Metagame SS Monotype Metagame Discussion

Eien

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Monotype Leader
Welcome to the Monotype metagame discussion thread!
Monotype on Showdown

Monotype is a really simple concept; you build a team of six Pokemon sharing one common type and fight against teams with the same restriction. You are allowed to use Pokemon with dual-typing on a team represented by either type, but every other Pokemon must share at least one type with the dual-typed Pokemon. For example, you can use Gyarados, a Water / Flying type Pokemon, on a Water or a Flying team. If you choose Gyarados, you can also use Jellicent, a Water / Ghost type Pokemon, and create a Water team with the two of them, but you cannot use Noivern, a Flying / Dragon type Pokemon, on that team because it does not share a type with Gyarados and Jellicent.


Using six Pokemon of the same type can lead to some interesting team archetypes, and it challenges teambuilders to make sure the common weaknesses a certain type of Pokemon share are covered as best as possible. This metagame allows for all kinds of Pokemon to be viable against top threats, so be imaginative. As you play, you'll find many unique threats that aren't common in the usage based tiers.

The Monotype metagame features builds from all playstyles—Offense, Balance, and Stall. The playstyle will often reflect the Pokemon available on that type. For instance, there are many strong offensive Fighting types, but the type lacks reliable defensive Pokemon. As such, a Stall Fighting-type team is hard to make, while Offensive Fighting is more likely to be viable. The best Monotype players build and play a wide variety of types, using teams that capitalize on the strengths of an individual type. Forcing your favorite type into an archetype that it will struggle to pull off is a good way to lose matches and get frustrated!


Tiering and Discussion
Monotype has its own tiering, which is based on the tiering philosophy. The metagame is led by a 7-man council, each with an equal say in tiering decisions.

You may find the current banlist in the Monotype entry on the Smogdex.
This thread is meant for discussion—not just requesting bans! That said, if you feel anything not on these banlists is too overpowered for the meta, this is the place to discuss it. All tiering discussion should be framed within the context of the Monotype Tiering Philosophy, which you can find below. Additionally, if you want to recommend a Pokemon for suspect testing, include some evidence and reasoning why you think said Pokemon is broken. Just saying something like, "I think Kyurem-Black should be banned because it has base 170 Attack." is a post that will get deleted, and it won't get you taken seriously. Back up your claim with replays showing how the Pokemon is overpowered in practice. Tell us how it interacts against other types/playstyles, what checks and counters it, its role on the team type(s) where it's played (going back to the Kyurem-Black example, how does it play on Mono-Ice vs. Mono-Dragon?), and so on. If you need any advice or have any questions on things you think are broken but are unsure what the best way to post is, contact a member of the Monotype Council either through message or on Showdown in the Monotype room.

As a final thought, before you post, think about what you're saying and whether it adds anything to the conversation or sparks discussion. If not, add to it until it does. Let's make an effort to have fun while keeping a certain level of mature conversation!

Special note: This thread is for metagame discussion, not tiering philosophy discussion. If you would like to propose a policy change then please start a private message with the members of the Monotype council. If the council would like to field general discussion on the tiering philosophy then it will make a post requesting input from the community.
 
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Moosical

big yikes
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Moderator
Hot take #1 using mod powers to get the first post of gen8 :bloblul:.

Before any bans are discussed for tiering purposes during the quickban stage I think Dynamax as a mechanic needs to be assessed. On paper, Dynamax is very overwhelming and impactful to the game that it drastically affects how games turns out. Pokemon that would not (necessarily) be broken on any individual type are extremely threatening with little to no counter play with Dynamax, especially given the Monotype environment. Although it's only Day 2, I think that a huge amount of individual Pokemon would need to be banned if Dynamax stays.

This, however, is a very tricky subject as it is such a huge part of Generation 8, banning a whole mechanic early in the life of the metagame could be a bit controversial. What truly is enough time to assess if it's broken given that it's brand new? On the flip side, I do not think that quickbans can begin until a decision is made on Dynamax. But, let's look at a couple of different aspects of Dynamax that make it seem overwhelming on paper:

Dynamax + Choice item
As shown in this video, if you have a Choice item equipped on your Pokemon and then Dynamax, you are not limited to only 1 move. This effectively means that your Pokemon has +1 Speed/Attack/Special Attack (depending on the item you're using) for free without being locked into only 1 move, one of the balancing factors of Choice items themselves. Powerful items have negative effects for a reason. This makes trying to check Pokemon that use Dynamax much more difficult, especially for those using Choice Band/Specs as your typical defensive check that relies on resisting the move they locked into now has to deal with the Pokemon's other coverage moves, not to mention those moves being boosted in damage themselves.

Edit: Strikethrough for the part that apparently isn't true.

Stat boosting Dynamax moves
Not all Dynamax moves were created equally. The ones that boost your own Pokemon's stats are incredibly impactful to the way the battle turns out and what the opponent can even do to deal with said Pokemon. Some examples would be Fighting boosting Attack, Flying boosting Speed, and Poison boosting Special Attack. While the Poison one is less impactful as Poison is generally a bad/rare coverage move, the other two are extremely threatening, especially Flying.

Any Pokemon with decent Speed, natural access to a primary offensive-boosting move, and an at least halfway decent Flying-type attack becomes incredibly threatening with Dynamax. Togekiss is a great example of a Pokemon like this. Access to Nasty Plot means that it can immediately gain +2 Special Attack and then go Dynamax the next turn and start blasting out STAB Dynamax Flying moves that are not only incredibly powerful, but also give it +1 Speed on each use, making it increasingly difficult to deal with. What makes it even harder to deal with is the increased HP values from going Dynamax, as described next. While Togekiss is only one example, this holds true for basically any Pokemon with a Flying-type move that they can afford to run, meaning there's the potential for a plethora of Pokemon to be broken for a similar reason.

Fighting Dynamax moves are similarly powerful but rather look for Pokemon with moves that boost their Speed or have naturally high Speed to make them difficult to deal with. An example off the top of my head would be Barraskweda. With incredibly high Speed, let alone under Rain, it can freely dish out a Fighting type Dynamax move or two to get +1/+2 Attack and then start blasting out STAB Water Dynamax moves (that also set Rain) to blast through teams when given the opportunity. For certain teams, there's hardly any counterplay for this, especially in Monotype. It goes even further when you consider that the Barraskewda in question could even be using a Choice Band to further bolster its naturally high Attack.

Weather/Terrain
Generally, I think the Dynamax moves that set weather or a terrain upon use are much less of a problem on their own. The problem is more when you combine it with the stat boosting and increased HP values. Teams that are built around weather status become even more difficult to deal with as now you have to ALSO deal with weather abusers being able to set the weather themselves without any negative.

Generally, I don't think Sand is a problem outside of Excadrill (who is a big problem on his own), but you can't necessarily say the same about Rain. Rain has a good chunk of Pokemon with Swift Swim that can abuse Rain in this generation. With Dynamax, these Pokemon don't even require Rain to be already on the field in order to become effective. By Dynamaxing, they can set their own Rain with offensive moves and re-set it every turn of Dynamax if your opponent removes it. It's way too much compression of factors that kept Rain in check in previous generations. The only real effective means of dealing with this would be to cancel their weather by using a Dynamax Fire/Ice/Rock move to change the weather, but already 2 of those 3 are resisted by Water, meaning you're doing next to no damage just to cancel Rain. That being said, the Ice/Hail version is not broken inherently either for similar reasons to Sand (ie, not boosting your type's attacks on top of boosting Speed with abilities).

While I haven't played around with Sun or Terrains yet, I can see them also being potentially broken for similar reasons to Rain (ie, boosting type damage), but without the factor of boosting your Pokemon's Speed through ability either. However, Sun in particular is dangerous due to Pokemon like Charizard that take advantage of Solar Power along with boosted Fire damage from Sun.

Dynamax HP Values
The increasing HP value upon Dynamax only further exacerbates the issues laid out above. When going Dynamax, your HP pool doubles, which makes it even more difficult to check these Pokemon. By effectively doubling your bulk, typical offensive checks won't work as they often won't deal enough damage to take down the Pokemon in question any more. The doubled bulk makes it even easier to "get away" with the scenarios I described above, where you use a stat boosting move prior to Dynamaxing so long as the Pokemon you're against does not immediately threaten you, which often is the case.

How to deal with Dynamax Pokemon?
Obviously there are ways to deal with Dynamax Pokemon as a whole - the problem is that the majority of types do not have this ability.

Personally, I don't think there's any reliable check to the Choice item problem listed above, beyond having your own Choiced Pokemon to expend for Dynamax that happens to beat the one they're using. Choice Band/Specs into Dynamax means defensive checks likely won't work anymore (obviously case by case) as theyre free to use whatever coverage they want and the Choice Scarf variant means offensive checks likely won't work either unless your Pokemon happens to be faster still AND you're most likely forced into Dynamax as well.

To deal with the stat boosting variant, there's hardly any counter play. The best you could do is Haze, which is shakey at best given that Haze Pokemon are typically very slow meaning they have to be able to take the oncoming move in the first place, not to mention needing to sack Pokemon just to get them in safely. Phaze will not work as you cannot Whirlwind or Roar out a Dynamax Pokemon. Unaware is so rare this generation that I don't think it's even worth mentioning, and Quagsire itself likely won't be able to check these Pokemon as they're using boosted BP moves.

So realistically, the best you could do is hope that your own Dynamax Pokemon beats your opponents and if it doesn't...well...too bad. Given the limitations of Monotype as a metagame in the first place, I think Dynamax has the potential to be way too much.

Take Home Message
As I mentioned, it's still only Day 2 of the metagame and therefore Dynamax has hardly had enough time to be tested. At the risk of looking like a fool, there are a lot of factors on paper that make Dynamax incredibly dangerous, especially in the Monotype environment. I think a very careful and scrutinizing eye needs to be placed on Dynamax as we progress through the early stages of the metagame, especially before anything else is quick banned.
 
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DYA

formerly DeadYouAre
Ban Scarf Dynamax Excadrill ASAP LOL

Well, jokes aside Excadrill Scarf is a very powerful Pokemon that can solo most types with Dynamax. I think it is 100% suspect worthy because some types just can't afford to stop it's Rock-, Steel and Ground-type coverage.

