SandStall

[muna]

Introduction

I stepped away from playing competitively for a couple years around the time Platnium came out, but I have had some more time on my hands the past couple months so I figured it would be fun to give Pokemon a shot again. I quickly familiarized myself with all of the changes in Black and White. The biggest one I found was not all the Dream World abilities and the new threats, but the weather. Permanent sun and rain inducers made it so that whoever controlled the skies controlled the game. I ran several teams with each of the major weather conditions (excluding hail) and decided that sandstorm was the best because teams based on sand could function without it if they had to while sun and rain teams worked as effectively as a fish out of water. Once I knew that I wanted to use sandstorm, it came down to whether I wanted to run an offensive team, a defensive team, or something in between. I tested out all three and my favorite quickly became clear: stall. With opponents losing 1/16th of their health every turn, stalling would become much easier. I know that stall gets more and more difficult every generation, but I feel like if I can win the weather war, I can win the game, and there is no better way to do this than through stall. And like that SandStall was born.

Team Building Process

The most important part of any sandstorm team is a Pokemon with Sand Stream so I had two options: Tyranitar or Hippowdon. I tested out both, but Hippowdon is just so much more suited to play a defensive role with instant recovery and roar.

Now that I had my weather-inducer and Stealth Rock user, I needed a Pokemon to lay down Spikes. Originally I went with Ferrothorn, but his inability to do much more than lay down Spikes and then try to psuedo-phaze via Leech Seed made me scrap him for a long-time favorite. With his ability to not only lay down Spikes, but Phaze and recover health on demand made Skarmory a must.

Skarmory got me in a nostalgic mood, thinking back to the good old days of GSC. I think we know where I am going with this. No Skarmory can reach its potential without a Blissey by its side. I started off using a Chansey with an Eviolite, but switched to Blissey for the Leftovers which I needed to counter the health lost from Sandstorm and for its usable special attack which I needed to help me out with my weakness vs steel types.

With my core down, now I needed 3 more parts: a toxic spiker, a spin blocker, and a rapid spinner. Ideally I wanted to try to knock out all three birds with one stone, but there are no Pokemon that could do all three so I decided to take the best Pokemon that could do at least two of those. Tentacruel manages to provide rapid spin support and toxic spike support in one moveslot, and that was all the convincing I needed to add him.

Now that I had all 3 entry hazards covered, I needed to make sure not to get them removed. It would be a very important role that couldn't faint so I needed some bulk. I started to grow frustrated with the removal of ghost typing on the Rotom forms, but that all changed when I saw it sitting there in all of its hairy glory: Jellicent. It had reasonable bulk, access to instant recovery, and taunt with offensive stats that could at least leave a small dent in most things. The only thing that could even compete for that slot is Dusclops and the lack of Leftovers recovery and instant recovery made him completely outclassed by the mustached monster.

I had all of my essential roles filled and one extra slot. What would a stall team be without the best staller of this generation. In a sandstorm, nothing can stall better than a Gliscor. It can stall for at least 32 turns with Poison Heal between Protect and Substitute - enough time for Sandstorm alone to take out 2 Pokemon without even taking Stealth Rocks or Spikes or Toxic or direct damage into account. My team was complete.

The Team

Hippowdon (M) @ Leftovers Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Stealth Rock
- Roar
Hippowdown is essential to my team for his ability. He sets up Sandstorm, not only to help out my team, but to stop other teams from setting up their own weather. He tends to lead unless I see a Breloom or Venasaur on their team, in which case I'd start off with Gliscor to get his Toxic Orb activated so I can switch into their sleep-inducing moves later on and not fall asleep. Earthquake actually does a decent amount of damage and keeps Hippowdon from being competely shut down by taunt. Slack Off is vital for keeping him alive which is imperative, especially if I am involved in a weather war. Roar finally works to help me counter stat-boosters who tends to give stall teams problems.

Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 180 Def / 76 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Protect
- Substitute
- Toxic
- Earthquake
This guy is one of the most insane things I've ever seen. With poison heal, protect, and substitute, it can stall for 32 turns unless it gets taunted or phazed. If I am playing against a rock or ground type who isn't afraid of sandstorm damage then toxic should do the trick. Against steel-types who are immune to both, Earthquake leaves a pretty big dent.

Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Charm
- Toxic
- Softboiled
- Flamethrower
I have always loved this Blissey. It's a set that barely sees any usage anymore, but it is great at surprising opponents. Charm is incompatible with Wish and Seismic Toss, but I think in this case it is worth it. By cutting the attack of the inevitable incoming physical attacker in half, it forces them to either switch back out or try to take on Blissey with half their attack stat. This allows me to go for a Calm nature over a Bold nature. The next 2 moves are self explanatory and Flamethrower helps me take on the steel types that are immune to toxic that give me so many problems.

Skarmory (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 228 Def / 28 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Spikes
- Whirlwind
- Roost
- Brave Bird
Skarmory's ridiculous defense and great typing along with its instant recovery in Roost and access to Spikes make it hard not to include. Access to Whirlwind just makes the decision even easier, allowing me to take out dragons who get too many dragon dances under their belt, and helping me rack up entry hazard damage.

Tentacruel (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Rain Dish
EVs: 252 HP / 240 Def / 16 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Rapid Spin
- Toxic Spikes
- Scald
- Ice Beam
Tentacruel's stats aren't anything spectacular and neither is its typing, but it fills a very specific niche and it does it well. It is the only viable Pokemon outside of Fortress who learns both Toxic Spikes and Rapid Spin. I didn't want to become too weak to fire-type moves and I enjoyed the speed that Tentacruel brought. Scald works well to potentially cripple physical attackers who try pick on Tentacruel's weaker defense stat. If they get burnt, it makes setting up my 2nd layer of Toxic Spikes much easier, usually allowing me to spin away the opponent's own hazards.

Jellicent (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 216 Def / 44 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Surf
- Toxic
- Taunt
- Recover
Last but not least, Jellicent has one real purpose on my team and that is blocking Rapid Spin. My team relies very heavily on entry hazards and I just can't afford to have them all knocked out in one move. Taunt makes most common spinners such as Fortress incapacitated while recover allows for obvious survivability and Toxic speeds up the demise of the opponent.


Problems

• Steel types are hard for me to take out as they resist Stealth Rocks and are immune to Toxic (Spikes) and sandstorm.
• I don't have a true Breloom counter. Gliscor can come in and try to stall it out, but there has to be a better, more consistent way.
• Reuniclus can just run circles around me. With Magic Guard, it takes no damage from toxic, hazards, or sandstorm. Meanwhile it can recover off any damage that I can do to it. This is another case where I am forced to just stall it out of its PP which is annoying, and difficult if it runs calm mind.

I put a lot of work into this RMT and ask that you please keep that in mind. I have identified a few of my problems above, but don't know how to fix them without opening my team up to another weakness or losing an essential part of my team.
​

 

[Nubagator]

Hi there. I don't have time for a full rate, but the best way to fix your listed problens would be either the following ir a CM roar latias:

Celebi @leftovers
Calm nature
252hp/220spded/36speed
-perish song
-giga drain
-recover
-Psychic

This will beat all varients of Breloom as well as giving you a much better way to beat CM reuniclus and jirachi. I would replace gliscor who while really good in general, isn't as neccesary here.

Alternativly you could use CM roar latias, and while it can't beat breloom, it will help against mixmence who is a threat to your team.

Lastly when using blissey with flamethrower it is a massive waste to not be outspeeding scizor and breaking volturn. I would definitly take your spdef evs and transfer as many as it takes to speed. Sorry this was so short, but hope i managed to help a tad :/

EDIT: go with will-o-wisp over toxic on jellicent. With WIllo it can beat ferrothorn, stop SD scizor, and stop physical jirachi. Also I really feel blissey should be bold.

