Resource SS Doubles OU Viability Rankings (updated 10/14 on post #134)

[Ezrael]

Zeraora --> 1
Zeraora has the speed stat and the damage to deserve a tier 1 slot. Zeraora offers coverage against important metagame threats like Togekiss, Dragapult and urshifu. It also is able to provide general support for a team in the form of knock off and fake out. Often Zeraora can be preserved at low HP but still put in work in the endgame due to its speed stat and coverage. It can also run an offensive Life Orb set, which has been doing pretty well in snake. It's the second most used mon overall, and definitely deserves it.

Venu --> 3
This mon is good, but only really finds its place on sun. Venusaur is outcompeted by Amoonguss on most teams, due to greater bulk and accuracy, as well as dealing with Trick Room. It also really suffers from an abundance of goggles, which are used to combat the prevalent sun team and also amoonguss. Clicking spore into goggles feels so terrible, especially for venusaur which doesn't have enough bulk to really deal with it.

Incin --> 2
Incin is the best fire type in the format and it's not even close. there aren't any other fire types unless you're playing sun. Incin has important coverage on a lot of tier 1 mons, in addition to fake out, intimidate and pivoting potential. We all know the problem of playing incin into rocks, but rocks aren't *super* common right now, and if you're scared of them you can always use boots. I find that, in order to have a team that really respects rillaboom, I often need at least 2 grass resists, and Incineroar is an important consideration for that slot.

Sylveon --> 3/4
Sylveon sucks, and no one uses it. It's cool for Sylv that it got to be tier 2 for a while, but it clearly is not tier 2 material; if it was, it would be used.

chansey --> 4/5
The entire metagame is full of physical damage, taunt, and fake out (and knock off). Urshifu, Rillaboom, Goth, Amoonguss, Zeraora, and the sand mons all make chansey very sad, as well as anything else that a team may tech for it. Chansey, as a result, is not used very much and doesn't find a home on many teams.

urshifu --> 1
I'm not entirely sure about this one, but Urshifu is a mon I put on almost all of my teams. The entire metagame is warped around it and it can be a really good source of physical damage. It's weird because it doesn't do much in each game, but that's because it restricts play to a massive extent because of how powerful it is. I think the amount of slots it gets warrants 1.

Blastoise --> 3
Blastoise suffers from 'no more volcarona' syndrome. Blastoise is a phenomenal support pokemon that has nothing to really support. Blastoise has to compete quite a lot with both Togekiss and Amoonguss, each of which has slightly better support tools for this meta; togekiss can beat kommo-o and urshifu, and amoonguss resists urshifu's stabs and has spore. Blastoise is good, but needs to be on the right team.

Dragalge --> 4
Dragalge is winning snake games like nobody's business. Resisting FWG and fighting allows dragalge to combat incin, rillaboom, and urshifu at the same time, while offering a ton of damage with specs sludge bombs and draco meteors. might even be worth tier 3

Indeedee-F --> 4
Indeedee competes with the pokemon mentioned in the blastoise nom, and also suffers from rillaboom setting grassy terrain on it. Psyspam is kind of a meme composition, and should be relegated to tier 4.

Pult --> 2
Dragapult has a unique position in this metagame as it's one of the only pokemon that can reliably outspeed and OHKO urshifu. Dragapult can also do large chunks of damage to Incin and Rillaboom, and has the ability to switch out of shadow tag. Life orb and Choice specs are both getting a lot of use. I'm not *too* attached to this nom, but I think Pult is really good.

Goth --> 1
Goth broken. Ban Goth. I'll explain more if anyone wants me to.

kommo-o --> 2
Not entirely sold on this one. However, Kommo-o exerts a severe teambuilding restriction such that I believe it ought be tier 2. Some of the best pokemon in the tier have a very difficult time dealing with Kommo-o after it has gotten a boost, and with the abundance of fake outs in the top 2 tiers, teams with kommo-o on it have an easy time setting it up. Sometimes it is not very useful on the board, but it always has an important gameplan influence.

Togekiss --> 1
Nasty plot togekiss is a solid threat, and defensive togekiss is one of the best supports out there. Defensive togekiss is a mon that can carry goggles and protect its teammates from spore, while also managing to do decent damage to amoonguss. It also beats urshifu and rillaboom, both of which are imposing threats.

whimsi--> 4
No one uses this mon because it doesn't really do enough and there are too many fake outs. You have to have a really specific type of team to want to use it.

