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Ultimate fighting counter for both Throh and Gurdurr, thanks to infiltrator throh cant hide at all. Strengh sap denys its bulk ups and leech seed alone chips it down really fast. Basically lets you have a free sub and keep leech seeding what ever comes in
Musharna @ Fairium Z
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind - Moonlight
- Psychic
- Dazzling Gleam
Musharna can come in on Throh even on a Knock off as Musharna is Fairium Z and doesn't have to fear massive damage .
It also can come in on a Bulk Up behind a Sub as Psychic will break the Sub easily, same mention goes to Dazzling Gleam.
Furthermore Musharna can pressure Throh to Substitute all over again in the long run thus making it that Throh is left with little HP
meaning It can't Sub again. Musharna can then proceed to OHKO it with either Dazzling Gleam or its STAB move Psychic.
Furthermore Musharna has Moonlight, means it can come in on any point of Throh and can stay healthy during that process of pressuring Throh.
Musharna is a pokémon the Throh User have to keep in mind during the game as Musharna can easily wall Throh during the long run
making Musharna a good counter to that fighting-type mon in Throh.
Calcs:
8 SpA Musharna Psychic vs. 128 HP / 148 SpD Throh: 204-240 (49.3 - 58.1%) -- 96.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
8 SpA Musharna Dazzling Gleam vs. 128 HP / 148 SpD Throh: 120-142 (29 - 34.3%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
8 SpA Musharna Twinkle Tackle (160 BP) vs. 128 HP / 148 SpD Throh: 238-282 (57.6 - 68.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
+1 8 SpA Musharna Psychic vs. 128 HP / 148 SpD Throh: 302-356 (73.1 - 86.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
+1 8 SpA Musharna Dazzling Gleam vs. 128 HP / 148 SpD Throh: 180-212 (43.5 - 51.3%) -- 4.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
+1 8 SpA Musharna Twinkle Tackle (160 BP) vs. 128 HP / 148 SpD Throh: 358-422 (86.6 - 102.1%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Storm Throw vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Musharna on a critical hit: 39-47 (8.9 - 10.8%) -- possible 9HKO after Stealth Rock
0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Knock Off vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Musharna: 76-90 (17.4 - 20.6%) -- possible 5HKO after Stealth Rock
+1 0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Storm Throw vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Musharna on a critical hit: 59-69 (13.5 - 15.8%) -- possible 6HKO after Stealth Rock
+1 0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Knock Off vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Musharna: 112-134 (25.7 - 30.8%) -- 13.2% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock
+2 0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Storm Throw vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Musharna on a critical hit: 78-92 (17.9 - 21.1%) -- guaranteed 5HKO after Stealth Rock
+2 0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Knock Off vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Musharna: 150-178 (34.4 - 40.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
Bulky Swords Dance Scyther can use Throh as set up fodder, as it 4X resists Storm Throw and shrugs off Knock Off. If Throh tries to set up alongside it, Technician boosted STAB Aerial Ace will make sure it loses. Overall Scyther is a strong Counter to Throh.
0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Scyther: 56-67 (16.3 - 19.5%) -- possible 6HKO
0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Knock Off vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Scyther: 56-67 (16.3 - 19.5%) -- possible 6HKO
0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Storm Throw vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Scyther on a critical hit: 29-34 (8.4 - 9.9%) -- possibly the worst move ever
8 Atk Technician Scyther Aerial Ace vs. 128 HP / 104+ Def Throh: 198-234 (47.9 - 56.6%) -- 32% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 8 Atk Technician Scyther Aerial Ace vs. 128 HP / 104+ Def Throh: 390-462 (94.4 - 111.8%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
future sight is a very interesting option and i've been enjoying it a lot recently. anyway, the future sight mechanic means that you hit last, which means musharna can break throh's substitute with dazzling gleam for the latter to take some big damage from future sight. also, knock off doesnt even do that much at +1 because of the item, and musharna has moonlight, solid counter.
This one makes for a worthy counter, since it can dodge the Storm Throw, deal with a Knock Off thanks to the Colbur Berry, and even contest with Bulk Up's increased attack boost. Taunt pierces through substitute, preventing it from setting up any more substitutes or beefing up further. The speed investment helps outpace Throh's build. Scald's the way to go on the attack, and while it can't break the substitute the first time, it can still take 2 Knock Offs even at +1 to be able to keep preventing substitute setups, then cast Toxic to cut him down. Recovery's there as standard-issue to keep him fighting. It's a war of attrition, but it's one he CAN win
With Colbur Berry: 0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 224+ Def Colbur Berry Jellicent: 65-77 (16 - 19%) Without Colbur Berry: 0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 224+ Def Jellicent: 88-104 (21.7 - 25.7%) +1 with Colbur Berry: +1 0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 224+ Def Colbur Berry Jellicent: 97-115 (24 - 28.4%) +1 without Colbur Berry: +1 0 Atk Mold Breaker Throh Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 224+ Def Jellicent: 130-154 (32.1 - 38.1%)
This set is perfect for Counter fight-type pokes since it transfers substitutes is capable of catching ape scarf and capable of burning SubThroh and Hitmonchan, it does not receive a very noticeable damage with knock off thanks to the Z move and hits strong with Psychic and Stab Sinister He only has problems with Gurdurr but he can solve it well.
