Other Rain In OU

[Kurona]

Guys; really, one trip to Bulbapedia as firehusky has done shows that Thunder and Hurricane can't break through protect .-. That's a relic from DP that's been removed ever since.

 

[firehusky]

I got this from Veekun:

During Rain Dance, this move has 100% accuracy. It also has a (100 - accuracy)% chance to break through the protection of Protect and Detect.

Thunder's accuracy without rain is 70%, so outside of rain it would have a 30% chance to break through protect. But with rain up, it's accuracy is 100%, so under rain it has a 0% chance to break through protect.

edit: so basically if you use Thunder in rain, you have perfect accuracy but no chance to break protect (if dr ciel's information is correct), and if you use it outside of Rain, it has poor accuracy but a chance to break through protect (assuming of course that dr ciels info is correct). So yeah even if it can break through protect outside of rain, it doesn't apply to using thunder in rain, which is kinda the whole point.

 

[DarkNostalgia]

I'll add Thundurus in.
Ludicolo isn't particularly viable, and I probably won't add it.
Seismitoad is interesting though, and it functions both in and outside of rain.

 

[Luckstard.]

• What other viable Pokemon are found on Rain as well*?

I don't see any mention of Metagross as breaker for rain teams while he can open the way to Kabutops easily by 2hkoing Slowbro with GK. Should be mentionned imo.

• How does Rain compare to other weather playstyles such as Sand?

Water spam is a huge threat, since the current water check are easy to break down (Lati@s, Rotom-W).

• Are Rain Stall or Hyper Offense archetypes viable as well?

I don't see how rainstall is viable. Rain Offense is imo the standard archetype when you use rain, you have, like Trick Room, a limited time to do a lot of damages with powerful stabbs.

• How has Rain been impacted with the introduction of Swampert?

Great sweeper, but as i said, metagross is also one of the new mega who gives rain cool possibilities.

 

[Enki]

Guess I'll dedicate my 600th post to my favorite playstyle here on OU

• What other viable Pokemon are found on Rain as well?

Well the OP already has a solid list of common Rain abusers/users but I would add Rotom-wash and Mega Manectric.

When i tend to use rain offense I always find myself a bit "overwhelmed" by the hyper offense "nature" of the playstyle, that's why I tend to add volturn in the equation, it gives the team more "control" of the game, and some volturn users do love rain support, an example would be Tornadus-Therian+Rotom-wash or Mega Manectric, who might even go with Thunder.
Though, Rotom-wash likes much more the rain due to Hydro Pump power, Rotom can also set up rain dance, and quickly volt switch to a Rain Abuser like say, Mega Swampert, Kabutops or Kingdra.

Hide

Rotom-W @ Damp Rock/Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 40 Def / 220 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Volt Switch
- Hydro Pump
- Rain Dance
- Will-O-Wisp

Damp rock gives rain more turns, leftovers give more of a "surprise" effect when I use Rain Dance, so it depends on the situations, Rotom has enough speed evs in order to outspeed and kill/burn Bisharp, which is a bit problematic to Rain Teams lacking Mega Heracross.

• What good partners are there to popular rain sweepers such as Swampert and Kingdra?

Politoed (duh), Rotom-wash as I mentioned already, Ferrothorn as a sr setter also helps them in order to score ohko or 2hko, and also has good defensive sinergy with them, Tornadus-Therian can act as a wallbreaker and weaken defensive cores for them, while also keeping up momentum, Mega Heracross/Mega Pinsir also acts as wallbreakers, Mega Scizor can set up on stuff used to check Kingdra and also likes the rain in case he finds itself against random hp fire users like Latios.

• How does Rain compare to other weather playstyles such as Sand?

I feel the question is a bit "bw-ish", sand teams do not exist anymore here in XY, it is more like a need for Hippowdon or Tyranitar's performance, or Excadrill, but they aren't builded as an archetype like rain, more like a stand-alone 'mon in the case of Hippowdon (which might even have Sand Force) or Tyranitar, or core in the case of Excadrill, an example would be teams used on the SPL/ST with both Mega Venusaur and Tyranitar in there, they aren't builded with sandstorm in mind, otherwise Venusaur would be a very strange pick due to its recovery, but more of a "need" for Tyranitar's qualities (and the sand sdef boost he gets in order to better check stuff like Latios).

