Metagame NP: Stage 8 - Coming Down (Inteleon & Snorlax Banned)

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:sv/inteleon:
I dont think inteleon:inteleon: is much of a threat. when In the tier you have florges:florges:, umbreon:umbreon:, sylveon:sylveon: and chansey:chansey:, I dont see inteleon being broken. Sure, it has great speed, but jolteon:jolteon: and electrode-H:electrode-hisui: are just faster. It hits hard, but There are v solid tanks out There that can come and just start wish protecting While often Even dont need To protecting. You need sheeeeer RNG against your oppo To bring two surf crits As snipe shot dont manage To 2hko leftos umbreon. Offensively, just enter snorlax:snorlax:, decidueye:decidueye:, hecidueye:decidueye-hisui: or Even bruxish:bruxish:. P easy To revenge kill with any scarf, like gallade:gallade: or flamigo:flamigo:. Its coverage moves are Ice beam and dark pulse, but dark pulse is just a faster way To kill mismagius:mismagius: and hoopa:hoopa:. The common defensive tera type water Also nukes It and You find yourself poing against coalossal for no Good reason.


:sv/toxtricity:
About toxtricity, I Really think that thing is strong. Busted, I dont know. Its lack of bulk make It hard To sweep if It doesnt OHKO. meanwhile, Its Good defensive typing is acceptable fr setting up against mono attackers. But Then its lack of bulk make It difficult To start sweeping for example on a choice locked pokemon As it'll probably dO 60% anyways. Tera Norm is good against offensive teams, But It makes It Too vulnerable for bulky teams. One of its best tools is that boomburst punk rock is so powerful that It kills Ground types, and Even if bulky, You can't take superreffective hits. If boomburst hit superefectively on anything, Then sure itd be straight up broken But I dont quite see It being one of The tier's main threats. Tip: Main counter: Umbreon:umbreon:. can't Really switch in If hazards are up buuut foul play does hella damages with foul play. chansey:chansey: is just a check To choiced sets.


:bw/snorlax:
Im a big snorlax fan, and this guy blocks The route win. Curse sets are solid with both leftos and restochesto, and You can Never know of It runs thick fat or immunity As anyways it's Very bulky specially so flamethrower won't do enough. it's yet another thing that kill typhlosion:typhlosion: and a solid counter To sun (if You manage To neutralize The brute bonnet:brute-bonnet:). While At first glance The abundance of fighting types and mostly sacred sword gallade:gallade: (ignores curse boosts) might just counter It offensively, Tera fairy chips out the matchup. What pushes It so far is the consistency of rest on it. While ither setup sweeper have To deal with the devil itself gligar:gligar:, snorlax is a Too heavy charge for it and You surely need roar To prevent a total rampage. Well, technically haze But eh qwilfish:qwilfish: has Other priorities and inteleon:inteleon: just isn't common enough To be a solid counterplay.


About venomoth, it's a v strong setup sweeper and tinted lens is so strong But I dont see it often enough To have An accurate opinion over it.
 
:inteleon: Choice Specs Inteleon is strong but manageable ,it has enough checks able to decently shrug off his water moves (or he's forced to tera to achieve 2hko) and offensive answers to force it out .On the other hand Sniper sets popped off recently.Unlike Specs, this set doesn't need to predict,denying defensive counterplay with crit boosted Snipe Shot.Special tanks able to avoid 2hko like Chansey or Florges are getting taunted and pivoted on . Thus Inteleon should be banned for now until we get more sturdiers water resists.

:toxtricity: Not only being able to bypass usual counterplay with Shift Gear+Drain Punch sets ,Toxtricity also gain Psychic Noise in DLC2 which allow it like Inteleon to deny recovery from Chansey her only reliable answer.Ban

:snorlax: Snorlax isn't threatening on his own with a lot of Fighting types able to keep it in check (especially sacred sword) but it's easy to build around it and abuse counterplay which is kinda shaky : Encore and Trick are heavily relies on prediction,Haze is hard to fit on teams when poison and paralysis from Snorlax and his teammates can be detrimental for defensive and offensive checks respectively to win long term as shown during SCL Finals . Even if fighting-types are good checks, they are also walled after Tera Fairy/Poison.Snorlax may come back later after drops but should be banned for now.
 