And because we are talking about Excadrill, I wanna say Steel is pretty much better that how much people were supposing before the release.
One my big surprise is our little friend Durant.
This thing in a Band set can just spam his new First Impression every time it comes to field, being able to even take 50-40% to non ultra bulky mons that resist it. Then if required you can use Dynamax to sweep. One bad thing of Durant is that it needs to run Hustle to keep his insane sheer power, making it fail decisive moves.

Another Pokemon I like is Duraludon

This guy is a decent physical wall with a good Spa stat, can fill the role as rocker too if needed and can run status moves like Thunder Wave.

Next Pokemon is Corviknight

This one is a Skarmory with better Spd stat, having Pressure makes it able to win a situation where the opposite Pokemon spams Stealth Rock and you spamming Defog. U-turn is a good way to keep momentum as well.

Another incorporation is the unban of Aegislash

This thing is pretty solid, getting the nerf in my opinion was good so we can enjoy his good offensive and defensive capabilities. It got some new moves such as Close Combat but I don't like to run that, a Gyro Ball + Shadow Claw coverage is enough.


Nothing much to say, I've tried to build some types but didn't work as much as Steel did, mostly because the Ice Spam. It has some flaws like Darmanitan-Galar being able to just click Flare Blitz for free and almost every Pokemon.

Shoutouts to TieR for making the team that became the base of this post.
 

Eien

is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Battle Simulator Administratoris a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
Monotype Leader
Initial takes on types in no real order:

1. Flying doesn't care about how bad its Pokemon are. Max Flying is Max Flying LMAO. HO Flying is a real team with Gyarados + Hawlucha being able to Max sweep almost everything. Then there's other options like Charizard with Solar Power + Sun from Max Fire and Max Flying from Hurricane giving +1. It's not amazing and most weather teams are extremely good at beating it, but weather vs HO is well obvious. You can combo these monsters with other setup sweepers like even the GOD Swoobat. Now that it learns Nasty Plot, it goes right to +4 with the STAB 100 BP Stored Power. If you can afford to Max Flying with it, you get +2 Speed, and only priority (a fair answer) can stop it. I've been running Xatu on this team for both the amazing Magic Bounce but also dual screens. Xatu is surprisingly fast at 317 and can set both screens + use Thunder Wave and U-turn. It's a pretty nice budget HO lead option. No Stealth Rock really hurts and I haven't found much room to have a lot of Boots users, but Dynamax has turned Flying from what was looking like an extremely poor type into a competitive one. I haven't cared to try Corviknight because I don't really think it fits on HO, so my team is all old Pokemon.

2. Ground is legit one of the best types. Excadrill beats almost everything. While in Dynamax, it can boost either or both of Defense or Special Defense, making it pretty unkillable even after its 2x HP wears off. That in combination with the fact it can set its own sand with Max Rock and Hippowdon is allowed to run Smooth Rock at the moment means Excadrill is a fucking monster. Very few types can actually prevent a late-game sweep. In addition to Excadrill, I've been trying max hp max def Seismitoad. The common Swift Swim users right now are both physical because for some reason no one is using Ludicolo, and Swift Swim Seismitoad doesn't really beat Water Absorb Seismitoad. This lets Ground have a real shot at beating Water, especially since Dugtrio is running around trapping Drednaw. Same story vs Ice, you just trap Alolan Ninetales and let Excadrill go to town. It's pretty nuts. Ground doesn't really have bad matchups outside of like Grass, but you don't automatically lose because Mamoswine goes to town, and you have outplay potential. Honestly, my team has 6 Pokemon from Gen 5 and earlier. I'm sure you can try to fit Runerigus or whatever, but Ground is Ground. The same formula for the past 3 generations is probably not going anywhere.

3. Water appears to be reprising its role as the most flexible type. I think rain is really strong but Water really can't fit everything it wants. I haven't even been running Toxic Spikes on Toxapex so far because I don't think the hazard is nearly as mandatory as it was in SM. Even though a lot of types lost removal, there are enough airborne threats and Boots users that I'm okay with dropping it. I'm sure I'll go back to using it in the future, but for now, I love having Toxic for on-demand poison on the Flying threats like Gyarados. Water just has a ton of options and I'm not sure what's best yet. Araquanid can get Sticky Web versus a lot of teams, and you still have access to Pelipper + Seismitoad for even more speed control and both Defog and Stealth Rock. Like with Flying, the access to Gyarados is essential and makes Water surprisingly good against even Electric and Ice once it gets a single Dragon Dance. I've been running Boots and Sitrus Berry on mine, to try to give Gyarados that little bit extra health to survive the Ice Shard and Shadow Sneak priority spam. I want to see Crawdaunt work, but the more I play, the less I like it, since Ghost can actually handle it between the annoyances of Mimikyu and the fact Aqua Jet doesn't really touch Dragapult. The new Water Swift Swimmers in rain are competing for some of the strongest wallbreakers, at least until the 170 BP moves become more reliable with the Rush abilities. Then you also have the fat wall of Jellicent, which recently got Strength Sap, and is a pretty crazy beast. Going to be really interesting what builds emerge as the strongest from Water's many options.

4. Ghost is great as expected. Dragapult is quite unfortunately a lot worse now that Choice Band doesn't boost during Dynamax. However, not being locked into 2-3 turn Outrage and charge up for Phantom Force is such a godsend for it. It's pretty much relegated to U-turn spam and Dynamax duty, but it does those jobs pretty damn well. Access to Mimikyu is extremely clutch, since Disguise is so powerful right now against Dynamax options and generally revenge killing. As much of a meme Wood Hammer is, I've been trying that out because fuck Ground and Water lol. Aegislash is actually fairly manageable, especially since Dynamax doesn't allow it to keep using priority Shadow Sneak, and it lost Toxic, so its defensive sets are almost not useful at all. Stallbreaker Sableye is back on the menu as well. Will-O-Wisp is super disgusting for a lot of teams, and it can just stall out a lot of the sweepers that rely on boosting thanks to Prankster Taunt. The main problem I've found for Ghost is handling weather teams. Sand kinda just eats everything up with Excadrill, and rain beats anything without Shedinja almost for free, and Shedinja can't really touch Toxapex. I think Ghost is clearly much better than it has ever been.

5. Ice is where I think I'm dropping an unpopular opinion. I don't think Ice is as great as people are saying from just playing against it. Sure, it's usable, but it's way to reliant on hail and other gimmicks. You somehow still lose to a lot of types that you would expect Ice to win, which is really troubling. The Ice cube's BD shenanigans are super unreliable, and removal isn't actually that easy to find and use outside of some stuff like Mr. Rime or Avalugg. Darm seems super solid because you can't really play around it until you know what ability it has, but it does still feel pretty gimmicky. Switching out against a Zen BD Darm can be costly, but it's also a very high risk play. CB CB Darm has some of the most outrageous damage output, but it's easy to revenge kill and is fairly one-dimensional. With how fast a lot of teams are, I don't think there is enough fat to make it as unbearable as past wallbreakers have been in Monotype. Running Choice Scarf on it is another seemingly decent option that I haven't explored too much, but it just doesn't seem to have enough damage in spite of the free Choice Band due to a lack of secondary STAB. Considering both other weathers are so much more consistent against Ice (and other types) and Aegislash is running around on two types again, I'll have to experiment with it myself to see just how good it is. And to be fair, a lot of the teams I've been using are equipped with anti-Ice tech, so it's definitely got some meta impact.

More to come after more games, more sleep, and more food ;w;
 
A little analysis of how Fairy looks to be in the early gen. I've been playing it nonstop since gen 8 came out last night, Definitely not the same level it was last generation, But I believe the type can be decently viable.

I'm gonna start by listing the new Pokemon and give my thoughts on how they function on fairy

Grimmsnarl-This thing can either be a screens utility Pokemon, A hard hitting 3 attacks bulk up/Twave pokemon. Or possibly running double stabs+Screens. Overall I think it's a staple on the type and 1 of the 2 best out of the new additions

Galaranian-Weezing-This thing is for sure the best physical wall that fairy has, It can either run gas to cripple pokemon or levitate for a ground immunity. Willowisp, defog, tspikes, strange stream, poison stab for the mirror or grass. Overall I think this is the other best New pokemon for fairy

Hatterene-not bad but not great? with like Trick room Dynamax you can attempt to nuke a mon or 2 in those 3 turns. This might get a lot better once it's gigantimax comes out but for right now I think it's not necessary it's an option. Maybe like a slow garde with tr if you don't wanna run scarf garde. Magic bounce however is very nice.

Alcremie- this thing is god in doubles but pretty useless in monotype, it's most appealing factor on fairy is just how cute it is and it's fat SPDEF. not worth running.

Galaranian-Rapidash- LMFAO dude I thought we had a decent physical attacker with ground coverage but this thing is a huge letdown, kinda fast but weak overall, Not recommended but I'm sure it has a niche on some teams. maybe banded on webs could be cool.

Now for which Old mons I think do a lot for the type

Ribombee- Fairy with webs is pretty threatening for a lot of teams and I think it'll be one of the stronger archetypes within fairy. Sash webs with like moonblast+coverage moves is pretty and with psychic it can beat Toxapex and the opposing galar weezing if you're willing to dynamax psychic.

Clefable- The only rocker onfairy, Not bad overall with magic guard, Moonblast/decent coverage is nice. can run the CM set or something. Strong pick for most fairy teams, Side note I think Unaware phys def clefable with tbolt is good here too for checking gyarados.

Mimikyu- I think this is a bit worse than last gen, psychic doesnt look as strong, they have a psychic surge that's also a normal type, and ghost has kings shield aegislash which can make it harder for this thing to sweep, however it's still good overall and I think we'll still be seeing this little guy

Togekiss- due to the missing mons this thing comes back into the spotlight, Scarf isnt bad and I think it can run a twave set too. dynamax flying is broken if you didn't wanna run scarf and vs steel bug and grass you can spam flamethrower/air slash and do a lot of damage.

Shiinotic-Spore/Leech seed/strength sap, all cancer moves and this thing get's all of them. good spdef wall and can heal itself up by sporing then leeching/strength sapping. I think this is a totally viable option on fairy and isn't bad if you want it for like ground/water (excadrill still eats it's ass so unless you can cheese drill with like garde trace shit you still don't win but if drill is gone this can do work)

Gardevoir-Trace is good, good SpA stat, decent speed in this metagame. I think this is pretty decent and can be really useful with it's stabs only being resisted by steel and it gets mystical fire for those. Probably the optimal scarfer for fairy right now.