 

[Honus]

Hey Muna, cool team you have here.

Anyways, I agree that Reuniclus is a problem. Reuniclus is the one Pokemon that can completely decimated even well-built stall teams if they're unprepared, so it's best that you prepare for it somehow. Trick Room Reuniclus should be easy enough to stop for your team, so it's mainly the Calm Mind one that's a huge threat. Jellicent's your best shot at stopping it, but it just haxes its way past more often that not and Jellicent hardly touches it with Surf. Anyways, I think you can fix your CM Reuniclus weakness by using a Calm Mind+Roar Latias over Gliscor. Calm Mind Roar Latias simply engages in a CM War with Reuniclus before Roaring it out and can sweep a team with ease at +6. CM Latias also has amazing synergy with your Skarmory, as Spikes allow it to Roar Pokemon that commonly switch on it, such as Tyranitar and Scizor back out into Spikes, assuring that they take a ton of residual. You basically rinse and repeat until they're gone and Latias can roam free. Latias also does so much more for your team that beat CM Reuniclus, though. Latias gives you an additional check to Rotom-W, which could potentially just trick blissey before having a field day with your team. It also counters most Pokemon on sun teams, which can prove to be a major problem for this team if you end up losing the weather war, and it's just useful overall when sun is in effect, walling stuff like Ninetales and Venusaur until you can get Hippowdon in. It also beats Nasty Plot Celebi, which can potentially power its way past Blissey under the right circumstances and proceed to make its way through the rest of your team, the list goes on and on, really. Skarmory and Hippowdon handle everything that Gliscor does, even CB Terrakion, which is handled by your Max Def Hippowdon, or just by predicting with Jellicent and forcing it out into Spikes, so your team should be alright without Gliscor.

Next, I think you should probably ditch Charm on Blissey for Wish. Tentacruel doesn't get any Leftovers recovery in sand, and keeping it alive in order to beat stall or any teams that employ spikes is vital. Wish allows Tentacruel to have much more staying power than it normally would, and can always prove useful in a pinch. Additionally, I think you could adjust Tentacruel's EVs a bit. Your current spread is nice, but to make the best use of Ice Beam, you should probably change the EVs to 252 HP / 212 Def / 44 Speed, which outspeeds the standard Gliscor by one point, if you want to beat Gliscor that try to speed creep, that you could invest 4 or 8 more EVs in speed, potentially.

I think you could also probably opt for using Will O Wisp over Toxic on Jellicent. I mean, if Volcarona is a problem, then using Toxic is fine [although I reccomend using Scald if you opt for Toxic], although Blissey seems to do a solid job at beating Volc. Either way, Will O Wisp is quite useful on Jellicent, as it allows it to get a good matchup against things it otherwise wouldn't get a good matchup against, such as Tyranitar, Ferrothorn and Scizor. The list goes on and on. You can also give Scald to Jellicent over Surf if you want, to increase your chances of burning things that commonly switch into Jellicent like Virizion or Latios, which can help in bringing them down. Scald is also useful in that you can often get a free burn without having to dedicate a turn to it, unlike with Will O Wisp. You do however, do more damage to Gliscor with Surf and also run the risk of burning Conkeldurr accidentally, so Scald has its pros and cons on Jelli.

Finally, I suggest giving Ice Fang to Hippowdon over Roar. You already have a Phazer in Skarm and 2 if you choose to use Latias, and Skarm can often Roar out many of the threats Hippowdon can. Ice Fang allows Hippowdon to beat Dragonite, Landorus and Salamence 1 on 1, which often occurs if they're the last Pokemon an opponents team, so it's probably the best option for Hippo to have, as you're essentially compromising the number of threats you can beat by not using Ice Fang on Hippowdon. Ice Fang also holds the benefit of being able to nail switchins like Tornadus and Latios for a good chunk of damage that can work nicely with SR, as such Pokemon usually switch around due to being forced out by Blissey; Ice Fang also holds the benefit of breaking Air Balloons. Anyways GL and here's the Latias set.

