Pokémon Black 2 and White 2 In-game Tier List - Mark III

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Its_A_Random

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I updated it (havent done any editing or checking and havent updated reservation index yet), and there's only one entry left.

This bad boy which I missed initially:



Anyone wanna give Sawk the entry?

Also I guess you can comment on writeups and what needs to be improved and whatnot.
 

Its_A_Random

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I shouldnt be triple posting...

Okay so this is a good time to start with the final phase of this tiering thing before we go to get the list on site.

So what we are going to do is we are going to go through the list. What we are going to do is basically QC the entry. We want to make sure the information is accurate, we want to make sure the information is concise and with no irrelevant / redundant information, and basically get it to a professional standard. Also possibly changing its tier placement if it is out of place. Which it may or may not be. Who knows.

Think of this as the QC process in a C&C analysis, except everyone gets to join in on the fun.

We did this with the RBY lists so I suppose it should work for this as well

It should also be noted that I've given DHR-107 free reign to help out with getting this tier list done and allow him to do stuff to the OP and adjust things as he wishes. He'll also help keep this thread going should I randomly lose my motivation (again) and end up going inactive for months, which shouldn't happen if this thread remains active.

Without further ado, let's begin. We'll do three entries at a time (enough at a time to stop it being too slow and enough at a time to stop disorganisation from too many entries to QC at once) and go from top to bottom. Starting with these three:


Name: Braviary
Availability: Early-Mid Game, Route 4, Stationary (Mondays only) [White 2]
Stats: Really good Attack right from the get-go, with good Speed to back it up.
Typing: Normal / Flying gives it good STAB moves to work with. Its weaknesses won't really come into play.
Movepool: It starts out with Aerial Ace and learns Slash three levels later. It should be taught Return later on, and can be taught Fly for more power. It gets access to both Superpower and Brave Bird late game.
Major battles: Unfortunately it comes right after Burgh. It will be able to push through Elesa despite its disadvantage. Clay will be a harder nut to crack, especially Excadrill. Braviary should be able to bust through most of the Gym Leaders and the Elite Four with just a little bit of help against bad matchups.


Name: Darumaka
Availability: Early-Mid Game, Route 4, 30% (Entrance)
Stats: It has a high Attack stat and good Speed upon evolution.
Typing: Fire doesn't hit a lot of things super effectively, but it can prove to be useful in some major battles like against Burgh.
Movepool: It has a lot of good physical attacks. Fire Fang, Fire Punch, and Flare Blitz give it good STAB moves. Rock Slide, Brick Break, and Superpower give some ammount of coverage.
Major battles: Darumaka is available right before Burgh and can help get through that gym quickly. Watch out for Dwebble's Rock moves though. Clay can be troublesome, and Marlon shouldn't be beatable. It has good utility against most of the other gyms and the Elite Four.


Name: Drilbur
Availability: Early-Mid Game, Relic Passage, 80% (Dust Cloud)
Stats: Great Attack coupled with good Speed. Gains nice bulk upon evolving.
Typing: Starts out as a pure Ground-type, which gives a good STAB to work with. An additional Steel typing upon evolution grants more resistances and better matchups.
Movepool: Will start out with Dig or learn it soon after capture. It also has access to Metal Claw, and later, Slash and Rock Slide. Waiting two levels before evolving it grants Drilbur early Earthquake.
Major battles: Won't do extremely well against Burgh, but can beat Dwebble. Elesa is child's play for it, but needs to be careful around Emolga. If evolved, it can be used to defeat Clay's Excadrill easily. Due to its good offensive capabilities, no major battle should be tough for it. However, stay away from Pokemon with potential super effective moves.

So what about these entries can be improved? Are they fine in the tier they are? Is there any useful information left out? Is there any information that should be altered / removed?

Please don't die thread.

Also Sawk needs his entry.
 

