Tournament Smogon Premier League X: SM OU Discussion

GMars

It's ya boy GEEEEEEEEMARS
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Week 5 write-up:



https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen7ou-424699 - tamahome v Sacri'

tamahome is rocking a very offensive team with a wallbreaking core of Tapu Lele + Mega Medicham with Greninja and most likely a Choice Scarf Landorus-T to provide the Speed necessary to back up the slower wallbreaking core. tamahome rounds off their team with BuluTran, most likely having their team's Rocks on Tran. Sacri' is running a more balanced team with heavy fat in Clefable, Ferrothorn, Toxapex, and Mega Latias, rounded off by a Landorus-T and a likely offensive Magearna. The same 6 mons have been used a few times in Snake, and it's a tried and true balance formula.

Mega Medicham + Psychic Terrain puts in serious work against Sacri's team. Under terrain, Zen Headbutt can easily break Clefable, and Sacri's ability to play around it hinges on smart play with Latias and Lando, depending on the set. Besides this, the high number of other wallbreakers tamahome has access to such as Swords Dance Tapu Bulu can be very threatening to Sacri's build. Initial matchup heavily favors tamahome, though they will need to avoid giving Magearna setup opportunities, as the right set could be a massive threat against their team.

tamahome leads with their Tapu Lele against Sacri's Landorus-T. Intimidate triggers first from Sacri's Lando, revealing its Choice Scarf. Able to eat any hit from Scarf Lando from full and not wanting to give the opposing Ferrothorn free turns against their own Lando, tamahome opts to stay in and go for a Psyshock as Sacri U-turns into Ferro. Not being Choiced, tamahome goes for a Hidden Power Fire, greatly weakening the opposing Ferro and living a Power Whip. Sacri' bails out into their Latias, forcing tamahome into Heatran. At this point, Sacri' reveals Surf, doing a good chunk to Tran. tamahome leaves their Tran in and lets it get down into the red in order to set up Stealth Rock, looking to keep hazards up as early as possible to aid in breaking down Sacri's defensive core and for additional information against Sacri's Clefable.

Sacri' switches into Toxapex, expecting tamahome to preserve their Heatran. Unfortunately for Sacri', tamahome reveals their Z-User: Z-Dig Greninja. This OHKOes Toxapex, though Toxapex would have ultimately only served as an annoyance to tamahome's mons through potential Scald burns and struggled against most of them otherwise. Some pivoting occurs, and a U-turn from tamahome's Lando does way more to Clefable than expected, revealing that it's hardly invested in Defense at all. tamahome sacks Tapu Lele to Clefable to set up Psychic Terrain, confident that a Terrain-boosted Zen Headbutt from Mega Medicham will KO Clefable given the previous U-turn damage. Sacri' chooses to sac Ferrothorn to Medicham, getting off a bit of chip from Iron Barbs in the process. Another cycle of Lando pivots comes and goes, Sacri' clears Rocks from the field, and Medicham is back inside against Magearna. At this stage, Shift Gear Magearna is extremely threatening to tamahome's team, so they go for a High Jump Kick to avoid taking any chances as Sacri's Lando makes another appearance to eat the damage. With a good chance to live an EQ, tamahome keeps Medicham inside and goes for a Zen Headbutt against a freshly U-turned Mega Latias.

Latias roosts up as Greninja comes out, inviting Magearna in for its chance now that Z-Dig has been burned. Sacri' reveals Shift Gear as tamahome is forced to Dig, letting Sacri' bring out their flying resist of choice for free. They go for Latias over Lando and catch a devastating Freeze from an Ice Beam. Sacri' recovers from this by predicting tamahome's Dig and switches hard into Lando, taking advantage of a seldom seen interaction to allow Earthquake to hit the semi-invulnerable Greninja and deliver a clean OHKO. Bulu comes in on the locked Landorus, taking the opportunity to get a Swords Dance up. Clefable reveals a Life Orb Fire Blast, outspeeding Tapu Bulu, but specially defensive Bulu eats it up and drains all the health back from Clef, ending the turn back at 90%. Knowing tamahome's Bulu is slow, Sacri' goes into Magearna to hope their Z-Fleur Cannon can do enough damage to kill it or put it in range of Mega Latias should it unfreeze, given how threatening the pair of Mega Latias and Landorus can be to the remainder of tamahome's team. Magearna is unable to kill Bulu and a Superpower finishes it off, leaving Bulu in range of an attack from Lati. However, it's unable to thaw, and tamahome begins gaining health back with Horn Leech. Sacri' fails to thaw over three turns, and Bulu takes the game for tamahome, netting his second win of the season for the Sharks.
 

