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Metagame SS NU Metagame Discussion
- Thread starter shiloh
- Start date
- Status
You can't take my boots away from me...
In all seriousness I think they're still a top tier item even with decent hazard removal. It's so much harder to pressure things like Mantine when you can't rely on getting rocks down and then doubling to force them out before they can recover.
been using it since home dropped and i think i can safely say that drum slurpuff is a big big problem now, as expected. play ruff and drain punch are enough to hit most of the viable tier, so it can afford to run aromatherapy as its last slot to aid its own sweeping capabilities. seems really stupid in this meta and should probably be looked at ASAP lmao.
I agree. The Rotom-Fs get a huge buff as defog pivots through boots. The items are still quite strong. It is just now less mandatory to run Unfezant/Noctowl/etc. or a Tyrouge evolution now.
On a related note, the revival of Toxic in mons like Cofagirus make Toxicroak and such seem like far strong options now as well since Toxic Spikes also exist.
... I just realized Toxicroak got Knock Off back as well...
Swoobat NastyPlot + Simple gona break NU like Sygi does in RU. Airslash + Psyshock + Heatwave is great coverage rn.
Also Vikavolt gaining roost make for more defensive set...
Silvally gaining Defog is insane.. I think Hitmonchan and GalarianMime are still great pokemon. LO Chan and Nasty Plot Mime are great moveset. Not needing to use spin Mime can use another coverage like Focus Miss or Shadowball
Also Vikavolt gaining roost make for more defensive set...
Silvally gaining Defog is insane.. I think Hitmonchan and GalarianMime are still great pokemon. LO Chan and Nasty Plot Mime are great moveset. Not needing to use spin Mime can use another coverage like Focus Miss or Shadowball
Let's talk about the problem children.
It has decent enough bulk to set up, and you'd be hard pressed to find anything that wants to take it on after a Belly Drum.
+6 252+ Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Garbodor: 190-224 (52.1 - 61.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+6 252+ Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cofagrigus: 258-304 (80.6 - 95%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Fairy/Fighting hits the whole tier really hard, with Drain Punch providing some recovery to keep you out of range of priority, and last slot is free to experiment. Facade hits the Poisons neutrally, but doesn't that much more damage than Play Rough would do. I heard of Aromatherapy being discussed, not sure what it would do besides get rid of unlucky burns and toxics. Sticky Web is an honourable mention that also allows Slurpuff to support its teammates if it does inevitably go down. This mon definitely needs to go after we exit Alpha.
Among all the new toys we got from home, this thing is like the second most busted. Despite 77 base SpAtk, after a NP this thing hits like a heart-shaped bat-shaped truck. Personal preference right now is SubSalac since it allows you to dodge Sucker Punches and Toxics, while also putting you in range to proc Salac, which gives you +2 Speed with Simple. +4 SpAtk and +2 Speed gives a 140 BP Stored Power that not even Pyukumuku can wall. +2 Speed means Scarfers like Togedemaru or fast mons like Jolteon can't easily revenge kill. SpDef Haze Mantine is probably the only thing that can handle this, but even that gets 2HKOed on the switch in. It is, however, as tough as tissue paper defensively, and can be easily pressured out or KOed through Sub pre set-up. This mon is still kind of problematic though.
Honestly not as problematic, but still difficult to deal with. AoA LO sets have no switch ins, while SubDisable abuses fighting types and bulky mons that have limited ways of dealing with Haunter, and helps with Sucker Punch. Decent switch-ins to AoA include SpDef Skuntank, Flareon, Lanturns (AV or no AV), and AV Hitmonchan, but if it's SubDisable, you better hope you have more than 1 move that can break the Sub. It still retains the problems it had last gen, but with a lack of checks and Pursuit, Haunter is much better than it was last gen.
Slurpuff @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Play Rough
- Drain Punch
- Facade / Aromatherapy / Sticky Web
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Play Rough
- Drain Punch
- Facade / Aromatherapy / Sticky Web
It has decent enough bulk to set up, and you'd be hard pressed to find anything that wants to take it on after a Belly Drum.
+6 252+ Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Garbodor: 190-224 (52.1 - 61.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+6 252+ Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cofagrigus: 258-304 (80.6 - 95%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Fairy/Fighting hits the whole tier really hard, with Drain Punch providing some recovery to keep you out of range of priority, and last slot is free to experiment. Facade hits the Poisons neutrally, but doesn't that much more damage than Play Rough would do. I heard of Aromatherapy being discussed, not sure what it would do besides get rid of unlucky burns and toxics. Sticky Web is an honourable mention that also allows Slurpuff to support its teammates if it does inevitably go down. This mon definitely needs to go after we exit Alpha.
Swoobat @ Salac Berry
Ability: Simple
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Nasty Plot
- Stored Power
- Air Slash
Ability: Simple
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Nasty Plot
- Stored Power
- Air Slash
Among all the new toys we got from home, this thing is like the second most busted. Despite 77 base SpAtk, after a NP this thing hits like a heart-shaped bat-shaped truck. Personal preference right now is SubSalac since it allows you to dodge Sucker Punches and Toxics, while also putting you in range to proc Salac, which gives you +2 Speed with Simple. +4 SpAtk and +2 Speed gives a 140 BP Stored Power that not even Pyukumuku can wall. +2 Speed means Scarfers like Togedemaru or fast mons like Jolteon can't easily revenge kill. SpDef Haze Mantine is probably the only thing that can handle this, but even that gets 2HKOed on the switch in. It is, however, as tough as tissue paper defensively, and can be easily pressured out or KOed through Sub pre set-up. This mon is still kind of problematic though.
Honestly not as problematic, but still difficult to deal with. AoA LO sets have no switch ins, while SubDisable abuses fighting types and bulky mons that have limited ways of dealing with Haunter, and helps with Sucker Punch. Decent switch-ins to AoA include SpDef Skuntank, Flareon, Lanturns (AV or no AV), and AV Hitmonchan, but if it's SubDisable, you better hope you have more than 1 move that can break the Sub. It still retains the problems it had last gen, but with a lack of checks and Pursuit, Haunter is much better than it was last gen.
Just wanted to post some random observations on the meta (most of these assembled pre-home drop), gonna be rambly so here goes:
Heavy duty-boots are the glue holding this tier together. Unironically consider running them on any defensive pokemon you use, even if they’re not “hazard weak”. Hazard stack is really damn good right now w coffin’s ability to beat every spinner, and outright wall most of them. Hazards wise there’s a bunch of good rockers rn (don conda golurk pilo mostly, also kinda cursola), and then garb coffin and qwil are all solid spikers.
Imo mime is the only spinner that’s actually a good pokemon in the tier due to its speed tier and ability to pressure its checks between its other 3 slots in np/psyshock/freeze dry/focus blast. I haven’t tried it but just running np mime w/o spin is probably good. It also actually puts some pressure on coffin and has enough offensive presence to prevent most setters from just getting them right back up. Not a fan of the hitmons since they can’t break coffin and depending on the set most spikers just come right back in. Offensive top with LO is def the way to go imo, at least that way you threaten garb and qwil. Chan can’t really beat any of these, but I guess it can check haunter and other random special attackers.
Defog wise, I really don’t like unfezant. Its speed tier is disappointing, and despite getting brave bird its still getting walled by everything that used to wall it, which notably includes literally every hazard setter ever. Scarf isn’t awful, though. With home, I imagine boots rotoms become the main defoggers since its not an unreasonable assumption ru will scoop up mantine at some point.
95 is def the key speed tier rn with haunter and silvallys running around
jolteon to me is p much unviable unless its being run with weather (includes abomasnow as a teammate), every time I face it when its not on weather all it does is give free turns every time it comes in. just use raichu instead on weatherless squads, it actually has coverage for elec immunes and the speed tier difference means u miss out on maybe 2-3 relevant mons
I tried phys def appletun after readings rozes post and im a huge fan. Walls a lot of things and is much more difficult to wear down than ferro thanks to recover. I personally like draco in the last slot since it punishes its offensive switchins much harder than any of its other options (croak, haunter, vika, etc).
Lukewarm take, silvally is amazing. Fairy is definitely the best, its coverage lets it beat p much all of its switchins with a bit of chip. Dark also seems solid, but def doesn’t like the prevalence of fairy silvally. I’ve tried poison, and its ok. It’s only really worthwhile if you want to use silvally and also need a tspike absorber or a slurpluff check.
Offensive mantine is pretty threatening. Rain dance/water move/hurricane/roost is honestly really good since there isn’t much that can eat both LO hydro or hurricane under rain, and its bulky enough to set it for itself. I imagine sub toxic becomes really good as well now that homes dropped. Lanturn obviously walls it regardless of what it wants to do, but its not super common, and also lanturn is not a hard pokemon to take advantage of from an offensive standpoint so proper teambuilding means its not that big of an issue. Bulky sets are solid, but give offensive sets a go, you won’t be disappointed.
Vika is a very good mon. imo boots agility is its best set, other than flareon there aren’t many things that eat its stabs + eball even without the specs boost. Specs is also nearly impossible to reliably switch into. However, its super prediction reliant- if you predict right, youre crippling or KOing something, but if you predict wrong youre not doing much. Still good just much more difficult to use. Now that vika gets roost again sub + metronome will also be effective at beating bulky shit it wants to beat.
