[OU] Stall #351

~ Stall #351 ~​

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#351___Introduction
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Hello everyone, here’s the lowest classed Smogon Tour player (the 351st). That’s right, I’m a noob ;o ! Now seriously, here’s a HardStall Team that I love to use. I don’t think it’s as well built as Kevin Garett’s but I still wanted to show it to you. Have a nice read (and big thanks to FoX (and dadoux/O-R) for the translation).


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#351___The Team
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Item : Shed Shell
Ability : Keen Eye
Nature : Impish
EV's : 252 HP / 164 SpD / 92 Spd
- Taunt
- Whirlwind
- Spikes
- Roost


  • I first chose a version based more on physical defense but then realised that I couldn’t handle neither Crocune, nor Cursers (such as Snorlax or Tyranitar) which set themselves up near the end of the battle and that even with an investissement in SpD, it handles Flygon really well. That’s why I chose the Taunt version which fits perfectly in the Team and is very useable as a Lead.

    The 92 Speed EVs allow me to outspeed RestTalk Gyarados and to Taunt it, preventing it from Sleep Talking and Roaring. An Impish nature lets me face more than comfortably DDKingdra versions which can really damage my Team. It also makes handling Dragonite’s Outrage easier.

    Let’s take a look at what I’d do against common Leads :

- Azelf : I directly switch to Tyranitar. If it’s the Choice Banded U-Turn, I take quite some damage but I can easily handle it with the rest of my Team. If it’s the classic Focus Sash, I definitely win the duel. If I’m facing the Dual Screener, I Crunch and I’m blocked against a probable Heavy Offense, the worst case scenario, but I can really face it well.
- Aerodactyl : I either switch to Rotom, or to Starmie (who can Spin). It’s on instinct.
- Machamp : Switch to Nidoqueen who wouldn’t take much on Ice Punch and will have a chance to poison it. Which will activate its Lum Berry and allow Rotom-H to burn it without fear.
- Metagross : One of the best match-ups, I’d Spike rather than Taunt and switch to Rotom-H as I don’t want Skarmory getting an Explosion blasted at it.
- Swampert : Here, probably the easiest case, I directly Spike as the opponent will (normally) switch.
- Jirachi : I stay whatever happens. If it Tricks me, it would’nt be a big problem as I’d be able to Spike quoi in any case.
- Infernape : Direct switch to Starmie who counters it perfectly.
- Roserade : I directly switch to Blissey and let it place its Toxik Spikess that I eventually absorb with Nidoqueen.
- Hippowdon : Look at Swampert, we’re in the same case except that here it activates the SandStorm (which is advantageous).
- Tyranitar : It’s all good, it activates the SandStorm for me and I can easily place my Spikes.
- Heatran : I switch to Starmie who’d be able to Spin and survive after 2 Fire Blasts.
- Smeargle : I switch to Rotom-H who’ll take Spore then I switch to Skarmory for Spikes or to Nidoqueen in order to absorb its Toxik Spikes (and place my own).
- Uxie : Switch to Tyranitar to take the Trick.


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Item : Leftovers
Ability : Natural Cure
Nature : Timid
EV's: 136 HP / 156 SpA / 216 Spd
- Hydropump
- Thunderbolt
- Rapid Spin
- Recover



  • As you can see, this is my Spinner. It is the perfect Heatran Counter (Specially Defensive) and it’s my main switch to StallBreak Gliscor who ToxikTaunts my entire Team therefore it’s a Pokemon that I must conserve at all costs for specific threats (Infernape notably).

    The EVs spread lets me outspeed all Pokemon with 110 Base Speed (and it’s worth saying that I also outspeed Jolly Gliscor and Jolly Infernape) and to handle two Fire Blast from Heatran. I can also 2HKO Standard Rotom (who is supposed to block my Spinning), facilitating its task. Thunderbolt lets me fare better against Bulky Waters and to get another Gyarados counter.

    What I don’t like about Starmie is its weakness to Pursuit but most Pokémon making the most of this (Infernape, Lucario or Breloom) are easily handled by the rest of my Pokemon. Only MixApe with Fire Blast / Mach Punch / Close Combat / U-Turn or Stone Edge can 6-0 my team if Starmie were to get trapped. In any case, it wouldn’t last long with Entry Hazards, its Life Orb and the SandStorm, the danger is therefore less present than we can imagine it to be.