Sacri'

a wish for peace
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GMars most of this is quite accurate but you completely missed a big part of the match up analysis. Calm Mind Latias, especially the one i was running (Surf Stored Power) was a massive threat to his team as it almost always is against this type of offensive build. I'd go as far as to say that Latias was pretty much set to sweep by turn 6 (the only potential threat being Punishment Lando which isnt used much and even then its not difficult to scout for). The freeze was what it was, I could have avoided it by just going on Lando on the first dig but you hardly ever formulate a game plan by considering an ice beam freeze on first attempt so I didn't have that many regrets, just unfortunate circumstances there.
 
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GMars

It's ya boy GEEEEEEEEMARS
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GMars most of this is quite accurate but you completely missed a big part of the match up analysis. Calm Mind Latias, especially the one i was running (Surf Stored Power) was a massive threat to his team as it almost always is against this type of offensive build. I'd go as far as to say that Latias was pretty much set to sweep by turn 6 (the only potential threat being Punishment Lando which isnt used much and even then its not difficult to scout for). The freeze was what it was, I could have avoided it by just going on Lando on the first dig but you hardly ever formulate a game plan by considering an ice beam freeze on first attempt so I didn't have that many regrets, just unfortunate circumstances there.
Forgot you mentioned it was CM at the end when writing it up, thanks for bringing that up!
 

Eternal Spirit

wrawn - screamed the magician
is a Tiering Contributoris a Past Smogon Snake Draft Champion
If theres someone thats out already and is interested to share teams/sets and talk about your games I suggest you post in this thread instead of making a new one. I will edit the op with an index linking to every post made here.

Sacri' Sabella Valentine Tamahome Tricking Spectear High Impulse Finchinator 1 True Lycan Insult ZoroDark bro fist Talah The Hallows ABR BHARATH_THEBEST obii Exiline

Kickasser Charmflash BLUNDER SANTANA Mana Poek craing ;_; Lopunny Kicks FMG Will of Fire Cdumas Empo imsosorrylol Hiye RedEmption Rewer too when you finish your runs.
 

Insult

I am a motherfucking astronaut.
is a Tiering Contributoris a defending Smogon Snake Draft Champion
Didn’t rly use too many wild teams/sets in my 5 games, but I guess I can drop 2 sets that I feel are fairly interesting.


toadvine (Reuniclus) (M) @ Psychium Z
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 188 Def / 68 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Energy Ball
- Recover
- Psyshock

Used this week 5; at this time I knew UB was in the process of getting back into OU after a bit of a tour break, so I was expecting somethig easily pilotable like medi volt turn or some other type of bo with maw/lop. In a self scout of mine, I had been pretty weak to medi, so using reuni felt like a solid pick. However, I know UB is a very offensive player, so using smth like acid armor reuni would just lose too much momentum for me, and he would be able to heavily take advantage of that set's passivity. After some fooling around, I settled on psych z eball. Psychium Z is rly nice as it allows reuni to nuke threats like sd chomp, lando, non spdef bulu, sd glisc, and the zards, (all options I thought UB could definitely use) while still maintaing its defensive capabilities and role of a long term win condition. The coverage move could be many different things, but I decided on energy ball to cover rain as well as not let gren switch in for free; also, if I fought like a quag stall, it would basically be an autowin.

endorphins (Clefable) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Thunder Wave
- Counter
- Soft-Boiled

This is a set I used vs exiline week 6, altho the main tech didn’t get to be shown, I still think this set has alot of potential in both tournament and ladder alike. Similar to UB, I was also expecting an offensive team from Exiline. In particular, I felt there was a very strong chance he would bring rain. I didn’t want to make a full rain cteam however, and had already been passed a team I really liked and wanted to use. The team was pretty weak to rain, and this clef set was a perfect fit to patch this hole, while still maintaining the same 6. This set could also bop band bulus clicking horn leech, aoa maws, +2 spdef bulus etc. Finally, twave is always nice for speed control and the evs allow me to be faster than paralyzed + speed base 100s like medi/zards.

Finally, thank you z0mOG and Eo Ut Mortus for taking a chance and bidding on me, Finchinator for always helping me with teams/testing, and the rest of the classiest/methlab for a great first team tour experience.

