Lower Tiers RU Viability Rankings Thread

[ChrystalFalchion]

Scarf Typhlosion is an inferior set to Specs, and after Stealth Rock Scarf Typlosion doesn't OHKO Virizion: 252 SpA Typhlosion Eruption (112 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Virizion: 260-308 (80.4 - 95.3%).
Virizion OHKOes Golbat after Stealth Rock if it's running Life Orb (Lum Berry's usually better, but Life Orb is still viable, as it gives you a good chance to OHKO defensive Venusaur after Stealth Rock with Zen Headbutt).
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Virizion Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Golbat: 265-315 (75 - 89.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

The fact that a Pokémon has checks and counters low down in the VR doesn't make it itself any less viable. Almomola gets wrecked by Sceptile, Ludicolo and Lilligant (the latter using it as set up fodder), which are all C Rank Pokémon. Should it be bumped down?

 

[TheGreatKoala]

Okay, thanks for clarifying that :)

 

[Natan]

Am I missing something with Virizion? yes, it's very powerful after it's boost, but surely the fact that even d- rank pokemon(scarfed) can switch in and ohko it a couple of times over:
252 SpA Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Virizion: 348-410 (107.7 - 126.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
(348, 350, 356, 360, 362, 368, 372, 378, 380, 384, 390, 392, 396, 402, 404, 410)

Or that C+ rank pokemon check it comfortably and then ohko it twice over:
+2 252 Atk Virizion Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Golbat: 204-242 (57.7 - 68.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
(204, 208, 210, 212, 214, 216, 220, 222, 224, 226, 228, 232, 234, 236, 238, 242)
0 Atk Golbat Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Virizion: 564-664 (174.6 - 205.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
(564, 568, 576, 580, 588, 592, 604, 612, 616, 624, 628, 636, 640, 648, 652, 664)


That should mean it's not S rank material

Well, I think its like saying Venusaur shouldn't be S Rank because Typhlosion OHKOes any of its sets and because it can't break some C+ and C Ranks like Golbat and Ferroseed.

 

[EonX]

>Suggesting Typhlosion should be used at all. But I digress.

Slowking: Idk, I feel Slowking is fine where it's at. If it were dropped to A, I feel like it should be from the competition it receives from Alomomola, not because it's gotten worse itself. Defensive sets are still good and AV w/ Future Sight is still annoying to have to switch into for quite a few teams. I don't like Calm Mind in the current meta, but it still has pure defensive, AV, and OTR to work with and all of those are solid sets in their own right. Defensive Slowking in general is a pain in the ass to switch into since it carries the two best moves in the game that are obviously balanced (Scald and T-Wave for anybody unaware) and AV and OTR have their spots on teams as well. I think it's still fine in A+ rank due to how much it can bring to a team and it isn't one dimensional, but if we're talking a drop to A because of Mola being so damn good right now, I can at least understand / respect it.

Medicham: Another one I'm a little confused on. Scarf is still a royal pain for most offensive builds to deal with, even though Uxie helps with that to an extent and Life Orb still hits hella hard with a decent enough Speed tier to do shit with. Pursuit users are still good in the current meta and it works really well with some of the best Pokemon in the tier, especially Sneasel. LO sets also can bust through the RegiMolaVenu core with a little bit of prediction around Protect, which is a much better shot than a lot of other Pokemon in the tier have atm. Keep it in A+ rank atm.

Sneasel: This has been a long time coming, but I'm completely backing this one. Sneasel is just so freaking good right now. Sure it hates dealing with Alomomola, but it is able to support so many Pokemon that can beat Mola anyway that it hardly matters. Pursuit is a godsend supportive tool for many Pokemon in the tier right now and Sneasel is easily the best user of it due to its high Speed, STAB on Pursuit, and ability to hinder most defensive responses with Knock Off. Overall, Sneasel just adds so much support to so many teams and its capable of wearing down defensive mons, sweeping late-game with that great Speed, and trapping Psychics with Pursuit. It can even run stuff like Iron Tail for Diancie and Ice Shard if you're weak to Flygon. It's one of the best all-around offensive Pokemon in the tier right now and completely deserving of S rank imo.