Im a fan of klingklang so far, it’s a pretty good cleaner and even beats a few defensive cores (ferro + mantine, if running sub). Sets up on a decent amount of threatening offensive mons (silvally-fairy and sneasel, for example). gear grind + wild charge are mandatory, and what you run in the last slot is team dependent. Sub means you beat ferro and can potentially take advantage of sacks, while magnet rise lets you set up on pilo and rhydon. It also performs very well vs sticky web teams, which are being spammed on the ladder, especially if they’re not using vika as their setter. Even without steelix in the tier theres still a lot of checks to it, so don’t expect to click shift gear and win games. Coffin, sandaconda, vika, and rotom fan must all be chipped a decent amount if youre gonna sweep w it. Even if you’ve got a full stop on ur opps team tho it can still check the aforementioned offensive mons, so its never deadweight really.
Scrafty’s an interesting mon. I was a huge fan of bulk up at the end of last gen but that set’s honestly really bad right now. While it takes advantage of fat shit that will over-rely on toxic to wear shit down mostly it just gives free turns to croak, slurpluff, and silvally-fairy. DD, on the other hand, is actually somewhat threatening. At +1 you outpace base 95s, which is all you really need, since its bulky enough to eat most attacks from whatever scarfers or faster shit we do have. DD/knock/cc/pjab iron head or zen headbutt beats most of the shit you need it to. depending on whether you pack the fairy or poison coverage, theres plenty of stuff that pairs well with it to wear down its checks. Garb w stomping tantrum in particular pairs well with it, since it provides spikes, helps check fairies and poisons that will force scrafty out, and can even help wear down opposing garb if needed. Silvally-fairy also shares similar checks, and helps chip them down sufficiently.
Overall the meta feels weirdly not full of ridiculous shit that most alpha tiers are prone to. Nothing sticks out to me as immediately problematic, we’ll see how home shapes stuff and how the meta develops I guess. Slurpluff with belly drum now is scary but w/o return poison types can actually beat it, too bad theres like maybe 3 poison types in the tier. Can also see veil builds with shit like pluff and np swoobat being a lot as well
Washed nu main out
Heavy duty-boots are the glue holding this tier together. Unironically consider running them on any defensive pokemon you use, even if they’re not “hazard weak”. Hazard stack is really damn good right now w coffin’s ability to beat every spinner, and outright wall most of them. Hazards wise there’s a bunch of good rockers rn (don conda golurk pilo mostly, also kinda cursola), and then garb coffin and qwil are all solid spikers.
Imo mime is the only spinner that’s actually a good pokemon in the tier due to its speed tier and ability to pressure its checks between its other 3 slots in np/psyshock/freeze dry/focus blast. I haven’t tried it but just running np mime w/o spin is probably good. It also actually puts some pressure on coffin and has enough offensive presence to prevent most setters from just getting them right back up. Not a fan of the hitmons since they can’t break coffin and depending on the set most spikers just come right back in. Offensive top with LO is def the way to go imo, at least that way you threaten garb and qwil. Chan can’t really beat any of these, but I guess it can check haunter and other random special attackers.
Defog wise, I really don’t like unfezant. Its speed tier is disappointing, and despite getting brave bird its still getting walled by everything that used to wall it, which notably includes literally every hazard setter ever. Scarf isn’t awful, though. With home, I imagine boots rotoms become the main defoggers since its not an unreasonable assumption ru will scoop up mantine at some point.
95 is def the key speed tier rn with haunter and silvallys running around
jolteon to me is p much unviable unless its being run with weather (includes abomasnow as a teammate), every time I face it when its not on weather all it does is give free turns every time it comes in. just use raichu instead on weatherless squads, it actually has coverage for elec immunes and the speed tier difference means u miss out on maybe 2-3 relevant mons
I tried phys def appletun after readings rozes post and im a huge fan. Walls a lot of things and is much more difficult to wear down than ferro thanks to recover. I personally like draco in the last slot since it punishes its offensive switchins much harder than any of its other options (croak, haunter, vika, etc).
Lukewarm take, silvally is amazing. Fairy is definitely the best, its coverage lets it beat p much all of its switchins with a bit of chip. Dark also seems solid, but def doesn’t like the prevalence of fairy silvally. I’ve tried poison, and its ok. It’s only really worthwhile if you want to use silvally and also need a tspike absorber or a slurpluff check.
Offensive mantine is pretty threatening. Rain dance/water move/hurricane/roost is honestly really good since there isn’t much that can eat both LO hydro or hurricane under rain, and its bulky enough to set it for itself. I imagine sub toxic becomes really good as well now that homes dropped. Lanturn obviously walls it regardless of what it wants to do, but its not super common, and also lanturn is not a hard pokemon to take advantage of from an offensive standpoint so proper teambuilding means its not that big of an issue. Bulky sets are solid, but give offensive sets a go, you won’t be disappointed.
Vika is a very good mon. imo boots agility is its best set, other than flareon there aren’t many things that eat its stabs + eball even without the specs boost. Specs is also nearly impossible to reliably switch into. However, its super prediction reliant- if you predict right, youre crippling or KOing something, but if you predict wrong youre not doing much. Still good just much more difficult to use. Now that vika gets roost again sub + metronome will also be effective at beating bulky shit it wants to beat.
Im a fan of klingklang so far, it’s a pretty good cleaner and even beats a few defensive cores (ferro + mantine, if running sub). Sets up on a decent amount of threatening offensive mons (silvally-fairy and sneasel, for example). gear grind + wild charge are mandatory, and what you run in the last slot is team dependent. Sub means you beat ferro and can potentially take advantage of sacks, while magnet rise lets you set up on pilo and rhydon. It also performs very well vs sticky web teams, which are being spammed on the ladder, especially if they’re not using vika as their setter. Even without steelix in the tier theres still a lot of checks to it, so don’t expect to click shift gear and win games. Coffin, sandaconda, vika, and rotom fan must all be chipped a decent amount if youre gonna sweep w it. Even if you’ve got a full stop on ur opps team tho it can still check the aforementioned offensive mons, so its never deadweight really.
Scrafty’s an interesting mon. I was a huge fan of bulk up at the end of last gen but that set’s honestly really bad right now. While it takes advantage of fat shit that will over-rely on toxic to wear shit down mostly it just gives free turns to croak, slurpluff, and silvally-fairy. DD, on the other hand, is actually somewhat threatening. At +1 you outpace base 95s, which is all you really need, since its bulky enough to eat most attacks from whatever scarfers or faster shit we do have. DD/knock/cc/pjab iron head or zen headbutt beats most of the shit you need it to. depending on whether you pack the fairy or poison coverage, theres plenty of stuff that pairs well with it to wear down its checks. Garb w stomping tantrum in particular pairs well with it, since it provides spikes, helps check fairies and poisons that will force scrafty out, and can even help wear down opposing garb if needed. Silvally-fairy also shares similar checks, and helps chip them down sufficiently.
Overall the meta feels weirdly not full of ridiculous shit that most alpha tiers are prone to. Nothing sticks out to me as immediately problematic, we’ll see how home shapes stuff and how the meta develops I guess. Slurpluff with belly drum now is scary but w/o return poison types can actually beat it, too bad theres like maybe 3 poison types in the tier. Can also see veil builds with shit like pluff and np swoobat being a lot as well
Washed nu main out
After having a good amount of success with a nice team that I used on the ladder that just got me to #1 , I would like to talk about my thoughts so far in regards to SS NU alpha post-bank.
Sawk is a pokemon that I think is extremely good atm and should probably be used a bit more than what I have seen on ladder so far. With a choice band, this pokemon has enough coverage moves to nearly 2hko the entire tier with nice moves such as close combat, knock off, thunder punch, poison jab, ice punch earthquake. The only pokemon that can really avoid a 2hko would be something like defensive gourgeist, and that mon gets heavily crippled by knock off. Since this meta is so boots reliant, being able to knock off pokemon like mantine is super useful. In conjunction with sturdy, you can stay in vs pretty much anything and get off a hard hit if you want to, even close combating unfezant on the usual u turn and catching the opponent off guard with a coverage move they cant handle. Sturdy + poison jab is also very nice for slurpuff atm, since that mon is really good. You can even run mold breaker to get past pokemon such as sturdy crustle if you really want to.
As said in many posts above, vikavolt is a very good pokemon, which is not changed much by home. Electric bug grass offensive coverage is great to have, and it can be a very good sweeper / breaker in general with agility. I started using timid on this pokemon to outspeed rhydon and to outspeed mons such as jolteon after an agility. I have personally been seeing throat spray do wonders for me, but heavy duty boots is a very nice option as well to come in on rocks without much worry.
Also, silvally has been a big one with the release of knock off. It not only makes spike stacking a lot less busted, but also helps to invalidate abomasnow's aurora veil too (which is helpful vs a decent amount of the ladder). There are numerous different forms that can be considered viable, which makes it very team-dependent. As long as the silvally has defog and parting shot, it can be extremely effective.
