Serious Teacher loses appeal to return to teaching because of history in pornography

jrrrrrrr

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Also, do you consider yourself defiled for having sucked a few dicks, or does the defiling only happen when you accept money for it for a few months of your life and film it? Because that's essentially the only difference between the two of you. She got paid, you didn't.
She also made it public forever by posting it online for money, and she's now complaining about how the public is treating her. Pretty big difference that you guys conveniently keep ignoring. My support of her firing has nothing to do with sex or morality. I support her not being a teacher because it's 100% inarguably impossible to teach kids when they are watching you have sex in class. I seriously don't understand how I can make this any clearer. Maybe bold will help.

Seriously, outside of Logan, you're the most blatantly misogynistic poster in this thread... your "you have to pick a wife out of this generation" is incredibly reminiscent of his comments about how women who have had a lot of sex are less valuable to men. Classy.
...
no, I wouldn't encourage anyone in my life to get into porn.
Do you people really not understand the hypocrisy in these two statements being back-to-back in all of your posts? Everyone telling me how awful I am to suggest that a porn star is not the best source of guidance would never encourage their own family to do a porn. I wonder why that is!

But I guess you're taking your arguments from Logan here. "Once a whore, always a whore", right?
Like I said before, I don't hear her complaining about the royalty checks she's going to get from this popularity spike.

Youre completely ignoring the people's REASONING for saying they wouldnt encourage their family to do porn. Theyre saying theyre afraid of the industry first and foremost. It has nothing to do with societal pressures from sexist douche bags like jrrrrr
They should be afraid of the porn industry. That's my entire point. Kids should not be learning that the porn industry is a stepping stone to a career from their middle school teacher. There is no societal or moral pressure here, it is a terrible idea to do porn and kids should not be paid with our tax money to be taught that it's a good idea. You accuse me of ignoring people, but you can't even grasp the most basic concepts from my post. I don't care that women and men do porn. I don't care that they make money from it. I care that you are all trying to convince me that my kid should be watching their teacher have sex in class and see it as a success story and not a distraction.

I guess I'm still in it to show that he's just another example of someone who says he likes freedom, but it turns out that just means freedom of attitude and/or freedom for just him and people he likes.
Also I kept wanting to answer his question but the rest of his posts were just so incredible I wasn't sure I wanted to dignify that with a response. Cshadow put it really well. The important thing is, I'd value honest dialogue over fear-mongering and forcing of opinion.
Guys, why are you still debating this. It's clear JRRRRRRRRRRR just has a pathological hatred of women and sexuality.
I have nothing else to add to this conversation other than the fact that jr is a judgmental fuckhead and having people like him in society makes me upset.
I disagree with you, so I must be a blind bigoted sexist! Classic. Newsflash: People can disagree with you and still have legitimate reasons for it. You have utterly failed to explain why anything I said is wrong other than "if you dont think its cool to have kids watching porn of their teacher, you must hate all women and want to keep their vaginas locked up until marriage!!" Somehow, capefeather has taken my comment that I don't think her teaching at the school is appropriate and turned me into a sexist female-enslaving pigman.

Men can do porn too, and I don't support a male pornstar being a role model for kids either. So you can all take your "j7r must hate women" theory elsewhere.
 
You're right, I don't know why people think you hate women. You hate people based on decisions they made. You've made that quite clear.
 

jrrrrrrr

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You're right, I don't know why people think you hate women. You hate people based on decisions they made. You've made that quite clear.
Is this meant as an insult? Are you really saying that people should not be judged by the content of their character displayed by the choices they make? How else do you decide to view someone? Of course I hate people based on decisions they've made. I also love people based on the decisions they've made. Why would any job ask for a resume if the choices you make didn't matter?

And for the record, since I know you'll take this out of context: I don't "hate" this woman. I think she should not be propped up as a role model for kids. It's fine that she does porn for money, it's not fine when she tries to pass off doing porn for money as a success story to kids while they watch her porn in class. If you can't understand the difference, that's on you.
 
it's not fine when she tries to pass off doing porn for money as a success story to kids while they watch her porn in class. If you can't understand the difference, that's on you.
I don't remember anyone saying she did this? In fact didn't the article make it quite clear that she was trying to keep this a secret, and wanted to make sure that absolutely no one knew about her past a porn star :I?