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Item :
Leftovers
Ability : Point Poison
Nature : Relaxed
EV's : 252 HP / 252 Def / 6 SpA
- Toxik Spikes
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Fire Blast


  • Inspired by Lady Bug’s Hail Stall. I could have chosen another Ground type such as Gliscor or Hippowdon but Nidoqueen has a valued argument : She learns Toxik Spikes and possesses the Poison type allowing the absorption of the ones laid by the opponent’s. Nidoqueen is very useful for me to counter Machamp even without a life-recovering move, as with the presence of SandStorm and the Toxik Spikes (or Poison Point), Machamp won’t last. We can also emphasise that she counters Heracross but its move to UU makes it less prevalent in OU so it isn’t much use. A big point is her ability to perfectly counter SubToxikRoost Zapdos. Fire Blast allows me to hurt Skarmory and an eventual Scizor who’d think it’s be able to scount me without danger.

    Let’s not forget that she’s primarily here to set up Stealth Rock, which is more than important to annoy Dragonite who is a real pain (especially when I do not know its moves). For those of you who didn’t know, a Relaxed nature lets me avoid reducing any offensive or defensive stats so I find myself obliged to reduce my Speed, making me slower than Skarmory but this is not much of a worry.


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Item : Choice Scarf
Ability : Sand Stream
Nature : Jolly
EV's : 6 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
- Pursuit
- Crunch
- Stone Edge
- Superpower


  • Here’s ScarfTar, another classical HardStallTeam Pokemon . First of all, it is the one that activates my SandStorm and it can do so from the start by coming on a Lead Azelf who cannot do much (except Choice Band U-Turn but in that case, Skarmory and Rotom-H counter it).

    It will allow me to Revenge Kill a whole lot of stuff, primarily Mixed Dragonite who is an excellent WallBreaker and all Sweepers in the likes of Starmie, Gengar, Zapdos if I were to lose Blissey. The most delicate case is Rotom-A, especially the Water and the Grass. It is very hard to switch on them as their signature moves can 2HKO, or even OHKO me. Generally, I send Blissey in order to see which move is used. If I see Hydropump or Leaf Storm, I’d deduce that it’s an offensive version and according to the HitPoints that I lose, I could deduce whether it’s a Choice Specs or a Choice Scarf. That’s when I send out Tyranitar to anticipate the Trick.

    It also allows me to counter RainDanceTeams. In fact, I don’t have any Pokemon (apart from Blissey who can face Ludicolo) to take attacks from Rain Sweepers. Tyranitar, can cancel the Rain out and outspeed most SwiftSwimmers thanks to its Choice Scarf.

    Obviously, the problem of this set is that it is blocked on one attack and facilitates the set-up of many Pokémon like Infernape, Lucario or Machamp, Pokémon that are quite difficult to handle. For Infernape, I switch to Starmie without any hesitation, a perfect counter with Grass Knot and a resistance to Vacuum Wave. I don’t really fear Lucario, all I have to do is switch to Nidoqueen, a really nice counter due to the fact that we do not see many Lucarios with Ice Punch nowadays. In the unlikely case that it has Ice Punch, I’d let Nidoqueen die and put Rotom-H (If Luke has Ice Punch, it won’t have Crunch). Finally, concerning Machamp, I send Nidoqueen out to handle its attacks really well ; Machamp generally doesn’t have Ice Punch (except the Lead)) and Earthquake has the potential to inflict good damage on top of damage from the SandStorm (canceling out Leftovers Recovery) and Toxik Spikes. For Breloom, I just have to send Rotom-H out.


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Item : Leftovers
Ability : Levitate
Nature : Bold
EV's : 252 HP / 252 Def / 6 Spd
- Thunderbolt
- Will-O-Wisp
- Rest
- Sleep Talk


  • The classic Spin Blocker, it is indispensable in this Team (like all the others) because, as its name suggests, it prevents the oppenent from Spinning while taking no damange from Spikes and Toxik Spikes. The choice of Will-O-Wisp is obvious. It allows me to burn a Dragonite or a Scizor on the switch, two Pokémon with the ability to inflict considerable damage . Let’s add that Shadow Ball wouldn’t have brought me much, knowing that I can easily handle Celebi.

