UU Suicune [QC: 3/3] [GP: 2/2]

Aqua∞Ring

Lazybones
:ss/Suicune:

[OVERVIEW]

Despite its average movepool, Suicune is a decent setup sweeper due to its astounding bulk and valuable defensive typing that allow it to check distinguished threats such as Scizor and Rhyperior. With Pressure, Calm Mind, and its superb bulk, Suicune is able to stall out threatening walls such as Aegislash and Chansey. However, Suicune is held back by the prevalence of Water-resistant Pokemon in the tier such as Keldeo, Mantine, and especially Zarude; Keldeo can simply ignore Suicune's Special Defense boosts with Secret Sword, Suicune struggles to make headway against Gastrodon and Mantine, and Zarude especially can use Jungle Healing to cure itself of burns and Power Whip to deal significant damage. In addition, Suicune lacks reliable recovery, forcing it to rely on Leftovers and Rest in order to regain HP. This makes Suicune susceptible to Knock Off, as losing Leftovers would require Suicune to use Rest more often. In addition, its overreliance on Sleep Talk isn't great either, as you rely on RNG to choose the ideal move. Furthermore, Suicune's weakness to Grass- and Electric-type moves is easily exploitable by the common Power Whip Tangrowth, Zarude, Thundurus, and Thundurus-T.

[SET]
name: CroCune
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

Calm Mind allows Suicune to become a threatening bulky sweeper. Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, which it can use to spread burns and sweep. Rest allows Suicune to easily recover HP while also curing any status conditions. Sleep Talk prevents Suicune from being too passive during sleep turns either by letting it continue to boost its special stats or attack foes. Suicune's Speed investment allows it to outspeed Adamant Scizor and potentially burn it before Scizor can switch out via U-turn.

As Suicune is a sweeper, it fits best on balance teams. Pokemon such as Scizor and Salamence are essential teammates for Suicune, as they threaten Grass-types like Zarude that pose a tremendous threat to Suicune. Salamence can also provide Defog support for Suicune and its teammates, which they appreciate. Suicune also appreciates Electric-immune teammates such as Nidoqueen and Rhyperior, with the former having the ability to set up Toxic Spikes to help Suicune stall opposing Pokemon like Seismitoad, and the latter providing counterplay to foes such as Nasty Plot Togekiss as well as Stealth Rock support. However, Nidoqueen cannot switch into Thundurus and Thundurus-T after a Nasty Plot boost. Suicune also appreciates teammates like Assault Vest Tangrowth and Amoonguss, which can help check threats like Keldeo; Tangrowth can also help check Thundurus and Thundurus-T, while Amoonguss can provide sleep support with Spore. Pokemon that can sponge Knock Off such as Buzzwole and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude are also treasured on Suicune's team, as Suicune despises losing its Leftovers. Zarude is especially appreciated, as it can also threaten KOs on Water-resistant foes such as Gastrodon, Milotic, and Seismitoad, which would otherwise completely wall Suicune.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Substitute + Calm Mind is another option, as it allows Suicune to PP stall would-be checks such as Quagsire; Ice Beam can also be used over Protect to prevent it from getting walled by Grass-types. However, it makes Suicune extremely vulnerable to passive damage and status and thus less reliable than CroCune. In addition, it is unable to sponge hits from foes like Rhyperior and Mamoswine, effectively taking up the teamslot of a Water-type without offering very much defensive utility. Toxic can be used to subdue Water-immune Pokemon such as Gastrodon, Mantine, and Seismitoad. However, Suicune often doesn't have room to run Toxic due to it suffering from four-moveslot syndrome. If you were to run Toxic, it would likely replace Sleep Talk on CroCune. A set with Calm Mind / Roar / Scald / Rest allows Suicune to be used as a dedicated phazer and stop foes like Calm Mind + Psyshock Galarian Slowbro and Nasty Plot + Psyshock Mew from setting up; however, this would waste Suicune's sweeping capabilities and requires entry hazard support to be effective.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-types**: Pokemon such as Raikou and Thundurus-T can easily severely damage Suicune with Thunderbolt, even after a Calm Mind boost.

**Grass-types**: Grass-types such as Tapu Bulu and Zarude pose an immense threat to Suicune with Horn Leech and Power Whip due to Suicune's lackluster Defense and poor Speed. Heavy-Duty Boots variants of Zarude, in particular, completely counter Suicune, as they can switch into Scald without fear due to Jungle Healing.

**Water-immune Pokemon**: As Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, it can't damage Water-immune foes such as Mantine and Gastrodon; Suicune struggles with Gastrodon especially, as it can force Suicune to use Rest more often due to Toxic. Despite this, Suicune can still annoy both through Pressure stalling.

**Knock Off and Trick Users**: Knock Off removes Leftovers, preventing Suicune from regaining passive recovery over the course of a battle and forcing it to use Rest more often. Trick users such as Jirachi and Rotom-W can force Suicune into being Choice-locked.

**Haze Users**: Moves such as Clear Smog and Haze make it difficult for Suicune to set up for a late-game sweep, as they reset all of Suicune's stat boosts. Notable examples of foes that are able to do this are Gastrodon and Mantine.

[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Aqua∞Ring, 531302]]
- Quality checked by: [[Twilight, 344575], [Lilburr, 481709], [Estarossa, 461329]]
- Grammar checked by: [[Milak, 262594], [DC, 449990]]
 
Last edited:

Twilight

is a Site Content Manageris an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Live Chat Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
Moderator
:ss/Suicune:


[OVERVIEW]

-> Suicune is an exceptional setup sweeper due to its astounding bulk, decent movepool, and valuable defensive typing that allows it to check distinguished threats such as Scizor and Rhyperior.
-> By virtue of its ability, Pressure, access to Calm Mind, and its superb bulk, Suicune is able to stall out threatening walls such as Aegislash, Celesteela, and Chansey.
-> However, Suicune is held back by the prevalence of Water resistant Pokemon in the tier such as Rotom-W, Tangrowth, and Tapu Bulu. Washtom doesn't exactly do anything against Suicune. I'd use Keldeo instead because Secret Sword will ignore the CM boosts. Would be good to include water immune mons like Gastrodon and Mantine that can just sit on it. Both also have the option to carry Clear Smog and Haze respectively.
-> In addition, Suicune lacks dependable recovery forcing it to rely on Leftovers and Rest in order to regain HP. Mention how this leaves it vulnerable to Knock Off because losing its Lefties results in it having to click Rest more often
-> Furthermore, Suicune's weakness to Grass- and Electric-Ttype moves are easily exploitable with Tangrowth, Azelf, and Amoonguss being commonplace. Amoonguss does not beat Suicune though. One Calm Mind is enough for you to just PP stall it out of Giga Drains. If you are going to mention Tangrowth then you should specify Power Whip because the same thing happens otherwise. Not a big fan of the Azelf example, just use Thundurus/Thundurus-T as both can still 2HKO a +1 Suicune with tbolt

[SET]
name: CroCune
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Bold
evs: 240 HP / 172 Def / 96 Spe 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

-> Calm Mind allows Suicune to become a threatening bulky sweeper by boosting its Special Attack and Special Defence.
-> Scald is Suicune's only offensive move which it can use to spread burns and sweep.
-> Rest allows Suicune to easily recover HP while also curing any status condition.
-> Sleep Talk prevents Suicune from being too passive during the turns that it's sleeping by either letting it continue to boost its special stats or attack foes.
-> Pressure allows Suicune to outstall some walls such as Celesteela. Don't think this is necessary
-> The HP investment allows Suicune to maximize its Leftovers recovery while minimizing Stealth Rock damage.

-> Suicune's Speed investment allows it to outspeed Adamant Scizor and burn it before Scizor can switch out via U-Turn U-turn.