Also, out of curiosity, why do you dislike her decision so much? It's fair to say that the decisions people make in life are a great way to judge their character, so why aren't you judging her by her ambition to become a teacher despite the fact that she was a porn star at one point in her life? Doesn't the desire to become a teacher show that she's ambitious and wants to make a difference in children's live(s) the best way possible? Especially when you consider that she has openly admitted to regretting the decision(s) she made that made her a porn star?

Why do you choose only to judge her as a dick-sucking porn star, and not also as the ambitious middle school teacher?

Also; yes, everyone knowing about the sex video makes her job as a teacher more difficult. You talk about role models and making the best decision for the children, but at the end of the day, what did the decision the board made to fire her prove to the children? That sex is wrong and it's okay to discriminate against women because of it? Their are a million different ways to twist that, most of them end up in an extremely negative, sex-is-taboo-idea-promoting way.
 
This may be a novel concept to you, but a person is not equal to his/her actions. I suppose one could argue that a person is equal to the sum of his/her actions, but we literally know nothing else about her life, so that's out the window. You can judge - even condemn - a person's actions without judging the person. You've done the opposite. Not only are you condemning this person, but you've also gone so far as to make shit up about her and the story overall to justify it.
 
I personally prefer to be paid for money. Or at least paid money. Wait. :evan:
I posted that at 4am and I was half asleep, I'm surprised that it was even remotely coherent. I think you know what I meant, but just in case, I meant I don't like the ideal of getting paid for sex, even if it's legal.
 

jrrrrrrr

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This may be a novel concept to you, but a person is not equal to his/her actions. You can judge - even condemn - a person's actions without judging the person. You've done the opposite. Not only are you condemning this person, but you've also gone so far as to make shit up about her and the story overall to justify it.
A person is absolutely equal to their actions. There is literally no other way for you to show your character other than the decisions you make. We can't read people's minds (yet) so the only thing we have to see what a person is made of is what they've done. If you're so confident that a person isn't the sum of their actions, go to a job interview without a resume and explain that.

I don't remember anyone saying she did this? In fact didn't the article make it quite clear that she was trying to keep this a secret, and wanted to make sure that absolutely no one knew about her past a porn star :I?
If you want to keep the fact that you were in a porn secret, you shouldn't be doing porn. The entire point of doing porn is to sell as many videos to as many people as possible. The fact that she was trying to keep it secret should tell you that she knows damn well that it's not appropriate. I wonder if she put that on her resume?

Why do you choose only to judge her as a dick-sucking porn star, and not also as the ambitious middle school teacher?
Great question. Thank you for actually engaging in a discussion instead of dismissing my posts as sexist even though being in porn has nothing to do with gender. I judge her as both. The porn star who thinks that is an appropriate segway into the field of childhood education. That ridiculous stretch of the imagination is what I have issue with.

what did the decision the board made to fire her prove to the children? That sex is wrong and it's okay to discriminate against women because of it? Their are a million different ways to twist that, most of them end up in an extremely negative, sex-is-taboo-idea-promoting way.
Another good question.

Once again, this has nothing to do with discrimination against women. The decision to do porn is equally bad for men, possibly even worse because men make way less money in porn with all the same risks. This decision by the school board teaches kids that you should not do porn if you want school-age children to take you seriously, a lesson that should have been crystal clear before this case anyways.
 
There's a huge number of jobs I would actively discourage my kids from getting into, engineering being a major one, any job involving janitorial work being another. But clearly, if you don't actively encourage people to do certain jobs, that means you look down on them and feel that they're terrible jobs and anyone who does them is a terrible role model for children. You got us, J7R! You're so smart, conveniently ignoring that she did NOTHING to inform people about her past (the judges actually saying she was 'deceitful' about her prior porn work, and her lawyer saying she was too embarrassed to tell anyone), and acting like we live on a planet where kids watching porn in class isn't completely inappropriate in a classroom and grounds for a detention at the very least, regardless of who is acting in it. Teach me how to call a woman's body defiled for fucking on camera and then claim that it has nothing to do with sexism, please! I think you forgot to say that you have female friends, though.