it is very important to enter the turn after the substitute to avoid the Bulk up set up and thus stop that threat soon with Will or wisp and Psychic Z, Spiritomb makes OHKO having the Z Move and then another Psychic and Sucker Punch with priority that will makes a good counter of Throh
Due to the loss of the beloved Poster Child of PU being Mesprit, this tier has had quite the difficulty recovering in terms of finding a new psychic type to rule the tier of the omnipresent fighting types. Naturally, because of this loss, fighting types have begun to reign supreme all over the tier and that would include the very intriguing set of Sub Bulk Up Throh. With this mon's incredible bulk and unique coverage with Storm Throw and Knock Off, most Psychic types have difficulty dealing with that coverage because they lack the power to revenge-kill Throh once it loses it's Substitute, or they will die to the Super-Effective Knock Off, even with a Colbur Berry aiding them.
However, with Mr. Mime's incredibly blessed new typing of Psychic + Fairy, it gains a neutrality to Dark, as well as a x4 resist to Fighting. This might not mean a whole lot in terms of a pivot to these offensive mon's because of Mr. Mime's abysmal HP and Def Base Stats, but with the proper usage of this mon, you might be able to get this guy out of Ash's mom's kitchen once in a while in preparations for a battle. As such, I would consider Mr. Mime a CHECK to Throh.
The reason this would be considered a check and not a counter to Throh, is because Mr. Mime, unless you are running Taunt or Encore, cannot simply stop the substitute + bulk up shenanigans from occurring. Mime can only reliably break the Substitute and then revenge-kill afterwards, or at least force Throh into a bevvy of continuous Subbing or force an attack, which will ultimately allow a healthy Mime to deal with a non-boosted Throh.
Although this particular Mr. Mime is not the most standard set it would like to run, being Choice Scarf because of it's access to Healing Wish that it's predecessor Mesprit had, a Z-Crystal allows Mr. Mime to take less damage from Throh's Knock Off; ultimately increasing this guy's likelihood of dealing with the mon from the dojo.
However, utilizing a Z-Crystal allows Mr. Mime to have a nice relevance in the meta, because of its access to the amazing boosting move Nasty Plot and its great coverage. You can almost always get a free boost if your opponent has a Drampa, so as long as you pair Mr. Mime with a nice revenge-killer for the speed control, going from the kitchen to a battlefield will be worthwhile for the experienced trainer.
This is yuppy. He is a simple Quagsire. He enjoys to switch in on Throh and use it as setup bait by cursing them out while being unaware of his foe's stat changes. He's a bulky fella and can seduce the foe with toxicity. He can also take out his red bull to recover half his health if need be, even nibbling on some leftovers while at it. Ah yuppy, you're quite the character.
Best check in existence. It's really difficult to find a good check that's not straight up a counter. So here we go using Oricorio-Sensu.
It comes in on the Fighting STAB, it chews the Knock Off once while it hurricanes the Sub and thaaan it Z-Hurricanes to ensure the KO on Throh! (And since Throh has to have around 86% due to Substitute chip and Leftovers recovery, it's a guaranteed kill as well!)
Dodrio @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Early Bird
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Jump Kick
- Swords Dance
- Quick Attack
Check. Stardard bird, has no problem breaking the sub, taking Storm Throw damage and removing the Throh behind it with Supersonic Skystrike. It doesn't even need the Z move for the kill, but it would faint to recoil damage without it, which is somewhat sad.
Granbull @ Normalium Z
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 212 HP / 252 Atk / 44 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Play Rough
- Earthquake
- Thunder Wave
- Heal Bell
Check. Had to scrape the bottom of the barrel for this one but it does work so I thank all of you for making my job tougher. First off, Intimidate takes effect right away even behind the sub. Throh will most likely click Bulk Up but it won't matter since Play Rough is just breaking the sub and hurting afterwards. Throh is going first here so, clicking Substitute will be pointless unless it's fishing for a miss. But other than that, Granbull should win the 1v1 here. Should Throh get Granbull low on HP, it can just get it all right back with Z-Heal Bell.
This Throh set was recently introduced on the Underrated and Creative Sets thread and it looks so good since it's able to set up on so much. Not to mention that once it gets going with Bulk Up, have fun trying to stop it or bring it down.
Honorable mentions: None (since I dug into the C mons for this)
Alright ladies and gents. We have a new Top Assassin this time around. Let's give a big hand and grats to jonago for winning the honors this time around with 17 points! While each and everyone one of you folks did an excellent job with your submissions, his were just better in this run. CONGRATS TO YOU JONAGO!!!!
This does conclude this season of victims. We are nearing closer to the end of Gen 7 but that does not mean the victims won't be around. Stick around, I will start up the next one within a few days!