 

[Nails]

Incin to 1

It's the only fire type and grasses are good. It's the only ghost resist and pult is good. The psychics are epic and incin farms them. It's the only intimidate and we're playing a 2v2 metagame so it's an important ability. Knock is phenomenal atm. It ticks too many boxes, put it in 1.

 

[MajorBowman]

Incin to 1

It's the only fire type and grasses are good. It's the only ghost resist and pult is good. The psychics are epic and incin farms them. It's the only intimidate and we're playing a 2v2 metagame so it's an important ability. Knock is phenomenal atm. It ticks too many boxes, put it in 1.

 

[qsns]

Kommo-o Tier 3 -> Tier 1

Kommo-o murders nearly everything in the tier. This metagame has been defined by "what is the dumbest setup mon we can put next to the 18000 Fake Out users we have available to us" and after Volcarona's ban, Kommo-o has largely taken its place. It sets up quite easily on many of the top support Pokemon (Rillaboom, Zeraora, Incineroar, Amoonguss) and proceeds to kill everything with a +2 high powered spread move. Dragon/Fire is great coverage that's only stopped by the Fairies too bad, but with Gothitelle's existence in the tier, trapping the Togekiss or chipping the Weezing isn't too hard (not to mention the numerous setup opportunities Shadow Tag gives). It has had a phenomenal Snake so far (6th in usage, nearly a 70% winrate) and I would be really surprised if this didn't continue to dominate the pre-Crown Tundra metagame.

 

[sawamura]

UR --->Tier 5

Set Comfey

Comfey @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Triage
EVs: 252 HP / 128 Def / 128 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draining Kiss
- Floral Healing
- Protect
- Calm Mind

I just don't see why not give a Comfey a chance. The coverage that you can get with Tsaerena and Kommo is Very Good since it can Achieve Many things and good Sets that can Grant Good Results. The Triage is very Underrated and since I have tested it on the ladder for my DLT Teams and at the same Givrix it has been very useful but given the Scizor Situation, Indeedes and Tsaerenas are one of the reasons why I do not place it higher . 128 in Spa allows you to go against Kommo avoiding Follow Me and / or Rage powder to Hit with Draining Kiss and give it a good hit before and after the Omniboost (calculations made by Givrix) which can stop Threats. With Floral Healing it allows you to Abuse other objects in other mons that need the berry such as Incineroar Taking Safety Google (Sleeping is Stupidly Broken) Thus avoiding Venusaur's Sleep Powder and other Movements that allow sleep (Except Hypnosis). I have seen good results on the stairs with this Mon and the truth is that I am a little excited to see it later in the competitive.

---> Tier 1

Honestly, this is another year that we see kommo among the best in the meta. The ability to take matches is very noticeable since the support metagame is here. It gives you much more strength in your onmiboost. The Throat Spray Item To die for this Good mon. Having good Stats good Coverage Fitting almost in all Teams. It tends to be a Level 1 Threat in which players take it as a priority given that the function of the Overcoat, Rillabom's Field + Goth's Trap, Follow me here, Follow Me there, Fake Out, Incineroar in the teams, Make this mon a really sensational when it comes to getting creative in any PlayStile you could build. It just deserves the Tier 1.

---> 1

friends do not resist we know that incineroar has to deserve this position. I will not say anything else the explanations are enough

 

[Nails]

Mew -> 2

Why's this in 3? It's a super flexible utility bot, it's the best Tailwinder, best Spiker and Rocker, Psychic is a really good offensive typing right now. Pollen Puff is a sick move in a lot of situations, Taunt and Encore provide massive amounts of tempo, etc. It has its movepool and everyone knows it but the reason it's so good rn is that Psychic lines up really well into the meta. It's a core mon in the meta, and its current ranking doesn't reflect that.

Scizor -> 2

Has been around, everyone knows what it does and it's stood up to meta scrutiny and continues to be effective. It's the best steel type, it beats the best fire type, it offers very high damage on its pivot move which is sick in such a pivot heavy meta. Bullet Punch is a good solution to a lot of tricky situations and is a viable endgame wincon. It can suffer from bulk issues and it's definitely an offensive steel rather than a defensive steel, but CB U-turn is excellent.