Ah, to live in a world where porn is simultaneously morally neutral yet doing it and then stopping doing it isn't a success story or, again, morally neutral, but a total negative because not doing something that would be considered "fine" or neutral is... bad? I don't get what you're trying to say here. You think porn is fine, but why is encouraging kids to do it bad, assuming anyone in the article referenced was actually doing that (did you even read it)? Why don't you tell us how you really feel? I'd really like to know how you answer this one. I'd also like to know why you consider her body defiled due to filming and/or getting paid for sex, as well. Maybe you could stop dodging the questions? Why would having to find a wife in the current generation would take a toll on your sanity, for that matter?

I'm guessing if she had been fired for being a lesbian or something that you'd also support that, since, you know, society's judgement is always the appropriate reaction, and dykes are just the worst role model for children despite homosexuality being morally neutral, right?

Also, you keep on bringing up royalty payments... that's not usually how porn stars are paid, I believe. Pretty sure it's by scene. She doesn't get any benefit from people watching her videos now, and quite frankly, wouldn't even if no one had watched the shit she already did.
 
A person is absolutely equal to their actions. There is literally no other way for you to show your character other than the decisions you make. We can't read people's minds (yet) so the only thing we have to see what a person is made of is what they've done.
I don't disagree~

The fact that she was trying to keep it secret should tell you that she knows damn well that it's not appropriate. I wonder if she put that on her resume?
It's more likely that she was afraid of how people would treat her after they found out. Honestly, I'd expect more people on this forum to sympathize with her in that respect. It's kind of saddening that more people don't, and haven't focused more on this point than anything else. Surprise: Whether it's right or wrong, illegal or legal, society is going to harshly criticize, chastise, discriminate and act out against anybody that "goes against" what the majority feel is "appropriate". I know you don't want to argue this from a standpoint of morality, but as soon as you throw around the word(s) "appropriate" or "inappropriate", it becomes easier to sneak in (or interpret that as) "right" or "wrong".

Then the argument falls apart, and is unmasked as "It is wrong for a porn star to teach children because porn is wrong". If you honestly feel that the firing was justified solely because (whether you feel this is right or wrong is irrelevant) being a porn star is too much of a distraction for middle school students to handle, then please stick to that. Do not throw around words like "appropriate" or "inappropriate" unless you feel you can handle arguing why porn is "morally wrong", because that is what it will become.

Ideally, she'd tell everyone else to go suck a dick [with instructions on just how to please your man the best way possible ;)] and continue on her merry way, teaching the middle schoolers about earth science and sex ed, but instead she has to deal with a faculty that would rather gossip and get her fired than reprimand the students who:

a) are watching porn in class
b) etched profanity on her classroom window
c) are being disruptive in general

Because they aren't mature enough to handle it.

But really, I'm not expecting them to be! Ideally, though, she would have kept her job. Why? Because this is the exact kind of thing that helps people grow the fuck up and builds character.

But that's okay! We should keep the gays out of school now. How will students be able to focus while they're thinking about how their teacher puts it up another dude's butts? How could we possibly let someone in school that would corrupt our children into thinking that it's okay to be gay! They'll end up recruiting them because that's how it works! And let's not even get into how offensive it is to my religion to have a gay man teach my children.

Great question. Thank you for actually engaging in a discussion instead of dismissing my posts as sexist even though being in porn has nothing to do with gender. I judge her as both. The porn star who thinks that is an appropriate segway into the field of childhood education. That ridiculous stretch of the imagination is what I have issue with.
Be honest - what else was she supposed to do with her life? Not follow the career path of her choice? I mean, it's not like she spent years getting educated and qualified to do it after all.

This decision by the school board teaches kids that you should not do porn if you want school-age children to take you seriously, a lesson that should have been crystal clear before this case anyways.
The problem with this logic is that it basically reaffirms society's view on porn and porn stars - that it's bad, that they shouldn't be taken seriously, and that they'll never amount to anything else because we won't let them take a job that will let them make a significant contribution to society.
 

jrrrrrrr

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Let me summarize:

1) This person was deceitful in their application
2) This person has a history of bad decision-making
3) I am a terrible ignorant person for thinking that this person should not be given my tax dollars to teach children

Teach me how to call a woman's body defiled for fucking on camera and then claim that it has nothing to do with sexism, please! I think you forgot to say that you have female friends, though.
YOU DONT HAVE TO BE A WOMAN TO BE IN PORN. BEING IN PORN HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH GENDER. The bold obviously didn't work, how about caps? The fact that you people are STILL saying that my argument has basis in sexism is making my head explode. It's time you people learned how to read other people's arguments on their own, rather than trying to figure out which "-ism" seems most relevant so you can dismiss entire posts.