    Elsewhere, it lets me counter Metagross with the help of Skarmory (who suffers a lot from Explosion), Gyarados (who eliminates Starmie with Bounce and can also Taunt Skamory), Breloom or even SwordsDanceScizor. Its excellent typing (and special ability) also facilitates the handling of Pokémon like Magnezone (a pain in the butt with its Explosion) but more importantly, it lets me switch on Jirachi who doesn’t threaten much. I only switch on Jirachi in the case that I don’t know its moves, as it can Thunderbolt on Skarmory. If it’s the WishMindJirachi, I directly switch to Blissey, winning the duel thanks to Calm Mind.

    One of the problems of this set is the fact that I’m totally blocked by TauntGliscor, but Starmie (or Blissey) are here and are often able to scare it. The other problem is the risk of activating Heatran’s Flash Fire, which can be quite a big obstacle. My only solution is to send Blissey, take a Fire Blast (which inflicts less than 50% if it doesn’t hold Choice Specs ) and I SoftBoil to recover my HP. If I have the feeling that it’ll stay after my recovery, I can place Calm Minds to fare even better against it.

    The other problem is that I can’t burn Tyranitar (due to the ToxikSpikes), allowing it to set-up or to Pursuit. I generally try resolving this by switching (unless I don’t have enough HP to survive, I stay and Rest) to Skarmory who is a good general counter to scout the move it possesses. The only avantage of this situation is that it’ll die quite quickly due to the poison.


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Item : Leftovers
Ability : Natural Cure
Nature : Bold
EV's : 252 HP / 252 Def / 6 SpD
- Calm Mind
- Ice Beam
- Seismic Toss
- Softboiled


  • The best special wall of the game, she has an obvious position in the Team as she couples herself perfectly to the other Pokémon (SkarmBlissRotom blablabla).

    You’ve probably noticed the presence of Calm Mind, it is not there randomly. In fact, CalmMind Bliss will let me avoid the set-ups of many CalmMinders who could very well 6-0 my team, I think straight away of Jirachi and Celebi. She’s also a perfect counter to Charge Beamers such as Jolteon or Rotom. The case of Shaymin musn’t be forgotten, an annoying as hell Pokemon if it’s LifeOrbed with HP Fire, its Seed Flare acts like a Nasty Plot and I find myself forced to switch to Skarmory to PP Waster the 8PPs of Seed Flare. Here as well, Calm Mind can be a solution.

    I really hesitated on Ice Beam or Flamethrower but I realised that Gliscor et Dragonite could be real buggers so I went for Ice Beam. The absence of Toxik is due to the fact that I have Toxik Spikes, I therefore chose Seismic Toss, removing 100 HP to all Pokémon other than Ghosts in the game, giving me more flexibility. Concerning EVs, I maximise Defense and HP in order to better take physical hits as well as Pursuit, and I don’t have much to fear in terms of Special Attack with Calm Mind.
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#351___Threat List
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The threats below are only offensive, I think it'd be useless to make a list of defensive threats, seeing as Entry Hazards largely help to ruin them.​

- In black, you'll find the threats that I handle completely,
- In orange, you'll find the threats that have the potential to be dangerous, but have great diffulcity to set themselves up,
- In red, you'll find the threats that cause big problems.

