Pokemon Sun/Moon Random Battle sets

duck

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#1
Approved by TheImmortal

We are now welcoming suggestions on fixing some movesets we have right now. Please use this thread.
This is the Single Random Battle thread. For doubles, click here.

What is OK to post?
Screenshots of bad movesets/items/abilities or an accurate description of the set.
Suggestion about adding new moves/items to the sets but supported by a good argomentation.

What is NOT OK to post?
One liners suggestions.
Screenshot of movesets that are not actually bad.
Post complaining about unfairness and hax about teams.
Anything that is illegal on the pokemon.

KEEP IN MIND THAT
Every pokemon has 84 ev in every stat, so consider this before telling a set is "bad".
We may not accept your suggestion.
It's random battle, something should be random. We are not looking for one single viable set. If you wanna play that way, play Battle Factory.
In random battle unreleased abilities are legit and so are allowed some illegal egg moves combo.

You can find all the Pokemon info on https://dex.pokemonshowdown.com/
You can find current move sets at https://raw.githubusercontent.com/Zarel/Pokemon-Showdown/master/data/formats-data.js
 
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#2
hi there

I've read the event set for Pumpkaboo Super, and I think that it should be removed (if event mons are allowed to be moved). My primary reasoning is that only Shadow Sneak is viable in this moveset; Astonish does little damage and it's primary role is already completed by shadow sneak, plus the priority. Scary Face isn't nessecary because Pumpkaboo would probably be KOed before it can lower a Pokemon's Speed enough to be effective, it might be useful on some occassions but it all relies on convinience and it's just not good compared to the other moves Pumpkaboo posseses. Trick Or Treat and Shadow Sneak are fine, but priority users can easily KO Pumpkaboo before it can STAB them with the aforemention combo.

In the case of above, if Event Pumpkaboo cannot be removed, then I'd like to suggest a new set likewise.

Items and nature are randomized, so the moveset is the only thing that needs changing (correct me if im wrong and I will fix this)

Moveset:

Giga Drain - Alternative answer to Bullet Seed due to Mudbray having Stamina, so Giga Drain would at least prevent this problem, since otherwise, Mudbray will wall out Pumpkaboo and other mons. also stab

Shadow Sneak - Ghost-type STAB move, can be used to pick off low HP mons, and can hit mons like Abra and Gastly nicely, it also has useful priority that is esstential due to Pumpkaboo's sluggishness.

Leech Seed - Recovery Option besides Giga Drain, Synthesis is better but this is more random. This can be used to wall some physical attackers and can help Pumpkaboo take them out easier while gaining important, but little health.

Will-O-Wisp - "Let it burn" Jokes aside, Pumpkaboo can spread status which cripple physical attackers and temper with other Pokemon's longevity. Generallya utility move to help teammates sweep better.

If this isn't random enough I can randomize it even further, although I think that this is fine, as it isn't particularly viable in competitive LC, and yet again, it isn't that bad to the extent of it being useless, in my opinion.

Thanks for your time, have a great day!
 
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#3
I've read the event set for Pumpkaboo Super, and I think that it should be removed (if event mons are allowed to be moved).
OK so like

formats-data.js is not only for Random Battle sets. Only the parts under randomBattleMoves (singles) or randomDoubleBattleMoves (doubles) pertain to Random Battle.

Event data (what you're looking at) has nothing to do with random battles at all; it's just the set of a Pokemon given by a specific event.

Have a great day!
 
#5
Pumpkaboo doesn't appear in standard Random Battle. The set info is still there for legacy purposes and Seasonal formats as necessary (and is usually updated when said Seasonal formats use the Pokemon). We never did figure out how we would create and balance LC Random Battle, though, so your comments might be taken into consideration if that format is ever created.

If we assume the sets are for Gourgeist, it already has the last 3 moves in its pool and its low Special Attack (58 base) makes Giga Drain a bad move to use.
 
#6
Linoone should have a Figy Berry (or equivalent) + Gluttony set instead of just Sitrus Berry + Quick Feet.