Ninetales-A -> 5 (or 4? iunno. prob 5)

Veils are good, Blizzspam lines up well into the meta, it can outspeed and OHKO Urshifu. It has a nice support kit and can disrupt enemy weather. It might fall off when the DLC drops but it deserves its spot next to Politoed until then.

252 SpA Ninetales-Alola Moonblast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Urshifu-Rapid-Strike: 338-402 (99.1 - 117.8%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO

 

[Katy]

4 -> 3

Kyurem alongside Alolan-Ninetales is a scary combination and with Aurora-Veil Support it can just spread out hard hitting Blizzards with that amazing SpA and it offers a great Speed as well from the get go. With the right support from A-Tales and Incineroar it can truly be a monster on the field with spamming its strongest STAB. And it is able to claim safe 2HKOes.

UnRanked -> 5

With being able to threaten Pokemon like Urshifu-R, Dragalge, and Togekiss with an own decently hard-hitting Blizzard and being able to OHKO the former of these Pokemon with Moonblast it has a decent time on the field. With the well-known Aurora-Veil which is a Light Screen and Reflect in one go and the great Speed it offers a great supportive factor and it is able to set these Veil up pretty comfortably.

 

[Shadowmonstr7]

Mew -> 1

Other than maybe incin, this is the best mon in the tier rn. Due to its vast movepool it can provide a nice array of functions on a wide variety of teams. Mew has become a dominant force in recent weeks which is made evident by the fact that mew appeared on 8 of the 10 teams used in snake games last week (6 of which were the spikes set). Mew with fakeout, twind, psychic, hazards has proven to be a very splashable and incredibly potent mon in the current metagame that I believe deserves to be ranked as one of the best mons in the format.

 

[talkingtree]

Shift time! This will be our last shift until the Crown Tundra metagame has settled a little bit (at least a week after release), but once you feel like you've gotten a hang of the new Pokemon feel free to nominate them regardless.

Dragalge UR → Tier 4

votes

Ezrael: My nom

Qsns: 3. Dragalge is killing everything with its amazing offensive typing. There are no good steel types in this format, so poison is very effective. It pairs extremely well with broken Gothitelle and defensively, it doesn’t take much from the tier’s best Pokemon besides Goth. It’s won 5/6 of its Snake games and deserves to move up significantly.

talkingtree: 4. Definitely super strong, but a little bit awkward to position correctly and suffers a bit from having three strong Psychic-types in the meta.

MajorBowman: 4. Agree with tree that it seems a little difficult to put it in a spot where it will start claiming souls. Absolutely has the capability to do so, just needs a bit of help

Paraplegic: 3. It clicks buttons and things get erased. It has the right support to do well right now and it’s showing in snake.

SMB: 4, struggles vs sand, useless when not in tr, only fits in semiroom builds

Gothitelle Tier 2 → Tier 1

votes

Ezrael: 1. While we’re not at the point in the metagame where the optimal play for any team is to lead two random mons and always switch to Goth + Melmetal, goth is way more splashable. The same parts of goth are good, but breaking defensive cores is critical in this metagame, and very difficult. Not many pokemon have lots of damage output, so being able to ensure that your damage output is always super effective is very important. Gothitelle can also provide important speed control with Trick Room or shut down defensive threats with Taunt.

Qsns: 0 it’s fucking goth lmao

talkingtree: 1, Goth's super splashable in this meta and deserves to be placed at the top of the list.

MajorBowman: I mean yeah

Paraplegic: 1. Ban stag

SMB: goth is pretty weak rn compared with other states of the metagame but hasn’t ever been this splashable, tier 2 is fine.

Weezing-G Tier 2 → Tier 1

votes

Ezrael: 2. I think Weezing sucks as a pokemon, and almost never gets to do what it wants done. Weezing offers very little offensive presence in any particular situation, not even ko’ing kommo-o with dazzling gleam. Tspikes is a very powerful move, but as a result of it being so powerful, almost every team has a poison type. Neutralizing gas is a very strong ability, but you give up a lot of pressure to have it.

Qsns: 2. Weezing-G is mostly a threat in the teambuilder. It has rare times where it can be extremely, extremely scary (neutralizing an important ability, TSpikes vs. a non-Poison team) but on the field it’s often pretty mediocre.

talkingtree: 2, qsns said it perfectly.

MajorBowman: 2, there are some games when Weezing basically lets you control the entire game but those aren’t nearly often enough to put it in 1

Paraplegic: 2. I love weezing way more than everyone and everything, but it really doesnt deserve tier 1.