Name: Metang
Availability: Metang is first encounter-able at the Giant Chasm, which means you have defeated all of the gyms at this point cause it's not found in the cave. When you do get to it, it won't be easy to catch, as is infamously known. When you do manage to catch it, however, it only takes a few levels to fully evolve.
Stats: Metagross, being a pseudo legendary, has solid all-around stats. It has a potent Attack stat and good physical bulk. He is a little slow, but with the bulk he has, Metagross doesn't really mind all that much.
Typing: Steel/Psychic in Gen 5 was a good typing, with it only being 2x weak to Fire and Ground. Its Psychic typing makes it only neutral to Fighting type moves, which is quite helpful in Gen 5. Other helpful resistances include Normal, Ice, Flying, Rock, Psychic, and Dragon. Grass and Steel resistances are there too. The typing on the offense isn't as great as it is defensively, with Steel only beating Rock and Ice. Still, Steel deals decent neutral damage, while Psychic smacks bulky Poison types and Fighting types.
Movepool: Because he comes so late, you should have a lot of TMs for Metagross at this point. Right when you catch it, Metang has some good moves of its own- like Bullet Punch and Psychic. Meteor Mash comes soon after, and Zen Headbutt can be learned through move tutor depending on how long you want to wait for it. It gets coverage like Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Hammer Arm, and Rock Slide. All of these moves are quite serviceable, though moves like Zen Headbutt, Meteor Mash, Hammer Arm, and Rock Slide do have the potential to miss. Meteor Mash is a great STAB move, being able to boost Attack. Zen Headbutt usually gets the job done, and if it does miss, Metagross usually doesn't worry that much about it. Overall, a good movepool.
Major Battles: Metagross is a pretty good fighter in boss battles, although coming so late, it only contributes to fighting Team Plasma at the end, the last rival battle, the Elite Four, and the Champ. Dragon resistances are potentially helpful against Iris and Ghetsis, though Dragons usually have coverage for Metagross. I found Metagross to be useful against Iris regardless, mainly due to its bulk and power. That can go for a lot of the fights it's in bar Ghetsis- who is usually always challenging. He plows through Victory Road efficiently, and can take on Marshal, Caitlin (due to his Psychic resistance), Grimsley if you have Hammer Arm, and has a neutral chance against Shauntal, but he has to be careful of Jellicent, Golurk, and Chandelure. With his raw base stats, Metagross usually is able to contribute to any fight he's in.
Additional Comments: Clear Body, while not the world's greatest ability, is never a bad thing, blocking off Intimidate or NPCs' status-lowering moves. While I did praise Metagross a lot for this entry, keep in mind that he still comes very late- meaning your team will have to really reserve a spot for him for a long time. This is not for everybody. Metagross also levels up slowly, an issue that can be somewhat mitigated if you give it the Lucky Egg. Without that, though, Metagross does have a slower than usual level up growth.
 

DHR-107

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Its_A_Random are we still allowed to dispute tierings or is attention solely focused on writeups now
If you bring an incredible argument as to why something would need to be moved at this point I guess so? If it's not an amazing argument then it's probably not going to change anything.

Also I'll take a look at this over the weekend and do some tidy ups as well.
 
One super small nitpick -- in the Gligar entry, you can actually get a Razor Fang if you're willing to grind up on the PWT (8 BP) -- which I had to for a Nuzlocke
 


Name: Heracross
Availability: Mid Game, Lostlorn Forest, 5% [Black 2]
Stats: Heracross has a high Attack stat, which allows to tear teams apart; 85 Speed is good enough to outrun the majority of Pokemon. Its other stats are decent but not outstanding.
Typing: Offensively, Bug and Fighting can hit quite a lot. Defensively, the weaknesses to Fire, Flying, and Psychic are going to trouble Heracross throughout the game.
Movepool: It gets Brick Break one level after you catch it, as well as Close Combat at level 34. At level 46, it obtains Megahorn. TM-wise, Heracross only really would like Rock Slide, which is obtainable before Skyla.
Major Battles: Heracross beats Clay easily due to getting Close Combat around that battle. It can take on Marlon's Carracosta, as well as some of Drayden’s frailer dragons due to its sheer power. Heracross can take on Ghetsis's Hydreigon with relative ease, as well as Kyurem. Heracross beats Grimsley's whole crew, does very well against the majority of Caitlin's team, can utilize a coverage move to fare against Shauntal and Marshal and can smash Iris's Aggron and Lapras.

