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Opinions about Hyper Beam moves?
- Thread starter TheBear
- Start date
Any competitive battler will tell you that Hyper Beam and friends are horrible attacks to use. Sure, they do big damage but the next turn you are unable to move. You can't even switch while your opponent switches or tries to set up.
Using a "Hyper Beam" is worse than using two 75 BP attacks. The touch more damage from the "Beam" is not worth skipping an entire turn.
To put in other ways...
2 Energy Ball > Frenzy Plant
2 Lava Plume > Blast Burn
2 Waterfall > Hydro Cannon
2 Dragon Claw > Roar of Time
Need I go on?
To put in other ways...
2 Energy Ball > Frenzy Plant
2 Lava Plume > Blast Burn
2 Waterfall > Hydro Cannon
2 Dragon Claw > Roar of Time
Need I go on?
With the number of pokes w/ the ability to set up some pretty sick stuff (even a substitute can be sick), giving the opponent a free turn might be even considered a bigger draw back than killing yourself. :/
That's why I think the attacks should be ammended next gen to have a base power of 6000 . . . but even that probably wouldn't make them see use. :/
That's why I think the attacks should be ammended next gen to have a base power of 6000 . . . but even that probably wouldn't make them see use. :/
Well, when Hyper Beam is used on Porygon-Z with Adaptability, it becomes a 300 BP attack. With a Nasty Plot, I'm pretty sure it's a OHKO on Blissey. That seems worth it if a special sweeper can actually do that to the biggest special wall in the game.
In pretty much every other scenario, all of the "Hyper Beam" attacks are worthless.
In pretty much every other scenario, all of the "Hyper Beam" attacks are worthless.
The only somewhat useful two turn move is hyper beam itself, after a NP off of a porygon Z it can OHKO any non immune/x4 resist pokemon in the game, including blissey. With that said, it's still a major gimmick. Blast Burn, Hydro Cannon, and Frenzy Plant are all learned by only 4 pokemon who've all got better stuff to do or are useless anyways. Roar of Time is only used by one pokemon in ubers who isn't even that good of a special attacker anyways. Giga Impact is useful for slaking (provided it works like hyperbeam did on him in R/S/E, I have not used a slaking since) but that's about it.
I think Giga Impact Slaking sucks too...like everyone's said, Hyper Beam-esque moves ain't all that great.
Kinda off topic, but if the Hyper Beam glitch from R/B/Y still existed, where you didn't have to recharge if you killed the opponent with it, would Porygon-Z be majorly broken, or would Focus Sash and Ghost types keep it from being uber? Just curious...
Kinda off topic, but if the Hyper Beam glitch from R/B/Y still existed, where you didn't have to recharge if you killed the opponent with it, would Porygon-Z be majorly broken, or would Focus Sash and Ghost types keep it from being uber? Just curious...
Simply put, they're awful. If you KO an opponent with them, the opponent has a choice of pokemon to switch in, AND a free turn to do whatever they want (most likely setup).
If you don't KO the opponent with them, then they have one free turn to switch in whatever they want or just kill the pokemon you've got out.
Best case scenario - you hit an opponent with it, it doesn't kill them, they kill you. Even then, though, 150 base power is inferior to Explosion's 250 base (and it doesn't have explosion's half-defense effect, either).
So, basically, they suck. I wouldn't even use Hyper Beam on Nasty Plot Porygon-Z, as that gives the opponent a free switch-in AND turn of setup if you do KO Blissey with it.
If you don't KO the opponent with them, then they have one free turn to switch in whatever they want or just kill the pokemon you've got out.
Best case scenario - you hit an opponent with it, it doesn't kill them, they kill you. Even then, though, 150 base power is inferior to Explosion's 250 base (and it doesn't have explosion's half-defense effect, either).
So, basically, they suck. I wouldn't even use Hyper Beam on Nasty Plot Porygon-Z, as that gives the opponent a free switch-in AND turn of setup if you do KO Blissey with it.
