[OU Gen 4] Bringing it back(?)

After deciding that I hated getting shat on by an infinite number of lame strats in Gen 5 (every other team having perma-weather, Erufuun with Leech Seed+Substitute+Protect+Taunt, Excadrill, Ditto and Venesaur raping my team, etc. etc.), I thought about going back a generation to the not-so-distant Gen 4. As I never got the chance to make a team before in the 4th gen of pokemanz, I decided to start now.

Team At a Glance:
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I'm not very original in my thinking, so I decided to take a bunch of different kinds of pokemon and meld them into a "balanced" team. I don't know if it worked or not, but seeing as Smogon is a ghost town for g4 matches (or simply just in general) right now, I tested most of it on PO.


Okay, my last RMT had a familiar lead to this one, so I thought to myself, "why change something that's working?"

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Jirachi @Choice Scarf
Jolly [252 Atk/252 Spe/4 HP]
Serene Grace
~Iron Head
~Zen Headbutt
~Stealth Rock
~Trick

(Taken from my other:)Pretty self-explanatory set; no one likes being tricked into Stealth Rock, no one likes being Flinched to death. Only thing that I DID change was that I put in ZH for more flinch coverage. Usually works out pretty well if I can flinch hax a pokemon or two.


Well now that I had my familiar lead who pretty much sets the tone that I'm going to be a little annoying. So, to add to this annoying strat, I picked up my possibly favorite competitive pokemon. This guy was also in my gen 5 RMT, but I'll be playing a different style in this team.


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Breloom @Toxic Orb
Jolly [252 Atk/244 Spe/12 HP]
Poison Heal
~Spore
~Substitute
~Seed Bomb
~Focus Punch

Standard SubPuncher set, 12 HP so that Toxic Orb heals the most it can. Taken straight off the page, pretty standard in terms of Gen 4, but still really annoying if you don't have the proper counter. Almost always nets a kill plus a couple of hits on others and maybe still a disable on the last guy to get Spore'd in the face.


Okay now that I had some annoying pokemanz, I wanted a SD sweeper, but I also wanted some high damage priority, and seeing as how I wanted to be a little original...

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Lucario @Life Orb
Jolly [252 Atk/252 Spe/4 HP]
Inner Focus
~Swords Dance
~Extremespeed
~Close Combat
~Stone Edge

Something that gives SD Lucario an edge over SD Scizor: Close Combat and Stone Edge. Great coverage, smashing into tons of pokemon for easy 2HKOs or even 1 hits and the ability to keep trucking on. I also like his typing over Infernape's, plus his priority does more than the monkey's. SR helps him a ton with scoring kills, and does a good job of taking out enemies.


Next, I needed a more versatile pokemon who could act primarily as a revenge killer. I narrowed it down to either Starmie or Gengar, it was a tough choice between the two because of their ups and downs, but...

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Starmie @Life Orb
Timid [252 SpA/252 Spe/4 HP]
Natural Cure
~Hydro Pump
~Thunderbolt
~Ice Beam
~Rapid Spin

An added bonus to not only having superior speed to Gengar is having Rapid Spin for pesky hazards AND Natural Cure just in case I switch in on a status. Like I said, I wanted versatile, and Starmie delivers. But don't think this guy's a slouch on the offensive aspect, he can revenge or even take down by himself plenty of pokemon before this star bites the dust. I did initially use Surf, but Hydro Pump's power is too much to be overlooked.

Okay, as this team was supposed to be focused around being balanced, I noticed that it was mostly offensive so far, so I thought to myself that I needed to make it a little bulkier. So, I figured I wanted two main things: support, and stalling. Well, why can't I put a little of both into one?

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Vaporeon @Leftovers
Bold [248 HP/224 Def/36 SpD]
Water Absorb
~Wish
~Protect
~Toxic
~Surf

Again, taken from the Smogon page, everything I wanted here. You know how it works, I either stall by myself or I pass my Wish to a teammate who needs it. Provides a nice fall-back when things get rough. Always a nice alternative to status another wall to pass through them. I guess I could put Roar in the last slot, but then Taunts would pwn me.


Okay now I have a little bulk, but I still want a more reliable sweeper that can set up in a turn or two easily. Meaning, I'd need a more tanky sweeper or at least one that did a good job scaring other pokes away.

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Dragonite @Life Orb
Jolly [252 Atk/252 Spe/4 HP]
~Dragon Dance
~Dragon Claw
~Earthquake
~Fire Punch

I would've liked if this dude was a Salamence instead, but this guy is the next best thing. I did have Gyarados instead, but I saw quickly that it was mostly redundant coverage, and I still wanted Dragon Dance. Jolly to outspeed 130's after DD, and Fire Punch so that I don't get stopped by Bronzongs. I considered Tyranitar, but my team doesn't really need Sand, plus he's still pretty slow with even with a DD. I might try him if Dragonite seems to be lacking.


Alright, finally I had a pretty well-rounded set of Pokemon where I think I put a bit of thought into it. I still think I can shift around some Pokes to better fit the roles I want, but I'm open to criticism and suggestions, but I'll be sure to test for a while first. Thanks.
 
Hey, I'm not an experienced team rater, but I'll give my two cents quickly.

Something that stands out to me (and bothers me if I'm honest) is your use of Dragonite.
I can see you're using him to imitate Salamence, but Dragonite is so much more versatile than Salamence ever was and can fit your team better in other ways.

Read this thread: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51407

I recommend a Bulky DD Dragonite.

Something that is potentially a threat is Heatran. Fire Blast and Earth Power are obvious, and if it's packing HP Electric or Dragon Pulse (or both?) it threatens nearly all of your team.

