Slow But Deadly

[Trogdor]

So after making a few switches to my last time, and generally getting quite frustrated by my win-loss, I decided to make another team, and to incorporate some of the pokemon who I've had lots of trouble with; namely weavile, and metagross.

After these two, I thought about what kind of strategy I should use, and I thought about using a lot of bulky sweepers that are too slow for the normal metagame, but if some speed was added could completely wreck. The first pokemon I thought of for some reason was Porygon-z, because of his ridiculous SpA, and his just barely too slow speed. I thought why not try him out, make some blissey's cringe.

After the inclusion of porygon-z, I thought i needed a bulky water who can sweep pretty easily, i thought about suicune and empoleon. After a lot of thought, I opted for empoleon mostly because of EQ and his priority in aqua jet.

After this, I considered putting lucario on my team, because in the past I've had trouble sweeping with him because of his average speed. Then I thought about a tank of a pokemon known as machamp, who if had the speed could substitute and wreck everything with dynamic punch. Machamp beat out lucario.

At this time I was trying to determine a way to make sure they each gained a speed boost, or could at least gain the time to setup. I thought about ninjask, but he annoys me a lot, and he can only reliably get +1 speed.I started looking for other bp lead pokemon, who can do ok against most common leads, and if not my other pokemon can take them out. I settled on gliscor, because if I get the chance, I can setup agility and swords dance. With lum berry, I can beat sleep leads by using agility, then taunting next turn, then using swords dance and bp. Gliscor was in.

My bulky offensive team was looking pretty good, so i played a cou[ple battles no pokemonlab and had pretty good results, with 3 straight wins, one match going on a 5 pokemon sweep with machamp behind a substitute. So without further ado, my team.

Gliscor@Lum berry
Jolly nature
Hyper Cutter
252 HP, 60 SpE 196 SpD
-Agility
-Baton Pass
-Swords Dance
-Taunt
Baton passing lead ftw. Pretty much he sets up agility on the first turn, tanking hits or status with his bulk and lum berry. Then next turn he either uses swords dance, taunts the slow setup leads, or baton passes to another pokemon. I will usually switch to machamp to counter the leads he can't beat.

Matchups against common leads, red are pokemon i have a lot of trouble with orange is pokemon i have some trouble with.

Hide

Azelf: He will usually taunt, and shut down my bp chain. I just switch
to weavile and pursuit it to death.
Aerodactyl:Will beat gliscor, will hopefully taunt as i switch to metagross and 1HKO with thunderpunch, in case he switches.
Bronzong: Beat him easily, taunt since he's slower, then agility twice as he misses the 2HKO with gyro ball, then baton pass
Forretress: same as above, need to watch out for explosion, even though it misses the 1HKO (86.4% - 101.7%)
Gengar: icy wind kills gliscor, so I switch to weavile immediately and pursuit.
Gliscor: With opposing gliscor I again switch to weavile and use ice shard.
Heatran: misses the 1HKO with fire blast, so I agility then Baton pass to empoleon
Hippowdon: I need to watch out for roar and ice fang, but ill try and get in one agility then baton pass
Infernape: I'll set up one agility, then switch to empoleon since he 2HKO with fire blast. Encore variants also cripple gliscor.
Jirachi: As of now he's a pretty big threat due to the lack of fire on my team, I'll switch to metagross and use eq after a baton pass, since ice punch misses the 1HKO on gliscor
Machamp: Ice punch doesn't get the 1HKO if he has a lum berry, so i'll agility then switch to metagross, use meteor mash then bullet punch fro the 2HKO. If i lose due to confusion, ill switch to weavile and finish him off.
Mamoswine: Misses out on the 1HKO, agility then baton pass
Metagross: same as above
Ninjask: will probably use protect then BP, so i agility then swords dance and baton pass to a counter
Roserade: Agility, and absorb the status, next turn I taunt, then setup until I feel it's necessary to switch out
Smeargle: same as above
Swampert: Ice beam misses the 1HKO, so I agility and pass to machamp then set up a sub

Weavile@life orb
Jolly nature
Pressure
252 Atk 252 SpE 4 HP
-Ice Punch
-Ice Shard
-Low Kick
-Pursuit
Pretty self explanatory set, works well in conjunction with this team in case gliscor gets beaten, I can swoop in and revenge kill. I didn't scarf it because my team has a large number of priority moves, so I didn't feel like I needed it.

Metagross@Leftovers
Adamant nature
Clear Body
252 Atk 252 SpE 4 Def
-Bullet punch
-Meteor mash
-Thunderpunch
-Earthquake

One of my bp recipients, taking the speed boost and going to town. Thunderpunch is for gyarados and bulky waters, and I chose leftovers over life orb because I didn't really feel like I needed the power boost, plus LO is on three guys in my team. I needed a survivor.

