Teambuilding Frameworks

Anty

let's drop
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Another fwg core which i have used and have seen being used (i know Steeljackal<3 has used it):
+
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Ferrothorns weaknesses: fire (resisted by both), fight (resisted by azu)
rotom's weaknesses: rock (resisted by ferro), water (resisted by both)
Azumaril's weaknesses: poison (ferro is immune), electric (both resist), grass (both resist)
Firstly, this core doesn't share any weaknesses, so it is hard for one mon to break it (focus blast ludi somewhat although never seen) and this core also manages to resist every type apart from ghost (rotom deals with aegi and lum ferro deals with gengar). It is also great and stopping powerful threats like mega gardevior and mega gyarados

Although this core is very good, it receives competition from venutran style as this can crack easier vs offensive pressure from repeated hits. Mega venusaur can easily eat up neutral hits, recovery somewhat with giga drain and can put specific threats to sleep which threaten its team mates, whilst with these, you can simply protect + ko/sleep the threat. Also, i'm finding rotom-h to be the weak part of this core - will-o-wisp are predictable, and it doesn't like throwing overheats around trying to protect azu from grass types (as an example). Despite this, its defensive typing is invaluable for walling yzard and skymin (and even heat wave zapdos)

Otherwise this core is very solid and definitely deserves a mention as it barely prevents teambuilding (doesn't use a mega, can fit into semi room etc)

e: i know this is a core, but cores are something to build around (lame excuse ik)
 
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Laga

Forever Grande
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I'd like to quickly point out that the above two posts are cores, not frameworks. While they are very similar, there is actually an entire thread for posting strong 2- or 3-mon cores. Teambuilding frameworks are about listing things that certain team archetypes need (rain needs things to deal with Dragon-, Grass-, and Water-types by using specific type of mons outside of the main core).

Obviously FWG doesn't count as an archetype by itself, just a core that can go under one of: Bulky Offense, Heavy Offense, Trick Room, Weather, etc., which there again is an entire thread for.
 

Arcticblast

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Yesterday I queued a couple ladder matches while avoiding my homework and hit Benja299. The battle was fun (turn 1 Hydro miss messed things up though...) but what's interesting is that we were running almost identical Deoxys teams. I might make a post about Deoxys teams or even just hyper offense in the next day or so but I need a bigger sample size.

My team: Kangaskhan / Deoxys / Keldeo / Amoonguss / Rotom-H / Salamence
Benja's team: Kangaskhan / Deoxys-A / Keldeo / Amoonguss / Thundurus / Entei

EDIT:
KyleCole: char y / deo a / thundurus / salamence / terrakion / bisharp iirc [Laga's team]

@KyleCole: for what its worth, my deo team from months ago
@KyleCole: is kang / deo a/ togekiss / kyurem b / lando t / aegislash
 
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Yesterday I queued a couple ladder matches while avoiding my homework and hit Benja299. The battle was fun (turn 1 Hydro miss messed things up though...) but what's interesting is that we were running almost identical Deoxys teams. I might make a post about Deoxys teams or even just hyper offense in the next day or so but I need a bigger sample size.

My team: Kangaskhan / Deoxys / Keldeo / Amoonguss / Rotom-H / Salamence
Benja's team: Kangaskhan / Deoxys-A / Keldeo / Amoonguss / Thundurus / Entei
Yeah, that was a fun battle, and I had a good laugh about how similar our teams were. That said, I strongly agree with your idea to make a post about deoxys/hyper offense teams, because there seems to be a clear framework encompassing what works.
 

Electrolyte

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I'm curious about the actual utility of the FWG core itself; I find that the success of groups such as this is more due to the powerful Pokemon that carry these traits rather than the traits themselves. Fire / Water / Grass has subpar synergy (by themselves) both offensively and defensively, lacking resistances against the most prominent offensive types (get wrecked by Flying spam, Dragon spam, Fighting spam, Dark / Ghost spam.) Offensively, the most significant thing each type hits is just another type within the trio.

