Ok. I am glad it is maybe worth dropping(idk why, I was championing mola like yesterday lol,) and though I see how dozo isn't really relevant to that(now,) I didn't know what WOULD be. Got smacked down hard for relying on usage too much. Usage is like the only thing to use that isn't an "I feel" statement. That just is, it isn't an opinion. Otherwise I rely on my opinion, which here isn't reliable. Well anyways yay, basically a win:|
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Resource SV BSS Viability Rankings (Regulation J)
- Thread starter Psynergy
- Start date
you didn’t get “smacked down” for relying on usage too much, you were told that solely citing usage as justification for a mons ranking is in violation of the rules of this thread. There are also plenty of objective ways to analyze how a mon performs in the current meta.
- what are its high tier matchups like
- what kind of teams does it fit on
- how versatile is it
- how consistent is it
- what does it do that other pokes cant
- is what it does valuable in the current meta
The VR thread is not a competition. It’s a resource. If trying to influence the ranking of something is the only reason you’re posting on this thread I would kindly ask you to not. It’s fine to ask questions if you don’t understand why something is rated where it is, but if someone says your view of something isn’t correct that isn’t a “loss.” If you want your opinions to be taken more seriously you should probably familiarize yourself with the metagame more so you can make more informed posts.
Ok, constructive criticism vs losing. Yeah I get it. I am glad we can ask...I definitely have had questions over some rankings. I don't get zamazemta and Groudon being here at all. And should gothitelle be ranked? Totally unique, very diabolical potentially. I'm asking not telling, because of usage and the fear factor.
I mostly/fully agree no on gouging fire, but then I wonder why yes for walking wake. I don't also wonder on raging bolt though, that's another I get. Like in ps, dachsbun oughta drop. Off completely that is. That's all I have for what is here and why. I asked in other thread about one that's not here so nvm that, others I use that aren't I'm not even confident enough about to ask just yet.
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Goth was just overlooked by the VR council and we will definitely be adding it in the next update.
Walking Wake is a water type that actually likes being in the sun, which is quite a big deal. Koraidon does not immediately want to tera fire if WW is present on a teamsheet, but it’s also scared of dragon stab if it doesn’t Tera. This can lead to some pretty nice checkmate situations if the WW user plays this pressure well.
For the record I did not want to rank Dachsbun because I knew it was just an early meta “haha funny shitmon beats big bad legendary” thing, but I was overruled and we ended up ranking it anyway, again this should be fixed in the next update.
I tried to rank all of the “usable” restricted Pokémon and groudon does in fact have a few niches that Koraidon can’t replicate. Access to heat crash gives it a nice high power physical fire move that doesn’t kill itself, ground typing makes it naturally immune to thunder wave, it’s more capable of taking on stuff like flutter mane thanks to not being forced to tera in fear of being tickled by a fairy move, and it has a much wider support movepool. It’s not great, hence why it’s ranked rather low, but it does have a place. Zamazenta is also actually quite effective in the proper lineup. It gained access to body press this gen which allows it to be the defacto IronPress user. It’s good bulk also allows it to use a fairly decent general offense build, but again, it’s ranked rather low because it’s quite specific and generally outclassed by other restricteds.
Goth was just overlooked by the VR council and we will definitely be adding it in the next update.
Walking Wake is a water type that actually likes being in the sun, which is quite a big deal. Koraidon does not immediately want to tera fire if WW is present on a teamsheet, but it’s also scared of dragon stab if it doesn’t Tera. This can lead to some pretty nice checkmate situations if the WW user plays this pressure well.
For the record I did not want to rank Dachsbun because I knew it was just an early meta “haha funny shitmon beats big bad legendary” thing, but I was overruled and we ended up ranking it anyway, again this should be fixed in the next update.
That makes sense then. This is picky, but I vote Bundle move to A-. It's great in a lot of ways, but it seems on par more with chi yu, being the accompaniment to miraidon as chi is to kor. That is to say, it's not really the best mate of its respective legend. And even mir oddly lacks bundle in top 10 teammates. Usage is why it was on my radar, not all though. Bundle is obvious, in that it essentially always is encore, so you can switch if it switches in because you mostly know what you get. Also, chi yu gets big power and some defensive help outta sun, bundle JUST gets spe from terrain, and it's already speedy so it can go to waste often. I'm not sure those two make the most sense to compare, but hopefully some. Overall I just think needs for water types weak to electric are going down. There's already 2 top 10 despite mir, I think more in that rank category is pushing it for now.
