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Low Ubers
- Thread starter Trust
- Start date
A counter is a pokemon that can switch in with minimal damage and threaten. Because Wobuffet cannot be switched into, it has no counters.
Anything with Taunt: It can't switch in.
Anything with an offensive stat-up move and at least one attack: It can't switch in and if you guess wrong about whether Wobbuffet is going to encore or counter/mirror coat, you're in trouble.
Anything powerful Dark/Bug/Ghost STAB: It can't switch in.
Anything with Toxic: Swellow says hi. Also, it can't switch in.
Anything with Toxic Spikes: Bellyzard says hi. Also, it can't switch in.
Anything with Whirlwind/Roar: That's not really countering anything. Also, it can't switch in.
Anything with U-Turn: You depend on the Wobbuffet player to switch Wobbuffet into the U-turner. Even if that happens, Wobbuffet countering means you just sacrificed something.
Another Wobbuffet/Wynaut: It can't switch in. And what's it going to do anyway?
Anything with a Sleep-inducing move: It can't switch in.
Knock Off/Trick/Switcheroo in Sandstorm/Hail: It can't switch in. And that still suffers from the encore/switch into something that will pump itself up problem.
Burn/Poison in Sandstorm/Hail: Same problem as toxic.
Anything powerful with Explosion: It can't switch in. And you STILL sacrifice something.
Unless every pokemon on the team has some serious answer to Wobbuffet, it will very probably take at least one thing out and scew things up for others.
Anything with an offensive stat-up move and at least one attack: It can't switch in and if you guess wrong about whether Wobbuffet is going to encore or counter/mirror coat, you're in trouble.
Anything powerful Dark/Bug/Ghost STAB: It can't switch in.
Anything with Toxic: Swellow says hi. Also, it can't switch in.
Anything with Toxic Spikes: Bellyzard says hi. Also, it can't switch in.
Anything with Whirlwind/Roar: That's not really countering anything. Also, it can't switch in.
Anything with U-Turn: You depend on the Wobbuffet player to switch Wobbuffet into the U-turner. Even if that happens, Wobbuffet countering means you just sacrificed something.
Another Wobbuffet/Wynaut: It can't switch in. And what's it going to do anyway?
Anything with a Sleep-inducing move: It can't switch in.
Knock Off/Trick/Switcheroo in Sandstorm/Hail: It can't switch in. And that still suffers from the encore/switch into something that will pump itself up problem.
Burn/Poison in Sandstorm/Hail: Same problem as toxic.
Anything powerful with Explosion: It can't switch in. And you STILL sacrifice something.
The Wobbuffet player can predict too and has the advantage of being able to switch Wobbuffet out for something else. Whatever goes up against Wobbuffet has to either kill it, have shed shell/u-turn/baton pass or FORCE it to switch while watching out for encore.
Unless every pokemon on the team has some serious answer to Wobbuffet, it will very probably take at least one thing out and scew things up for others.
In response to the 100+ posts out there saying Wobuffet has no counter, I'll just say this, (nearly) EVERY SINGLE POKEMON IN THE GAME CAN COUNTER WOBUFFET. Let's just say there's a certain item out there in the pokemon world that has relegated poor Wobby to the realm of mortals.
Haha, I love where this is going... and soon enough trace porygon2's will run rampant in an massive effort to counter all those toxic dugtrio's running loose.
In all seriousness though, shed shell combined with any of the other options listed by Deucalion2 (he forgot to mention BP, any dark pokemon with a special attack or ghost pokemon with a physical attack).
In all seriousness though, shed shell combined with any of the other options listed by Deucalion2 (he forgot to mention BP, any dark pokemon with a special attack or ghost pokemon with a physical attack).
Toxic Dugtrio isn't overcentralizing the metagame. Wobbufett is.
The fact that you would even consider Toxic Dugtrio is a testament to either your stupidity or Wobby's power.
To the above, Wobby can easily avoid the ghost/dark Pokemon. You can't switch on it is the main thing, so you have to predict when it will come out and by the time you know your opponent has a Wobbufett you've lost something.
speed deoxys. But sinces its not up there im voting regular deoxys because its completely outclassed by deoxys-A with deoxys regulars pitiful defenses it is going to get 1 hit by magikarps splash.
I didnt vote wobbufet for coming in on CB and CS attacks on owning it and for encore. Manaphy because its relatively fast bulky can rest off all damage in one turn and hit hard with +2 surf under rain. The latis always carry soul dew. DEoxys - a and deoxys - d have great purpose. Ho-oh has great stats only a SR rape. Mews movepool is too good to pass up.
Wynaut isnt on the list so...
I didnt vote wobbufet for coming in on CB and CS attacks on owning it and for encore. Manaphy because its relatively fast bulky can rest off all damage in one turn and hit hard with +2 surf under rain. The latis always carry soul dew. DEoxys - a and deoxys - d have great purpose. Ho-oh has great stats only a SR rape. Mews movepool is too good to pass up.
Wynaut isnt on the list so...