Name: Magnemite
Availability: Early Game, Virbank Complex, 25% (Inside)
Stats: Has a great Special Attack stat, with decent overall bulk to back it up.
Typing: Steel/Electric is arguably the holy grail of defensive typings, with resistances to everything bar four types. Ground and Fighting types are rather common though. Offensively, this typing is mediocre, but is saved by Magnemite's stats and movepool.
Movepool: Magnemite comes with Sonicboom, a godsend earlygame that can 2HKO everything. Aside from that, it has Thundershock, and later Mirror Shot. Magnemite doesn't get any good STAB moves until Flash Cannon, but it can hold on with STAB Volt Switch, Thunder, and a tutored Signal Beam.
Major Battles: Magnemite steamrolls over Roxie, Burgh, Skyla, and Marlon by virtue of typing alone. It helps a lot against Drayden, but needs to watch out for coverage moves such as Earth Power.

Name: Minccino (Hidden Ability)
Availability: Mid Game, Route 5, 100% (Hidden Grotto)
Stats: Minncino has average stats, with a slightly above average speed. Upon evolving into a Cinccino, it has a very high speed and slightly above average attack. All its other stats are below average, so it won't be taking many hits.
Typing: Both Minccino and Cinccino are of the Normal type, so it has a weakness and an immunity defensively, and its STAB has two resists and an immunity.
Movepool: It may have a shallow movepool, but it has what it needs to function. It starts with Double Slap and learns Tail Slap at level 25. Upon evolving, it can relearn Bullet Seed and Rock Blast by the move relearner.
Major Battles: It struggles against any Steel-type, and Fighting-types can hit hard if they get a chance to attack. Other than that, it does just fine and will pull its own weight and more against anything else, bar Rock- or Ghost-types before getting the fifth gym badge.
Additional Comments: Skill Link Minccino is required for its top tier placement, and Cinccino needs Tail Slap, Bullet Seed, and Rock Blast to function.

I've been looking through the original post, and from what I see, I can't spot any spelling errors or odd sentence structure but I did add the phrase "Hidden Ability" to Minccino's name just to specificy that specific Minccino and not any others.
For Heracross, you should mention how it fairs against Caitlin because it does get Megahorn much earlier than the previous generations and proceeds to outspeed and OHKO 3 out of Caitlin's 4 Pokemon. Heracross overall does very well against all of the E4 since it can have a coverage move to beat them all which I added my comments to it in italics and underline.
 

Punchshroom

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How's this, Its_A_Random?


Name:
Sawk
Availability: Late Game, Route 23, 25% (Black 2) - 5% (White 2)
Stats: Incredibly powerful with workable Speed. Average but not terrible defenses.
Typing: Fighting-typing gives it favorable matchups against many types, but is also resisted by many, increasing reliance on coverage moves. Its Dark and Rock resistances can be of mild benefit.
Movepool: If it doesn't already come with the obscenely strong Close Combat, it only needs one level to learn it, so it can put in work immediately after you get it. It doesn't learn any worthwhile level-up moves at that point though, so it needs TMs or tutors to diverge from its current moveset, such as the Brick Break and Rock Slide TMs and Ice Punch from the Driftveil move tutor.
Major Battles: While it can thrash Grimsley quite easily as well as dispose of Iris's Hydreigon, Lapras and Aggron, it has awkward if not outright bad matchups against Caitlin and Shauntal while being vulnerable to Archeops. Close Combat's defense drops can also make its neutral matchups shaky, further warranting the use of coverage moves.
Additional Comments: While Sawk isn't a bad Pokemon to pick up, there are way more powerful Fighting-types one can access before it, most of which offer an additional typing and STAB as well as actually contribute early- or mid-game. If you do choose to use Sawk, go for one with Sturdy.