Edit: seems none of the top ten use bundle in their top ten. No shock.
2nd edit: I take back the encore comment
Missed it before, what does rayquaza do? And not suggesting anything yet, but why is pelipper ranked, not torkoal, when sun has gotten better than rain?
Edit: seems none of the top ten use bundle in their top ten. No shock.
2nd edit: I take back the encore comment
Missed it before, what does rayquaza do? And not suggesting anything yet, but why is pelipper ranked, not torkoal, when sun has gotten better than rain?
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Oki so here’s my thoughts for changes
NEW ADDITIONS
Gothitelle - B - shadow tag is some bullshit but w Tera fly to dodge ohko attempts and rest to heal off status while it sets up it can really do a number on fat mons and open holes for stuff like SD Koraidon. It’s pretty cheesy imo and is prone to getting critted or just immediately revenge killed after it spends an eternity setting up on dondozo or something so I can’t really say it’s worth higher than B. Still a menace for stall type teams.
RISES
Terapagos - A- > A - Terapagos honestly has a lot going for it that was overlooked. Tera Starstorm providing actually perfect neutral coverage once Terastallized opens up so many options for it. It is perhaps the easiest specs bomber to use ever, as there’s literally zero thought required. This ability to run a mono attack set opens it up to running double dance sets, too. The Calm Mind + Rock Polish set can be a pain to stop when backed by Toxic Spikes support, with protect able to allow it to get back to full HP via leftovers and potential grassy terrain recovery to make use of the absolutely absurd Tera Shell repeatedly, all whilst the opponent takes more and more chip from poison. The flexibility provided by its ability and movepool really make it a good option for bulky teams, and there have even been teams solely designed around supporting a Terapagos sweep that saw high level success.
Glimmora - A- > A - Toxic spikes pair well with a ton of the big restricteds and Glimmora is arguably the most reliable tspiker since it doesn’t even have to run the move. Red Card glimmora is possibly one of the most infuriating mons I’ve ever seen as it can ruin almost any sweep attempt from a physical attacker and punish the Mon it drags out with poison. Mortal Spin allows it to keep its side of the field hazard free while giving it yet another option to spread poison and put things on a timer. The fact that glimmora enables so many options just with its presence and accentuates the pressure of already terrifying monsters like Koraidon and Calyrex-S put it well above the threshold for A- in my eyes, it honestly has an argument to get bumped to A+
DROPS/REMOVALS
Kyogre - A > A- - Kyogre’s scarfer speed tier just isn’t what it used to be, and its bulk isn’t anything to write home about either. It can still be a terrifying wallbreaker with the right support but it takes a ton to get much tangible value out of it nowadays. The presence of Ogerpon-W and a potential Water Absorb Clodsire on a teamsheet can be enough to make the Kyogre user very hesitant to click its most powerful move. Even without Ogerpon-W, the presence of any Ogerpon can easily scare a Kyogre away, and that’s not mentioning the threats posed to it by Miradon and Calyrex-S, or the fact that Koraidon can switch in, remove the rain and resist Water to then threaten a KO to Kyogre’s team very easily. I do think rain teams have a place in the meta, and Kyogre is definitely still nothing to write off, but at the same time it’s really not what it used to be and struggles to find a super consistent role in the current meta.
Gholdengo - A- > B - This one really just boils down to the fact that Gholdengo just doesn’t matchup well against a ton of the big threats in the metagame. Stuff like Koraidon, Calyrex-S, Flutter Mane and Chien-Pao are all easily capable of ohkoing Gholdengo, and often come with partners that don’t care too much about its offensive presence. The fact that it’s Scarf set, arguably its most consistent variant, now is harder than ever to fit due to a ton of the best restricted pokes being incredible scarfers themselves also doesn’t do it any favors. It still shuts down utility based mons like nothing else but currently that trait is probably at its lowest value so far in SV.
Dachsbun - C > UR - just a shitmon that saw mostly unserious usage at the beginning of the regulation because it could stop Koraidon semi consistently and does basically nothing else of value. Should’ve never been ranked in the first place imo, just nuke it.
NEW ADDITIONS
Gothitelle - B - shadow tag is some bullshit but w Tera fly to dodge ohko attempts and rest to heal off status while it sets up it can really do a number on fat mons and open holes for stuff like SD Koraidon. It’s pretty cheesy imo and is prone to getting critted or just immediately revenge killed after it spends an eternity setting up on dondozo or something so I can’t really say it’s worth higher than B. Still a menace for stall type teams.
