It's kind of funny that the two pokemon who were the biggest roadblock for offense are gone, whereas all the things that balance can't handle are still around. This is going to make checking Kyu-B even more annoying.
Where did you get access to these usage stats?Not sure I agree with banning Naga first as it is “most ban-worthy” when we have Kyub and Lando-I in the tier (arguably as broken if not more so) sporting 12 and 14 percent usage respectively to Naga’s 6%
That is Smogon's modus operandi lol. You kind of have to learn how to get used to it.Yea I don't agree with naga being QB'd over the others, thats just another case of the council doing their own thingand bet we won't be allowed a retest like ace did either
I think still naga has significantly more checks/counters that can stonewall it or delay it long enough to be offensively checked, than lando/kyu/and genesect combined, and it would've been better to remove those threats and see how naga fairs in a meta with them gone. It might've still be broken but what the fuck is that bias to QB it over other stuff.. at least include them with the QB.
You can even lure them in quite well; it has access to a very colorful movepool with a 110 SPA. Before you scout it, it's actually pretty tricky to deal with.IMO Galarian Slowking should be listed as a viable OU addition in the preliminary Viability List. Yes, it's not going to be GREAT probably but it's got a unique and useful defensive typing that has important niches over Slowking/Slowbro due to not being weak to Electric, Grass, and Bug (along with a Fairy resistance). Yes, being weak to Ground in a meta where Lando-I exists and Ground-types are everywhere (in part due to Regieleki), but those aforementioned benefits are still notable.
https://www.babiri.net/#/teamsouWhere did you get access to these usage stats?
I don't really understand this...what checks and counters are there? Aside from heatran/tyranitar/blissey with twave/av magearna...there really isnt anything else, and it's hard to actually offensively check it because of beast boost boosting its speed after a kill. I also imagine the council voted on other pokemon as well, though I do wish we got to see some of the votes like in lower tiers.Yea I don't agree with naga being QB'd over the others, thats just another case of the council doing their own thingand bet we won't be allowed a retest like ace did either
I think still naga has significantly more checks/counters that can stonewall it or delay it long enough to be offensively checked, than lando/kyu/and genesect combined, and it would've been better to remove those threats and see how naga fairs in a meta with them gone. It might've still be broken but what the fuck is that bias to QB it over other stuff.. at least include them with the QB.
I think suicune has potential in the tier and/or will have a lot more potential once the meta settles and moves away from HO spam. As a side note, isn’t this core shut down completely by Toxapex or do you have some tech on suicune?I don't really understand this...what checks and counters are there? Aside from heatran/tyranitar/blissey with twave/av magearna...there really isnt anything else, and it's hard to actually offensively check it because of beast boost boosting its speed after a kill. I also imagine the council voted on other pokemon as well, though I do wish we got to see some of the votes like in lower tiers.
Anyway, to return to the the current metagame, I have been playing around with the combination of toxic spikes + sub cm suicune. Specifically, I am using nihilego to set my tspikes with this set:
Nihilego @ Black Sludge
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 8 HP / 252 SpA / 248 Spe
Timid Nature
- Toxic Spikes
- Sludge Wave
- Power Gem
- Knock Off
Speed is for jolly garchomp. There might be a better set, but I really like knock off since you can bait in pex, and the combination of lack of black sludge recovery + burn from scald helps suicune a lot. Also, knock off is just broken in general this gen so...no reason not to run it.
Has anyone else had success with suicune? If there are any other toxic spikes setters you guys have used, or any other partners you really like using with suicune, please share! I think suicune has a chance to be an underrated pick this gen.
A knocked and burned toxapex can't beat suicune, as far as I know. This is suicune vs max spdef calm toxapex: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ou-1211793998-rnvxlaw20rp5ui6kk6m37esjbh3oq45pwI think suicune has potential in the tier and/or will have a lot more potential once the meta settles and moves away from HO spam. As a side note, isn’t this core shut down completely by Toxapex or do you have some tech on suicune?
To clarify my point about toxapex:A knocked and burned toxapex can't beat suicune, as far as I know. This is suicune vs max spdef calm toxapex: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ou-1211793998-rnvxlaw20rp5ui6kk6m37esjbh3oq45pw
Obviously, this situation may not be the most realistic because adding regenerator and other teammates makes things more complicated, but in terms of a pure 1v1 suicune should win (even easier vs physdef pex). On the team I'm using, I have lando I and magma/ep heatran to pressure toxapex as well, so that I don't have to rely on trying to 1v5 with suicune even when opposing toxapex is put into an unfavorable position. Toxapex has always been a thorn in suicune's side so if you guys have any more ideas for how to make this core more effective, let me know!
