Team Burning Mountain Forest [BULKY SUNNY GEN 5 OU RMT]

TEAM OVERVIEW
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For some reason, this team can't seem to decide whether it's good or bad. It just seems that its effectiveness fluctuates every day, even against the same opponents, and in both directions. I have too many Stealth Rock weaknesses in here, which is a problem, but I'm basically posting this so that I can get any real problems fixed up. It just seems that I hit a brick wall whenever I get close to a presentable ranking on the ladder.

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All changes will be italicized.

FULL TEAM ANALYSIS

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Ninetales @ Leftovers
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 96 SpD / 160 Spe
Timid Nature (+Spe, -Att)
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Flamethrower
- Will-O-Wisp
- Hypnosis

Ninetales brings in the sun, which can be a blessing or a curse, depending on the opponent. Ninetales can’t switch in constantly to being out the sun when I have a free turn because of Stealth Rock limiting its amount of switch-ins. To further cause issues, this Ninetales cannot take on Politoed, Tyranitar or Hippowdon 1-on-1 unless i gets lucky with status. What it actually manages to do is bring out the sun to remove Water weaknesses from the entire team. Double status cripples switch-ins unless Hypnosis misses (which happens quite often), and happens to be the best way to eliminate other auto-weathers. Sleep cripples Politoed, Burn cripples Hippowdon and Tyranitar. Unfortunately, it's still unable to take repeated Earthquakes/Stone Edges after burning the opponent. Its main issue is that Hypnosis rarely ever hits.

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Terrakion @ Balloon Ability: Justice Heart
EVs: 6 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SpA)
- Close Combat
- Rock Polish
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance

It's quick, powerful, and has a large amount of natural bulk. Terrakion uses the proper boosting move if it has the chance (It usually has an opening to use both once each) and hits hard, tearing holes in everything. Base 108 Speed allows it to move faster than many commonly-used Pokémon, but Rock Polish is still necessary to go faster than things holding Choice Scarves, opponents with Swift Swim, or simply opponents with naturally high Speed. Close Combat and Stone Edge put together has rather good coverage, leaving very few openings for most opponents.

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Forretress @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 6 Att / 252 Def
Impish Nature (+Def, -SpA)
- Payback
- Rapid Spin
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic Spikes

Forretress is there to use Rapid Spin to clear hazards and then proceed to set them up itself, along with Toxic Spikes. I can usually guarantee Stealth Rock and two layers of Toxic Spikes will go up when I use this, depending on the composition of the opponent's team. After I put the hazards up and clear the ones the opponent put up, I switch this out and keep it saved in reserve until my opponent puts more up (if he/she bothers to). Payback hits Ghosts who try to block Rapid Spin. The sun doesn't hurt Forretress because it's already double weak to Fire.

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Shaymin @ Miracle Seed
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 196 HP / 252 SpA / 60 Spe
Modest Nature (+SpA, -Att)
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Leech Seed
- Rest
- Seed Flare

Shaymin basically tries to use its bulk to survive while it fires off powerful Seed Flares at my opponents. Its usual chances to switch in are on obvious Ground attacks. While the ideal scenario would have Shaymin use Rest when low on health and switch out to end up fully recovered, it is typically my last Pokémon or doesn’t have a chance to heal in such a way due to not having the open turn or simply because it gets KO’d too quickly, or even because the Pokémon that ends up coming in after my KO deals more than half of its max HP as damage. Leech Seed forces many things that wall it to run away, giving me the chance to bring something else in. If the opponent doesn't switch and is using a special-based Pokemon that doesn't carry status, Volcarona can come in and set up with very little risk.

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Volcarona ♂ @ Leftovers
Ability: Flame Body
EVs: 248 HP / 10 SpA / 252 SpD
Modest Nature (+SpA, -Att)
- Bug Buzz
- Butterfly Dance
- Flamethrower
- Hidden Power [Rock]

Everyone seems to be using Volcarona offensively, which makes it even more of a shock when this comes in after my opponent has put their Stealth Rock up, and proceeds to wall their Water-type attacks, even in the Rain, after losing half of its health by just coming in. This Volcarona takes about 18% or so from most Water-type attackers, and some even allow me to get 6 Butterfly Dances up if the opponent isn’t smart enough. The only things killing this are Physical moves or Critical Hits, and only if the opponent is fast enough to outspeed or bulky enough to survive a hit. Other counters include Teasing Heart Encore and anything fact with Rock Slide or Stone Edge. HP is not maxed out in order to take a little less from Stealth Rock. Unfourtunately, most Pokémon that seem to be seeing major use are physical-based, and Volcarona can’t tank those hits, especially after losing half of its health from Stealth Rock. Also, getting status ailments when switching in cripples it and essentially turns it into setup fodder. Hidden Power Rock gets me neutral coverage on a variety of opponents that resist both STABs, such as Heatran.