In my opinion, what REALLY makes the 'core' powerful is the Pokemon that fall under that appreciably broad definition. Many of the best Pokemon in the tier are already either Water-, Grass-, or Fire-type, and though I will not hesitate to point out that the three types each contribute to their owner's viability, their typing does not define them. Things like Heatran and Amoonguss are just naturally good, have great synergy because their roles can help a wide range of partners, and just happen to share a not-overly-significant amount of type coverage. Proof of this is found in the fact that very rarely do you find any single-typed Pokemon within FWG cores--alone, FWG is pretty lackluster, as I've proved above. What you need is an extra type (or three) to really patch things up, but when you get to that point, it's no longer "FWG"--it's really more like "3 all around good Pokemon that just happen to work well together." I mean, what exactly does FWG have over other type-based cores? Not much, sadly. Other type combinations can be listed that are very much more specifically synergetic. (Dark/Ghost, for example.)
 

Electrolyte

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While this is technically true, when you take into account what is actually used in the game, you find that FWG becomes much stronger.

The only relevant offensive pokemon using flying type attacks are shaymin sky and Talonflame, both of which lose to a member of FWG. Two of the most common fire types (Heatran and Rotom-Heat) also resist flying attacks so "Flying spam" isn't really a relevant concern.

Dragon spam is all but non-existant, Garchomp is largely outclassed by Landorus for EQ spam and isn't very common, further more almost all common water types (barring Rotom-Wash) can viably carry an Ice attack (politoed, Ludicolo, Gyarados, Keldeo). Latios and Hydreigon do not suffer the same quad weakness to ice, however they both primarily use Draco meteor for dragon STAB which isn't spammable, and I have never seen the two of them on the same team (I think lol).

Edit: forgot about cube, but cube doesn't usually carry dragon moves anyway

Fighting spam is taken care of by the common grass types like Shaymin, Amoonguss, Venusaur, and even Ferrothorn because you do not want to be physically hitting it. The only relevant special fighting attack is Secret Sword from Keldeo, but switching Keldeo Safely into Ferrothorn isn't a for sure thing and even then you'd better OHKO.

Dark spam I'll give you, but Ghost spam primarily is only coming from Gengar or Aegislash, Aegislash loses to Fire, and while Mega Gengar isn't frail, it certainly doesn't "eat up" many attacks.

So that being said, FWG in doubles is a lot more powerful than a typing chart would have you believe
But this logic is exactly what spurred me to make my post in the first place. Your Fighting-type counters all carry a secondary typing that is what enables them to counter the Fighting-types in the first place, and that type is not Grass. Neither Heatran nor Rotom-H can beat Flying-types without their other typings.

If you consider Amoonguss / Rotom-W / Heatran: I'd rather consider that as a Grass / (Levitating) Electric / Fire core than FWG; Rotom's resistances to Ice, Steel, and Fire are already better covered by Heatran (which by the way also very much relies on its Steel typing and ability.) For Steeljackal's core, it looks more like a Water / Steel / (Levitating) Fire core to me, as I could argue that Ferrothorn's Grass typing does not provide as many important benefits as its Steel typing does (and even if you don't agree, you would be very wrong to claim that its Grass typing is the major reason why it is present.) Because of Rotom-H's ability (remember, NOT its Fire typing,) the core does not have to worry about Ground, and with Azumarill's ability to turn the tide against Rain AND Rotom-H's secondary Electric typing, you're not as concerned about Water.

