will continue to be in it. And the same goes for every mainline game that follows: whatever follow up mainline games Gen 9 gets will have it too, Gen 10 games will continue to have it, and so on. I'm sorry to say this, but I think permanent EXP All is going to be a permanent part of the mainline Pokemon games going forward, and it's never going to go away.

With that in mind, I think if you're not fond of the EXP All, the most you can hope for is that they handle levelling better in SV and future games. PLA for instance largely worked fine with permanent EXP All in mind because the levelling was changed, especially because the curve was well designed with respect to it and most importantly, they changed how EXP is gained and calculated in Trainer battles in that you don't gain EXP until you've defeated the entire Trainer's team, thus regulating the total experience you gain from Trainer battles. It was an improvement from Sword and Shield in that regard, even though the latter did handle the level curve itself largely okay with respect to EXP All despite the game not being all that hard in a vacuum. If SV handles levelling in terms of EXP gain and level curve better then people would likely have less of an issue with it.
 
I have never understood the "always on" approach to the EXP All-Share in the Switch games. After 2 gens with it as an option where it was relatively fine, why suddenly take away the choice and reduce ways to play the game? It's an on-off switch, probably handled in like 5 lines of code to set a Boolean at the absolute most, it can't possibly have been a coding complexity or complication. I'd have just assumed short-sightedness if it was always on in Gen 6, but they had it as optional and then made it mandatory, while their leveling curves clearly did not adjust with nearly the speed to compensate.

What does it benefit them to remove the option to toggle it from the game? If the worry is like really little kids not knowing to turn it on the have an easy run, enable it by default since most people who would be concerned about a more challenging Level curve would probably be able to figure out to go turn it off anyway
 
I have never understood the "always on" approach to the EXP All-Share in the Switch games. After 2 gens with it as an option where it was relatively fine, why suddenly take away the choice and reduce ways to play the game? It's an on-off switch, probably handled in like 5 lines of code to set a Boolean at the absolute most, it can't possibly have been a coding complexity or complication. I'd have just assumed short-sightedness if it was always on in Gen 6, but they had it as optional and then made it mandatory, while their leveling curves clearly did not adjust with nearly the speed to compensate.

What does it benefit them to remove the option to toggle it from the game? If the worry is like really little kids not knowing to turn it on the have an easy run, enable it by default since most people who would be concerned about a more challenging Level curve would probably be able to figure out to go turn it off anyway
Hell I'm in the bargaining phase of "interact with a NPC to get the option to turn it off" like they inexplicably did with sound options. Could even put on a big warning of "this could make the game harder, watch out!!" or something.


At the very least if they insist on keeping it always on at least experiment with the level curve more.
 
In all honesty, I'm sorry to break it to you, but I honestly feel at this point that there just isn't ever going to be a game that doesn't have the EXP All mechanic baked in anymore. It's been nearly four years since the first Switch Pokemon game, Let's Go Pikachu and Eevee, and all of the mainline games on the Switch thus far have had the EXP All mechanic baked in and unable to be turned off, as even Legends: Arceus has it, and even the minor one-off remake BDSP did too. LGPE, Sword and Shield, and Legends: Arceus have all had it, and given this I think the permanent EXP All mechanic is here to stay in every mainline Pokemon game going forward.

Gen 9 likely isn't going to remove it in any of its games either. In other words, given we've had four different games that have permanent EXP Share over the span of four years, I think you should fully submit yourself to the expectation that it's going to be the norm from here on out. In other words, for Scarlet and Violet? Fully expect that baked-in, permanent EXP Share will continue to be in it. And the same goes for every mainline game that follows: whatever follow up mainline games Gen 9 gets will have it too, Gen 10 games will continue to have it, and so on. I'm sorry to say this, but I think permanent EXP All is going to be a permanent part of the mainline Pokemon games going forward, and it's never going to go away.

With that in mind, I think if you're not fond of the EXP All, the most you can hope for is that they handle levelling better in SV and future games. PLA for instance largely worked fine with permanent EXP All in mind because the levelling was changed, especially because the curve was well designed with respect to it and most importantly, they changed how EXP is gained and calculated in Trainer battles in that you don't gain EXP until you've defeated the entire Trainer's team, thus regulating the total experience you gain from Trainer battles. It was an improvement from Sword and Shield in that regard, even though the latter did handle the level curve itself largely okay with respect to EXP All despite the game not being all that hard in a vacuum. If SV handles levelling in terms of EXP gain and level curve better then people would likely have less of an issue with it.
Yeah, you're most likely right about it being here to stay now. :( It's something I hope will be turned off in future games, but I'm not going to hold my breath for it.

Yeah, hopefully levelling is handled better in future games. If this is the case, then the EXP share problem won't be as bad.

Good post, by the way! I gave it a like.
 
I'll never like the Exp. All because I'm somehow fond of the odd idea of actually, y'know, using my mons.

Oh well. At least mods can turn it off.

So, apparently, it's rumored that customization in SV will be nothing but school uniforms for some plot reason.
It's bad enough that we gotta have kids as protags every single game, but man, we losing drip now too?

This has been solved in PBR, I refuse to believe it's that hard. The protags being literal children was only a relevant plot point in SwSh and that was just so they could have Leon handle problems off-screen.
 

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