You think porn is fine, but why is encouraging kids to do it bad, assuming anyone in the article referenced was actually doing that (did you even read it)? Why don't you tell us how you really feel? I'd really like to know how you answer this one. I'd also like to know why you consider her body defiled due to filming and/or getting paid for sex, as well. Maybe you could stop dodging the questions?
I haven't dodged a single question in this discussion. I have said how I really feel many times. Sex isn't bad. You can have sex, you can have sex for money. But don't tell me that you're a success because you used to have sex for money and now you don't. And about the "defiled" comment, you can answer it yourself: how would you feel if your wife told you she was in porn recently before she met you? Would you praise her for being so progressive? Probably not.

I'm guessing if she had been fired for being a lesbian or something that you'd also support that, since, you know, society's judgement is always the appropriate reaction, and dykes are just the worst role model for children despite homosexuality being morally neutral, right?
If someone made a video of themselves being a "dyke", sold that video for money to the public, and had kids watching it in class, while taking my tax dollars as wages after being deceitful on their application...then yes, I would 100% support that firing.
 

TheValkyries

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I judge her as both. The porn star who thinks that is an appropriate segway into the field of childhood education. That ridiculous stretch of the imagination is what I have issue with.
Why is that a ridiculous stretch of the imagination to go from one profession to a vastly different one? People do it all the time. What is it in this specific instance that makes this so completely unacceptable.

P.S. Teachers are not paid to be role models. They're paid to educate first and foremost, and if it all, be a role model through their professionalism, and actions in the classroom, not for who they are as a person. This is important because, If a teacher isn't in the classroom, they are not binded to be stunningly pristine, as much as they are expected to be by ill-informed parents. Teachers ARE in fact allowed to do whatever they want as long as it is within the bounds of the law.


This decision by the school board teaches kids that you should not do porn if you want school-age children to take you seriously, a lesson that should have been crystal clear before this case anyways.
I know that this will only be anecdotal evidence, but I really want people to get a perspective here about how these classes went.

I had Ms. Halas in 9th Grade, in my first semester of High School for Geoscience. After making a few friends in the class we would talk, and one day one of the guy's just mentioned offhand how hot Ms. Halas was. My best friend at the time said, "Yeah, dude, she used to be a porn star." We took this with a lot of skepticism, and he insisted that she was, and that his older sister was friends with the guy who found the videos and that she went under the name Tiffany Six. We all went home google searched that shit, and found it was true. Our teacher was in fact a former porn actress. This information spread quickly through our class, and through other older siblings to all of her other classes. This apparently had been a known fact by the students at my High School for quite a while.

From that point on, can you guess what happened? Nothing. No one gave a shit. It was tossed around as gossip and always ended with "Woah dude, that's so crazy." And then we'd go to her class, and learn about the difference between igneous and metamorphic rocks and erosion and blah, blah, blah. In reality, we never really knew her as Tiffany Six from the videos even though we saw them with our own eyes. We knew her as Ms. Halas, Geoscience teacher. It just happened to be a "fun fact", or interesting gossipy tidbit, that she formerly was a porn star, but this was not something that changed our viewpoint from her as a person. She was always our teacher first.

I do recall one incident where it came up in a negative way. My best friend was admittedly kind of an immature dick, and when she asked a general question to the class, he answered, neither loudly nor quite softly, "Yes, Tiffany". Maybe she heard him and ignored him, or maybe she didn't hear him at all. All I know is the reaction of the people who did hear it, the students around him. Amidst many glares, "Shut the fuck up, Brendon." The class as a whole disdained the very impunity of the statement, and thought his act of disrespect was more vulgar than her past actions.

Hey, maybe my class was the exception? Maybe it really is impossible for most kids that age to not act maturely in that situation. But frankly, I doubt it, and I doubt it heavily.
 
But don't tell me that you're a success because you used to have sex for money and now you don't
If someone made a video of themselves being a "dyke", sold that video for money to the public, and had kids watching it in class
Oh my god i swear to everything that is high and mighty in this world that if you make this assumption seriously one more god damn time even though she has NEVER EVER EVER claimed to be a success for being in porn I will go on a rant so vile and vulgar that I will get the banhammer on this forum so hard (or maybe not because everyone will actually agree with what I'm saying!!!). I absolutely can not take your unending stupidity that is constantly being addressed and shot down by the intelligent, respectable members of this forum anymore it is literally breaking down the walls of logic at this point.
 