What I'm trying to say here is not that FWG is bad. What I'm saying is that it is not necessarily good and its presence just happens to be a coincidence derived from the naturally powerful nature of its Pokemon. Most of all, you shouldn't be building teams or creating frameworks around FWG (at least not any more than you should for other type-based cores) because in and of itself there is not much present in FWG until you add the other, just as important but less repetitive attributes--such as abilities and secondary typings, things your frameworks should really center around.
 
i dont know about water but fire and grass are definitely two types i add specifically for their fireness and grassness. Fire is the best type to counter the many strong Steels in the meta, such as Scizor and Mawile, and if you don't have one, you'll be hard pressed to handle them. It's also a decent switchin into Fairy-spam (though most fire-types being special hurts this somewhat) and for opposing Fire-types such as Charizard. And Grass-types are crucial for a couple reasons: Amoonguss switchins, Rotom-W killers (though Dragons can do this instead), and Landorus-T switchins. Water is the most dispensable of the FWG core but it still helps to round out the defensive core since you already need the other two types.
 

Arcticblast

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My team: Kangaskhan / Deoxys / Keldeo / Amoonguss / Rotom-H / Salamence
Benja's team: Kangaskhan / Deoxys-A / Keldeo / Amoonguss / Thundurus / Entei
Laga's team: Terrakion / Deoxys-A / Bisharp / Thundurus / Charizard Y / Salamence
Kyle's team: Kangaskhan / Deoxys-A / Togekiss / Kyurem-B / Landorus-T / Aegislash (note: much bulkier)

Still working on Deoxys offense over here. I haven't totally figured out, but what I do know is this:

- every team is built around Deoxys and an immediately threatening physical attacker
- - following this, every team has Pokemon dedicated to beating Landorus-T, be it by scaring it off the field or outright beating it
- every team has some method of outspeeding the other team - be it through Thunder Wave (primarily Thundurus), priority spam, or Scarf
- every team has at least one Pokemon dedicated to removing Steel-types (usually two)
- every team save Kyle's (which doesn't fit the mold in many ways) carries Quick Guard

My team: Kangaskhan / Deoxys / Keldeo / Amoonguss / Rotom-H / Salamence
Strong physical attacker - Kang
Quick Guard - Keldeo
Redirection - Amoonguss
Intimidate - Salamence
Fast Electric - Rotom-H (Scarf)
Fire - Rotom-H
Priority - Kang, Deoxys
Speed control -
Anti-Lando - SToss Kang, Keldeo, Rotom-H (Scarf), Salamence
Steel buster - Keldeo, Rotom-H
Anti-TR - Amoonguss, priority, Trick
Bulky pivot - Amoonguss

Benja's team: Kangaskhan / Deoxys-A / Keldeo / Amoonguss / Thundurus / Entei
Strong physical attacker - Kang
Quick Guard - Keldeo
Redirection - Amoonguss
Intimidate -
Fast Electric - Thundurus
Fire - Entei
Priority - Kang, Entei
Speed control - Thundurus
Anti-Lando - Keldeo, Thundurus?
Steel buster - Keldeo, Entei
Anti-TR - Amoongus, priority, Taunt
Bulky pivot - Amoonguss, Thundurus

Laga's team: Terrakion / Deoxys-A / Bisharp / Thundurus / Charizard Y / Salamence
Strong physical attacker - Terrakion
Quick Guard - Terrakion
Redirection -
Intimidate - Salamence
Fast Electric - Thundurus
Fire - Charizard
Priority - Bisharp
Speed control - Thundurus
Anti-Lando - Bisharp, Salamence
Steel buster - Terrakion, Zard
Anti-TR - Taunt
Bulky pivot - Thundurus

Kyle's team: Kangaskhan / Deoxys-A / Togekiss / Kyurem-B / Landorus-T / Aegislash
Strong physical attacker - Kang
Quick Guard -
Redirection - Togekiss
Intimidate - Lando-T
Fast Electric -
Fire -
Priority - Kang
Speed control - Togekiss
Anti-Lando - Sub Kyu-B
Steel buster - Lando-T
Anti-TR - Aegislash
Bulky pivot - Aegislash
 
Mega Gardevoir Team Framework
Edit: Added Mizuhime Gardevoir
KyleCole:

AuraRayquaza:

Pwnemon:

Shaian:

Mizuhime:


[01:11] %Arcticblast: Gardevoir / Scarf Lando-T / Hydreigon / Smogonburd / Scarf Rotom-W / Ferro