SMB: tier 2, checks many stuff and it’s great in some offense teams but that’s it, definitely not good enough for tier 1

Zeraora Tier 2 → Tier 1

votes

Ezrael: My nom.

Qsns: 1. Very high usage ‘mon that provides both a fantastic offensive presence and a fantastic support presence (I value Knock Off very highly right now).

talkingtree: Yeah, LO sets rising in popularity also shows that it has a little bit of versatility.

MajorBowman: 1, great combination of power, coverage, and versatility. It would be hard to find a team that wouldn’t benefit from having a Zeraora on it

Paraplegic: 1. Maybe I’m crazy but I think this is the best mon in the meta. It’s such a good glue on basically any team and its set variety both in terms of items and coverage moves allows it to do basically whatever you’d want it to do.

SMB: 1, fastest relevant mon, hits strong, can also fulfill a support role, offensive check to many other threats

Venusaur Tier 2 → Tier 3

votes

Ezrael: 3. Venusaur doesn’t have as much presence as it did back in the melmetal metagame. There are too many safety goggles in the metagame for venusaur to safely click sleep powder, and most of the mons that don’t have goggles threaten it as well. Venusaur is a very important mon for Sun, but that puts it in the same tier as Charizard and Ninetales.

Qsns: 3. Venusaur is now a good sun Pokemon and should just be ranked with the good sun Pokemon.

talkingtree: 3, what they said.

MajorBowman: 3, agree with Ezrael

Paraplegic: 3. Agree with them all

SMB: Tier 3 or even 4, only fits in sun, most other teams opt for tsareena, rillaboom or amoonguss for their grass type slot.

Incineroar Tier 3 → Tier 2 → Tier 1

votes

Ezrael: 1. I think Incineroar offers too many solid traits into this metagame. Incineroar neuters the damage of critical mons like Scizor, Rillaboom, and Zeraora with the only intimidate in the format. Incin is immune to psychic, allowing it to be a valuable check to Necrozma and Mew. Incin is also a strong response to dragapult, often forcing trades that remove the pult. Incin suffers slightly from the loss of super sitrus berries, but is able to use any item it wants to suit the needs of the team. Incin is one of the best safety goggles carriers, can become immune to hazards with boots, take a ton less special damage with AV, or be generally bulky with sitrus berry. Finally, Knock Off is a phenomenal move in this metagame. Incin is able to remove Boots, or safety goggles, or choice bands from mons that would really like to have them. There is almost no good switch in to knock off in this metagame. Judging incin by the standards of last year is a mistake, because our tier 1 mon is rillaboom as opposed to koko fini lando meta. Incin is tier 1 in the meta that we have. Incin is as good as boomer, zeraora, and togekiss, and slightly worse than gothitelle.

Qsns: 2. I think Incineroar has many valuable traits as a support Pokemon that not much else can offer in the format. That being said, its matchups into almost everything are just “fine.” It usually takes a significant amount of chip damage while switching into a threat and the chip damage is not as recoverable as the previous gen, meaning its longevity throughout the match is seriously compromised. I don’t think this is as dominating as the other Tier 1 Pokemon.

talkingtree: 2, I'm with qsns on this one. I'm no longer of the opinion that the cat is terrible, because a few of the recent trends definitely help its utility (psychics and scizor rising, mainly). But I still don't think it's consistently useful enough to be in tier 1.

MajorBowman: I definitely see the arguments for putting it in 1 because it’s a pretty solid blanket check to a lot of the good mons in this format, but I think I’d stick to 2 for now because it basically has to pick its poison when it comes to items. Vest/berry gives you more general longevity but as soon as hazards are on the field you find yourself really wanting boots. Either one you pick you’re missing out on a lot of opportunities to switch and pivot, which is really what Incineroar wants to be consistently doing.

Paraplegic: 2. Qsns,tree, and bowman covered my thoughts

SMB: if this could run 3 items it would be tier 1, afaik it can’t so tier 2 is fine

Sylveon Tier 2 → Tier 4

votes

Ezrael: My nom. Sylveon just doesn’t get used, and for a good reason. Sylveon doesn’t have enough bulk to run an offensive set, and doesn’t have enough damage to run a defensive set.