-> Suicune's teammates are often bulkier Pokemon that appreciate its ability to easily switch in on a number of threats, such as Defensive Celesteela. I wouldn't exactly call defensive steela a threat
-> On account of Suicune's threatening nature, hazard setters such as Nihilego, Mew, and Klefki are able to capitalize on the frequent switches it forces.
Suicune isn't that threatening and hazards really aren't that mandatory to support it. The only example I really like here is that Nihilego can set Tspikes but that isn't worth its own point. You can just slide a mention of Tspikes in with the Nidoqueen example further down.
-> Suicune especially enjoys being paired up with Nihilego, as it can set Toxic Spikes as well as Stealth Rock for Suicune to further pressure opponents.
-> However, Klefki and Mew are able to role compress Defog as well as Hazard setting. You are not running both Defog and a hazard on these mons
-> Steel-Types such as the aformentioned Klefki as well as Scizor have good synergy with Suicune, as they are easily able to tank Grass moves from Tangrowth.
You're focusing on the wrong Grass-types. Read my comments below for more insight on this
-> The presence of clerics such as Sylveon and Umbreon are appreciated by Suicune, as they allow Suicune to remove its status condition easily instead of using Sleep Talk PP. Well, you can save Sleep Talk PP while asleep by just clicking another move till the 3 turns are up.
-> In return, Suicune can threaten Fire-Types such as Incineroar that they would otherwise be helpless against.
They aren't helpless vs Incineroar though. Incin doesn't want to take Hyper Voice and Umbreon can just put it on a timer.
-> Due to Suicune's Electric-Ttype weakness, immunities such as Nidoqueen are excellent teammates for it.

You need to rework the team options. You keep listing these bulky Grass-types that it doesn't care about after a CM boost.
  • You should 100% start this section off by talking about Zarude and Tapu Bulu, particularly the former because it literally invalidates the progress of this set due to Jungle Healing.
  • The Electric-types point should be bigger because we have a lot of powerful ones in this tier that can muscle past Suicune. Give more examples of checks to them than just Nidoqueen. Rhyperior would be a good option here and you could further expand on how it deals with NP Togekiss.
  • Give some examples of Knock absorbers like Buzzwole
  • Keldeo is rather obnoxious especially if it is CM so give some checks that check/remove it
  • List some breakers that deal with the Water resistant Pokemon you listed in the OP or tie this in with some examples you bring up for these other points.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Vincune is another option, as it turns Suicune into a potent wincon against Stall. However, it is extremely vulnerable to passive damage and status making it less reliable then CroCune. People probably won't know what Vincune is if it doesn't have a proper description so just say Substitute + Calm Mind. This set is also more about winning through PP stalling would be checks like Seismitoad so specify this more than it being a wincon vs stall. Toxic can used to subdue Pokemon that are otherwise immune to Water-Ttype moves such as Gastrodon, Mantine, and Seismitoad. However, Suicune often doesn't have room to run Toxic due its four-moveslot syndrome. A set with Roar empowers Suicune to be used as a dedicated phazer, however this would be wasting Suicune's sweeping capabilities. It also requires hazard support to really be effective

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-Types**: Pokemon such as Raikou and Thundurus-T can easily click Thunderbolt and severely damage Suicune even after a Calm Mind boost.

**Grass-Types**: Grass-Types such as Amoonguss and Tangrowth can pose an immense threat to Suicune with Giga Drain. As mentioned before, they really don't. Tangrowth can be threatening if it's Power Whip but has to be wary of a burn. Focus on Bulu because it's faster and how Zarude walls if the boots set.

**Water-immune Pokemon**: As Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, Water-immune foes such as Mantine and Volcanion are unable to be damaged. Despite this, Suicune can still annoy both through Pressure stalling. Volcanion isn't the best example because it literally will never win this matchup. Use Gastro or Seis because they at least force it to Rest more easily due to Toxic.

**Haze users and phazing**: Moves such as Haze and Whirlwind make it difficult for Suicune to set up for a late-game sweep, as they reset all of Suicune's stat boosts. Can you give examples of users of these moves

**Knock Off/ and Trick users**: Knock Off removes Leftovers, preventing Crocune Suicune from regaining passive recovery over the course of a battle and forcing it to use Rest more often. Trick forces Suicune to Choice-lock into Scald, a move only effectively spammed after Suicune has used Calm Mind.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Aqua∞Ring, 531302]]
- Quality checked by: [[username1, userid1], [username2, userid2], [username3, userid3]]
- Grammar checked by: [[username1, userid1], [username2, userid2]]

I need to give this another look over before giving 1/3

add remove comments
 

Aqua∞Ring

Lazybones
Implemented QC Check.
Pinging Twilight to give this another look over.
(Btw I already added your name to the credits despite you not giving it an official check since I assume you will be eventually, hope thats okay)
 

Twilight

is a Site Content Manageris an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Live Chat Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
Moderator
:ss/Suicune:


-> Suicune is an exceptional setup sweeper due to its astounding bulk, decent movepool, and valuable defensive typing that allows it to check distinguished threats such as Scizor and Rhyperior.
-> By virtue of its ability Pressure, access to Calm Mind, and its superb bulk, Suicune is able to stall out threatening walls such as Aegislash, Celesteela, and Chansey.
-> However, Suicune is held back by the prevalence of Water resistant Pokemon in the tier such as Keldeo, Gastrodon, and Mantine.
-> As a result of Secret Sword, Keldeo can simply ignore Suicune's Special Defence boosts while Gastrodon and Mantine are immune to Scald and phase Suicune using Clear Smog and Haze, respectivly.
-> In addition, Suicune lacks dependable recovery forcing it to rely on Leftovers and Rest in order to regain HP.
-> This makes Suicune susceptible to Knock Off, as losing Leftovers would require Suicune to use Rest more often.
-> Furthermore, Suicune's weakness to Grass- and Electric-type moves are easily exploitable with Thundurus, Thundurus-T and Tapu Bulu being commonplace.
-> Be that as it may, Tapu Bulu cannot recklessly switchin to Suicune as it would risk a Scald burn.

[SET]
name: CroCune
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

-> Calm Mind allows Suicune to become a threatening bulky sweeper by boosting its Special Attack and Special Defence.
-> Scald is Suicune's only offensive move which it can use to spread burns and sweep.
-> Rest allows Suicune to easily recover HP while also curing any status condition.
-> Sleep Talk prevents Suicune from being too passive during the turns that it's sleeping by either letting it continue to boost its special stats or attack foes.
-> Suicune's Speed investment allows it to outspeed Adamant Scizor and burn it before Scizor can switch out via U-turn.

Add a small line saying it fits best on balance builds
-> Pokemon that threaten Grass-Ttypes such as Scizor and Sylveon are essential teammates for Suicune, as they threaten Grass-Ttypes like simillar to Tapu Bulu and Zarude. Sylveon isn't really a partner that wants to pivot into either of these two. Just use Salamence here and expand on it giving Defog support.
-> Zarude especially poses a threat to Suicune, as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns that may be inflicted via Scald.
-> Suicune also appreciates teammates that are immune to Electric moves such as Nidoqueen and Rhyperior, with the former having the ability to set up Toxic Spikes that helps Suicune stall opposing Pokemon like Seismitoad setup sweepers while the latter provides counterplay to foes such as Nasty Plot Togekiss, as well as Stealth Rock.
-> Suicune also appreciates having teammates like Assault Vest Reuniclus that are able to deal with opposing setup sweepers such as Calm Mind Keldeo by threatening switchins with Future Sight and dealing massive damage post-setup with Psyshock. I'd rather see a mention of Amoong and AV Tang here than AV Reuni. These two can also check Electric-types like Thundurus.
-> Pokemon that can sponge Knock Off such as Buzzwole and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude are also treasured on Suicune's team, as Suicune despises losing its Leftovers.
-> Zarude is especially appriciated appreciated, as it can also threaten KO's on Water resistant foes such as Gastrodon, Milotic, and Seismitoad that would otherwise completely wall Suicune.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Subsitute + Calm Mind is another option, as it turns Suicune into a potent wincon against Stall, as it can PP stall would-be checks such as Seismitoad. However, it is extremely vulnerable to passive damage and status making it less reliable then CroCune. Toxic can used to subdue Pokemon that are otherwise immune to Water-type moves such as Gastrodon, Mantine, and Seismitoad. However, Suicune often doesn't have room to run Toxic due its four-moveslot syndrome. A set with Roar empowers Suicune to be used as a dedicated phazer, however this would be wasting Suicune's sweeping capabilities. However, this set and requires hazard support to be effective.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-Types**: Pokemon such as Raikou and Thundurus-T can easily click Thunderbolt and severely damage Suicune even after a Calm Mind boost.