Team Roles
(Shaian's team doesn't fit the framwork in some ways but I did what I could, also Aura and I indepently made teams with the same 6 Pokemon although there are differences in every set)
1) Mega Gardevoir (2/5 carry Trick Room, 3/5 are 252/252 timid)
2) Fast Offensive Support (4/5 are Choice Scarf Landorus-T, 4/5 carry 1st Intimidate, 5/5 are Ground Immune)
3) Bulky Fire Type (2/4 carry Safety Goggles, 3/4 are Heatran, 2/4 are Substitute Heatran, Mizu uses Sash Inernape to always survive one hit)
4) Water Defensive Support (3/4 carry speed control, 2/4 reduce opponents Attack with Intimidate or Will-O-Wisp)
5) Kangaskhan Check/Counter (3/5 carry Intimidate + Fake Out, 5/5 are "Bulky Attackers")
6) Wild Card, 4/5 complete popular tri-core typing, 3/5 use Amoonguss
  • My team, Auras team, and Pwnemons team all carry double Intimidate, Gardevoir/Landorus-T/Amoonguss, a Pokemon that uses Substitute, and a Fire/Water/Grass core. Mizuhime alternatively uses the popular Fairy/Dragon/Steel core although Hydreigon and Aegislash synergise perfectly without Gardevoir.
  • My team, Auras team, Shaian's team, and Mizuhime's team all carry Fake Out
  • Every team except Mizuhimes carries some form of speed control with either Trick Room (Aura, Shaian, and Pwne) or Thunder Wave (Pwnemon and I). Overall, four teams are what I would consider "bulky offensive" teams with only 1 or 0 (in Shaian's case) member of each team dedicated to a purely defensive role.
    • Shaian and I use teams with 4/6 Pokemon carrying siginificant (128 or higher) HP invesment while Aura and Pwne each have 5 Pokemon that fit this description.
  • The top 3 teams all carry Amoonguss for its synergy with the popular FWGT (fire/water/grass/landorus-T) core and all use Ragepowder to partially support a Pokemon that has Substitute. Shaian's team is the only team that doesn't have a sub user. All substitute users have steel typing
  • Where the top 3 teams use Amoonguss, Shaian has opted to use Choice Scarf Zapdos as a measure to Check Landorus-T and Mizuhime has used Hydreigon for its synergy with Aegislash and Gardevoir
  • Aura and I are using the same 6 Pokemon, however notable differences include Safety Goggles on my Heatran where Aura has Leftys, my Landorus is Jolly where his is Adamant, my Rotom-Wash has Thunder Wave where his has Will-O-Wisp, and his Gardevoir carries Trick Room while mine has Thunderbolt.
Let's Talk Customization

gards.PNG

Other than 4th moveset choices and bulk investment, notable but slight differences between sets include Pwnemon opting for Psychic > Psyshock and Telepathy > Trace. While both Aura and Pwne opted to use Trick Room, Aura's Gardevoir is carrying Trick Room with max speed investment which is pretty cool. Shaian and I both opted for coverage moves, his being Hidden Power Ground to hit Heatran and mine being Thunderbolt because I was afraid of fighting a Choice Band Gyarados in BotW, my own Goggles Gyara somewhere down the line, and as a way to smash Talonflame switch ins. Also Tbolt is just unexpected :]. Shaian's EVs are all over the place but the general idea is an offensive enough Gardevoire with bulk to survive common hits that will Target it (LO Sucker Punch for example) where Pwne went straight into HP Investment and Aura and I aren't running any bulk.

Supporting Gardevoir and her horrible defensive bulk was a priority on each team, all carry Intimidate, Will-O-Wisp, or both; 2 teams also opted to straight up invest in bulk to patch up this problem at the source. All teams use Fake Out, Ragepowder, or both for redirection but this is most likely because those moves are just straight up good and less because we had Gardevoir in mind specifically.