RISES
Terapagos - A- > A - Terapagos honestly has a lot going for it that was overlooked. Tera Starstorm providing actually perfect neutral coverage once Terastallized opens up so many options for it. It is perhaps the easiest specs bomber to use ever, as there’s literally zero thought required. This ability to run a mono attack set opens it up to running double dance sets, too. The Calm Mind + Rock Polish set can be a pain to stop when backed by Toxic Spikes support, with protect able to allow it to get back to full HP via leftovers and potential grassy terrain recovery to make use of the absolutely absurd Tera Shell repeatedly, all whilst the opponent takes more and more chip from poison. The flexibility provided by its ability and movepool really make it a good option for bulky teams, and there have even been teams solely designed around supporting a Terapagos sweep that saw high level success.
Glimmora - A- > A - Toxic spikes pair well with a ton of the big restricteds and Glimmora is arguably the most reliable tspiker since it doesn’t even have to run the move. Red Card glimmora is possibly one of the most infuriating mons I’ve ever seen as it can ruin almost any sweep attempt from a physical attacker and punish the Mon it drags out with poison. Mortal Spin allows it to keep its side of the field hazard free while giving it yet another option to spread poison and put things on a timer. The fact that glimmora enables so many options just with its presence and accentuates the pressure of already terrifying monsters like Koraidon and Calyrex-S put it well above the threshold for A- in my eyes, it honestly has an argument to get bumped to A+
DROPS/REMOVALS
Kyogre - A > A- - Kyogre’s scarfer speed tier just isn’t what it used to be, and its bulk isn’t anything to write home about either. It can still be a terrifying wallbreaker with the right support but it takes a ton to get much tangible value out of it nowadays. The presence of Ogerpon-W and a potential Water Absorb Clodsire on a teamsheet can be enough to make the Kyogre user very hesitant to click its most powerful move. Even without Ogerpon-W, the presence of any Ogerpon can easily scare a Kyogre away, and that’s not mentioning the threats posed to it by Miradon and Calyrex-S, or the fact that Koraidon can switch in, remove the rain and resist Water to then threaten a KO to Kyogre’s team very easily. I do think rain teams have a place in the meta, and Kyogre is definitely still nothing to write off, but at the same time it’s really not what it used to be and struggles to find a super consistent role in the current meta.
Gholdengo - A- > B - This one really just boils down to the fact that Gholdengo just doesn’t matchup well against a ton of the big threats in the metagame. Stuff like Koraidon, Calyrex-S, Flutter Mane and Chien-Pao are all easily capable of ohkoing Gholdengo, and often come with partners that don’t care too much about its offensive presence. The fact that it’s Scarf set, arguably its most consistent variant, now is harder than ever to fit due to a ton of the best restricted pokes being incredible scarfers themselves also doesn’t do it any favors. It still shuts down utility based mons like nothing else but currently that trait is probably at its lowest value so far in SV.
Dachsbun - C > UR - just a shitmon that saw mostly unserious usage at the beginning of the regulation because it could stop Koraidon semi consistently and does basically nothing else of value. Should’ve never been ranked in the first place imo, just nuke it.
VR upkeep has been a bit slower and quieter as of late, apologies for that. However, the VR is now updated for Regulation H. We've had the meta on PS long enough for people to have developed opinions on it but the cart meta has already shown developments different than our initial opinions so some of the stuff in the B ranks might look unusual. Feel free to comment on anything you think is off or missing, I nearly forgot Kingambit on the list here so for all I know I missed something else important too.
Also note that the Regulation G format will be returning in January so I have that list archived in a different thread that you may have already seen, link can be found in the OP and also here. When the time comes I'll just copy that list back into the OP, so if you see anything in the meantime that should be updated then I would recommend posting in that thread so it can be noted and updated on the archive ahead of time.
Also note that the Regulation G format will be returning in January so I have that list archived in a different thread that you may have already seen, link can be found in the OP and also here. When the time comes I'll just copy that list back into the OP, so if you see anything in the meantime that should be updated then I would recommend posting in that thread so it can be noted and updated on the archive ahead of time.
This format is really interesting, I don’t think we’ve ever had such a wide roster of S ranks but I also think that the majority of these S ranks are more oppressive than any other S rank I’ve seen. It’ll be interesting to see how the meta shapes up but I can only hope developments make it less reliant on who wins the S rank mirror.
I like that some stuff that barely saw the light of day is now good or great.