Texas Cloverleaf

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15:50 Texas jrrrr I highly disagree with your position regarding Ms. halas
15:51 jrrrr thats fine, i expect people to disagree with me on some things
15:52 jrrrr i just find it really odd that people are seriously looking at a pornstar as a progressive beacon of morality
15:52 Texas I find it difficult to believe that you view her as a porn actress

15:53 jrrrr sorry, former porn actress. either way, the connection is being made by the kids and its not conducive to teaching
15:54 jrrrr easier than trying to convince an entire generation of kids that porn should be seen as a stepping stone to a career but if your spouse gets mad, they are sexist bigots
15:54 jrrrr etc
15:54 jrrrr she also lied on her application
15:54 Texas I've found that your posts seem to be distinctly vehement enough to consistently incite distinct anger in me which makes it difficult to comprehend and respond to your points
15:54 jrrrr the judge called her deceitful lol
15:54 Texas also jrrrr, i didnt see that, how did she lie on her application?
15:55 Texas did she just not list the former employment?
15:55 jrrrr im not sure 100% but the judge in the case said she was being deceitful about her former employment
15:55 jrrrr which means she either lied on the application or after it was discovered
15:55 Texas well its just cause iirc the story said she worked in the adult industry ~7 years ago
15:56 Texas so its no unreasonable to expect it might no longer be recent, relevant work informaiton
15:56 jrrrr its easy to support morally questionable people teaching when you dont realize that youre paying them with money taken out of all of your paychecks and everything you buy
15:56 Texas except that
15:56 Texas I dont consider her a morally questinable person
15:57 Texas for once having worked in a morally questionable industry

15:57 jrrrr thats a legitimate disagreement that i'd like to see in the responses to my posts, rather than WHY DO YOU HATE WOMEN???
15:57 jrrrr or my personal favorite "how can you judge a person by their actions?"
15:58 Texas that particular question is only silly in the scope in which its presented
15:58 Texas if it were worded say
15:58 Texas how can you judge the entirety of a person's actions based on one relatively small facet of their life
15:58 Texas it would be more relevant

After a comment about homosexuality

16:01 jrrrr if the teacher is involved in sexuality being brought into the classroom, thats inappropriate
16:02 jrrrr whether they are telling kids about their own sexuality or they are the actual subject of the discussion
 
She also made it public forever by posting it online for money, and she's now complaining about how the public is treating her. Pretty big difference that you guys conveniently keep ignoring. My support of her firing has nothing to do with sex or morality. I support her not being a teacher because it's 100% inarguably impossible to teach kids when they are watching you have sex in class. I seriously don't understand how I can make this any clearer. Maybe bold will help.
wow, great backpedaling. do you think that your bolded comment is what i found to be so offensive? you've said a lot of really stupid and hateful shit that has absolutely nothing to do with that bolded statement.

also: 'it has nothing to do with morality!!! but she shouldnt be a role model because shes clearly an amoral/immoral person!!!' oh ok

Men can do porn too, and I don't support a male pornstar being a role model for kids either. So you can all take your "j7r must hate women" theory elsewhere.
uh its not a theory, it's pretty obvious. if you want to keep using loaded terms like 'defiled body' you should expect to get called a misogynist.
 
16:01 jrrrr if the teacher is involved in sexuality being brought into the classroom, thats inappropriate
16:02 jrrrr whether they are telling kids about their own sexuality or they are the actual subject of the discussion
Okay.

Don't take this the wrong way - I had initially brought up the homosexuality point as a way for you to put yourself in her shoes, and was hoping you'd directly respond to that. I suppose the post left something to be desired, though, as there wasn't as much content as there were sarcastic remarks and jabs.

So lets assume that everything in the story that had happened, happened instead to a gay man. He didn't bring it up - people just found out, like in the story. You know, gossipy school teachers, or maybe he visited a gay bar on his day off and a student's parent caught him walking out. Maybe he adopted kids and his son/daughter goes to the same school, made a few friends, and brought one of them over, only to discover he/she has two dads! You know, endless possibilities just because.

And then it happened.

