Online Competition Mega Melee

#26
Did Game Freak suddenly realize that these competitions can be both competitive and (more importantly) fun? First they allowed us to use Mythical Pokemon in the last competition and now it's a competition where every Pokemon can Mega-Evolve. Sure the scale of this meta-game is a lot smaller than previous competitions, but after going almost 10 consecutive competitions without mega-stones I'm sure some of us can agree this sounds pretty awesome.
 
#27
Did Game Freak suddenly realize that these competitions can be both competitive and (more importantly) fun? First they allowed us to use Mythical Pokemon in the last competition and now it's a competition where every Pokemon can Mega-Evolve. Sure the scale of this meta-game is a lot smaller than previous competitions, but after going almost 10 consecutive competitions without mega-stones I'm sure some of us can agree this sounds pretty awesome.
I don't know about that, the 1v1 format makes it a little too luck-based for my liking. At the very least, it will allow GF to learn which Megas fall short of deserving that one coveted Mega-slot (coughGarchompcough)
 
#31
Hello everyone. i'm kind of a newbie, i'm kinda slow and my english kinda sucks so be..kind

i just fell in love with how adorable Mega-Slowbro looks and i was wondering.. given the presence of Mawile, Aggron & Metagross (by reading your first analysis i understand that Scizor and Lucario are considered lesser threats as far as Steel-type go) i suppose that running a set with 3 defensive moves (Amnesia, Withdraw/Iron Defense and Slack Off/Rest) + Toxic is impossible.. or am i wrong?
Is it virtually possible to stall/make those steel type pokemon run out of time, and defeating the non-resistant pokemon with toxic? is it considered a "trolling", unsportsmanlike way to go? :)

I'm trying to understand (i've never used a super-defensive dude like Mega-Slowbro) if with the right nature and Evs i can avoid using DEFensive buff and play something like "Calm Mind/Amnesia, Scald, Slack Off, Toxic" or if that way i've zero chances to overcome big bad ATK bullies such as Mega Salamence & Co.

i may should've have written a lot of dumb things and of that i'm sorry
 
#32
If you're using Mega Slowbro, it's a reality that there are some opponents who will have come down to PP stalling them out, and making them kill themselves with Struggle. Steel types against a Toxic set are like this, but you generally shouldn't have trouble beating those sets anyway (unless they have Taunt, of course, in which case you're the one who has to Struggle immediately).

The way the timer works here, each player gets 10 minutes of decision time, which starts counting down at the start of the turn, and temporarily stops once you select your move. It may not seem like much, but if you take 5 seconds to decide on each move on average (you can probably do better than this, since your timer doesn't count down during move animations and you can use that time as thinking time), that still gives you enough time to get to turn 120 before you time out and lose, and 120 turns is enough to stall out almost any opponent unless they're specifically choosing moves like Withdraw on the basis of their high PP as well.
 
#33
unless they're specifically choosing moves like Withdraw on the basis of their high PP as well.
so that's the reason why some set use "Withdraw" over "Iron Defense" (i was puzzled by that, now i get it :) )

thank you!... so basically given the better amount of PP that a defensive Slowbro set has over the offensive Steel set of this competition, most of the time i could manage to defeat them (again, by stalling+struggling, 'cause i don't have another way of dealing with them) and I shouldn't worry too much about a damage-dealing move.


so what i understand is that: in this competition a Mega-Slowbro that's 100% pro-stalling:

Nature: +SpD (or Def)
EVS: 252 HP + 252 divided between SpD and Def)

Withdraw
Amnesia
Toxic
Slack Off
(or Rest? not sure)


most of the time will be better than a "hybrid" Mega-Slowbro that goes:

Nature: +Def
EVS: 252 Hp + 252 Def

Calm Mind/Amnesia
Slack Off
Toxic
Scald


sounds right? ^^''
 
#34
Make sure to pick Oblivous as your Pre-Mega ability. That way you cannot get taunted and thus avoid struggling/being unable to heal. Note that M-Slowbro does not gain SpD while mega-evolving so it is a pretty safe bet to postpone mega evolution against Special attackers in order to scout for Taunt.

