Sylveon

Chillarmy

Chillarmy

Overview
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  • Cutest mon introduced in XY
  • May face competition for its cuteness with the likes Zygarde, Dedenne, and Bunnelby
  • Very good support movepool
  • Nice defensive stat spread
  • Pixilate
  • Fairy typing
  • Pretty slow
  • Protect nerf makes Roar / WW an effective stop to Sylveon
  • Needs Defense investment to utilize Fairy typing (needs to take coverage moves)
  • Still slightly more physically bulky than Florgarbage
  • Passes bigger Wishes too
  • It's not complete setup fodder, unlike its comp (Clefable, Togekiss, Florges)
  • More special bulk than Clefable; bigger wishes / stronger than Florges / not weak to SR
Wish Support
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name: Wish Support
move 1: Wish
move 2: Protect
move 3: Hyper Voice
move 4: Heal Bell
ability: Pixilate
item: Leftovers
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 196 Def / 60 SpD

Moves
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  • What else would you expect from a not-Jolteon Eeveelution
  • Ok fine; Wish + Protect gives Sylveon somewhat reliable recovery
  • Do you really want your WishPasser to get crapped on by a random Toxic / stray Scald burn?
  • Heal Bell is also excellent for team support
  • Hyper Voice wards off things that it hits for neutral
  • Hits through subs, too
  • Some NVE targets like Skarm and Mega Mawile will get dented
Set Details
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  • 394 HP + 311 Special Defense always avoids the 2HKO from max (AV) Goodra's Sludge Wave after SR
  • Yawn + hazards
  • Toxic [is the worst option and there are plenty of good moves to choose from]
Usage Tips
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  • Keep it healthy
  • Mostly use Wish as a 'cushion' for getting something in
  • Try not to rely on Sylveon too much vs stall (Wish's PP will deplete fast)
  • Don't overuse Heal Bell
Team Options
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  • Stall appreciates it and vice versa
  • Would like something capable of pressuring common phazers (Skarm, Hippo, Tran, etc)
  • Run a team capable of maintaining solid offensive momentum (BO + VoltTurn or something; you know, don't rely on Sylveon too much)
  • Something capable of tangoing with the many Steel- and Fire-types that are just eager to switch into Sylveon
  • Heatran, Nattorei, Skarm, Jellicent, Volcarona, etc (pretty much anything that discourages the use of Steel STAB / setting up)
  • Pack a second user of Heal Bell
Calm Mind
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name: Calm Mind
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Hyper Voice
move 3: Shadow Ball / Psyshock
move 4: Wish / Baton Pass
ability: Pixilate
item: Leftovers
nature: Bold
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD

Moves
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Set Details
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Usage Tips
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Team Options
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Other Options
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  • Baby-doll Eyes
  • Specially defensive spread
  • Other stat-lowering moves (Charm, Fake Tears, Tickle)
  • Dual screens
  • Stored Power + CM
  • Echoed Voice
  • Refresh
  • Don't use Draining Kiss
  • Don't use physical Sylveon
Checks & Counters
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  • Heatran (Roar, Taunt, Toxic, double resists HV)
  • Steels in general that aren't Lucario (Scizor can force Sylveon out and maintain momentum with U-turn)
  • Most Poison-types (Mega Venu, Crobat, Tentacruel, etc)
  • Watch out for [coverage attack]
  • Roar / WW screws up WishPassing / CM
  • Specially defensive Hippo / Skarm
  • Offensive pressure (don't give it a chance to Wish)
  • General tip: Fightingmons / Dragons with Poison Jab, Iron Head, etc can smash through Fairies
 
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Very good support movepool
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Overstatement. Sylveon's support movepool is not that expansive, just wish+heal bell+dual screens+yawn.

General tip: Fightingmons / Dragons with Poison Jab, Iron Head, etc can smash through Fairies
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Again, overstatement. Especially since dragons running poison jab and iron head are pretty rare because they generally have better options.
 
Offensive steel types such as excadrill, lucario, scizor, and genesect are pretty common switch ins to sylveon that seek to demolish it with their steel STAB. Id say advise in team options to keep a good switch in to these pokemon.
 
6feetunder-I wouldn't call either of those overstatements. Possessing Wish + Heal Bell alone is enough to consider a support movepool "very good", IMO at least; the Pokemon in question is capable of keeping a team healthy on its own, which isn't a common feat. Labeling Sylveon's movepool as "incredible", or "massive" would be much closer to an overstatement than what the overview is depicting, which isn't the case. That said, I won't oversell Sylveon's movepool in the actual write-up, so no need to worry about that.