• Are Rain Stall or Hyper Offense archetypes viable as well?

Rain Stall absolutely not, the drizzle nerf was fatal to them, Rain Hyper Offense yes, but you tend to give up some sort of "crowd control" like volturn and focusing on pressuring the opponent with powerful water/hurricane attacks. other powerful water attackers such as Kabutops or Omastar helps Swampert/Kingdra to soften up the opponent's team,

• How has Rain been impacted with the introduction of Swampert?

Definitely a great pwoer up, before, every rain teams needed at least something like Ferrothorn and various priority like say Aqua Jet Kabutops in order not to lose against Thundurus.

• Provide any replays of Rain teams in action

Uhh, let's not; I might get killed

• Provide any rain teams you have

Everything but the Rain (Team)
The name comes from Bleach, but it is also a reminder that rain is an unexpected playstyle which has a nightmare-ish (for them) matchup against some playstyles.

Hide

Politoed (M) @ Damp Rock
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump
- Icy Wind
- Encore
- Psychic



Ferrothorn (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SDef
IVs: 4 Spd
Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Stealth Rock
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip
- Gyro Ball



Swampert (M) @ Swampertite
Trait: Damp
EVs: 32 HP / 252 Atk / 224 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Power-Up Punch
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Ice Punch



Kabutops (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Waterfall
- Superpower
- Rapid Spin
- Stone Edge



Tornadus (Tornadus-T) (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Regenerator
EVs: 76 Atk / 180 SAtk / 252 Spd
Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
- Hurricane
- U-turn
- Superpower
- Taunt



Rotom-W @ Damp Rock
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 40 Def / 220 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Volt Switch
- Hydro Pump
- Rain Dance
- Will-O-Wisp


The teams is made from 3 frameworks: Parallel Sweepers, Support, Volturn.

Politoed and Ferrothorn acts as the support, Politoed with this spread has great chance to 2hko naive Mega Metagross with a combination of icy Wind, Hydro Pump and Stealth rocks (otherwise clean 2hko if gross came in two times with SR on the field/touched by Iron Barbs/Leech Seeded.)
Icy Wind also helps Encore, with the dropped speed I can Encore the set up sweeper, an example would be Nastypass/SDPass Celebi who gets trolled by it, offensive Mega Scizor, Sash SD Chomp, Tail Glow Manaphy, Calm Mind Keldeo and so on, the spread is your standard 252/252, but it requires 'Toed to be that, since you get to outspeed max speed Serperior after an icy Wind, and tie with Adamant Bisharp/Breloom, psychic is there to weaken Mega Venusaur on the switch, since in these last days he had an usage rise.
The Volturn Core helps me keeping momentum, while Rotom-wash also acts as a back up rain setter if by chance Politoed dies, tornadus-therian is also an excellent non-mega wallbreaker, and the fact that he gets to outspeed Scarf Tyranitar means that balance archetypes such as Slowbro, Gliscor, Ferrothorn Scarf Tyranitar etc have an hard time dealing with him, Superpower because really fuck Focus Blast, Rotom with this spread is a much needed Bisharp check, which imo is problematic for all rain teams without a powerful fight type faster than him like MHeracross.
Kabutops and MSwampert act as parallel sweepers, they share majority of their checks, as such one can weaken some of them while the other cleans up, Kabutops also acts as a spinner for the team, when the opponent only has Stealth Rocks it isn't really a big deal, but when you find yourself surrounded by Spikes or god forbid toxic Spikes you are in trouble, PUP Swampert is an underrated sweeper, due to MSwampert's natural bulk he can find many opportunities to set up a PUP, get a boost and then proceed to smash the opponent, for example at +1 you now get to always ohko common water resistant 'mons like keldeo and latios with Earthquake and ice Punch respectively

 

[azureleaf17]

It seems like the most successful rain teams in ORAS have at least one or two members that can function outside of the rain without the rain being a hindrance to them. It not only provides some insurance should Politoed go down early, but also means that Politoed is not the mandatory switch-in when eight turns of rain are up, relieving it of a lot of pressure. There was a popular rain RMT that was running Tornadus-T and Breloom as well as the usual cast of rain setters and sweepers that did really well; though both would prefer rain being up, they are absolutely not neutered without it.