- Azelf : Tyranitar (all versions except the Choice Bander (U-Turn)), Rotom-H (Choice Bander) / Skarmory (Choice Bander).
- Breloom : Rotom-H / Nidoqueen.
- Dragonite : Skarmory (Dragon Dancer, Mixed's Draco Meteor), Rotom-H (Dragon Dancer), Blissey (Mixed's Draco Meteor) and Rotom-H (Dragon Dance without Lum Berry), Tyranitar (Revenge Kill). Stealth Rock.
- Electivire : Rotom-H (all versions), Tyranitar (Revenge Kill), Nidoqueen (Mixed without Earthquake).
- Empoleon : Blissey (specially versions), Skarmory and Rotom-H (physically versions).
- Flygon : Skarmory (all versions), Rotom-H (Scarf).
- Gengar : Blissey / Tyranitar (Nidoqueen can withdraw the Toxik Spikes).
- Gyarados : Rotom (all versions), Starmie (except Bounce), Skarmory (except Taunt).
- Heatran : Blissey (All versions (but be careful to Explosion)), Starmie (Specially Defensive, Choice Scarfer), Tyranitar (Revenge Kill).
- Infernape : Starmie (Mixed (but be careful to Pursuit)), Blissey (Nasty Ploter), Nidoqueen (Swords Dance (if he have Flare Blitz, it will be OHKO by the recoil). Entry Hazards, SandStorm and his Life Orb.
- Jirachi : : Skarmory (WishMinder), Nidoqueen and Rotom-H (Physical versions). Specially versions beat my team.
- Jolteon : Blissey (all versions), Tyranitar can be a good counter.
- Kingdra : Skarmory (all DD versions), Tyranitar (Rain Sweeper).
- Lucario : Nidoqueen, Tyrascarf + Rotom (Swords Dance) Bliss + Rotom (Choice Specs).
- Machamp : Rotom, Nidoqueen (allversions except the Sleep Talker), Skarmory (Sleep Talker) and Toxik Spikes.
- Magnezone : Blissey (All versions (but be careful to Explosion)), Tyranitar and Rotom-H.
- Mamoswine : Skarmory and Rotom-H (all versions) Tyranocif and Starmie (Revenge Kill).
- Metagross : Rotom-H (all versions), Skarmory (all versions except ThunderPunch).
- Roserade : Blissey (all versions), Skarmory (all versions), Nidoqueen withdraw his Toxik Spikes.
- Rotom-A : Blissey (be careful to Trick), Tyranitar (be careful to Hydropump / Leaf Storm) and a good prediction.
- Scizor : Rotom-H / Skarm / Nidoqueen.
- Shaymin : Blissey (all versions except the Leech Seeder) + Skarmory (for Seed Flares) and Toxik Spikes.
- Starmie : Blissey (all versions), Tyranitar (Pursuit).
- Suicune : Blissey (all versions except CroCune), Skarmory (CroCune) and Toxik Spikes (except for CroCune).
- Togekiss : Rotom-H, Tyra, Skarm and Bliss (all versions).
- Tyranitar : I haven't counter to the Dragon Dancer (with Stone Edge / Earthquake / Crunch (Skarmory can take a Stone Edge but that's it)), MixTar is a good threat to. My only way to kill him is the Poison.
- Weavile : Skarmory, Entry Hazards & SandStorm.
- Zapdos : Blissey (all versions except the SubRoost), Nidoqueen (SubToxikRoost).
 
Hey, this is a cool stall team, and I love the use of Nidoqueen as it is a great Pokemon and has a huge niche in OU. I like the combination of Taunt Skarm + TTar + Spinner, as if Skarmory lures in Rotom on the Taunt, TTar can trap and KO it.

Anyway, I know this is going to make you Magnezone bait, but I really want you to try Lum Berry on Skarmory. Lum Berry lets you take Sleep from Roserade and Smeargle so you can retaliate with Taunt. From there you can just keep laying your hazards. Another option is Brave Bird over Whirlwind, although I would probably just keep Whirlwind as you lack any other phazers on your team [which is really important for stall]. You really want Whirlwind as it lets you phaze Kingdra who is a large threat to your team.

You say your Blissey will beat Jirachi [and it has a good shot at beating the SubCM versions], but Wish+CM outright beats you. Currently you do not have much that can beat that version of Jirachi as Tyranitar 3HKOes, Skarm dies, Nidoqueen dies to Psychic, Rotom is generally set up fodder and Starmie is OHKOed at +1. Obviously you would handle it by Burning with Rotom then trying to stall out before you get crit with Blissey. Because of this Jirachi weakness, I would like you to try Earthquake on Tyranitar over Superpower. This move accompanied by Rotom's WoW will let you always beat Calm Mind Jirachi.