164841
 

Attachments

Reasoning for Ditto:
As some of you may have noticed I used Ditto three times during this tournament and its been doing great for me. If you watch my games you'll notice that I dont leave the house without a scarfer/unaware or excessive speed control / possibilities to revenge kill. My reasoning for that is that I want to avoid being swept by specific threats and add another rock/paper/scissors element in matchups, which ideally allows you to win every game if you play well. Unfortunately SM OU does not have many good scarf user (things like Keldeo/Garchomp are very very niche and largely regarded to as bad as they only succeed in the revenge killing role - and maybe in the cleaner role if everything is suuuper weakened - efficiently) so what you'd ideally want is your scarfer to offer some additional form of utility be it removing items and learning Defog (Kartana), Healing Wish and gaining momentum with great specific defenive utility (Jirachi) or Intimidate, defensive utility and gaining momentum (Landorus-Therian).
Ditto accomplishes the following feats marvelously:
1. Revenge killing of speedboosting threats
2. Major player in the stall matchup with minimal team support
3. Steel-type protection against Magnezone (Finchinator for example pointed out that my team against Hiye had only one Steel-type which was trapped by Magnezone, however, the combination of U-Turn Mega-Scizor and HP Ground Ditto is quite good at fixing that issue)
Moreover, Ditto is oftentimes useful as a midground or able to steal important moves such as Defog or Spikes and use them against its opposition.


Week 1
https://pokepast.es/7163922c8000cbcbInitially wanted to try out double AoA Nidoking + MMawile to specifically target ABR's prefered team style which was balance. I had to later fit Stealth Rock on my MMawile due to defensive reasons since Chansey needs confide to stop things like Reuniclus and Blacephalon etc.. I instantly realized that Rotom-W is very valuable post-Zygarde so I added a pivoting core of that + Helmet torn who I was also really high on (rightfully so). Electrium-Z was mainly for pex but it can also nail other things such as Tornadus and Fini & WoW burns the Grass-Types for Tornadus. Chansey+Ditto was chosen to solidify myself against special attackers whom I had nothing for up until that point as well as offense and stall. Ditto being able to trap Magnezone is of lesser significance here and was not the initial reason for its addition on this team. This team is indeed weak to the fighting type Megas and physical attackers but I was banking on physdef Tornadus + Intimidate Mawile + Ditto + Rotom-Wash to be able to handle those & ABR isnt really known for bringing Medichams or Gallades.

Week 2
https://pokepast.es/e8c4c88844940a5eThis was the first time I tried to build with Bronzong (it was a very retro looking Volc team with Fini+Bronzong which was a thing before Torn became popular) but it didnt quite make it due to the last builds being weak to a few threats on all variations. Tony suggested a mix of a different team of mine + the Volc team and it turned out nice (a tiny bit weaker to torn but still very weak to it) so thats what we went with. Ditto is not enough to handle stall on this team but we were confident Talah wouldnt bring that anyway, Metal Sound is to not lose to Reuniclus and it helps vs things like Mega Latias as well, Air Slash serves as a middle-ground between STAB and way to hit Leech Seed blockers with, it also benefits from Metal Sound. The only Grass-type it doesnt hit (Ferrothorn) gets abused hard by Volcarona (especially in terrain) which is noteworthy. Venusaur is a pretty good Pokemon overall since it handles huge threats like Mawile & Magearna and its seeds make progress as they cannot be switched into.

Week 3
https://pokepast.es/bbd57bb6003f4aaaGot inspired by Kickasser's Mega-Garchomp team and decided to use him + Ttar myself due to them being nice fire resists which is something hard to come by these days in SM OU. I had a few variations of this but I decided on Rotom+Torn and Scarf Jirachi to support Mega-Garchomp and Amoonguss rounded up the build nicely. Bit weak to the fighting Megas against but it does have a physdef Tornadus.

Week 4
https://pokepast.es/9fa51ec115162e37Decided to stall Tamahome since hes not exactly an SM OU main and the stall I decided on was Trosko Stall with something else over Tang since Zygarde was no longer a thing. Volc fits nicely to better the Mawile and Tran matchups and gives us another Defog. Sableye is physdef for Rockium Garchomp/Lando and to take on Medicham better, especially since ive been quite weak to it in my previous builds.