Flygon: I'm really torn on this one. It's so hard not to use a team with Flygon since it can run Band, Scarf, or Defog support, but on the other, i feel it's so well prepared for and kind of a victim of its own success. What I mean by that is even though Flygon is still a fantastic Pokemon, most teams aren't going to be beaten by it and are prepared to take on its best sets. For that reason, I feel it could drop to A+ rank as most teams are prepared to take it on and it can't really pose a massive threat / annoyance to teams like it used to since everyone is ready for it now. That said, it's still a fantastic Pokemon that is one of the key Pokemon on VoltTurn playstyles in RU and any Pokemon weak to entry hazards is going to like having Flygon on its side. Fantastic Pokemon, but kind of a victim of its own success now.

Granbull: Completely behind this. Granbull has been lowkey good for quite a while now. It's really about the only Fairy-type that doesn't give Venusaur a completely free switch-in due to the threat of Thunder Wave (best move in the game!) and Fire Punch. It still has room for Heal Bell to provide cleric support for its team and can even run less-explored sets like Pixie Plate with Heal Bell / T-Wave + 3 Attacks or a more tanky version of its support set with Pixie Plate. Band sets are obviously powerful and catch a lot of opponents off-guard due to that high Attack stat and Intimidate is what makes a lot of it possible for Granbull. The lack of recovery isn't as glaring in a meta where Alomomola is a fantastic option for almost any balance / bulky offense squad (which is where Granbull should be used) Definitely deserves a rise to B+ rank

 

[Cenamazing]

Abomasnow from B+ to B-
Abomasnow is a decent pokemon. It's a good mixed attacker and it has nice coverage, but I really dont think it deserves to be as high as it is. It's combination of its slow speed and terrible defensive typing means that it usually can't take any hits. One paticular problem is it's weakness to fighting, one of the strongest attacking types in the tier. It also faces stiff competition from the multitude of strong grass types attackers in the tier, paticularly Virizion and Venusaur. Overall, I'm really not sure why it's so high, and I believe it should be a lower tier.

 

[Take Azelfie]

Abomasnow from B+ to B-
Abomasnow is a decent pokemon. It's a good mixed attacker and it has nice coverage, but I really dont think it deserves to be as high as it is. It's combination of its slow speed and terrible defensive typing means that it usually can't take any hits. One paticular problem is it's weakness to fighting, one of the strongest attacking types in the tier. It also faces stiff competition from the multitude of strong grass types attackers in the tier, paticularly Virizion and Venusaur. Overall, I'm really not sure why it's so high, and I believe it should be a lower tier.

I don't really think it's fair to compare Venusaur to Abomasnow let alone Virizion. If you are going to make a comparison at least compare it to Mega Goalies who is another Ice-type wallbreakers that can punish Water-types. Also we realize it doesn't have the best defensive typing but you shouldn't be using that as an argument as many of the tiers wallbreakers are particularly vulnerable to a common offensive typing. In fact it's probably better to a degree since it resist Scald. It does lack speed but it has a ridiculously strong Ice Shard to make up for its lost of speed. You don't even acknowledge its core breaking potential beating Water-Grass Cores or Water-Steel cores. Heck it even has the ability to limit Venusaur the moment hail is set up preventing it from recovering half its health. This doesn't deserve to stop and even so it should only drop to B since its Blizzards and Ice Shard can be occasionally overwhelming and it beats Waters much better than Mega Glalie could

 

[Cenamazing]

Sneasel: This has been a long time coming, but I'm completely backing this one. Sneasel is just so freaking good right now. Sure it hates dealing with Alomomola, but it is able to support so many Pokemon that can beat Mola anyway that it hardly matters. Pursuit is a godsend supportive tool for many Pokemon in the tier right now and Sneasel is easily the best user of it due to its high Speed, STAB on Pursuit, and ability to hinder most defensive responses with Knock Off. Overall, Sneasel just adds so much support to so many teams and its capable of wearing down defensive mons, sweeping late-game with that great Speed, and trapping Psychics with Pursuit. It can even run stuff like Iron Tail for Diancie and Ice Shard if you're weak to Flygon. It's one of the best all-around offensive Pokemon in the tier right now and completely deserving of S rank imo.