Qsns: 4. Its physical bulk is bad and most good stuff is physical

talkingtree: 4, honestly could even be 5. I have no desire to use Sylveon on any team.

MajorBowman: 4, Sylveon had its month of popularity and then almost entirely died out, agree with all three of the above

Paraplegic: 4 or 5 lol. Sylv doesnt really seem to have a place in this meta

SMB: yeah either 4 or 5

Chansey Tier 3 → Tier 5

votes

Ezrael: my nom. Every team has knock off and physical damage.

Qsns: UR. chansey is better into offensive metagames and also metagames with less Gothitelle.

talkingtree: UR, I think Chansey is useless right now. I'd be okay with 5 too, but I have yet to see a team in Snake that Chansey would be even somewhat okay playing against.

MajorBowman: UR, agree with tree. Kill it with fire

Paraplegic: UR. chansey sucks right now

SMB: UR, too passive for this metagame, knock off and goth are too relevant for this to shine

Urshifu-R Tier 2 → Tier 1

votes

Ezrael: 2. This was my nomination, but I have since reconsidered it. Urshifu loses to pretty much every top pokemon, but still is an extraordinarily powerful pokemon. The ability to hit through protect makes clicking moves with urshifu very safe into any mon, and allows it to do solid damage to threats like Kommo-o, Togekiss, and Excadrill. Urshifu is not tier 1 though, because it loses to mons like Mew, Necrozma, Dragapult, Zeraora, Gothitelle, and Rillaboom. You can play around them, but it is tricky.

Qsns: 3. This mon loses to the STABs of nearly every top Pokemon and unlike the good Urshifu, there are things that can actually tank both of its STABs (Amoonguss, Rillaboom, Dragalge). Protect is not a very good move right now - regardless of their matchup into Urshifu, most Pokemon in the format don’t run it. This metagame is extremely unfavorable for Urshifu-R.

talkingtree: 3, I honestly have trouble getting Urshifu to work on most builds.

MajorBowman: 2, I still think Urshifu is a pretty solid breaker. Even if not many Pokemon are running Protect, you still force the ones that do into an awkward spot when Urshifu is on the field. Surging Strikes is a very good move, and Urshifu also abuses the hell out of the increasingly common Incineroar.

Paraplegic: 2. I'm inclined to agree with bowman here

SMB: definitely not tier 1. Ig tier 2 is fine because with nice positioning is really threatening but most teams have 2-3 good switch ins to it. Mew outspeeding it is pretty bad too.

Blastoise Tier 1 → Tier 3

votes

Ezrael: My nom. Blastoise doesn’t have anything to support in this metagame.

Qsns: 3. Suffers heavily from the loss of Volcarona, as this now doesn’t pair super well with Kommo-o, the best setup Pokemon in the tier.

talkingtree: Yeah 3. Every team has a Grass-type, lots of teams also have Zeraora, and Kommo-o/Togekiss would both rather have Amoonguss as their redirector.

MajorBowman: I’d say 2 for now, Fake Out + Follow Me + Flip Turn is still an absurdly good combo. Blastoise definitely suffers from some of the current trends (Zeraora specifically) and I could see it falling to 3 eventually but I’d still rate it pretty highly.

Paraplegic: 3. Toise is still toise and its kit is insane, but meta conditions are super unkind to him

SMB: tier 3 or 4, meta is dominated by grass and dragon types and zeraora is arguably the best mon rn, i’d rather have any other redirection mon instead of blastoise. Also imagine being a water type that doesn’t check fire types.

Indeedee-F Tier 3 → Tier 4

votes

Ezrael: 4. Indeedee only finds its home on hard TR, which is not that good right now. Hard TR has trouble with Rillaboom and Taunt, and some of the strong defensive mons in the meta. Indeedee is key to the team, but the team is not strong.

talkingtree: 4's description fits better, so let's drop it

MajorBowman: 4, Ezrael said it well

Paraplegic: 4. Agree with above

SMB: 4, psyspam has always been cheese and bad, as ezrael said this only fits on hard tr

Dragapult Tier 3 → Tier 2

votes

Ezrael: 2. Pult gets to force favorable trades with almost every mon in the format, with the exception of Zeraora. Were it not for Zera, I think pult would be a straightforward tier 1. However, as it currently stands, Pult has to find a position where it’s not being threatened by a faster knock off before it gets its free meteors off. When it does though, they do a bunch of damage to whatever is in the way.