Sylveon- good SPA and good Spdef too. it's decent on fairy and might he good for wish tect+2 attacking moves but we'll have to see.

Sylvally- hate to say this but this isn't even the worst option. it's decent coverage and if you wanted to run an offensive set it's signature move got
buffed and is a lot stronger. I still don't think it's great but it's definitely usable

as for all the other mons I haven't found any of them to be useful yet but I'll keep testing sets and stuff and try to give an update on what they can do to assist fairy this generation.

All things considered I think it's a mid tier type so far and that could change with certain pokemon being banned/the rest of the mechanics being added or fixed. I think for the type to really thrive we have to hope excadrill stays broken enough to recieve the ban hammer.

EDIT: I've made a ton more teams and I think Fairy is actually one of the top types, the only mu I think is very very hard is ground.
 
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No one is posting teams so I thought I would share, just a quick team I made for fun to use to battle friends. My favourite mon this gen is definitely darmanitan so wanted to build a team with it right away. Hits way too hard and is just fun to spam icicle crash, even beating toxapex with it.

https://pokepast.es/a8909cee8843be44

It's a pretty standard team, main differences are that weavile lost its 2 main moves, so foul play and throat chop it is. However, scarf weavile is actually really good so far, being able to outspeed crazy fast threats like barraskewda and dragapult, and now with max knuckle giving you a +1 atk raise, foul play is very clutch. Dynamaxing weavile is also really good because FP turns into a 170 bp move and it gets rid of ur scarf so you can change up moves. Rotom is on here as more of a gimmick with its item, if you miss blizzard you get a +2 speed increase so its nice regardless. Anyways, have fun with it, wish I could have put arctozolt but sadly slush rush is unreleased.
 
Post Dexit monotype teams lost access to up to half their available mons, putting much more restriction on teambuilding than there was in previous gens. Many previously essential mons to Monotype teams are not available at all, drastically changing the teams that we'll see this gen. With that in mind, here's some lists of what mons are currently available, and what viable mons (as of most recent USM viability rankings) from last gen are now gone.

Butterfree
Shuckle (C)
Ninjask
Shedinja
Vespiquen
Crustle
Escavalier
Galvantula (A)
Accelgor
Durant (D)
Vikavolt
Ribombee (D)
Araquanid (B)
Golisopod
Silvally
Orbeetle
Centiskorch
Frosmoth

LOST:
Armaldo (S)
Volcarona (S)
Forretress (A)
Heracross (A)
Mega Pinsir (A)
Mega Scizor (A)
Scizor (A)
Buzzwole (B)
Mega Heracross (B)
Scolipede (C)
Yanmega (C)
Vivillon (D)
Alolan Persian (waiting on transfer)
Umbreon
Tyranitar (A)
Shiftry
Sableye
Crawdaunt (D)
Skuntank
Drapion
Weavile (C)
Liepard
Scrafty
Bisharp (B)
Mandibuzz (S)
Hydreigon (A)
Pangoro
Malamar
Incineroar (waiting on transfer)
Silvally
Thievul
Grimmsnarl
Obstagoon
Morpeko

LOST:
Greninja (S)
Alolan Muk (S)
Mega Sableye (A)
Krookodile (B)
Mega Tyranitar (B)
Mega Sharpedo (C)
Cacturne (D)
Honchkrow (D)
Flygon
Haxorus
Hydreigon (B)
Kyurem (waiting on transfer)
Goodra
Noivern
Silvally
Turtonator
Drampa
Kommo-o (A)
Flapple
Appletun
Dracozolt
Dracovish
Duraludon
Dragapult

LOST:
Dragonite (S)
Kyurem-B (S) (waiting on transfer, but with Dragon Dance access is likely not long for this world)
Latios (S)
Garchomp (A)
Latias (A)
Dragalge (B)
Mega Altaria (B)
Mega Latias (C)
Mega Garchomp (D)
Raichu
Alolan Raichu (A) (waiting on transfer)
Jolteon
Lanturn
Manectric
Rotom
Rotom-Fan
Rotom-Frost
Rotom-Heat
Rotom-Mow (C)
Rotom-Wash (S)
Galvantula
Stunfisk
Heliolisk
Vikavolt
Silvally
Togedemaru
Zeraora (S) (waiting on transfer)
Bolthund
Toxtricity
Pinurchin
Morpeko
Dracozolt
Arctozolt

LOST:
Tapu Koko (S)
Zapdos (A)
Alolan Golem (B)
Magnezone (B)
Thundurus (B)
Mega Manectric (D)
Raikou (D)
Xurkitree (D)
Clefable (A)
Alolan Ninetales (waiting on transfer)
Galarian Rapidash
Galarian Weezing
Gardevoir (D)
Mawile
Togekiss (B)
Whimsicott
Aromatisse
Slurpuff
Sylveon
Primarina (C) (waiting on transfer)
Ribombee (B)
Shiinotic
Silvally
Mimikyu (A)
Hatterene
Grimmsnarl
Alcremie

LOST:
Mega Diancie (S)
Tapu Bulu (S)
Tapu Koko (S)
Azumarill (A)
Klefki (A)
Tapu Fini (C)
Machamp
Hitmonlee
Hitmonchan
Hitmontop
Lucario (C)
Toxicroak (C)
Gallade
Conkeldurr
Throh
Sawk
Scrafty
Cobalion (A) (waiting on transfer)
Terrakion (S) (waiting on transfer)
Virizion (waiting on transfer)
Keldeo (S) (waiting on transfer)
Pangoro
Hawlucha (C)
Bewear
Passimian
Silvally
Kommo-o (A)
Marshadow (waiting on transfer, banned last gen, remains to be seen this gen but has not seen any significant nerfs)
Grapploct
Sirfetch'd
Falinks

LOST:
Mega Gallade (S)
Heracross (A)
Breloom (B)
Buzzwole (B)
Infernape (B)
Mega Heracross (D)
Charizard
Ninetales
Arcanine
Rapidash
Flareon
Torkoal (A)
Rotom-Heat (A)
Darmanitan
Chandelure
Heatmor
Incineroar (waiting on transfer)
Salazzle
Turtonator
Cinderace
Coalossal
Centiskorch

LOST:
Mega Charizard X (S)
Blacephalon (A)
Heatran (A)
Infernape (A)
Volcarona (B)
Victini (C)
Alolan Marowak (C)
Entei (D)
Mega Charizard Y (D)
Volcanion (D)
Charizard
Butterfree
Gyarados
Noctowl
Xatu
Delibird
Mantine (C)
Pelipper
Ninjask
Vespiquen
Drifblim
Togekiss (C)
Rotom-Fan
Unfezant
Swoobat
Sigilyph
Braviary
Mandibuzz (D)
Hawlucha (C)
Noivern
Silvally
Corviknight
Cramorant

LOST:
Celesteela (S)
Landorus-Therian (S)
Dragonite (A)
Gliscor (A)
Mega Aerodactyl (A)
Tornadus-Therian (A)
Zapdos (A)
Aerodactyl (B)
Landorus (B)
Mega Charizard Y (B)
Thundurus-Therian (B)
Skarmory (D)
Thundurus (D)
Gengar (A)
Galarian Corsola
Shedinja (D)
Sableye
Dusclops (D)
Drifblim
Dusknoir
Froslass (D)
Rotom
Cofagrigus (C)
Jellicent (B)
Chandelure
Golurk (C)
Aegislash (banned last gen, remains to be seen this gen)
Trevenant
Gourgeist (D)
Decidueye (B) (waiting on transfer)
Silvally
Mimikyu (S)
Dhelmise (D)
Marshadow (waiting on transfer, banned last gen, remains to be seen this gen but has not seen any significant nerfs)
Polteageist
Cursola
Runerigus
Dragapult

LOST:
Mega Sableye (S)
Blacephalon (A)
Alolan Marowak (A)
Hoopa (C)
Venusaur (waiting on transfer)
Vileplume
Bellossom
Celebi (B) (waiting on transfer)
Ludicolo
Shiftry
Roserade
Cherrim
Abomasnow
Leafeon
Rotom-Mow (D)
Whimsicott (B)
Maractus
Ferrothorn (S)
Virizion (waiting on transfer)
Trevenant
Gourgeist (C)
Decidueye (B) (waiting on transfer)
Shiinotic
Tsareena
Silvally
Dhelmise
Rillaboom
Eldegoss
Flapple
Appletun

LOST:
Mega Venusaur (S)
Breloom (A)
Tapu Bulu (A)
Cradily (C)
Serperior (C)
Amoonguss (D)
Dugtrio (C)
Alolan Dugtrio
Quagsire (D)
Steelix
Flygon
Whiscash
Claydol
Gastrodon (A)
Hippowdon (A)
Rhyperior
Mamoswine (B)
Excadrill (S)
Seismitoad (A)
Stunfisk
Galarian Stunfisk
Golurk
Diggersby (D)
Mudsdale
Silvally
Sandaconda
Runerigus

LOST:
Landorus (S)
Garchomp (A)
Mega Steelix (A)
Mega Garchomp (B)
Gliscor (C)
Landorus-Therian (C)
Krookodile (C)
Nidoking (C)
Mega Camerupt (D)
Alolan Ninetales (S) (waiting on transfer)
Cloyster (A)
Lapras (B)
Piloswine (A)
Delibird
Glalie
Abomasnow
Weavile (A)
Glaceon
Mamoswine (S)
Froslass (C)
Rotom-Frost (B)
Galarian Darmanitan
Vanilluxe
Beartic
Kyurem (waiting on transfer)
Avalugg (B)
Silvally
Mr. Rime
Frosmoth
Eiscue
Arctozolt
Arctovish

LOST:Kyurem-B (S) (waiting on transfer, but with Dragon Dance access is likely not long for this world)
Alolan Sandslash (A)
Walrein (B)
Cryogonal (C)
Articuno (D)
Persian
Ditto (A)
Snorlax (B)
Noctowl
Unfezant
Cinccino
Braviary
Diggersby (A)
Heliolisk (D)
Bewear (C)
Oranguru
Silvally
Drampa
Greedent
Dubwool
Obstagoon
Indeedee

LOST:
Chansey (S)
Porygon2 (S)
Staraptor (S)
Mega Lopunny (A)
Porygon-Z (A)
Mega Pidgeot (B)
Meloetta (B)
Smeargle (C)
Mega Audino (D)
Venusaur (waiting on transfer)
Vileplume
Gengar (B)
Weezing
Galarian Weezing
Qwilfish
Roserade
Skuntank (D)
Drapion
Garbodor
Toxapex (S)
Salazzle (B)
Silvally
Toxtricity

