Resource PU Simple Question, Simple Answers Thread

#51
Is Type:Null minimally good or is it completely out-shined by its evolution?
It is bulkier than Silvally but the lack of reliable recovery and the poor defensive typing leave it overall lacklustre as a wall. I've seen people use an SD RestTalk set with OK results, but I still prefer Gurdurr and Munchlax as bulky physical sweepers. Silvally is for the most part better
 

Megazard

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#52
Is Type:Null minimally good or is it completely out-shined by its evolution?
It is bulkier than Silvally but the lack of reliable recovery and the poor defensive typing leave it overall lacklustre as a wall. I've seen people use an SD RestTalk set with OK results, but I still prefer Gurdurr and Munchlax as bulky physical sweepers. Silvally is for the most part better
Can't say I agree with this at all. Type Null is a strong competitor in the same way that Vigorth and Munchlax were last gen/are this gen. Munchlax has resists, Vigoroth has speed/reliable recovery/taunt, but Type Null has an insane amount of bulk. Like, previously the go-to reference was that you could switch into both Tauros and Specs Vanilluxe, but now they're gone so the point is it's stupidly bulky. I think the Sd/Rest/Talk/Return set has a lot of merit, but Toxic or even Roar on a Spikes team both seem decent in theory. I'd post an EV spread for you too, but idk what to run now that the benchmark isn't Tauros and Vanilluxe.
 
#53
I see. So it runs a completely different set from it's evolution, mainly as a bulky-ass physical attacker. This is interesting as I was focusing more on its offensive properties rather than defensive ones. Thanks!
 
#54
I see. So it runs a completely different set from it's evolution, mainly as a bulky-ass physical attacker. This is interesting as I was focusing more on its offensive properties rather than defensive ones. Thanks!
Yeah, so Type:Null generally wants to run a bulkier set due to both it and it's evolution having the same defensive benchmarks of 95, giving you 236 as a stat uninvested, but then due to the access of Eviolite, Type:Null is able to boost it's defenses up to 339 invested, meaning you can either take it physically or specially (or mixed), and fortify it's defenses even further. Because of this, a Rest Talk set that nullifies status such as Toxic (from the omnipresent toxic spikes) and burns fits much better on Type: Null than it's evolution, Silvally. On the other hand, Silvally's increased speed tier at 95 allowing it to hit 317 and tie things such as Jynx and outspeed 80's hint towards a much more offensive set, and Silvally still has decent bulk on top of it's hard hitting attacks. Silvally also allows you to choose what fits into your team the best, for example if you need a spinblocker than Silv-Ghost fits well, or if you need an answer to pursuit trappers and dark types in general, Silv-Fairy fits very well. Because of this, a set focused on All out Attacking, or a Toxic or Twave/Multi Attack/Swords Dance/Parting Shot set works very well to gain momentum on your team as well as spread status.

 
#55
What are the roles I need to worry about in this tier?

So far I'm thinking hazard support
Something to suck up knock off
Scarf user unless I want a really proactive stall build
Something that can suck up T-spikes(could be kola spinner)
A dark type
And even for a stall team I think I'd want some form of momentum at times by switch based moves

I haven't played in a long time cause ou disappointed me after meta shifts from metagross banning and last when time in oh I only played zangoose, gravity, and an explosion team that was more funny and ending in losing draws than good

I've been messing with marcago paired with tortiterra because their type combo and support is amazing. But been playing marcago as a rapid spin, knock off, physical contact switch in running Rocky helmet/flame body recover and refresh spreading burns, chip and rocks.

Probably as vaible as furret but I wanna mess with it more till I'm crushed. Low ladder has been decent so far

Bare bones on teams in this tier/crappy snail monster?
 
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Megazard

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PU Leader
#57
What are the roles I need to worry about in this tier?

So far I'm thinking hazard support
Something to suck up knock off
Scarf user unless I want a really proactive stall build
Something that can suck up T-spikes(could be kola spinner)
A dark type
And even for a stall team I think I'd want some form of momentum at times by switch based moves

I haven't played in a long time cause ou disappointed me after meta shifts from metagross banning and last when time in oh I only played zangoose, gravity, and an explosion team that was more funny and ending in losing draws than good

I've been messing with marcago paired with tortiterra because their type combo and support is amazing. But been playing marcago as a rapid spin, knock off, physical contact switch in running Rocky helmet/flame body recover and refresh spreading burns, chip and rocks.