When it uses Belly Drum, Gluttony activates berry usage at 50%. Figy Berry and its equivalents heal 50%, so Linoone will be at 100% health, which is vital for how frail it is. There have been times where I really wish Linoone just had that extra 25% health.

Quick Feet isn't entirely bad, however. I say keep both, but of course randomize which set Linoone uses.

Also, this only works because Linoone has Gluttony. If there are other mons which could benefit from the Figy Berry buff, I'd like to know. But I think Linoone definitely deserves to benefit from this gimmick.
 
#7
Linoone should have a Figy Berry (or equivalent) + Gluttony set instead of just Sitrus Berry + Quick Feet.

When it uses Belly Drum, Gluttony activates berry usage at 50%. Figy Berry and its equivalents heal 50%, so Linoone will be at 100% health, which is vital for how frail it is. There have been times where I really wish Linoone just had that extra 25% health.

Quick Feet isn't entirely bad, however. I say keep both, but of course randomize which set Linoone uses.

Also, this only works because Linoone has Gluttony. If there are other mons which could benefit from the Figy Berry buff, I'd like to know. But I think Linoone definitely deserves to benefit from this gimmick.
Currently Linoone has a random chance of either Quick Feet or Gluttony, and with Gluttony it always gets a random Figy Berry equivalent. We will look into whether or not the Quick Feet version should be removed or not, since it does help a little in dealing with paralysis.
 
#8
Currently Linoone has a random chance of either Quick Feet or Gluttony, and with Gluttony it always gets a random Figy Berry equivalent. We will look into whether or not the Quick Feet version should be removed or not, since it does help a little in dealing with paralysis.
Oh, my bad, I never knew that. And yeah, Quick Feet is good only situationally. It also helps when opponents use Toxic and then send out a faster ghost pokemon, which Quick Feet + Shadow Claw can handle. However, it's very niche.

Is there a place where we can see which items/abilities are randomized? Another Pokemon that could use Figy Berry is Wishiwashi, but I rarely get it so I don't know if it has one or not.
 

boltsandbombers

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#9

Cresselia without Moonlight is pretty bad imo, especially cm cress; cm toxic isnt really a set anyways. A set of moonlight / cm / psyshock / moonblast would be much better.
 

duck

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is a Battle Server Moderator
#10
Is there a place where we can see which items/abilities are randomized? Another Pokemon that could use Figy Berry is Wishiwashi, but I rarely get it so I don't know if it has one or not.
Yes in the link of the op you can find all the info you need. It's written like code, but you should be able to find the information you need.
Also Wishiwashi is okay with figi i guess, but this same thing could be applied to everything that is slow and hits hard IMO.
 
#12
Yes in the link of the op you can find all the info you need. It's written like code, but you should be able to find the information you need.
Also Wishiwashi is okay with figi i guess, but this same thing could be applied to everything that is slow and hits hard IMO.
But the thing with Wishiwashi is that it loses its School Form at 25% or less. More than any other pokemon, health is important for it.
 
#14
Got a Mega Scizor set with no Roost, no Swords Dance, and no Bullet Punch ?_? (also no U-turn but at least I got Bug Bite)

At the very least, i think M Scizor should always have Roost or ditch Pursuit.
 

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#16
Even if we don't ditch Pursuit, there is absolutely no reason why Pursuit and Knock Off should ever be on the same set. At least on non-Dark Pokemon, anyways. Weavile might be able to work with it, but definitely not something like Escavalier or Scizor.
 
#17
I want to start a petition to see whether Unown should be removed from Random Battles.

I believe that Unown is too far removed from the Standard set of Pokemon allowed to perform in the Random Battle Tier. An average Pokemon found on a team is either fully-evolved (ex: venusaur), a middle stage evolution holding Eviolite (ex: magneton), or a Pokemon that cannot evolve (ex: tauros).

These Pokemon also have access to 4 moves.