LOST:
Mega Venusaur (S)
Alolan Muk (S)
Crobat (A)
Nidoking (A)
Nihilego (A)
Scolipede (B)
Nidoqueen (C)
Dragalge (D)
Tentacruel (D)
Alolan Raichu (waiting on transfer)
Galarian Rapidash
Mew (A) (waiting on transfer)
Xatu
Espeon
Wobbuffet
Celebi (A) (waiting on transfer)
Gardevoir
Lunatone
Solrock
Claydol
Jirachi (B) (waiting on transfer)
Bronzong
Gallade
Musharna
Swoobat
Sigilyph
Gothitelle
Reuniclus (C)
Beheeyem
Meowstic
Malamar
Oranguru
Silvally
Necrozma (waiting on transfer)
Orbeetle
Hatterene
Mr. Rime
Indeedee

LOST:
Victini (S)
Deoxys-Speed (A)
Latios (A)
Mega Gallade (A)
Metagross (A)
Alakazam (B)
Latias (B)
Mega Latios (B)
Mega Latias (C)
Mega Slowbro (C)
Meloetta (C)
Slowbro (C)
Deoxys-Defense (D)
Mega Alakazam (D)
Mega Gardevoir (D)
Sudowoodo
Shuckle (S)
Tyranitar (S)
Lunatone
Solrock
Rhyperior (A)
Gigalith
Crustle
Terrakion (S) (waiting on transfer)
Barbaracle
Silvally
Drednaw
Coalossal
Stonjourner

LOST:
Mega Diancie (S)
Cradily (A)
Alolan Golem (A)
Nihilego (A)
Omastar (B)
Mega Aerodactyl (C)
Mega Tyranitar (C)
Diancie (D)
Lycanroc-Dusk (D)
Minior (D)
Stakataka (D)
Alolan Dugtrio
Steelix
Mawile
Jirachi (A) (waiting on transfer)
Bronzong (D)
Lucario (C)
Excadrill (A)
Escavalier
Ferrothorn (A)
Klingklang
Galarian Stunfisk
Bisharp (B)
Durant
Cobalion (C) (waiting on transfer)
Aegislash (banned last gen, remains to be seen this gen)
Silvally
Togedemaru
Melmetal (waiting on transfer)
Corviknight
Purrserker
Copperajah
Duraludon

LOST:
Celesteela (S)
Heatran (S)
Mega Scizor (A)
Magnezone (B)
Klefki (C)
Stakataka (C)
Empoleon (D)
Skarmory (D)
Blastoise (waiting on transfer)
Cloyster
Kingler
Seaking
Gyarados (B)
Lapras
Vaporeon
Lanturn (C)
Quagsire (C)
Qwilfish
Octillery
Mantine (C)
Ludicolo
Pelipper (B)
Wailord
Whiscash
Crawdaunt
Milotic (D)
Gastrodon (B)
Rotom-Wash (A)
Seismitoad (D)
Basculin
Jellicent (D)
Keldeo (A) (waiting on transfer)
Barbaracle
Primarina (waiting on transfer)
Wishiwashi
Toxapex (S)
Araquanid
Golisopod
Silvally
Inteleon
Drednaw
Cramorant
Barraskewda
Dracovish
Arctovish

LOST:
Greninja (S)
Mega Swampert (A)
Swampert (A)
Empoleon (B)
Mega Sharpedo (B)
Suicune (B)
Azumarill (C)
Kingdra (C)
Manaphy (C)
Mega Gyarados (C)
Mega Slowbro (C)
Slowking (C)
Alomomola (D)
Tapu Fini (D)
 
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Decem

stay hydrated
is a Community Contributor
My thoughts on the metagame so far;

Let's start with Ghost. Dragapult is honestly really good for the type, considering its natural speed and offensive presence is great for Ghost teams that have the ability to run offense effectively with it this generation. While yes, it doesn't have the best movepool, seeing as Choice Band lacks good Ghost physical STAB, and if you choose to run it with special coverage, you have to rely on its worse Special Attack stat, its huge speed is what I believe to be one of its selling points. With that being said, I've seen Dragon Dance + Dynamax Dragapult really put in work as it can just boost up, outspeed the entire metagame bar like Barraskewda under Rain and just start dismantling the opposition because Dynamax is so strong. I think Dragapult's definitely a threat to be reckoned with in the metagame as it is. Polteagiest, Cursola, Runerigus, are all decent, though Polteagiest has to really look for opportunities to setup, especially when Ghost doesn't have the necessary hazard control and its frail defensively before Shell Smashing and can't afford to take any strong attacks after setting up at all. Runerigus doesn't have recovery, which makes it a bit awkward. Leftovers Sableye is something that I think should really catch on; Taunt is pretty much your best form of "hazard control" on the type unless you feel like running the odd Dhelmise and Will-O-Wisp and Knock Off are great for just breaking things down and crippling faster threats like Excadrill and Barraskewda. It should be noted that without Heatran, Steel really hates Sableye as it cripples everything. Mimikyu is still good for checking setup and all but it can be hard to revenge kill Dynamax Pokemon since 2x HP makes it them so much bulkier while Mimikyu isn't the strongest. Ghost definitely has the potential to be a good type right now.

Steel is in an interesting spot from what I've seen, and this is just going off of my experiences playing against it. One thing thats very obvious is that no Fire immunity sucks. Sure, a lot of Pokemon that carried Fire-type attacks got deleted in the dex cut like Victini, Mega Charizard Y, Zapdos, and even Heatran itself that Steel needed Heatran to check in SM, but that's not all. It's very easy to take advantage of the lack of a Fire immunity on Steel teams especially when some Pokemon run Fire coverage. This could just be as simple as running something like Indeedee, Gardevoir, Hydreigon, G-max Charizard whatever with Fire coverage, and Steel would have trouble checking them consistently as literally nothing can switch in. On the other hand, it has access to good Pokemon like Excadrill, Aegislash, Ferrothorn and whatnot otherwise. Excadrill itself is a monster with Dynamax in the Monotype metagame right now, with everything being powered up, G-max Rockfall setting Sand and it being harder to revenge kill under it due to 2x HP makes it more threatening that it was back in SM. Aegislash I think is more managable with Dynamax but is still nice. I've also tried out Water briefly; I've only made one team which is similar to bulky offense Rain in SM but with Seismitoad over Mega Swampert and other options like Barraskewda. Although its one of the types I've explored less, I would expect it to stay as one of the good if not best types this generation. Water always has a ton of options, which is why its successful basically in any Monotype format because having a lot of Pokemon to work with is important in a metagame where you're "restricted" by same type clause. This generation is no different, with old good Pokemon like Toxapex, Gyarados, Seismitoad, Lanturn, Quagsire, and a few others returning, while new options like Barraskewda, arise. It'll have to rely on worse options for hazard removal though, as you can't fit Defog on Rotom-W and Pelipper anymore unless Pokehome lets us transfer Pokemon.

Other types I've tried out include Normal, Bug, and Poison, which I feel are all fairly niche and struggle because of the dex cut like a lot of people expected. Normal is a weird combination of offensive Pokemon and Ditto without its defensive core, and no way to set Stealth Rock by itself. I don't expect it to hold its own ground like in previous generations where it had strong defensive support in Porygon2, Staraptor, and Chansey and has proved itself to be flimsy. Bug has a cool option in Dynamax Durant which can be threatening with Hustle, but the lack of Rapid Spin users along with some of its most potent offensive threats missing really hurts as a type that's supposed to focus mainly on offense. Yeah, Heavy Duty Boots is also cool, but even with it, its not enough. Similar to Normal, Poison's removal of most of its defensive core bar Toxapex and Stealth Rock also makes it struggle. Toxapex is one of the main selling points of it, but even that is surprisingly easy to break with Dynamax being ever so present, while on Water, it has a complete set of Pokemon that can form a sturdy defensive core. I'm interested to see where Dynamax itself goes as the main mechanic of the generation. It's been pretty nuts from what I've played with and against it, but after all, it's only been two days, and I'm giving it more time until I form a more educated opinion on it. I'm sorry if this post isn't the most accurate because the metagame's only been out for two days, but I'll continue to post as I play and build more while the metagame develops.
 
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I can't say I expected this metagame to be this whack.

So basically fighting is arguably one of the worst types this gen due to the widespread access of dynamax flying sweepers. Without a proper neutrality to stop it in the form of either cobalion or terrakion, fighting gets swept by any flying type or strong mon with a flying move. Dynamax really made this type a lot worse than I expected. Aside from that, it also suffers in the steel MU as now that we don't have infernape we now have a harder time winning against steel assuming aegislash is staying. At least until keldeo comes back. A lot of the issues fighting has right now can be remedied by the swords of justice coming back, so its best to just be patient and wait until they come back because right now the type is not doing too well.

Ground is a type I thought was going to be overrated originally, but I was proven wrong. Excadrill is bonkers under sand along with dynamax if a team lacks a dedicated check to it. And because of the way dynamax + choice items work (in which you get to still choose moves after you dynamax and then choose another move when you are freed from dynamax), this mon has insane sweep potential. Its stabs boost both of its defenses in dynamax, and it can set its own sand if needed. A lot of other users before me have said this but I'll say it again, ground right now is exca + 5 mons. Sandless ground is not that good anymore but you still have a decent lead in claydol to make it work, but due to the lack of strong offensive mons out of sand like landorus, nidoking, and mega steelix, its harder to justify its use. Overall though, ground is looking like one of the best types. I'll drop a team that I am using to test the waters with right here.

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Whirlwind

Excadrill @ Choice Band
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rock Slide
- Rapid Spin

Mamoswine @ Choice Band
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Icicle Crash
- Ice Shard
- Superpower

Seismitoad @ Choice Specs
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 116 HP / 252 SpA / 140 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Earth Power
- Sludge Wave
- Focus Blast

Flygon @ Choice Scarf / Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- U-turn / Dragon Dance
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Fire Blast / Fire Punch

Diggersby @ Life Orb
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
- Quick Attack
- Mega Kick


And yes before anyone says it I am using choice specs seismitoad so I can at least have something to break physical walls with. Also people have used dugtrio or gastrodon on other ground builds over diggersby, its up to you which one you like as it is too early to see what is the best mon for the last slot, but i feel like the first 5 mons are pretty solid (their sets maybe not so much).

