VGC RMT vgc2016 no primal,suggestion

hello.first of all sorry for my bad english but i am italian..i try to give as more details i can compare to my possibilities.
so my team is this:Kyurem white,palkia,kanga(was my core,lot of damage and good coverage),after i added whimsi and talon for some speed control and taunt and some extra damage too and after a xerneas counter and i chose aegislash.

Kyurem-White @ Choice Specs /life orb
Ability: Turboblaze
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fusion Flare
- Ice Beam
- Draco Meteor
- Icy Wind/sleep talk/protect

1hko p-groudon with draco meteor.Can give some speed control with icy wind and do also good damage thanks to stab and choice specs,or be more directly with ice beam without spatk drop.fusion flare for hit all weak pokemon against fire.not know if use sleep talk for dark void smeargle or switch to protect if is better to use with life orb and change palkia too

Palkia @ Life Orb /lum berry
Ability: Telepathy
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Aura Sphere /earth power/flametrower/thunder
- Protect
- Spacial Rend
- Hydro Pump /trick room

My second legendary,good typing(dialga is better in this i know),nice speed(speed tie only with kanga and not mega salamance),not sure for the first move,i had good usage of thunder against a prima kyogre doing good damge but i think aura sphere can be a better choice(?),hope to recieve some suggestion in this.Protect mainly for stall eventually trick room if i wasn't able to counter it.spacial rend stab,good damage,high crit ratio and without the spatck drop.Hydro pump other stab for easy kill fire pokemon like ho-oh or p-groudon in case of dual primal team and there isn't sun,not sure if keep this move too,maybe use trick room for a double speed control,over other trick room and over tailwind.

Aegislash (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- King's Shield
- Wide Guard
- Shadow Sneak
- Gyro Ball

xerneas counter.shadow sneak for have a priority over some pokemon who are near to die..or for do a little bit more damage on cresselia who is really fat and can give a lot of problem to me.i know is more defensive but better of nothing.wide guard for protect against dlazzing glean or other mover(sorry not remembre the english name,the groudon and kyogre move that scale with hp is what i am referring to)

Whimsicott (F) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast /gass knot
- Encore
- Taunt
- Tailwind

not sure of what of the first move i have to pick,moonblast can be useful agaist salamance and ray,since whimsi is faster,but grass knot can give a good hand taking down kyogre.encore for stall protect user and geomancy,taunt for a lot of reason,first of all smeargle,and tailwind for give me speed control,so for example i can set the wind protec with palkia and then outspeed salamence and rayquaza.

Talonflame (M) @ Sharp Beak
Ability: Gale Wings
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Tailwind
- Taunt
- Flare Blitz

not sure about carrying him or some other pokemon..is the one i use less,can give me hand agaist fat special defensive pokemon like kyogre and cress,can give me speed control too and taunt and kill ferrothern easily and other weak pokemon against fire.i usually carry him if i not need whimsi,but is rare...usually if i not see smeargle i can take talon.hope someone can give me some advice on this.

Kangaskhan @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Inner Focus
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Sucker Punch
- Double-Edge
- Low Kick

kanga..well what to say? is kanga.is a counter of himself,chance to kill other kanga with low kick,doind nice damage to fat pokemon,i prefer double egde over return for do more damage,is a good trade off the recoil...for what i see this meta is really fast ...so more damage is better.

ok hope is clear enogh what i write here.i am new to the competitive world,especially vgc...so i hope to recieve some advice now,cause is alredy 5 month that those new vgc run.i not want take and user other team with the classic "big six" like primal pokemon,xerneas,smeargle ect...i use kanga who is one of the most used i know...but i need it and i not know anyone who can cover his role.thanks for any help

ps:i thinked to put amoongus over talon or crobat
 
Last edited:
This is just a personal feeling but other than glass cannon mons, 4/252/252 spreads are just inefficient for VGC/doubles. Icy wind is inefficient on Kyurem-W no matter what item you're holding, it's a support move and you're having it on one of your primary attackers. Trick Room on Palkia just as inefficient for anything other than countering trick room which teams can again take advantage of you having to spend a turn on getting rid of it and then protect to get it back up again (Cresselia is bulky and Bronzong resists or takes neutral damage from Palkia's STAB moves). Telepathy isn't really that great either since you have nothing like surf/earthquake/ etc that will do damage to it, pressure would make more sense as the opposing play has to be efficient with their moves.
 
i not have a normal palkia in my game :( i have alpha ..so what u suggest?i changend some moves cause someone told me on showdwn..but not really sure..he told me that ho-oh and dialga are really inesistent in vgc so i have no use of aura spehre and hydro pump
 
i not have a normal palkia in my game :( i have alpha ..so what u suggest?i changend some moves cause someone told me on showdwn..but not really sure..he told me that ho-oh and dialga are really inesistent in vgc so i have no use of aura spehre and hydro pump
Go on some giveaway threads. There are a few in the wi-if forum.