Phantomistix

I exploded on a protect Snorlax
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:Inteleon:
Inteleon has 3 sets it can run. Scarf is very mediocre but specs and criteleon are plain broken and its very easy to see. The only pokemon in the tier that can eat 2 water moves from either set and live are Chansey, Wo Chien, Goodra and SDef Decidueye/Brute Bonnet, and even then its only barely and doesn't factor in hazards or the latter three getting 2HKOd by Ice beam. Traditional SDef options like Umbreon, Sylveon, AV Copperajah, Scream Tail, Hariyama, Snorlax, Bronzong all get 2HKOd from full with ease, especially when you factor hazards in the case of the eevees. An adaptation I've made to the Criteleon set is running Protect over Dark Pulse because frankly, Dark Pulse is very redundant. Protect allows you to scout scarfers (and Ambipom), nullifying them as counterplay by going into an immunity/resist and taking back the momentum advantage. Jolteon and Htrode outspeed and revenge kill Inteleon but can never come in on its attacks, often having to trade a pokemon for the chance to revenge kill, and even then the Inteleon can switch out and come in later for another kill. Inteleon is a very easy BAN for me. It makes progress very easily with or without tera and there are no reliable options to eat its attacks in practice, especially considering the threat of Ice Beam, and hazards and chip from Inteleon's teammates.

:Snorlax:
We currently have 7 fighting types in the tier, and every single one loses to Snorlax. It simply clicks tera and continutes boosting/sweeping. I think it's worth noting that the Snorlax DOESN'T have to curse every time it comes in. It can also click BSlam and cripple teams through chip and yellow magic. Defensive counterplay is very unreliable (see SCL Finals replay), and phasing doesn't even work in last mon situations. Encore especially is very unreliable as both Scream Tail and Uxie are not strong enough to break the Snorlax while its encored, and Salazzle will never risk switching in as the Snorlax can simply attack on switch and nuke it. Snorlax has 2 insane abilities that enable its playstyle; Immunity completely invalidates Encore + Toxic, and Thick Fat can bolster its already impressive defensive profile to give it an even easier time boosting. When facing Snorlax I found that often the best way to limit it is playing incredibly aggressively with doubles to not allow it to set up, but that playstyle is very prediction reliant and can crumble at any turn. Yes Snorlax is vulnerable to hazards, but it can also come in safely on all hazard setters not named Copperajah. Another very easy BAN imo.

Please note that saying that a mon is not broken simply because it relies on tera is a VERY bad argument. There is very little incentive to tera with other mons if using it on one of the brokens wins the game. (which it does 90% of the time).
 

Rabia

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:snorlax:
I voted to ban Snorlax. I think CurseLax dominates games far too easily to keep it around; Terastallization + Body Slam paralysis negates a lot of counterplay that you'd otherwise have. Even in games where you can't find easy setup, you still have a paralysis-spreading special wall that really nothing is threatening to OHKO.

DNB arguments are quite valid in that Snorlax can be really heavily pressured, though, and forced to constantly use Rest. Hazard control in this metagame isn't great, while Spikes are, which conveniently is Snorlax's worst matchup. If you're able to maintain passive damage pressure through hazards or even just exploit Snorlax's propensity to switch into power special attacks, you can keep it in check by preventing it from doing anything other than being that really reliable special wall. In the end, though, I've found that more direct counterplay isn't really prevalent in the tier currently outside of, say, IronPress Duraludon and Swords Dance Rhydon, which win the mirror matchup almost always.

:inteleon:
I voted to not ban Inteleon. I think critics of it are fair in saying it picks up KOs really easily, but they go overboard in saying "this is such an obvious ban" because it is really held back by how poor its bulk is. Essentially every revenge killer can pick it off, and every common form of priority in the tier (we're really just talking Sucker Punch from Zoroark, Brute Bonnet, and Toxicroak here) puts it down. This fragility also makes getting switch-ins pretty hard unless you can always rely on teammate pivot support or aggressive double switching, but I find that to be a fair reward for playing well in games. Even when you get it onto the field, you're not guaranteed to get a KO or anything; Pokemon like Chansey, Umbreon, Sylveon, Assault Vest Meloetta, and more can avoid the 2HKO or force the offensive Tera to... still not get OHKOed and reveal what Inteleon's set is, which makes playing around it much easier. It's one of the top-3 or so Pokemon in the tier I'd wager, but I think people are overreacting to it.

:toxtricity:
I voted to not ban Toxtricity. It really just comes down to the mid speed and how it relies on attacks with common immunities to wallbreak. Psychic Noise is definitely bait I would never use that move, but Shift Gear is a fair shout the pro-ban crowd has mentioned that does worry me a bit. So far, though, I've not seen enough of it to get me to vote ban.
 