Sneasel is good, but I wouldn't really say it's S Rank good. Most of the S Rank pokemon are good because of how versatile they are, being able to fit on most team styles. Sneasel is very good at what it does, but I wouldn't say it's that easy to fit on every team. It almost requires volt-turn support considering how frail it is, and it doesn't appreciate the many fighting types in the tier. It also misses out on OHKOing many threatening pokemon, and is walled by defensive water types like Alomomola and Blastoise. It's definitely good at trapping Psychics and dealing with other strong pokemon, but I believe that sneasel should stay at A+

 

[Kushalos]

->B/B+
I think it's time for Golbat to move up to at least B/B+ rank. This thing beats all S-rank pokemon 1v1 and has some very valuable assets over Flygon as a defogger option on your team. While it may be more vulnerable to knock off and has a rocks weakness, the resists a flying/poison typing brings are invaluable. Moreover, whereas Flygon gets completely set up on, Golbat can use its Infiltrator ability and 100% accurate Toxic to severely cripple Braviary, one of the scariest balance and stall breakers at the moment.

 

[-Tsunami-]

->B/B+
I think it's time for Golbat to move up to at least B/B+ rank. This thing beats all S-rank pokemon 1v1 and has some very valuable assets over Flygon as a defogger option on your team. While it may be more vulnerable to knock off and has a rocks weakness, the resists a flying/poison typing brings are invaluable. Moreover, whereas Flygon gets completely set up on, Golbat can use its Infiltrator ability and 100% accurate Toxic to severely cripple Braviary, one of the scariest balance and stall breakers at the moment.

I completely disagree with this. Golbat is one of those things that is a lot better on paper than it is in practice. It is so easy to pressure a Golbat with Stealth Rock alone that I don't think it's deserving of a higher rank. The fact that it's susceptible to Knock Off is simply icing on the cake. Also, I suppose you can say it beats all S-rank Pokemon 1v1, but it also does not at the same time. If Golbat gets Scald Burned by Alomomola, it becomes almost impossible to wall anything. Venusaur can put it to sleep with Sleep Powder, so let's not act like it completely counters it; if Venusaur runs Knock Off over Sleep Powder, Golbat is just as screwed if not even more so. Even Leech Seed Venusaur can be kind of annoying, because if you Leech Seed the Golbat and then go to your SR Pokemon, they can't exactly Defog very easily. Flygon can also U-Turn out of Golbat on the switch, which is a major problem because that means Golbat will be under 50% when it comes in again because of the pressure of Stealth Rock. Also, let's not act like Golbat is some amazing Flygon counter in the 1st place.
252 SpA Life Orb Flygon Draco Meteor vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Eviolite Golbat: 168-199 (47.5 - 56.3%) -- 80.1% chance to 2HKO
Golbat can be easily KO'd after Stealth Rock by two Draco Meteors; if you run a specially defensive spread, Golbat loses to many more threats.

Its' weakness to Knock Off is also a major hindrance, as it leaves it unable to check Fighting-types such as Hitmonlee without becoming a great deal less useful for the rest of the battle. With SR up, it simply cannot counter many things effectively. If someone brings in Virizion, you literally cannot go to Golbat immediately as a counter. If they SD on the switch, the Golbat user is pretty much forced to attack because +2 Stone Edge deals way too much damage otherwise.
+2 252 Atk Virizion Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Golbat: 204-242 (57.7 - 68.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
This may not seem like that much initially, but factoring in Stealth Rock, Golbat is at risk of being 2HKOd if it decides to Roost. This means that the Virizion user can just easily switch to something to force Golbat out, and Golbat will be below 50% the next time it comes in due to Stealth Rock and Brave Bird recoil; this leaves it unable to check Virizion. I think that Flygon definitely outclasses Golbat as a defogger on most teams. Golbat would be very good if Stealth Rock did not exist, but because it does, I don't believe Golbat is worthy of a rank that high and feel that C+ is best for it.