Also, for your team, it looks like gravity wouldn't hurt.
 
100 percent accurate blizzard and hydro pump. Kyurem is commonly used with gravity.
Use this set:

Kyurem-White @ Choice Scarf

Ability: Turboblaze

EVs: 100 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 148 Spe

Modest Nature

- Blizzard

- Draco Meteor

- Ice Beam

- Fusion Flare
 
oh...playing now on showdonw i found that m meawile is really hard ...i cannot shot him with palkia...so is flamethrower needed ? and i have to replace talon?
 
Mawile shouldn't be that hard... You have fusion flare and a talonflame. Maybe try a ferrothorn? It walls Mawile quite a bit.
 
Hi Alkatraz91. A team with no Primals can be somewhat tricky to pull off, but it can be viable, nonetheless. Most of my changes will be set changes since your Pokemon choice is pretty solid. My main focus will be improving your damage output while also adding a bit of bulk to your team. Changes in bold.




Kyruem-W @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Turboblaze
Level: 50
EV's: 100 HP/4 Def/252 SpA/4 SpD/148 Spe
Modest Nature

- Blizzard
- Draco Meteor
- Earth Power
-Ice Beam
This is the set used by Patrick Smith at Anaheim Regionals. It allows you to put down some serious damage turn one with a fast Blizzard, provided you have the right support, which I'll get into later. I've added Earth Power for P-Don. Draco Meteor should only be used if you can be sure it will net a KO or you think Kyurem will die that turn.


252+ SpA Turboblaze Kyurem-W Blizzard vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Rayquaza in Strong Winds: 188-224 (103.8 - 123.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ SpA Turboblaze Kyurem-W Blizzard vs 252 HP / 4 SpD Crobat: 222-264 (115.6 – 137.5%) – guaranteed OHKO

252+ SpA Turboblaze Kyurem-W Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Primal Groudon: 103-123 (49.7 - 59.4%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO



Palkia @ Haban Berry
Ability: Telepathy
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Earth Power
- Protect
- Spacial Rend
- Gravity
I've added Haban Berry to allow him to survive Super Effective Dragon-type attacks better. Gravity is there for the aforementioned support for Kyurem-W. Spacial Rend should be your primary offensive move, since the STAB boost it gets, plus the accuracy, make it one of the most consistent high power Dragon moves in the format.

252 SpA Palkia Spacial Rend vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Primal Kyogre: 64-76 (36.5 - 43.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

0 SpA Mega Rayquaza Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Haban Berry Palkia: 105-124 (63.6 - 75.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 SpA Palkia Spacial Rend vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Mega Rayquaza: 212-252 (117.7 - 140%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 SpA Palkia Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Primal Groudon: 124-148 (59.9 - 71.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO



Thundurus>Whimsicott


Thundurus @ Life Orb
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
EVs: 36 HP / 220 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Wild Charge
- Taunt / Swagger
- Thunder Wave
- Protect
I decided to swap out Whimiscott for another Prankster user that can provide speed control. I chose him over Whimsi because this team is lacking in reliable Kyogre checks. This is a set we VGC raters have been playing around with for quite some time. It can OHKO most Kyogre, which can swing a game into your favor pretty quickly. I'd recommend Taunt over Swagger, but its ultimately your call.

220 Atk Life Orb Thundurus Wild Charge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Primal Kyogre: 198-234 (113.1 - 133.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO



Talonflame @ Life Orb
Ability: Gale Wings
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Tailwind
- Quick Guard/Taunt
This is a somewhat optional change. I do recommend putting Life Orb on him, but you may wish to stick with a Jolly Nature.

This is pretty much all I have to add. I'll drop an importable below if you want to try these changes out for yourself. Big thanks to Draconid997 for motivating me to make my unofficial comeback to the rating community. Hopefully I'll be here to stay from now on. Alkatraz91 good luck with your team, and welcome to VGC!

Kyurem-White @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Turboblaze
Level: 50
EVs: 100 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 148 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Blizzard
- Draco Meteor
- Earth Power
- Ice Beam

Palkia @ Haban Berry
Ability: Pressure
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Earth Power
- Protect
- Spacial Rend
- Gravity

Thundurus @ Life Orb
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
EVs: 36 HP / 220 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Wild Charge
- Taunt / Swagger
- Thunder Wave
- Protect

Talonflame @ Life Orb
Ability: Gale Wings
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Tailwind
- Quick Guard/Taunt

Aegislash (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- King's Shield
- Wide Guard
- Shadow Sneak
- Gyro Ball

Kangaskhan @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Inner Focus
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Sucker Punch
- Double-Edge
- Low Kick
 
