Project ORAS Research Week #1

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is a Tutor Alumnusis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Top Community Contributor Alumnusis a Metagame Resource Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
inspired from King UU's amazing OP
molk approved n.n
Hi RU!
Today i am introducing the new Research Week!
sFihLiV.png




Keep the following things in mind during every Research Week:
  • This project's goal is to create Discussion so don't think you can get away only by doing well on the ladder.
  • Be open-minded, don't just say something is terrible and walk away; look at its stats and typing and think something up!
  • Try to back up your posts with hard evidence like replays, actual sets, perhaps even teams. A bit of theorymonning is fine but please don't just make assumptions :/
  • This project is a great way to discuss some of your inventions and innovations!
  • You aren't forced to use the Sets that will be posted alongside the Pokemon. They are just sample sets, do what you want!
A few things to clarify:
  • Sign-ups can be as late as you want, but the week will always start on Sunday and end on Saturday.
  • This project doesn't have any real prize but good posts really helps to get noticed for Roomvoice in RU room and, as always, participation in projects like Research Week help towards earning the Community Contributor badge!
  • If you do not post one somewhat-coherent post that describes the Pokemon that you're using, their roles, and their niche in the metagame, you will be disqualified from winning this week. Please post about your experiences no matter if you think you've got a chance to win or not.
  • Post and save your replays. Replays are the most informative and sometimes entertaining sources of information about RW Pokemon - you can write a full two paragraphs about the role of a Pokemon, but often that can all be summed up with a video and an explanation of it.
  • Some questions to answer in your posts are how useful are these Pokemon in the ORAS metagame? What gives them trouble? What advantages do they have over other Pokemon? How well do they work in the metagame? If you have anything to say about any of these Pokemon, please post about them! Remember, discussion is not limited to this topic.
In order to participate you must do the following:
  • Post here with a fresh alt and the name(s) of the Pokemon you will be using.
  • Use at least one of the Pokemon being researched.
  • Post your experiences with the Pokemon you're using, participate in the discussion!
  • Post logs of this Pokemon in action against other teams - don't just tell us, show us
  • The winner of the challenge will be the person who has the highest ladder ranking on the Pokemon Showdown ladder on the alt they registered at the end of the week.


This Week's Selection

Mega-Pidgeot
pidgeot-mega.gif

Pidgeot @ Pidgeotite
Ability: Keen Eye
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Heat Wave
- U-turn / Hidden Power Grass
- Roost

Pangoro
pangoro.gif

Pangoro @ Choice Band
Ability: Scrappy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- Ice Punch / Parting Shot
- Gunk Shot / Parting Shot

or...

Pangoro @ Lum Berry / Life Orb
Ability: Iron Fist
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly / Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- Iron Head / Gunk Shot

If it touches you you die


Malamar
malamar.gif

Malamar @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 248 HP / 160 SpD / 100 Spe
Careful Nature
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Good luck!
 
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boltsandbombers said:
Just curious, what are the Speed EVs on Malamar for? Also, do we have to use the exact sets given?
Click to expand...
They outrun minimum speed Gligar and Cresselia so that you can superpower/rest before Gligar can U-turn and before cress uses Moonblast or w/e
also your question is addressed in the OP
op said:
  • You aren't forced to use the Sets that will be posted alongside the Pokemon. They are just sample sets, do what you want!
Click to expand...
good luck! (and read more carefully)
 
galbia said:
They outrun minimum speed Gligar and Cresselia so that you can superpower/rest before Gligar can U-turn and before cress uses Moonblast or w/e
also your question is addressed in the OP

good luck! (and read more carefully)
Click to expand...
Thanks.
Sorry, guess I missed that.
 
Alright I guess I'll go for it. My alt is Powerful Panda and I'll obviously be using Pangoro. Also just to clarify, the op says the week will start on Sunday and end on Saturday so since it's starting on Wednesday will the time period be extended? This is a really cool idea as well(even if you stole it :p)
 
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Have some experience with the SD panda and CB set and I have to say they are quite good, if you decide to use Pangoro, I really recommend using Doublade as a partner as it can deal with Fighting-type attacks aimed at Pangoro (hard walls Cobalion and Virizion) and it is capable of taking on Pokemon that use Fairy-type coverage such as Cresselia, Granbull, and Aromatisse. In return Pangoro really weakens opposing physically defensive walls with STAB Knock Off removing their items and wearing them down for a Doublade sweep. I prefer Jolly on both sets as well if I'm being honest as out speeding Exploud is super important imo, and if you do go with the Choice Band I really recommend you stick with Scrappy Superpower because it is an absolute nuke that requires basically no prediction.

May join later w/ Mega Berd or Malamar but idk yet, gl all n_n.
 
