Monogen

I think that this metagame is really going to test the mettle of anyone who wants to build using an underdog generation. There are some things which are normally useless but suddenly gain a large amount of viability due to the limited options for that generation. For example, Trapinch and Nosepass are the only currently legal options for trappers in generation 3, which means that their viability (or at least the former's) will be significantly higher here than it is in standard due to them providing unique support to their generation.

Just one thing, but I think it'd probably be okay to unban STag in this metagame on the basis that it is limited to generations 2, 3 and 5. Most of the cores which made Shadow Tag uncompetitive in standard (e.g. Goth+M-Sab) are no longer possible due to the generational restrictions. Sure, you could run Wynaut+Mega Sableye, but Wynaut's disappointing bulk (even with Eviolite) and comparatively lackluster utility - especially without access to any of Tyranitar, Bisharp or Weavile for Pursuit support - means that the core is nowhere near as potent as the more traditional GothSab core. Similarly, Wobbuffet has lost one of its more potent archetypes due to Weavile being lost to gen 4, Bisharp being lost to gen 5 and Hoopa-U being lost to gen 6. To run Wobb darkspam, your options are now limited to Tyranitar, Houndoom and Sneasel - which lacks a lot of the potency of the traditional Wobb+Bisharp+Weavile core of from standard. In addition, a lot of the stuff which it supports best are exclusive to other generations, which further hurts its viability. All in all, I think that Shadow Tag is nowhere near as uncompetitive as in standard due to the available options, and as a result I think it is pretty balanced for the most part. Its at least re-test worthy imo.

Edit: Seriously, why in god's name does gen 1 have access to everything needed to make a successful full sun team (CharY+Venu+Duggy+Ninetales+Sandslash (spinner and sand stop in one)+filler) .-.

I guess gen 2 gets Poli+Kingdra, but seriously gen 1 is capable of putting sun on sterroids .-.
 
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If Donphan is on the gen 2 list, add fucking Feraligatr imo

You can actually do a bit of water spam with some gen 2 mons, like politoed, feraligatr, azu, kingdra to maul offense. And you got Scizor too.
 
Alexis Breeze said:
Add Clefable into the mix and Starmie as one of the best spinners and you got yourself a monster team with plenty of flexibility for a 6th slot (Curselax for wincon, BandNite, sash Zam for revenge killing, etc)
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In my experience Defog Zapdos is superior to Starmie for removing hazards on Gen I stall because it has far better defensive synergy with the rest of the team, providing a Flying resist and a Ground immunity - whereas Starmie has the same typing as Slowbro and as such doesn't actually improve the teams ability to wall anything. I find that either Ditto or stallbreaker Mew is best for the last slot; Ditto deters dangerous sweepers like Charizard X from setting up, whereas Mew is excellent against other defensive teams and also serves as a check to a lot of physical attackers.
 
Actually something rather fun on gen 1 stall, semistall and balance is SubToxic Zapdos, which is able to PP stall low PP moves with the combo of Sub and Roost while breaking down stuff like Thick Fat Snorlax and Hippo (the latter of which it lures effectively due to its inability to otherwise touch it). Zap ain't just limited to Defog :p
 
From playing this metagame, getting 3 alts to the top of the ladder. Here is my opinion on the tier list for each Generation. Top-Middle-Bottom

Top Tier:

Gen 1
They offer the most diversity in this metagame. Equipped with the majority/best of megas, allows it to run a multitude of teams. It has great hazard control, great diversity of typing and a wide variety of pokemon that can perform different roles. Clefable, Chansey, charizard, Slowbro, mew are some of the few you are going to see when running into a Gen 1 team. All powerful and can fit into nearly any team.