**Grass-Types**: Grass-Types such as Tapu Bulu and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude can pose an immense threat to Suicune with Horn Leech and Giga Drain due to Suicune's minimal defence investment and poor speed.

**Water-immune Pokemon**: As Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, Water-immune foes such as Mantine and Gastrodon are unable to be damaged. Gastrodon especially, as it can force Milotic to use Rest more often due to Toxic. Despite this, Suicune can still annoy both through Pressure stalling.

**Haze users and phazing**: Moves such as Haze and Whirlwind make it difficult for Suicune to set up for a late-game sweep, as they reset all of Suicune's stat boosts. Notable examples of foes that are able to do this are the aforementioned Gastrodon and Mantine.

**Knock Off and Trick users**: Knock Off removes Leftovers, preventing Suicune from regaining passive recovery over the course of a battle and forcing it to use Rest more often. Trick forces Suicune to Choice-lock into Scald, a move only effectively spammed after Suicune has used Calm Mind.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Aqua∞Ring, 531302]]
- Quality checked by: [[Twilight, 344575], [username2, userid2], [username3, userid3]]
- Grammar checked by: [[username1, userid1], [username2, userid2]]

1/3

Same colour coding as before
 

Lilburr

i know it's not alright
is a Tutoris a Social Media Contributoris a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributor
UU Leader
:ss/Suicune:

[OVERVIEW]

-> Suicune is an exceptional setup sweeper due to its astounding bulk, decent movepool, and valuable defensive typing that allows it to check distinguished threats such as Scizor and Rhyperior. you are giving it way too much credit here, it kind of sucks overall. it's not exceptional, it's just decent.
-> By virtue of its ability Pressure, access to Calm Mind, and its superb bulk, Suicune is able to stall out threatening walls such as Aegislash, Celesteela, and Chansey.
-> However, Suicune is held back by the prevalence of Water resistant Pokemon in the tier such as Keldeo, Gastrodon, and Mantine.
-> As a result of Secret Sword, Keldeo can simply ignore Suicune's Special Defence boosts while Gastrodon and Mantine are immune to Scald and phase Suicune using Clear Smog and Haze, respectivly.
-> In addition, Suicune lacks dependable recovery forcing it to rely on Leftovers and Rest in order to regain HP.
-> This makes Suicune susceptible to Knock Off, as losing Leftovers would require Suicune to use Rest more often.
-> Furthermore, Suicune's weakness to Grass- and Electric-type moves are easily exploitable with Thundurus, Thundurus-T and Tapu Bulu being commonplace.
-> Be that as it may, Tapu Bulu cannot recklessly switchin to Suicune as it would risk a Scald burn.


bulu sucks, def remove the point on it. if anything you should mention how boots zarude completely invalidates suicune all game long because it doesn't care about scald burns and power whip does so much. that's a huge reason why suicune is not great at all. stuff like power whip tangrowth being common also sucks.

[SET]
name: CroCune
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

-> Calm Mind allows Suicune to become a threatening bulky sweeper by boosting its Special Attack and Special Defence.
-> Scald is Suicune's only offensive move which it can use to spread burns and sweep.
-> Rest allows Suicune to easily recover HP while also curing any status condition.
-> Sleep Talk prevents Suicune from being too passive during the turns that it's sleeping by either letting it continue to boost its special stats or attack foes.
-> Suicune's Speed investment allows it to outspeed Adamant Scizor and burn it before Scizor can switch out via U-turn.

-> As a result of Suicune's nature as a sweeper, it best fits on balance teams.
-> Pokemon that threaten Grass-types such as Scizor and Defensive Salamence are essential teammates for Suicune, as they threaten Grass-types like Tapu Bulu and Zarude.
-> Salamence can also provide Defog support for Suicune and its teammates, which they appriciate.
-> Zarude especially poses a threat to Suicune, as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns that may be inflicted via Scald. this and the prior point should be included in the 2nd point
-> Suicune also appreciates teammates that are immune to Electric moves such as Nidoqueen and Rhyperior, with the former having the ability to set up Toxic Spikes that helps Suicune stall opposing Pokemon like Seismitoad while the latter provides counterplay to foes such as Nasty Plot Togekiss, as well as Stealth Rock.
-> Suicune also appreciates having teammates like Amoonguss and Assault Vest Tangrowth that are able to deal with opposing setup sweepers such as Calm Mind Keldeo by threatening switchins with Spore and Sleep Powder, respectively.
-> They can also check Electric-type sweepers such as Thundurus. should be in the above point
-> Pokemon that can sponge Knock Off such as Buzzwole and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude are also treasured on Suicune's team, as Suicune despises losing its Leftovers.
-> Zarude is especially appreciated, as it can also threaten KO's on Water resistant foes such as Gastrodon, Milotic, and Seismitoad that would otherwise completely wall Suicune.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Subsitute + Calm Mind is another option, as it turns Suicune into a potent wincon against Stall, as it can PP stall would-be checks such as Seismitoad. seismitoad does not exist on stall However, it is extremely vulnerable to passive damage and status making it less reliable then CroCune. Toxic can used to subdue Pokemon that are otherwise immune to Water-type moves such as Gastrodon, Mantine, and Seismitoad. However, Suicune often doesn't have room to run Toxic due its four-moveslot syndrome. A set with Roar empowers empowers doesn't really make sense here just say "allows" or something Suicune to be used as a dedicated phazer, however this would be wasting Suicune's sweeping capabilities and requires hazard support to be effective.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-types**: Pokemon such as Raikou and Thundurus-T can easily click Thunderbolt and severely damage Suicune even after a Calm Mind boost.

**Grass-types**: Grass-types such as Tapu Bulu and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude can pose an immense threat to Suicune with Horn Leech and Giga Drain giga drain..? due to Suicune's minimal defence investment it runs nearly max defense and poor Speed.

**Water-immune Pokemon**: As Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, Water-immune foes such as Mantine and Gastrodon are unable to be damaged. Gastrodon especially, as it can force Milotic who? to use Rest more often due to Toxic. Despite this, Suicune can still annoy both through Pressure stalling.

**Haze users and phazing** nothing really runs phazing moves in this tier: Moves such as Haze and Whirlwind make it difficult for Suicune to set up for a late-game sweep, as they reset all of Suicune's stat boosts. Notable examples of foes that are able to do this are the aforementioned Gastrodon and Mantine. reword this to reflect that it's just haze

**Knock Off and Trick users**: Knock Off removes Leftovers, preventing Suicune from regaining passive recovery over the course of a battle and forcing it to use Rest more often. Trick forces Suicune to Choice-lock into Scald, a move only effectively spammed after Suicune has used Calm Mind. mention specific trick users since there aren't many, jirachi being the main one relevant to suicune


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Aqua∞Ring, 531302]]
- Quality checked by: [[Twilight, 344575], [username2, userid2], [username3, userid3]]
- Grammar checked by: [[username1, userid1], [username2, userid2]]
this has a lot of sloppy mistakes so i'd like you to ping me when you're done implementing so i can go over it again
 

Lilburr

i know it's not alright
is a Tutoris a Social Media Contributoris a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributor
UU Leader
:ss/Suicune:

[OVERVIEW]

