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One-Winged Angel
- Thread starter Oblivion IX
- Start date
-l Complete threatlist coming soon. l-
Hi Oblivion IX, solid team. I'd suggest running Toxic on your Heatran for stalling purposes to benefit your sweepers. You could also fit Life Orb on your Virizion for more power. In my opinion replace ThunderBolt on Starmie for Recover it will extend its survivability. Gyarados doesn't seems intimidating since you're running Scrotom. Replace Hidden Power Grass on Rotom-W for HP Ice, it will help him taking down Dragons with an ease. Lastly I'd suggest running a SD Scizor:
Scizor will help you take down most special walls to support Virizion and paired with Dragonite and Heatran it's amazing.
Summary:
1) Change Protect to Toxic on Heatran.
2) Put Life Orb on Virizion instead of Lefties.
3) Recover over Thunderbolt on Starmie.
4) Put HP Ice instead of Grass on Rotom-W.
5) SD Scizor instead of CB.
Good Luck.
Scizor (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Technician
EVs: 252 HP / 96 Atk / 160 SDef
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Swords Dance
- Bug Bite
- Bullet Punch
- Roost
Trait: Technician
EVs: 252 HP / 96 Atk / 160 SDef
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Swords Dance
- Bug Bite
- Bullet Punch
- Roost
Summary:
1) Change Protect to Toxic on Heatran.
2) Put Life Orb on Virizion instead of Lefties.
3) Recover over Thunderbolt on Starmie.
4) Put HP Ice instead of Grass on Rotom-W.
5) SD Scizor instead of CB.
Good Luck.
Hey nice team. Just to what that guy said first off... ^^^
1)Keep protect on heatran, toxic and lava plume together would be basically pointless.
2)lefties is a better choice on virizon, since you say it counters rain teams and sand teams it would get whittled away by sand far too quickly, and reduce its switching in capabilities.
3)Recover blows on starmie it is too frail.
4)I think with ice beam on starmie and hidden power ice on virizon with stealth rock support you should be ok facing dragonite, so HP ice on rotom-W is probably not needed HP grass is a great idea if you're good at predicting switches into gastrodon, quagsire, swampert and the likes.
5)I agree with him on this one, SD scizor seems to be more effective in the current metagame... not sure why, CB scizor is just too predictable i guess.
Finally... I'm not sure what heatran is doing for your team. With all the politoeds running around that set especially is a bit... dead weight for your team, when starmie and rotom-W and even dragonite are all reasonable at taking hits from fire type moves. If you wanted to fit reuniclus in you could put it in there. I know your heatran is for countering sun teams so i don't have a similar suggestion to replace it other than latios, given the offensive nature of this team.
Oh and i don't see the problem with 2 choiced pokes >.<
Hope i helped, good luck!
1)Keep protect on heatran, toxic and lava plume together would be basically pointless.
2)lefties is a better choice on virizon, since you say it counters rain teams and sand teams it would get whittled away by sand far too quickly, and reduce its switching in capabilities.
3)Recover blows on starmie it is too frail.
4)I think with ice beam on starmie and hidden power ice on virizon with stealth rock support you should be ok facing dragonite, so HP ice on rotom-W is probably not needed HP grass is a great idea if you're good at predicting switches into gastrodon, quagsire, swampert and the likes.
5)I agree with him on this one, SD scizor seems to be more effective in the current metagame... not sure why, CB scizor is just too predictable i guess.
Finally... I'm not sure what heatran is doing for your team. With all the politoeds running around that set especially is a bit... dead weight for your team, when starmie and rotom-W and even dragonite are all reasonable at taking hits from fire type moves. If you wanted to fit reuniclus in you could put it in there. I know your heatran is for countering sun teams so i don't have a similar suggestion to replace it other than latios, given the offensive nature of this team.
Oh and i don't see the problem with 2 choiced pokes >.<
Hope i helped, good luck!
@ Reiko: I actually did use a non-Choiced variant of Rotom-W in some of the earlier stages of testing and found it to be inferior to the current set for this team. Might test it out again though; thanks for the rate.
@ Mostwanted: Protect is too useful of a move to replace since it lets me scout Pokémon that are using Choice items. Toxic is definitely a good idea though so I'll try it out in place of Roar since it can also wear down Volcarona. As for the rest of the changes. I already tried Life Orb on Virizion and found in this case that the extra power was not be worth the damage I was taking. Thunderbolt is needed on Starmie to KO Jellicent making it much easier to pull off a Rapid Spin. Might test out Hidden Power [Ice] on Rotom-W for the extra insurance against D-Nite but that also means that half my team will be completely walled by Gastrodon. I guess we'll see how it goes. SD Scizor has always been a favorite of mine and it'll help patch up my Reuniclus weakness too so I'll certainly give that a try as well. Only problem is that without CB Bullet Punch things like +1 Salamence will be more difficult to eliminate. Thanks for the rate.