Deoxys Speed. But he isn't here, so it's the normal form. Completely outclassed by Deoxys-A, but far too strong for OU, though.
First of all, calm down and don't insult a fellow player who is obviously joking.
Next, consider that many OU pokes can actually do something about Wobby.
Assuming Wobbuffet w/ 252 Def, 252 SDef, 0 HP EV's and +personality depending on atk type.
From the Shoddy usage:
# Blissey (56445215 points) - Shed Shell does not really take much away from Blissey's walling ability
# Garchomp (48969247 points) - Outrage 54.13% - 63.72% , crunch 48.37% - 57.01% w/ orb
# Gengar (47210300 points) - can use a physical attack, but shadow ball 2hko's, sleep
# Gyarados (40376718 points) - taunt, obviously
# Tyranitar (39969044 points) - crunch 2hko's, taunt
# Infernape (35691877 points) - u-turn, base 120 moves fire moves hurt.
# Salamence (32224350 points) - crunch, (~50% w/ orb) draco meteor (~60% w/ orb)
# Metagross (32207375 points) - meteor miss w/ orb 46.45% - 54.70%
# Cresselia (32110627 points) - use shed shell
# Heatran (30859801 points) - Fire blast w/ orb 49.71% - 58.54%, as an added bonus, it can taunt.
Out of the top 10, many can 2hko Mr. Wob.
A 2HKO from something is basically a OHKO that's gonna be reflected right at you. Unless you're using something like a Boah set on TTar, Chain Chomp, MixMence, MixApe or a special Gyara or Metagross then the Wobbufett has no problem predicting for the kill. It sounds like a long list, but when you think about it, Boah, Wobby would probably be able to take one special hit before realising that it needed to switch, which means that Boah could theoretically do something. ChainChomp differs from Boah in that he can only get in one special attack for damage, and that one isn't exactly a Porygon-Z strength atttack, and it lowers Chomp's Special Attack. As well, Chomp isn't Dark, and so can be Coated. MixMence and MixApe I think are as useful as Boah here. Special Gyara and Special Gross are easily countered by the rest of your team. They do the same thing to Wob as they do to everything: Get one surprise hit in and then lose all effectiveness.
Your problem with everything on that list that isn't using Taunt (or physical Gengae) is the following:
Encore
Counter
Encore
screwed
won't switch in or Counter.
Mirror Coat or predict NP and Encore
Mirror Coat at first, then reassess.
Counter
Encore
Mirror Coat
I'm glad somebody caught that toxic Dugtrio wasn't serious =/
Personally I think Wob is a bit overpowered for OU, almost always either killing something or locking something into a useless attack and setting up against it (and probably coming back out later to kill/encore something again).
Sorry then. But even Smogon is overflown with retards nowadays. And you seemd so serious...
I know why Deoxys - S isn't good in Uber play, but in OU it would kill everything with specs or a CB. Look at those stats. IMO wobuffet is the worst Uber, it gets killed or gets status'd.
Yes, you 2HKO Wobba with Metagross's Meteor Mash. But then again, it OHKOs YOU with Counter. Same with Garchomp, Infernape, and Heatran. And Blissey/Cresselia carrying Shed Shell just FOR Wobba does one of two things:
1. Deals a massive blow to their walling power (both become rather retarded walls)
2. Makes Wobba overcentralizing
1. Deals a massive blow to their walling power (both become rather retarded walls)
2. Makes Wobba overcentralizing
(I am using Blaziken's quote as it sums up the counterargument quite well... )
Let me make clear my views on Wob, it is indeed a powerful pokemon and my calculations (most of which used Life Orb), have confirmed that. Any lesser pokemon would have taken substantially more damage. I initially made that post to counter Sanjay's argument that
But my point is that it is in no way invincible and it be brought down by proper prediction. If they encore, a Heatran fireblast, or any other such move, the next attack will KO Wob before it can counter. Also Wob cannot be brought in on these pokes without being destroyed on the next hit.
It has yet to be seen the extent to which Shed Shell will erode Blissey and Cresselia's formidable guard.
If you mean by 'overcentralizing' (This has always seemed a bit of an abstract term) , being taken into account whenever you make a team, then yes. However, do we not already do that for Blissey, Garchomp, etc?
If you mean by overcentralizing, limiting the metagame so that only a chosen few 'elite' pokemon can withstand Wob's power, then the answer would have to be a resounding no. Shed Shell and various other strategies can still ensure a varied and creative metagame.
After reading part of the Lati@s thread, I am glad that testing will be done (sooner rather than later) by adding Wob for a limited time into the OU realm.
Baton Pass completely tramples Wobbuffet to oblivion, especially if they are passing attacking stats. Trick users that pass Choice items also screw it. There's more than just one way to beat it, and Spiritomb and Sableye are both immune to its "attacks", and can freely set up on it.
Heh, don't forget about the PC Drinking Bird in Porygon2, and the French wonder in Gardevoir. Trace counters Wobbuffet since Gardevoir and P-2 can switch out freely after the Trace (2 pokemon with Shadow Tag against each other at the same time neutralize each other's trapping ability).