Knock off being released has been big for pokemon such as pawniard and especially sneasel. Sneasel has enough speed to outrun 317, which is a huge speed tier to pass, and is faster than max speed gourgeist and others. Stab banded knock off has little answers with mons such as silvally fairy and maybe even dubwool as the only decent switchins, not even considering that silvally fairy could take an icicle crash if they get outpredicted. I personally have not gotten to use sneasel yet, but it has a ton of potential in this new meta. (Also why there might be a slight rise in mawile as well)
These were just some of my thoughts, hope you liked them :)!
Sawk is a pokemon that I think is extremely good atm and should probably be used a bit more than what I have seen on ladder so far. With a choice band, this pokemon has enough coverage moves to nearly 2hko the entire tier with nice moves such as close combat, knock off, thunder punch, poison jab, ice punch earthquake. The only pokemon that can really avoid a 2hko would be something like defensive gourgeist, and that mon gets heavily crippled by knock off. Since this meta is so boots reliant, being able to knock off pokemon like mantine is super useful. In conjunction with sturdy, you can stay in vs pretty much anything and get off a hard hit if you want to, even close combating unfezant on the usual u turn and catching the opponent off guard with a coverage move they cant handle. Sturdy + poison jab is also very nice for slurpuff atm, since that mon is really good. You can even run mold breaker to get past pokemon such as sturdy crustle if you really want to.
As said in many posts above, vikavolt is a very good pokemon, which is not changed much by home. Electric bug grass offensive coverage is great to have, and it can be a very good sweeper / breaker in general with agility. I started using timid on this pokemon to outspeed rhydon and to outspeed mons such as jolteon after an agility. I have personally been seeing throat spray do wonders for me, but heavy duty boots is a very nice option as well to come in on rocks without much worry.
Also, silvally has been a big one with the release of knock off. It not only makes spike stacking a lot less busted, but also helps to invalidate abomasnow's aurora veil too (which is helpful vs a decent amount of the ladder). There are numerous different forms that can be considered viable, which makes it very team-dependent. As long as the silvally has defog and parting shot, it can be extremely effective.
Knock off being released has been big for pokemon such as pawniard and especially sneasel. Sneasel has enough speed to outrun 317, which is a huge speed tier to pass, and is faster than max speed gourgeist and others. Stab banded knock off has little answers with mons such as silvally fairy and maybe even dubwool as the only decent switchins, not even considering that silvally fairy could take an icicle crash if they get outpredicted. I personally have not gotten to use sneasel yet, but it has a ton of potential in this new meta. (Also why there might be a slight rise in mawile as well)
These were just some of my thoughts, hope you liked them :)!
Played a few games with the new home toys and have some thoughts about what dropped:
Knock Off, Defog, and Toxic coming back into the game makes the tier feel more or less like Pokemon. It isn't nearly as complete as it could be with the lack of other pokemon that are still MIA but this makes it feel like the tier exists. A couple notables got back their resources and can now be used effectively, along with some newcomers.
Swoobat: The posts above are not trolls. Swoobat is a legitimate threat now thanks to Sw/Sh blessing it access with Nasty Plot and home giving Swoobat access back to it's HA; Simple. Now this thing can go on some menacing late-game sweeps while it also boasts a blazing base speed of 114. Only Jolteon and Ninjask naturally outspeed it in-tier. Also it totes some decent options for sets thanks to Nasty Plot running either SalacBerry Stored Power or Nasty Plot triple attacker thanks to access to great coverage. (Heat Wave, Giga Drain, Shadow Ball) What's gonna kill it is still being as weak as a real bat defense wise. The lack of good dual screen support outside Mogrem really suck and once there is a sucker puncher or a Jolteon / fast scarfer still alive it can be curtains for the late game sweep. Still do not sleep on this thing.
Skuntank: Prior to Home it was mostly forgotten in NU as it's biggest claim to fame as a Pursuit trapper was removed from the game. While it doesn't have Pursuit back, gaining back Defog allows Skuntank to have room to come back into the meta. Having a good matchup versus Garbodor / Cofagrigus and being immune to toxic / toxic spikes is a pretty good deal considering the users. It doesn't boast a great movepool but with defog back in it can go back to running a special attacker set with Acid Spray, Dark Pulse, and Fire Blast. It isn't going to be a game changer but there is a relevant reason to consider Skuntank in your lineup now as it can get the job done as an offensive defog user.
Silvally (All-Types) - Home blessed all the types back with access to Toxic and Defog allowing Silvally even more options than it had previously. It already has been considered a popular choice by many as it is a great offensive Swords Dance user while having decent enough bulk to live through most unboosted moves in NU. Now that all the Silvally-Types have their full kit ready they now come with a STAB move worthy of taking seriously that they can throw at the opponent thanks to Sw/Sh buffs. Silvally is also aided with Knock Off users coming back and being completely immune to having it's memory item removed. Offensive Pivot, utility, and Swords Dance are now all options available to the Silvally-Types and potentially making Silvally a dangerous threat on team preview.
Smaller Notes -
Slurpuff getting Belly Drum back is very dangerous now in this meta. Nothing likes to take the hits and you need either a scarfer to outspeed, Jolteon, or something to trade it out / priority it out with Bullet Punch.
Vikavolt is still very good right now and will grow stronger now that many defog users are now back in play allowing for further longevity.
Cofagrigus, while still being very good and potentially broken, does not appreciate many things receiving back Knock Off. It still does it's general shenanigans with it's impressive bulk, but it may take a dip in popularity now that it's leftovers may no longer be a guarantee in most games it will be played in.
Knock Off, Defog, and Toxic coming back into the game makes the tier feel more or less like Pokemon. It isn't nearly as complete as it could be with the lack of other pokemon that are still MIA but this makes it feel like the tier exists. A couple notables got back their resources and can now be used effectively, along with some newcomers.
Swoobat: The posts above are not trolls. Swoobat is a legitimate threat now thanks to Sw/Sh blessing it access with Nasty Plot and home giving Swoobat access back to it's HA; Simple. Now this thing can go on some menacing late-game sweeps while it also boasts a blazing base speed of 114. Only Jolteon and Ninjask naturally outspeed it in-tier. Also it totes some decent options for sets thanks to Nasty Plot running either SalacBerry Stored Power or Nasty Plot triple attacker thanks to access to great coverage. (Heat Wave, Giga Drain, Shadow Ball) What's gonna kill it is still being as weak as a real bat defense wise. The lack of good dual screen support outside Mogrem really suck and once there is a sucker puncher or a Jolteon / fast scarfer still alive it can be curtains for the late game sweep. Still do not sleep on this thing.
Skuntank: Prior to Home it was mostly forgotten in NU as it's biggest claim to fame as a Pursuit trapper was removed from the game. While it doesn't have Pursuit back, gaining back Defog allows Skuntank to have room to come back into the meta. Having a good matchup versus Garbodor / Cofagrigus and being immune to toxic / toxic spikes is a pretty good deal considering the users. It doesn't boast a great movepool but with defog back in it can go back to running a special attacker set with Acid Spray, Dark Pulse, and Fire Blast. It isn't going to be a game changer but there is a relevant reason to consider Skuntank in your lineup now as it can get the job done as an offensive defog user.
Silvally (All-Types) - Home blessed all the types back with access to Toxic and Defog allowing Silvally even more options than it had previously. It already has been considered a popular choice by many as it is a great offensive Swords Dance user while having decent enough bulk to live through most unboosted moves in NU. Now that all the Silvally-Types have their full kit ready they now come with a STAB move worthy of taking seriously that they can throw at the opponent thanks to Sw/Sh buffs. Silvally is also aided with Knock Off users coming back and being completely immune to having it's memory item removed. Offensive Pivot, utility, and Swords Dance are now all options available to the Silvally-Types and potentially making Silvally a dangerous threat on team preview.
Smaller Notes -
Slurpuff getting Belly Drum back is very dangerous now in this meta. Nothing likes to take the hits and you need either a scarfer to outspeed, Jolteon, or something to trade it out / priority it out with Bullet Punch.
Vikavolt is still very good right now and will grow stronger now that many defog users are now back in play allowing for further longevity.
Cofagrigus, while still being very good and potentially broken, does not appreciate many things receiving back Knock Off. It still does it's general shenanigans with it's impressive bulk, but it may take a dip in popularity now that it's leftovers may no longer be a guarantee in most games it will be played in.
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yoyoyo everyone is talking about the out coming of home and I wanted to share my opinion too.
Lets start with the OP-stuff:
Well well well, Belly Drum + Unburden not only sounds dangerous, it really is. With Play Rough/Drain Punch/Filler Slurpuff can almost hit everything for neutral or sets up Sticky Web for a team mate. I don't want to spend to much time on this 'cause there are enough posts above that explain its brokenness.
This really ugly looking bat got a huge buff sw/sh with Nasty Plot. Simple lets it get to +4 after one turn and stat raising berries are giving it +2 instead of +1. With a crazy 114 base speed its one of the fastes mons in the tier. Combine all of that and you have a great sweeper. Did I mention that Swoobat has an amazing movepool too? No? Now you know :). I dont think it will stay long in this tier.