@ Coughing: Neither of my Water-types are going to be taking Sun boosted, STAB attacks well and because of the fact that Sun also weakens their STAB moves they won't be hitting very hard either. This is why Heatran is needed on the team. It can be difficult facing Rain teams when one of your members is near useless and it always will be but that's not enough of a problem to remove it altogether and weaken my team's overall performance.
@ Mostwanted: Protect is too useful of a move to replace since it lets me scout Pokémon that are using Choice items. Toxic is definitely a good idea though so I'll try it out in place of Roar since it can also wear down Volcarona. As for the rest of the changes. I already tried Life Orb on Virizion and found in this case that the extra power was not be worth the damage I was taking. Thunderbolt is needed on Starmie to KO Jellicent making it much easier to pull off a Rapid Spin. Might test out Hidden Power [Ice] on Rotom-W for the extra insurance against D-Nite but that also means that half my team will be completely walled by Gastrodon. I guess we'll see how it goes. SD Scizor has always been a favorite of mine and it'll help patch up my Reuniclus weakness too so I'll certainly give that a try as well. Only problem is that without CB Bullet Punch things like +1 Salamence will be more difficult to eliminate. Thanks for the rate.
@ Coughing: Neither of my Water-types are going to be taking Sun boosted, STAB attacks well and because of the fact that Sun also weakens their STAB moves they won't be hitting very hard either. This is why Heatran is needed on the team. It can be difficult facing Rain teams when one of your members is near useless and it always will be but that's not enough of a problem to remove it altogether and weaken my team's overall performance.
@ BankaiBro: The song is very alluring. ;-;
Interesting team here, congrats on that!
Now let's see... you say you've got quite some problems against Terrakion, Conkeldurr and Reuniclus, huh?
Althrough it isn't the best solution against terrakion... have you considered calm mind reuniclus over virizion? With Life Orb, Psyshock and some Calm Minds he can 2hko an enemy reuniclus and of course, brutally kill other fight type, imo you should test it out
Now let's see... you say you've got quite some problems against Terrakion, Conkeldurr and Reuniclus, huh?
Althrough it isn't the best solution against terrakion... have you considered calm mind reuniclus over virizion? With Life Orb, Psyshock and some Calm Minds he can 2hko an enemy reuniclus and of course, brutally kill other fight type, imo you should test it out
Otherwise, great team and gl
Heatran, air baloon, you wouldn't want your stealth rocker being destroyed in one turn and then obliviated (pun not inteneded) by the likes of Cloyster, Haxorus, Flygon and other Sturdy/Sashers. No point having protect on Heatran if you use air baloon, go ahead and give it Toxic to stop Gallades and Conks. Or you can just give it Will-o-wisp if you want more reliable burn.
Starmie despite having a diverse moveset, good speed and sp.att and also rapid spin is slightly outclassed (in my opinion) by dream world Espeon cause any entry hazards not only could be got rid of but bounced back to your oppoments team. In other words, you see a azelf? Switch to Espeon. See a Breloom? Switch to Espeon. See a Whirlmory? Espeon... etc.etc. You can give it yawn+protect just to be annoying and also give your Dragonite moar Ddance. Also Espeons powerful physic STAB attacks with 130 base sp.att will kill the Terrakions and Conks (whom you outrun) that you would otherwise be worried about. If you want to keep the Starmie you might want to give it Physic to deal with Terrakion at the very least.
Dragonite is powerful and has Ddance, one slight change: Roost to Extremespeed, no point restoring your HP if you're just going to swept by Cloyster with sash. Also considering that Dragonite is a late game comeback sweeper you can give it earthquake instead of fire punch as soon as you defeat the dreaded Skarmory. Give it life orb because you're going to be surviving hits anyway if you predicted the entry hazards well with Espeon or got rid of them with Starmie. Killing all of his team > Stalling for 90 turns without doing anything useless before finally falling prey to a crit, losing your scale and dying a horrible death from ice. You wanna use Dragonite after eliminating any Skarmorys and Foretresses and finding out most of their team so you can use it as a effective comeback sweeper.
Virizion isn't the greatest pokemon of all time, this would be the one to replace.
