PU Stunfisk

bb skarm

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Overview
########

Stunfisk carves itself a notable niche in the PU metagame as one of the best status spreaders for balanced teams in the tier. With its reasonably good bulk, Stunfisk is able to paralyze opponents with its ability or Discharge, or poison them with Toxic. Stunfisk also has access to Stealth Rock, which provides good team support. Stunfisk makes for a good counter to common Electric-types in the tier because of its unique Ground / Electric typing, as well as a good check to physical attackers that may be reluctant to attack due to Static. However, Stunfisk's weaknesses to the ever-so common Water-, Ice-, and Grass-type attacks make it difficult to stay in for very long. Stunfisk also has a very, very low Speed stat, leaving it outsped by the entire tier bar Avalugg. Stunfisk also has no reliable recovery outside of the somewhat unreliable Rest. Lastly, like all walls, Stunfisk is very susceptible to Toxic and burns, which requires it to have cleric support.

Support
########
name: Support
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Discharge
move 3: Earth Power
move 4: Toxic
ability: Static
item: Leftovers
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
nature: Bold

Moves
========

Stealth Rock provides the utility of wearing down each foe that switches in. Discharge is a STAB move that has a high chance to paralyze, allowing Stunfisk to cripple opposing Pokemon and sweepers. Earth Power is a good STAB move that provides coverage on opposing Electric-types, such as opposing Stunfisk. Toxic is a good move to cripple opposing walls that are not hit hard by Stunfisk's other attacks, and it has good synergy with Earth Power, as Earth Power threatens Poison- and Steel-type Pokemon that attempt to switch into Toxic. Yawn is another option if Stunfisk wants to force switches or immobilize the opponent. Rest is also an option, as it recovers all of Stunfisk's health; however, while Stunfisk is bulky, it is very risky to keep it in while it is unable to do anything.

Set Details
========

252 HP EVs add to Stunfisk's overall bulk, allowing it to sustain more hits and spread more status. 252 Defense EVs with a Bold nature maximize Stunfisk's Defense stat, allowing it to take any physical hit well and possibly paralyze the opponent with Static. However, a specially defensive spread can be used to take hits from special attackers. The aforementioned Static is the ability, as it has a high chance to paralyze the opponent if hit on contact. Leftovers are used for passive recovery, as Stunfisk has no other method to restore HP except the unreliable Rest.

Usage Tips
========

Stunfisk should stick around throughout the match and spread status with Discharge and Toxic to cripple most of the opposing team. Stealth Rock is best used after Stunfisk has already induced status or if it forces a switch due to type advantage. With its good Defense and Static, Stunfisk does a great job of keeping physical attackers, such as Dodrio, Purugly, and Scyther, in check. This means that Stunfisk can pivot into physical attacks to try to activate Static. U-turn, in particular, is a great attack to pivot into, as users of the move are normally reliant on being quick. That being said, Stunfisk should not pivot recklessly into attacks that are powerful, as they can easily wear it down.

Team Options
========

Stunfisk's paralysis support is greatly appreciated on balanced teams by Pokemon that are relatively slow albeit powerful, such as Bouffalant and Flareon. These two Pokemon also can cover Grass-types for Stunfisk. Garbodor, Roselia, and other hazard setters can set their hazards in combination with Stunfisk's Stealth Rock to apply extreme pressure to the opponent. Grass-types such as Roselia and Serperior can keep Water- and Ground-type Pokemon at bay, making them good partners. Clerics such as Lickilicky and Togetic are vital partners for sets using Rest, as Stunfisk usually is unable to risk three turns sleeping. In general, clerics are good partners, as they rid Stunfisk of poison and burns and can provide Wish support for sets not using Rest. Spinblockers such as Haunter can also keep Stealth Rock on the field, as well as other hazards. If Defog is a threat, Purugly is a good partner, as the Evasion drop from Defog activates Defiant and boosts Purugly's Attack by two stages. Swanna and Scyther also have great synergy with Stunfisk, while Stunfisk can block Volt Switch for them, which they both despise.