Also important for rain is that you don't want battles to drag on. In general, the longer the battle goes for rain teams, the more their chances of winning decrease. Sweepers need to be capable of massive damage without setting up, and losing momentum and being forced to switch is usually pretty bad, wasting valuable turns of rain and putting more pressure on Politoed, who would prefer not to be getting hit with its merely passable defenses.

 

[xSilentDeviL]

Guess I'll dedicate my 600th post to my favorite playstyle here on OU

• What other viable Pokemon are found on Rain as well?

Well the OP already has a solid list of common Rain abusers/users but I would add Rotom-wash and Mega Manectric.

When i tend to use rain offense I always find myself a bit "overwhelmed" by the hyper offense "nature" of the playstyle, that's why I tend to add volturn in the equation, it gives the team more "control" of the game, and some volturn users do love rain support, an example would be Tornadus-Therian+Rotom-wash or Mega Manectric, who might even go with Thunder.
Though, Rotom-wash likes much more the rain due to Hydro Pump power, Rotom can also set up rain dance, and quickly volt switch to a Rain Abuser like say, Mega Swampert, Kabutops or Kingdra.

You clearly have a lot of experience with rain teams in OU. I would just add Raikou as an option next to Mega Magnetric. Raikou does a lot of similar things, while freeing the Mega slot allowing the use of powerful Rain abusers such as MSwampert and MScizor. MegaMan also has his awesome fire coverage weakened when under the rain which sucks. Mega Man is, however, better against birdspam and other physical threats with intimidate, while also having greater speed and special attack. Raikou is specially bulkier when equipped with an AV to handle Rain team threats like opposing Thundurus, and can run a pretty cool Specs set and CM set. Just thought I would add on to your great post :)

 

[Ninj4 Pikachu]

It seems like the most successful rain teams in ORAS have at least one or two members that can function outside of the rain without the rain being a hindrance to them. It not only provides some insurance should Politoed go down early, but also means that Politoed is not the mandatory switch-in when eight turns of rain are up, relieving it of a lot of pressure. There was a popular rain RMT that was running Tornadus-T and Breloom as well as the usual cast of rain setters and sweepers that did really well; though both would prefer rain being up, they are absolutely not neutered without it.

Also important for rain is that you don't want battles to drag on. In general, the longer the battle goes for rain teams, the more their chances of winning decrease. Sweepers need to be capable of massive damage without setting up, and losing momentum and being forced to switch is usually pretty bad, wasting valuable turns of rain and putting more pressure on Politoed, who would prefer not to be getting hit with its merely passable defenses.

These things are very true of any weather whether that weather be your weather or your opponents weather. The important thing to remember is that whether the weather is the weather to be weathering at that time is dependent on the pokemon out, and whether it can function with or without the weather or whether that is the whether to be weathering at the given time. My solution to this is to have at least 3 pkmn that can weather the weather whether or not it is the optimal weather to be weathering. In simpler words, i would rather not have a weather team but a weather inclined team. This way whether the weather is your weather or your opponents weather or no weather at all your team can weather the battle whether any of these conditions are present....

So have a team that likes rain but can work with or without it. This seems to be the best way to approach a rain stall or balanced team. That way whether the battle has long passed the point at which you can set up rain, you can still function. Rain dosent have to be your rise and fall, just a boon that turns your stall team into a balanced team with the boosted power you get from the water attacks. I feel like people go all or nothing in weathers and you can just dip your legs in so you arent so dependent. The key to weather is momentum and setting the weather slows it down. With this plan you can set the weather at your leisure or when you want to sweep.

 

[firehusky]

Uh can you like actually put the first paragraph into english please? My head is kind of hurting right now after I read your post like 4 times and I still don't get what the first paragraph means.

 

[Ninj4 Pikachu]

Uh can you like actually put the first paragraph into english please? My head is kind of hurting right now after I read your post like 4 times and I still don't get what the first paragraph means.