With those two out of the way we can talk about the fun stuff:
I love this mon. It has an amazing offensiv typing with a good movepool. Its fast but frail, not broken imo. With Swoobat being such a threat having a higer speed stat is such a big plus for Sneasel. I predict it will rise in usage. As long as Swoobat doesnt has a sub up u will outrun it with priority or 'cause you're natural faster. I found out that you can beat sub Swoobat. Just put Beat Up as your fourth move and you're good to go. Even if im right and Swoobat will be banned with Knock Off being the best move in this gen Sneasel still has potential to be a great offensive sweeper/cleaner with sd or banded/scarfed.
What my fav. mon from the new gen is you ask? This one. I like the designe so much. But thats what we are here for.
The list of things this mon can do is nearly endless. It has so many options to run f.E. dual screens; Calm Mind (+Agility/Iron Defense) -Sweeper; Def-SpDef-Wall; offensiv-/defensive pivot; Sticky Web-Setter; Magic Coat-Antilead […]. Its typing may not be the best defensively but i prefer the offensive sets anyway. If you see this mon you can never really tell which set its running. Quick note: This set works good under veil:
Orbeetle @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Agility
- Bug Buzz
- Stored Power
Does anyone else think that this sprite looks like a baby????
Anyway with a base 145 SpAtk-Stat this thing hits like a truck. Sad to know that we don't really have good Trick Room-Setter. My fav set is sash with steal rocks three attacks or cm+2 attacks. Perish Body can be a niche pick to prevent a sweep from the likes of sd sillvally (worst case u need 3 more mons but you could run Protect if this really is your answer to physical setup mons). I wish it has just little more physical bulk. It has access to Strength Sap, Destiny Bond, Will-O-Wisp, Haze and notably Stealth Rock which all are great support moves. The specs set is also really devastating.
Tiki Tiki is the thing that came into my mind when i saw this piece of stone. Im a big fan of the designe, its stats and look reminds me of Stakataka. I tried Choice Band but didn't had much success with it. Its movepool is so good and wide that you don't want to lock yourself into one move. So I went with Chople Berry to bait Toxicroak and kill it in return with Earth Quake. Stuff like Ferroseed or Abamasnow just gets Heat Crashed. The set i run is:
Stonjourner @ Chople Berry
Ability: Power Spot
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Superpower/Self-Destruct
- Heat Crash
70 base speed really isn't bad anymore and can outrun some slower folks like the fossils. The physical bulk that this thing is packing is pretty good so it can live most of the physical attacks. Unfortunately its special side is so weak that even Kartana is laughing at it. Rock Polish is an option if you want a late game sweeper/cleaner.
Call me fanboy of gen 8 but I also love this fella. Shed Skin is such a nice ability for an defensive mon. You almost don't care about Toxic Spikes or status at all. You can run Rest for recovery and maybe wake up the same turn. Its just a bit luck-based but im a lucky player so I don't care lol. I guess we all know how to use this and I don't have to describe it to you. (Glare is busted)
I have to admit I don't have the time to explain every mon I wanted to but I keep it with this little list.
Thx for reading. Have a great day.
Lets start with the OP-stuff:
Well well well, Belly Drum + Unburden not only sounds dangerous, it really is. With Play Rough/Drain Punch/Filler Slurpuff can almost hit everything for neutral or sets up Sticky Web for a team mate. I don't want to spend to much time on this 'cause there are enough posts above that explain its brokenness.
This really ugly looking bat got a huge buff sw/sh with Nasty Plot. Simple lets it get to +4 after one turn and stat raising berries are giving it +2 instead of +1. With a crazy 114 base speed its one of the fastes mons in the tier. Combine all of that and you have a great sweeper. Did I mention that Swoobat has an amazing movepool too? No? Now you know :). I dont think it will stay long in this tier.
With those two out of the way we can talk about the fun stuff:
I love this mon. It has an amazing offensiv typing with a good movepool. Its fast but frail, not broken imo. With Swoobat being such a threat having a higer speed stat is such a big plus for Sneasel. I predict it will rise in usage. As long as Swoobat doesnt has a sub up u will outrun it with priority or 'cause you're natural faster. I found out that you can beat sub Swoobat. Just put Beat Up as your fourth move and you're good to go. Even if im right and Swoobat will be banned with Knock Off being the best move in this gen Sneasel still has potential to be a great offensive sweeper/cleaner with sd or banded/scarfed.
What my fav. mon from the new gen is you ask? This one. I like the designe so much. But thats what we are here for.
The list of things this mon can do is nearly endless. It has so many options to run f.E. dual screens; Calm Mind (+Agility/Iron Defense) -Sweeper; Def-SpDef-Wall; offensiv-/defensive pivot; Sticky Web-Setter; Magic Coat-Antilead […]. Its typing may not be the best defensively but i prefer the offensive sets anyway. If you see this mon you can never really tell which set its running. Quick note: This set works good under veil:
Orbeetle @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Agility
- Bug Buzz
- Stored Power
Does anyone else think that this sprite looks like a baby????
Anyway with a base 145 SpAtk-Stat this thing hits like a truck. Sad to know that we don't really have good Trick Room-Setter. My fav set is sash with steal rocks three attacks or cm+2 attacks. Perish Body can be a niche pick to prevent a sweep from the likes of sd sillvally (worst case u need 3 more mons but you could run Protect if this really is your answer to physical setup mons). I wish it has just little more physical bulk. It has access to Strength Sap, Destiny Bond, Will-O-Wisp, Haze and notably Stealth Rock which all are great support moves. The specs set is also really devastating.
Tiki Tiki is the thing that came into my mind when i saw this piece of stone. Im a big fan of the designe, its stats and look reminds me of Stakataka. I tried Choice Band but didn't had much success with it. Its movepool is so good and wide that you don't want to lock yourself into one move. So I went with Chople Berry to bait Toxicroak and kill it in return with Earth Quake. Stuff like Ferroseed or Abamasnow just gets Heat Crashed. The set i run is:
Stonjourner @ Chople Berry
Ability: Power Spot
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Superpower/Self-Destruct
- Heat Crash
70 base speed really isn't bad anymore and can outrun some slower folks like the fossils. The physical bulk that this thing is packing is pretty good so it can live most of the physical attacks. Unfortunately its special side is so weak that even Kartana is laughing at it. Rock Polish is an option if you want a late game sweeper/cleaner.
Call me fanboy of gen 8 but I also love this fella. Shed Skin is such a nice ability for an defensive mon. You almost don't care about Toxic Spikes or status at all. You can run Rest for recovery and maybe wake up the same turn. Its just a bit luck-based but im a lucky player so I don't care lol. I guess we all know how to use this and I don't have to describe it to you. (Glare is busted)
I have to admit I don't have the time to explain every mon I wanted to but I keep it with this little list.
Thx for reading. Have a great day.
Noctowl @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Tinted Lens
EVs: 252 HP / 116 SpA / 56 SpD / 84 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Hurricane
- Nasty Plot
- Roost
Noctowl is a cool mon. It’s probably a little outclassed by Defog Mantine (which will be gone by next month I assume...), but access to Nasty Plot plus Tinted Lens gives it a bit of a niche. This spread allows Noctowl to switch into Cursola as it avoids the OHKO from specs Ice Beam. It also outruns jolly Rhydon because while that’s probably not actually a thing I appreciate the peace of mind. Fast Rhydon spreads are OHKOed by +2 Hurricane. Fat ones need some chip.
ohayo im here again to drop some more thoughts after using a team that features some of these guys, which i used to reach v high on ladder :3
Rotom-Frost @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Nasty Plot
- Discharge
- Blizzard
kinda reinventing the wheel right? some variation of this has been used in like every upper tier for the other rotom forms, but i dont think rotom-f is getting enough love in NU atm. a lot of the slower, more defensive cores that are prevalent in the meta of today are absolute food for this thing, as it can set up substitutes against prevalent defensive tools such as mantine, ferroseed (lacking gyro ball), many sandaconda sets, pyukumuku, most qwilfishes, and obviously many more. while its speed tier isnt godlike, its good enough to outspeed the likes of banded sawk, qwilf, toxicroak, skunk, etc. i think that a lot of teamks simply arent prepped adequately for rotom-f, and it almost always goes 1-for-1 at worst, if played well. i do think that sub/willo/dual stab is pretty good too, but thats for you to decide for yourself i guess.