 

[Funbot28]

Ok so I know there placement in the meta is kinda grey, they are still in the tier as of know so why not talk about there placement (cause its kinda easy to see...)

Unranked ---> S

Shaymin is such an amazing wallbreaker in the tier right now as its amazing all around base stats plus the impact of Seed Flare's secondary effect help it break through so many common cores that are popular right now such as the infamous RegiMola. Its very hard to switch into it as well since it also packs decent coverage to pick off certain checks such as Psychic for Venasaur, Golbat and Virizion and Earth Power for Magneton and Drapion. It also checks a bunch of stuff itself especially with its SubSeed set thanks to its decent defensive typing and good stats. Really meta defining wallbreaker atm.

Unranked ---> S

The other drop that has shaken the meta quite a bit, Slurpuff is probably the best sweeper in the meta atm. BD just demolishes everything once it is able to get the opportunity to setup which is quite often thanks to its Fairy typing and decent bulk. It also has access to nice coverage in Drain Punch which helps it break down Steel types and heal itself at the same time which prolongs its survivability. It really lacks good answers due to most of its checks being able to be easily worn down due to the lack of recovery in conjunction with the prevalence of hazard stacking atm. It is honestly a top tier threat as well.

So yeah I find we should place these guys here for the time being anyways :)

Edit: RIP :( they got banned

 

[phantom]

updates:

Slowking down to A
Jolteon up to A-
Granbull up to B+
Abomasnow down to B

discussion points:

Registeel up to A+
Fletchinder down to A-
Bronzong up to B+/A-
Xatu up to B/B+
Audino (mega) up to A-
Aromatisse down to B-
Trevenant Unranked
Blastoise down to A-
Gurdurr up to B+

 

[MANNAT]

Fletch down to A-: Agree
I always find myself using scarf medi or sneasel over fletch as cleaners, they are both so much more consistent as cleaners, and don't need a turn to setup to clean. Fletch relies too much on both rocks being off the field and flying resists being eliminated to clean. On top of that, fletch isn't exactly the bulkiest mon in the tier, so it has to rely on threatening shit like virizion out to setup, and prediction can go both ways, so they can just stay in and edge you out of the match. Additionally, regimola is arguably the most common core in the game rn, and we all know how shitty fletch's MU Vs that core is, especially since regi's bulk let's it set up rocks very often. Another metagame trend that hurts fletch is the fact that rhype is rising in popularity as a solid check to subbu brav, which can blast through a lot of teams nowadays that frankly aren't ready for it. Overall, fletch suffers from a lot of issues as a cleaner and is hurt by recent metagame trends, so it is a subpar pick in comparison to other cleaners that we have rn.

I don't have much opinion on the rest of the slate, although I think that really needs to rise because it is a SUPER consistent rocker and tank for balanced teams that can do its job really well.

 

[Cenamazing]

Out of all of these, the one I want to talk about immediately is Blastoise to A-. I definetely think that while Blastoise is still a great mon in the tier, it's time for it to move down to A-. The biggest thing that makes me believe Blastoise should not be A Ranked is its lack of reliable recovery. Flygon, for example, gets Roost, an amazing recovery move, especially on a non-flying type. All blastoise has is Leftovers and refresh. I do love refresh for stopping Blastoise from being toxiced, but refresh is nothing compared to Roost. As a defensive water type (not as a spinner, as a defensive pokemon in general), it's outclassed by Alomomola. Alomomola has amazing defensive stats and the ability to pass huge wishes, while Blastoise's defenses pale in comparison. It also lacks any good offensive stats, and therfore can only run one set. Flygon can run a defensive set, and offensive set, and even a scarfed set (some sets are more viable then others, but the point is all of them are usable in the meta). The only thing you need to predict when fighting Blastoise is one move. It's only real niche is which move you decide to put in your 4th moveslot: refresh of foresight. I already mentioned how useful refresh is, but foresight is also useful to stop spinblockers like Jellicent from stopping a rapid spin. It's not a terrible pokemon as it does have its niche. It's probably the most viable defensive spinner in the tier, which is useful for teams that need hazard control but don't appreciate losing hazards on the opponents side of the field. But with the loss of Mega Steelix and Tyrantrum and the rise of offensive grass types like Venusaur and Virizion, I don't believe Blastoise is still deserving of being an A-Rank Pokemon