Qsns: 2

talkingtree: 2. Psychics are good, so Ghost is a good STAB to have, and resisting Grass is a great trait to have as a fast offensive mon. There are still a few things that Pult has to play around, but it's a solid hole-puncher especially when paired with Goth.

MajorBowman: Yes, one of the best cleaners in the tier right now imo, whether it be with Dragon Darts or the (probably better) specs set. Though it gets eaten up by Zeraora, that’s really the only thing Dragapult has to worry about when it’s on the field since it can pretty easily just uturn out on other bad matchups.

Paraplegic: 2. Pult is fantastic right now. Its so good at spreading damage and is one of the best offensive options in the tier currently

SMB: 2, great coverage, excellent sun check, meta is really kind to it with so many psychic and dragon types being good

Kommo-o Tier 3 → Tier 1

votes

Qsns: 1, my nom

talkingtree: 2. I think Kommo-o is the best setup user right now, but there are just a couple small traits that keep me from calling it 1. Namely, Kommo-o is fairly weak before the boost (umbry's Kommo-o failed to take out a 29% Mew in her game today), and it requires some support to truly thrive. That support is easy enough to provide (Fairy killers, hazards, Fake Out and/or redirection, etc), but Kommo-o on its own isn't self-sufficient enough or overwhelmingly threatening enough to reach 1 in my opinion.

MajorBowman: 2, I think Kommo-o is great but it has a far too glaring weakness to Fairies to be higher than 2. Like tree said, it’s pretty weak before it sets up, and it requires some help to get set up without sacrificing too much. Still eating shit against fairies even after it sets up is really disappointing, and you really can’t drop any move for Flash Cannon to give yourself an out unless you give up better coverage or Protect, neither of which is optimal.

Ezrael: 1, it’s really hard to go wrong using Kommo-o. Sure, Kommo-o needs support, but the mons it likes to have supporting it are all tier 1 or tier 2 threats, like Incin, Mew, Amoonguss, Zeraora and gothitelle. Kommo-o is one of the only mons that does damage in the tier. Sure, it may not do damage before it boosts, but there are teams that are not required to use clangorous soul. I’ve played my last few games in snake without getting the +1 boost and just using the damage of clang into +1 clang which can wreck teams. Clang is a win con and a damage dealer and a steel check and fits on a ton of teams.

Paraplegic: 1. I have nothing to add, everyone else said it well. I just want to say kommo in tier 1 is literally my favorite thing EVER. clang clang

SMB: 2, agree with bowman and tree here. I think it’s been overhyped a bit since many teams are dropping their mandatory fairy type to use 2 psychic types, and sometimes that’s not good enough to check kommo

Togekiss Tier 2 → Tier 1

votes

Qsns: 1

talkingtree: stay 2. I think Kiss is towards the top of Tier 2 but it's not really something that I'd want to put on lots of teams. Scizor, Dragalge, and Zeraora all rising as offensive threats are unfortunate trends for it, and I find both sets to be just a little bit underwhelming in most games -- not quite taking the hits you want in the case of Follow Me, and not quite netting the KOes you want in the case of NP.

MajorBowman: Agree with tree that Togekiss feels more like a top end of 2 mon. Both of its sets are great and can provide a lot of utility for its team, it just doesn’t feel like either set is good enough to push it over the edge to 1. Its win against Urshifu is pretty contingent on it being near full health when it eats a Surging Strikes and getting chip damage onto Togekiss isn’t particularly hard, and the support set doesn’t take hits from some of the popular threats well enough to sit on the field as long as you would want it to.

Ezrael: 2, what they said

Paraplegic: 2. Agree with tree and bowman

SMB: 2, agree with bowman and tree

Whimsicott Tier 3 → Tier 4

votes

Ezrael: 4, my nom. Whimsicott is fundamentally very powerful, but struggles to find a place in this metagame. Priority tailwind is phenomenal, but there aren’t really teams that want the uniquely priority tailwind when they could run mew, which offers a pretty quick tailwind with a lot of bulk and utility, or togekiss, which is a lot bulkier than either.

Qsns: 4

talkingtree: 4, what Ezrael said

MajorBowman: 4, Ezrael said it well

Paraplegic: 4. Ezrael did in fact say it well
SMB: does this even gets usage. 4 ig

Comfey UR → Tier 5

votes

Ezrael: UR. I appreciate the theory behind comfey; it kills Kommo-o before slow fake outs or follow me, but I have to see it in action first. I doubt Comfey does much outside of the Kommo-o matchup and that might be problematic for comfey.