A lot of people have been saying that ghost is good and after trying it out I completely agree. This type now has bonkers offensive capability with dragapult, mimikyu, gengar and other mons allowing it to be crazy effective. I think ghost may be one of the types to look out for this gen, which is a first for that type in quite some time.

I agree with most of what everyone else in the thread is saying as well, just to save time on rehashing what others have said about other types I tried. However, I have not used fire, dragon, or dark extensively yet and will post when I can about them.
 
Water:
Water seems to be in a really good position in the meta. Having an actual defensive pivot is something very few other types are able to boast at the moment. Toxapex will likely be S tier again, but I could see it dropping due to the power that dynamaxing offers wall breakers. The sheer number of viable Pokémon water has access to allows it to be really creative in abusing the dynamax mechanic. Pokémon like gyarados and berraskewda turn into unstoppable sweepers for weaker types, and often force the opponent to dynamax themselves to answer the sweep. Balanced swift swim seems to be the build of choice right now. Toxic spikes makes using protect/max guard a viable option for stalling out dynamax Pokémon.

Berraskewda was probably completely ignored by most people during spoiler season, but it’s stats seem to be really solid. I don’t know where this Pokémon will fall in a couple of months, but right now it’s movepool is proving to be really useful on balanced rain teams.

Berraskewda Movepool:
Waterfall
Aqua jet

Close Combat
Drill Run
Poison Jab
Ice Fang
Psychic Fangs

Current thoughts on the new Pokémon that I have used:

Berraskewda- Great coverage and sweeping potential, but no useful secondary typing brings it down. Its rather frail, so teammates like toxapex and u-turn pelipper are really important for getting a safe switch. B tier

Inteleon- very similar to berraskewda, but without a useful ability. maybe a C or D tier

Drednaw- the typing isn’t very useful, and it’s stats are pretty poor. It’s speed can be made up for by the fact that it gets swift swim, but it’s outclassed by seismitoad as a swift swim user

Dracovish- it’s a bulky dragon/water type with strong jaw. Unfortunately it’s bulk is only used passively because it doesn’t have access to reliable recovery. I don’t think this Pokémon will be used much.
 
Been playing a lot the past few days and I wanted to give my take on the current meta. The top 5 types in no specific order seem to be Steel, Water, Psychic, Ghost and Ground. Dark and Dragon are solid too while Fairy and Ice are pretty mid but still usable. Normal isn't too great but it has some niches like Ditto to revenge kill Dynamax Pokemon and Curse Snorlax which for some types can be very hard to kill. Most of these have already been covered above so I'll mainly focus on Psychic and what it can do in the current meta but real quick I want to point out that hazard stacking is very good right now especially on Steel with Stealth Rock Bronzong (Heatproof) + Spikes Ferrothorn. Both Defog and Rapid Spin are rare and you do have Aegislash for spin blocking.

Anyways here's a Psychic team I made that works pretty well in my experience.
Gallade (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Knock Off
- Shadow Sneak

Gardevoir (F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Trace
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Psyshock
- Mystical Fire
- Thunderbolt

Bronzong @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Gyro Ball
- Hypnosis
- Earthquake

Indeedee (M) @ Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psychic
- Shadow Ball
- Dazzling Gleam
- Hyper Voice

Reuniclus (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Psychic
- Thunder

Hatterene-Gmax (F) @ Room Service
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Psychic
- Dazzling Gleam
- Mystical Fire
- Trick Room


Until Celebi, Jirachi, and Necrozma? come out, these are pretty much the best Pokemon that Psychic has. I don't really know what to do with Mew since it gets no recovery and no Defog, and I don't think an offensive dual dance set is necessary here. Mold Breaker Excadrill is a big threat to this team but in my opinion it's not worth running Xatu / Sigilyph for a "real" Ground immunity because it can just Dynamax Rock anyway so the only counter play is to Gigantamax Hatterene which can live an unboosted Max Steelspike, or put Focus Blast on Reuniclus. I'm very big on Hatterene, thanks to its Magic Bounce ability, access to Mystical Fire and very low Speed, it checks the aforementioned threat that is Ferrothorn pretty well because Gyro Ball does around 24 percent and prevents it from stacking up hazards. If you get this thing going it can put in a ton of work against pretty much any type. Indeedee is also a great addition to Psychic, especially since Ghost is so good right now and Psychic Surge can help out the rest of the team against priority moves from Aegislash, Mimikyu etc. The other Pokemon are self explanatory, Gallade is the physical wallbreaker, Scarf Gardevoir is a nice revenge killer especially against weather abusers, Bronzong for rocks and somewhat of a special tank and Reuni as a bulky setup mon that can be annoying for some teams to break. In conclusion Psychic has the tools to deal with the top types currently (except Ground, although Steel is not an easy matchup either), and it's only going to get better after it gets Jirachi, and Celebi.
 
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ELECTRIC

After playing a lot of electric and testing out many pokemon ill make my post on how I see electric overall, it has got significantly weaker from gen 7 as electric will now only face its good matchups and wont stand a chance against the bad ones, balance is a playstyle that was lost along with zapdos, having a defensive core is not viable at all, only rotom wash of course, so to sum up, the only viable playstyle is Hyper Offense, mixing fast attackers and bulky attackers and should focus on its strenghts, trying to get a lot of coverage will result on your team weakening against most matchups.
On the bright side, electric is a team that is not swept as easily by those dynamax flying moves everyone complains about (yay)

Here is how an electric tier list would look like in my opinion (of course, open to discussion), plus I will explain each pokemon individualy

S:
jolteon.gif

For a fast attacker jolteon is definitively the best option, its main appeal will be its very fast speed plus decent special attack, jolteon speed in only suprassed by dragapult and barraskewda (who I doubt it runs jolly so you should be faster out of rain), he is also the best volt switch pivoter followed by rotom wash, I found zap plate, choice specs and choice scarf to be the most effective items for him as keeping our HP with him will be very important if we decide to go dynamax with him, which is also very good for late game sweeping, jolteon is the best when it comes to abusing electric's advantages only being held back by the lack of coverage, only having shadow ball to hit other targets for neutral damage when thunderbolt is resisted or innefective
rotom-wash.gif

Despite Defog and Pain split being a huge loss for rotom, he will still hold its position as a mandatory pokemon because our main use for rotom is to check a lot of physical threats that could sweep our team otherwise, a dynamax rotom can save you from powerhouses like excadrill and barraskewda, as well as almost any physical threat, simply the best option when it comes to ground inmunity and water resist and stab

A:
toxtricity.png

Definitively something you are gonna see on every electric team, mandatory for its sheer power with its ability punk rock plus strong sound based moves, toxtricity is a very splashable pokemon being able to run many different sets, which include both scarf and specs aswell as a fearsome shift gear + throat spray setup sweeper
dracozolt.png

Dracozolt is electric's best physical attacker (until zeraora arrives), he has a good defensive typing which is pretty helpful altho his main attractive is his insane attack when using hustle, nothing will be glad to switch into this and a lot of walls cant stand his bolt beak, even managing to OHKO bronzong who otherwise is pretty annoying for electric to deal with, access to fire fang is a good adition to be able to hit ferrothorn which is also totally unbreakable otherwise, the main thing that holds him back is that he is very slow, it dosent have to much bulk to compensate for this, there are many things capable of taking him down in one hit unless you wanna run it with no speed, tho this is a little worse, also the fact that he relies on hustle to have a good offensive pressure, which he does not have if he dosent run it
morpeko.png

Morpeko has a niche as the only hazard control electric has as morpeko learns rapid spin, it also gets few other support moves like parting shot and taunt, offensively morpeko with aura wheel and a life orb can be pretty powerfull, doing a lot of damage and making ghost and psychic matchups easier, since aura wheel boosts our speed morpeko odes great for late game cleaning

B:
arctozolt.png

Of course the only viable pokemon that has ice moves is gonna make it here, having boltbeam coverage is quite handy, plus he learns freeze dry so that also allows him to check water/ground types like seismitoad and gastrodon, this is also the most bulky offensive pokemon that electric has, its very difficult to OHKO him on his base form and on dynamax he is going to take a lot of hits before dying. However its horrible speed holds it from a higher position, it gets hurt a lot by hazards so heavy duty boots is your best bet on this pokemon and it will be a one time use thing as he will get worn down quickly
vikavolt.gif

Vikavolt getting access to Sticky Webs makes him a lot better than Galvantula for a team that wants to abuse of webs, its far bulkier and does a lot more damage with that insane special attack he has, making him another candidate for dynamax if the situation demands it, I think this pokemon is great overall, only hurt by his slow speed and maybe that not all teams want to make use of webs

C:

boltund.png

Boltund is also another niche holder, this time on strong jaw and access to fire fang, giving electric fire coverage, he also gets another tools like Play Rough and Bulk Up, while all this is great it feels underwelming when it comes to offensive power, it only has 90 base attack so you either need a choice band or a couple of Bulk Ups in order to be more threatening
galvantula.gif

Honestly I dont know why would I run this over the awesome Vikavolt, Galvantula and Vikavolt are the exact same when it comes to typing and movepool and the difference lies on their stats and abilities, while Vikavolt has a lot more of special attack and bulk, Galvantula is faster and this may be the reason of why its so popular, I wanna hear everyone's thoughts on this one


Finishing with my list, there is a few pokemon I did not talk about because I neither have tried them or seem them being played and those are: Silvally, Togedemaru, Heliolisk and Lanturn. I expect them to not be as viable as other pokemon listed above because they are either outclassed by someone else or offer a niche that is to small to make up for the many flaws they have, tho if someone wants to talk about this ones feel free to do so and point us what would make them good, without futher ado ill end the post here, in the future ill make one talking about different team compositions and matchups
 
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I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that Fighting has benefited more from Dynamax than it has lost. In Lucario and Conkeldurr the type has access to some powerful priority moves to take down opposing Dynamaxes. Sirfetch'd and HDB Sawk also act as anti-meta mons in First Impression and Sturdy respectively. It is unfortunate that the type has few better options but these two perform as well as they should.