-> Suicune is a decent setup sweeper due to its astounding bulk, average movepool, and valuable defensive typing that allows it to check distinguished threats such as Scizor and Rhyperior.
-> By virtue of its ability Pressure, access to Calm Mind, and its superb bulk, Suicune is able to stall out threatening walls such as Aegislash, Celesteela, and Chansey.
-> However, Suicune is held back by the prevalence of Water resistant Pokemon in the tier such as Keldeo, Gastrodon, and Mantine.
-> As a result of Secret Sword, Keldeo can simply ignore Suicune's Special Defence boosts while Gastrodon and Mantine are immune to Scald and phase Suicune using Clear Smog and Haze, respectivly.
-> In addition, Suicune lacks dependable recovery forcing it to rely on Leftovers and Rest in order to regain HP.
-> This makes Suicune susceptible to Knock Off, as losing Leftovers would require Suicune to use Rest more often. this should go in the above point
-> Furthermore, Suicune's weakness to Grass- and Electric-type moves are easily exploitable with Power Whip Tangrowth, Thundurus, Thundurus-T, and Zarude being commonplace.
-> Zarude especially, as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns and Power Whip can OHKO Suicune from full HP. nah it doesnt even come close to ohkoing but it does a lot

[SET]
name: CroCune
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

-> Calm Mind allows Suicune to become a threatening bulky sweeper by boosting its Special Attack and Special Defence.
-> Scald is Suicune's only offensive move which it can use to spread burns and sweep.
-> Rest allows Suicune to easily recover HP while also curing any status condition.
-> Sleep Talk prevents Suicune from being too passive during the turns that it's sleeping by either letting it continue to boost its special stats or attack foes.
-> Suicune's Speed investment allows it to outspeed Adamant Scizor and burn it before Scizor can switch out via U-turn.

-> As a result of Suicune's nature as a sweeper, it best fits on balance teams.
-> Pokemon such as Scizor and Defensive Salamence are essential teammates for Suicune, as they threaten Grass-types like Zarude which poses a tremendous threat to Suicune as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns that may be inflicted via Scald. Salamence can also provide Defog support for Suicune and its teammates, which they appreciate.
-> Suicune also appreciates teammates that are immune to Electric moves such as Nidoqueen and Rhyperior, with the former having the ability to set up Toxic Spikes that helps Suicune stall opposing Pokemon like Seismitoad while the latter provides counterplay to foes such as Nasty Plot Togekiss, as well as Stealth Rock.
-> Suicune also appreciates having teammates like Amoonguss and Assault Vest Tangrowth that are able to deal with opposing setup sweepers such as Calm Mind Keldeo by threatening switchins with Spore and Sleep Powder, respectively. They can also check Electric-type sweepers such as Thundurus.
-> Pokemon that can sponge Knock Off such as Buzzwole and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude are also treasured on Suicune's team, as Suicune despises losing its Leftovers.
-> Zarude is especially appreciated, as it can also threaten KO's on Water resistant foes such as Gastrodon, Milotic, and Seismitoad that would otherwise completely wall Suicune. should be in the above point

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Subsitute + Calm Mind is another option, as it turns Suicune into a potent wincon against Stall, as it can PP stall would-be checks such as Quagsire. However, it is extremely vulnerable to passive damage and status making it less reliable then CroCune. mention ice beam on this set to not get super duper owned by Toxic can used to subdue Pokemon that are otherwise immune to Water-type moves such as Gastrodon, Mantine, and Seismitoad. However, Suicune often doesn't have room to run Toxic due its four-moveslot syndrome. A set with Roar allows Suicune to be used as a dedicated phazer, however this would be wasting Suicune's sweeping capabilities and requires hazard support to be effective.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-types**: Pokemon such as Raikou and Thundurus-T can easily click Thunderbolt and severely damage Suicune even after a Calm Mind boost.

**Grass-types**: Grass-types such as Tapu Bulu and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude can pose an immense threat to Suicune with Horn Leech and Power Whip due to Suicune's lackluster Defence poor Speed.

**Water-immune Pokemon**: As Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, Water-immune foes such as Mantine and Gastrodon are unable to be damaged. Gastrodon especially, as it can force Suicune to use Rest more often due to Toxic. Despite this, Suicune can still annoy both through Pressure stalling.

**Haze users**: Moves such as Haze make it difficult for Suicune to set up for a late-game sweep, as they reset all of Suicune's stat boosts. Notable examples of foes that are able to do this are the aforementioned Gastrodon and Mantine.

**Knock Off and Trick users**: Knock Off removes Leftovers, preventing Suicune from regaining passive recovery over the course of a battle and forcing it to use Rest more often. If Suicune is tricked by a Pokemon such as Jirachi, Suicune will be at best Choice-lock into Scald, a move only effectively spammed after Suicune has used Calm Mind.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Aqua∞Ring, 531302]]
- Quality checked by: [[Twilight, 344575], [username2, userid2], [username3, userid3]] dont forget this
- Grammar checked by: [[username1, userid1], [username2, userid2]]
much better, qc 2/3
 

Estarossa

CHOMPY BIRD
is a Social Media Contributoris a Community Contributoris a Live Chat Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
:ss/Suicune:

[OVERVIEW]

Suicune is a decent setup sweeper due to its astounding bulk, average movepool, this reads REALLY weirdly when you essentially say "its a good sweeper due to its average movepool" , maybe say that its a decent sweeper despite its movepool or something? and valuable defensive typing that allows it to check distinguished threats such as Scizor and Rhyperior. By virtue of its ability Pressure, access to Calm Mind, and its superb bulk, Suicune is able to stall out threatening walls such as Aegislash, Celesteela, and Chansey. An important facet to it stalling out Aegislash and Chansey here is that its running rest Talk, so it absorbs their status nicely. I don't think celesteela is the best example, its not going to stay in on you anyway but what it does do is Leech seed u and make u much easier to deal with for whatever it brings in, which becomes pretty punishing for you. However, Suicune is held back by the prevalence of Water resistant Pokemon in the tier such as Keldeo, Gastrodon, and Mantine. Well yes but the biggest issue is Zarude realistically, you've basically called gastrodon and mantine prevalent here which is pretty untrue. This should be reordered to really express that the issue for Suicune in this tier is Zarude, as well as stuff like Keldeo etc. Atm you mention zarude at the very end but its probably the single hardest COMMON counter to Suicune in the tier. As a result of Secret Sword, Keldeo can simply ignore Suicune's Special Defence boosts while Gastrodon and Mantine are immune to Scald and phase Suicune using Clear Smog and Haze, respectivly. You can essentially make this point about gastro/mantine more that it can struggle to make headway vs the fatter teams you'd find this sorta stuff on. In addition, Suicune lacks dependable recovery forcing it to rely on Leftovers and Rest in order to regain HP. This makes Suicune susceptible to Knock Off, as losing Leftovers would require Suicune to use Rest more often. Overreliance on sleep talk isn't great either. Furthermore, Suicune's weakness to Grass- and Electric-type moves are easily exploitable with Power Whip Tangrowth, Thundurus, Thundurus-T, and Zarude being commonplace. Zarude especially, as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns and Power Whip can deal significant damage to Suicune.

[SET]
name: CroCune
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

Calm Mind allows Suicune to become a threatening bulky sweeper by boosting its Special Attack and Special Defence. Scald is Suicune's only offensive move which it can use to spread burns and sweep. Rest allows Suicune to easily recover HP while also curing any status condition. Sleep Talk prevents Suicune from being too passive during the turns that it's sleeping by either letting it continue to boost its special stats or attack foes. Suicune's Speed investment allows it to outspeed Adamant Scizor and burn it before Scizor can switch out via U-turn.