Gen 2
The stall tier of this metagame. It offers the best walls of pokemon along with the best team synergy. Funny thing about Gen 2 is that Defensive Sap Sipper Azumarill shuts down the majority of Gen 3,5, and 6, due to their lack of good poison and electric types. It also specializes in bulky offense with Tyranitar, Mega Scizor. Heracross, Ampharos, azumaril, Feraligatr, raikou etc. Gen 2's bulk is hard to break


Middle Tier:

Gen 4
Someone said earlier it's "the jack of all trades, master of none." I agree it is the best balanced tier. It has great walls, good sweepers, good team synergy and hazard control. Gen 1 can overshadow certain teams preventing this gen from being top tier. You'll most likely find a Garchomp, Rotom form, Lopunny, Mamoswine, Cresselia. All of them are great additions to balance teams

Gen 5
The Hyper Offense of this metagame. Due to having limited hazard control with just Excadrill, mandibuzz and Archeops(if you are leading with it) It usually needs to get the job done quickly. Also it homes some of the most powerful non-mega attackers in pokemon. It is very easy to play with however it is limited to having more diversity only in Hyper Offense. Stall teams look the same (When they are played) Thundurus, Serperior, bisharp, hydreigon, terrakion. A great Gen, just not enough to top Gen 1 and 2


Bottom Tier:

Gen 3

It has the hardest hitting megas in the game, however alot of the pokemon are random with very little team synergy. Team building can be difficult but creative. Sadly I've found that if you are running a Gen 3 team, there is probably another gen who can do exactly what that team is trying to accomplish but better. It's not that bad, just every other Gen completely overshadows it. Although without Drizzle it has some of the best rain sweepers in pokemon.

Gen 6
I dont have much experience against this Gen but the best way I can describe this gen is it is like having a bunch of point guards on one team. No good walls, great offensive pokemon who need support from "other generations." but without that support it is hard for them to function. ZERO hazard control unless you want to use LOL avalugg. Magic Bounce Diancie gives a good check to hazards, but it risks switching in sometimes. Hoopa and Talonflame are the stars of Gen 6, Hoopa wall breaking and Talonflame cleaning up. As I stated earlier though, lack of good walls, means that it has a tough time with momentum compared to Gen 5. With their lack of Steel and Poison types Fairy types are hard to kill, limiting team building even more. Hence why I put them at the bottom of the tier list.

If anyone has a different opinion on viability I'd love to hear it :) This metagame is fun.
 
Gen 6 isnt as bad as everyone makes it out to be. It can run hyper offensive easily, and put a ton of pressure on the meta currently, as it seems a lot of generations are leaning more towards stall. Hoopa U is great right now, most gens don't have a switchin for this thing, and when paired with diancie/talon, they can reap havoc on plenty of unprepared teams. Although they don't have a reliable way to keep hazards off the field, stacking spikes with chesnaught is prefered anyway. On a side note, did aegi get rebanned? It wont let me use it on the ladder
 
I swear literally every decent gen 6 team ive seen so far has been talon+mdiancie+hoopa-u+aegi and two fillers. I mean jeez the diversity among gen six teams has been god awful from what I've seen due to it having so few fully evolved mons to choose from. It is honestly so hard to build with and honestly I agree qith what people have been saying about it being the worst option to build with. I have tried to build around three teams now and it always ends up looping back around to that same build. I might as well list some of the cooler options I've found for the last two slots...
  • Avalugg (hazard removal+titanic defense+reliable recovery is all handy to have given that there are literally no other spinners/defoggers
  • Zygarde (proving to be kinda nice due to its typing and nice stat spread)
  • Chesnaught (spikes+good defense make this valuable support to have)
  • Hawlucha and Slurpuff (nice cleaners)
  • Diggersby (nuke)
  • Vivillon (okay cleaner and neat utility)
  • Klefki (need I say what this does lol)
  • Sylve and Helio (best fairy and elec, respectively; latter provides Volt Switch support)
  • Pangoro (stall reaker)
I've literally listed half of the available options in this post alone. Its kinda pathetic just how little it has to use tbh.
 
I can't say I agree with Gen II being the stall tier honestly. I haven't played much, but Gen I has all the tools needed for stall, as well as other things on top of that. My experience from monotype tells me that not every group (be it type or gen) will necessarily be useful, and while Gen I lacks Steel mons I find it more than makes up for this from its access to clefable, mew, zapdos, mega venusaur and more, while chansey > blissey and slowbro and starmie can fill the role of bulky water just as well as any of the Gen II water mons. The ability to run a cleaner such as Dragonite or revenge killer such as Alakazam or Ditto, as well as stallbreakers such as Gengar, simply make Gen II stall teams seem outclassed from what I've seen.
With that said, access to mons like Ttar, Scizor and Mega Heracross make semi-stall or balanced Gen II seem reasonable, I think.
 