Qsns: UR

talkingtree: UR, what Ezrael said

MajorBowman: UR, Triage is cool but it doesn’t seem nearly useful enough to do anything other than snipe Kommo and get off one Floral Healing before it gets knocked out. Comfey’s bulk really lets it down, if it were a bit fatter it would probably be a reliable mon.

Paraplegic: UR. I have faced this mon more than enough on the ladder to know that its actually trash and doesnt do much worthwhile

SMB: I’ve been using this to ladder from time to time and i can confirm it’s gastrodon tier

Mew Tier 3 → Tier 2

votes

Ezrael: I wouldn’t be upset with mew to 1.

Qsns: 2

talkingtree: 2, honestly thought it was 2 already. Pretty much a no-brainer.

MajorBowman: absolutely

Paraplegic: easy 2.

SMB: easiest 2 ever

Scizor Tier 3 → Tier 2

votes

Ezrael: I think scizor is phenomenally strong right now. Hazard stack meta is actually really strong for scizor, as it gets to clean up late games with bullet punch. Scizor is one of the reasons I’ve been seriously considering tsareena on a lot of teams. I think scizor finds its home really easily, and is really potent. 2

Qsns: abstain

talkingtree: Stay 3. The hazard stack meta keeps Scizor from being more of a terror, so even though it can roll up to some great matchups, I often find it dying before being able to complete its job. Still a great powerful mon, but I don't think it's quite tier 2 material.

MajorBowman: 3, definitely agree with tree

Paraplegic: 2. I agree with Ezrael

SMB: I’d say keep in 3, although it has impressed me lately because i thought it was a lot worse, but i still don’t see it at the same level than the mons currently on tier 2

Ninetales-A UR → Tier 4

votes

Ezrael: 5, but Hail is a fire team.

Qsns: 5

talkingtree: 5's fine, haven't really seen it enough to say more than that.

MajorBowman: 5, I don’t want to prematurely throw a mon into 4 just because of its success on exactly one team

Paraplegic: 5. Needs to be seen more but the potential is very obviously there as of now

SMB: 5 ig, i’d like to see more of it, it has potential as it has been said

Changes:
UR → Tier 4
Tier 2 → Tier 1
Tier 2 → Tier 1
Tier 2 → Tier 3
Tier 3 → Tier 2
Tier 2 → Tier 4
Tier 3 → UR
Tier 1 → Tier 3
Tier 3 → Tier 4
Tier 3 → Tier 2
Tier 3 → Tier 2
Tier 3 → Tier 4
Tier 3 → Tier 2
UR → Tier 5

 

[Commander Beta]

I have been toying around in my test account too much to talk soundingly about metagame staples, but here is one beauty I discovered.

Naganadel UR->4/5. This is just a perfect pokemon for countering the early meta, give it a life orb and it deals a surprising amount of damage, giving it plenty of 0HKO (I must admit some of it is probably down to surprise factor) ,not to mention it's STABs are well suited to destroying monsters such as Zygarde, Salamence, non scarf Tapu Lele, Tapu Fini (depends on spread) Tapu Koko (it resists it's attacks quite well in spite of being outsped) whilst dealing heavy damage to even AV Rillaboom, and in general, any fairy/dragon better run in fear, to round up it's coverage you have your choice of flamethrower and fire blast to surprise opposing kartana in particular, or instead run Tailwind to take advantage of the offensive pressure once they do discover it's power.

A few tough matchups hold it back, but I have found Heatran is a great pairing as it checks most of it's counters except for scarf Landorus-Therian, which given how many flying mons are ran these days, is probably fine.

 

[Badger]

Zygarde UR -> 1/2. The mon literally does everything you need it to. It hits hard, spreads paralyzations out, sets up, and has the most spammable move in the game. It's almost uncounterable unless you have a super fast ice type move or something but it's one of the hardest things in the game to revenge kill. A set I've seen is Protect, Thousand Arrows, Espeed, DDance. It works on almost every team due to the spamability of thousand arrows and one of the easiest set up opportunities in the game. I'd say it's almost uncounterable, but if y'all know how to please let me know.