5 weaknesses to the common fire, physic and ice isn't brilliant and the x4 flying means that Thunderus and friends will destroy you. Sure you resist some powerful type, ground, rock and water to be precise but ground and rock moves are generally PHYSICAL so they'll be going up against your 72 defence. As far as lefties go, they're not going to be much help against the likes of Conk and friends so a life orb or a expert belt will both do the job here. If you going to replace it then I would reccomend Sceptile, I know its UU but its faster than Virizion, bulkier, and has more special attack and also acess to leech seed which is good wallbreaker. Then you have the terrible fact that Virizion is a special attacker and has to resort with focus blast which just misses and against fast sweepers you can't give them any chance to set up.
Rotom-W despite being a powerful defensive and offensive core does not need timid, Its 89 base speed stat is not the greatest user of timid of all time, a modest one or a defence raiser may be more helpful unless you want to outrun Luke but that has one more base speed which is just a middle finger to the face anyway. Other than that its good. I have to admit I have a soft spot for Rotom-W cause its a brilliant wall and can learn one of my favourite moves: volt switch, if worst comes to worst give it a choice specs and either trick it or use volt switch and pass to scizor which uses u turn etc. etc.
Scizor is fine.
Heatran ----- Azelf/Skarmory/Fortress
Starmie-------Foretress/Tentacruel/Espeon
Dragonite-----Haxorus/Luke
Virizion-------Sceptile/Gengar/Jolteon
Rotom-W-----Registeel/Dusknoir/Porygon2
Scizor--------Another dragonite o.o
Starmie despite having a diverse moveset, good speed and sp.att and also rapid spin is slightly outclassed (in my opinion) by dream world Espeon cause any entry hazards not only could be got rid of but bounced back to your oppoments team. In other words, you see a azelf? Switch to Espeon. See a Breloom? Switch to Espeon. See a Whirlmory? Espeon... etc.etc. You can give it yawn+protect just to be annoying and also give your Dragonite moar Ddance. Also Espeons powerful physic STAB attacks with 130 base sp.att will kill the Terrakions and Conks (whom you outrun) that you would otherwise be worried about. If you want to keep the Starmie you might want to give it Physic to deal with Terrakion at the very least.
Dragonite is powerful and has Ddance, one slight change: Roost to Extremespeed, no point restoring your HP if you're just going to swept by Cloyster with sash. Also considering that Dragonite is a late game comeback sweeper you can give it earthquake instead of fire punch as soon as you defeat the dreaded Skarmory. Give it life orb because you're going to be surviving hits anyway if you predicted the entry hazards well with Espeon or got rid of them with Starmie. Killing all of his team > Stalling for 90 turns without doing anything useless before finally falling prey to a crit, losing your scale and dying a horrible death from ice. You wanna use Dragonite after eliminating any Skarmorys and Foretresses and finding out most of their team so you can use it as a effective comeback sweeper.
Virizion isn't the greatest pokemon of all time, this would be the one to replace.
5 weaknesses to the common fire, physic and ice isn't brilliant and the x4 flying means that Thunderus and friends will destroy you. Sure you resist some powerful type, ground, rock and water to be precise but ground and rock moves are generally PHYSICAL so they'll be going up against your 72 defence. As far as lefties go, they're not going to be much help against the likes of Conk and friends so a life orb or a expert belt will both do the job here. If you going to replace it then I would reccomend Sceptile, I know its UU but its faster than Virizion, bulkier, and has more special attack and also acess to leech seed which is good wallbreaker. Then you have the terrible fact that Virizion is a special attacker and has to resort with focus blast which just misses and against fast sweepers you can't give them any chance to set up.
Rotom-W despite being a powerful defensive and offensive core does not need timid, Its 89 base speed stat is not the greatest user of timid of all time, a modest one or a defence raiser may be more helpful unless you want to outrun Luke but that has one more base speed which is just a middle finger to the face anyway. Other than that its good. I have to admit I have a soft spot for Rotom-W cause its a brilliant wall and can learn one of my favourite moves: volt switch, if worst comes to worst give it a choice specs and either trick it or use volt switch and pass to scizor which uses u turn etc. etc.
Scizor is fine.
Heatran ----- Azelf/Skarmory/Fortress
Starmie-------Foretress/Tentacruel/Espeon
Dragonite-----Haxorus/Luke
Virizion-------Sceptile/Gengar/Jolteon
Rotom-W-----Registeel/Dusknoir/Porygon2
Scizor--------Another dragonite o.o
Hi Oblivion IX,
Nice Team you got there but there is some important weaknesses. First weakness, and that's the biggest problem, Latios/Latias just destroy this Team. Look at how the CM Set or the LO Set (it means Dpulse, Hp Fire, Surf, CM/Recover) decimate your Team. So it's why you need Tyranitar in your Team. In addition, it gives you a Weather Inducer, and that was the second problem of your Team. Use it instead of Heatran because both have the same job in your Team but Tyranitar helps you against Latios/Latias.