Articuno I said:
I can't say I agree with Gen II being the stall tier honestly. I haven't played much, but Gen I has all the tools needed for stall, as well as other things on top of that. My experience from monotype tells me that not every group (be it type or gen) will necessarily be useful, and while Gen I lacks Steel mons I find it more than makes up for this from its access to clefable, mew, zapdos, mega venusaur and more, while chansey > blissey and slowbro and starmie can fill the role of bulky water just as well as any of the Gen II water mons. The ability to run a cleaner such as Dragonite or revenge killer such as Alakazam or Ditto, as well as stallbreakers such as Gengar, simply make Gen II stall teams seem outclassed from what I've seen.
With that said, access to mons like Ttar, Scizor and Mega Heracross make semi-stall or balanced Gen II seem reasonable, I think.
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Stalling from Gen II and Gen 1 are quite different. From experience Gen 1 i believe is better due to having "unique" stallers and Mew (who can customize to certain stall needs). Gen I stall allows it to beat a variety of play styles from all generations which is why I believe it is better. However... Gen 2's stall flatout beats certain generations regardless of their team. Gen 2 has the bulkiest walls we use in regular OU. Suicune,Skarmory,Blissey,Celebi,Donphan, Assault Vest Raikou, Spdef tyranitar, forretress, scizor. Gen 2 also offers the best in hazard control with the best spinners, spikers, Xatu and Espeon. So far Gen 2 is what I've been rocking and a pokemon I stated earlier just shits on other generations alone is sap sipper azumarill. Being a defensive bulkier fairy that puts a complete stop to Breloom, Serperior, both charizard formes, heracross, clefable and alot of dragons.Those are just some things I've listed off the top of my head but huge threats on teams. Gen 2 also provides wincon set ups with suicune,Raikou, ttar, and mega scizor.

Edit: you know after all this rambling I might have to change my opinion and say Gen 2 is the better staller. Didn't want to be biased but it has very few weaknesses. Except gen 6 who just shits on Gen 2 stall with Hoopa U
 
gamer boy said:
I swear literally every decent gen 6 team ive seen so far has been talon+mdiancie+hoopa-u+aegi and two fillers. I mean jeez the diversity among gen six teams has been god awful from what I've seen due to it having so few fully evolved mons to choose from. It is honestly so hard to build with and honestly I agree qith what people have been saying about it being the worst option to build with. I have tried to build around three teams now and it always ends up looping back around to that same build. I might as well list some of the cooler options I've found for the last two slots...
  • Avalugg (hazard removal+titanic defense+reliable recovery is all handy to have given that there are literally no other spinners/defoggers
  • Zygarde (proving to be kinda nice due to its typing and nice stat spread)
  • Chesnaught (spikes+good defense make this valuable support to have)
  • Hawlucha and Slurpuff (nice cleaners)
  • Diggersby (nuke)
  • Vivillon (okay cleaner and neat utility)
  • Klefki (need I say what this does lol)
  • Sylve and Helio (best fairy and elec, respectively; latter provides Volt Switch support)
  • Pangoro (stall reaker)
I've literally listed half of the available options in this post alone. Its kinda pathetic just how little it has to use tbh.
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First of all, Aegi is banned lol. Have you actually seen any teams?
Sure you don't have much to work with, but it completely shits on every stall team due to Hawlucha and Talonflame. Diggersby is actually amazing, and Klefki is the only hazard setter you need.
Additionally, Pangoro and Avalugg are pretty bad.
I would say that teambuilding is difficult, but gen 6 gives you almost everything you need. In particular, the speed tiers are amazing because most teams have only one thing to outspeed you with.

jamashawalker said:
From playing this metagame, getting 3 alts to the top of the ladder. Here is my opinion on the tier list for each Generation. Top-Middle-Bottom

Top Tier:

Gen 1
They offer the most diversity in this metagame. Equipped with the majority/best of megas, allows it to run a multitude of teams. It has great hazard control, great diversity of typing and a wide variety of pokemon that can perform different roles. Clefable, Chansey, charizard, Slowbro, mew are some of the few you are going to see when running into a Gen 1 team. All powerful and can fit into nearly any team.