For whatever reason, the student body knowing he's gay now makes it more difficult for him to be a teacher. The students become harder to control, and now he's finding profanity etched on the window of his classroom with students calling him "(BAN ME PLEASE)" or something else equally as offensive from the back of his classroom while he's trying to teach. A board of three judges has unanimously decided that, because of this, his homosexuality has impeded his ability to be an effective teacher and role model, and because of that, he is unfit to be a teacher.

I'm legitimately curious - how would you respond to this and why? Then, if for any reason should your reaction be different to that of how you responded to the firing of Ms. Halas, please explain why. What makes the two situations so different? Two "morally questionable" (I thought this had nothing to do with morality??) people were fired in these scenarios, but are your reactions and reasons for it being weighed differently? Why and why not?
 
the students and teacher both lose here, but it's really pretty obvious the teacher didn't instigate shit lol. it kind of depends on how accountable you think kids are capable of holding themselves, but boy if my parents found out i was ever disrespectful in class
 

jrrrrrrr

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Okay.I'm legitimately curious - how would you respond to this and why? Then, if for any reason should your reaction be different to that of how you responded to the firing of Ms. Halas, please explain why. What makes the two situations so different? Two "morally questionable" (I thought this had nothing to do with morality??) people were fired in these scenarios, but are your reactions and reasons for it being weighed differently? Why and why not?
Thanks once again for the excellent question and discussion.

I am using the word moral interchangeably and I shouldn't be. Good catch. When I say she is immoral, I mean that I would never encourage someone to take the same path as that person. Judging from many responses in this thread, I know I'm not the only one who would advise this woman differently. The morals that I think people are talking about involve sexual taboo and shunning things just because they used to be shunned. She is immoral (to me) because she has made bad life choices, not because sex is evil. Let me make my stance clear whether you want to use the word immoral or not. She made decisions in life that we all agree are bad, she chose to misrepresent her history and those decisions to her employer, that is not a person that I want to pay to teach my kids. That's what my point is. We are her employer and she lied.

And about the gay situation, if someone is doing something privately then it is their business. Porn is the opposite of that. The entire point of porn is to have as many eyes viewing it as possible. You don't get to change your mind about privacy once it's in the public eye. I would feel sympathy for the person who was exposed as gay, because it is something that should be private and they had their trust violated when it was exposed. But I do not feel sympathy for the porn star that wishes all of the tapes would just disappear and everyone would forget about it.

wow, great backpedaling. do you think that your bolded comment is what i found to be so offensive? you've said a lot of really stupid and hateful shit that has absolutely nothing to do with that bolded statement.

also: 'it has nothing to do with morality!!! but she shouldnt be a role model because shes clearly an amoral/immoral person!!!' oh ok
I'm not backpedaling, people are putting words in my mouth. I've listed many reasons why sex work is a bad idea for any man or woman, very few of which have to do with morality. I don't think she should be seen as a role model because I do not want children to mimic her decisions, as they almost always lead you to a worse position than you were before. It has nothing to do with a mystical undefined sense of morality.

uh its not a theory, it's pretty obvious. if you want to keep using loaded terms like 'defiled body' you should expect to get called a misogynist.
Men can't have their bodies defiled?
 
Been lurking this thread for a while, might as well chip in.

She is immoral (to me) because she has made bad life choices, not because sex is evil.
So anybody who makes a bad life choice is suddenly an immoral person? You're being ridiculous-I agree that decisions should have consequences, but at the same time society needs to have room to forgive past decisions. Everyone does stupid things in their life, and while it's fair to punish in the short term, in the long term forgiveness is important. That's one of the reasons why we have A. a statute of limitations and B. limits on prison terms. It's been over 5 years, when does she get to move on?

But I do not feel sympathy for the porn star that wishes all of the tapes would just disappear and everyone would forget about it.
She doesn't want the tapes to disappear. She wants to teach children, which is a perfectly respectable occupation. There is no evidence suggesting that she was an incompetent teacher until her porn history became public knowledge to the students and the other teachers, and from what the article said, it seemed as if they came upon it themselves (i.e she didn't intentionally reveal them)

If Halas is a competant teacher, let her teach. Starring in porn movies is NOT ILLEGAL and has nothing to do with her teaching ability.

I'm not backpedaling, people are putting words in my mouth.
Judging by what you said in this post, nobody is putting words in your mouth except you.
 