On the other hand, lots of mons that restricted Fighting's identity as an offensive type have left, such as defensive threats in Mega Sableye, Mega Venusaur, Celesteela, Tapu Fini etc. and offensive mons that suppress the type such as Tapu Koko, Latios, etc. Speed tiers in general have been lowered which helps a lot and Dynamax is potent to ensure your mon lives to eliminate big threats. (Hawlucha is an especially potent Dynamax user.) Also, almost every Fighting mon runs a high BP Fighting move which is good for Dynamax and good to consistently hit hard in general as the distribution of moves has changed.

I think Fighting right now is niche/antimeta at best, and while it does have its strengths, it gets totally rolled over by types like Psychic (especially with D-Max Mindstorm summoning Psychic Terrain). Flying I can't comment on because I haven't played a single game vs it yet but the matchup looks very rough.

I'll wait and see what the unova swords bring
 
I'll speak only about normal, since it's the type I've always been working on since years, and it's the only thing I wanna test when I'm in a new generation. (Yeah, I love normal that much.)

Normal is DEAD. Simple, clear, and concise. I'll explain why in the few incoming lines, because I playtested it a lot.

Pokemons availables are : Persian, Ditto (A), Snorlax (B), Noctowl, Unfezant Cinccino Braviary Diggersby (A) Heliolisk (D) Bewear (C) Oranguru Silvally Drampa Greedent Dubwool Obstagoon Indeedee

Basically, when you check it overall, you have almost nothing that will take a neutral damage from fighting moves, which are a great threat. The birds we have are just awful in defensive way, and the psychic hybrids don't take physical hits. With close combat becoming so mainstream, it's just impossible to keep a defensive core against it. Even in ORAS while there was scarfed terrakion which was a dangerous threat by himself, we could manage to get over him by a combination between staraptor and P2, but now, there is litteraly nothing we can do.

I bolded everything that seems like giving a try, well, I tried every pokemon in the list, but still. Thing is, there is NOTHING fast enough, nor Bulky enough. Bewear just loses to close combat despite its ability, same for every psychic hybrid who are more oriented in taking special hits than physical (if they can take any.) I wanted Oranguru to act like a cheap Meloetta, but the outcome wasn't good enough. The lack of intimidate pokemons causes the whole game to be rigged as soon as there is a stat boost, and some moves like roar on Type:null are missing compared to last gen, which makes the thing litteraly unbearable.

The attack power decreased like there is no tomorrow. The important fact is we lost return/frustration, AND the hidden power. That makes our best stab go away and rely on moves like double edge or body slam which are bad, each in its way. The pokemons we have are terribly slow compared to what you can find against you. Most of them wont even surpass 350 speed at max EV and good nature, which will make you basically run 2 or 3 scarfes if you wanna go against something that did have 1 turn to setup like Gyarados dmax or excadrill.

The only notable thing is Ditto, which is way overated, especially in monotype. Many pokemons dont have the needed coverage for sweeping their own type combination, and since Ditto is obviously a choice scarf candidate, it is predictable and you're forced to switch most of the time you're using it. That basically means absolutely nothing can save normal. We don't have bulkys, we don't have wallbreakers, we don't have ANY pokemon that can take a physical hit without faint (NO, Bewear is NOT an option). The only thing I did like while testing gen 8 is braviary CAN be good with an agility set, but again, if you rely on Diggersby/Braviary for the whole game, you're out. They're not good enough to be a reason to play normal by themselves, and any other pokemon is either too slow, not bulky enough, or not powerful enough. We rely too much on scarf to play cleverly, and we can't face threats such as excadrill or aegislash.

Not to mention any dyna pokemon will completely obliterate us.
 

Y8

formerly ara
One type that has not gotten a lot of recognition is Dark.
Dark has some of its staple pokemon still retained after the dex cut such as, Hydreigon, Tyranitar and Mandibuzz, while we still have Sableye its mega form is non existant which makes the mon very lackluster in terms of usability.

We also got a few decent additions to dark that i think can excel at filling the missing parts of the team.

Obstagoon


Obstagoon @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Facade
- Bulk Up
- Low Kick/ Close Combat

This Obstagoon set can easily replace the offensive pressure that we had with Greninja, it cannot match it exactly but it is the best variant to Greninja so far. Running Flame Orb+ Guts makes this mon a powerhouse as it enters the field with a base 216 Atk; 279 Maxed Atk it benefits severly from Guts+ Bulk Up, combined with its speed it can also outspeed certain pokemon that may check it otherwise. Knock Off is self explanatory, You can run Close Combat as a variant to Low Kick but it is very situational as Obstagoon does no appreciate the Def and SpDef Drops. Facade is also self explanatory.

Grimmsnarl


Grimmsnarl @ Light Clay
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Taunt/Thunder Wave
- Spirit Break/Darkest Lariat

Another Mon we have obtained that is very versatile is Grimmsnarl, Grimmsnarl can run a few different sets from screens to offensive pressure, its typing makes it Steel and Fairy both of which suffered a huge lose on staple pokemon, Fairy losing the Tapus + Klef and Steel losing Heatran and Megas greatly decrease the viability and otherwise usability of the types to where dark wins more matchups. Grimmsnarl can run dual screens + Taunt/Thunder Wave to make matchups easier versus such mons as Hatterene which can set Trick Room, Gyarados with DD, Mimikyu, Poltaegiest, Runerigus, Clefable and Ribombee, Getting Prankster allows it to setup screens and possibly get off a taunt/thunder wave depending on the mon. Grimmsnarl can also run a Band + Trick set


Grimmsnarl @ Choice Band
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Trick
- Play Rough
- Darkest Lariat
- Thunder Punch/Fire Punch

This set allows Grimmsnarl to choice lock an opposing mon before they can move because of the trick + prankster combination it allows Grimmsnarl to get rid of setup sweepers, somewhat hazard setters and otherwise bulky/stall like mons.

Now There are returning mons that are still very viable and have sets that can greatly impact the team. One of these mons is Tyranitar, while ttar has lost its mega form it still is a decent bulky/tanky mon with a decent movepool and stats. Another mon that has great usability and viability is Mandibuzz access to defog and Knock Off is huge because a lot of pokemon lost those two moves and it kept both of them, Mandibuzz is a bulky mon with access to recovery and hazard removal. Weavile is now more viable, it gets DD but you cannot currently use it on weavile. Weavile helps with all of the pokemon that are roaming around lately like Dragapult, it also helps versus ground because with the buff to Excadrill ground monotype more preferably the sand variant has become more and more used within the few days that SwSh has been released. Hydreigon is also a extremely viable choice being able to run Specs, Scarf or Band sets depending on the team its versatile movepool and ability to take advantage of choice items is a great component of making a dark team. There are many different ways you can go with dark offensive/defensive or balanced all of which have more than one viable set per mon

Here are some sets/variants for potential dark mons that are viable

Tyranitar @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Rock Slide/Stone Edge
- Thunder Wave
- Fire Blast

Tyranitar @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 224 HP / 32 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Rock Slide
- Crunch
- Pursuit
- Earthquake

Mandibuzz @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Overcoat
EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Roost
- Defog
- Foul Play
- U-turn/Taunt


Mandibuzz @ Leftovers/Rocky Helmet
Ability: Overcoat
EVs: 248 HP / 20 Def / 240 SpD
Careful Nature
- Defog
- Taunt/U-Turn
- Roost
- Foul Play/Knock Off

Weavile @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Ice Shard
- Low Kick
- Pursuit

Hydreigon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Fire Blast
- Focus Blast


Hydreigon @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Fire Blast
- U-turn

Hydreigon @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Roost
- Taunt

Hydreigon @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Draco Meteor
- U-turn
- Flash Cannon/Fire Blast

Please note all of these sets are optional, there are plenty more sets that you can use, these are just the sets that have worked for me as of right now. The meta hasent developed and im sure things will change within the type so take everything with a grain of salt
 
Currently trying out some new strats for Poison with a handful of alts, here are my notes so far:

- Grass / Poison seems like a necessity on a defensive team due to the resists and Ground neutrality. G-Weezing's ground immunity isn't enough seeing as how Excadrill is common and can either EQ you with Mold Breaker, or just use Iron Head which Weezing is now weak to. That said, Vileplume is still garbage and Roserade, while it packs more offensive presence than Venusaur, isn't physically bulky enough to withstand repeated switch-ins (though Natural Cure is nice).

- Team composition is extremely restricted as Toxapex, G-Weezing and a poison/dark (usually Drapion) are hard requirements when not running HO. From there, Toxtricity, Roserade (soon to be replaced by Venusaur) and Gengar are at least 2 solid tiers above the rest of your options; trying out other potentially useful mons like Salazzle and Toxicroak leave a gaping defensive hole in your team.

- Stall looks to be impossible with Toxapex alone, and the bulky offense of Gen 7 fame has been gutted. However, Hyper Offense may be a valid option with NP Gengar, Shift-Gear Toxtricity, and Salazzle.

- Hilariously, Toxicroak is a solid Dynamax Candidate as it has access to Max Airstream via Bounce, Max Knuckle for those sweet attack boosts, and priority in Sucker Punch. If you hate opposing Toxapex that much you can also run Thunder Punch; Elec/Fight/Dark coverage hits the big 3 defensive threats super effectively, but Dynamax is required or else G-Corsola lols at you and you can't break Pex otherwise. When running an offensive build, if you can save Dynamax for Croak it seems like a worthy replacement for wallbreaker Nido.

That's it for now, gonna try some other things but may have to shelve Poison at least until Venusaur is released:(
 

Perish Song

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
is a Pre-Contributor
Nice post. I'll make some additions to it.

Obstagoon


Obstagoon @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Facade
- Bulk Up
- Low Kick/ Close Combat

This Obstagoon set can easily replace the offensive pressure that we had with Greninja, it cannot match it exactly but it is the best variant to Greninja so far. Running Flame Orb+ Guts makes this mon a powerhouse as it enters the field with a base 216 Atk; 279 Maxed Atk it benefits severly from Guts+ Bulk Up, combined with its speed it can also outspeed certain pokemon that may check it otherwise. Knock Off is self explanatory, You can run Close Combat as a variant to Low Kick but it is very situational as Obstagoon does no appreciate the Def and SpDef Drops. Facade is also self explanatory.
I haven't tested this Pokemon myself so I can't really say anything about it, but people say its good. I've been almost exclusively running Dark in room tours ever since we have the format and I actually haven't even considered giving this Pokemon a chance because the way my team was functioning was pretty much enough for me to handle most of the types that can be considered viable/dominant at the moment. Its defensive capabilities are nonexistent even with Bulk Up, doesn't really help you out with any matchups that you struggle against and most importantly it stacks up Fighting-type weakness for your team. In return, it just offers Ghost-type immunity which is not really a problem for you anyway and its coverage is not that helpful for you to overcome any matchup you struggle against. Fairy still beats you, you cannot touch to Mimikyu in Ghost, Excadrill eats you alive and you don't have any proper switch-ins some of the current metagame defining Pokemons in Gyarados. So Idk. Maybe I'm overexaggerating but I don't really think this Pokemon is that beneficial for Dark-type teams.