I'm curious about two mons, though I'm in no way nomming them. Just wondering why meowscarada is 'better'(and by a lot going off here) than cinderace and Greninja. Very early on new toy syndrome played a part I bet, but definitely not now.
I'm curious about two mons, though I'm in no way nomming them. Just wondering why meowscarada is 'better'(and by a lot going off here) than cinderace and Greninja. Very early on new toy syndrome played a part I bet, but definitely not now.
Hisuian Typhlosion: UR > B+/A-
Been using it a fair bit recently for fun and it turned out to be quite good with proper support. Eruption is a fantastic nuke option and Ghost STAB makes a great complement to it. Infernal Parade is honestly a lot better than it would initially seem, the burn rate is absolutely nasty, and should you get that burn (which is not a totally unreasonable expectation) you have another extremely powerful STAB option to throw out given that Infernal Parade becomes a massive 120 BP nuke against burned targets. Of course, if you’re looking for consistent general damage, shadow ball is a great option as well. Frisk is also a massively useful ability, given how many mons have sets that can revolve around their item, and immediately having that information can be a godsend (i.e. knowing a Gholdengo is scarfed before you get blasted by shadow ball). The Ghost-Typing is massively useful as well, dodging Extreme Speed attempts from Dragonite and being able to blank the various Fighting moves flying around to catch monsters like Blursa and Archaludon.
It’s not the best mon ever but it’s really great on some team comps
Been using it a fair bit recently for fun and it turned out to be quite good with proper support. Eruption is a fantastic nuke option and Ghost STAB makes a great complement to it. Infernal Parade is honestly a lot better than it would initially seem, the burn rate is absolutely nasty, and should you get that burn (which is not a totally unreasonable expectation) you have another extremely powerful STAB option to throw out given that Infernal Parade becomes a massive 120 BP nuke against burned targets. Of course, if you’re looking for consistent general damage, shadow ball is a great option as well. Frisk is also a massively useful ability, given how many mons have sets that can revolve around their item, and immediately having that information can be a godsend (i.e. knowing a Gholdengo is scarfed before you get blasted by shadow ball). The Ghost-Typing is massively useful as well, dodging Extreme Speed attempts from Dragonite and being able to blank the various Fighting moves flying around to catch monsters like Blursa and Archaludon.
It’s not the best mon ever but it’s really great on some team comps
Gallade had been doing lots of work for me, nominating to B+ conservatively. It has moves for all the big guys, buffed by sharpness. More usage than some a fair bit above B, and it's versatile with things like trick even, that you wouldn't expect if you are familiar with its data. 4mss and speed are the big drawbacks, but the first applies to almost everything good somewhat. I also think gallade is plainly better than the counterpart Gardevoir. I think it fits on lots of teams, esp as an archaludon answer I think.
Gallade would probably be a better candidate for B rather than B+ but I have been seeing it here and there and it is quite threatening to a lot of the top tiers so I can absolutely see it getting ranked
Its super fragile and not that fast, though speed is a lot less important in this meta but you still feel it sometimes, more offensively invested Volcarona for example can be a big issue if Gallade is what you use to threaten the other sets. Dragonite can similarly be troublesome with dd and band sets doing too much damage for Gallade to keep up with sometimes, but its threat level is definitely still there
Its super fragile and not that fast, though speed is a lot less important in this meta but you still feel it sometimes, more offensively invested Volcarona for example can be a big issue if Gallade is what you use to threaten the other sets. Dragonite can similarly be troublesome with dd and band sets doing too much damage for Gallade to keep up with sometimes, but its threat level is definitely still there
Those are good points. I actually run aqua cutter AND Triple Axel for those two, although stronger e speeds are bad. And boosted volc for speed.
Maybe b is fine since you have to be wary of #1...though with the right move it gets ghold, and naturally gets Blursa/arch more than most.
Yeah Gallade definitely has the tools to threaten pretty much whatever you want, it’s just highly unlikely that you’ll ever be able to fit everything you need for it to be a consistent threat. All the coverage for the top mons + contingencies for their common teras (Axel for example won’t be looking too hot if Dragonite decides to send it with Tera normal espeed right away), alongside your STABs (you at the very least want sacred sword for the aforementioned threats as you stated) and shadow sneak for priority is very tempting as well to make up for Gallade’s sometimes disappointing speed in the event it comes up short of a KO on something.
Yea it likely defines b at this time, be that with + or b proper.