That's what the second paragraph is for. It's basically the same thing but not funny.

 

[firehusky]

That's what the second paragraph is for. It's basically the same thing but not funny.

Then I'd recommend removing the first paragraph. It adds nothing really, and is probably just going to make the reader more confused.

 

[Ninj4 Pikachu]

Then I'd recommend removing the first paragraph. It adds nothing really, and is probably just going to make the reader more confused.

Well if you read carefully it does make sense. I just figured it would be funny and ppl would enjoy it. I'm sry you diddnt find it funny. I did try to make a good point though. If it bothers you that much I will take it down but I see no harm.

Anyways I think I did present a viable way to run rain stall or rain balance. I would love to hear feedback on that.

 

[Kermit the Frog]

Thunder's accuracy without rain is 70%, so outside of rain it would have a 30% chance to break through protect. But with rain up, it's accuracy is 100%, so under rain it has a 0% chance to break through protect.

edit: so basically if you use Thunder in rain, you have perfect accuracy but no chance to break protect (if dr ciel's information is correct), and if you use it outside of Rain, it has poor accuracy but a chance to break through protect (assuming of course that dr ciels info is correct). So yeah even if it can break through protect outside of rain, it doesn't apply to using thunder in rain, which is kinda the whole point.

Yea my bad about my earlier post I briefly saw it on Serebii and went with it. Didn't mean to cause a shit storm. I will do more research next time before I post.

 

[DarkNostalgia]

It's fine, don't shit yourself over it :]
What's the ideal moveset for RD Thundurus? It sounds cool and I'll probably add it to the OP. I'll add like a section on 'alternate swift swimmers' too.

 

[Kermit the Frog]

It seems like the most successful rain teams in ORAS have at least one or two members that can function outside of the rain without the rain being a hindrance to them.

In regards to rain in OU it has been my go to team for a while and it has worked well for me. However if you are a new-b like myself I would be cautious when building a rain team because there are tons of great mon's that work well in the rain. It is easy to over centralize causing your team to get walled. Also if you are playing against someone and god forbid they kill your Politoed early on then switch in Charizard -Y or Tyranitar with sand stream you could be in some serious shit if your team is not build right(Not that that’s ever happened to me…lol). I would strongly recommend like azureleaf17 said to have other members of your team that function outside the rain like M-Heracross, M-Gross, Thundurus, Scizor just a few to mention.

With my team I set up rocks with Ferrothorn if I am in fear of focus sash or sturdy to stop my sweep. Switch in to Politoed to get the rain going depending upon my first decision, or start with Politoed to get the rain going perish song then protect almost always causes your opponent to switch out. Allowing you to switch in Azumarrill safely Belly Drum then sweep there entire team with Aqua-Jet. Azumarill is an absolute monster in the rain if you can set up. This has worked for me countless times winning 6 and 0. If I feel like there on to me trying to set up I switch in M-gross and tear apart most Azumarrill checks and counters.

I think that stall is kind of pointless with rain due to the fact that rain runs out in 8 turns and in my opinion I would prefer to use the brute force and blistering speed that rain can provide to certain Pokémon and just clean up quickly. The longer that the game seems to last the more difficult it is to win, at least that’s been my experience. Overall rain teams can be very powerful if you do it right I highly suggest them.

By the way this is only my 7th post hopefully I posted the quote correctly if not please PM me I will try to fix it.

 

[firehusky]

It's fine, don't shit yourself over it :]
What's the ideal moveset for RD Thundurus? It sounds cool and I'll probably add it to the OP. I'll add like a section on 'alternate swift swimmers' too.

Thundurus @ Damp Rock
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt / Thunder
- Hidden Power Ice
- Thunder Wave
- Rain Dance

Slashed Thunder after Thunderbolt, because in some cases Pokemon are weakened enough that HP Ice can't KO them, but you don't want to risk Thunder missing. Also more reliable for checking birds outside of rain. Acts as a great emergency rain setter in case Politoed faints or whatever.

 

[Kermit the Frog]

It's fine, don't shit yourself over it :]
What's the ideal moveset for RD Thundurus? It sounds cool and I'll probably add it to the OP. I'll add like a section on 'alternate swift swimmers' too.