Mawile @ Rocky Helmet / Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off / Play Rough
- Iron Head
- Toxic
this thing has gone criminally overlooked as a rocker, simply put. i originally started using it because its a serviceable check to slurpuff, but it ended up being wayyy more useful than i wouldve expected. it has an excellent set of resistances, access to rocks and toxic which is always nice, and a super useful ability in intimidate. mawile carries its weight fantastically well, providing a solid check to SD silvally forms, scrafty, sneasel, togedemaru, mr. mime-galar, physical skuntanks, unfezant, and a whole host more. i think its typing and ability alone make mawile a shockingly good rocker, and one that i'd love to see more people experiment with in due time.
some more stray thoughts that arent as fully fleshed out:
togedemaru is very good. defensive sets have a cool niche in checking vika, klinklang, other toges, butterfree, mantine etc. scarf is also excellent and has an awesome speed tier.
cofag is nutty good. super resilient, great ability, and an assload of viable moves like willo, body press, hex, tspikes, haze, knock off, pain split, toxic. just an absolute defensive staple rn.
abomasnow still underrated! gives you an instantly great matchup vs weather, applies huge pressure w/ dual stabs, has priority, and a-veil is the best move in the game.
still feel like toxicroak hasnt been used enough lol. it might very well be the best mon in the tier and idt its being played adequately for how great its matchup seems to be vs like every team i see.
jolteon still terrible lol
swoobat very overrated i think, still super frail and rarely finds adequate turns to set up. also sever 4MSS because you kinda want substitute (for salac berry), nasty, stored power, giga, air slash, heatwave, but having to only run 4 moves is rufff and feels like youre always failing to cover some big defensive staple.
aurora veil is a very silly playstyle at the moment thanks to an abundance of setup sweepers like slurpuff, gearguy, butterfree, dual dance kingler, etc. lmfao who'da thought
thx for reading! hope my insight is worth anything to anybody :3
Rotom-Frost @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Nasty Plot
- Discharge
- Blizzard
kinda reinventing the wheel right? some variation of this has been used in like every upper tier for the other rotom forms, but i dont think rotom-f is getting enough love in NU atm. a lot of the slower, more defensive cores that are prevalent in the meta of today are absolute food for this thing, as it can set up substitutes against prevalent defensive tools such as mantine, ferroseed (lacking gyro ball), many sandaconda sets, pyukumuku, most qwilfishes, and obviously many more. while its speed tier isnt godlike, its good enough to outspeed the likes of banded sawk, qwilf, toxicroak, skunk, etc. i think that a lot of teamks simply arent prepped adequately for rotom-f, and it almost always goes 1-for-1 at worst, if played well. i do think that sub/willo/dual stab is pretty good too, but thats for you to decide for yourself i guess.
Mawile @ Rocky Helmet / Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off / Play Rough
- Iron Head
- Toxic
this thing has gone criminally overlooked as a rocker, simply put. i originally started using it because its a serviceable check to slurpuff, but it ended up being wayyy more useful than i wouldve expected. it has an excellent set of resistances, access to rocks and toxic which is always nice, and a super useful ability in intimidate. mawile carries its weight fantastically well, providing a solid check to SD silvally forms, scrafty, sneasel, togedemaru, mr. mime-galar, physical skuntanks, unfezant, and a whole host more. i think its typing and ability alone make mawile a shockingly good rocker, and one that i'd love to see more people experiment with in due time.
some more stray thoughts that arent as fully fleshed out:
togedemaru is very good. defensive sets have a cool niche in checking vika, klinklang, other toges, butterfree, mantine etc. scarf is also excellent and has an awesome speed tier.
thx for reading! hope my insight is worth anything to anybody :3
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I'm insanely hyped about Swoobat. Obviously, it's going to be a really strong Pokemon, but getting +4 a pop from a single use of Nasty Plot on top of its phenomenal speed tier and immediate access to STAB 100 BP Stored Power is nice. It's also really cool that it has a great typing in the tier right now, being able to check Haunter with its STAB SE moves and actively threaten the many Fighting types in the tier currently. Getting to run Sub and Roost is also quite nice, and I've found that it actually has some good opportunities to set up with. Despite its frailty, it has the ability to set up just by the threat of it alone.
Though, things getting Knock Off really, really stings, especially on Scarf mons.
Swoobat @ Leftovers
Ability: Simple
EVs: 32 HP / 252 SpA / 224 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Substitute / Roost
- Stored Power
- Heat Wave
A sample set I quickly concocted. While the EVs are pretty crude, I'm more focused on the moveset itself. It does suffer from 4MSS, though I believe Stored Power and Heat Wave are the ideal duo, as they cover one another's blind spots and allows for Swoobat to nail Steels in the tier. Only issue lies in the fact that bulky Psychics wall it, so the last slot is definitely prone to change depending on your preference.
Something else that's fun, I've found, is running a Sub Salac set with Nasty Plot as well. You beef your Stored Powers to a whopping Base 140 power, but this is really gimmicky, and requires a lot of team support. Might be a useful tech in the late game if played properly, though.
Dropping my thoughts on some post-home stuff.
About the Meta in general, I think it's much better now that you have way more options for hazard control on your team so you don't lose to spikes every single game and Toxic is back, lots of mons got better with Knock too.
Sneasel is amazing, its STABs cover basically anything alongside Low Kick, and priority Ice Shard can come in handy, the only thing that can really resist its coverage is Mawile, but since Inner Focus blocks Intimidate, after a Knock you should be able to wear it down between hazads and Icicle Crashes, otherwise this is just really strong in general, still amazing even without Pursuit and really hard to play against with offensive teams. SD could work too but I only have tried/seen Band so far.
I wish it didn't have Belly Drum, Calm Mind is a fun and balanced set but Belly Drum is just dumb, it's not impossible to play the tier rn because we have enough responses that don't force you to go too far to check it (you don't have to use like Clear Smog Lampent just so you don't lose to it), it's just something annoying that you have to keep in mind. its just a couple weeks before beta so we're good. The best ways to check are:
Defog Mantine is cool, so is Toxic, however the 4MSS it has is kinda annoying. You can't run Roost + Defog + Toxic/Haze + Scald + Air Slash, and since you don't want to be unable to touch Croak, you'll most likely need Air Slash, forcing you to drop either Scald or Toxic, really bulky and a solid defogger nonetheless.
As for Silvallies, Defog is really nice on it, you can use Poison to have a defogger that checks Slurpuff, and maybe throw in Surf so you aren't dead weight vs Rhydon (great mon rn). Maybe Water is fine too since it should be able to beat most hazard setters in the tier (Surf, Flamethrower, Defog, Parting Shot should be fine vs basically anything). Ground might be cool too as an Electric resist that defogs. Otherwise they got Flame Charge back which makes it much scarier as a sweeper, I can see it being specially nice on Silvally-Fairy.
I like Fan because its a Defogger and a Fighting/Flying resist, Frost looks good too, haven't tried it cuz Blizzard always misses tho, but anyway still a Flying resist that also resists Electric resist and has BoltBeam coverage, great against most hazard setters and most of the tier in general. Boots is obviously really cool for both. (They also have Pain Split which might be interesting in a STABs Defog set)
I think Lanturn was okay pre-home but without Toxic or Heal Bell it was just a BoltBeam resist that could burn or Volt Switch. Flareon is a similar case, Yawn is fine but it was lacking either Toxic to properly punish Fire-resists (specially Mantine) or Heal Bell for the extra value, SpD looks nice whereas you could use Phys Def as an emergency check to Slurpuff ig.
A lot of mons got Knock Off back which is great, its really cool for Croak because I hate how SD would always feel kinda helpless against bulky Ghosts (basically Cofa), at least now it has a good way to punish them, its also a nice option for Scarf (now just give it CC ffs). It's much better than Throat Chop as a stab/coverage for Malamar, Scrafty and Sawk. There's also Leafeon that had almost no coverage otherwise so at least it has that back. Those are the main ones I guess.
Roost Vikavolt is cool, much easier to beat bulkier shit and abuse its cool resistances/immunity with a recovery option, I tried an offensive set with Roost and its bulk + recovery can help a lot sometimes, I also think Charti might be a nice option vs stuff like Rhydon, Drednaw, or just Rock coverage in general, this means no Boots, tho. Drampa got Roost and Defog which might be cool alongside its decent bulk but I don't know how good it could be and I don't think I've ever seen Drampa in NU so far, so I won't say too much about it.
Finally for hidden abilities, Simple Swoobat is probably the coolest one, I'm still not convinced it isn't just a meme when it has a very hard time setting up and can't boost its speed to prevent itself from being RK'd by Sneasel, Jolteon or Scarfers, but ig the raw power after a NP might work (I'm using Sneasel a lot rn so it never gets to do that much against me). Tinted Lens Noctowl is interessting alongside Hurricane and NP, Idk what this would run but I could even see a double dance set putting in some work, specially with its respectful bulk allowing it to find more setup opportunities, never tried it or saw it do much, tho, so I don't know what to think. Meowstic-F might be interessting on offense to punish Defog. Meowstic and Liepard with Prankster can now be solid setters for screens and weather, respectively.
Also Gourgeist got Synthesis which makes Super much better and every other non Gen8 mon got Toxic but ig those are minor changes so I won't go too deep into them.
About the Meta in general, I think it's much better now that you have way more options for hazard control on your team so you don't lose to spikes every single game and Toxic is back, lots of mons got better with Knock too.
- Poison-types that resist Play Rough (Garbodor, Poison-Vally or Qwilfish; maybe PhysDef Roselia),
- Cofagrigus (you either eat one and burn/haze it or sack it to get Mummy and revenge kill with something faster
- Shedinja, unless Slurpuff with Flamethrower or a status move becomes a thing (Flamethrower also hits Eiscue without activating Ice Face, but Idk how much you care about it); I heard about Gastro Acid which also invalidates Unaware but sacrificing a slot for that scenario kinda sucks and the mon can just status and switch out so what's the point.