Grimmsnarl


Grimmsnarl @ Light Clay
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Taunt/Thunder Wave
- Spirit Break/Darkest Lariat

Another Mon we have obtained that is very versatile is Grimmsnarl, Grimmsnarl can run a few different sets from screens to offensive pressure, its typing makes it Steel and Fairy both of which suffered a huge lose on staple pokemon, Fairy losing the Tapus + Klef and Steel losing Heatran and Megas greatly decrease the viability and otherwise usability of the types to where dark wins more matchups. Grimmsnarl can run dual screens + Taunt/Thunder Wave to make matchups easier versus such mons as Hatterene which can set Trick Room, Gyarados with DD, Mimikyu, Poltaegiest, Runerigus, Clefable and Ribombee, Getting Prankster allows it to setup screens and possibly get off a taunt/thunder wave depending on the mon. Grimmsnarl can also run a Band + Trick set


Grimmsnarl @ Choice Band
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Trick
- Play Rough
- Darkest Lariat
- Thunder Punch/Fire Punch

This set allows Grimmsnarl to choice lock an opposing mon before they can move because of the trick + prankster combination it allows Grimmsnarl to get rid of setup sweepers, somewhat hazard setters and otherwise bulky/stall like mons.
A nicely written analysis here, just a note that you cant Taunt Hattereene because it has Magic Bounce. Also, I will post the set I use below.

Grimmsnarl (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 196 HP / 252 Atk / 60 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Darkest Lariat
- Spirit Break
- Sucker Punch

60 Speed ensures that you outspeed Corviknight, so Steel doesn't auto-win with Bulk Up + Body Press. It is also why I run Darkest Lariat in this set as it deals enough damage to Corviknight to prevent a 6-0 (Granted Corviknight runs a specially bulky set because of Bulk Up). Thunder Wave and Sucker Punch together are essential to cover up Dark's lack of Speed overall, Sucker Punch is also good to take advantage of Choice-locked Pokemon occasionally. Spirit Break is self-explanatory.

Weavile is now more viable, it gets DD but you cannot currently use it on Weavile. Weavile helps with all of the pokemon that are roaming around lately like Dragapult, it also helps versus ground because with the buff to Excadrill ground monotype more preferably the sand variant has become more and more used within the few days that SwSh has been released
You have enough ways to deal with any variant of Dragapult, also Dragapult outspeeds Weavile and has ways to OHKO it. As for Excadrill, you have no ways of dealing with Excadrill under Sandstorm so while Weavile is extremely helpful it's not really enough in Ground-type matchup to prevent an Excadrill sweep. It also doesn't help with any other matchup besides Dragon maybe.
Here are some sets/variants for potential dark mons that are viable
As for these, I'd recommend you to take a look at new learn sets for gen8, as some of those sets are illegal. (Pursuit is removed from the game, Hydreigon doesn't have Roost.)
 

Y8

formerly ara
Nice post. I'll make some additions to it.



I haven't tested this Pokemon myself so I can't really say anything about it, but people say its good. I've been almost exclusively running Dark in room tours ever since we have the format and I actually haven't even considered giving this Pokemon a chance because the way my team was functioning was pretty much enough for me to handle most of the types that can be considered viable/dominant at the moment. Its defensive capabilities are nonexistent even with Bulk Up, doesn't really help you out with any matchups that you struggle against and most importantly it stacks up Fighting-type weakness for your team. In return, it just offers Ghost-type immunity which is not really a problem for you anyway and its coverage is not that helpful for you to overcome any matchup you struggle against. Fairy still beats you, you cannot touch to Mimikyu in Ghost, Excadrill eats you alive and you don't have any proper switch-ins some of the current metagame defining Pokemons in Gyarados. So Idk. Maybe I'm overexaggerating but I don't really think this Pokemon is that beneficial for Dark-type teams.



A nicely written analysis here, just a note that you cant Taunt Hattereene because it has Magic Bounce. Also, I will post the set I use below.

Grimmsnarl (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 196 HP / 252 Atk / 60 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Darkest Lariat
- Spirit Break
- Sucker Punch

60 Speed ensures that you outspeed Corviknight, so Steel doesn't auto-win with Bulk Up + Body Press. It is also why I run Darkest Lariat in this set as it deals enough damage to Corviknight to prevent a 6-0 (Granted Corviknight runs a specially bulky set because of Bulk Up). Thunder Wave and Sucker Punch together are essential to cover up Dark's lack of Speed overall, Sucker Punch is also good to take advantage of Choice-locked Pokemon occasionally. Spirit Break is self-explanatory.



You have enough ways to deal with any variant of Dragapult, also Dragapult outspeeds Weavile and has ways to OHKO it. As for Excadrill, you have no ways of dealing with Excadrill under Sandstorm so while Weavile is extremely helpful it's not really enough in Ground-type matchup to prevent an Excadrill sweep. It also doesn't help with any other matchup besides Dragon maybe.


As for these, I'd recommend you to take a look at new learn sets for gen8, as some of those sets are illegal. (Pursuit is removed from the game, Hydreigon doesn't have Roost.)
looking over i realize mostly everything u have said seems to be true the sets i will edit because of the movepool changes, i will attempt to look for better fitting mons to replace mons or better movesets that work preferably better in the new meta. I wrote this kinda sleepy so i can understand where i could make errors. Thanks for Helping ill be sure to try that grimmsnarl set
 

Yami

闇の光の天使
is a Pre-Contributor
Lets talk about Dragon. When I heard about Pokemon being cut, it made me worry that Dragon will suck with missing key Pokemon like Dragonite, Lati@s, and Garchomp. However, since playing Gen 8 Monotype, Dragon is not as bad as I thought, in fact, it does pretty well when testing it in room tours and winning the bad mus such as Ice and Fairy. Now, Lets talk about the new tools first and some older Pokemon that are great on Dragon!

Duraludon
Duraludon @ Leftovers
Ability: Stalwart
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Thunder Wave
- Foul Play
- Flash Cannon / Steel Beam

Duraludon is a bulky defensive Pokemon, which makes it prefect to run Foul Play + Thunder Wave to help with setup Pokemon and slow down Pokemon, a great switch in to physical attacks like Mimikyu's Play Rough, and can help pressure Fairy-types with its Steel-STAB attacks. Duraludon also gets Stealth Rock, which I think is pretty great to allow Kommo-o to run Taunt, Clangorous Soul or a 4th attacking move. The most disappointing thing about duraludon is it cannot take a special hit too well, which hurts its usefulness in the Fairy and Ice matchup.
Dragapult
Dragapult @ Life Orb
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Dragon Darts
- Phantom Force
- Will-O-Wisp / Sucker Punch

Dragapult @ Choice Specs
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Draco Meteor
- Thunderbolt
- U-turn

Dragapult @ Choice Band
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Dragon Darts
- Phantom Force
- U-turn

Dragapult @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Psychic Fangs
- Dragon Darts
- Phantom Force
- U-turn

Dragapult is one of my favorite new Pokemon as its Attack and Special Attack are ok and backed by its 421 Speed that allows it to outpace the metagame bar Choice Scarfers or a setup Pokemon at x2. it also has Clear Body that allows it to ignore Sticky Web and Attack drops. However, Dragapult has a not so great physical movepool and has to use Phantom Force for physical Ghost-STAB. Life Orb is cool to be able to change moves outside of Dynamax and run Sucker Punch and Dragon Dance. However, I been trying out Choice Specs Dragapult, and it works pretty well due to its access to Draco Meteor, Shadow Ball, Fire Blast, Thunderbolt and Hydro Pump that can put major dents into teams as wells as get some kills on Water-types with Thunderbolt. It can also be a good pivot because of its access to U-turn, which will go nice on any Choiced sets to get momentum for the team.
Appletun
Appletun @ Leftovers
Ability: Ripen
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dragon Pulse
- Leech Seed
- Protect
- Apple Acid

Appletun is a cool Pokemon, but is better on Grass. However, it is a cool tool to take on Water-type Pokemon and help take on special attacks and spread Leech Seed around and get double recovery from Leftovers due to Ripen, but I think Dracozolt helps in this mu a lot more due to its wallbreaking power.
Dracovish
Dracovish @ Choice Band
Ability: Strong Jaw
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ice Fang
- Iron Head
- Low Kick
- Outrage

Dracovish will have a niche once it gets its unreleased ability, Sand Rush. For now, it probably wont see much usage because of Haxorus and Dragapult usually being on the team as the main physical wallbreakers and Dracozolt also being a better choice to help out in the Water matchup.
Dracozolt
Dracozolt @ Choice Band / Choice Scarf
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Bolt Beak
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Low Kick

Dracozolt looks interesting, however its Speed and average bulk is its major downfall. Although, Dracozolt can greatly help out with Water, Steel and Dark matchup, and also has Hustle to become a fearsome wallbreaker.
Flapple
Flapple @ Life Orb
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Sucker Punch
- Outrage
- Bullet Seed

No idea what to do with this thing, feel like Appletun is a lot better as it has more bulk and better movepool. I do not think we will see this Pokemon being used much.