As for the latter, well, it's at the very end of CC, which is generally where the more obscure, but at least somewhat relevant threats go. While Dragons and Fighting-types DO have better options, it's not unheard of (or unseen!) for them to run something specifically for Fairies.

porky-Thank you! I aim to have this skeleton done by tomorrow, and definitely appreciate any suggestions to fill it up :D
 
Chillarmy said:
As for the latter, well, it's at the very end of CC, which is generally where the more obscure, but at least somewhat relevant threats go. While Dragons and Fighting-types DO have better options, it's not unheard of (or unseen!) for them to run something specifically for Fairies.
Click to expand...

That doesn't make them checks or counters. For instance, adamant Haxorus only does 50.2 - 59.3% with poison jab while Sylveon OHKOs.
 
CC is generally reserved for anything that could quickly become a threat. Wouldn't you agree that an odd, but usable coverage move is something that Sylveon (anything, really) has to watch out for? I mean, I certainly wouldn't want to be left in the dark about something that denies the basic principles of this game (e.g, HP Ground Jirachi); in this particular case, a Dragon or Fighting-type being capable of breaking Fairies is something that can swiftly put an end to Sylveon if the player using it isn't careful.

Also, Haxorus is likely to have boosted beforehand or predicted the Sylveon switch-in with Poison Jab (though, this isn't the best example, as +2 Earthquake (SD) already does mad crazy work to Sylveon). Maybe redo that calc taking other factors into account?
 
Chillarmy said:
Also, Haxorus is likely to have boosted beforehand or predicted the Sylveon switch-in with Poison Jab (though, this isn't the best example, as +2 Earthquake (SD) already does mad crazy work to Sylveon). Maybe redo that calc taking other factors into account?
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This scenario implies that Sylveon is the one trying to check Haxorus, not the other way around.
 
Remove Sylveon in the cutest Pokemon introduced etc.

That clearly goes to Dedenne, no questions asked.
 
6feetunder said:
This scenario implies that Sylveon is the one trying to check Haxorus, not the other way around.
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I never said that the latter was the case. Haxorus isn't likely to be spamming its Dragon STAB without having some kind of boost backing it; and if it does, so what? Physically defensive Sylveon gets 2HKOed by an odd coverage move, and that's enough to place it in a pretty poor position. I'm only trying to support the possibility of could-be fodder for Sylveon packing something with enough oomph to prevent Sylveon from doing its intended task. If Haxorus, Garchomp, Roobushin, etc can effectively bait out and curbstomp Fairies, then that makes them possible threats to Sylveon. They deserve at least some kind of mention in this analysis, and CC is the best place, IMO at least.

Also Dedenne is too fat to be cute >=[
 
I'd think if Sylveon is running any HP, it'd be ground as a means of checking the steel and poison switch ins she attracts as well as nailing heatran really hard.
 
Chillarmy said:
I never said that the latter was the case. Haxorus isn't likely to be spamming its Dragon STAB without having some kind of boost backing it; and if it does, so what? Physically defensive Sylveon gets 2HKOed by an odd coverage move, and that's enough to place it in a pretty poor position. I'm only trying to support the possibility of could-be fodder for Sylveon packing something with enough oomph to prevent Sylveon from doing its intended task. If Haxorus, Garchomp, Roobushin, etc can effectively bait out and curbstomp Fairies, then that makes them possible threats to Sylveon. They deserve at least some kind of mention in this analysis, and CC is the best place, IMO at least.
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Again, you are seriously overstating the effectiveness of fighting/dragon mons with poison/steel coverage. Carrying super-effective coverage moves =/= curbstomping. Poison jab Conkeldurr is not a Sylveon check any more than HP fire Rotom-W is a Ferrothorn check. For one thing, Conkeldurr is slower than Sylveon, so it will be crapped on before it can actually do anything.

And I know I already said this, but the majority of dragons have no business running poison and steel moves, and most of the ones that do (such as Goodra or Hydreigon) have bad matchups vs. Sylveon regardless.

EDIT: On a different note, about the wish set's EV spread, Sylveon only needs 44 EVs in spdef to avoid the 2HKO from Goodra's sludge wave after SR and lefties.

252+ SpA Goodra Sludge Wave vs. 252 HP / 44 SpD Sylveon: 156-184 (39.5 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
 
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Semi-Offensive Calm Mind sets with Fairies should always use Fairy-type STAB and Shadow Ball*.

*Unless you're Togekiss then Flamethrower or Aura Sphere works.
 
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