 

[feen]

Registeel holds a very important place in the tier by checking Venusaur and acting as a Flying check. The infamous RegiMola core is very hard to break and Registeel supports a bulky Water partner regardless of what it is. On top of that, Registeel actually has a decent hitting move in Seismic Toss, unlike Bronzong's Psywave, and Protect allows it to break opposing momentum on choice locked Pokemon. Yes, it is definitely Dugtrio bait, but Registeel can actually beat Dugtrio if it hits Life Orb Dugtrio with a Seismic Toss upon switch in. Moreover, Registeel also has some interesting sets: Dual status is very good on status spamming and relatively slower teams, while Curse RestTalk is also very nice to have as a win condition. Registeel is also a setup fodder for Braviary, but if the team has no other Braviary check, then Thunderbolt with 28 SpA EVs can be used to beat Braviary. Registeel alongside Alomomola is very very hard to break because Registeel has Wish support and so has a higher longevity. Registeel can also pressure bulkier Pokemon like opposing Alomomola, Diancie, and Uxie to switch out due to Toxic, and it being immune to Toxic is very good for a bulky Pokemon. I believe that Registeel definitely deserves A+ rank.

 

[ChrystalFalchion]

Registeel up to A+

I haven't used it, I have no opinion

Fletchinder down to A-

Agree, it's weak before boosting, Stealth Rock is a major pain for it, and unlike its big brother it doesn't have Brave Bird or Flare Blitz, meaning it lacks coverage and since it has to run Acrobatics that means it can't hold items. If I want a revenge killer, I typically find myself using Sneasel - if I want a Flying type sweeper, I find myself using SubBU Braviary.

Bronzong up to B+/A-

Agree with B+. Gyro Ball / Heavy Slam let it do decent damage, Levitate and its Psychic typing give it a nice over Registeel - it and Escavalier are the only Steel types in RU not weak to Ground or Fighting moves

Xatu up to B/B+

Disagree, with Rhyperior and Diancie all over the place its job is that much harder. For hazard control I'd rather use Blastoise or defensive Flygon

Audino (mega) up to A-

Agree, its CroDino set is a superb bulky sweeper - unlike Slowking it doesn't fear Toxic. After a Calm Mind or two it's virtually unbreakable.

Aromatisse down to B-

Agree, as a Wish Passer Alomomola is usually better and as a bulky Fairy-type I prefer defensive Granbull as that can still dish out decent damage.

Trevenant Unranked

Agree - between Venusaur, Virizion and Rotom-C there isn't much reason to use this thing

Blastoise down to A-

Disagree, it's still the best Rapid Spinner in RU and with the right move it can beat many of its usual checks

Gurdurr up to B+

I haven't used it, I have no opinion

 

[Hilomilo]