There is no point in using Withdraw and Rest on the same set, Rest is better paired with Iron defense. Rest already fulfills the role of PP-stalling by adding 2 sleep turns in which your opponent has to use PP and you don´t, effectively tripling the PP of Rest. Rest is definitely worth being considered on Slowbro since it beats Toxic users.

I woud also advise against having Calm mind and Toxic on the same set. The point of picking Calm mind is to get break through mons with recovery who can shrug off unboosted Scald and regain more health. Toxic does the same (and gets stopped by Substitute) and thus it wastes a move slot.

As for EVs: I can´t think of a specific calc off the top of my head where defense EVs are important. So - since you get much more marginal benefit from investing in SpD - I would put all of it into SpD.
 
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#35
Here's a set I came up with:

Aggron
Ability: Sturdy
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 Atk/ 252 Spd / 4 Sp.Def
Item: Rockium Z
Moveset
- Head Smash
- Metal Burst
- Taunt
- Protect

This set focuses on surviving a hit with sturdy, then retaliating with Metal Burst. Taunt shut downs all other attempts of status mind games. Protect is for scouting from things like Fake Out or Status moves and keeps Sturdy in tact. The Speed investment allows you to outrun 4 Spd Venusaur. Rockium Z combined with Head Smash insanely powerful attack:

252+ Atk Aggron Continental Crush (200 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 154-183 (87.5 - 103.9%) -- 25% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Aggron Continental Crush (200 BP) vs. 252 HP / 136+ Def Altaria: 288-342 (158.2 - 187.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
-1 252+ Atk Aggron Continental Crush (200 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Salamence-Mega: 180-212 (105.2 - 123.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
52+ Atk Aggron Continental Crush (200 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Blastoise-Mega: 144-169 (92.9 - 109%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
 
#36
Note that Metal Burst, unlike Counter or Mirror Coat, does not have -priority, so if you're planning on using that move, it'll only work if you're slower than the opponent.
 
#38
Here's a set I came up with:

Aggron
Ability: Sturdy
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 Atk/ 252 Spd / 4 Sp.Def
Item: Rockium Z
Moveset
- Head Smash
- Metal Burst
- Taunt
- Protect

This set focuses on surviving a hit with sturdy, then retaliating with Metal Burst. Taunt shut downs all other attempts of status mind games. Protect is for scouting from things like Fake Out or Status moves and keeps Sturdy in tact. The Speed investment allows you to outrun 4 Spd Venusaur. Rockium Z combined with Head Smash insanely powerful attack:

252+ Atk Aggron Continental Crush (200 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 154-183 (87.5 - 103.9%) -- 25% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Aggron Continental Crush (200 BP) vs. 252 HP / 136+ Def Altaria: 288-342 (158.2 - 187.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
-1 252+ Atk Aggron Continental Crush (200 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Salamence-Mega: 180-212 (105.2 - 123.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
52+ Atk Aggron Continental Crush (200 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Blastoise-Mega: 144-169 (92.9 - 109%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
Since metal burst deals damage based on how much damage you take, wouldn't it make more sense to have max HP?
 
#39
Make sure to pick Oblivous as your Pre-Mega ability. That way you cannot get taunted and thus avoid struggling/being unable to heal. Note that M-Slowbro does not gain SpD while mega-evolving so it is a pretty safe bet to postpone mega evolution against Special attackers in order to scout for Taunt
i didn't realize that, thanks! :)

about the rest of your suggestions, there are things I understand and intend to do, for example the Evs distribution in SpD.. and things I'm confused about:

there is no point in using Withdraw and Amnesia on the same set
why is that? if a choose to use a pure defensive M-Slowbro, with Toxic and Slack Off/Rest, shouldn't i be ready to boost both my defense (if i face a physical attacker) and special defense (if i face a special attacker?)