Usage =/= viabilityNot sure I agree with banning Naga first as it is “most ban-worthy” when we have Kyub and Lando-I in the tier (arguably as broken if not more so) sporting 12 and 14 percent usage respectively to Naga’s 6%
i would agree but since you cant use mega in ou ss and blaziken normal speed stats is only 80 your gonna want that extra speed boosts or your never gonna be able to attack, also you dont need sword dance.While on paper this set might sound great, there are definitely some issues.
By fitting Protect and Swords Dance you sacrifice any sort of coverage Blaziken can use, letting it be checked even harder by Pokemon such as Slowbro, Tapu Fini, Toxapex, Moltres, Latis, Salamence, Dragonite, Victini, and heck Gyarados and Alolan Marowak, which resist the STAB combination and can easily blow it away with their super effective attacks. Even Toxapex with it's garbage special attack is able to 2HKO it after a round of Life Orb recoil or Stealth Rock damage. The fact that this set is dependent entirely on Recoil and Defense Dropping moves for any sort of damage also just undermines it's already ridiculous bulk even more.
Edit: You also put Blaze as it's ability, instead of the vastly superior Speed Boost
Yea I definitely don't think something should be banned strictly on viability. I was moreso saying that all 3 Naga, Lando-I, and Kyu-B are equally powerful enough to be at least considered for a ban. Given their much higher usage I would've considered them a priority if you want to clean up the meta buuut I guess council voted differently.Usage =/= viability
... Although I do agree with you to an extent. While right now lando-I has been relatively manageable imo, kyub is so overbearingly powerful after a ddance its not even funny. It will rip your team apart and its not very hard for it to set up given its great natural bulk and near perfect boltbeam coverage.
Aside from that, I agree with the council's decision to QB naga. Once it gets going it's very hard to stop even with priority since its resistant/neutral to the most common priority moves. If it seems underwhelming, it is probably because heatran is being spammed by half the ladder as a necessity in order to deal with it and the other broken mons roaming ou.
I was thinking of running a similar set (focusing on Rest Talk I mean) but I still no quite sure if G-Moltres would be that useful in OU. Maybe a niche pick, but not thay great imo.I wanna talk about this mon![]()
Moltres-Galar @ Leftovers
Ability: Berserk
EVs: 248 HP / 204 SpA / 56 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sleep Talk
- Rest
- Fiery Wrath
- Air Slash
This set is ripped from a blunder video, and while I don't know exactly what the spread is for, i've found it really useful as a sort of bulky pivot that can eventually be a wincon. It's a great status absorber that is also surprisingly strong and surprisingly bulky. This mon is very good at slowly defeating other fat mons, and can even serve as a half-decent check to pokes like lando-i and zygarde. Berserk comes into play quite a bit and makes beating defensive mons a bit easier.
Knock + Rocks dampens this badly. AlsoSo, a bit of theory-moning before I try this set out. But I tried to figure out what a potential check to Lando-I, that can come in on anything fairly consistently might look like (outside of Cress). Unfortunately my first choice didn't have enough Sp Def. So here's Araquanid.
Araquanid @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Careful Nature
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
- Sticky Web
- Liquidation
- Magic Coat
- Toxic
Essentially you are never 3HKOed by any of standard Timid Lando's moves, and you can always OHKO it back. You do unfortunately have to lose out on the 44 speed EVs run on standard webs spider to make sure you take 33.3% max from sludge wave. The leftover EVs are put into Attack to net you an OHKO on Lando a bit more consistently. You only outspeed Pelipper and negative speed nature Magearna with 8 speed EVs, so it's better to get some more oomph.
This is a really interesting mon, and another interesting set that I've seen being run (I don't know the spread since I only saw it a couple times) is weakness policy and agility. Come in on a U-turn or live a super effective move with its great bulk and you are in good shape.I wanna talk about this mon![]()
Moltres-Galar @ Leftovers
Ability: Berserk
EVs: 248 HP / 204 SpA / 56 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sleep Talk
- Rest
- Fiery Wrath
- Air Slash
This set is ripped from a blunder video, and while I don't know exactly what the spread is for, i've found it really useful as a sort of bulky pivot that can eventually be a wincon. It's a great status absorber that is also surprisingly strong and surprisingly bulky. This mon is very good at slowly defeating other fat mons, and can even serve as a half-decent check to pokes like lando-i and zygarde. Berserk comes into play quite a bit and makes beating defensive mons a bit easier.
I'm sorry but who in the world is running rock slide Landorus-I? Is there some secret tech I'm missing?Knock + Rocks dampens this badly. Also
4 Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Rock Slide vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Araquanid: 239-283 (70.2 - 83.2%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
It's mainly to hit tornadus, but people have switched to gravity + earth power to hit ground immunities insteadI'm sorry but who in the world is running rock slide Landorus-I? Is there some secret tech I'm missing?