Gen 2
The stall tier of this metagame. It offers the best walls of pokemon along with the best team synergy. Funny thing about Gen 2 is that Defensive Sap Sipper Azumarill shuts down the majority of Gen 3,5, and 6, due to their lack of good poison and electric types. It also specializes in bulky offense with Tyranitar, Mega Scizor. Heracross, Ampharos, azumaril, Feraligatr, raikou etc. Gen 2's bulk is hard to break


Middle Tier:

Gen 4
Someone said earlier it's "the jack of all trades, master of none." I agree it is the best balanced tier. It has great walls, good sweepers, good team synergy and hazard control. Gen 1 can overshadow certain teams preventing this gen from being top tier. You'll most likely find a Garchomp, Rotom form, Lopunny, Mamoswine, Cresselia. All of them are great additions to balance teams

Gen 5
The Hyper Offense of this metagame. Due to having limited hazard control with just Excadrill, mandibuzz and Archeops(if you are leading with it) It usually needs to get the job done quickly. Also it homes some of the most powerful non-mega attackers in pokemon. It is very easy to play with however it is limited to having more diversity only in Hyper Offense. Stall teams look the same (When they are played) Thundurus, Serperior, bisharp, hydreigon, terrakion. A great Gen, just not enough to top Gen 1 and 2


Bottom Tier:

Gen 3

It has the hardest hitting megas in the game, however alot of the pokemon are random with very little team synergy. Team building can be difficult but creative. Sadly I've found that if you are running a Gen 3 team, there is probably another gen who can do exactly what that team is trying to accomplish but better. It's not that bad, just every other Gen completely overshadows it. Although without Drizzle it has some of the best rain sweepers in pokemon.

Gen 6
I dont have much experience against this Gen but the best way I can describe this gen is it is like having a bunch of point guards on one team. No good walls, great offensive pokemon who need support from "other generations." but without that support it is hard for them to function. ZERO hazard control unless you want to use LOL avalugg. Magic Bounce Diancie gives a good check to hazards, but it risks switching in sometimes. Hoopa and Talonflame are the stars of Gen 6, Hoopa wall breaking and Talonflame cleaning up. As I stated earlier though, lack of good walls, means that it has a tough time with momentum compared to Gen 5. With their lack of Steel and Poison types Fairy types are hard to kill, limiting team building even more. Hence why I put them at the bottom of the tier list.

If anyone has a different opinion on viability I'd love to hear it :) This metagame is fun.
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I'd say swap 6 and 5. Six has an amazing Mega (Diancie), a prankster for speed control, amazing sweepers, two belly drummers if you are into that, and can rip any fairies you need with the star of the show, Talonflame. Without Talonflame it would honestly be the worst of them all, but Talonflame+Diancie+ 4 OU is pretty great, even without its ability to pack Hoopa-U.
 
gamer boy said:
Aegislash is legal read the op .-.
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The Immortal said:
Monogen is the Leader's Choice for January! I think starting with OU by default is a good idea.
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upload_2016-1-4_8-37-0.png

Play the meta Lmao
 
Thats weird i could have swore i saw a bunch the other day. Maybe im misremembering then ignore me rip.

Anyway I have messed around w/ gen 2 the most and its a sweet gen for rain, which is a nice contrast from the typically very bulky gen 2 stuff and its nice to have v.s offensive builds due to overwhelming them. I've been using a build of
Poli+Kingdra+Azu+Celebi+MZor+Raikou and been having some fun with it as a nice offense team, although I'll still say that the fat builds are the most consistent in gen 2. Its a nice break from the very defensive builds either way, which is why I use it ;P

Edit: Oh ik why i think i remember aegi; the combo of the op and one guy who kept getting paired with me who was using a doublade squad, and he was using the build i brought up
 
Since I was bored, I've decided to revamp the list of relevant Pokemon, including the Megas introduced in ORAS:

Megas:
006-mega-x.png
006-mega-y.png
003-mega.png
009-mega.png
015-mega.png
018-mega.png
065-mega.png
080-mega.png
127-mega.png
130-mega.png
142-mega.png