Tyranitar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 192 SDef / 64 SAtk
Sassy Nature (+SDef, -Spd)
- Ice Beam
- Fire Blast / Superpower
- Crunch
- Stealth Rock
With Dragonite, Starmie and Rotom-W, I don't know why you need Virizion in your Team. Another big threat for your Team is Terrakion and now without Heatran, Scizor. That's why I'll use a Gliscor instead of Virizion. In addition, Gliscor helps your Dragonite with Toxic because it attracts Slowbro, Rotom-W, Quagsire, etc.
Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Protect
- Toxic
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
Last thing now, I don't like your Rotom's Set. You need Rotom-W against Rain Teams, Landorus, Scizor, Gliscor, etc and it's why you need a Bulkier Spread with Pain Split. Use the Standard Set for your Rotom-W. That's the same problem on Starmie. You need it against Rain Team and for Spinning Stealth Rock / Spikes, so it's why you need once again a Bulkier Spread and Recover on it.
Starmie @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Hydropump
- Thunderbolt
- Recover
- Rapid Spin
Rotom-W @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 108 HP / 252 SAtk / 148 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Volt Switch
- Will-O-Wisp
- Hydro Pump
- Pain Split
If you scared about an opponent Virizion, you can use a Bulky Scizor or use a Mew instead of Gliscor with a Bold Nature and Will O Wisp / Psychock or Ice Beam / Taunt / Sofboiled.
GL with this Team !
Nice Team you got there but there is some important weaknesses. First weakness, and that's the biggest problem, Latios/Latias just destroy this Team. Look at how the CM Set or the LO Set (it means Dpulse, Hp Fire, Surf, CM/Recover) decimate your Team. So it's why you need Tyranitar in your Team. In addition, it gives you a Weather Inducer, and that was the second problem of your Team. Use it instead of Heatran because both have the same job in your Team but Tyranitar helps you against Latios/Latias.
Tyranitar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 192 SDef / 64 SAtk
Sassy Nature (+SDef, -Spd)
- Ice Beam
- Fire Blast / Superpower
- Crunch
- Stealth Rock
With Dragonite, Starmie and Rotom-W, I don't know why you need Virizion in your Team. Another big threat for your Team is Terrakion and now without Heatran, Scizor. That's why I'll use a Gliscor instead of Virizion. In addition, Gliscor helps your Dragonite with Toxic because it attracts Slowbro, Rotom-W, Quagsire, etc.
Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Protect
- Toxic
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
Last thing now, I don't like your Rotom's Set. You need Rotom-W against Rain Teams, Landorus, Scizor, Gliscor, etc and it's why you need a Bulkier Spread with Pain Split. Use the Standard Set for your Rotom-W. That's the same problem on Starmie. You need it against Rain Team and for Spinning Stealth Rock / Spikes, so it's why you need once again a Bulkier Spread and Recover on it.
Starmie @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Hydropump
- Thunderbolt
- Recover
- Rapid Spin
Rotom-W @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 108 HP / 252 SAtk / 148 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Volt Switch
- Will-O-Wisp
- Hydro Pump
- Pain Split
If you scared about an opponent Virizion, you can use a Bulky Scizor or use a Mew instead of Gliscor with a Bold Nature and Will O Wisp / Psychock or Ice Beam / Taunt / Sofboiled.
GL with this Team !
@The Silent Storm: I'll give it a try.
@Spudzes: Your suggestions for both Heatran and Dragonite aren't fitted for their current sets and would be better suited for their offensive counterparts. Espeon is a good Pokemon but I find that have a spinner is more reliable of a way to keep my side of the field clear of entry hazards. Sceptile is an interesting idea. I'll look into that and see how it goes. Also, some of your information is incorrect and changing my team to the Pokemon you have highlighted would make it unfit to compete in the OU metagame.
@Ojama: Thanks for the rate! All of the suggestions look good and I'll try them out later.
@Spudzes: Your suggestions for both Heatran and Dragonite aren't fitted for their current sets and would be better suited for their offensive counterparts. Espeon is a good Pokemon but I find that have a spinner is more reliable of a way to keep my side of the field clear of entry hazards. Sceptile is an interesting idea. I'll look into that and see how it goes. Also, some of your information is incorrect and changing my team to the Pokemon you have highlighted would make it unfit to compete in the OU metagame.