Unown can only learn 1 move, Hidden Power. The only Unown that Random Battle will ever give is an Unown (A) with Choice Specs and Hidden Power (Psychic). This Pokemon feels like an empty slot when on my team, and makes me feel like I'm playing with an overwhelming handicap.

I know that there is a list of Pokemon that will never show up on a random battle team (ex: baby pokemon and 1st stage pokemon), and I believe that Unown should fall into this category.
 
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duck

No, don't die!
is a Battle Server Moderator
#18
I want to start a petition to see whether Unown should be removed from Random Battles.

I believe that Unown is too far removed from the Standard set of Pokemon allowed to perform in the Random Battle Tier. An average Pokemon found on a team is either fully-evolved (ex: venusaur), a middle stage evolution holding Eviolite (ex: magneton), or a Pokemon that cannot evolve (ex: tauros).

These Pokemon also have access to 4 moves.

Unown can only learn 1 move, Hidden Power. The only Unown that Random Battle will ever give is an Unown (A) with Choice Specs and Hidden Power (Psychic). This Pokemon feels like an empty slot when on my team, and makes me feel like I'm playing with an overwhelming handicap.

I know that there are a list Pokemon that will never show up on a random battle team (ex: baby pokemon and 1st stage pokemon), and I believe that Unown should fall into this category.
Unown was recently re-added just to fullfill the "all full evolved mons should be there". I understand that he is really bad however, but i personally feel he should not be removed.
 
#19
Unown was recently re-added just to fullfill the "all full evolved mons should be there". I understand that he is really bad however, but i personally feel he should not be removed.
I'm sorry, but could you elaborate on why you believe that Unown should not be removed?

Also, would I be able to post a strawpoll for this? I really do want to start a petition.
 

duck

No, don't die!
is a Battle Server Moderator
#20
I'm sorry, but could you elaborate on why you believe that Unown should not be removed?

Also, would I be able to post a strawpoll for this? I really do want to start a petition.
Because he is a fully evolved pokemon and this is enough. I know it is shit even at level 100 however, I may try to look into this and try to make it slightly better.
However don't do a poll, this thread is more than enough room to talk about this.
 
#21
Because he is a fully evolved pokemon and this is enough. I know it is shit even at level 100 however, I may try to look into this and try to make it slightly better.
However don't do a poll, this thread is more than enough room to talk about this.
okay, i'll take the consideration. thank you.
 
#23
Echoing what's been said of Cresselia, some Pokémon just shouldn't be without recovery moves. The ones I remember are Lugia, Blissey, Chansey, Aromatisse, Florges... maybe Jellicent, too.

Kyurem (base one) is regularly shipped with too many Dragon moves. Dragon Pulse/Draco Meteor/Outrage all together are pretty redundant. Also, please no more AV Kingdra. Damp Rock/LO/Lefties all work but AV just does nothing.

(I apologize for the utter lack of screenshots. Might take them from now on.)

I once got a Life Orb Bronzong, but that might have been Gen. VI. I still see that thing in nightmares, though.
 

Punchshroom

Paralysis is slightly less of a devil
is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
#24
This whole issue about bulky mons not having any recovery might mandate the use of 'mandatory moves', like how most offensive Pokemon are (as far as I know) never seen without their STAB, although there are some cases where mons are only using one of their perfectly good dual STAB (ex: Iron Head + Brick Break SubSD Bisharp). Also I can't tell you how many times I got a Mega Slowbro without any recovery.

My proposed list of changes of mons (Part I):

Mega Blastoise: -Dragon Tail, +Dragon Pulse
Not sure why Mega Blastoise is intent on phasing when it has no passive recovery whatsoever and opts to forgo strong neutral coverage (which is pretty important in Randoms); the phasing business should just be left to regular Blastoise, especially seeing as Stoise has Roar while Mega Stoise does not.

Mega Beedrill: +Fell Stinger
If Swords Dance is an option on this in Randoms, I don't see why Fell Stinger shouldn't be either, particularly since MBee is arguably the single most effective user of this move.

