KratosMana made a post in the snake draft discussion and included metronome gengar. I’m not sure if he ended up using it but it does have at least a slight bit of relevance.
edit: sniped
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Resource SM OU Sets Viability Rankings
- Thread starter Colonel M
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edit: sniped
This might be controversial, but imo gren's 4 attacks set is just straight-up far worse then the other 3 sets it has, and this should be reflected by at least a sub rank. Even with 4 attacks it's just too easily walled no matter what. Gren's main niche in this tier is hazards and its sets should reflect that. I definitely don't see 4 attacks gren as better than anything in A- for sure. It's definitely not around the same level as scarf.
Zygarde's top 2 sets are still marked as A+, correct that.
Why the hell are we bothering to rank scarf garchomp? Why? It suggests it's viable at all. It's not. Ever. I get the "HURR DURR IT KILLS VOLCARONA STILL" but it's just deadweight vs way too many teams right now and honestly should just go to UR.
Also I have legit never seen a suicide lead skarm in all of SM. HO is better off leading with Drill or Azelf and if you're one of those people who still use Webs Shuckle. Just unrank it.
Gliscor's set should be Protect + Toxic, the one on that new hip stall. Everything else is legit garbage. That one set is what's worth using in this meta as it actually does well on that AnnaKartana stall.
Any reason for Scolipede's SD set being D+? And there apparently being a D+ rank at all?oh wait yeah it's for scarf garchomp I don't see a reason to have a D+ there so just UR it ig.
Zygarde's top 2 sets are still marked as A+, correct that.
Why the hell are we bothering to rank scarf garchomp? Why? It suggests it's viable at all. It's not. Ever. I get the "HURR DURR IT KILLS VOLCARONA STILL" but it's just deadweight vs way too many teams right now and honestly should just go to UR.
Also I have legit never seen a suicide lead skarm in all of SM. HO is better off leading with Drill or Azelf and if you're one of those people who still use Webs Shuckle. Just unrank it.
Gliscor's set should be Protect + Toxic, the one on that new hip stall. Everything else is legit garbage. That one set is what's worth using in this meta as it actually does well on that AnnaKartana stall.
Any reason for Scolipede's SD set being D+? And there apparently being a D+ rank at all?
Why M-Gardevoir is Calm Mind and not Offensive ? Even if it's a shitmon in the meta, it almost always uses taunt/wow and not Calm Mind in the 4th slot.
OTR Reuniclus could be ranked one or two subranks below CM. It's the only TR setter that can stands on its own (maybe Magearna too but it has so many other sets). This would be its set:
Reuniclus @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 200 HP / 56 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Psychic
- Signal Beam
- Hidden Power [Fire]
Reuniclus @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 200 HP / 56 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Psychic
- Signal Beam
- Hidden Power [Fire]
Cool set but why signal beam over focus blast? What are the 56 defense Evs for?
No one uses Mega Gardevoir.
Nor Scolipede.
Anyway made the updates from this post. Thank Christ because Infernape is ass lol. I've temporarily dropped the Suicide Lead from Skarmory and made SD the only Scolipede set (though honestly Scoli is dong so why people care about it is beyond me).
Which means
is now added.
Also going to pass on adding Trick Room Reuniclus because it faces a lot of competition for a team slot in most Trick Room teams and other members have had far greater success. At least CM Reuni can fuck around with CelePex, CeleSaur, and other balance shenanigans - though it's still got a lot of problems in the meta.
Nor Scolipede.
Anyway made the updates from this post. Thank Christ because Infernape is ass lol. I've temporarily dropped the Suicide Lead from Skarmory and made SD the only Scolipede set (though honestly Scoli is dong so why people care about it is beyond me).
Which means
Also going to pass on adding Trick Room Reuniclus because it faces a lot of competition for a team slot in most Trick Room teams and other members have had far greater success. At least CM Reuni can fuck around with CelePex, CeleSaur, and other balance shenanigans - though it's still got a lot of problems in the meta.
Some things.
Toxapex should be remained "KingPex" because it's more appropriate.
I think the Defensive Heatran and Offensive Z-Crystal should be switched around. Also are we considering Utility the Sub set to? Magma Storm, Toxic, Sub, Taunt / Earth Power. Utility is a bit weird in wording here.
Sub Mawile should be a set. I would put it at A-.
CB Bulu should be above Sub SD. I think its just a better set in general and Tapu Bulu needs as much coverage as possible anyways for certain checks, something that I can think the Sub set fails to accomplish. The SubSD set is stronger on Kartana anyways.
Scarf Chomp to C. Hard to justify Chomp on a team already over something like Lando-T and better scarfers to use.
The utility set should be above Calm Mind on M-Latias and perhaps even put CM at B. I don't think the CM set is very effective and I know people like to hype it up but the vulnerability it has to Band Tar, Toxic, Magearna, and over-reliance on coverage I find makes the set very specific for certain builds / risky as your win condition. The utility in defog has similar issues but you get a reliable defogger that doesn't care about Toxic Spikes and Spikes, Lando-T, can't be trapped by Magnezone, and isn't Rock Weak all at once. These are some common issues that plague all the viable defoggers in terms of their effectiveness in removing hazards. It's more about which roles I feel M-Latias functions better with.
Hawlucha I would just name SD. I'm seeing more builds utilize other Tapus with it to activate Unburden and the corresponding seed.