As a result of Suicune's nature as a sweeper, it best fits on balance teams. Pokemon such as Scizor and Defensive Salamence does it really need to be defensive specifically here? offensive can do everything you state afterwards too. are essential teammates for Suicune, as they threaten Grass-types like Zarude which poses a tremendous threat to Suicune as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns that may be inflicted via Scald. Salamence can also provide Defog support for Suicune and its teammates, which they appreciate. Suicune also appreciates teammates that are immune to Electric moves such as Nidoqueen and Rhyperior, with the former having the ability to set up Toxic Spikes that helps Suicune stall opposing Pokemon like Seismitoad while the latter provides counterplay to foes such as Nasty Plot Togekiss, as well as Stealth Rock. be careful how you word this cause it sounds like your setting both up from the same nidoqueen. This point is also interesting because if you run into an NP electric they are going to just beat these two Pokemon too (provided rhyp took some chip if its the thundies). Which makes the whole being Electric immune thing a bit dodgy on Nidoqueens part (its ok on Rhyps part cause it does check the unbooosted Thundies pretty well). Suicune also appreciates having teammates like Amoonguss and Assault Vest Tangrowth that are able to deal with opposing setup sweepers such as Calm Mind Keldeo by threatening switchins with Spore and Sleep Powder, respectively. I don't understand this sentence very much, yo usay they deal with sweepers like Keldeo by threatening their switch ins with Spore? They can also check Electric-type sweepers such as Thundurus. Pokemon that can sponge Knock Off such as Buzzwole and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude are also treasured on Suicune's team, as Suicune despises losing its Leftovers. Zarude is especially appreciated, as it can also threaten KO's on Water resistant foes such as Gastrodon, Milotic, and Seismitoad that would otherwise completely wall Suicune.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Subsitute + Calm Mind is another option, as it turns Suicune into a potent wincon against Stall, it really doesn't, chansey + av tang can just PP stall you themselves, since Scald has limited PP and is doing minimal damage to either of them. They don't even have to attack you and waste their PP, they can just switch between each other, with Chansey healing when necessary. This is obviously made even worse by the addition o Quaggers too. as it can PP stall would-be checks such as Quagsire. However, it is extremely vulnerable to passive damage and status making it less reliable then CroCune. Ok so the most important HUGE issues with Vincune come down to the fact that it a) offers no defensive utility as a water type since it can't switch into Pokemon like Rhyperior / Mamoswine etc as it can't afford to take chip and b) can't afford to take status etc. You cover the second one but the first is really important too. Ice Beam is also an alternative option on Substitute + Calm Mind sets, amake it very clear that its over Protect here, just for clarities sake as it prevents Suicune from getting walled by Grass-types. Toxic can used to subdue Pokemon that are otherwise immune to Water-type moves such as Gastrodon, Mantine, and Seismitoad. However, Suicune often doesn't have room to run Toxic due its four-moveslot syndrome. Where exactly would you be running Toxic on these sets? Would you be running it on SubCM or on Rest Talk? Which move would it be replacing? [This is an important question to answer because its really not clear to anyone reading it] A set with Roar allows Suicune to be used as a dedicated phazer, however this would be wasting Suicune's sweeping capabilities and requires hazard support to be effective. I assume you are referring to Calm Mind, Rest, Roar, Scald sets here, which should again be clarified. Another benefit you should state here is that it stops stuff like CM Psyshock Glowbro and NP Psyshock mew from trying to boost up and beat you as easily.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-types**: Pokemon such as Raikou and Thundurus-T can easily click Thunderbolt and severely damage Suicune even after a Calm Mind boost.

**Grass-types**: Grass-types such as Tapu Bulu and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude can pose an immense threat to Suicune with Horn Leech and Power Whip due to Suicune's lackluster Defence poor Speed. You should explicitly mention about Jungle Healing letting zarude hard switch in without fear of Burns here, and make the Zarude mention more general as scarf still forces you out.

**Water-immune Pokemon**: As Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, Water-immune foes such as Mantine and Gastrodon are unable to be damaged. Gastrodon especially, as it can force Suicune to use Rest more often due to Toxic. Despite this, Suicune can still annoy both through Pressure stalling.

**Haze users**: Moves such as Haze make it difficult for Suicune to set up for a late-game sweep, as they reset all of Suicune's stat boosts. Notable examples of foes that are able to do this are the aforementioned Gastrodon and Mantine. Gastrodon doesn't learn Haze, but Clear Smog.

**Knock Off and Trick users**: Knock Off removes Leftovers, preventing Suicune from regaining passive recovery over the course of a battle and forcing it to use Rest more often. If Suicune is tricked by a foe such as Jirachi, Suicune will be at best Choice-lock into Scald, a move only effectively spammed after Suicune has used Calm Mind. If you wanted to be more thorough here, you could also mention that while uncommon sets on them, Mew and Rotom-W also occasionally run Trick Scarf sets to cripple something, meaning you should be careful of them if they haven't revealed their items early game.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Aqua∞Ring, 531302]]
- Quality checked by: [[Twilight, 344575], [Lilburr, 481709], [username3, userid3]]
- Grammar checked by: [[username1, userid1], [username2, userid2]]
I would like another look at this, tag me on Discord when this has been implemented.
 

Estarossa

CHOMPY BIRD
is a Social Media Contributoris a Community Contributoris a Live Chat Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
:ss/Suicune:

[OVERVIEW]

Despite its average movepool, Suicune is a decent setup sweeper due to its astounding bulk and valuable defensive typing that allows it to check distinguished threats such as Scizor and Rhyperior. By virtue of its ability Pressure, access to Calm Mind, and its superb bulk, Suicune is able to stall out threatening walls such as Aegislash, and Chansey. However, Suicune is held back by the prevalence of Water resistant Pokemon in the tier such as Keldeo, Mantine, and especially Zarude. As a result of Secret Sword, Keldeo can simply ignore Suicune's Special Defence boosts while Suicune struggles to make headway against bulkier teams that feature Gastrodon and Mantine. In addition, Suicune lacks dependable recovery forcing it to rely on Leftovers and Rest in order to regain HP. This makes Suicune susceptible to Knock Off, as losing Leftovers would require Suicune to use Rest more often. In addition, overreliance on Sleep Talk isn't great either as its PP can easily be stalled out this isn't the issue with sleep talk, its that you become more reliant on RNG to hit the moves you actually want. Furthermore, Suicune's weakness to Grass- and Electric-type moves are easily exploitable with Power Whip Tangrowth, Thundurus, Thundurus-T, and Zarude being commonplace. Zarude especially, as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns and Power Whip can deal significant damage to Suicune.

[SET]
name: CroCune
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

Calm Mind allows Suicune to become a threatening bulky sweeper by boosting its Special Attack and Special Defence. Scald is Suicune's only offensive move which it can use to spread burns and sweep. Rest allows Suicune to easily recover HP while also curing any status condition. Sleep Talk prevents Suicune from being too passive during the turns that it's sleeping by either letting it continue to boost its special stats or attack foes. Suicune's Speed investment allows it to outspeed Adamant Scizor and burn it before Scizor can switch out via U-turn.