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Blaziken ♂ @ Life Orb
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 6 HP / 252 Att / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature (+Att, -SpA)
- Flare Blitz
- Hi Jump Kick
- Protect
- Stone Edge

Blaziken’s uses are quite obvious, so I’ll just speak about the differences on mine. I use Protect to catch up to neutral base 120s and positive-natured base 100s. However, there are many things that are faster than that, and Blaziken can’t take a hit from any of them. Furthermore, Blaziken still loses if it is unable to get rid of any given opponent before they get a hit in. Blaziken is always a little short on either speed or power, but rarely both. Furthermore, every time it is used is rather suicidal due to the less-than-perfect accuracy of High Jump Kick and Stone Edge, along with the recoil of Flare Blitz. For opponents that are too fast, Blaziken can potentially handle it if Protect isn’t used during the turn the Pokémon is switched in. Due to this, Protect must be used at the proper time to work well.

Thanks in advance for any help with the team.
 
Hi user burnpsy, i may be new to this community but not the competitive metagame so i've decided to help you out to make your team more efficiently.

In order to make an effective team one always has to start with a basic team(such as your currently) and later on fix it by removing the 'problem' pokemons out of the team aka those who don't function so well in practice.

It appears that you prefer 'hyper offense' as style of play. Very important for a team like yours that is incredibly weak to SR, is to make sure that they don't come up in the first place.

In other words everything in your team has to be capable of defeating both Tyranitar and Nattorei the most prominent users of SR in order to be succesfull. That is why i would suggest to remove 'Metagross' from the team as that pokemon basically welcomes nattorei to come in and set up Stealth Rock in front of you. This is why i suggest you to run the standard CB Scizor set.

Sunlight does not bother Scizor much as it already is KO'd by any fire move without the boost in power but adds a very usefull water resist. Defeats SpecsLatios with remarkable ease through the use of Pursuit or U-turn. Your team really has trouble finding a safe switchin which is Scizor can provide with it's multiple resists and U-turn, not to mention that your team really needs priority to defeat really fast sweepers such as Terakion. Another massive advantage of Scizor in Sun is that it attracts Steel types that switch into U-turn which allows your fire pokemon to set up upon them for free!

Don't run Choice Spec's on Ninetales, despite it's offensively orientated stats it is unable to sweep very efficiently, hence the reason why it probably sucks for you now. Ninetales only purpose in your team is to stay alive and set up permanent sunlight to support your team, that's why i suggest running this set.
Ninetales@Leftovers
Nature: Timid
EVs.: 252 HP / 96 SpD / 160 Spe
move 1: Flamethrower
move 2: Will-O-Wisp
move 3: Hypnosis
move 4: Hidden Power Fighting

HP Fighting and WoW keeps Tyranitar at bay, Hypnosis and WoW can severely dent the effectiveness of your opponents team.

If you still need help for building your team don't hesitate to send me a VM, i'll be happy to help you out.

Good Luck!
 
While I agree with your suggestions overall, I have a few quick problems and nitpicks here. Seeing as I'm prone to writing walls of text when I'm not in a rush, I'll bold the key points:


  1. You made a logical guess in thinking that my preferred play-style was "Hyper Offense", but this is incorrect (though I suppose it's a bit difficult to pick up on what it is from the way this team is built). My preferred play-style is actually more along the lines of "Bulky Offense". If you closely examine some of my team members, you'll see that there are several team members that are either EV'd for bulk or have natural bulk. I usually try to have durable attacks with one or two quick Pokemon and things with priority attacks for when speed is necessary, but I had to somewhat mess with it in order to keep up with people, and it slowly became this. I'd honestly prefer to morph this back into something like that. The only time I was ever anything resembling a good player last gen was when I finally built a decent bulky offense team, meaning that I also happen to operate best with that kind of setup.
  2. You gave very good reasoning for replacing Metagross with Scizor, but I have a few issues with that. Scizor is good in here for all of the reasons you mentioned, but by replacing Metagross, I toss out my only Ground immunity. Ground is as popular an attacking type as it has ever been, and having only one resist for it isn't a good thing. I should note that this also leaves me with only one Rock resist, and it's the same Pokemon that would be my only Ground resistance as well. Remind me if I'm wrong, but both Ground and Rock are very popular attacking types, am I correct?
  3. Do you mind explaining how switching to Scizor beats Ferrothorn (Nattorei)? It seems to easily take a few hits from Shaymin's Earth Power, Galvantula's Bug Buzz, and Metagross' Earthquake without issue, so I don't get how Scizor can check it... Also, would a Rapid Spinner not be more efficient?
I'll change Ninetales immediately.
 