Week 5
https://pokepast.es/8be16a2ebd03e1e2Lando+Mag offense is actually super good and Im a bit disappointed I only brought it once. I actually developed a formula for how to run this archetype due to the amount of variations I tested out: Defensive (Scarf) Lando + AV Mage + 1-2 Fire-resists + 2 Water-resists + good Stealth Rock setter+fast breakers (these roles can overlap). By good Stealth Rock setter I dont mean sturdy and can get many opportunities to set them up but rather threatening offensively to keep them up and not be defogable like Mega-Diancie, Rockium Garchomp, Mega-Ttar, Z-move Kommo-o, etc (which also serve as a Fire-resist). Fire-resists are important since Magearna can take on every other special attacker as Ground-type special attackers do not really exist in this tier and Water-resists are necessary for the rain matchup and to cover Landorus-Therian's weakness, more often than not Kartana, particularly CB, found its way on my builds. Other things that are threatening to this archetype: Celesteela, Toxapex, Hawlucha; - be careful to cover these somehow (for example SpA Rotom-Wash). This team is relatively self-explanatory, the only thing that I would like to mention is the reasoning behind custap Rotom-Wash. At first I had Leftovers or Iapapa as consideration with Iapapa eventually winning out but getting an attack off seemed to be much more valuable for SpA invested Rotom-Wash and I had to get low anyway for Iapapa to work. This team was also a bit on the slower side of my Lando-Gear builds so the extra pseudo-priority really helps out and you can manipulate your HP with sand even.

Week 6
https://pokepast.es/ec09864ec9324ce8Kyurem looked good vs him & was a mon I really wanted to use, MegaZor+Ditto core handles offense and has the nice interaction vs Magnezone, Reuni+Pex core was something I wanted to use. Gliscor rounds up everything nicely. Team has its fair share of problems like no dark or flying resists but Kyurem lives z-fly from Landorus and Torn can get dealt with via Pex as long as it isnt Taunt, Ash-Gren is trouble but not unbeatable either. I just loved the cores and team overall against literally every other matchup in theory, having great tools for Stall, Offense and Balance as well as Rain so I still went with it.

Week 7
https://pokepast.es/158a01028c1b7889I tried out a few stall builds and this 6 turned out to be my favorite. Really wanted to stall Valentine since he's not the most knowledgeable person in SM OU and it managed to win despite running into 6 troublesome mons although I did have to play my heart out and rely on a few... not exactly chokes since the alternative plays didnt win 100% but premature steps by him.

Week 8
https://pokepast.es/5e77f87082c05d22Probably my favorite overall team. This just feels very complete, despite being rather slow I think that Mew+Lando-T are decent enough as speed control when coupled with things like BB pex, sand and sludge bomb tang which can all whittle down the opposition. Defensive core with offensive Rocks Ttar and Mag to make progress, you have to choose the moment perfectly tho since your mons that make progress can get chipped very easily.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-877185646 is a replay from the hispanic premier league a few days ago that showcases how this is supposed to be played (not saying the SPL replay is bad, this just allows every mon to showcase its purpose while in the other game mew for example was a sack to allow a switch)

Week 9
https://pokepast.es/35cedbfae13c1899At this point I was a bit out of new ideas outside of rain & Bronzong. I loved the double Leech Seed strategy I used in week 2 but wanted to remove the weak to Stealth Rock aspect and use a good rocker of my own. Knock Off Clefable helps the Suicune sweep since getting rid of Tang/Amoonguss/Pex/Fini items is very helpful. Torn is very annoying for this team and more specifically Taunt Torn rolls over this which was beautifully showcased in the actual game. I think that outside of that this team can be really dangerous against more offensive builds or balance due to Leech Seed being impossible to switch into, especially with Stealth Rock up. Chomp/Hydreigon fit in nicely for defensive and speed purposes, particularly Scarf Garchomp is pretty nice to allow Celesteela to do its thing.

Semi-Finals
https://pokepast.es/9ea0547dc73fac42I also wanted to use Rain at some point & blunder was the perfect opponent to do it against. I started off with my RMT and replaced Mimikyu with Torn to handle the Tangrowths hes been bringing a bit better and to allow Kartana to run z-move. I later changed to timid Kartana to better handle offense since that appreciates the additional bulk and Speed vs offense and without Mimikyu my offense matchup was a bit worse but Timid Kartana is by no means necessary. The spread here lives Celesteela Flamethrower in Rain after Stealth Rock while being as physically bulky as possible, it also lives things like random HP Fire in rain and 0 SpA Hurricane from Tornadus.


Funny thing I noticed is how I exclusively used Steel-types not weak to Focus Blast.

I got to use pretty much every core I REALLY wanted to use, the only thing I didnt get to show off was Bronzong with a simple mixed defensive spread which I have been trying to bring for a while due to his ability to handle a few very prominent threats (Z-Landorus, Z-Garchomp, Tapu Lele, SG Magearna) while getting up rocks reliably and not being able to get trapped by Magnezone. Here is one of the better builds I have done with Bronzong https://pokepast.es/05950025de737503.
 

talah

never salt, only sweet
is a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Simulator Driver
i'll post some of the more interesting stuff we used. might update at a later time or in a different post altogether(maybe with teams!)
(click on sprites for imports)

: mixed Chomp's been gaining traction and with good reason; DM + FB completely demolishes every single one of Rockium's usual checks while also being able to lure stuff like Mawile thinking it can take an EQ at -1, or a Ferrothorn in a 1v1. I used it against Mana, where it would've lured the Ferro and given me a huge advantage if it didn't miss and Mana used it in the same team against Spectear with more effectiveness. the defense is sorta unneeded and is used to tank a Jolly Lando's Z-Fly from full.

