Potential Changes to WCoP

Status
Not open for further replies.
Now that the dust has settled over the format finally (big thanks to the TDs for being so receptive to it all), my team needs to address issue; US West not being able to grandfather in dice. I've had short discussions with ABR and Hogg, and it seems as if they are completely opposed to us being able to keep our teammate under the premise that




However -- this just makes no sense. US West is not a new team. We have the same name as every year before, we have at least 75% of the same players as years before, we have the same boundaries as years before (+3 states… which hold no players who we plan to add to our 2018 lineup). The other 3 US teams are what different teams look like. New boundaries, new team names, new lineups. There is no reason why US West would or should be treated as a new team, because it isn't. Will France/Canada be allowed to continue fostering McMeghan/Blunder (2 players who have less reason to be on their respective teams than dice does, but that's not my current point)? They will be able to, because they aren't a “New team”.


But why is this? Why is our team, which isn't changing whatsoever from past years, a new team, while France and Canada are not? There are no factors at play that make US West a new team. Dice does have a team to be grandfathered into: the team that he had played on for 5 years and previously captained. The team representing the region that our player was born in (https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/the-world-cup-of-pokémon-ix-sign-ups-read-post-322-and-463.3508134/page-24#post-5525857 evidence here if needed)


Our team is effectively being hand-picked to not allow old players to be grandfathered, and I can show that with this. Last year, when afrabs disbanded and changed Asia’s boundaries by allowing afrabs players to play for Asia, Asia still was allowed to keep their grandfathered players such as Whitequeen. Asia with their immense new boundaries and large amount of new players was an actual new team. So... it seems like this should be a basic precedent to follow, and it woud be absurd of us to not also be able to retain our player given these circumstancs when Asia was in the same boat last year. I'm not accusing the TD team of having some prejudice/bias/whatever against my team, but the rules and guidelines need to be the same for everyone.


Please either let us continue to grandfather in our teammate(s) and keep the tournament fair or remove the ability for any team to grandfather weak eligbility players. Having the TDs pick and choose who gets to play the rules each year seems silly, particularly when something such as this specific case is very straight forward about what should happen. Something also worth nothing is that this could very well effect other teams in near years to come, with how rapidly-changing wcop is every year. This is particularly addressed to the other American captains/European teams.


TL;DR: dice should be allowed on west. (other grandfathered players should be allowed to play on their “new team” if the team is the same)
 

Luigi

is a Tournament Directoris a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris the Smogon Tour Season 27 Championis a defending SPL Champion
Tour Commissioner
Now that the dust has settled over the format finally (big thanks to the TDs for being so receptive to it all), my team needs to address issue; US West not being able to grandfather in dice. I've had short discussions with ABR and Hogg, and it seems as if they are completely opposed to us being able to keep our teammate under the premise that




However -- this just makes no sense. US West is not a new team. We have the same name as every year before, we have at least 75% of the same players as years before, we have the same boundaries as years before (+3 states… which hold no players who we plan to add to our 2018 lineup). The other 3 US teams are what different teams look like. New boundaries, new team names, new lineups. There is no reason why US West would or should be treated as a new team, because it isn't. Will France/Canada be allowed to continue fostering McMeghan/Blunder (2 players who have less reason to be on their respective teams than dice does, but that's not my current point)? They will be able to, because they aren't a “New team”.


But why is this? Why is our team, which isn't changing whatsoever from past years, a new team, while France and Canada are not? There are no factors at play that make US West a new team. Dice does have a team to be grandfathered into: the team that he had played on for 5 years and previously captained. The team representing the region that our player was born in (https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/the-world-cup-of-pokémon-ix-sign-ups-read-post-322-and-463.3508134/page-24#post-5525857 evidence here if needed)


Our team is effectively being hand-picked to not allow old players to be grandfathered, and I can show that with this. Last year, when afrabs disbanded and changed Asia’s boundaries by allowing afrabs players to play for Asia, Asia still was allowed to keep their grandfathered players such as Whitequeen. Asia with their immense new boundaries and large amount of new players was an actual new team. So... it seems like this should be a basic precedent to follow, and it woud be absurd of us to not also be able to retain our player given these circumstancs when Asia was in the same boat last year. I'm not accusing the TD team of having some prejudice/bias/whatever against my team, but the rules and guidelines need to be the same for everyone.


Please either let us continue to grandfather in our teammate(s) and keep the tournament fair or remove the ability for any team to grandfather weak eligbility players. Having the TDs pick and choose who gets to play the rules each year seems silly, particularly when something such as this specific case is very straight forward about what should happen. Something also worth nothing is that this could very well effect other teams in near years to come, with how rapidly-changing wcop is every year. This is particularly addressed to the other American captains/European teams.


TL;DR: dice should be allowed on west. (other grandfathered players should be allowed to play on their “new team” if the team is the same)
All the US teams that existed in WCOP 2017 and earlier years don't exist anymore.

The team that represented the US West coast in previous years being called US West and the census region which will define the boundaries for the western coast of the US in this year's WCOP also being called US West and the fact that most of the roster might be the same is entirely coincidental and not a reason to pretend it's the same team. If the US Census Bureau had named it Western instead of West would you be making this argument? If you planned to include new players from the 3 states that got added to the "new" West would you be making this argument?

The decision with regards to Asia and Afrabs is entirely different than this case, that was a team dissolving and being absorbed into a different team, this is a team being extinguished by the tournament directors as a result of a redrawing of the map. It has been deliberately decided that all the old US teams don't exist anymore. You can't be grandfathered into a team if it's the team's first year in the tournament.

We're by no means picking which teams get to keep grandfathering. If you played for your team last year you can be grandfathered into it. This is not the case for dice, who played for a team with a similar name and roster to a team that'll exist this year.

And before you ask, how come the 4 new US teams get to be in the tournament while other "new" teams need to qualify? They are being equally grandfathered in to replace the 4 US teams that were deleted. How come West gets to inherit a spot in WCOP but not it's grandfathered players? This is because a slot in WCOP is equal to any other slot in WCOP, unlike rosters which change between teams. Sure "New West" is similar in name to "Old West" so it's easy to say they should inherit the players from Old West but then who inherits the players from Metro, East and Central? Surely you don't think West should be treated differently just by virtue of having a similar name.

Also, this thread has served its purpose so i'll be locking it. If you have individual eligibility inquiries feel free to pm any tournament director.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top