As you said, you have no direct counter to Tyranitar and by using Earthquake on your own TTar, you cannot OHKO it anymore, especially Shuca variants. That is, if you win the speed tie. Unfortunately I cannot suggest much to fix this weakness without disrupting your team. One option, although it definitely is not a fix to the problem, is to use Rotom-W. There is no spot for Hydro Pump, but Rotom-W may ward off Tyranitar for fear of Hydro Pump, although most Tyranitar will be more wary of a burn rather than a small Hydro Pump hit, barring Lum Berry variants of course. Worth a try I guess, it doesn't really harm you.

Sorry I couldn't suggest much. Good team.
 
Very solid Stall team. Just one question; why Nidoqueen > Forretress?

Forretress @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Careful nature
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic Spikes
- Payback
- Rapid Spin / Explosion / Earthquake / Gyro Ball

Since the role of Rapid Spinner is filled feel free to take advantage of an extra slot.
 
Nice Stallfest, dude.
Only thing I can see right now would be replacing Nidoqueen for Gliscor.
It fits really well with your Scarftar and Blissey, it can add some SR too, and it's damn bulky.
It also loves playing in the sand, and some haxx can't be bad.
Not only it solves your DDtar problem (except LOL ICE PUNCH), but it also does what Nidoqueen tries to do, like stalling Gliscor.
Also, the moveset I'm tell you is another solution against stall.
It's a sort of improved Nidoqueen ?
You can still easily spin with Starmie, without worrying about T-spikes, thanks to Natural Cure.
Here is the set :
Gliscor (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Veil
EVs: 216 HP/40 Def/252 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt
- Roost
- Earthquake

It's a quick-bulky one, and it's very effective.
The only issue I can see is loss of T-spikes but I think you can easily afford it, as it stops Set-up dudes.

What do you think of that awesome little boy ?
 
Firstly, thank you for comments.

Honestly, Jirachi SubMinder can beat my team (I forgot it, I added this crap in my Threat List). I don't know what I can do to fix this problem.

I hate play Foretress, he's called " spinner " but he can't. It can set up Entry Hazards but a lot of Pokemon can set up on him (but that's my opinion).

To play Gliscor isn't a bad idea but Nidoqueen can set up Toxik Spikes and can counter Machamp Lead (with Rotom-H), Gliscor can't but why not, he can help me against Jirachi. I'll think about it. Thanks Aga (;

(Oh and sorry for my poor English u_u).
 
Not enough time for an explanation, buuuuuuuuuuuuut;

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP/128 Spd/132 SDef
Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Lava Plume
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Roar

Deals with CM Jirachi very well.
 
Hey really cool stall team! I like that it's different from KG/Earthworm/Taylor stall which everyone seems to be running, and employs some unique ways to stop threats (CM Blissey, Nidoqueen) that most stall teams are troubled by. I'd say the main issues are the weakness to DD Tyranitar (and most other sets), WishCM Jirachi (although it can be handled), ChestoRest Kingdra (if Skarmory is dead) and most Dragonite. However if you play your cards right, all of these can be handled. The synergy is pretty airtight, so I won't suggest any member changes.

First, I agree with Heist- since Jirachi is such an issue, try Earthquake over Superpower. It can still hit most of the things Superpower does (Lucario, opposing Tyranitar, Heatran) and enjoys the ability to provide a reasonable answer to WishCM Jirachi.

As far as Rotom, having used nearly that set on most of my stall teams, I highly recommend Reflect over Will-o-wisp for a number of reasons. Firstly, and least importantly, will-o-wisp's accuracy sucks. Reflect allows you to resist physical attacks from things already poisoned, such as Kingdra. Kingdra can shake off a will-o-wisp with a well-timed rest and wreak havoc- reflect doesn't suffer from this. Reflect also gives you an answer to Lead Machamp 100% of the time and to things like Lum Dragonite or Tyranitar that can shake off a will-o-wisp.

As far as Blissey goes, if you're already running CM, why not use Thunderbolt over Seismic Toss? BoltBeam coverage is super and thunderbolt makes Crocune a lot easier to handle in most instances, as well as annoying things like Empoleon, Starmie or even Gyarados.