As a result of Suicune's nature as a sweeper, it best fits on balance teams. Pokemon such as Scizor and Salamence are essential teammates for Suicune, as they threaten Grass-types like Zarude which poses a tremendous threat to Suicune as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns that may be inflicted via Scald. Salamence can also provide Defog support for Suicune and its teammates, which they appreciate. Suicune also appreciates teammates that are immune to Electric moves such as Nidoqueen and Rhyperior, with the former having the ability to set up Toxic Spikes that helps Suicune stall opposing Pokemon like Seismitoad while the latter provides counterplay to foes such as Nasty Plot Togekiss, as well as Stealth Rock. However, Nidoqueen cannot switch into Thundrus and Thundrus-Therian after they have recieved a Nasty Plot boost. it just doens't want to switch into them at all NP boost or not, they tend to run psychic very commonly which is just awful for nidoqueen. Suicune also appreciates having teammates like Amoonguss and Assault Vest Tangrowth that are able to deal with opposing setup sweepers such as Calm Mind Keldeo by preventing it from entering the field with Spore and Sleep Powder, respectively. This still makes no sense, their sleep moves are a totally different matter entirely than checking Keldeo, which they do irregardless. Its also improtant to mention them as Keldeo checks in general, Specs is just as important as CM Keldeo here. Also AV tang cant use sleep powder because of its item. Just separate the point andmention amoongs spore separately or something. Assuming a different foe is already asleep, Amoonguss and Tangrowth can also enter the field and beat in 1 on 1. They can also check Electric-type sweepers such as Thundurus. Well Tang can, amoong doesn't. Just comment on wat each one provides here, eg. amoong provides sleep, tang provides thundy check. Pokemon that can sponge Knock Off such as Buzzwole and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude are also treasured on Suicune's team, as Suicune despises losing its Leftovers. Zarude is especially appreciated, as it can also threaten KO's on Water resistant foes such as Gastrodon, Milotic, and Seismitoad that would otherwise completely wall Suicune.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Subsitute + Calm Mind is another option, as it can PP stall would-be checks such as Quagsire. This just isn't the reason you run SubCM to beat Quagsire in particular which is rather niche mon and nowhere near the only issue on stall teams they are found on. Whats important is that it allows you to stall out PP of targets like Specs Keld and Scarf Zarude. However, it is extremely vulnerable to passive damage and status making it less reliable then CroCune. In addition, it is unable to sponge hits from foes like Rhyperior and Mamoswine, effectivly taking up the teamslot of a Water-type pokemon without offering very much defensive utility. Its not that it can't sponge its off of them, because it can do once or twice, but that due to the lack of reliable recovery it doesn't want to because it hinders its own effectiveness. Ice Beam is also an alternative option over Protect on Substitute + Calm Mind sets, as it prevents Suicune from getting walled by Grass-types. Toxic can used to subdue Pokemon that are otherwise immune to Water-type moves such as Gastrodon, Mantine, and Seismitoad. However, Suicune often doesn't have room to run Toxic due its four-moveslot syndrome. If you were to run Toxic, it would likely replace Sleep Talk on CroCune. A set with Calm Mind / Roar / Scald / Rest allows Suicune to be used as a dedicated phazer, however this would be wasting Suicune's sweeping capabilities and requires hazard support to be effective. Another benefit to Roar is s that it improves your matchup versus Psyshock users such as stops foes like Calm Mind Psyshock Glowbro and Nasty Plot + Psyshock Mew from trying to boost up and beat you as easily.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-types**: Pokemon such as Raikou and Thundurus-T can easily click Thunderbolt and severely damage Suicune even after a Calm Mind boost.

**Grass-types**: Grass-types such as Tapu Bulu and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude can pose an immense threat to Suicune with Horn Leech and Power Whip due to Suicune's lackluster Defence poor Speed. You didn't implement any of my comments on this section. Just state Zarude in general to begin with instead of explicitly boots, then comment on boots being able to hard counter you due to Jungle Healing removing Burns rom scald.

**Water-immune Pokemon**: As Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, Water-immune foes such as Mantine and Gastrodon are unable to be damaged. Gastrodon especially, as it can force Suicune to use Rest more often due to Toxic. Despite this, Suicune can still annoy both through Pressure stalling.

**Haze users**: Moves such as Clear Smog and Haze make it difficult for Suicune to set up for a late-game sweep, as they reset all of Suicune's stat boosts. Notable examples of foes that are able to do this are the aforementioned Gastrodon and Mantine. clear smog is pretty uncommon on Gastrodon however, which should be stated. Also move this below the knock off / trick users section since these users are far more uncommon.

**Knock Off and Trick users**: Knock Off removes Leftovers, preventing Suicune from regaining passive recovery over the course of a battle and forcing it to use Rest more often. If Suicune is tricked by a foe such as Jirachi or Rotom-W, Suicune will be at best Choice-lock into Scald, a move only effectively spammed after Suicune has used Calm Mind.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Aqua∞Ring, 531302]]
- Quality checked by: [[Twilight, 344575], [Lilburr, 481709], [username3, userid3]]
- Grammar checked by: [[username1, userid1], [username2, userid2]]
QC 3/3. Please be careful to implement all comments, as you missed some things last time such as the Grass-types section in checks and counters.
 

Albatross

Doing a Merry Little Jig
is an Artist
AM check here, this is an unofficial GP check so you don't have to implement it and it doesn't count towards 1/2 GP
Add Remove (Comment)
AC (Add Comma) RC (Remove Comma)
AH (Add Hyphen) (Remove Hyphen)

:ss/Suicune:

[OVERVIEW]

Despite its average movepool, Suicune is a decent setup sweeper due to its astounding bulk and valuable defensive typing that allows it to check distinguished threats such as Scizor and Rhyperior. By virtue of its ability With Pressure, access to Calm Mind, and its superb bulk, Suicune is able to stall out threatening walls such as Aegislash, and Chansey. However, Suicune is held back by the prevalence of Water-resistant(AH) Pokemon in the tier such as Keldeo, Mantine, and especially Zarude.;(replaced period with semicolon) As a result of Secret Sword, Keldeo can simply ignore Suicune's Special Defense boosts with Secret Sword,(AC) Suicune struggles to make headway against bulkier teams that feature Gastrodon and Mantine, and Zarude especially can use Jungle Healing to cure itself of burns and Power Whip to deal significant damage. In addition, Suicune lacks dependable recovery,(AC) forcing it to rely on Leftovers and Rest in order to regain HP. This makes Suicune susceptible to Knock Off, as losing Leftovers would require Suicune to use Rest more often. In addition, overreliance on Sleep Talk isn't great either,(AC) as you rely on RNG to choose the ideal move. Furthermore, Suicune's weakness to Grass- and Electric-type moves are easily exploitable with Power Whip Tangrowth, Zarude,(AC) Thundurus, and Thundurus-T, and Zarude being commonplace. Zarude especially, as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns and Power Whip can deal significant damage to Suicune.

[SET]
name: CroCune
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

Calm Mind allows Suicune to become a threatening bulky sweeper by boosting its Special Attack and Special Defense. Scald is Suicune's only offensive move,(AC) which it can use to spread burns and sweep. Rest allows Suicune to easily recover HP while also curing any status conditions. Sleep Talk prevents Suicune from being too passive during the turns that it's sleeping by either letting it continue to boost its special stats or attack foes. Suicune's Speed investment allows it to outspeed Adamant Scizor and potentially burn it before Scizor can switch out via U-turn.

As a result of Suicune's nature as As Suicune is a sweeper, it best fits on balance teams. Pokemon such as Scizor and Salamence are essential teammates for Suicune, as they threaten Grass-types like Zarude which that poses a tremendous threat to Suicune as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns that may be inflicted via Scald (you’ve already said this in verbatim lol, I don't see any need to repeat it). Salamence can also provide Defog support for Suicune and its teammates, which they appreciate. Suicune also appreciates teammates that are immune to Electric moves Electric-immune teammates such as Nidoqueen and Rhyperior, with the former having the ability to set up Toxic Spikes that helps to help Suicune stall opposing Pokemon like Seismitoad,(AC) while the latter provides counterplay to foes such as Nasty Plot Togekiss,(RC) as well as Stealth Rock. However, Nidoqueen cannot switch into Thundrus and Thundrus-Therian after they have received a Nasty Plot boost. Suicune also appreciates teammates like Amoonguss Assault Vest Tangrowth and Assault Vest Tangrowth Amoonguss (swapped to better fit with the next clause) that can help check threats like Keldeo.;(replace period with semicolon) Tangrowth can also help to (remove double space) check Thundurus and Thundurus-T for Suicune,(RC) while Amoonguss can provide Sleep support with Spore. Pokemon that can sponge Knock Off such as Buzzwole and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude are also treasured on Suicune's team, as Suicune despises losing its Leftovers. Zarude is especially appreciated, as it can also threaten KOes on Water-resistant(AH) foes such as Gastrodon, Milotic, and Seismitoad that would otherwise completely wall Suicune.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Substitute + Calm Mind is another option, as it can PP stall would-be checks such as Quagsire.;(replace period with semicolon) Ice Beam can also be used over Protect to prevent it from getting walled by Grass-types. However, it is extremely vulnerable to passive damage and status,(AC) making it less reliable then CroCune. In addition, it is unable to sponge hits from foes like Rhyperior and Mamoswine, effectively taking up the teamslot of a Water-type pokemon without offering very much defensive utility. Ice Beam is also an alternative option over Protect on Substitute + Calm Mind sets, as it prevents Suicune from getting walled by Grass-types. (Moved bc reading negatives for a set and then an alternative option for it immediately after is a little jarring) Toxic can used to subdue Pokemon that are otherwise immune to Water-type moves such as Gastrodon, Mantine, and Seismitoad. However, Suicune often doesn't have room to run Toxic due its to it suffering from four-moveslot syndrome. If you were to run Toxic, it would likely replace Sleep Talk on CroCune. A set with Calm Mind / Roar / Scald / Rest allows Suicune to be used as a dedicated phazer and to stop foes like Calm Mind Psyshock Galarian Slowbro and Nasty Plot + Psyshock Mew from boosting up; however,(AC) this would be wasting waste Suicune's sweeping capabilities and requires hazard support to be effective. Another benefit to Roar is s that it stops foes like Calm Mind Psyshock Glowbro and Nasty Plot + Psyshock Mew from trying to boost up and beat you as easily. (Moved for similar reasons to Ice Beam above)