I have some experience with Pidgeot so I'm gonna post about it for a bit. I'll start off with its speed, it's got solid 121 base speed, just 1 point over base Sceptile and Dugtrio, and this actually helps it a lot. It means that Sceptile can't Mega Evolve against it (or it dies to Hurricane), and Dugtrio can't revenge with Stone Edge. Likewise though, Pidgeot can find it just a tad bit difficult mega evolving against some faster threats, but base 101 speed is still pretty solid to start with.

It's Hurricane is decently strong, and Heat Wave coverage is pretty good. It has Roost which increases it's durability significantly, allowing it to outlive some Pokemon like non-fully specially defensive Alomomola and being able to Roost against some defensive variants of Rhyperior which can't do much with Rock Blast assuming you roosted that turn. And speaking of Rhyperior, it's often a common switch in to Pidgeot, but that can be taken care of by carrying HP Grass which -in my opinion- is extremely helpful as it is a clean 2HKO on all Rhyperiors. This does force Pidgeot to give up U-turn though, which would otherwise give the user some offensive momentum. I still prefer HP Grass though.

252 SpA Mega Pidgeot Hidden Power Grass vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Solid Rock Rhyperior: 210-249 (48.3 - 57.3%) -- 92.6% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Even though it carries Heat Wave, it still struggles against Steel-types, namely just Bronzong and Registeel who are often specially defensive. The former can hurt a lot with Gyro Ball while the latter can render Pidgeot useless with Thunder Wave, as Bronzong is only 3HKO'd by Heat Wave and Registeel is 4HKO'd most of the time:

252 SpA Mega Pidgeot Heat Wave vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Bronzong: 138-164 (40.8 - 48.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Pidgeot Heat Wave vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Registeel: 116-138 (31.8 - 37.9%) -- 0.6% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

This doesn't mean Pidgeot is bad though. Pidgeot is excellent, and it shines against most playstyles when those 2 Pokemon have been weak, and it shines especially against offense where its speed can be threatening. All in all Pidgeot is an excellent sweeper, pivot with U-turn, and overall good special attacker. Hurricane is a very strong and spammable move, and the 30% confusing chance can allow it to muscle its way through walls sometimes.

I might try out Pangoro for the research week.
 
I'll try this out as well! Going with the alt Su Beifong once the week starts (kudos to people who recognize the character) and using Pangoro.

From my current experience from facing the panda, it's definitely a terrifyingly strong Pokemon. I've used Gurdurr and M-Audino to deal with it, as they both can tank Pangoro's attacks pretty well (the former being more reliable cause Gunk Shot), and they can easily OHKO back. I don't have too much experience using it, so I'll be testing it out and will edit this post with a few more thoughts if I find something interesting.
 
will post with results, panda is a fucking monster though.

Name: TomBusFan sigh looks like im not the only fan out there. partynextdoor sls
Pokemon: Pangoro
 
Alt: Contrary-Pouch
Pokemon I'm researching: Malamar
Replays: Info I've gathered: Well the ladder is Pokebola so I made like 8 alts to switch between. Anyways, the pokemon.

Malamar is severely underrated. Getting Knock Off this gen was a blessing, as now it had a move just as spammable as Superpower. I used the sample set bc frankly, it is the best set to use for it. Once you get a free SPower or two, Malamar can snowball through teams. It can take out at least three pokemon once set up. A testament to this is the fact I have 0 replays bc every game Malamar got like 2 superpowers up they would FORFEIT ;-; RestTalk also makes it a potent status absorber, and once all the bug type moves are gone (fought an insect plate Signal Beam Jolteon once -_-) It doesn't take much time for Malamar to leave a serious impact on the game.
 
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So I'm currently 14-0 with Panda because he's a monster, but in all seriousness the Lum SD set is amazing. Before this I'd only ever used the Choice Banded set which definitely hits hard, but the Lum SD set has some great perks that CB doesn't. For one, being able to safely switch into Slowking and Registeel without fearing a burn, toxic, or paralysis is fantastic. The opponent then has to make the choice to sack king/regi, sack a different mon, or go into a mon that can actually take a hit. This creates some mind games with the opponent in which you either ko a mon or switch out due to over predicting and trying to get up an Swords Dance. I'll leave a replay I just had against a friend of mine on the ladder in which I got consistently out predicted, but that's irrelevant because I won XD

ps- I'm better than justin

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-194347755
 
Name: north of montague
Pokemon: mega pidgeot

been underwhelmed from my experiences playing against it, so i figure it would be neat to try here. pangoro i already know is cool, so not really finna burn time reaffirming that. i'll post up some thoughts and what have you in due time
 
I've actually been maining a team that features both Pangoro and Mega Pidgeot p. much since the start of ORAS, so I'll just talk about both of them for a bit:

Mega Pidgeot: One of the absolute best Megas on the tier. Mega Pidgeot is just a spammable button essentially. No Guard Hurricane is simply amazing and there is almost never a time you will find yourself wanting to use another move the turn you send it out. Heat Wave is nice to crush the hopes and dreams of stuff like Escavalier, Cobalion, and Durant (tho I think Durant just dies to Hurricane) For Mega Pidgeot to be most effective mid-game, you need it to already be Mega Evolved. That is when most of the faster threats on the opponent's team are going to be trying to do damage to your's. If you can get an early Mega Evolution (like, say, on lead Rhyperior, Omastar, etc.) and simply U-turn out, you get that extra Speed that can be really beneficial later in the game. Now, shit like Cobalion, base Sceptile, and Cinccino can't outspeed and revenge kill you (or Mega Evolve in the case of Mega Sceptile) I definitely find it most useful on Spikes offense and VoltTurn offense. Do NOT waste your time with Defog though. It's weak to Rocks and has no Leftovers recovery, nor can it hold Eviolite like Golbat to make up for this. I like Hurricane / Heat Wave / U-turn / Roost, but you can use other moves over Roost, such as Toxic, Tailwind, and HP Grass if you need their utility.

Pangoro: It's a nuke. It will spam Knock Off 80% of the time and it will use Scrappy Superpower the rest of the time. Literally, the only time you need to predict with another move is if the opponent has a Fairy-type. Parting Shot is really cool on the Band set since it allows Pangoro to continue VoltTurn chains and possibly give shit like Meloetta and Mega Pidgeot an even safer switch-in. Lum SD is seriously underrated and I would recommend it for anyone that wants a nuke for Stall teams that doesn't necessarily need to set up vs. offense teams to hurt them. It might not have the same nuking powers of CB, but Lum SD does tear Stall a new one and is still able to perform against p. much any playstyle thanks to the raw power of its STAB moves. Regardless of the set, always run Gunk Shot / Poison Jab. The CB set should be accompanied by stuff that drills Gligar into the ground while the SD set can just 2HKO Gligar with +2 Knock Off anyway, rendering Ice Punch pointless on that set. llamas mentioned Jolly being useful for Exploud, but it's also nice for 2HKOing Golbat with Knock Off before it can retaliate with Brave Bird or heal up with Roost.
 
Name: Borussia Birdmund
Mon: Bird


Results: Alright, I chose this Bird mainly for one purpose: To see if it can do anything beyond being the set posted. I've actually used Bird since the beginning of ORAS on an AccelBalion Spikes-stack team (that being what I mainly used actually) accompanied by partner Dragalge. In that team it mainly performed as a late-game cleaner or a mid-game hurricane spammer (clearly), by utilizing the free switches it got from passive walls such as Gligar and Alomomola. Since I carried Toxic over Roost on that set (I dislike Roost on Bird actually), I had no issues with it being checked time and time again. And I actually fancy Toxic quite a lot on Bird too, as it nails switch-ins such as Rhyperior, Assault Vest Eelektross and the likes pretty well, wearing them down by residual damage and repeated hurricanes. I admit it's pretty clunky at times to Mega Evolve against opposing offensive teams, and that does hold it back quite a lot; it's fairly frail, and definitely needs to evolve against safe targets to avoid being completely crippled.

Now, this is the knowledge I had before starting this project. I wanted to test what other playstyles it could thrive on, and I ended up testing it on Sun Offense. I did about 30 games where I faced most playstyles. In this team it was not the designated "clean up the damaged trash", that was in fact Victreebel (which is severely underrated imho). It was more used to throw about Hurricanes mid-game or set up Sunny Days so that my Chloro-mons could rampage (or give my up-coming Rhyperior switch some durability against water types). Seeing that most of my threats are actually fairly slow outside of the Sun, this high speed that it brought to the table meant I didn't need to push for Sun to be up at all times, instead keeping my main Sun-setter fresh until the final hours. And at times where this doesn't go well and my main setter dies, I opted to give Bird Sunny Day over Roost/Toxic/HP Grass (Sun teams don't exactly struggle with Rhyperior or Gastrodon anyways) as it creates a lot of free switches for this or can suicide so that Victreebel can sweep. Since I carried Physically-based Mix Pursuit Houndoom on the team, I could pretty easily overcome Bronzongs that fly around, giving Bird full leverage to do his job. The team on a whole was pretty much put upon Bird and Victreebel's shoulders, though, and the overall performance was just average (I'm not that good at Offense either, as I hate the thought of not being able to switch into things.) If you want to test out the team, then here you go: http://hastebin.com/pugeninuka.md

Yes, I am 'salty' (as the cool kids say) about the DCs.

I'd throw in a replay or three, but I forget to save my games lol.
 
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Okay, I'm double posting to say that Mega Pidgeot is actually a very good Pokemon right now. With base 121 Speed, 135 SpA and No Guard Hurricane, Pidgeot can put a dent in most offensive teams. Even some resists, like Tyrantrum and Jolteon (?), are 2HKOd by the ridiculous power behind a STAB 110 BP Attack off of 135 Special Attack. I used it with Pursuit support for Spiritomb, which let it get past things like Slowking and SpDef Meloetta.

so yeah, I'll keep laddering and post my team here once I'm done :]
 
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