Edit: should mimikyu go A+? It is pretty prevalent, and seems more meta defining than, say, garg or corv, which it's ranked with. Lotta options, though it is mostly lo. Disguise is still pretty busted, no pun intended...
Edit: should mimikyu go A+? It is pretty prevalent, and seems more meta defining than, say, garg or corv, which it's ranked with. Lotta options, though it is mostly lo. Disguise is still pretty busted, no pun intended...
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I think we can drop Espathra from A. Maybe A-, idk that still feels generous. It hasn't had a great track record throughout much of this gen, though I feel like it should've. It's also quite an outlier, by being in A, based on usage. Though I think it's more the frailty than anything that drags it down, you just don't see too much plainly frail stuff that high up, esp. on both sides.
Edit: why is volc s? I never understood cause it is typically walled by fires. I like the stats, and I suppose there aren't a huge number of high tier fires, but still.
Edit: why is volc s? I never understood cause it is typically walled by fires. I like the stats, and I suppose there aren't a huge number of high tier fires, but still.
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Meowscarada - A > A+
Cat has been seeing a lot of use and good results, even entering the top 6 last season. Its kit is really a lot better than it would seem at first glance, and having the auto crit flower trick is great for dealing consistent damage. Access to triple axel is really what pushes it up though imo, as it finally has a consistent way to threaten Dragonite even with multiscale intact. On top of having STAB knock off and sucker punch, toxic spikes, trick, and taunt to toy with almost any archetype, it has great stats yo make use of either choice scarf or band, and lead sash sets are always good. Definitely deserving of a bump imo
Cat has been seeing a lot of use and good results, even entering the top 6 last season. Its kit is really a lot better than it would seem at first glance, and having the auto crit flower trick is great for dealing consistent damage. Access to triple axel is really what pushes it up though imo, as it finally has a consistent way to threaten Dragonite even with multiscale intact. On top of having STAB knock off and sucker punch, toxic spikes, trick, and taunt to toy with almost any archetype, it has great stats yo make use of either choice scarf or band, and lead sash sets are always good. Definitely deserving of a bump imo
Apologies for the delay on getting this updated, TCG Pocket is to blame. The old list from before Regulation G ended the first time is now added back to the first post.
So activity definitely took a nosedive during Regulation H but the Regulation H list has been archived as we transition back into Regulation G. Whether it's that Regulation H was less popular or it's just the late-gen burnout, it sounds like Regulation G is getting more discussion despite this just being a retread of an old meta. Feel free to ask questions on placements as it's certainly possible that meta opinions have already changed from what this list suggested 4 months ago.
So activity definitely took a nosedive during Regulation H but the Regulation H list has been archived as we transition back into Regulation G. Whether it's that Regulation H was less popular or it's just the late-gen burnout, it sounds like Regulation G is getting more discussion despite this just being a retread of an old meta. Feel free to ask questions on placements as it's certainly possible that meta opinions have already changed from what this list suggested 4 months ago.
Why is Lunala ranked so high, if you don't mind me asking? It's definitely a useable Pokemon but unlike Kyogre and Eternatus, who both have very defined roles in the meta, Lunala seems to just be Calyrex-lite. It has defensive merit with Shadow Shield, but struggles a lot from the abundance of Caly-S and every team basically needing a Caly-S answer making it a massive tera hog since unlike Caly it doesn't have the speed to simply remove problematic Pokemon before they can become threats to it (unless you run Agility, which is a meme set and requires significant support). It also suffers hard from four moveslot syndrome where it needs to be running Moonblast to not be completely walled by Dark types and would generally like Calm Mind, but that means it either has to completely sacrifice a STAB attack or forgo running Moonlight which renders its defensive properties pretty useless. I would advocate for moving it to B+ but honestly I would say that Kyu-B has a greater meta presence with its ability to act as a pseudo Koraidon and snowball with Scale Shot, so maybe plain ol' B?
I'm not super familiar with the Japanese side of the meta so if Lunala has had good showings there it makes sense but in my personal experience it isn't great.