Probably as vaible as furret but I wanna mess with it more till I'm crushed. Low ladder has been decent so far

Bare bones on teams in this tier/crappy snail monster?
Knock Off absorber idk, in general you want to have Dark resists but knock itself is a little overly specific imo. Dark types are far from mandatory though, Musharna checks are not limited to Darks if that's the idea you had behind that. I'd say that other than rocks/removal you're just looking to check the top threats like in any tier. Making sure your team can handle mons like Archeops, Musharna, Charizard, Gurdurr, etc. may be obvious but that doesn't mean it's easy to do. I wouldn't recommend Magcargo either but the post said you weren't concerned with it being terrible so by all means.
When does the initial tier list come out?
I assume you mean viability rankings? We have a tier list already, that's just the list of mons that are allowed in PU. Since idt we've announced anything anywhere, EXPECT VR TO COME IN A WEEK TOPS I HOPE MAYBE
 
#58
What are the roles I need to worry about in this tier?

So far I'm thinking hazard support

Sandslash can set up Stealth Rock and remove it with Rapid Spin. Qwilfish can set up Spikes and Toxic Spikes - it also has Taunt and Explosion to prevent opposing Defogs and Rapid Spins. Hitmonchan and Komala can both Spin hazards away - I prefer the latter as Comatose makes it immune to Toxic Spikes.

Something to suck up knock off

Bulky Z crystal users in general are good at this. Z-Heal Bell Granbull and Z-Haze Weezing have great bulk - the former also resists Dark types.

Scarf user unless I want a really proactive stall build

Primeape is a great choice - fast, resists Stealth Rock and has U-turn. While it will probably be banned soon, Medicham works well too - epic power thanks to Pure Power, decent Speed, great move pool and access to Trick to cripple Sableye.

Something that can suck up T-spikes(could be kola spinner)

Qwilfish and Skuntank

A dark type

Skuntank, Shiftry, Absol (I think, can't remember if it moved up)

And even for a stall team I think I'd want some form of momentum at times by switch based moves

Again Primeape is a good U-turn user.
Lanturn's a great Volt Switch user - most ground types won't switch in as they won't want to risk eating a STAB Scald / Hydro Pump.


I haven't played in a long time cause ou disappointed me after meta shifts from metagross banning and last when time in oh I only played zangoose, gravity, and an explosion team that was more funny and ending in losing draws than good

I've been messing with marcago paired with tortiterra because their type combo and support is amazing. But been playing marcago as a rapid spin, knock off, physical contact switch in running Rocky helmet/flame body recover and refresh spreading burns, chip and rocks.

Probably as vaible as furret but I wanna mess with it more till I'm crushed. Low ladder has been decent so far

Bare bones on teams in this tier/crappy snail monster?
Replies in Bold
 
#59
I loved scarf primape from last gen, it definitely is a great way to clean up a match and its tricky to predict at times, but mespite just dropped again and wanted to try it out because it has just a sickening amount of great options even if primape is overall the better scarf user

Tier threats are great to know, I was mostly wondering about guidelines for pu teams, like ou You basically don't have a vaible team if You have no steels most of the time
 
#60
I loved scarf primape from last gen, it definitely is a great way to clean up a match and its tricky to predict at times, but mespite just dropped again and wanted to try it out because it has just a sickening amount of great options even if primape is overall the better scarf user

Tier threats are great to know, I was mostly wondering about guidelines for pu teams, like ou You basically don't have a vaible team if You have no steels most of the time
That obviously depends on what type of team you're building because different styles of teams need different things. For example, Hyper Offense doesn't really need switch ins for anything whereas Stall or Semi-Stall wants checks or counters to most of the meta.

Other than that, some things to take note of when teambuilding on archetypes such as Balance which are pretty crucial are:

- Stealth Rocks
- Hazard Control (i.e. Defog/Rapid Spin)
- Volt Switch absorber
- Revenge Killer (i.e. Choice Scarfer/Fast mon)
- Stallbreaker
- T-spikes absorber (mainly due to the prevelance of Weezing and Qwilfish)

These are some pretty good roles to try and fill when teambuilding. For more information check out this thread which contains a Role Compedium, Speed Tiers and Threat list: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/pu-resources-thread.3611496/#post-7463107

Hope this helps!
 