:Snorlax:
Snorlax feels to me alot like the various bulky setup pokemon (Ursaring, Eelektross, Sandaconda, Dudunsparce, etc.) NU has dealt with so far this generation. It abuses Tera to flip its weakness meaning the opponent has to preserve multiple pieces to deal with the Snorlax before it reveals its final typing. It is pretty dependent on Tera to win games, but it is very good an converting the Tera to a win. The opportunity cost of using your Tera with Snorlax is outweighed by how much Snorlax can get out of it. I think its often neglected in the builder, but options to directly counter it feel quite weird. Perhaps with time, the meta will develop to better handle it, but for now my vote for this is slate is Ban.

:Inteleon:
This pokemon has felt overwhelming in both the builder and in-game play to me since it dropped. Specs and sniper sets really stand out to me as the premier options since you really want to be doing damage when you manage to get Inteleon in. Inteleon requires more than just water resist/immunity per team, and you often need to stack switchin or have a dedicated Tera Water SpDef sponge for it, like Umbreon. This has felt super warping for me, where I find myself making multiple pokemon Tera Water on my team that would otherwise be something else, in addition to running natural water resists. Its not impossible to revenge kill, but it is faster than probably 5/6 pokemon on your opponents team. The speed and power that this pokemon offers is just too much for the current tier. My vote for this slate is Ban.

:Toxtricity:
I haven't found Toxtricity to be bannable so far. Its attacks have lots of natural immunites on top of some ability based immunities like Soundproof Trode and Lightning Rod Rhydon. I find that I struggle to have a moveset that feels "free" to just click and get kills with on Choiced sets. Its typing is quite good defensively, but it is still quite frail, making it hard to get in often. Shift gear sets have felt underwhelming when I've used it since it can't really hit everything with 3 slots. My vote for this slate is Do Not Ban.
 

etern

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NU Leader
Last slate of the year has come to a conclusion and the results are as follows: Inteleon and Snorlax are banned from NU, while Toxtricity remains in NU.



DLC2 Shifts are just a bit over a week away, and we can expect a massive shakeup from that, so expect more tiering action to occur after that. Until then, cope, seethe, and mald at toxtricity abusers by using soundproof tera steel electrode-hisui on every team!

Marty Kris
 
Last slate of the year has come to a conclusion and the results are as follows: Inteleon and Snorlax are banned from NU, while Toxtricity remains in NU.



DLC2 Shifts are just a bit over a week away, and we can expect a massive shakeup from that, so expect more tiering action to occur after that. Until then, cope, seethe, and mald at toxtricity abusers by using soundproof tera steel electrode-hisui on every team!

Marty Kris
Haye whabt shift gear drain punch? Very Good rn and kills dat soundproof piece of wood
 
Predection for the new droping mons from OU to NU: (and also pu)
-:alcremie: :araquanid: :blastoise: :bellossom: :entei:
:comfey: :dewgong: :dodrio: :flygon: :exeggutor: :exeggutor-alola: :golurk: :granbull: :hitmontop: :hitmonchan: :hitmonlee: :lanturn: :bastiodon::rampardos: :lapras: :meganium: :malamar: :meowstic: :meowstic-f: :magmortar: :minior: :minun: :plusle: :regirock: :regice: :regigigas: :galvantula: :zebstrika: :whimsicott: :virizion: :vileplume: :toucannon: :smeargle: :scrafty: :sceptile: :kingdra:

-And there's some pokemon that i feally don't know what tier they will fell:
-:electivire: was always a big big disappointment since it's introduction in gen 4 it have a ok stats but the problem with beign a mono electric pokemon is that you don't have a good stab unless you're a pikachu or zeraora and the worst part having no setup moves beside meditite but with the dlc 2 giving it another electric stab and access to bulk and and tera flying it can maybe be banned from NU


-
:cinccino: Tidy up + loaded dice that's it
 
Been getting into NU lately and with the new drops I feel the tier is a lot more interesting, at least to me. Choice band Terrakion has been cooking something everytime I get it in, but I'm not entirely sure if it's broken or not...yet. Aqua Tauros, Pallosand and t-wave + spikes from Klefki have been keeping opposing Terrakions in check very well but it should definitely be on the radar.

Flygon has been a really solid scarfer(as usual) and can often clean up the endgame with outrage and provide momentum and pressure throughout a game. Really like this mon so far.

Gonna ladder more with the new mons throughout the week but I would like to thank our lord and saviour Rabia for showing off NU on YouTube. It has been fun to learn about this tier and I probably wouldn't be playing if not for your channel!
 
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