Other Options
========

Choice Specs is a viable option on Stunfisk, as it finds a lot of opportunities to switch in and can do surprisingly good damage. Sleep Talk is an option to use Rest more effectively, but Stunfisk doesn't have enough space to fit it in. Foul Play seems like a good option to hit physical setup sweepers, but it is rather weak without a STAB boost, and Stunfisk would much rather use a status-inducing move. Scald has a chance to burn but is usually inferior to Discharge, as it has worse coverage, doesn't get a STAB boost, and doesn't always cause a burn, whereas Discharge is also backed up by Static. Protect can be used to rack up Toxic damage and Leftovers recovery, but Stunfisk will rarely have a slot for it. Sludge Wave can hit Grass- and Fairy-types, but it is rather weak. Thunderbolt is better on stall teams which would rather have Stunfisk poison opponents with Toxic, as well as having a higher damage output.

Checks & Counters
########

**Grass-types**: Grass-types aren't threatened by any of Stunfisk's attacks and can OHKO it or set up on it. Roselia in particular is a threat, as it has the bulk to take Earth Power, has Natural Cure to deal with status, and resists Stunfisk's coverage moves, while it sets up Spikes or OHKOes.

**Ground-types**: Faster Ground-types, such as Marowak, usually will outspeed Stunfisk and hit it hard with a STAB move, although Stunfisk carrying Scald can take a hit and potentially burn. Pokemon that carry Earthquake as a coverage move also threaten Stunfisk.

**Water-types**: Water-types, such as Simipour and Frogadier, can hit Stunfisk hard with their STAB moves but must be wary of Stunfisk using Discharge, which will either OHKO or possibly paralyze in return.

**Status**: Poison and burn instantly puts a timer on Stunfisk's longevity and negates its Leftovers recovery, wearing it down quickly. Toxic in particular stacks up, making it even harder for Stunfisk to stay on the field. Stunfisk that carry Rest are less threatened by status, especially with cleric support.

**Taunt**: Taunt stops Stunfisk from using its utility moves, which really cripples it role as a status spreader. Stunfisk is also rather weak, which means any offensive move it is forced to use will not be doing too much damage.

**Clerics**: Clerics, such as Lickilicky and Togetic, can eliminate the status Stunfisk spreads, and they can easily wall it and wear it down. Most clerics also have reliable recovery, so they cannot be worn down by repeated attacks from Stunfisk.

**Entry hazards**: Entry hazards, namely stacked Spikes, will wear down Stunfisk each time it switches in. Two layers of Toxic Spikes will badly poison Stunfisk, which makes it very hard for it to properly function as a wall.

**Offensive Pressure**: Despite heavy defensive investment, Stunfisk struggles against offensive pressure, especially special attackers, as most invested attackers can still hit it hard and make it easier to wear down. Stunfisk only has Leftovers and Rest as recovery options, so it cannot stick around indefinitely.
 
Last edited:

Punchshroom

Paralysis is slightly less of a devil
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Grass-types should be in C&C, especially Roselia who doesn't give an absolute damn about what Stunfisk can do.

I am inclined to mention Earthquake over Earth Power on the main set, since most of Earth Power's targets are usually hit harder by either Earthquake, Discharge, or Scald, so Earth Power seems overshadowed.
 
Toxic is incredibly counterproductive with discharge and Static, and not a very good option in general :/
Something like Protect/Scald/FOUL PLAY should be used over it lol
 

bb skarm

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Grass-types should be in C&C, especially Roselia who doesn't give an absolute damn about what Stunfisk can do.

I am inclined to mention Earthquake over Earth Power on the main set, since most of Earth Power's targets are usually hit harder by either Earthquake, Discharge, or Scald, so Earth Power seems overshadowed.
Toxic is incredibly counterproductive with discharge and Static, and not a very good option in general :/
Something like Protect/Scald/FOUL PLAY should be used over it lol
Done :)

This is ready for QC.
 