Cheryl.

Celesteela is Life
#61
Has anyone used Bouffalant at all in this new PU? I think it could be useful as a Grass check that also has reasonable offensive presence with moves like SD.
 
#62
Like it can hit hard and has bulk, but it's not something I'd call reliable outside of maybe a neato trick room member to double down on it's best traits but sawsbuck has a much better speed tier to fill more roles besides forces a grass switch at cost of 10 base power and bulk, but has some recovery in leech horn

Like looking into decent normal types on paper You realize everything is fighting over niches and trying not to drown in the tier

I'd compare it to a worse choice band arron if You wanted it banded and bulky
 
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#64
Has anyone used Bouffalant at all in this new PU? I think it could be useful as a Grass check that also has reasonable offensive presence with moves like SD.
Not really, there really isnt a reason to use it at the moment as its subpar and is kinda outclassed by Type-Null or even Miltank in terms of bulk.

Like it can hit hard and has bulk, but it's not something I'd call reliable outside of maybe a neato trick room member to double down on it's best traits but sawsbuck has a much better speed tier to fill more roles besides forces a grass switch at cost of 10 base power and bulk, but has some recovery in leech horn

Like looking into decent normal types on paper You realize everything is fighting over niches and trying not to drown in the tier

I'd compare it to a worse choice band arron if You wanted it banded and bulky
Sawsbuck isnt really relevant, and better normal consist of Stout/Kang/Goose anyway. But to answer his question, like I said Miltank or Type-Null are better options

Is there a possibility of doing ZU again this generation?
Probably not, but this isnt the best place to ask either. Try their discord imo https://discord.gg/UEFW4F
 
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#65
Bouffalant is not outclassed by Type:Null. The former has better Speed, better abilities, more power and can actually damage Steel types and Rock types as it has Earthquake. All Type:Null has going for it is its awesome bulk, but with Knock Off being so common its still not that effective.
 
#68
1. How does Haunter do in this metagame?
2. When are viability rankings coming out?
Haunter is decent in this meta, being a strong and decently fast ghost, but struggles with the amount of Darks present. Also, Megazard said this above but the VR should be out in a couple of days.

Also, when will the resources thread be updated with the new shifts?
 
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Twix

this is thriller
is a Contributor to Smogon
#70
What are Pidgeot's and Fearow's niches in this meta? Surprised to see them so high on the VR.
due to the lack of Pokemon with Normal/Flying typing (rip Dodrio) Pidgeot and Fearow carve out their niches attempting to pick up the pieces. Personally, I have used Fearow to pretty good success, and like how it has access to both Flying/Normal STABs, U-turn, and Ground-type coverage in Drill Run. Additionally, it has a really solid Speed tier of 100. I have not used Pidgeot personally, though I'd imagine it's used mainly for Heat Wave + Supersonic Skystrike as well as U-turn. I am not sure how it distinguishes itself from Archeops other than better defensive typing, more bulk, and non-crippling ability.
 

Twix

this is thriller
is a Contributor to Smogon
#72
How much less does Farfetch'd suck with the quite big attack buff this gen?
Even with the buffs and the loss of Dodrio, Farfetch'd has not really gained any viability in the PU metagame. It's slow, frail, and still generally weak, leaving it outclassed by Flying-types such as Archeops, Normal-types such as Kangaskhan and Zangoose, and Normal/Flying-types such as Dodrio.
 
#73
Z-mirror move pidgeot is a cool way to get a boost and a has better bulk and speed to use it, but it has return, brave bird(Or wing attack), and steel wing and that's all, i' d just pray to switch in on an earthquake to kill rock/steel Pokemon
 
#75
How is Toucannon B- rank when its slow and can't even touch steel types?
If you believe a mon is out of place for any reason, I'd recommend nominating it on the viability rankings list for either a raise or drop. To answer the question though, there aren't that many steel types used in pu, especially with klinklang leaving, and it can rely on its teammates to break common checks if needed. It's also got decent coverage, access to skill link with suitable moves to utilise it and even a niche special set that can utilise boomburst.
zard edit: actually, this is a fine place to ask about an individual ranking. Also, it learns overheat
 
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