- Boots Phys Def Flareon should work as you can eat any hit and burn or Toxic it, kinda sucks that you need phys def just for that tho.
- Boots Sturdy Sawk is also interesting but you don't ko after Drain Punch heal so you would have to run Counter if you want to be safe vs it (which doesn't necessarily look that bad but it sucks to use it on a mon that already has a 4MSS), without hazards Sturdy Sawk with Band works.
- Mawile is similar to Sawk since you can't KO it with Iron Head and you'd need Metal Burst in order to reliably stop it, cool mon tho cuz Rocker + good Sneasel and Puff check in one slot.
- Finally something like Chople Perrserker with some Phys. Def investment can work as well.
Also Gourgeist got Synthesis which makes Super much better and every other non Gen8 mon got Toxic but ig those are minor changes so I won't go too deep into them.
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It's that time once again for me to urge the NU community to please use my friend Pawniard
Pawniard @ Eviolite
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
Really though, Pawniard remains one of my favorite Pokemon to use competitively, and now that both Knock Off and Defog are back it has so much more potential. It does struggle with being a Steel-type that gets outsped and OHKOed by Slurpuff, and it's not super likely to outright sweep most teams, but it's a highly fun and useful holepuncher that offers a ton of offensive support.
Gourgeist-Small @ Life Orb
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Power Whip
- Shadow Sneak
- Fire Blast
- Explosion
This looks like a meme, and it still kind of is, but it's the good type. Smallgeist is the fastest Grass-type in the tier, spinblocks, and its offensive movepool has always been pretty clutch, especially now that it gets Power Whip. Priority is always useful and notably threatens Galarian Mime despite it outspeeding you, Fire Blast is just enough to always 2HKO SpD Ferroseed, and Explosion destroys common switchins like Skunk and Flareon. Rock Slide likely has some use over Sneak / Explosion too but I haven't tried it yet.
Other, smaller notes:
@
- Unless I absolutely need Colbur Berry, I'm starting to prefer Kasib Berry as the anti-meta pick for bulky Ghosts and Psychics. The ability to eat a hit from Haunter and kill in return is so valuable in this meta. These two are the ones I use the most but I'm sure it works for others as well.
- Unsurprisingly, the meta is more offense-oriented, but not quite as much as you'd expect from a typical alpha tier. Boots is a godsend in keeping bulky cores viable, and HO actually isn't super favorable when compared to bulky offense or offensive balance. Fat balance feels like the least favorable style imo, it's highly important to either have some aggressive edge or go full stall.
- On the subject of offense, everyone's been talking about Slurpuff, and these two have potential as clutch offensive checks for as long as it sticks around (which I imagine won't be very long after this month). Eiscue is known for being gimmicky, but it's a gimmick that can still completely halt a sweep and threaten to reverse it right around. Note that it does need to run SubSalac to outspeed Unburden Puff though. As for Sawk, it can run either Boots Counter or CB Poison Jab (both with Sturdy ofc) depending on the team.
- Paralysis is a strong form of speed control in theory; our priority users are rather limited, Sticky Web is unreliable thanks to Boots, and Scarfers are just kind of mediocre. Definitely plan on looking more into it.
Pawniard @ Eviolite
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
Really though, Pawniard remains one of my favorite Pokemon to use competitively, and now that both Knock Off and Defog are back it has so much more potential. It does struggle with being a Steel-type that gets outsped and OHKOed by Slurpuff, and it's not super likely to outright sweep most teams, but it's a highly fun and useful holepuncher that offers a ton of offensive support.
Gourgeist-Small @ Life Orb
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Power Whip
- Shadow Sneak
- Fire Blast
- Explosion
This looks like a meme, and it still kind of is, but it's the good type. Smallgeist is the fastest Grass-type in the tier, spinblocks, and its offensive movepool has always been pretty clutch, especially now that it gets Power Whip. Priority is always useful and notably threatens Galarian Mime despite it outspeeding you, Fire Blast is just enough to always 2HKO SpD Ferroseed, and Explosion destroys common switchins like Skunk and Flareon. Rock Slide likely has some use over Sneak / Explosion too but I haven't tried it yet.
Other, smaller notes:
@
- Unless I absolutely need Colbur Berry, I'm starting to prefer Kasib Berry as the anti-meta pick for bulky Ghosts and Psychics. The ability to eat a hit from Haunter and kill in return is so valuable in this meta. These two are the ones I use the most but I'm sure it works for others as well.
- Unsurprisingly, the meta is more offense-oriented, but not quite as much as you'd expect from a typical alpha tier. Boots is a godsend in keeping bulky cores viable, and HO actually isn't super favorable when compared to bulky offense or offensive balance. Fat balance feels like the least favorable style imo, it's highly important to either have some aggressive edge or go full stall.
- On the subject of offense, everyone's been talking about Slurpuff, and these two have potential as clutch offensive checks for as long as it sticks around (which I imagine won't be very long after this month). Eiscue is known for being gimmicky, but it's a gimmick that can still completely halt a sweep and threaten to reverse it right around. Note that it does need to run SubSalac to outspeed Unburden Puff though. As for Sawk, it can run either Boots Counter or CB Poison Jab (both with Sturdy ofc) depending on the team.
- Paralysis is a strong form of speed control in theory; our priority users are rather limited, Sticky Web is unreliable thanks to Boots, and Scarfers are just kind of mediocre. Definitely plan on looking more into it.
Funbot28
Banned deucer.
Been really liking Screens offense and offense in general after the post-Home update. Here is a team that I been having a blast using on the ladder:
Thoughts on specific mons here:
Thoughts on specific mons here:
- : This thing got busted again with the combo of Belly Drum + Drain Punch. While the lack of Return means that defensive checks such as PhysDef Garbador and Qwilfish can help deal with it, Slurpuff just does to much of a wincon with the right support (ie: with either Screens, hazard support, or even more fringe options like Memento or Healing Wish), making it extremely hard to properly avoid a clean sweep once it can get a Bdrum off. This is compounded with rather decent bulk and a great defensive typing that offers it a lot of opportunities to setup. Probably deserves a quickban which sucks as Sticky Web lead sets and Calm Mind sets were fun to use.
- : Another rather crazy wincon, TR + NP Cofag with Sball and Bpress can also sweep teams like no one's business. It can also find quite a few opportunities to setup given the amount of Fighting types in the tier that tend to lock themselves in Fighting moves or just generally setup on physical mons thanks to its great natural physical bulk. The wider distribution of Knock Off does help deal with Cofag somewhat, but I also been experimenting with TR + Colbur Berry and it can really mess up how one chooses to properly prevent Cofag from setting up. Another kinda busted mon rn ngl.
- : Addition of Nasty Plot and getting Simple back makes the bat quite usable this gen. While their are still checks like Stunktank, Scarf Togedemaru, and AV Lanturn, after getting an NP or two, Swoobat can sweep pretty easily. Really fun to actually have this bat viable for once and I think its a dope addition to the tier.
In addition to my last post I want to talk a bit more about my fav gen8-mon Orbeetle .
When I played sw/sh I just liked that mon for its unique typing and its (imo) cool design. But little did I know.
Anyway Im going to start of with the set I had the most success with.
Im sure this is the set most people know and what it does / how to play it. There are many variations to this set e.g. Body Press > Bug Buzz + Iron Defense > Calm Mind or > Agility. Or 252 SpA instead of 248 HP … the list goes on.
What I like about this set is the fact that Orbeetle really shines by being the sweeper / breaker. When Im building a team around a mon its most likely the star of the team and what would be a better star than the sweeper? With Homes release this set got buffed and nerfed. The buff comes from more passive mons running Knock Off over an other filler move 'cause everything that learns Knock should use it. With them knocking off you get your WP-boosts wich immediately boost the power of Stored Power (lol). I have to admit that the nerf is bigger that the buff. Toxic is everywhere and you really want to boost in peace while them doing no damage but toxic cuts hard into your longevity. I guess you could run Lum Berry but no boosts from Weakness Policy mean that you are super weak or you have to waste many turns for setting up. I still love this set especially underbroken Veil.
The next set is this one:
So this is going to be hard 'cause on the defensive / utility site you can customize this thing to do nearly anything. I either run this set which is faster than Adamant Stonjourner or if you lacke an answer to Croak you can run 216 speed timid with Colbur Berry to live the Sucker Punch and kill it with Psychic in return. Sticky Web and Magic Coat are also viable options but more for (anti)lead-variants. U-Turn is always great for momentum on Volt-Turn-Teams or hazard stack. Im not going to go over every modification in the EVs but Im encouraging you to modify this mon yourself! Giga Drain / Energy Ball is like Body Press coverage for Rock-types with the benefit of hitting most Rock-types harder (and for the likes of Giga Drain giving some recovery) but keep in mind that you lose to most Dark-types on paper. Futur Sight is my fav way of creating mind-games but its removable I guess.
The next two sets are outclassed by other mons just doing better or by the upper mentiont sets so count them as honorable mentions:
With the possibility of Veil being banned screen offense will be harder to run. The list of viable screen-setters is limited and imo Orbeetle is one of them. U-Turn for momentum, Screens (duh) and Recover for longevity. Nothing special tho.