Ares

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[Overview]
base stats do not have to be mentioned as the will be shown above upon upload
mention no reliable recovery
I would play up its status spreading a little bit, especially paralysis. Stunfisk is so good at spreading paralysis around on the enemy team
On the Shell Smash point, Stunfisk is actually a decent check, they would not want to setup Shell Smash on the fisk as they will risk getting hit by a super effective move and possibly paralyzed

[Set]
I think the order of your moves should be switched around rocks/discharge/epower/then scald
I almost feel like Rest is worth a main slash on the 4th move slot over scald or foul play as it helps mitigate Stunfisk's lack of recovery

[Set Details]
I've tried a mix spread before that does put in a lot of work (I didnt actually EV it for anything but it does work really well) I would probably give a mention of it in Set Details

[Team Options]
mention spin blockers to keep rocks and other hazards on the field

[C&C]
Water types should also get a mention


Not QC just some thoughts
 

bb skarm

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[Overview]
base stats do not have to be mentioned as the will be shown above upon upload
mention no reliable recovery
I would play up its status spreading a little bit, especially paralysis. Stunfisk is so good at spreading paralysis around on the enemy team
On the Shell Smash point, Stunfisk is actually a decent check, they would not want to setup Shell Smash on the fisk as they will risk getting hit by a super effective move and possibly paralyzed

[Set]
I think the order of your moves should be switched around rocks/discharge/epower/then scald
I almost feel like Rest is worth a main slash on the 4th move slot over scald or foul play as it helps mitigate Stunfisk's lack of recovery

[Set Details]
I've tried a mix spread before that does put in a lot of work (I didnt actually EV it for anything but it does work really well) I would probably give a mention of it in Set Details

[Team Options]
mention spin blockers to keep rocks and other hazards on the field

[C&C]
Water types should also get a mention


Not QC just some thoughts
All of this is done! (although I kept the base stats point)

This is ready for QC input.
 
small nitpick, but I don't think you need to mention the defenses at the overview, as they will be listed at top of the smogon dex.
 

bb skarm

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small nitpick, but I don't think you need to mention the defenses at the overview, as they will be listed at top of the smogon dex.
I'm going to keep that point so I can mention why it's good. Also, montsegur also mentioned this.

Anyways, I polished OO up a bit, and I think this is ready for QC so I can write it up :)
 
Last edited:

WhiteDMist

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Just say good defenses. You can keep the stats in the skeleton phase, but remove it before you write it up. There is literally no reason to list the stats when the stats are right above.
 

bb skarm

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Just say good defenses. You can keep the stats in the skeleton phase, but remove it before you write it up. There is literally no reason to list the stats when the stats are right above.
Alright, I'll be sure to remove that when writing this up. Otherwise, I think is ready for QC (I looked through and there wasn't anything I could find so yeah).
 

bb skarm

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Also, I meant the number of Defense ( 109 / 84 /99 ) as they will be listed on top.
Just saying if you misunderstood.
Yeah, I understand.

Also, to QC, is Rest worth slashing before Foul Play? It does provide good recovery, and I've never had an instance where Foul Play was better than spreading status or getting recovery.
 

scorpdestroyer

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remove either Earthquake or Earth Power, preferably keep the latter. Neither of them have very strong merits over another.

The fourth slot seems a little iffy in my opinion. Scald isn't that good because it's weak and Stunfisk doesn't need coverage; all it does is have a low chance to burn. When you mention Rest make sure you state that cleric support is needed or Stunfisk becomes shit while sleeping.

I actually think Toxic is a better option in that fourth slot than any of the other options, but let me discuss with QC on that first before you change it.
 

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remove either Earthquake or Earth Power, preferably keep the latter. Neither of them have very strong merits over another.

The fourth slot seems a little iffy in my opinion. Scald isn't that good because it's weak and Stunfisk doesn't need coverage; all it does is have a low chance to burn. When you mention Rest make sure you state that cleric support is needed or Stunfisk becomes shit while sleeping.

I actually think Toxic is a better option in that fourth slot than any of the other options, but let me discuss with QC on that first before you change it.
I did everything bar the last slot, because you said you need to discuss with QC on it.