Latias (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Dragon Pulse
- Roar

 

[LUST]

Hey

Nice team. At the moment, I think your biggest threat is easily Calm Mind Reuniclus. It posses a big threat to many stall teams thanks to it's ability magic guard and ton of defensive bulk. Reuniclus effortlessly sets up on your every mon as they fail to strike it back hard, Hippowdon and Skarmory can't do much except for phazing it out which wouldn't be benefiting you in the long run; Blissey and Tentacruel are straight up set fodder; Jellicent doesn't stand a chance since people like to pack dark-type mons like Tyranitar alongside Reuniclus. After a couple of boosts it literally OHKOs majority of this team. To fix this situation I would highly recommend replacing Hippowdon with Choice Band Tyranitar. With a behemoth attack stat and decent neutral coverage courtesy of two powerful stabs, it is only natural that a Choice Band set is proposed. Tyranitar should be must on every sand-stall team, since majority of them are weak to Psychic-type mons such as Celebi, Latios, Latias. It does an excellent job eliminating those big threats with the effective combination of Crunch and Pursuit. Stone Edge is extremely powerful as it puts a large dent in pretty much anything that doesn't resist it. For the last slot Superpower allows you to shut down Heatran, Ferrothorn, opposing Tyranitar and Terrakion. It fits in perfectly with-in this team after all you pack solid defensive walls like Jellicent, Skarmory and Gliscor all supporting Tyranitar's major weaknesses. In my opinion this change will be really beneficial as everything gets along efficiently after Tyranitar added.

Choice Band Tyranitar

Tyranitar @ Choice Band | Sandstream
Adamant | 156 HP / 252 Atk / 100 Spe
~ Stone Edge
~ Crunch
~ Pursuit
~ Superpower

For some other minor changes, I would suggest changing Blissey's spread to 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD with Bold nature. These EVs give Blissey full potential to absorb special and take on physical hits at the same time. A moveset with Aromatherapy / Stealth Rock | Softboiled| Seismic Toss / Flamethrower | Toxic would be greatly appreciated as it enhances it's ability to take on certain things. Moving onto Jellicent, I don't understand the specific purpose of running this set. It's main role in the team should be to spread burn on physical attackers that are immune to toxic spikes like Lucario, Scizor, Jirachi. A utility counter variant would be an ideal replacement for the current set. Night Shade provides consistency which comes in handy paired with Taunt and double statuses. Surf and scald are also reasonable options. While recover is one of Jellicent's most important moves, as it would be on any defensive Pokemon. It is capable of stalling out Draco Meteor from Latios, Latias, or Dragonite by using it. The EV spead and nature makes Jellicent more reliable in handling Landorus. Running double statuses may seem like a dumb idea but it essentially deals with residual damage to steel-type mons which are problematic to face. With these changes your team looks solid, Good Luck!

Support Blissey

Blissey @ Leftovers | Natural Cure
Bold | 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
~ Stealth Rock
~ Softboiled
~ Seismic Toss / Flamethrower
~ Toxic

Utility Counter Jellicent

Jellicent @ Leftovers | Water Absorb
Bold | 248 HP / 216 Def / 44 Spe
~ Night Shade / Scald / Surf
~ Will-O-Wisp
~ Recover
~ Taunt

 

[yee]

Hello muna, great job with your stall team.

I mostly second the changes Nubagator recommended, Celebi gives you a lot of benefits. It gives you another solid Fighting-resist along Jellicent, something to help absorb status from things like Jellicent / Mew and a generally bulky mon. I would use Celebi > Gliscor so you keep your solid fighting resist while having a more solid Breloom counter.