Pidgeot: +Defog
Mega Pidgeot: +Hidden Power Grass, +Refresh, + Work Up, -Defog(? optional)

Why does MPidgeot have only 5 options for moves? And why does MPidgeot have the option to Defog but not regular Pidgeot? MPidgeot should at least have more freedom in its moveset, and the Defog thing just seems like a random inconsistency to me.

Raichu-Alola: +Surf, +Grass Knot
In addition to duck being on board with wanting Surf on AlolanRaichu to smack Grounds hard, I don't see why it shouldn't have Grass Knot as well.

Ninetales: +Pain Split
Given the presence of Will-O-Wisp, Substitute, and Nasty Plot on this set, as well as people's desire for Ninetales to have a bit more longevity as a weather setter, I see Pain Split having decent use on the majority of Random sets generated for Ninetales.

Ninetales-Alola: +Freeze-Dry, +Encore
Freeze-Dry adds some useful additional coverage on AlolanTales' repertoire, and is a generally annoying move to deal with in Randoms, especially coming from such a fast user. Encore is a neat move AlolanTales gets as well, and helps to circumvent setup sweepers looking to work around Aurora Veil.

Parasect: +Leech Life, -X-Scissor
Leech Life outclasses X-Scissor aside from superior PP, which is not really relevant in Randoms, plus it's not like Parasect can last anyway.

Dugtrio: +Memento
Dugtrio-Alola: +Memento, +Sucker Punch

Is there a reason why these two aren't running memento? In fact, I'm seeing a shortage of Memento users in Randbats in general; the only Memento users are the Grimer, Muk, Slugma (but not Magcargo), Mega Latios (but not regular Latios), and Whimsicott. Also Alolan Duggy really needs more moves lol

Persian-Alola: +Snarl
In addition to Foul Play and Parting Shot as per suggested by duck, I also think Snarl has potential for Alolan Persian's useful abilities; Fur Coat + Snarl go decently together while Technician Snarl is stronger than Dark Pulse, which can be useful for Nasty Plot Alolan Persian.

Mega Alakazam: +Psychic
I noticed this absent from MZam's moves when Alakazam has both Psyshock and Psychic.

Victreebel: +Poison Jab, +Swords Dance(?), +Leaf Blade(?)
The use of Power Whip and Sucker Punch on the set means that a fully physical set could be viable (and has shown up from time to time on Random), so giving Victree its 2nd STAB is only fitting. There's also the option of adding SD and Leaf Blade to the set, but that's less something to address and more of a bonus than anything.

Tentacruel: +Ice Beam, +Giga Drain, +Dazzling Gleam
Since Random sets don't give fully optimized EV spreads, Tentacruel's moveset being catered towards defensive seems less than ideal, and I don't see why Tentacruel doesn't opt for more coverage moves to give itself a bit more offensive presence, as well as make use of its Speed.

Dewgong: +Whirlpool, +Disable
How can you expect this Perish Song set to work when u have zero methods of keeping them there? Disable is an option that synergizes with Perish Song and especially Encore.

Muk-Alola: +Memento
I don't see why Muk has this but Alolan Muk doesn't.

Cloyster: +Explosion
Synergizes well with both the Shell Smash set and the hazard control set.

Gengar: +Hex
Since Gengar has Wisp, Sub, Disable, and Pain Split, Hex could potentially fit nicely in there.

Exeggutor-Alola: +Giga Drain, +Leech Seed
Alolan Eggy's potential is pretty squandered by just giving it 4 moves, duck already suggested a physical set, so I'm just gonna toss in mentions of Giga Drain for a special STAB move that doesn't force Alolan Eggy out, and Leech Seed because Harvest shenanigans.

Marowak-Alola: -Flame Charge, +Fire Punch
Would like to suggest getting rid of Flame Charge since it's ass on such a slow mon and weak as Fire STAB, and replacing it with Fire Punch as the generally reliable Fire STAB, as having only Flare Blitz can be inconvenient for non-Rock Head AlolanWaks.