Viable:
003.png
031.png
034.png
036.png
051.png
065.png
073.png
080.png
082.png
091.png
094.png
113.png
121.png
130.png
132.png
139.png
141.png
142.png
145.png
149.png
151.png


Niche:
038.png
(Sun Setter)
059.png
(Priority)
062.png
(Phazer)
076.png
(Suicide Lead/Stealth Rock)
134.png
(Wish Passer/Water Check)
135.png
(Pivot)
143.png
(Curse)
Megas:
181-mega.png
208-mega.png
212-mega.png
214-mega.png
229-mega.png
248-mega.png


Viable:
160.png
169.png
184.png
186.png
195.png
199.png
212.png
213.png
214.png
227.png
230.png
233.png
242.png
243.png
244.png
245.png
248.png
251.png


Niche:
171.png
(Cleric/Electric Check)
178.png
(Magic Bounce)
196.png
(Magic Bounce)
197.png
(Foul Play/Wish Passer)
198.png
(Prankster)
205.png
(Spikes/Spinner/Suicide Lead)
211.png
(Swift Swim)
232.png
(Spinner/Stealth Rock)
235.png
(Spore)
Megas:
254-mega.png
260-mega.png
282-mega.png
302-mega.png
306-mega.png
308-mega.png
310-mega.png
319-mega.png
323-mega.png
334-mega.png
359-mega.png
362-mega.png
376-mega.png
380-mega.png


Viable:
286.png
292.png
302.png
342.png
373.png
376.png
380.png
381.png
385.png


Niche:
272.png
(Swift Swim)
282.png
(Trace)
344.png
(Spinner/Suicide Lead)
346.png
(SubSeed)
350.png
(Competitive)
356.png
(Spinblocker)
368.png
(Shell Smash Sweeper)
Megas:
428-mega.png
445-mega.png
460-mega.png
475-mega.png


Viable:
392.png
395.png
398.png
407.png
423.png
430.png
437.png
445.png
448.png
450.png
454.png
461.png
462.png
464.png
465.png
468.png
472.png
473.png
478.png
479-wash.png
479-heat.png
482.png
485.png
488.png
490.png
492.png


Niche:
389.png
(Stealth Rock)
429.png
(Spinblocker)
441.png
(Chatter/Boomburst)
442.png
(Spinblocker)
477.png
(Spinblocker)
Mega:
531-mega.png


Viable:
494.png
497.png
500.png
530.png
534.png
537.png
545.png
547.png
553.png
563.png
579.png
591.png
593.png
594.png
598.png
609.png
612.png
620.png
625.png
630.png
635.png
637.png
638.png
639.png
641.png
641-therian.png
642.png
642-therian.png
645-therian.png
646.png
646-black.png
647-r.png
648.png


Niche:
508.png
(Sand Rush)
571.png
(Illusion)
596.png
(Sticky Web)
Mega:
719-mega.png


Viable:
652.png
660.png
663.png
675.png
680.png
691.png
697.png
700.png
701.png
706.png
707.png
711.png
718.png
720.png
720-u.png


Niche:
673.png
(Bulk Up + Milk Drink)
685.png
(Belly Drum)
687.png
(Topsy Turvy)
695.png
(Pivot/Water Check)
713.png
(Spinner)
715.png
(Pivot)

I'm aware that this list is far from perfect, so feel free to give me suggestions about how to improve or fix it.
 
so the first post says that this uses the same ban list as OU then lists greninja and talonflame as relevant Pokes
 
Tanamon said:
so the first post says that this uses the same ban list as OU then lists greninja and talonflame as relevant Pokes
Click to expand...
Its old. The author has been away for a while. Back then, Greninja was legal (talonflame still is, btw).
 
Ppl don't seem to rate gen 4 that much but I think it has a pretty solid offense team lurking in there somewhere, Froslass is always annoying especially with the limitation of options to counter lead it, while mix infernape(Fire Blast/Close Combat/Grass Knot/Gunk Shot) brutalises most stall builds. Garchomp, Lucario, Mamoswine, Heatran and Manaphy means you have a lot of toys to play with too, not to mention how effective Lopunny and Weavile are vs opposing offense
 
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