Edit: Its_A_Random made some changes
 
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cityscapes

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is it still am qc if there's no qc team? :thinking:

Name: Braviary
Availability: Early-Mid Game, Route 4, Stationary (Mondays only) [White 2]
Stats: Really good Attack right from the get-go, with good Speed to back it up.
Typing: Normal / Flying gives it good STAB moves to work with. Its weaknesses won't really come into play. yes they will, the next gym is electric type man and ice/rock is common late game. note that braviary has enough bulk to take super effective non stab hits tho.
Movepool:
It starts out with Aerial Ace and learns Slash three levels later. It should be taught Return later on, and can be taught Fly for more power. It gets access to both Superpower and Brave Bird late game. mention what these do-- superpower provides coverage vs steels and rocks, brave bird is stronger than fly but has recoil. also braviary can fly you around which is probably worth mentioning
Major battles:
Unfortunately it comes right after Burgh. It will be able to push through Elesa despite its disadvantage. Clay will be a harder nut to crack, especially Excadrill. Braviary should be able to bust through most of the Gym Leaders and the Elite Four with just a little bit of help against bad matchups.


Name: Darumaka
Availability: Early-Mid Game, Route 4, 30% (Entrance)
Stats: It has a high Attack stat and good Speed upon evolution.
Typing: Fire doesn't hit a lot of things super effectively, but it can prove to be useful in some major battles like against Burgh.
Movepool: It has a lot of good physical attacks. Fire Fang, Fire Punch, and Flare Blitz give it good STAB moves. Rock Slide, Brick Break, and Superpower give some ammount of coverage. when does it learn these moves?
Major battles:
Darumaka is available right before Burgh and can help get through that gym quickly. Watch out for Dwebble's Rock moves though. and dwebble in general really, its fire neutrality and high defense means that it can 1v1 darumaka unless you're overleveled Clay can be troublesome, and Marlon shouldn't be beatable. It has good utility against most of the other gyms and the Elite Four. what does "good utility" mean?


Name: Drilbur
Availability: Early-Mid Game, Relic Passage, 80% (Dust Cloud)
Stats: Great Attack coupled with good Speed. Gains nice bulk upon evolving.
Typing: Starts out as a pure Ground-type, which gives a good STAB to work with. An additional Steel typing upon evolution grants more resistances and better matchups.
Movepool: Will start out with Dig or learn it soon after capture. It also has access to Metal Claw, and later, Slash and Rock Slide. Waiting two levels before evolving it grants Drilbur early Earthquake. dig is strong/gets you out of caves, metal claw is a steel stab for driller, rock slide covers flying types, slash...exists i guess? why
Major battles:
Won't do extremely well against Burgh, but can beat Dwebble. Elesa is child's play for it, but needs to be careful around Emolga. If evolved, it can be used to defeat Clay's Excadrill easily. Due to its good offensive capabilities, no major battle should be tough for it. However, stay away from Pokemon with potential super effective moves. how does it do vs marlon and skyla?
 

Its_A_Random

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I did it I actually did something and updated the OP with Sawk at long long last.

That said, if anyone wants to look over the write-ups for the Pokémon, then be my guest (they are all done, just reviewing).

Also epic bump I guess.

please be active for extended period of time so i dont lose drive and leave this thread inactive for months again
 

DHR-107

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Let's get it done dude. I would also agree with Kurona in updating this to be S/A/B/C/D/E etc to match the other new lists.

How do we want to handle this? I can either move it down to the Ingame Articles section or we can repost it there after I talk to TDP about it.

Thank you IAR for getting all of this sorted!
 

Conni

katharsis
On the subject of write-ups, my opinion is that maybe we could move them somewhere where they can be more organized as cramming them all in one in game tier list thread can be less easier to navigate sometimes. The in-game articles subforum would be an appropriate place on paper, but it feels like that section is more for TM articles, shiny stuff, and RNG and etc. Maybe if we could split that subforum or make a seperate one so that these write-ups are more organized, perhaps maybe similar to C&C, then they can possibly be easier to do and manage, but thats up to the mods.

I'll of course help with checking the articles for feedback I can give or by writing them myself! Always a pleasure to work on a project I like and im comfortable with. Thanks all for making this happen, looking forward to this new write-up project!
 