Mega Aerodactyl: +Earthquake
EQ is too good to pass up on this, especially how well it synergizes with its STABs.

Articuno: +Heal Bell
I know Cuno isn't the best Heal Bell user, but comparing its moveset with its fellow birds, Cuno doesn't have a standout support move, so I thought to just throw it a bone.

Mega Mewtwo X: -Ice Beam, +Ice Punch
Ice Punch is much more useful in Randoms while Ice Beam is needlessly selective.
 
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Punchshroom

Paralysis is slightly less of a devil
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#25
My proposed list of changes of mons (Part II):

Togekiss: +Dazzling Gleam, +Fire Blast
This gives Togekiss significantly more offensive options and presence, especially on sets without Thunder Wave.

Jumpluff: +Memento
Moar Memento users pls, plus Pluff's Speed makes it a decent user of it and pairs very well with Sleep Powder to force switches.

Yanmega: +Hidden Power Ground
Offers useful coverage against Steels.

Mismagius: +Mystical Fire
Probably an unnecessary suggestion, but it's not unhelpful coverage for Mismagius (akin to Thunderbolt) and is a decent way to showcase Mystical Fire's buff. The SpA drop can combo nicely with Will-O-Wisp for disruption as well.

Dunsparce: -Rock Slide, +Drill Run(?)
Not exactly sure what Rock Slide does for Dunsparce compared to its other moves which serve a distinct and important purpose. If you're insistent on including Rock Slide to showcase Dunsparce's flinching factor, then u might as well incorporate the other flinching moves it gets while you're at it, like Zen Headbutt and Dragon Rush. If you intend to make Dunsparce a bit more well-rounded as opposed to sticking to its flinching role, then Drill Run gives Dunsparce a better matchup against Rocks and Steels at least.

Granbull: -Crunch, +Fire Punch
Fairy + Ground coverage is great enough on its own, so Crunch seems really out of place in terms of what it can hit. Fire Punch can at least hit the remainder of Pokemon that can shrug off that coverage, like Skarm and Forretress, while still hitting Bronzong.

Qwilfish: +Poison Jab
Like Tentacruel, the Random sets' EV spreads mean that the moveset doesn't always cater to its stat distribution, and Randoms Qwilfish has just enough offensive kick that it just feels like a waste that it doesn't have access to its secondary STAB, which would allow it to offensively check Grasses and Fairies and the like.

Magcargo: +Yawn, +Memento
Randoms Magcargo is really underwhelming in general and it won't see too much improvement from move suggestions, but it's better than leaving it in its current state without 2 of the best momentum-grabbing moves in Randoms, right?

Corsola: +Head Smash, +Liquidation, +Earthquake
Say what you will about this, but there's no denying that Corsola technically has the means to finally pull off the physical set it wanted ever since it received Hustle. Moreover, with Hustle and Random's level scaling, this set can hit much harder than expected, and can be an unpleasant surprise for opponents who greatly look down on Corsola (which is the majority of them).

Octillery: -Rock Blast
Considering Octillery is historically known for having high powered attacks, Rock Blast just seems really out of place on a set like this, and usually just serves to get in the way of Octillery's best coverage moves in most situations.

Smeargle: +Nuzzle
This prevents Smeargle from being utter Taunt and Magic Bounce fodder, as well as giving it a way to threaten foes after they sacced a mon to Spore.

Sceptile: +Swords Dance, +Leaf Blade, +Earthquake, +Acrobatics, +Substitute
Mega Sceptile: -Substitute, +Leaf Storm

Not gonna lie; not too sure what's going on with Sceptile & MSceptile's movesets here. Why does Sceptile not have an SD set while MScept does? Why does Sceptile lack Sub when it has more obvious reasons to do so (Overgrow Giga Drain, pinch berry) compared to Mega Sceptile? Why does MSceptile not have Leaf Storm while Sceptile does?