Unranking Trevenant seems like the right thing to do at this point in time. I can't say that I'm super experienced with RU, but seeing as how I've been around the metagame and have used every grass type pokemon that's ru by usage, I can say with certainty that the poor thing is nothing short of outclassed. While it has a unique niche in its ability to switch into scald and heal itself from burns immediately, that is a very specific niche that is outdone by the niche of not even taking damage from water types attacks (held by Jellicent and Seismitoad) or by getting an attack boost from burns (Gurdurr). Not only does Trevenant lack defensive utility by virtue of its poor mixed bulk and defensive typing, but its outclassed by Venusaur as a user of leech seed, due to Venu's better bulk, typing and access to recovery (Rest and natural cure is nice, but it forces Trevenant to switch out immediately after recovering). Offensively, Trevenant is outclassed by Virizion, which has better speed, access to SD, and great special bulk to better deal with its potential threats in Delphox and Venusaur. Overall, there really isn't anything Trevenant can do without being outclassed by another grass type, and its lack of offensive and defensive utility as opposed to other grass types and common checks in Mega Glalie, Mega Camerupt, Fletchinder, and anything with access to knock off further augments how poorly it performs in the current meta. It was borderline C- rank to begin with, and with the recent drop to NU, no longer has much of a reason to be ranked.

 

[Take Azelfie]

Registeel really does need a rise and if it wasn't on this slate I would have nommed it myself. It's stupidly splashable because it checks and provides so much utility into one slot. Speed control, Toxic, Stealth Rock, Psychic check, Fletch check, Venu check etc. On balance or even stall its very hard to pass up and of course a part of the tiers most infamous core RegiMola. Curse sets aren't dramatically powerful but they are pretty hard to stop once they get rolling. Of course it's more susceptible to Taunt unlike Braviary. I could probably point out more but this mom speaks for itself. Or I can just use the words of shake, "Does RegiMola ever lose?"

Fletch has been struggling a lot as of late since there aren't teams massively weak to it. Magneton and Registeel are two Pokemon that have been given spotlights as of late and even its revenge killing properties are being taken away by Dugtrio. Not to mention it forces the user to run hazard control which makes it much more stricter than the rest of the GOOD set up sweepers like Virizion or Sigilyph. It's also held down by its defenses making extremely hard to set up Swords Dance on anything it can actually threaten.

Xatu is a weird one, first off its usage and win rate is pretty good in the RU Open but is it because more people are finding a way to incorporate Xatu into there teams? Or is it because they saw Chakra' s RMT in the team showcase? This would also bring up Sawk' s even higher usage (which is reasonable since its more viable) so now this challenges Xatu splashability on teams. You have to look and see that it's kind of prediction heavy at times since Diancie could end up tossing out a Diamond Storm or Garbodor may choose to Gunk Shot. I'm not saying it doesn't deserve to rise but I thought maybe people should take this good for thought in mind when suggesting nominations.

 

[Senpai D.M]

Registeels fine just looking at a+ you can tell it doesn't belong especially with how good dugtrio is imo Bronzing on the other hand is another underrated rocker atm that has levitate I feel should also rise
On mobile if registeels is to a+ lol bronzong deserves to be higher

 

[aurora]

Trevenant blows. Simply put, I've never felt the need to use it over any of the other offensive Grass-types in the tier. Natural Cure + Choice Band is cool in theory, but switch-in opportunities are difficult to find in practice. Average bulk and low Speed do not help it, either. I can see why it's C- rank, but I don't think it should be there. Unrank.

As one half of arguably the best defensive core in the tier, Registeel absolutely deserves to be A+. It checks some of the more dangerous special attackers in the tier, such as Venusaur, with high efficacy. Its staying power is augmented by the gigantic Wishes it can receive from Alomomola, mitigating its natural lack of a reliable recovery move. This lets it do its job consistently throughout a match. Registeel's ability to run multiple status moves is a boon for it, as it can force out defensive and offensive Pokemon alike with Toxic and Thunder Wave, respectively. It is still rather passive, even with Seismic Toss, but this can be played around with appropriate support. I fully support elevating Registeel.

I find Blastoise slightly more difficult to fit these days. Like in UU last generation, Blastoise is not a great bulky Water-type, as it does not offer the sheer bulk or utility in Wish that Alomomola does. It is almost complete Venusaur bait, and has some trouble deciding what move to run in its last moveslot; it really wants both Refresh and Foresight, but simply cannot fit both. Of course, it is still by far the best Rapid Spinner available, which is useful for Spikes teams. However, for most other teams, Flygon is much easier to fit, so it is for this reason I think Blastoise should drop.