Now lets talk about the Pokemon that did not get snapped.
Haxorus
Haxorus @ Choice Band / Choice Scarf
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Tail
- Superpower
- Outrage
- Earthquake

I love Haxorus, and its finally good this gen. Thanks to its raw power and good Speed tier, it can greatly help in the Fairy and Ice matchup as well as the Water matchup due to Iron Tail and Outrage and Superpower. It can also help in the Dark and Steel matchup with Superpower and Earthquake . Mold Breaker is also useful to get Levitate Pokemon such as the Rotom formes, Weezing and Bronzong and can also ignore Disguise and Ice Force from Mimikyu and Eiscue.
Hydreigon
Hydreigon @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Dark Pulse
- Draco Meteor
- Flamethrower

Hydreigon @ Choice Specs / Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower
- Draco Meteor
- Dark Pulse
- Flash Cannon

Hydreigon gain Nasty Plot, but lost Roost. This means that Hydreigon is forced to run leftovers with Nasty Plot to get some passive recovery back as Life Orb will kill it way too fast. Using just one Nasty Plot then dynamax can help kill a couple Pokemon, which is pretty good, but it is hard to find a place to set up. So, I still use Choice Specs or Choice Scarf depending on the members of the team and what I need. Choice Specs can greatly help break Pokemon with Dark Pulse and fish for flinches while Choice Scarf helps in mirrors and help deal with Alolan Ninetales and weaken Ice and Fairy-types with Flash Cannon.
Goodra
Goodra @ Assault Vest
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpA
Mild Nature
- Sludge Wave
- Flamethrower
- Earthquake
- Dragon Pulse

Goodra is not the best Pokemon, but with Assault Vest I can see it get some usage to help tilt the Fairy matchup to Dragon's favor. With Duraludon taking the physical Fairy-type attacks, Goodra can take the special Fairy-type attacks from Clefable, Alolan Ninetales and Galar Weezing. Earthquake is filler, but can be helpful against Poison- and Steel-types. Sap Sipper allows Goodra to soak up Spore, Stun Spore and Leech Seed, which can be helpful to avoid a teammate from getting statused from Grass-type moves.
Kommo-o
Kommo-o @ Iapapa Berry
Ability: Soundproof / Bulletproof
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Clanging Scales
- Drain Punch
- Flamethrower
- Clangorous Soul / Flash Cannon / Taunt

Kommo-o gotten Clangorus Soul which gives it an omniboost at the cost of losing 33% of its HP. Before knowing what that move did, I was using LO 4 attacks, but Clangorus Soul can be good to use on a predicted switch or a choiced Pokemon locked into a resisted attack.
Flygon
Flygon @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Outrage
- Defog
- Earthquake
- U-turn

Flygon is actually usable now, mainly because of its Speed, access to Defog and can pivot out with U-turn, but I am not conviced that this is the best choice scarfer for Dragon as Hydreigion and Haxorus work better in the small testing I have done.
Noivern
Noivern @ Leftovers
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hurricane
- Roost
- Draco Meteor
- Defog / U-turn

Noivern @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- U-turn
- Draco Meteor
- Hurricane
- Flamethrower

Noivern is the second fastest Pokemon that Dragon has and also one of the few Defog users. Choice Scarf is cool for pivoting and able to help with the Dragon mirror and its Flying-STAB can be useful in the Bug mu.

Here are some of the Dragon teams I built
https://pastebin.com/T3ZRs352 - Scarf Noivern +Double Specs
https://pastebin.com/Bb8fSRky - Scarf Haxorus + Band Daragpult + AV Goodra
https://pastebin.com/pQLCPX1u - Double Band

Replays
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8oubeta-1012117424-ryquouyucea15rywq26xekc7nevy7hwpw vs Ice
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8oubeta-1012220053-dtj1sjqoklb9rrsl5jnv8x915rsn0lopw vs Dark

Overall, I feel like Dragon will remain somewhere in the high middle tier for this gen, as it does have trouble with Ghost, Dark, weaknesses if not played well, rain water and sand Ground. Dragon will be even better if Kyurem-B gets to stay, but with the buffs and Dynamax, it is probably getting the boot. Looking forward to see how gen 8 monotype develops as so far I am liking it a lot than Sun and Moon mostly due to the fast-paced battles unlike last gen!
 
Last edited:
Thought I'd share a cool (imo) set for steel, which is
Duraludon @ Chople Berry
Ability: Light Metal
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Flash Cannon/Stealth Rock
- Thunder
- Solar Beam

This lets you get like 3 kills vs water when dynamaxed, chople lets you live barraskewda close combat with ease.

General thoughts: still too early to tell how the meta is going to shape up, dynamax seems pretty broken at times but feel like we could have some more time to play with it to truly analyse its effects on the game. Otherwise, there is certainly some disparity between low tier and top tier types, some types are pretty unusable at the moment but maybe that will change as people innovate the meta.
 

Perish Song

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
is a Pre-Contributor
Some more insights on Dark.

Sableye @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Knock Off
- Will-O-Wisp
- Encore
- Recover

This offers a few things for Dark-type teams. Atm, I'm running a pretty standard max physical def build because I haven't experimented enough to come up with an optimal set. Will-O-Wisp is an extremely handful tool that lets you cripple some of the most dangerous Pokemon available in the metagame at the moment, such as Gyarados, Dragapult, Barraskewda, and Excadrill, which have potential to sweep your team almost single-handedly. It also eases Ghost matchup a bit by burning the Mimikyu. Encore was godsent for Sableye, I mainly use it to pivot into any status move, any setup moves, hazard, etc, lock them and cripple them with Knock Off + Will-O-Wisp. Recover is usually very easy to spam against passive Pokemon and such, and poor distribution of Knock Off makes it more valuable than ever. It removes almost always removes an item from something you cant pivot into Z-crystal holders or Megas anymore.

Another bonus of Sableye is that it can block the new Fossil Pokemon's main STAB attacks. Since Prankster goes first, their BP will not be doubled. Idk how effective this one is but burning an Arctozolt in an Electric matchup previously came in handy for me as I was able to pivot in with a Pokemon that could resist.

Drapion @ Black Sludge
Ability: Battle Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Toxic Spikes
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Earthquake

Bulky Drapion is another Pokemon I have been experimenting with lately. The reason for this spread is outspeeding Adamant Mimikyu (Although I haven't seen anyone use it ever) and effectively breaking disguise for something to revenge kill it. I had max in Attack and Speed before but Jolly Life Orb at +2 has a very high chance to OKHO it so it couldn't reliably break Mimikyu's Disguise. Earthquake is just a coverage move that lets me hit on Steels that take x2 damage, such as Bisharp and Excadrill for a good amount. As for Toxic Spikes... I'm enjoying this quite a lot. Toxic Spikes turns many matchups around. This is simply because of the poor distribution of hazard control elements in this generation. Not a lot of types have access to Defog / Rapid spin, not every type have access to Cleric Pokemon to play around it, not every type comes with a Magic Bounce user. Pairing up this with Sableye also eliminates removal option from several types as well so I think its quite effective at the moment.

Thanks for reading!
 
I keep seeing old man Torkool begging for people to talk more on here, so I'm gonna throw out some Things I think I could see getting banned and some things I've seen other people complaining about, hopefully spark some discussion about it.

DYNAMAX-I don't expect this to get banned as I see them going after the abusers first, but I do feel this is so extremely unhealthy and is just promoting brainless "attack what's in front of you" play. my most successful team right now doesn't have a stealth rocker or a defogger because I would rather just be attacking every turn. overall not sure how I feel about this

With that being said the rest of this list is for a timeline where dynamax is not being banned

Gyarados-I think this is probably the best abuser of dynamax standalone, Max airstream is so incredibly powerful and you can intimidate in for a safe DD into dynamax or you can run moxie and Dynamax max airstream for a free DD on each kill. power whip+eq+waterfall all good moves too this thing is just so strong HELP

Excadrill- Okay so this thing is also a creature being able to set it's own sand, having the def+spdef boosting max STABS, teams like fairy, elec, fire, pretty much anything weak to rock steel or ground have an insanely hard time with this and I could see this being the first banned since smooth rock hippo is allowed alongside it.

Togekiss-Again, Max Airstream is just so broken. This thing can nasty plot, max airstream 3 times, then u have a 2x spa 2.5x speed flinch machine with fire coverage and stabs. I don't think this is as strong as the 2 mentioned before it but it is definitely good and I could see it being discussed

barraskewda-I don't really think this thing is "banworthy" but I see a LOT of people talking about how it should be, I think damp rock should go before this and it might be a lot more managable. But it does have a good ATK stat and an INSANE speed stat so who really knows.

Hawlucha-This is another one I'm not sure I see banworthy but a ton of people have complained about how it has no counterplay, I do believe that like an unburden SD'd dynamax hawlucha probably just 6-0s some types so I could definitely see this thing being power. but I haven't seen it outside of once or twice and I didn't really get that impact in those games. this ones more of a community pick

Aegislash- Now Idk if it's like psychic or something having a hard time but I've been playing almost all Fairy since this generation began, be it on ghost or steel this thing is honestly not that much of an issue and I'm wondering if the nerfs were really that hard for it or if it's just a lot easier to deal with this gen with the massive fire coverage. that being said I could see this thing getting an SD+ like weakness policy or maybe 2 SD's and sneak just cleaning some stuff. Overall I don't think this needs to be banned but a lot of people seem to.

Damp Rock-SS is back to being the strongest water variant and also one of the 2 strongest teams in the entire metagame (probably). I believe this and smooth rock wont last as long as excadrill and things like barraskewda are around. Maybe the mons deserve the bans and not the items but idk

Smooth Rock-If Drill get's banned I don't think this needs to be touched, but as of right now this cant be alright, smooth rock hippo and once drill comes in it get's like 7-8 turns to run rampant and claim a bunch of lives, in some mu's it just ends the game. 1 of the 2 prob gotta go.

There are some more Pokemon I think are strong but definitely not enough to warrant a ban or anything like that. I think that these will be the next on the throne assuming some of these get removed from the meta but that's all hypothetical and I'm only gonna talk about what's big right now.

Well there's the Pokemon I feel should be banned/A lot of people I see want banned. I hope this sparks some discussion on what Pokemon are strong this meta and maybe some underrated sleeper picks you guys have been using =D
 
First type posting, so i may as well do so for a set ive been running for poison

Salazzle @ Black Sludge
Ability: Corrosion
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Flamethrower
- Toxic
- Protect
- Substitute

Last gen, Salazzle sat at a good, but not amazing speed tier--but now, with dexit, Salazzle is one of the fastest mons in the tier (fastest on poison). With that, Classic anti-Steel Salazzle has quickly become a staple on my posion teams ATM. Its ability beat out Steels, Corsala, Pex, and pretty much any manner of bulky thing i need dealt with is a lifesaver. As well, due to Substitute it can even stall out slower dynamaxs without Flying coverage. This mon synergizes super well with T-Spike Pex, and can somewhat reliably stall out most teams. You can basically set it out on a passive mon without coverage, and toxic stall it to submission. Most slower threats inevitably crumble to it.
 

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