So for Thundurus I believe he is a valuable asset to my rain team. First off Prankster is a must for his ability allowing you to have +1 Thunder waves and Rain Dance. I have bounced around with mine for the move sets for quiet some time now. Thundurus has access to weapons like Prankster like Thunder Wave, and Rain Dance. He also has a great range of coverage with Focus Blast, Hidden Power, Dark Pulse, Sludge Bomb, Grass Knot, Flash Cannon, Psychic, and Thunder. He is really what ever you want him to be. He is able to give your team what ever coverage your team is missing. With access to all these moves he can be very unpredictable. Since he will be being used in the rain I like using thunder. I know there is concern about the accuracy when it is not raining however I would rather try to thunder wave to buy me some time with paralysis, then set the rain up, then thunder. If I am concerned and need to take out a Gyarados before he boosts with DD I will roll the dice if rain is not out and thunder (hopefully it don’t miss). If I do miss and he starts to boost then I will try to disrupt him with T-Wave. Having a powerful Electric Pokémon is important to me because I don’t want any one taking advantage of the rain with there water types. It is really the players option I generally choose thunder over T-Bolt. I feel like HP Ice is a must to deal with Grass types that can straight up wreck my water power houses like M-Swampert, Azumarill, and many others. Focus Blast Is good too because of opposing Ferrothorn, M-Gross and other Steel types because Fire that can usually handle steel types gets kind of weak in the rain. Another thing is I was running Rotom-W which by the way is one of my favorite Pokémon. As far as Electric go the Prankster Rain Dance is way to valuable and Rotom-W is weak to Grass and there are too many other must haves on a rain team like Politoed that are weak to grass and I’m not trying to get swept with all the Serperior running around. So Rotom is a thing of the past on my rain team. (I am not saying he is bad in the rain he is really good I am just saying I feel Thundurus does a better job than Rotom-W as a Rain Dancer). So overall the set really depends on the needs of your team but mine is as follows as I posted before.



Thundurus (Rain Setter)
Ability: Prankster
Nature: Timid
Ev’s: 252 Sp Atk/ 252 Spe/ 4 Hp
Move 1: Rain Dance
Move 2: Thunder
Move 3: HP Ice
Move 4: Thunder Wave/ Focus Blast (I am running Superpower on Azumarill now so no need for Focus Blast)
Item: Damp Rock, Focus sash, Life Orb (I’ve used many items, currently Damp Rock)

 

[DarkNostalgia]

Gonna link a post here by AM about rain: http://www.smogon.com/forums/thread...ain-check-post-30.3527171/page-2#post-6035025
its really well thought out and really is what you should consider on a rain team

 

[Red King]

If you don't want to use Mega Swampert or Seismitoad you really should be running mamoswine as a lead. Why? Thundurus. Every rain team needs a thundurus check unless they want to have all of their swift swimmers crippled with ease. Mega Ampharos is actually pretty nice on rain as well, as it takes on Thundurus as well as Charizard Y. It's coverage of Focus Blast, Thunder and Dragon pulse is great, and it's not shut down by hippowdon thanks to powerful dragon pulses. Also you should add mega scizor to the guide. Mega Scizor benefits from rain as it's only weakness is reduced from 4x to 2x, as well as taking on bulky dragon types that resist water type moves. Great for taking on Altaria who is a massive problem to rain.

 

[Liarliarpantsonfire]

I like to use Landorus-T on my Rain team. It forms that classic 5th gen core with Politoed and Ferrothorn and covers some important resistances like Fighting, Ground and of course Electric. You also get momentum with U-turn, either to bring Politoed in to setup Rain or Kingdra if it's up already. Tentacruel is also really underrated, but Toxic Spikes help a great deal to wear stuff down and you have hazard control with Rapid Spin. And of course it forms an unstoppable core with Ferrothorn, especially when Rain is up.

 

[DragonAscent]

One mon I've been having a blast with on rain teams is mega sceptile. The electric immunity, powerful grass STAB, sanic speed (rain or shine), and 4x resistance to water are great assets. You lose out on mega pert, but it's got some merit. Really works well with torn t to beat fat grass types.