Fletchinder has declined somewhat since the banning of Mega Steelix, as checks to it have increased in viability. It reminds me of Ho-Oh in Ubers in that hazard removal becomes mandatory for it to function adequately, thus limiting the builds it can fit on. It should drop.

 

[eren]

can anyone give an actual good reason as to why one of the best, if not the best, rocker in uxie is in the same rank as an overhyped, and frankly, shit mon in aggron. i think uxie can stand to be bumped to a- or even a with the current state of the meta. uxie fulfills many roles on both offense and balance teams, these include: u-turn (sometimes in combo with yawn), thunder wave, and sometimes even knock off while allowing for use of sets such as cb rhyp (as other rockers conflict w cb rhyp / cb aggron ironically enough etc). it also holds together as a great fighting check, (even w lefties or could run the rare colbur to get the get-up on even sneasel) particularly of medicham, which ravages normal offense w.o uxie. i feel this rise is necessary especially since definitely less common, less effective mons are above it in rank at the moment (see fox aggron seis). uxie -> a- or higher

on that note, let's drop aggron down. it's trapped by the ubiquitous dugtrio, has to predict on a turn-to-turn to even wallbreak vs stall, and has neither the speed nor the special bulk to consistently come in versus offense. this nom is more concise bc there isn't much to say. although if u want to use aggron, definitely use it in tandem with coba berry virizion. aggron -> b or lower

lets rank torterra: band torterra is better than aggron to me at least. the current set i use is crunch / wood hammer / stone edge / eq. it's a wallbreaker that isn't trapped by duggy unless it has used wood hammer several times or gotten chipped heavily (probably resulting in a kill or 2). i dont have replays showcasing it all two well since my team uses it more to pressure a build, get a kill, and set up otr diancie (since tort lures in zong w crunch) or scarf drapion (tort pressures grounds for drap so you can suit / knock psychics safely) for a sweep. it also has a neat rocks set where i use 248 HP / 180+ Def / 80 Spe with sr whammer eq synth. it's a cool set i like using on teams where i need a rocker that resists ground. it also recovery which is nice! i probably didn't much of a case for it but eh. tort -> c or higher

up should go hariyama like his weight. its especially nice in the current meta w the ubiquity of sneasel / glalie. DTC and myself concocted a physically defensive set w lefties that makes it less able to be worn down and checks the relevant ice types much more easily. you could do a nifty ev spread such as 220+ Atk / 252 Def / 20 SpD / 16 Spe (outspeeds 252 spe mega rupt). ps i run bp / ice punch / cc / knock cuz flygon is a nuisance. yama -> b or higher

here are some replays of my tort / hariyama team:
vs shake http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-420149635
loss vs cody where i play like ass http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-419517590
ru ssnl r8 vs psynergy http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-421123247
not my team but rozes team (pearl V bkc) http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-ru-186392

i forgot to nom kabutops up. it's a neat spinner / fletch counter for offense and works quite well with uxie while not sapping momentum like toise. id like to see kabu in b-


discussion points:

Registeel up to A+ agree
Fletchinder down to A- disagree
Bronzong up to B+/A- agree
Xatu up to B/B+ agree
Audino (mega) up to A- on the fence, leaning disagree
Aromatisse down to B- agree, c+ if possible
Trevenant Unranked hell yes
Blastoise down to A- no, it's the best spinner and i like it a lot
Gurdurr up to B+ yes

too lazy to elaborate on those but yeah :p

 

[empire370]

Hi
Omastar to B or B+: I find is kind of disrespectful that this fossil is in the same rank as my second favorite Pokemon samurott when it's clearly above the water starter shell smash works really well right now and allowing omastar to u know sweep teams so I find b- rank really low for it so it should rise imo

 

[TheGreatKoala]

I saw nothing on those replays to suggest an improvement for Torterra. The trick room Diancie I liked however

 

[glock in my toyota]

Gurdurr up to B+: Agree.