I absolutely second Will-o-wisp over Toxic on Jellicent- burning Ferrothorn and Scizor is extremely important for your team either for spinning on them or in Scizor's case being able to defeat it as the last pokemon. It's also cool against Dragon + Magnezone teams because you won't have to switch out against dragons like Haxorus and Salamence at full health and ensuring safety against them with your physical walls but Toxic is more reliable in to stall them out with.

Cursed Body on Jellicent will allow you to force out non-LO CM Reuniclus reliably, because it's Psychic gets disabled before it has a fair chance to crit and Jelli isn't 2HKOed by a boosted Psychic- I checked many Reuniclus this way and even found it more reliably then spD Jirachi as a check. Water Absorb prevents no 2HKOes on Jellicent.

I would run Knock Off > Ice Beam on Tentacruel, it's just a much better move IMO. It helps you by wearing down spinblockers like Jellicent and Sableye coming in, letting you beat them more easily with Celebi, and is generally useful against anything. Ice Beam is generally weak and Tentacruel is not safe against Dragons. I personally recommend a Calm Nature because it makes a much more significant difference than Bold but it ultimately comes down to what your team needs and your personal preference. The main things it would help against are Gengar and Heatran, the EVs would stay the same to be as efficient as possible, except for 248 HP EVs to lower hazard damage.

I know you like Charm Blissey but I think it's holding you back, I would run Wish + Protect over Softboiled and Charm. This helps out Tentacruel in particular who has no recovery and makes it easier for your team to check physical attackers who force Blissey out, and protects it from choiced pursuits. I would also change the EV spread to 72 HP / 252 def / 184 spD Bold to safely survive two Choice Specs Hydro Pumps from Rotom-W in rain, safely outstall a Sub + CM Latias without getting killed by a crit, and help patch up Blissey's low defense as well as possible. Don't worry about maxing out your HP to maximize Wish recovery- it'll always be enough coming from Blissey.

Lastly, I recommend more specially defensive spreads on Hippowdon and Skarmory. Both have massive defense to start with but benefit much more EV wise on the special side, for example I used a spread of 252 hp / 72 def / 184 spD on my Hippowdon and it was incredibly useful because Draco Meteors didn't force me out and I could take two Scalds from bulky Politoed and Tentacruel. However, you can't really afford to have your sand-starter taking Scalds without Aromatherapy, I would use 252 hp / 152 def / 104 spD- This prevents you from having to switch out of Salamence's LO Draco Meteor. This also lets you survive a +2 Jolly LO Terrakion CC, which should be more relevant but people are running the weak sub set anyway. You need to check this or else it'll run through the rest of your team should it manage to set up. For Skarmory, I would run 252 hp / 56 def / 200 spD Impish, this let's you take a +1 Virizion Focus Blast after SR and even prevents Lum DD Nite from 2HKOing with Fire Blast if it ever uses it. Here is an importable to sum up all of my changes-

Hide

Hippowdon (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 152 Def / 104 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Roar
- Slack Off

Skarmory (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Spikes
- Roost
- Brave Bird
- Whirlwind

Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 72 HP / 252 Def / 184 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Wish
- Protect
- Flamethrower
- Toxic

Tentacruel (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Rain Dish
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spd
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Knock Off
- Scald
- Toxic Spikes
- Rapid Spin

Jellicent (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Cursed Body
EVs: 248 HP / 216 Def / 44 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Surf
- Taunt
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover

Celebi @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 HP / 216 Def / 24 SDef / 20 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Reflect
- Recover

It should take only slight tweaks in your team to fix any weakness you find that you're unhappy with, great team and good luck!

Edit- Consider Hidden Power Ice on Hippo if you find SD + Taunt Gliscor annoying, lower the speed IV to 30 with a Relaxed Nature, this also conveniently ensures you are slower than Politoed for weather wars.

 

[emirinho]

Hello pretty nice team you have made here.