Beautifly: +Hidden Power Ground
Not liking the fact that Beautifly has no way to hit Steels, especially when it doesn't have Tinted Lens; dunno why HP Rock took precedence over this.

Shiftry: +Explosion
Shiftry can make decent use of this, either as a surprise or used after +2 Atk to utterly brutalize something, and is helped by the fact that few Ghost- or Rock-types ever dare switch into Shiftry.

Swellow: +Boomburst, +Heat Wave, +Hurricane, +Hidden Power Grass
With its Special Attack buff, it goes without saying that Swellow demands a special Scrappy set this time around.

Ninjask: +Leech Life, -X-Scissor
X-Scissor is outclassed, and health gain is especially notable on a mon that spams Sub all the damn time. Btw, I'm not gonna suggest the same for Shedinja, since Leech Life can actually backfire on it in the presence of a Liquid Ooze mon.

Probopass: +Earth Power
Considering Probo occasionally gets Magnet Pull, it would want at least a way of hurting some of the Steels it traps. It also offers decent neutral coverage alongside its STABs in general.

Mega Sableye: +Knock Off, +Foul Play
It would probably be remiss to suggest to less experienced players that MSab has to play like a CM wincon all the time, as those two moves allow MSab to adopt a hit-and-run style and stick around for the match much more effectively.

Manectric-Mega: +Flamethrower
Seems odd that MMane would lack this additional option when Manectric has it.

Swalot: +Gunk Shot
Don't see why Swalot can't have this as an STAB option alongside Sludge Bomb, especially since this is Swalot's strongest neutral attack.

Flygon: +Defog
Considering its access to Roost as well as being one of the most hazard-resilient Pokemon in the game, I don't see Defog being a bad option on this, especially when you consider the quality of hazard removers Randoms tends to offer (fuking Lumineon and Armaldo >.<).

Crawdaunt: -Dragon Dance
Dragon Dance is like actually so bad on this due to its bad Speed tier, and is largely outdone by SD Jet in nearly every way. Sure DD could be nice on Crawdaunt sets without Jet, but by removing DD, you have better odds of hitting Jet out of 5 moves as opposed to the previous 6.

Armaldo: -Rapid Spin, +Earthquake
Instead of saddling Armaldo with a move it makes such poor use of, how about improving its neutral matchups, like not losing to nearly every Steel-type for starters? As it stands, most Steel-types are SR setters, which make Armaldo even worse at its current job.

Froslass: +Will-O-Wisp
Froslass has access to Wisp now, which should diversify its Spiking roles and general disruptive capabilities.

Walrein: +Super Fang
Since its current set is focused on it being a whittler, Super Fang should only help improve its efficiency.

Mega Metagross: +ThunderPunch, +Bullet Punch
TPunch wouldn't be a bad idea to hit bulky Waters and Steel/Flyings, and MMeta's reasonably strong priority is noteworthy.

Mega Latias: -Draco Meteor(?), +Stored Power(?)
Not too keen on the idea of Draco MLatias when its moveset is tailored towards it staying in battle for a long period of time (Sub, CM). You could drive that point home by adding Stored Power.

Latios: +Memento
Mega Latios: +Dragon Pulse, -Memento(?)

MLatios definitely wants Dragon Pulse as an alternate STAB; getting stuck with CM + Draco can get awkward. Also don't know why Latios isn't using Memento when it has less opportunity cost than MLatios.

Primal Groudon: +Fire Punch, -Overheat, +Swords Dance
I would've thought PDon would've gotten Fire Punch as a reliable Fire STAB (considering it outdamages Earthquake), especially on Rock Polish sets. I've found Overheat to be very inconvenient on both the SR sets (prefer Lava Plume) and the Rock Polish sets (prefer Fire STAB that doesn't force it out). Also puzzling why PDon is lacking Swords Dance while Groudon gets it.

ascriptmaster, duly noted, edited Tentacruel & Yanma suggestions
 
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