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-types**: Pokemon such as Raikou and Thundurus-T can easily click Thunderbolt and severely damage Suicune even after a Calm Mind boost.

**Grass-types**: Grass-types such as Tapu Bulu and Zarude can pose an immense threat to Suicune with Horn Leech and Power Whip due to Suicune's lackluster Defense and poor Speed. Heavy-Duty Boots versions of Zarude in particular completely counter Suicune, as they can switch into Scald without fear due to Jungle Healing.

**Water-immune Pokemon**: As Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, it can't damage Water-immune foes such as Mantine and Gastrodon are unable to be damaged.;(replace period with semicolon) Suicune struggles with Gastrodon especially, as it can force Suicune to use Rest more often due to Toxic. Despite this, Suicune can still annoy both through Pressure stalling.

**Knock Off and Trick users**: Knock Off removes Leftovers, preventing Suicune from regaining passive recovery over the course of a battle and forcing it to use Rest more often. If Suicune is tricked by a foe such as Jirachi or Rotom-W, Suicune will be,(AC) at best,(AC) Choice-locked into Scald, a move only effectively spammed after Suicune has used Calm Mind. (This doesn’t seem too relevant and is also kinda obvious; ofc Suicune is gonna prefer spamming Scald with Calm Mind boosts rather than without)

**Haze users**: Moves such as Clear Smog and Haze make it difficult for Suicune to set up for a late-game sweep, as they reset all of Suicune's stat boosts. Notable examples of foes that are able to do this are the aforementioned Gastrodon and Mantine.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Aqua∞Ring, 531302]]
- Quality checked by: [[Twilight, 344575], [Lilburr, 481709], [Estarossa, 461329]]
- Grammar checked by: [[username1, userid1], [username2, userid2]]
[/QUOTE]
 

Milak

Stoïque fierté
is a Site Content Manageris a Top Social Media Contributoris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Battle Simulator Driver
Moderator
Albatross: Add (AC=Add comma, AH=Add hyphen) Remove (RC=Remove comma, RH=Remove hyphen)
Milak: Add Remove
1/2
when implemented, please do it carefully ^^
[OVERVIEW]

Despite its average movepool, Suicune is a decent setup sweeper due to its astounding bulk and valuable defensive typing that allows it to check distinguished threats such as Scizor and Rhyperior. By virtue of its ability With Pressure, access to Calm Mind, and its superb bulk, Suicune is able to stall out threatening walls such as Aegislash,(RC) and Chansey. However, Suicune is held back by the prevalence of Water-resistant(AH) Pokemon in the tier such as Keldeo, Mantine, and especially Zarude.;(replaced period with semicolon) As a result of Secret Sword, Keldeo can simply ignore Suicune's Special Defense boosts with Secret Sword,(AC) Suicune struggles to make headway against bulkier teams that feature Gastrodon and Mantine, and Zarude especially can use Jungle Healing to cure itself of burns and Power Whip to deal significant damage. In addition, Suicune lacks dependable reliable recovery,(AC) forcing it to rely on Leftovers and Rest in order to regain HP. This makes Suicune susceptible to Knock Off, as losing Leftovers would require Suicune to use Rest more often. In addition, its overreliance on Sleep Talk isn't great either,(AC) as you rely on RNG to choose the ideal move. Furthermore, Suicune's weakness to Grass- and Electric-type moves are is easily exploitable with by the common Power Whip Tangrowth, Zarude,(AC) Thundurus, and Thundurus-T, and Zarude being commonplace. Zarude especially, as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns and Power Whip can deal significant damage to Suicune.

[SET]
name: CroCune
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

Calm Mind allows Suicune to become a threatening bulky sweeper by boosting its Special Attack and Special Defense. Scald is Suicune's only offensive move,(AC) which it can use to spread burns and sweep. Rest allows Suicune to easily recover HP while also curing any status conditions. Sleep Talk prevents Suicune from being too passive during the sleep turns that it's sleeping by either by letting it continue to boost its special stats or attack foes. Suicune's Speed investment allows it to outspeed Adamant Scizor and potentially burn it before Scizor can switch out via U-turn.

As a result of Suicune's nature as As Suicune is a sweeper, it best fits on balance teams. Pokemon such as Scizor and Salamence are essential teammates for Suicune, as they threaten Grass-types like Zarude which that poses a tremendous threat to Suicune as Jungle Healing allows it to cure itself of burns that may be inflicted via Scald. Salamence can also provide Defog support for Suicune and its teammates, which they appreciate. Suicune also appreciates teammates that are immune to Electric moves Electric-immune teammates such as Nidoqueen and Rhyperior, with the former having the ability to set up Toxic Spikes that helps to help Suicune stall opposing Pokemon like Seismitoad,(AC) while and the latter provides providing counterplay to foes such as Nasty Plot Togekiss,(RC) as well as Stealth Rock support. However, Nidoqueen cannot switch into Thundrus Thundurus and Thundrus-Therian Thundurus-T after they have received a Nasty Plot boost. Suicune also appreciates teammates like Amoonguss Assault Vest Tangrowth and Assault Vest Tangrowth Amoonguss that can help check threats like Keldeo.;(replace period with semicolon) Tangrowth can also help to (remove double space) check Thundurus and Thundurus-T for Suicune, while Amoonguss can provide Sleep support with Spore. Pokemon that can sponge Knock Off such as Buzzwole and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude are also treasured on Suicune's team, as Suicune despises losing its Leftovers. Zarude is especially appreciated, as it can also threaten KOs on Water-resistant(AH) foes such as Gastrodon, Milotic, and Seismitoad that would otherwise completely wall Suicune.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Substitute + Calm Mind is another option, as it can allows Suicune to PP stall would-be checks such as Quagsire.;(replace period with semicolon) Ice Beam can also be used over Protect to prevent it from getting walled by Grass-types. However, it is makes Suicune extremely vulnerable to passive damage and status,(AC) making it and thus less reliable then CroCune. In addition, it is unable to sponge hits from foes like Rhyperior and Mamoswine, effectively taking up the teamslot of a Water-type pokemon without offering very much defensive utility. Ice Beam is also an alternative option over Protect on Substitute + Calm Mind sets, as it prevents Suicune from getting walled by Grass-types.Toxic can used to subdue Water-immune Pokemon that are otherwise immune to Water-type moves such as Gastrodon, Mantine, and Seismitoad. However, Suicune often doesn't have room to run Toxic due its to it suffering from four-moveslot syndrome. If you were to run Toxic, it would likely replace Sleep Talk on CroCune. A set with Calm Mind / Roar / Scald / Rest allows Suicune to be used as a dedicated phazer and to stop foes like Calm Mind + Psyshock Galarian Slowbro and Nasty Plot + Psyshock Mew from boosting setting up; however,(AC) this would be wasting waste Suicune's sweeping capabilities and requires hazard support to be effective. Another benefit to Roar is s that it stops foes like Calm Mind Psyshock Glowbro and Nasty Plot + Psyshock Mew from trying to boost up and beat you as easily.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-types**: Pokemon such as Raikou and Thundurus-T can easily click Thunderbolt and severely damage with Thunderbolt Suicune even after a Calm Mind boost.