Rock Wrecker on Rhyperior is probably the only other choice I see viable besides what's already been mentioned, as it can be handy to use when you're running low on HP and don't think you'll be able to last much longer-and it at least has a little more accuracy than Stone Edge, and is 1.5x as powerful. Besides, it's his signature move for god's sakes.
But even then, I wouldn't really recommend it unless you're that desperate, and other than that, meh.
But even then, I wouldn't really recommend it unless you're that desperate, and other than that, meh.
Not even Giga Impact oN Slaking is worth it IMO.
I think they're slightly underrated, but nonetheless they're only useful in a handful of situations. They're not bad if both you and your opponent are on your last Pokemon, since they can finish your opponent off in one turn rather than two, which may make all the difference. The elemental Hyper Beams (ex. Hydro Cannon) are also capable of being super-effective, unlike Hyper Beam itself, which is another plus.
I do not agree.
Slaking can normally switch out on the turn he "loafs around" , but hyper beam/giga impact do NOT let you switch out. In other words, it can ruin a good team by allowing the opponent to switch in the appropriate counter AND set up on the switch.
They're terrible IMO, but they might surprise an opponent... kinda like Sp. Atker Gyarados.
Aka, you'll surprise them... but you'll still do less damage than if you just stuck with the standard attacks.
Aka, you'll surprise them... but you'll still do less damage than if you just stuck with the standard attacks.
Actually, the Choice Band Zapdos in the Analysis has Giga Impact (to take on Blissey of course).
IMO, they're decent. I kind of wish they worked like in R/B/Y days, but wishing does nothing. I can see of SOME use for it, but not much to warrant use.
There is only a total of 4 of them. 2 of them are exclusive: Dialga with Roar of Time (useless, but cool-looking move) and Rhyperior with Rock Wrecker (might be an ok thing under a Sub... not pushing it though).
I guess it seriously depends on the OHKO / 2HKO range. Just like discussed with Porygon-Z, it DOES have reasons to use Hyper Beam. Slaking, on the other hand, could make some use of Giga Impact, but you have Double-Edge anyways, which in the end does still some superior damage and allows you to switch out.
It basically comes down to what's better: a move that "technically" does roughly 75 damage per turn (more for STAB, however), or just to stick with something that does maybe 100 damage / 120 damage / etc. in a single turn? Is the "Hyper Beam move" going to KO something, while my other move is only 2HKO'ing? Will I be set up on the next turn? Will a counter occur the next turn?
IMO, they're decent. I kind of wish they worked like in R/B/Y days, but wishing does nothing. I can see of SOME use for it, but not much to warrant use.
There is only a total of 4 of them. 2 of them are exclusive: Dialga with Roar of Time (useless, but cool-looking move) and Rhyperior with Rock Wrecker (might be an ok thing under a Sub... not pushing it though).
I guess it seriously depends on the OHKO / 2HKO range. Just like discussed with Porygon-Z, it DOES have reasons to use Hyper Beam. Slaking, on the other hand, could make some use of Giga Impact, but you have Double-Edge anyways, which in the end does still some superior damage and allows you to switch out.
It basically comes down to what's better: a move that "technically" does roughly 75 damage per turn (more for STAB, however), or just to stick with something that does maybe 100 damage / 120 damage / etc. in a single turn? Is the "Hyper Beam move" going to KO something, while my other move is only 2HKO'ing? Will I be set up on the next turn? Will a counter occur the next turn?
That set is more of a gimmick than anything, IMO >_>
But...like I said, best case scenario they're like a much weaker form of explosion. And that assumes that you leave the target alive, which kinda reduces their value right there.
Dude the idea is alright but I definetely think roar ot time would do more damage than a dragon claw on a dialga. Physical special split. But the idea is totally correct. I mean hyper attacks are last ditch attacks and when you think about it you see it is just a waste of space as no you wont get that last ditch. Walls easily wall you if they are full hp. Even slaking doesn't use giga impact beacuse of the switching fear. The opponent can setup easily on that recharge turn.
The only beef I have with Hyper Beam is that it's not even 100% accurate. For losing a turn is bad enough, but not guaranteeing a hit is even worse!
I agree with Mekkah. You can use it like a sort of Explosion in the turn before you gonna die.