Men can't have their bodies defiled?
don't get cute, you know as well as i do how loaded that phrase is. 'white people can be thugs too, its not a loaded term!!!'

this is like those threads where its deck knight vs everybody, only difference being that hes actually skilled at handling himself in those situations.
 

Fishy

tits McGee (๑˃̵ᴗ˂̵)
well golly, if we're going to speak like "have you ever met a basic, stereotypical, completely bland and regurgitated idea of a human being before??" as the basis for imagining how and why ms. halas received the punishment that she did, we might as well analyze the other side of the table too.

i find it laughably naive that "a judge" or any goddamn person could truly think ms. halas omitting her prior porn history was her being deceitful. if you are 25 years old, have an established history/career at a former company, and are choosing to transfer to a different company that gladly accepts your current skill set, would you really feel it necessary to include in your resume that you flipped burgers for a summer at mcdonald's while you were in high school? no. that could be close to ten years ago, and such a tid-bit of "work experience" has absolutely no relevance in your current job venture. your employer knowing you could make a number 7 better than anyone would be as important as knowing you learned how to tie your shoes all by yourself.

the only reason she was colored as "deceitful" or truly felt embarrassment over her prior porn history is because of people like our knight in glistening moral armor, j7r. clearly, it does not matter how ms. halas viewed her momentary dip into the porn industry. clearly, her decision to dive into sucking dick for money is the single defining moment of her life, and the fact that she soared upward into a college education and reputable teaching career is completely invalidated because she didn't mind getting fucked on camera for money.

i have no idea what you have personally done with your life, j7r, to think yourself immeasurably more respectable and automatically a better role model than ms. halas because you would never allow your private sexual business to be filmed on camera, but i assume it's next to nothing. the glaring hole in your logic, and anyone else who believes ms. halas should have acted otherwise before she dropped her panties on set, is that you believe "society" is this giant entity of thought and morality that cannot, or will not change. society is a conglomeration of human beings, just like me, just like any of you, and your adamant belief that ms. halas is immoral, or, you know, a bad role model for making one bad(HOLY SHIT THOUGH, BAD IS SUBJECTIVE, JUST REMEMBER THIS FOR A SECOND) decision in her life, is ridiculous. utterly, insurmountably ridiculous.

j7r, it is painfully clear that you have an issue with other people enjoying/expressing their sexuality, or keeping it as private/public as they like, compared to your personal feelings on the matter. totally cool, home skillet. you raise your freak-flag high, or keep it tightly wound and bound, completely secret from the rest of us. regardless of how you manage your business, you have absolutely zero ground to judge someone else because they choose to manage their business otherwise. you don't judge ms. halas because she chose to make a bad decision involving sex? why are you clutching such a lie so tightly to your chest? you have gone back and forth with your wording and argument umpteen times, first claiming she's a person who lacks all self-respect, is an idiot for performing in porn, a no-good tramp who, should she have a definition in webster's dictionary, should be as far away from "role model" as possible.

then, annoyed that you're being labeled a misogynistic twat, you claim "but she was deceitful! she lied on her application! she did not relinquish the delicious, juicy gossip about her porn history! clearly, she is a human being that cannot accept her past decisions, and is not fit to teach young students! also, ignoring the fact she did porn at all, she lied to ME, her TAX PAYER, and considering money is the holy grail and i am her GOD, allowing her to SIP FROM THIS GRAIL, she is a bad person!!" forgive me for embellishing my interpretation of what you've said over and over again. say it a few more times, and you might as well own 50 cats and be talking to a corner in your basement.

society's biggest problem is that those who think contrarily to the norm are sooner taught to duck their heads and follow the herd than stand up for what they believe in, and act on their own beliefs and hearts. if i were your father, j7r, i would be ashamed to see your clear disdain for ms. halas, or a mr. halas, or anyone at all who was once involved in the porn industry. i would be baffled that my own son, a homosexual male, probably enduring his own hardships for something he cannot control (and wait right there, of course you can control your pornographic history……….) and being helplessly teased or demonized for it (because that is the reaction you cannot control, regardless of how you feel about your own sexuality. see the parallel?) would believe that ms. halas has any less ground or right to be a role model than you yourself do.