Standard scarfer: good speed, decent STABs + okay offensive stats. Nothing new but can be useful. Trick is after Knock Off the freest move with Silvally being the only viable counter to it.
Im stupid and posted this first in PU and got deleted so I hope i covered everything.
Thanks for reading.
.When I played sw/sh I just liked that mon for its unique typing and its (imo) cool design. But little did I know.
Anyway Im going to start of with the set I had the most success with.
Orbeetle @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid / Modest Nature
- Calm Mind
- Bug Buzz
- Stored Power
- Agility
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid / Modest Nature
- Calm Mind
- Bug Buzz
- Stored Power
- Agility
What I like about this set is the fact that Orbeetle really shines by being the sweeper / breaker. When Im building a team around a mon its most likely the star of the team and what would be a better star than the sweeper? With Homes release this set got buffed and nerfed. The buff comes from more passive mons running Knock Off over an other filler move 'cause everything that learns Knock should use it. With them knocking off you get your WP-boosts wich immediately boost the power of Stored Power (lol). I have to admit that the nerf is bigger that the buff. Toxic is everywhere and you really want to boost in peace while them doing no damage but toxic cuts hard into your longevity. I guess you could run Lum Berry but no boosts from Weakness Policy mean that you are super weak or you have to waste many turns for setting up. I still love this set especially under
The next set is this one:
Orbeetle @ Leftovers / Colbur Berry
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 164 Def / 96 Spe
Bold Nature
- U-turn
- Recover
- Body Press / Magic Coat / Sticky Web / Giga Drain / Energy Ball
- Psychic / Psyshock / Futur Sight /
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 164 Def / 96 Spe
Bold Nature
- U-turn
- Recover
- Body Press / Magic Coat / Sticky Web / Giga Drain / Energy Ball
- Psychic / Psyshock / Futur Sight /
The next two sets are outclassed by other mons just doing better or by the upper mentiont sets so count them as honorable mentions:
Orbeetle @ Light Clay
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- U-turn
- Recover
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- U-turn
- Recover
Orbeetle @ Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Psychic
- Bug Buzz
- U-turn
- Trick / Energy Ball
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Psychic
- Bug Buzz
- U-turn
- Trick / Energy Ball
Im stupid and posted this first in PU and got deleted so I hope i covered everything.
Thanks for reading.
Perrserker @ Choice Band
Ability: Steely Spirit
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Iron Tail
- U-turn
- Iron Head
- Close Combat
I tried this mon a bunch of times with the standard Tough Claws sets, and always found it really underwhelming, so decided to give Steely Spirit a try. I actually think this set is significantly better, because Iron Head becomes so so brainless and spammable to click with the level of power SS provides, meaning you never really even click coverage.
252+ Atk Choice Band Steely Spirit Perrserker Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cofagrigus: 211-250 (65.9 - 78.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (even with the removal of ability)
252+ Atk Choice Band Steely Spirit Perrserker Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mantine: 172-203 (45.9 - 54.2%) -- 53.1% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Steely Spirit Perrserker Iron Head vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mantine: 172-203 (45.9 - 54.2%) -- 53.1% chance to 2HKO
Like lol. You don't need stronger coverage when you can click Iron Tail occasionally for absurd calcs like this:
252+ Atk Choice Band Steely Spirit Perrserker Iron Tail vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Ferroseed: 122-144 (41.7 - 49.3%) -- 21.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Choice Band Steely Spirit Perrserker Iron Tail vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Pyukumuku: 143-168 (45.5 - 53.5%) -- 94.1% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Steely Spirit Perrserker Iron Tail vs. 40 HP / 220 Def Lanturn: 136-160 (33.9 - 39.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Steely Spirit Perrserker Iron Tail vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cofagrigus: 264-312 (82.5 - 97.5%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Choice Band Steely Spirit Perrserker Iron Tail vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Pyukumuku: 143-168 (45.5 - 53.5%) -- 94.1% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Steely Spirit Perrserker Iron Tail vs. 40 HP / 220 Def Lanturn: 136-160 (33.9 - 39.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Steely Spirit Perrserker Iron Tail vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cofagrigus: 264-312 (82.5 - 97.5%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
Obviously still has the same ol' faults of being slow and not particularly fat, but this is the set to run to make the most out of the opportunities it gets.
EDIT: Actually calc is broke and doubles bp with Steely Spirit instead of doing 1.5x so these calcs are off! I was wondering why it seemed like I was getting low rolls all the time lol. Still better than Tough Claws though
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I wanted to show off a twist on the popular Nasty Plot/Trick Room Cofagrigus set people have been using.
Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
Ability: Mummy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Shadow Ball
- Body Press
- Iron Defense
- Trick Room
At +2, Cofag becomes really tough to revenge kill, and given the opportunity can sweep under Trick Room. Here's a quick replay to show off what it can do. Sawk failed to revenge kill this thing at 20%. Don't sleep on this setunless you're using spore
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1067498278
edit: another sweep https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1067586652
Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
Ability: Mummy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Shadow Ball
- Body Press
- Iron Defense
- Trick Room
At +2, Cofag becomes really tough to revenge kill, and given the opportunity can sweep under Trick Room. Here's a quick replay to show off what it can do. Sawk failed to revenge kill this thing at 20%. Don't sleep on this set
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1067498278
edit: another sweep https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1067586652
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Just gonna post some fun sets!
Silvally-Fire @ Fire Memory
Ability: RKS System
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower
- Thunderbolt / Grass Pledge
- Surf
- Work Up
Pressures balance thanks to coverage and gives you a wincon. It's better than Heatmor and that's the only other special fire. Work Up + Surf blows back Wish Flareon. T-Bolt or Grass Pledge is up to you: T-bolt hits Mantine while Grass Pledge hits Lanturn so think about what is more valuable for your team. It also avoids a 2HKO from CB Sneasel so that's pretty cool!
Gourgeist-Super @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Impish Nature
- Power Whip
- Synthesis
- Leech Seed
- Will-O-Wisp
Sturdy Fighting resist and general physical sponge to most things especially Kingler. Not much to say about it but I think it's good right now. Annoy their teams with Leech Seeds and burns. Power Whip stops you from being too passive.
Roselia @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spikes
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Synthesis
Pretty desperate for checks to broken BD Slurpuff but this counts. I remember quziel talking about this on Discord but I tried it out on ladder and it wasn't too bad.
Drakloak @ Choice Specs
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Shadow Ball
- U-Turn / Thunderbolt
- Fire Blast
Fun meme set I was using! It's mostly outclassed by Haunter, but it has a few perks. Better speed tier against key threats (102 vs 95), fire coverage roasting ferroseed, toge and friends and better match up vs Skuntank. Clear Body's nice against sticky web teams and you can u-turn out for momentum on bulky targets. It's also cute so it must be good. xd
Silvally-Fire @ Fire Memory
Ability: RKS System
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower
- Thunderbolt / Grass Pledge
- Surf
- Work Up
Pressures balance thanks to coverage and gives you a wincon. It's better than Heatmor and that's the only other special fire. Work Up + Surf blows back Wish Flareon. T-Bolt or Grass Pledge is up to you: T-bolt hits Mantine while Grass Pledge hits Lanturn so think about what is more valuable for your team. It also avoids a 2HKO from CB Sneasel so that's pretty cool!
Gourgeist-Super @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Impish Nature
- Power Whip
- Synthesis
- Leech Seed
- Will-O-Wisp
Sturdy Fighting resist and general physical sponge to most things especially Kingler. Not much to say about it but I think it's good right now. Annoy their teams with Leech Seeds and burns. Power Whip stops you from being too passive.
Roselia @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spikes
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Synthesis
Pretty desperate for checks to broken BD Slurpuff but this counts. I remember quziel talking about this on Discord but I tried it out on ladder and it wasn't too bad.
Drakloak @ Choice Specs
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Shadow Ball
- U-Turn / Thunderbolt
- Fire Blast
Fun meme set I was using! It's mostly outclassed by Haunter, but it has a few perks. Better speed tier against key threats (102 vs 95), fire coverage roasting ferroseed, toge and friends and better match up vs Skuntank. Clear Body's nice against sticky web teams and you can u-turn out for momentum on bulky targets. It's also cute so it must be good. xd
Since everyone is desperatly looking for checks to BD Puff, i've got one that is pretty consistent:
Garbodor @ Poison Barb
Ability: Weak Armor
EVs: 4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant / Jolly Nature
- Explosion / Stomping Tantrum
- Cross Poison / Gunk Shot
- Seed Bomb
- Endure
Ability: Weak Armor
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Wave
- Giga Drain
- Focus Blast / Psychic
- Endure
Ik Ik Garbodor is nothing new or anything special in terms of a check to Puff but I never saw someone talking about this set so I call myself the inventer. Its pretty self-explanatory, you live a hit from Puff at any HP by using Endure. Weak Armor gives you +2 speed and since Garbodor is natural faster than Puff you are going to outspeed it in the following turn and OHKOing it in return.