As you said your problems are CM reuncilus, sometimes Breloom and the steel Pokes that can't be stalled by toxic.
First of all, for a better stall you should replace charm with Wish because Blissey is too slow to Charm the fast physical sweepers as they can severely damage blissey before it even charms.
You should try Tyranitar instead of Hippowdon becauase he can beat Reuncilus easily and the steel type pokemon you mentioned with fire blast. You will also have the access to Stealth Rocks.

Try this T-tar set:

Tyranitar Leftovers
Adamant
252 Hp 128 Sp.Def 128 Atk
~Stealth Rock
~ Crunch/Pursuit
~ Fire Blast
~ Superpower

You should also try Scald instead of Surf on Jellicent because that would help you a lot against the steel type pokemon because scald has 30% chance of burn. If you cant toxic them burn them with scald.

To sum up:
-replace charm with Wish
-replace Hippowdon with Tyranitar with the set i wrote above
-replce Surf for Scald on Jellicent.

I hope I helped...

 

[muna]

Thanks to all of you for your great replies! This is my first post on Smogon in a while and I'm glad to see that the community is still in great shape. These are the changes that I'm going to test out now.

• Tentacruel changed to Calm nature
• Tentacruel given 248 HP EV's (extra 4 put in to Def)
• Ice Beam on Tentacruel replaced with Knock Off
• Toxic on Jellicent replaced with Will-o-wisp
• Jellicent's ability changed to Cursed Body
• Roar on Hippowdown replaced with Ice Fang
• Charm and Softboiled replaced with Wish and Protect on Blissey
• I replaced Gliscor with a 252HP,252Def, 4Spe Bold CM Roar Latias

I tried out several variants of Tyranitar before, but his inability to check too many Pokemon because of his weaknesses and lack of recovery didn't make up for his increased power.

I'll let you know how the testing goes, and update my post with any changes I implement ideally by tonight. Thanks again to everybody who contributed!

 

[pwnage77]

I don't really play stall that much but I suggest you replace stuff in your team.

I see some faults but it can be covered. For now, I'll suggest something about the biggest hole in your team, your Blissey.
Changes in Bold.
Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Wish
- Toxic
- Softboiled / Protect
- Flamethrower

You see, even with a predicted switch to a physical attacker then Charm, they can simply set up on you then just hit you back. A Choice Band Terrakion with a neutral attack can still OHKO Blissey with Close Combat after Stealth Rock damage. For Conkeldurr, it wouldn't mind being Charmed and can just Bulk Up right on your face as when you Toxic it, you'll just make it stronger. With Guts boost and -2 with Charm, Conkeldurr will destroy Blissey with a combination of Drain Punch and Mach Punch. And you'll totally die if it goes for Bulk Up


EDIT: You may disregard this as I have posted it right after you posted yours so I didn't get time to read your changes.

 

[Princess Bubblegum]

First off pretty solid team, I use a similar stall team myself.

But the first thing I notice I how trick Rotom-W can literally run circles around this team, something which is found on over 10% of teams. For this alone I highly suggest you use Nubagator's Celebi over Gliscor. Gliscor does little for this team considering that Skarmory + Hippowdon + Jellicent walls pretty much all physical pokemon, Gliscor doesn't add much. Also perish song on Celebi will kill that last Reunicles, and Breloom is a non-issue thanks to psychic.

Aside from that, pretty solid team, there isn't much else I can say that hasn't been said. Just give Blissey a bold nature, that is all the physical bulk it needs.

 

[yee]

I have to back up the Celebi set I posted, the extra physical bulk is quite important from him to have a back up check to things like Mienshao and Terrakion while Reflect lets it laugh at Tyranitar. Hidden Power Fire is huge because it prevents Ferrothorn, Forretress, and less bulky Skarmory from setting up on him. Reflect is a great help to give insurance against things like DD Gyara and Lucario but that is an optional slash with Perish Song if he wants to use that- Reuniclus is usually handled well enough by Jellicent and phazing. Breloom is a non-issue with Reflect though because Skarm will laugh at any bulk up variants surviving HP Fires.