: Gallade has also been seeing play lately, mainly with SD+Knock Off. it's able to differentiate itself from stuff like Medi with a much superior Speed tier, abusing Garchomp & Kartana and of course Swords Dance itself, dismantling a lot of bulkier teams with a few strong plays. it's also a very big threat to Sab-less stall due to Knock Off. John used it against Will of Fire to great extent.

: Venu, albeit requiring more support than most defensive mons, when provided with said support is an absolute menace. Leech Seed is by far the best set imo while the rest are pretty self explanatory. it walls Mawile, Magearna, checks Kart extremely well, checks Ash Gren and Koko not as well, checks some variants of Prot Gren. John won with it against Empo with it being pivotal.

: Specs specifically because I consider it the strongest set. Z sets are pretty decent but Specs' ceiling is incredibly high. it's by no means a new set but it's kinda underrated & at times quite underprepped for. Roost seems like an outlier but it allows to check Tornadus-T long term as well as be able to beat stuff like Zapdos long term. it's not required but it's very useful. I used it against leru & pretty much turned the game on its head with it.

: the set I included was from a specific team and is definitely not the 'best' one or anything. that being said, Fini has made a huge comeback, being able to check a huge amount of Heatran sets, hard countering Ash Gren & being a huge annoyance to a lot of teams w/ the drop of AV Tang and SpDef Bulu. I'm personally a huge advocate of Knock Off (thanks to BKC, he was the one who pushed for it every time), crippling Pex/Ferro & more permanently instead of temporarily like NM does.

-> : this mon's absolutely fantastic rn. I love CM Boltbeam in particular, as it's nigh impossible to check with Spikes support, but T-Wave and Wish sets are also quite good. other strong CM options include CM Ice Beam + Psyshock(which allows it to get past Toxapex without Spikes) and Stored Power + Refresh, which means it can setup on Toxic (non-Taunt) Heatran, beat Toxapex long term with a lot more ease as well as do extremely well vs some Sab-less stalls. it's also one of the tier's best checks to Kartana & is in general a fuck to break.

there's a lot of other stuff that we used and a LOT more we didn't get to use but I don't wanna give away everything just yet.
 
168833
Wanted to go around cm lati cuz btb played almost only Greninja as his dark type, and +1 lati destroys it. Came up with that offense archetype that worked pretty well, scarf victini is interesting checks a lot of stuff and z kart is broken.
168834
Same archetype but with defog this time, iapapa Volc is a funny pick, triple steel seems kinda obnoxious but scizor is eved to live a scarf hp fire from zone and knock it off. The team is very solid despite not having a scarfer.
168835
Team that I brought in stour playoffs against zom0g with pex>guss. My guy Norton peaked v high and multiple times with it on the ladder
168836
I used this in olt qualification phase, its pretty solid but 6-0d by volc, but I figured it would work well against my opponent.
168837
Team that I actually builded Week 1 but didnt use it because it was very z garchomp weak. Its pretty sexy but not solid enough
168838
Someone actually passed me this, I think Hiye used it Week 4 or 5. I like those kind of balance, rain is a bitch but its p solid overall
168839
Wanted to rain since the start of spl bcs its kinda broken I feel. I went with icium and that cost me the game, obviously waterium is better. Maybe try a more bulky spread on mana with rest idk, I feel beam and psychic are both very needed
168840
ABR builded this, its pretty interesting and made me win even if thats not my playstyle
168841
Also an ABR team, also 6-0d by stall. I instantly liked when he came up with the Manectric idea. Originaly there was a Gallade>Manec
168842
Fun balance but Kyurem is ankward lol I got 6-0ed with this but I actually enjoy to play this




Pls dont play my teams against me during stour
 
https://pokepast.es/7b96494c01403498just wanted to post the original import to the team kick used that i made it for hiye. pretty standard jus wanted triple cm to eat up all playstyles and not have bad mu's. like kick said the rain mu is not the best but other than that it's definitely one of my favorite teams. surf > beam bcuz rockium chomp is outplayable in my experience and taunt tran rapes otherwise. fast hippo for mawile, tantrum is because bulu maw 6-0s.
 

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