The main perk to this set and its variations is that you can let your Garbodor get chipped by countering/checking Puffs teammates.
Now this set isn't flawless. Your oponent can play arround Endure with using Cotton Guard or Belly Drum again. Also with Abomasnow being the best Veil setter you have more than one problem. You cant OHKO Puff under Veil (even at 75%) and the Hail-damage is going to kill you regardless of Endure.
While testing these sets I realised that special Garb is a better check to Puff and a bit better overall. Modest Giga Drain hits Rhydon harder than Adamant Seed Bomb and Sludge Wave harder than Cross Poison (against Puff, Nerd). Psychic can be used over Focus Blast if you dont want to be set-up fodder against Toxicroak but keep in mind that you have
Im guessing that either Veil and/or Puff are going to be banned when we are in beta and I post this a bit late but idc.
only against mentioned mons
thanks again for reading
Garbodor @ Poison Barb
Ability: Weak Armor
EVs: 4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant / Jolly Nature
- Explosion / Stomping Tantrum
- Cross Poison / Gunk Shot
- Seed Bomb
- Endure
or
Garbodor @ Poison Barb Ability: Weak Armor
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Wave
- Giga Drain
- Focus Blast / Psychic
- Endure
Ik Ik Garbodor is nothing new or anything special in terms of a check to Puff but I never saw someone talking about this set so I call myself the inventer. Its pretty self-explanatory, you live a hit from Puff at any HP by using Endure. Weak Armor gives you +2 speed and since Garbodor is natural faster than Puff you are going to outspeed it in the following turn and OHKOing it in return.
The main perk to this set and its variations is that you can let your Garbodor get chipped by countering/checking Puffs teammates.
Now this set isn't flawless. Your oponent can play arround Endure with using Cotton Guard or Belly Drum again. Also with Abomasnow being the best Veil setter you have more than one problem. You cant OHKO Puff under Veil (even at 75%) and the Hail-damage is going to kill you regardless of Endure.
While testing these sets I realised that special Garb is a better check to Puff and a bit better overall. Modest Giga Drain hits Rhydon harder than Adamant Seed Bomb and Sludge Wave harder than Cross Poison (against Puff, Nerd). Psychic can be used over Focus Blast if you dont want to be set-up fodder against Toxicroak but keep in mind that you have
Im guessing that either Veil and/or Puff are going to be banned when we are in beta and I post this a bit late but idc.
only against mentioned mons
Against Puff:
special:
252+ SpA Poison Barb Garbodor Sludge Wave vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff: 318-374 (103.9 - 122.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Poison Barb Garbodor Sludge Wave vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff: 288-342 (94.1 - 111.7%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO (Timid)
252+ SpA Poison Barb Garbodor Sludge Wave vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff with an ally's Aurora Veil: 159-187 (51.9 - 61.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Poison Barb Garbodor Sludge Wave vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff with an ally's Aurora Veil: 144-171 (47 - 55.8%) -- 78.5% chance to 2HKO
physical:
252+ Atk Poison Barb Garbodor Cross Poison vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff: 276-326 (90.1 - 106.5%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Poison Barb Garbodor Cross Poison vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff: 254-300 (83 - 98%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Jolly)
252+ Atk Poison Barb Garbodor Cross Poison vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff with an ally's Aurora Veil: 138-163 (45 - 53.2%) -- 32.4% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Poison Barb Garbodor Cross Poison vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff with an ally's Aurora Veil: 127-150 (41.5 - 49%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Against Rhydon:
special:
252+ SpA Garbodor Giga Drain vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Rhydon: 276-328 (78.4 - 93.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Garbodor Giga Drain vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Rhydon: 252-300 (71.5 - 85.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
physical:
252+ Atk Garbodor Seed Bomb vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Rhydon: 180-212 (51.1 - 60.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Garbodor Seed Bomb vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Rhydon: 160-192 (45.4 - 54.5%) -- 55.9% chance to 2HKO
Against Toxicroak:
special:
252+ SpA Garbodor Psychic vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Toxicroak: 372-440 (121.1 - 143.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Garbodor Psychic vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Toxicroak: 340-404 (110.7 - 131.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
physical:
252+ Atk Garbodor Stomping Tantrum vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Toxicroak: 206-244 (67.1 - 79.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Garbodor Stomping Tantrum vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Toxicroak: 188-222 (61.2 - 72.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
special:
252+ SpA Poison Barb Garbodor Sludge Wave vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff: 318-374 (103.9 - 122.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Poison Barb Garbodor Sludge Wave vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff: 288-342 (94.1 - 111.7%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO (Timid)
252+ SpA Poison Barb Garbodor Sludge Wave vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff with an ally's Aurora Veil: 159-187 (51.9 - 61.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Poison Barb Garbodor Sludge Wave vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff with an ally's Aurora Veil: 144-171 (47 - 55.8%) -- 78.5% chance to 2HKO
physical:
252+ Atk Poison Barb Garbodor Cross Poison vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff: 276-326 (90.1 - 106.5%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Poison Barb Garbodor Cross Poison vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff: 254-300 (83 - 98%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Jolly)
252+ Atk Poison Barb Garbodor Cross Poison vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff with an ally's Aurora Veil: 138-163 (45 - 53.2%) -- 32.4% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Poison Barb Garbodor Cross Poison vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Slurpuff with an ally's Aurora Veil: 127-150 (41.5 - 49%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Against Rhydon:
special:
252+ SpA Garbodor Giga Drain vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Rhydon: 276-328 (78.4 - 93.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Garbodor Giga Drain vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Rhydon: 252-300 (71.5 - 85.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
physical:
252+ Atk Garbodor Seed Bomb vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Rhydon: 180-212 (51.1 - 60.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Garbodor Seed Bomb vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Rhydon: 160-192 (45.4 - 54.5%) -- 55.9% chance to 2HKO
Against Toxicroak:
special:
252+ SpA Garbodor Psychic vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Toxicroak: 372-440 (121.1 - 143.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Garbodor Psychic vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Toxicroak: 340-404 (110.7 - 131.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
physical:
252+ Atk Garbodor Stomping Tantrum vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Toxicroak: 206-244 (67.1 - 79.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Garbodor Stomping Tantrum vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Toxicroak: 188-222 (61.2 - 72.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
These are the two sets that I have been trying out to deal with set up sweepers.
Pyukumuku @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Recover
- Rest
- Toxic
- Spite
252+ Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Pyukumuku: 70-84 (22.2 - 26.7%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery
Simply Toxic stall Slurpuff to death.
Here's something a bit less passive:
252 SpA Black Glasses Liepard Dark Pulse vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff: 76-90 (24.8 - 29.4%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO
Liepard @ Black Glasses
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Dark Pulse
- Encore
- Copycat
Switch Liepard into a predicted set-up move and use Encore. Either set up with Nasty Plot or use Dark Pulse to do solid damage.
Pyukumuku @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Recover
- Rest
- Toxic
- Spite
252+ Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Pyukumuku: 70-84 (22.2 - 26.7%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery
Simply Toxic stall Slurpuff to death.
Here's something a bit less passive:
252 SpA Black Glasses Liepard Dark Pulse vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff: 76-90 (24.8 - 29.4%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO
Liepard @ Black Glasses
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Dark Pulse
- Encore
- Copycat
Switch Liepard into a predicted set-up move and use Encore. Either set up with Nasty Plot or use Dark Pulse to do solid damage.
Id replace Spite with Soak so you can toxic stall poison and steel types too
I'd rather swap out Toxic with Block, that way you can PP stall any trapped target to death
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 240 HP / 252 Atk / 12 Def / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Acrobatics
- Protect
- U-turn
- Swords Dance
This is a really slept on cleaner imo. Adamant Acrobatics is surprisingly strong, 1hko'ing standard Silvally spreads at +2, while protect and Speed Boost lets you outspeed the entire meta - 4 spe beats Jolly unburden Slurpuff, if that's a thing, and acro will kill as long as it was chipped a tiny bit while setting up. Protect stops one of the key flying resists offense has, scarf Togedemaru, revenging you or gaining momentum on you, as they can't click U-turn or you just swords dance again, meaning they have to Zing Zap, leaving you to bop them with a +2 u-turn and switch in a suitable answer. Mid game you just click U-turn to chip flying resists and force stuff out with a 110bp flying STAB off 306 attk.
Obviously hazard support is needed since no boots, but it can still nab opportunities with its few resists, immunities and barely acceptable bulk with this hp investment.
Have some random replays of it doing stuff because I'm trash at explaining anyway:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1069824343 - sets up on a Mantine and sweeps 3 mons, outspeeding what I assume was a scarf Rapidash
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1069832561 - sets up and sweeps 4 mons vs HO
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1069665461 - no big sweep, takes out an Orbeetle and pivots + scouts a Specs Lapras
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1066859201 - punishing a u-turning Togedemaru by sweeping its team
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1069832561 - sets up and sweeps 4 mons vs HO
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1069665461 - no big sweep, takes out an Orbeetle and pivots + scouts a Specs Lapras
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8nu-1066859201 - punishing a u-turning Togedemaru by sweeping its team
- Status