I'd be interested to know how you handle ScarfTran and SubTran when they appear in your matches (which they inevitably do).
 
Hi NaPz, cool team, there's some things I'd like to recommend that I think may help you out!

Currently, every member of your team is 2HKO'd by Life Orb Starmie. Jirachi and Lucario fall to Hydro Pump; Vaporeon and Starmie are fried by Thunderbolt; Breloom and Dragonite are taken out by Ice Beam. Your only ways of killing it is to risk a speed tie with your own Starmie (not wise) or to ExtremeSpeed it with Lucario. Smart players will just switch out and come back in later vs something that cannot hurt it like Jirachi; if this Starmie packs Recover, it can very easily run right through your team.

An easy fix to this is to use a Chesto Rest Kingdra over your Vaporeon - Vap doesn't really do anything for your team but slow down offensive momentum. Kingdra provides you with another fearsome sweeper and when paired with Dragonite forms a quite effective 'double dragon' duo - the concept is that when your opponent kills your first dragon, they are often too damaged to beat the second. The main reason to use Kingdra, though, is because it is one of the best answers to LO Starmie in the metagame - it can live any 2 of its hits, Dragon Dance up, Rest and get the Chesto Berry, Dance again if you feel a switch coming or if you just want to boost some more, and then fire off extremely powerful Outrages.

Kingdra @ Chesto Berry | Adamant | EVs: 144 HP / 160 Atk / 40 SpD / 164 Spe
Dragon Dance / Rest / Waterfall / Outrage

With this change implemented I think your team looks quite solid. Good luck!
 
Hey, interesting team you have there.
I have one or two suggestions:

Use U-Turn over Zen Heabutt on Jirachi. To be honest, Psychic is a terrible type coverage-wise, and it only has a 40% chance to flinch. U-turn will also help you keep offensive momentum, and allows you to take a chunk of HP away from Starmie (providing you switch in safely), which is a big threat to your team.

Swords Dance Lucario is a very threatening Pokemon. However, I think it is a bit too prepared for, and suggest changing it to Agility Lucario:

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Lucario @ Life Orb
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Moves:
~ Agility
~ Close Combat
~ Crunch
~ Ice Punch

Agility Lucario takes advantage of the surprise factor, and can OHKO most (if not all) typical SD lucario counters. Agility Lucario can outspeed and kill Pokemon such as Gliscor, Flygon, ScarfTar, Scarf Heatran, Starmie, Gengar, and Rotom, all of which can cause problems for Sword Dance variants.

I agree with BKC about changing Vaporeon to Kingdra. Vaporeon doesn't really fit the offensive nature of the team, and Kingdra also fixes the Starmie problem.

Thats all for now, good luck with the team! :)
 
Hm... I've tried all your guys' suggestions and I must say; it's working out really well. The only problem I'm facing is that I don't have a pokemon that has priority with these builds right now, and practically any poke that gets a +2 in speed can roll me over. Ideas?
 
I think I remember playing you yesterday. While offensively your team was strong, the lack of a reliable scarfer let me sweep you several times with a Gyarados/Scizor. To fix this you could do a number of things, but the easiest fix would be to run more coverage moves on Jirachi and try a Flygon out. Run fire punch > U-turn on Jirachi. Even after you trick your scarf, you can still check Lucario and Scizor. Then try running a Scarf Flygon out over Dragonite with Outrage / U-turn / Earthquake / Thunderpunch. This will allow you to check threats like Gyarados, Kingdra, ect. Jolly Agiligross will still be an issue and you will be weaker against stall teams, but SDluke can help with that, especially with stone edge to beat Gyara and rapid spin support from Starmie. Just don't let meta set up without taking a big hit.

edit: Also remember to turn off the show team on PO ;)
 
I think I remember playing you yesterday. While offensively your team was strong, the lack of a reliable scarfer let me sweep you several times with a Gyarados/Scizor. To fix this you could do a number of things, but the easiest fix would be to run more coverage moves on Jirachi and try a Flygon out. Run fire punch > U-turn on Jirachi. Even after you trick your scarf, you can still check Lucario and Scizor. Then try running a Scarf Flygon out over Dragonite with Outrage / U-turn / Earthquake / Thunderpunch. This will allow you to check threats like Gyarados, Kingdra, ect. Jolly Agiligross will still be an issue and you will be weaker against stall teams, but SDluke can help with that, especially with stone edge to beat Gyara and rapid spin support from Starmie. Just don't let meta set up without taking a big hit.

edit: Also remember to turn off the show team on PO ;)
Yeah I think I remember you too; like I said, easy to roll me after +2 speed or just any boosts in general. I agree, it seems Dragonite was/is my weakest link in this team, so Flygon should be better as I need a revenge killer. I did have Jirachi with Fire Punch originally but I just didn't use it too much, but it can prove useful to at least hurt foret a lot and KO scizor. Hmm, I'm getting "use agi luke, use sd luke," can't decide because both sets cover different pokes. I'm liking the agility for surprise tactics, but definitely noticeably less firepower... I'll try this stuff out, thanks.

O_O didn't even know that function was on PO... rofl, my newbness is showing.

*EDIT* Just fought an AgiGross right now, was thankfully saved by a Meteor Mash miss... dunno what woulda happened if it didn't... D:
 
I have an idea for the metagross problem: Try running 176 Atk / 80 Def / 252 Spe w/ Adamant on Flygon. It allows you to take a jolly LO Meteor Mash after SR. Flygon has to be at full health, but it might help in a pinch. You still have more attack than 252 jolly Flygon and jolly is still on option to tie with other Flygon, ect.
 
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