On the subject of write-ups, my opinion is that maybe we could move them somewhere where they can be more organized as cramming them all in one in game tier list thread can be less easier to navigate sometimes. The in-game articles subforum would be an appropriate place on paper, but it feels like that section is more for TM articles, shiny stuff, and RNG and etc. Maybe if we could split that subforum or make a seperate one so that these write-ups are more organized, perhaps maybe similar to C&C, then they can possibly be easier to do and manage, but thats up to the mods.

I'll of course help with checking the articles for feedback I can give or by writing them myself! Always a pleasure to work on a project I like and im comfortable with. Thanks all for making this happen, looking forward to this new write-up project!
The in-game tier lists are intended to be moved there once finished; the only reason they're currently all on-forum is because none of them have been finished yet (aside from BW2 like right this second).
 

Conni

katharsis
The in-game tier lists are intended to be moved there once finished; the only reason they're currently all on-forum is because none of them have been finished yet (aside from BW2 like right this second).
Which is my suggestion, if we worked on write-ups similarly to C&C processes then maybe they could be easier to organize aside from finding them in one thread. As the write-ups would be in different threads and thus being more easy to see and work on rather than going to post number. It may be a hassle to start off in the first place, but in my opinion it could create more clarity, but like I said before this is definitely a moderator action so its up to them to decide where write-ups that are being worked on go. But about finished ones, they should probably go with worked-on write ups if they are moved to a more specific section.
 

DHR-107

Robot from the Future
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On the subject of write-ups, my opinion is that maybe we could move them somewhere where they can be more organized as cramming them all in one in game tier list thread can be less easier to navigate sometimes. The in-game articles subforum would be an appropriate place on paper, but it feels like that section is more for TM articles, shiny stuff, and RNG and etc. Maybe if we could split that subforum or make a seperate one so that these write-ups are more organized, perhaps maybe similar to C&C, then they can possibly be easier to do and manage, but thats up to the mods.

I'll of course help with checking the articles for feedback I can give or by writing them myself! Always a pleasure to work on a project I like and im comfortable with. Thanks all for making this happen, looking forward to this new write-up project!
I'm kind of confused here. All the write ups are done. We just need them to be a little more streamlined/QC'd and Grammar checked and they should be good to go. The hard work has been completed. Like I said, I'll talk to TDP and how we want to do it, most likely grabbing the posts with all the content and reposting them all in a brand spanking new thread in the InGame Article section so they can all be looked at properly and objectively (without all the extra conversations etc that are here).

The organization of these lists is on the thread owner. IAR has done a fantastic job with this one to finally get it over the finish line and I'm very excited to finally be able to get something new up on the website that has been so long in the making.
 

Its_A_Random

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Let's get it done dude. I would also agree with Kurona in updating this to be S/A/B/C/D/E etc to match the other new lists.

How do we want to handle this? I can either move it down to the Ingame Articles section or we can repost it there after I talk to TDP about it.

Thank you IAR for getting all of this sorted!
I did this, though I called them "Ranks" instead of "Tiers", because it sounds more natural (to me at least). Also added brief descriptors for each rank though they may end up being redundant.

We can move this to the In-game Articles section but I do want to probably have a new thread to make an OP to be more article-like (though moving this thread and asking me to re-write OP or something is okay since this is only two pages long). I definitely want these entries to be QCed (before being GPed) to make sure they are all okay, don't have misinformation, and make things concise enough however.

It's about time we started to get this thing out the door.
 

DHR-107

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I did this, though I called them "Ranks" instead of "Tiers", because it sounds more natural (to me at least). Also added brief descriptors for each rank though they may end up being redundant.

We can move this to the In-game Articles section but I do want to probably have a new thread to make an OP to be more article-like (though moving this thread and asking me to re-write OP or something is okay since this is only two pages long). I definitely want these entries to be QCed (before being GPed) to make sure they are all okay, don't have misinformation, and make things concise enough however.

It's about time we started to get this thing out the door.
I am fine with it all going into a new thread. Just make sure you keep all the contributors listed somewhere in one of the posts. Thank you so much for your hard work and everyone else who has contributed to this thread.
 
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