My preferred play-style is actually more along the lines of "Bulky Offense
That changes quite a lot of course, i didn't really care about ground immunities as Hyper offense rarely tends to switch out regardless. My only goal was to prevent Nattorei from comming in without receiving any punishment , which i believe was solved by using Scizor. Galvuntula could force through nattorei by spamming Bug Buzz thanks to his resists to both it's STAB moves, Shaymin appeared to be your lategame sweeper and at that point of the game SR is usually quite redundant.

Perhaps this set could prove to be a usefull replacement for Metagross?

Donphan@Leftovers
252HP, 252Def, 4spe
Impish
Earthquake
Rapid Spin
Stealth Rock
Odor Sleuth

This set gives you a rock resist, a spinner and a reliable user of SR at the same time. Thanks to permanent sunshine Donphan can easily take Boiling waters from incomming Burunguru allowing it to use the Odor Sleuth/ Rapid Spin combo for certain removal of Entry Hazards.

Currently Shaymin, your only ground resist, is running max speed. I've been wondering though, is this max speed really worth sacrificing power and bulk? The only (fairly, not as much as it used to be) common pokemon left between the 250-328 speed bracket is Heatran who always carries either Balloon or Choice Scarf both sets Shaymin can't beat regardless and Gliscor who can't touch Shaymin anyway. Also why run HP Ice if you can run HP Fire? Dragonite will survive a HP Ice regardless thanks to Multi-scale but HP Fire allows you to hit steels hard, just as hard as Earthpower does thanks to the permanent sunlight. Earthpower which is currently pretty useless can than be replaced by Leech seed to defeat Blissey, also if you predict something to switch in that Shaymin can't beat just use Leech Seed to annoye him =). Last but not least Life Orb severely dents Shaymin's natural bulk, Miracle Seed can grant nearly as much power and HP Fire will beat Steels regardless.
In other words, i'd suggest running the fellowing set

Shaymin@ Miracle Seed
252 Spatt, 196 HP, 60Spe
Modest Nature
Seed Flare
HP Fire
Rest
Leech Seed

With it's massive bulk Shaymin will serve as a much more reliable ground resist. 60Spe allows you to outspeed anything that has 250Spe or lower and the rest is bumped into Spatt and HP to emphase on it's roll of a tank(running a flower pokemon as a tank? oh the irony)

I'm not really sure about Galvantula, however you claim that you have a lot of succes with it so i'll leave it like that. Do note however that in sunlight Thunder will only have 65% accuracy, not to mention that it doesn't really 'belong' in a bulky offense team. I'd suggest playtesting a bit with your current team after having made the changes i suggest above and see if it still works. Otherwise you may try running a Balloon Terrakion instead who has the same speed stat, adds a ground/rock immunity, benefits from Sun and Sandstorm, hits even harder and can be quite bulky.

Good luck!
 
Tested and changed. I need a better spinner than Donphan, it seems. I have 2 Rock resistances already, so that's not an issue anymore.

But what do replace it with? Starmie? Claydol? Forretress? Tentacruel?

Aside from Donphan being countered too quickly and too often, the team works several times better than before. Thank you.
 
Tested and changed. I need a better spinner than Donphan, it seems. I have 2 Rock resistances already, so that's not an issue anymore.

But what do replace it with? Starmie? Claydol? Forretress? Tentacruel?
Now that you no longer need a Rock resist i'd recommand using Forretress instead. It's the only Rapid Spinner that can switch into Nattorei with remarkable ease and it has worked wonder for my team.

Forretress@Leftovers
252HP/252Def
Impish
Rapid Spin
Toxic Spikes
Payback
Stealth Rock

I'm glad your team is already working better now =)
 
This is good. No weakness appears more than twice in the entire team except for Flying, which is a rare attacking type to begin with.

In any case, Forretress as a whole works fine, but Paayback was rather useless. I'm thinking that it should have Gyro Ball/Spikes instead. Thoughts?

EDIT: Actually, nevermind. I understand why it has that now.
 
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