Otherwise, this is ready for input :>
 

scorpdestroyer

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Alright since none of the QC replied to my PM I'll just put it out in public :>

I'm still iffy on the fourth slot. Firstly I feel that Toxic isn't a bad option at all because it allows Stunfisk to cripple bulky stuff. Clashing with Static / Discharge isn't a problem, in fact, both of them together allows Stunfisk to effectively cripple either offensive or defensive threats if it chooses to. Secondly Scald is pretty bad because it's essentially a 30% accurate burn move because it isn't going to damage many things, plus offensive threats can be paralyzed or Toxiced anyway. I don't see the point of Foul Play either -- what setup sweepers does it damage? Stunfisk shouldn't be staying in on stuff like SD Sneasel or Carracosta, and either way Yawn is probably better to force them out (Foul Play only does 50-60% to +2 Costa and +2 LO Sneasel). Finally, Rest is ok but it should only be used with a cleric so I'm thinking of shifting it to Moves.

Basically this is what I'm thinking:

Support
########
name: Support
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Discharge
move 3: Earth Power
move 4: Toxic
ability: Static
item: Leftovers
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
nature: Bold

Yawn, Rest, Protect(?) in moves, and maybe Thunderbolt.

opinions?
 

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I personally think that Rest should be slashed because I like the recovery (stunfisk is pretty bulky), but w/e.

Tagging WhiteDMist to hear his thoughts on scorp's set.
 

WhiteDMist

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Personally, I think that while Stunfisk is bulky, it's not so bulky that it can afford to give its opponent 3 free turns. Even with cleric support, that's still 3 free turns (maybe not consecutively, but still) so it's definitely not worth a slash. I think that scorp's set makes the most of Stunfisk's qualities, offensive utility. Yawn looks to be worth mentioning in Moves alongside Rest, but that's about it. Protect may scout and rack up Leftover and Toxic, but I'm not sure how valuable that truly is. If Thunderbolt KOs stuff that Discharge does not, then it may deserve a mention in Moves as well, otherwise it's an OO option as well.
 

scorpdestroyer

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Overview:
- remove mentions of Scald
- note that it's also a great counter to most Electric-types
- remove the mention about the Special Attack, it's not very relevant to Stunfisk because it's not powerful without investment
- don't need to mention Shell Smash users in particular when talking about common weaknesses. Instead mention that there are plenty of Water-, Ice-, and Ground-type moves flying around PU
- you can put that Stunfisk gets worn down easily as a separate point, because it has no recovery

Moves:
- Move Yawn from OO to here
- Move Foul Play, Scald, and Protect to OO
- mention that if you use Rest, a cleric is super important because sleeping Stunfisk sucks

Usage Tips:
- Remove Scald from the spreading status part
- Talk about how you shouldn't switch into stuff too recklessly midgame or it could get worn down

Team Options:
- Remove the point about burns and paralyses giving teammates a chance to set up: paralyzing opponents has nothing to do with that
- when talking about clerics, don't just talk about waking it up. Add that they some of them pass wishes and they can also cure Stunfisk of poison. Add examples, such as Flareon, Lickilicky, and Heal Bell Musharna

OO:
- Move Yawn to Moves and add Foul Play, Scald, Protect
- Add Thunderbolt for stall teams that prefer not to use Discharge

Checks and Counters:
- add clerics here, they wall Stunfisk and slowly wear it down while curing themselves of Toxic (Lickilicky, Musharna, Togetic)
 

scorpdestroyer

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Moves: Mention that cleric support is vital when using Rest

In Usage Tips you word the part about pivoting into powerful hits as if Stunfisk shouldn't be pivoting at all. Word it in a way that says that it shouldn't do it recklessly or unnecessarily

Other Options: you need to talk about the flaws of the options a bit more:
- when talking about Foul Play, state that it isn't a terrific option because it isn't very powerful and Stunfisk can just inflict status on the setup sweepers
- Scald: not a very good option because it won't do much damage and won't burn that often

In addition, Thunderbolt isn't just for the extra power. It's also a better option if you prefer to poison opponents and not to paralyze.

In Checks and Counters, mention that clerics wall Stunfisk and wear it down. Just saying that they eliminate status alone doesn't show that they beat Stunfisk.

Mysteria
 

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