**Grass-types**: Grass-types such as Tapu Bulu and Zarude can pose an immense threat to Suicune with Horn Leech and Power Whip due to Suicune's lackluster Defense and poor Speed. Heavy-Duty Boots versions variants of Zarude in particular completely counter Suicune, as they can switch into Scald without fear due to Jungle Healing.

**Water-immune Pokemon**: As Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, it can't damage Water-immune foes such as Mantine and Gastrodon are unable to be damaged.;(replace period with semicolon) Suicune struggles with Gastrodon especially, as it can force Suicune to use Rest more often due to Toxic. Despite this, Suicune can still annoy both through Pressure stalling.

**Knock Off and Trick users**: Knock Off removes Leftovers, preventing Suicune from regaining passive recovery over the course of a battle and forcing it to use Rest more often. If Suicune is tricked by a foe such as Jirachi or Rotom-W, Suicune will be,(AC) at best,(AC) Choice-locked into Scald, a move only effectively spammed after Suicune has used Calm Mind.

**Haze users**: Moves such as Clear Smog and Haze make it difficult for Suicune to set up for a late-game sweep, as they reset all of Suicune's stat boosts. Notable examples of foes that are able to do this are the aforementioned Gastrodon and Mantine.

[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Aqua∞Ring, 531302]]
- Quality checked by: [[Twilight, 344575], [Lilburr, 481709], [Estarossa, 461329]]
- Grammar checked by: [[Milak, 262594], [username2, userid2]]
 

DC

LC Main, No Brain
is a Social Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
Remove Add Comments
AC = Add Comma, RC = Remove Comma, AH = Add Hyphen, RH = Remove Hyphen

:ss/Suicune:

[OVERVIEW]

Despite its average movepool, Suicune is a decent setup sweeper due to its astounding bulk and valuable defensive typing that allows it to check distinguished threats such as Scizor and Rhyperior. With Pressure, access to Calm Mind, and its superb bulk, Suicune is able to stall out threatening walls such as Aegislash and Chansey. However, Suicune is held back by the prevalence of Water-resistant Pokemon in the tier such as Keldeo, Mantine, and especially Zarude; Keldeo can simply ignore Suicune's Special Defense boosts with Secret Sword,(AC) Suicune struggles to make headway against Gastrodon and Mantine, and Zarude especially can use Jungle Healing to cure itself of burns and Power Whip to deal significant damage. In addition, Suicune lacks reliable recovery,(AC) forcing it to rely on Leftovers and Rest in order to regain HP. This makes Suicune susceptible to Knock Off, as losing Leftovers would require Suicune to use Rest more often. In addition, its overreliance on Sleep Talk isn't great either,(AC) as you rely on RNG to choose the ideal move. Furthermore, Suicune's weakness to Grass- and Electric-type moves is easily exploitable by the common Power Whip Tangrowth, Zarude,(AC) Thundurus, and Thundurus-T.

[SET]
name: CroCune
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Scald
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
ability: Pressure
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

Calm Mind allows Suicune to become a threatening bulky sweeper.(add period) Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, which it can use to spread burns and sweep. Rest allows Suicune to easily recover HP while also curing any status conditions. Sleep Talk prevents Suicune from being too passive during sleep turns either by letting it continue to boost its special stats or attack foes. Suicune's Speed investment allows it to outspeed Adamant Scizor and potentially burn it before Scizor can switch out via U-turn.

As Suicune is a sweeper, it best fits best on balance teams. Pokemon such as Scizor and Salamence are essential teammates for Suicune, as they threaten Grass-types like Zarude that pose a tremendous threat to Suicune. Salamence can also provide Defog support for Suicune and its teammates, which they appreciate. Suicune also appreciates Electric-immune teammates such as Nidoqueen and Rhyperior, with the former having the ability to set up Toxic Spikes to help Suicune stall opposing Pokemon like Seismitoad, and the latter providing counterplay to foes such as Nasty Plot Togekiss as well as Stealth Rock support. However, Nidoqueen cannot switch into Thundurus and Thundurus-T after a Nasty Plot boost. Suicune also appreciates teammates like Assault Vest Tangrowth and Amoonguss,(AC) that which can help check threats like Keldeo; Tangrowth can also help check Thundurus and Thundurus-T for Suicune, while Amoonguss can provide sleep(lowercase) support with Spore. Pokemon that can sponge Knock Off such as Buzzwole and Heavy-Duty Boots Zarude are also treasured on Suicune's team, as Suicune despises losing its Leftovers. Zarude is especially appreciated, as it can also threaten KOs on Water-resistant foes such as Gastrodon, Milotic, and Seismitoad,(AC) that which would otherwise completely wall Suicune.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Substitute + Calm Mind is another option, as it allows Suicune to PP stall would-be checks such as Quagsire; Ice Beam can also be used over Protect to prevent it from getting walled by Grass-types. However, it makes Suicune extremely vulnerable to passive damage and status and thus less reliable than CroCune. In addition, it is unable to sponge hits from foes like Rhyperior and Mamoswine, effectively taking up the teamslot of a Water-type without offering very much defensive utility. Toxic can be used to subdue Water-immune Pokemon such as Gastrodon, Mantine, and Seismitoad. However, Suicune often doesn't have room to run Toxic due to it suffering from four-moveslot syndrome. If you were to run Toxic, it would likely replace Sleep Talk on CroCune. A set with Calm Mind / Roar / Scald / Rest allows Suicune to be used as a dedicated phazer and stop foes like Calm Mind + Psyshock Galarian Slowbro and Nasty Plot + Psyshock Mew from setting up; however, this would waste Suicune's sweeping capabilities and requires entry hazard support to be effective.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Electric-types**: Pokemon such as Raikou and Thundurus-T can easily severely damage with Thunderbolt Suicune with Thunderbolt,(AC) even after a Calm Mind boost.

**Grass-types**: Grass-types such as Tapu Bulu and Zarude can pose an immense threat to Suicune with Horn Leech and Power Whip due to Suicune's lacklustre lackluster Defense and poor Speed. Heavy-Duty Boots variants of Zarude,(AC) in particular,(AC) completely counter Suicune, as they can switch into Scald without fear due to Jungle Healing.

**Water-immune Pokemon**: As Scald is Suicune's only offensive move, it can't damage Water-immune foes such as Mantine and Gastrodon; Suicune struggles with Gastrodon especially, as it can force Suicune to use Rest more often due to Toxic. Despite this, Suicune can still annoy both through Pressure stalling.

**Knock Off and Trick Users(capitalize)**: Knock Off removes Leftovers, preventing Suicune from regaining passive recovery over the course of a battle and forcing it to use Rest more often. If Suicune is tricked by a foe such as Jirachi or Rotom-W, Suicune will be, at best, Choice-locked into Scald. Trick users such as Jirachi and Rotom-W can force Suicune into being Choice-locked. (Original sentence is a bit unclear)

**Haze Users(capitalize)**: Moves such as Clear Smog and Haze make it difficult for Suicune to set up for a late-game sweep, as they reset all of Suicune's stat boosts. Notable examples of foes that are able to do this are Gastrodon and Mantine.

[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Aqua∞Ring, 531302]]
- Quality checked by: [[Twilight, 344575], [Lilburr, 481709], [Estarossa, 461329]]
- Grammar checked by: [[Milak, 262594], [username2, userid2]]
GP 2/2. [DC, 449990]
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top