Last edited:
hello.thanks for your help.i try your changes for see.kyurem with the choice scarf not kill groudon..but with life orb even timid shot him always. was using a palkia with lustrudus orb,but i can give him the berry too,and with protect,spacial rend,flametrower and thunder for kyogre,and whimsicott encore is so good..thundurus can have it? or what u say about switch talon for thundurus? can be a good idea?thanks again and sorry for my bad english,and if u can give me some advice of my playstile with those changes...i usually do stupid error cause my inexperience in the game :(

ps: i hitted near 1300 on ladder in showdown with that:
(never used amoongus)

Kyurem-White @ Life Orb
Ability: Turboblaze
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fusion Flare
- Ice Beam
- Draco Meteor
- Protect

Palkia @ Lustrous Orb
Ability: Telepathy
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower
- Protect
- Spacial Rend
- Thunder

Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Wide Guard
- King's Shield
- Gyro Ball
- Shadow Sneak

Whimsicott (F) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Encore
- Taunt
- Tailwind

Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rage Powder
- Grass Knot
- Protect
- Spore

Kangaskhan @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Inner Focus
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Sucker Punch
- Double-Edge
- Low Kick
 
No worries. I wouldn't recommend dropping Talonflame for Thundurus, since he covers a couple weaknesses on the team. I'm not a big fan of Whimsicott since he's Taunt bait, and since you lack a solid Kyogre check I'd suggest keeping Thundurus. I would suggest Ferrothorn over Aegislash since he can check both Kyogre and Xerneas. If you'd like i can give you a set for him.

What specific Pokemon are you having trouble with?
 
No worries. I wouldn't recommend dropping Talonflame for Thundurus, since he covers a couple weaknesses on the team. I'm not a big fan of Whimsicott since he's Taunt bait, and since you lack a solid Kyogre check I'd suggest keeping Thundurus. I would suggest Ferrothorn over Aegislash since he can check both Kyogre and Xerneas. If you'd like i can give you a set for him.

What specific Pokemon are you having trouble with?
i know is a taunt bait..but he is so fast that i can taunt first...i take it in the ass if he hold mental herb...well not know..i can take care of groudon easily..and kyogre is not so hard to take down with thunder or double edge,can trap protect users with encore...well the common annoyer is smeargle..and that stupid dark void...or trick room user who have mental herb so i cannot do encore over they..if i have smeargle and a trick room setter i have to taunt smeargle...or fake out him...i never used even talon...i had some trouble with gengar too..thing that aegi can help me take down with priority shadow sneak..cresselia is hard too.or meawile if i not have kyurem..palkia is unable to 1hko..ps: i post a replay of a match i made today hope it can give u some advice:http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/vgc2016-387750709

ps: i can have a set in mind for ferrothrorn...with grass knot and gyro ball,leach seed and protect,special defence and hp can be good?
 
i know is a taunt bait..but he is so fast that i can taunt first...i take it in the ass if he hold mental herb...well not know..i can take care of groudon easily..and kyogre is not so hard to take down with thunder or double edge,can trap protect users with encore...well the common annoyer is smeargle..and that stupid dark void...or trick room user who have mental herb so i cannot do encore over they..if i have smeargle and a trick room setter i have to taunt smeargle...or fake out him...i never used even talon...i had some trouble with gengar too..thing that aegi can help me take down with priority shadow sneak..cresselia is hard too.or meawile if i not have kyurem..palkia is unable to 1hko..ps: i post a replay of a match i made today hope it can give u some advice:http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/vgc2016-387750709

ps: i can have a set in mind for ferrothrorn...with grass knot and gyro ball,leach seed and protect,special defence and hp can be good?
edit:yveltal is a problem...his sucker punch hit so hard...xerneas..well i learned now him..it my last fight just a minute ago i not even take aegi with me...taunt on smeargle,next turn encore on xerneas and ko smeargle with kanga,put in kyurem and remove whimsi,take a hit from p-don,start to kill xerneas with double edge,1hko p-don,xerneas die,win
 
Paging Draconid997 and GradeAGarchomp any other ideas? I'm a bit rusty.
lol.well thanks for all.and i know maybei am asking too much..but i really not want use the all know pokemon of this meta..i know kanga is so abused but i really need him..but i build this team from my own without seeing or capying anithing...happy is work a little,is hard to improve maybe for make it really competitive..but is ok.thanks again and sorry my bad english
 
any other suggestion? im playing in the new online battle(not know how it is called in english,in italian is gara online) for now i am 4-1,one loss cause for the hax but is ok,and i had to be 5-1 but the game didn't count one win..i trapped his talon and smeargle,after i killed his groudon and he fleee,but sometime when someone leave the battle my connection on 3ds crash and so i loss a easy win :(
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top