@Ojama: Thanks for the rate! All of the suggestions look good and I'll try them out later.
Hey, cool team. It does not seem like you have too many Reuniclus issues. I think that in most situations, Scizor should be able to handle it pretty easily even if it does not happen to pack roost. If it really becomes a problem, I would just switch Scizor to a more specially defensive ev spread with 248 HP / 44 Atk / 216 SpDef which can help you a bit more against the trick room sets in particular as well as latios / latias. This will allow you to play with Scizor with at least a bit more ease against Reuniclus if you truly do find trick room variants a problem.
The big issue against this team is fighting types. Although you have Scizor to soft check Terrakion, you will still definitely have some issues against it. Conkeldurr is in the same boat here, expect it isn't weak to priority and if it catches a bulk up, you may not have a good chance at stopping it. It seems that most of the members on this team are almost irreplaceable, although if you were to try and go for a generic change, I would say that Gliscor over Virizion is a pretty good idea. This way, you have the ability to provide yourself with a decent check to stuff like choice banded Terrakion, some Infernape, etc. Gliscor should probably be running a spread of 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 Spe with a jolly nature as well. Although this does not give you quite the defensive potential that the standard set achieves, it helps you check adamant ice punch Lucario. After a boost, adamant luke does huge damage to this team, being able to ko most members of this team with boosted moves after stealth rock. With a speedier ev spread on Gliscor, you will have a solid check to Lucario while being able to check other fighters like Terra in combination with Scizor. gl.
The big issue against this team is fighting types. Although you have Scizor to soft check Terrakion, you will still definitely have some issues against it. Conkeldurr is in the same boat here, expect it isn't weak to priority and if it catches a bulk up, you may not have a good chance at stopping it. It seems that most of the members on this team are almost irreplaceable, although if you were to try and go for a generic change, I would say that Gliscor over Virizion is a pretty good idea. This way, you have the ability to provide yourself with a decent check to stuff like choice banded Terrakion, some Infernape, etc. Gliscor should probably be running a spread of 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 Spe with a jolly nature as well. Although this does not give you quite the defensive potential that the standard set achieves, it helps you check adamant ice punch Lucario. After a boost, adamant luke does huge damage to this team, being able to ko most members of this team with boosted moves after stealth rock. With a speedier ev spread on Gliscor, you will have a solid check to Lucario while being able to check other fighters like Terra in combination with Scizor. gl.
@ AB2: I've been looking for a bulkier spread to use on Scizor and will give it a spin. I also like the idea to replace Virizion with Gliscor since I won't have to change too much in order to patch up some of my weaknesses. Thanks for the rate!
Ok, even if with 248 HP (8 Spd EVs have a purpose?) you are really weak to Conkeldurr and Scrafty. Protect, even if you get free Leftovers and he (maybe) get free burn damage, i guess it should be changed (i don't know, Toxic perhaps). Spread seems random, maybe you should try Defence enough to resist at Earthquake of someone
Heatran @ Leftovers
Nature: Calm (+SDef, -Atk)
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SDef / 8 Spd
-l Lava Plume l-
-l Stealth Rock l-
-l Protect l-
-l Roar l-
Something can be better. A spread 24 Def / 232 SAtk / 252 Spd is good too (Max Atk Conkeldurr with +1 Drain Punch won't kill him), or a mixed set, nature + SpAtk - SpDef (you'll get again the SpDef with a Calm Mind) with Close Combat to laugh at Blissey
Virizion @ Leftovers
Nature: Timid (+Spd, -Atk)
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
-l Giga Drain l-
-l Focus Blast l-
-l Hidden Power [Ice] l-
-l Calm Mind l-
It works, even if i prefer Choice Specs (Choice Scarf is great for sweepers such as Metagross
Rotom-W @ Choice Scarf
Nature: Timid (+Spd, -Atk)
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
-l Volt Switch l-
-l Hydro Pump l-
-l Hidden Power [Grass] l-
-l Trick l-
@ Bruno Magno: I don't understand why you think Heatran's EV spread is random. Considering the fact that it's a Specially Defensive Heatran investing heavily in SDef and HP should be expected. There's also no point in shifting any EVs to Defense since that would negate the point of the set and wouldn't help at all against those EQs.
EDIT: I've been experimenting with a different version of the team lately and it doesn't have that crippling Fighting-type weakness. The changes will be implimented later in the OP if things continue to be successful. Again, thanks for the rates!
EDIT: I've been experimenting with a different version of the team lately and it doesn't have that crippling Fighting-type weakness. The changes will be implimented later in the OP if things continue to be successful. Again, thanks for the rates!