Toxapex should be remained "KingPex" because it's more appropriate.
I think the Defensive Heatran and Offensive Z-Crystal should be switched around. Also are we considering Utility the Sub set to? Magma Storm, Toxic, Sub, Taunt / Earth Power. Utility is a bit weird in wording here.
Sub Mawile should be a set. I would put it at A-.
CB Bulu should be above Sub SD. I think its just a better set in general and Tapu Bulu needs as much coverage as possible anyways for certain checks, something that I can think the Sub set fails to accomplish. The SubSD set is stronger on Kartana anyways.
Scarf Chomp to C. Hard to justify Chomp on a team already over something like Lando-T and better scarfers to use.
The utility set should be above Calm Mind on M-Latias and perhaps even put CM at B. I don't think the CM set is very effective and I know people like to hype it up but the vulnerability it has to Band Tar, Toxic, Magearna, and over-reliance on coverage I find makes the set very specific for certain builds / risky as your win condition. The utility in defog has similar issues but you get a reliable defogger that doesn't care about Toxic Spikes and Spikes, Lando-T, can't be trapped by Magnezone, and isn't Rock Weak all at once. These are some common issues that plague all the viable defoggers in terms of their effectiveness in removing hazards. It's more about which roles I feel M-Latias functions better with.
Hawlucha I would just name SD. I'm seeing more builds utilize other Tapus with it to activate Unburden and the corresponding seed.
I'm not talking about SubPunch specifically. Sub / 3 attacks in General for Mawile. ABR literally used it in one of his Snake games so it definitely got used with effect and it's silly to discredit it otherwise, especially the ladder argument where Mawile isn't even seen that much because there's tons of teams roaming around with all sorts of wild shit where you can't even gauge all the time what specific sets are being used consistently. It would be bottom set for a reason anyways.
I have not seen a single Tapu Bulu set up and utilize effectively with the SD set. The Band set already smacks the majority of Balances I see and unless its the AV set Tapu Bulu should never be your only asset against Ash Ninja pivot wise, this is just bad building / playing, unless this was implied in your point and you failed to mention. It's easier to fire off shots with Tapu Bulu when using it offensively to soften cores up to supplement something else. It's a mediocre breaker with SD because its lower speed tier in comparison to its other grass counter part in Kartana plays a huge role in what it can actually hurt as the speed tier between Bulus and Kartanas is huge with important stuff like Heatran. This set is good at breaking the overhyped fat shit people have seemed to swear by (CelePex as one example), but all these similar builds have the same problem with SD Kartana and other powerful set up sweepers as well and are normally just poorly built teams in the first place. We'll probably have to agree to disagree here but I think Band is the better option for Bulu and a lot easier to fit so that's just me. It's not a mon good as a set up sweeper as opposed to just a general breaker that's really it.
I'd like to bring some attention to
, which is a set I've been using for quite some time.
Its a sick pivot with V-Create/Bolt Strike/Uturn/Trick and it has a great mu against various playstyles.
Its phenomenal bulk allows it to pivot into stuff like Tapu Lele, Mega-Medicham, Magearna, Charizard-Y etc. V-Create is an amazing move to revenge kill with. For example it has a 100% chance to OHKO Tapu Koko.
Scarf Tini getting numerous hard switch-ins while destroying everything vs offense: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-659323647
Scarf Tini contributing to beat stall: https://mega.nz/#!FJgy2QYS!5RSxqW5IK1cX2jNn0gUEBVgW1gzVz50bxVAt-v1BJFk
That being said its bad vs defensive lando as well as rocks, however, I dont think that should be enough to ignore all the other great traits it brings to a team, especially bulky offense builds, as it can be played around.
You can use defogger who defog on defensive lando such as defensive scizor and zapdos as offensive lando is not a switch-in since it gets 2hko'd by V-Create (care vs scarf).
Pokemon that appreciate Landorus-Therian removed or remove it themselfes also make for great partners such as electric types (specs Koko in particular) or Dragonium-Z Garchomp which can also switch into Heatran.
Scarf Victini: Unranked --> Somewhere in C or B-
Its a sick pivot with V-Create/Bolt Strike/Uturn/Trick and it has a great mu against various playstyles.
Its phenomenal bulk allows it to pivot into stuff like Tapu Lele, Mega-Medicham, Magearna, Charizard-Y etc. V-Create is an amazing move to revenge kill with. For example it has a 100% chance to OHKO Tapu Koko.
Scarf Tini getting numerous hard switch-ins while destroying everything vs offense: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-659323647
Scarf Tini contributing to beat stall: https://mega.nz/#!FJgy2QYS!5RSxqW5IK1cX2jNn0gUEBVgW1gzVz50bxVAt-v1BJFk
That being said its bad vs defensive lando as well as rocks, however, I dont think that should be enough to ignore all the other great traits it brings to a team, especially bulky offense builds, as it can be played around.
You can use defogger who defog on defensive lando such as defensive scizor and zapdos as offensive lando is not a switch-in since it gets 2hko'd by V-Create (care vs scarf).
Pokemon that appreciate Landorus-Therian removed or remove it themselfes also make for great partners such as electric types (specs Koko in particular) or Dragonium-Z Garchomp which can also switch into Heatran.
Scarf Victini: Unranked --> Somewhere in C or B-
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