this isn't about porn being bad. this isn't about making bad decisions. this is a tale about one woman having every reason dug up from a bible, tabloid, or tv show from society for why she can never amount to anything other than being a porn star. this is about society's uncontrollable urge to be ashamed of their sexuality, however it may be expressed. if her students should be taught anything, it's to be proud of their past, no-fucking-matter-what, because it is only the present that ever matters. how they arrived, where they plan to go next, they are irrelevant. the present is now. her teaching career used to be now, until her gossiping coworkers and stigma-ridden society condemned her for acts she hadn't committed in seven years, with absolutely no regard for how their actions may affect her future.

if one day my 18 year old daughter takes me out to lunch and says "mom, I'm considering doing porn… what do you think?" I will probably be surprised. I'll probably wonder what's going on in her life that I may not know about, that leads her to consider starring in pornography for money. or, maybe it's pleasure? maybe she's a fucking nymphomaniac, and this is her idea of a profitable good time? if my daughter is honest with me about what she wants to do, then fine. go get it, girl. do what you want, JUST MAKE SURE:

1) you understand the risks, both emotional and physical.
2) you keep yourself safe, and have an exit strategy should you require one.

but that's basically it. my personal feelings may influence my children, but they will never, ever define them. so should society relinquish its inadvertent, awful hold on any singular human being who is inspired to act out against the norm.

ps: it dawned on me again after seeing the bolded, quoted part in ninahaza's post, that if you think starring in pornography is the "lowest line of work," then you are clinically retarded. oh yeah, getting a dick shoved in my vagina on camera is farrrrr worse than say, owning a company where immigrants are paid pennies to sew clothing for hours on end, or maybe slaughtering animals for the fur industry, or oh oh, having any part in illegal gun trafficking. i mean, fuck, let's just consider for a fact that there are countless other ILLEGAL occupations that people the world over profit from, but those are just nowhere near as bad as catching a cum shot on screen. holy shit, someone inform the president, pornography is literally the 7th level of hell caught on tape!
 

ryan

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I think the main issue with this is that this person, however an effective teacher she may have been, was still a porn star, and as a teacher, she needed to be an effective role model to her students. I am not trashing on porn stars by any means because it is an honest living, and I have no issue with them taking advantage of what they've been given in life. But ultimately, what kind of message does a past in pornography deliver to kids? That all of these things I am teaching you (that I am sure you don't want to be hearing anyways), do not in any way correlate to your chances of success in the future and that instead, your looks do? In addition to that, these are middle school kids, ffs. Once they hear that their teacher is in a porno, they're going to Google that shit so fast. And of course, knowing that their teacher was a porn star, they are going to spend class laughing and not paying attention. No matter how effective a teacher is, if their classroom is always going to be that disruptive (which it will be), not only are you not going to be able to teach the kids causing the issues, but you're not going to be able to teach the kids who actually care either.

I don't know. I feel bad for the teacher. I really do. But I also feel like a teacher should be held to higher standards than almost any other career. It sucks that her past decisions are coming back to bite her now, especially since I see nothing inherently wrong with them. But I think the final decision made was justified.
 
Ha popemobile, I know right? On a related note, I actually feel like the other teacher being forced on leave was more a more appropriate reaction than what happened to Halas, mostly because I feel like a teacher calling his/her underage students jailbait is... really fucking inappropriate. Posting semi-nude photos on an account you know your students are following probably isn't appropriate either, but mostly it's just the former that bothers me the most. Ugh. That being said, probably shows that teenagers aren't the horny, dehumanising arseholes that most of us want to make them out to be. If only people would learn from that example and someone would actually respond to the shit TheValkyries was saying!
 
I felt the biggest takeaway from the second article is that in the Halas case, most of the pressure is coming from the parents. Kids honestly don't really give a shit and I think that was probably just a made up reason to stop the parental pressure on the school.

Kids are still shitheads though, but for different reasons.

if one day my 18 year old daughter takes me out to lunch and says "mom, I'm considering doing porn… what do you think?" I will probably be surprised. I'll probably wonder what's going on in her life that I may not know about, that leads her to consider starring in pornography for money. or, maybe it's pleasure? maybe she's a fucking nymphomaniac, and this is her idea of a profitable good time? if my daughter is honest with me about what she wants to do, then fine. go get it, girl. do what you want, JUST MAKE SURE:

1) you understand the risks, both emotional and physical.
2) you keep yourself safe, and have an exit strategy should you require one.
yes I'm sure you know how you'll react to your theoretical 18 year old daughter when you're currently 22 years old and don't have any kids
 

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