Porygon-Z@life orb
Timid nature
Adaptability
252 SpA 252 SpE 4 Def
-Nasty plot/Agility
-Tri-attack
-Thunderbolt
-Dark Pulse

One of my last ditch pokemon, use either stat-boosting attack and try and do as much damage as possible. I might use Agility, but I'm sticking with Nasty Plot for now, because hopefully gliscor will still be around to bp agility to him. Opinions on him would be nice

Empoleon@Life orb
Modest nature
Torrent
252 SpA 232 SpE 24 HP
-Aqua Jet
-Hydro Pump
-Ice Beam
-Grass Knot

Another bp recipient, attacks are their for coverage, and aqua jet is used for finishing off weakened pokemon.

Machamp@Leftovers
Adamant nature
No Guard
252 Atk 252 SpE 4 HP
-Dynamic Punch
-Substitute
-Payback
-Stone Edge

Probably the best bp recipient on the team. After recieving agility boosts and setting up a sub he becomes incredibly difficult to take down, especially with leftovers. The move set is pretty self explanatory, but I tweaked the EV's since I'm trying to get him speed boosts, so I wanted to max that out.

So there's mt team, hope you guys like it. I'm gonna play on pokemonlab more and try top determine what this team is weak against. Thanks for your time

 

[awyp]

To be honest, you have quite a nice team. The problem though I have with the team is the speed because the whole team is dependent on the Baton passer, but if something happens to ruin it, it's pretty much good game for you so I plan for you to have some-type of backup. The whole problem is speed so just to fix it a little I recommend you put Agility rather then Nasty Plot on Porygon-Z since your team has the power, but not the speed if you take out Weavile which can't carry the team on itself. Other things you might want to consider is Life orb on Metagross since it's getting baton passed on it, so it at least has to pack a punch, since Gliscor can try to only pass 1 rock polish and Metagross still has a potential to sweep. And since Metagross is all about recieving the baton pass there's no use for Bullet punch since, it's suppose to be receiving so I recommend Ice punch so you can take on more a variety of Pokemon.

 

[tomtom5858]

Watch out, if Bloo sees this, he'll lock it for the descriptions. Try to expand on them. I think that this is an okay team, but it's too reliant on the BPasser. If it gets hit with a Mamoswine lead that has Ice Shard, then your entire team collapses, as it's too slow to pull off it's own sweep.

 

[Flareon]

This is a nice team, and is very creatively built. My only thing is you might want a backup in case gliscor gets taken out. Iirc, most of your team learns agility if that helps. Maybe use a scarfer/ fast pokemon?

 

[undisputed]

Hi there Trogdor,

This is an interesting team idea you have on your hands. Baton Pass with Gliscor isn't unheard of, but I've never seen it as a lead. However, I think you could make this strategy a little better and easier to execute. To better help this team accomplish its goal, and so I don't make you an entire team, I think that you should try out Dual Screen Azelf as your lead. Not only is it an effective lead, but it can help Gliscor to easily grab boosts while taking a couple hits. In addition, I think using Dual Screen Cresselia could be beneficial. You can use DS thanks to Cress's great bulk, Lunar Dance, and then allow Gliscor to come in at full health to help another sweeper get a chance to do some work. From there, I would pick two sweepers that you feel give the whole metagame a lot of trouble and you can have a very effective team. Again, I don't want to make you a team, but Baton Pass can be a very efficient strategy with Dual Screens. More of a suggestion than a rate, so take what you want from it. Otherwise, good luck!

 

[Trogdor]

Watch out, if Bloo sees this, he'll lock it for the descriptions. Try to expand on them. I think that this is an okay team, but it's too reliant on the BPasser. If it gets hit with a Mamoswine lead that has Ice Shard, then your entire team collapses, as it's too slow to pull off it's own sweep.

My bad, I'll expand them I was just running out of time :/

Hi there Trogdor,

This is an interesting team idea you have on your hands. Baton Pass with Gliscor isn't unheard of, but I've never seen it as a lead. However, I think you could make this strategy a little better and easier to execute. To better help this team accomplish its goal, and so I don't make you an entire team, I think that you should try out Dual Screen Azelf as your lead. Not only is it an effective lead, but it can help Gliscor to easily grab boosts while taking a couple hits. In addition, I think using Dual Screen Cresselia could be beneficial. You can use DS thanks to Cress's great bulk, Lunar Dance, and then allow Gliscor to come in at full health to help another sweeper get a chance to do some work. From there, I would pick two sweepers that you feel give the whole metagame a lot of trouble and you can have a very effective team. Again, I don't want to make you a team, but Baton Pass can be a very efficient strategy with Dual Screens. More of a suggestion than a rate, so take what you want from it. Otherwise, good luck!