I'd also maybe suggest Archaludon moving from A+ to S-. Everyone has said their piece about it in previous Regs but the sheer number of effective sets it can run makes it a massive nuisance on team preview being both one of the meta's best physical walls, with sets able to check all of the Ogerpon forms, Dragonite, Chien-Pao, Caly-Ice, Koraidon, and at the very worst forcing tera on Zacian, and a capable bulky sweeper that can deal with special threats with Mirror Coat. Caly-S for example can deal with a Stamina set, but loses to AV Mirror Coat, but then takes the risk of being T-Waved or having its Sash broken if it tries to play around that. Having a Arch in the back also puts a lot of pressure on sweepers to not click weaker set up moves like Flame Charge/Trailblaze and Scale Shot in fear of giving it a head start with Stamina. That's on top of having several viable tera types that can turn even winning matchups into a guessing game of what type it'll become, or if it will tera at all. I wouldn't say it's as good as DNite but it definitely has a foot in the race (or a weird stubby bridge leg thing, at least).
I'm not super familiar with the Japanese side of the meta so if Lunala has had good showings there it makes sense but in my personal experience it isn't great.
I'd also maybe suggest Archaludon moving from A+ to S-. Everyone has said their piece about it in previous Regs but the sheer number of effective sets it can run makes it a massive nuisance on team preview being both one of the meta's best physical walls, with sets able to check all of the Ogerpon forms, Dragonite, Chien-Pao, Caly-Ice, Koraidon, and at the very worst forcing tera on Zacian, and a capable bulky sweeper that can deal with special threats with Mirror Coat. Caly-S for example can deal with a Stamina set, but loses to AV Mirror Coat, but then takes the risk of being T-Waved or having its Sash broken if it tries to play around that. Having a Arch in the back also puts a lot of pressure on sweepers to not click weaker set up moves like Flame Charge/Trailblaze and Scale Shot in fear of giving it a head start with Stamina. That's on top of having several viable tera types that can turn even winning matchups into a guessing game of what type it'll become, or if it will tera at all. I wouldn't say it's as good as DNite but it definitely has a foot in the race (or a weird stubby bridge leg thing, at least).
Lunala can do a lot more than just be “Calyrex at home,” defensive sets can be a massive nuisance for a lot of pokes, it can abuse Koraidon’s sun with moonlight to recover off pretty much all damage it deals and regain shadow shield, you can pair this with an item like Kee Berry to make a very potent end game wincon.
Offensive sets also have merit, moongeist beam has a built in mold breaker effect, meaning it is unbothered by stuff like Mimikyu, Garganacl, and any sturdy shenanagins opponents might use to snipe Calyrex. Lunala also has a wide array of support moves allowing it to facilitate a sweep from one of the many non restricted powerhouses such as Dragonite or the aforementioned Archaludon.
You’re correct in generally saying Calyrex is better in a vacuum, hence why it’s ranked higher, but Lunala has a few tricks up its sleeve that make it much better than one would assume at first glance.
Yea, all that and also hypnosis. 60% isn't great but it can be op cause it's a lot more than 50...and then there's blunder policy(not sure agility is a thing with this gen.)
My friend really likes and wins with lunala, so I wasn't gonna pick on it even though I was semi curious.
My area of concern is not even with the restricted here ATM, but rather hippo. Why is it with ting lu in rank? It's great(supposedly...I never went anywhere with it, though do well enough with ting,) but I'd say inferior. Those ruin abilities are ridiculous. Esp for ting in a specially dominant(90% sure, cuz mir, caly, bm, etc) meta. I guess you don't see as much annihilape to stop yawn cycles but...idk if that's that meaningful. Ting lu might have a tiny bit less atk and I think spe, but it's bulkier on both sides, which is more for the role. Hippo typically doesn't slack off, so that's not a selling point for it either.
Edit: all that to say, I'd like hippo that drop, but first I'm asking if it should.
My friend really likes and wins with lunala, so I wasn't gonna pick on it even though I was semi curious.
My area of concern is not even with the restricted here ATM, but rather hippo. Why is it with ting lu in rank? It's great(supposedly...I never went anywhere with it, though do well enough with ting,) but I'd say inferior. Those ruin abilities are ridiculous. Esp for ting in a specially dominant(90% sure, cuz mir, caly, bm, etc) meta. I guess you don't see as much annihilape to stop yawn cycles but...idk if that's that meaningful. Ting lu might have a tiny bit less atk and I think spe, but it's bulkier on both sides, which is more for the role. Hippo typically doesn't slack off, so that's not a selling point for it either.
Edit: all that to say, I'd like hippo that drop, but first I'm asking if it should.
I don’t believe it should. Hippowdon is probably the single sturdiest check to koraidon given that it removes the sun that plays a big role in making it so dangerous, isn’t weak to any of Koraidon’s common moves, and has recovery in slack off to continue to check it through a game. It is a very viable alternative to ting lu, and can in fact be used alongside something like assault vest ting.