 

[Actuarily]

Zygarde UR -> 1/2. The mon literally does everything you need it to. It hits hard, spreads paralyzations out, sets up, and has the most spammable move in the game. It's almost uncounterable unless you have a super fast ice type move or something but it's one of the hardest things in the game to revenge kill. A set I've seen is Protect, Thousand Arrows, Espeed, DDance. It works on almost every team due to the spamability of thousand arrows and one of the easiest set up opportunities in the game. I'd say it's almost uncounterable, but if y'all know how to please let me know.

An ice move from any bulky Pokémon such as Cresellia, Suicune, Glastrier. Fairy moves, such as from Fini (who also prevents glare). Grass types that resist ground such as Rillaboom and Tsareena (who also can run triple axel). Also intimidate cycling, roar/whirlwind, and spectral thief to steal the boosts.

Zygarde is really good, but there are plenty of ways to stop it.

 

[GRAND EMPRESS]

Zygarde UR -> 1/2. The mon literally does everything you need it to. It hits hard, spreads paralyzations out, sets up, and has the most spammable move in the game. It's almost uncounterable unless you have a super fast ice type move or something but it's one of the hardest things in the game to revenge kill. A set I've seen is Protect, Thousand Arrows, Espeed, DDance. It works on almost every team due to the spamability of thousand arrows and one of the easiest set up opportunities in the game. I'd say it's almost uncounterable, but if y'all know how to please let me know.

Zygaede -> T3 imo.

It definitely is pressive, and Thousand Arrows IS really stupid, but has plenty of checks to it. It hates Intimidate. Rillaboom exists. Fairies and especially stray Ice coverage maims it. Lot of common mons and scarfers can get the jump on it if it hasn’t boosted yet. Huge threat, but nothing world-breaking

 

[megacrazyhand]

Diancie --> T4/5 T 1/2 See edit.

I'd like to nominate Diancie to be Tier 4 or 5. It is a useful Trick Room setter that lets you pack an amazing spread move, good bulk, decent typing, and decent power all into one slot. Currently, it faces competition from Pokemon like Hatterene and Porygon 2 for its team slot and it doesn't seem like its essential to have on Trick Room at the moment. Still, its spread move is stronger than Dazzling Gleam and doesn't require Psychic Terrain up to work, and it can run Weakness Policy to punish opponents trying to kill it. Overall, it has pretty good team synergy with other Trick Room members but it requires support to work. I don't think its a staple, but its a really nice Trick Room setter to have and I think that qualifies it to be either Tier 4 or 5.

Edit: So I forgot that Diancie gets Body Press. Body Press makes it much better than I was going off of there and might make it Tier 1 or 2. Diamond Storming into Body Press lets it actually take care of Steel types more reliably. The ability to get defensive boosts while doing damage and then abuse those defensive boosts to hurt your opponent is extremely good.

 

[GimTomato]

Kartana UR-->T3
Not Really Much to say about this one. Give it a sash, slice the opposing mons to dust until it inevitable gets chunked by heat wave/volc, which it can kill with aerial ace anyway unless it's their Volc is sashed. As soon as you let this little paper sword kill one mon, it steamrolls everything not named metagross or aegislash. It has a decent chance to ko heatran, and with a twuser it can do much, much more. Just don't throw it at fire types and youre golden with this thing.

 

[TechPug VGC]

Ok im new to the fourms, but i will say one thing. I play both doubles and singles alot, and i see no problem with kartana or Metagross. People say there to "Meta breaking" or to "Broken" or "It should be in Ubers not OU". Kartana gets chunked by heat wave, heck it loses alot of hp if hit by a sp attack move, and with metagross, just burn it. I do that every time and they ethier rage quit or they hit me, and it does like nothing even at plus 2.

If were talking about a pokemon that should be banned to ubers, is genesect. He is scary with choice band u-turn, or thats just me idk. My point is, idk why people think kartana and metagross are op as, they are really not and are over hyped pokemon, but i could be wrong, when i versed them, ive won like 80% of the time.

**EDIT** Okay so im reading over this, and i see people are giving emojis on it. I hope there good emojis, like they dont mean anything, because if they mean something bad, i am deeply sorry if i said something wrong.

 

[talkingtree]

I'm locking this thread until all the council votes are done; there will be too many drastic shifts to reasonably rank any Pokemon or accurately nominate them. Take this time to figure out how to navigate the new meta and once things have settled a bit I'll open the thread back up.