So what would you suggest? Replace empoleon and porygon-z for cress and azelf? They kinda feel like the weakest links on my team, and i need machamp for sure, as he just wrecks. I think machamp and metagross can wreak havoc together, with revenge killing support from weavile. I like the idea, and I'll try it out before I do anything however. Thx for the idea

 

[Lucien Lachance]

DS would really help setting up Gliscor, but DS to Gliscor to Metagross is very frowned upon as it's nearly impossible to beat without Brick Break.

Your Gliscor is probably your weakest link. Azelf and Aero are the 2 more common leads still. Both carry taunt, and both shut you down. Gliscor would benefit a lot more with EQ somethere in the set. Probably over Taunt. With EQ, Gliscor to easily check all forms of Luke barring Agi and Scarf Luke with 40 Atk and 216 Spe EVs. You can also retain a good amount of HP EVs to tank a little. Those two small changes will make Gliscor a lot better off for your team.

Favor Agi >> Nasty Plot. Speed is a little more important on such a powerful sweeper.

If Machamp recieves Spd boosts, why don't you go 248/252/8? 258 allows least amount of SR damage for highest amount HP. 8 Speed is still moderatly helpful and the added bulk will allow you to tank a lot better.

Overall a fair team but there's always improvement. Keep Burninatin' Man

 

[Bloo]

Hello, Trogdor!

I agree with the other individuals that have posted in this thread. Baton Pass Gliscor runs into several problems when taking on the lead role, mainly the threat of being Taunted by Pokémon such as Azelf and Aerodactyl. If they Taunt you, Gliscor will be rendered useless, and your strategy will fail. Gliscor would be much more effective if you didn't use him as a lead. If you're looking for a lead that can help you successfully accomplish your strategy, I'd look into a Dual Screen Azelf lead, like mentioned previously. This will throw down screens so that your Gliscor has an easier time securing 1, maybe 2, SD boosts before sending them to Metagross, who will then appreciate the tail end of the screens for securing a sweep.

Azelf's set

Azelf @ Light Clay
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Nature: Jolly
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Stealth Rock / Explosion
- Taunt

You can replace Azelf with either Weavile or Porygon-Z; one of them needs to go, seeing as 1) you already have a pretty large weakness to Fighting-type attacks and 2) they really aren't effective sweepers nor are they doing your team any favors. Here's some food for thought: on Gliscor, you can look into running either Yache Berry to have a safety blanket versus Ice-type attacks, or Leftovers for slightly some lasting bulk. If you'd prefer to stay with Lum Berry, then by all means do so.

There are a few changes on Metagross that I'd like to propose. First off, I recommend using a Lum Berry over Leftovers in order to deal with pesky status inflicting moves that can stop a Metagross sweep. If you manage to successfully past Swords Dance / Agility to Metagross, you definitely don't want a Pokémon such as Rotom-A coming in and burning you with Will-O-Wisp.

If you decide upon using Lum Berry, ditch Bullet Punch for Zen Headbutt. As of right now, your Metagross is stopped right in its tracks by most Rotom-A variants. With Zen Headbutt, you can 2HKO it, assuming you've acquired an SD boost, while absorbing Will-O-Wisp thanks to Lum Berry. After all, there isn't much point in using Bullet Punch if you're being passed a Rock Polish!

Lastly, your EV spread on 'Gross is inefficient. With 252 Speed EVs, you hit 478 Speed, which is a waste since you still fail to outpace Jolly base 100s. The highest you'll want to run is enough to hit 450, which lets you at least allows you to outspeed neutral natured base 100's at +1 (e.g. Flygon). 64 HP / 252 Atk / 192 Spe allows you to do the above while being faster than Choice Scarf Rotom-A as well.

Onto my final suggestion. You stated that Empoleon was the "weak link" of the team, and I'd have to agree with you here. If you're interested, you can try using a Gyarados in its place. Gyarados makes an excellent teammate, mainly because it can take the Water-type attacks aimed at Gliscor and the Ground-type and Fire-type attacks aimed at Metagross and setting up on them all. I'll leave this one up to you: either choose the first set or second set listed here

That's all I have. Hopefully these changes will help your team flow and function more smoothly. Best of luck!

 

[Trogdor]

Thanks for the help guys, I'm just having a hard time using dual screens azelf as a lead. Everytime I used him he ended up getting nuked or machamp got nuked the second I switched him in. I'm probably doing something wrong like trying to get too many boosts though so it's probably my fault. I agree with the most part with you bloo, and thank you for the 'gross ev spread. I'm thinking I'll replace porygon-z with azelf, since I need a good revenge killer, but I might switch weavile with somebody else.