And that's all the advice I have, excellent team. Hope this helps.
 
Hello

This is one of the best stall teams I've seen in awhile, so congrats for that!
I can't suggest that much since there isn't much that can be approved, but I'll try to give some constructive criticism.

First I agree with Lum Berry on Skarmory. This allows you to beat leads as Roserade and Smeargle (and uncommon one like Butterfree, ...) while only losing the ability to flee against Magnet Pull pokemon.

I also agree with Smith with using Thunderbolt instead of Seismic Toss. After a few Calm Minds Blissey's special attack is pretty decent to an offensive BoltBeam combination is a good idea.

I "third" the suggestion to use Earthquake on Tyranitar instead of Superpower, as this will slightly help you with CM Jirachi.

I would also like to suggest Surf instead of Hydro Pump on Starmie. You have Tyranitar to "trap" Rotom-a and other spinblockers and with Surf you'll have a move that has higher PP and accuracy which could come in handy at times. You'll still hit pokemon as Heatran and Infernape with enough power to OHKO them. You might also try a little bulkier spread on Starmie. A spread of 136 HP / 156 Def / 216 Spe will make Starmie a bit bulkier, and thus making it easier to counter the likes of Heatra, Infernape, Gyarados.

Perhaps a bit of a nitpick here but on Nidoqueen I suggest putting those 6 SpA EV's in SpD.

Hope this helped!
 
Thanks for your rate Delko.

I think Lum Berry is a good idea for set-up Spikes against Sleep inducers but if I lost Skarm because of a Magnezone, Kingdra can destroy my Team. This is why Shed Shell is so important.

Starmie's Hydro Pump can 2HKO Scizor with Stealth Rock and I really want 2HKO Rotom for spin.

Regarding the rest, I agree.

Thanks again.
 
I'm not very good at rating, I can find weaknesses but am unable to patch them up.

I'm seeing a huge weakness to TyraniBOAH if Nidoqueen is down. It comes in on the whore and Subs as it runs (can Blissey run?) away. It KOs Starmie and Skarmory with TBolt, TTar and Blissey with Focus Punch and 2HKOs Rotom with Crunch / Dark Pulse because Rotom can't burn the sub. Hopefully some other rated can find how to fix this. If you don't change the team, your best bet is to scout with Blissy before Nidoqueen is dead. Nidoqueen fears Ice Beam But then Skarmory come is and Whirlinds Ttar away.

Hope someone else can build on this and GL with the team.
 
Firstly; Great team.

I remember playing this team on PL about a week ago and remember it being very strong. Its the sought of team that has small advantages over most other teams, rather than big advantages over some and big disadvantages over others. Allowing the skill of the player rather than team to win matches.

For your major threats I strongly recommend this set over TTar:

Jirachi @choice scarf
Serene Grace
Evs: 128hp/128atk/252spe
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SAtk)
- Iron Head
- FPunch
- IPunch/TPunch
- Trick

For most stall teams, bulky/mix set uppers can break through walling foundations. Tricking a choice has always been vital for my stall teams. Tricking jirachi can screw over wishingrachi/crocune leaving it set up fodder for blissey. It also 2hkos most ttar, beats curselax with a trick and handles scizor easily.

ChestoRest kindgra also looks like a major pain, especially the weird Rest/DD/Waterfall/HPump one that was running around awhile back. Tricking could ease predict wars. This could also be done for mix ape which can hurt your team with CC/Overheat/Uturn/Machpunch.

ScarfTtar on stall has lost its edge. With everyone knowing about scarf these days it has lost its surprise factor which gave it a big edge in being chosen for teams. Choosing jirachi instead covers more threats than it leaves open. You still beat standard LO starmie after entry hazards and LO/PS Gengar. Zapdos becomes tricky but playing safer with blissey covers this. You do lose out on Psuiting Rotom-A for a definite kill, however a bit of prediction from starmie predicting rapid spin blockers handles rotom well. Most cases it doesnt really matter however as ttar will not be first switch into rotom's potential WoW/Hpump/Lstorm. Azelf loses Psuit coverage as well, however it doesn't really threaten your team anyway.

Good luck, and good team.
 
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