Rest is better paired with Iron defense. Rest already fulfills the role of PP-stalling by adding 2 sleep turns in which your opponent has to use PP and you don´t, effectively tripling the PP of Rest. Rest is definitely worth being considered on Slowbro since it beats Toxic users
but doesn't Rest make Slowbro into dead meat against strong attack? considering how slow he is, arent't 3 turns more than enough for the other Mega-Pokemon (Mega Salamence, Heracross, etc.) to kill me while i'm asleep?


for what I understand, you think that Toxic is not a good choice, and Calm Mind + Scald is the better choice, because the pokemon i cannot kill with scald are the ones i can stall/struggle using defensive boost and recovery moves... is that so? ^^''

I'm not sure i got that right, but i think the 3 possible set for this competition are these:

SET 1
-Withdraw
-Amnesia
-Slack Off/Rest
-Toxic


SET 2
-Withdraw
-Calm Mind
-Slack Off
-Scald


SET
-Iron Defense
-Rest
-Calm Mind
-Scald

and while i understand that the first one has these problems:
1- can't touch steel pokemon, but could manage to stall/struggle them
2- has a problem against other toxic/rest users

i don't understand how the third one could work against strong attackers
 
#41
With this two fellows I could win almost all my games (calm mind Slowbro-M are so damn tankies)

Lucario @ Choice Specs
Ability: Steadfast
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Aura Sphere
- Flash Cannon
- Psychic
- Dark Pulse


Aerodactyl-Mega @ Aerodactylite
Ability: Unnerve
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ice Fang
- Aerial Ace
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake
 
#42
Kangaskhan @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Scrappy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fake Out
- Protect
- Seismic Toss
- Ice Beam

From what i've seen on the ladder this is S rank threat so far. Sub can be used over Protect if you want to fare better against Yawn + Protect or a physical Giga Impact set can be run over Ice Beam.

The big 3 fighting types (Lopunny, Blaziken, Lucario) and WoW ghosts are about it for what beats this set which in my experience means Kangaskhan is probably going to have a positive matchup against half of every team.
 
#43
Mescalinic

Oh sorry, what I meant to say is that there is no point in running "Withdraw and Rest" on the same set (I have edited that word now) - use Iron defense instead of Withdraw if you use Rest. I give the reasons for that in the sentences following it. Of course, there is nothing speaking against amnesia, in fact, I highly recommend it.

The other point I wanted to make is not that Calm mind + Scald is always better than Toxic. My point is that if you already have Calm mind + Scald on your set, then there is no further benefit to adding Toxic in a third moveslot. The benefit of using Toxic to break through stalling mons is that you can run Amnesia which allows you to handle certain strong special attackers who 2HKO you when you have only 1 stage of SpD boosts whereas +2 SpD gives you a third turn in which you can then heal up.
Of course the downside of Toxic is that you have to rely on trying to make your Toxic-immune opponents struggle (including all substitute users and Mega-Sableye/Absol). And rest gives you huge trouble. You also give up on the chance of a nice Scald burn.

You can also run a set with Scald + Amnesia (Iron defense, Slack off). You get the benefit of resisting most special attackers very well and you do not have to worry about the plethora of toxic immune mons. This of course weakens your matchup against recovering mons.

As you can see all these choices have their pros and cons. Handling a certain type of enemy better than others but falling short in other areas. It ultimately depends on what situation you expect to face the most or what role your Slowbro needs to fulfill in your team in order to patch weaknesses of the rest of your team composition.

Same goes for your criticism of Rest. It has problems against strong attackers. On the other hand it beats Toxic which other sets lose against.

In the sets your proposed I would make the following changes:
Set 1: If you pick rest, then use Iron defense instead of Withdraw.
Set 2: Pick Iron defense instead of Withdraw. If you can boost up to +6 SpA, you should have no need to PP stall. You also do not have to worry about your opponent using Rest because of your high damage.
Set 3: On a Rest set I would prefer to run Amnesia as with only +1 def boost you will likely not survive until you wake up.
 
#44
Yeah, definitely. HOWEVER, if your dank game is strong enough you just might meme your way to victory like I did here.
This replay is hilarious and I have to share it.
[replay]gen7megamelee-625504620[/replay]
This should be banned by the Geneva Convention.

But it gives me an idea or two...
 
#46
It took me a while to get used to this meta but Mega Mawile has been amazing it basically beats everything except physically defensive mons. Focus sash alakazam has also been great for me so far definitely the two that have won me the most matches.
 
#47
I've tested the waters quite a bit now, and have discovered that sash garchomp is pretty damn fantastic. I've been running a standard spread with Outrage / Swords Dance / Rock Slide / Earthquake. I would list all the mons which it beats, but I'd be here a long time. Go into the taembuilder and look at all the megas, it's amazing how many of them chomp beats without any effort!
 

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