I think Gurdurr is one of the most underrated Bulky Offense/Balance mons in the tier right now. It's pseudo-immunity to status helps it a lot as it can come in on will-o-wisps, twaves, and soak the status for your team, making it an even more potent threat to the opponent. Mach Punch is hugely important against offense, as it allows you to consistently Revenge Kill popular offense mons, like Scarf Magneton, Sneasel, Houndoom, and Mega-Glalie. Drain Punch does a decent job at keeping yourself alive, and while not reliable recovery, it does it's job well. Knock Off is the best move in the game, and it patches up Gurdurr's difficulty against Ghost-Types. Bulk Up is really where Gurdurr shines though, and you are sure to find that most Balance and BO teams are unprepared for it, as you can set up on things like Registeel, certain Flygon sets, non-Toxic Alomomola, and many, many more. Gurdurr poses a ridiculous threat to Balance teams and Bulky Offense teams, as well as having a good enough toolkit to be useful against Offense and HO teams as well. It is for these reasons that I see Gurdurr as definitely deserving of B+.

 

[freezai]

"OMG registeel aloma dugtrio are destroying the tier! Flygon is everywhere! Whatever shall we do???"

Have no fear, TORTERRA IS HERE
Torterra for C RANK



Torterra @ Leftovers
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Atk / 232 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Wood Hammer
- Synthesis
- Earthquake
- Swords Dance

Torterra has a myriad of sets that can be used in the RU metagame™, but the one that I feel is the most effective is the bulky SD set. Its capable of setting up on a number of top threats in the tier including Alomaloma(no toxic), Registeel (no toxic) Dugtrio Diancie Flygon, bulky variants of Venusaur and other bulky waters like Slowking. It uses top threats as set up bait and has a limited set of things that comfortably wall it because of its deadly high power stab combination.(Sigilpyh and Weezing come to mind). When its not being used a set up sweeper, it still functions as a great volt switch stop, taking on Rotom-Mow and Magneton too a lesser extent. It forms a great core with Alomamola as aloma can take the ice attacks targetted towards it and also stop Fire types who try to revenge it.

Replays:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-425874235 RU Seasonals Torterra gets so many set up opportunities on Slowking+Magneton+Diancie and basically forces a sack everything it gets in on of those three.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-403673654 RU Seasonals uses a bulky venusaur to set up and cause damage, albeit it gets revenge killed by fletch often.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-398494879 PSPL emergency check to and SD drapion gone out of hand.

other replays can be taken for slurmz post above

24+ Atk Torterra Wood Hammer vs. 252 HP / 116 Def Flygon: 165-195 (45.3 - 53.5%) -- 37.1% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
+2 24+ Atk Torterra Wood Hammer vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Flygon: 373-441 (123.9 - 146.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 24+ Atk Torterra Wood Hammer vs. 120 HP / 136+ Def Alomomola: 582-686 (116.1 - 136.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO


252 SpA Choice Specs Magneton Flash Cannon vs. 252 HP / 232 SpD Torterra: 166-196 (42.1 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Flygon U-turn vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Torterra: 136-160 (34.5 - 40.6%) -- 97.4% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery (Just synthe on the uturn)
0 SpA Venusaur Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 232 SpD Torterra: 87-103 (22 - 26.1%) -- possible 5HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

 

[MagicHoraceGrant]

Dugtrio A+->S
In the time I have been playing RU, I feel like it is ridiculous that Dugtrio is not ranked S. It is by far the best revenge killer because of its ability, and outspeeds basically anything weak to ground barring a Jolteon(even then it can sucker) or a Scarf mon. Just to name a few mons that it traps, venusaur(offensive), Diance, Virizion, Weakened Non-Scarf meloetta, Drapion, magneton, registeel, delphox. The fact it can take out a lot the threatening mons makes this a great team-mate no matter what play style you run. It is part of what makes Alomomola so good, but that is a different story. Also even if u can switch out it doesnt mean the mon is safe especially since it can run pursuit on certain teams. Overall, this mon is definitely worthy of an S rank.