Edit:
Mizuhime Gardevoir
Gardevoir @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Telepathy
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Ally Switch
- Protect

[01:11] %Arcticblast: Gard set is Timid with HP Ground and Telepathy


Typing Synergy
Because we all have pretty bulky teams, I figured it was worth including the typing synergy for the teams. I'll let the charts speak for themselves but it goes without saying that in most cases (the ghost weakness on 2 of the teams is the exception) Gardevoir in particular, and also her teammates all have their weaknesses pretty well covered. Shaian and Pwnemon have a much better matchup vs fighting offense than Aura and I, where we have better overall synergy. Mizuhime's team is not what I would consider "Bulky Offense" but note the synergy of the Dragon/Fairy/Steel core and how well Hydreislash works together. It also has a great matchup vs fighting offence.
syng.PNG

lordsquad.PNG

shane.PNG

mizu.PNG


Thanks to AuraRayquaza, Pwnemon, Shaian, and Mizuhime for sending me their teams
 
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shaian

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for what it's worth i have an updated one with scarfdoge, subtran and moltres that prolly fits that mold a bit better...
 

Bughouse

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I made a Mega Gard team for the No Protect minitour, so obviously it's not going to be PERFECT in matching this framework but it does pretty well.

It's:


Talonflame acts as my fast offensive support, boasting Tailwind and Quick Guard as well as priority Brave Birds.
Rotom-H was decently bulky and had some additional speed control in Electroweb. It also had Safety Goggles like others above.
Gyarados was a CB set, but still offered the first of my Intimidates.
Hitmontop offers the second Intimidate and serves as a good check to Kanga. For the team as a whole, Kanga isn't too awful to handle.
Amoonguss is Amoonguss.


As this was a No Protect team (and I only had one of my own EQ to worry about, which isn't used much by Gyara), the Gard set I was using was:
Gardevoir @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Ally Switch
- Heal Pulse
 

Arcticblast

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Ever since Electrolyte made that Swampert/Skymin/Talon core I've been thinking about this.
for reference said:
This is a thread idea that Laga and I had basically simultaneously and I'm posting it first because fuck him. It started forming in my mind a while ago when I noticed that basically all higher level rain teams follow a similar mold. Here are three for your consideration:

Laga's Rain:


Mizuhime's Rain:


Lolk's Rain:


i lined these up in a way that made it most apparent what the various roles were. First and foremost, toed. duh. Secondly, an electric type that outspeeds Charizard Y, to handle it and be the fast half of the team's major damage output. Third, a strong, bulky Steel-type, used for the bulky half of the team's major damage output. Fourth, a grass, to switch into opposing Water-types, especially Rotom-W. Fifth, intimidate, to turn politoed into a ridiculously good physical tank. Sixth, the wild card. Lolk chose Latios as a reliable water-type and fire-type switchin since Breloom is on the frail side (and burn weak) and he was short on Zard switchins. Laga chose talonflame because Rain is typically weak to bulky Grass-types, and as a fire-type switchin in a pinch. Mizuhime chose Breloom to spam spore all over everyone's ass with double fake out support (imo, the weakest pick of the three). Of course, multiple roles can be condensed into one pokemon to open up another wild-card slot.
I'll be formatting these with gaps where they break from the traditional framework.
Electrolyte's Team:
|
|
|
|___________|


wllmagic's Team:
|____________|
|
|
|


Ignoring the whole "four members are the same" thing, what the two teams have in common is the use of a bulky Steel. In both cases, it aids against Trick Room (priority or being slow as balls) and provides the excellent resistances that come with Steel (although neither Steel carries a Flying resist [HI SALAMENCE]). It seems that rather than the cut and dry roles from before, Thundurus and Hitmontop serve more as disruptors - while they can both still beat Charizard Y, their roles in Fake Out and Prankster are more pronounced than before. Talonflame serves as a check to most Grass-types (such as Ferrothorn) and as a general "oh shit" button, able to strike hard through Trick Room as well as (potentially) burn physical attackers. Mega Swampert carries such impressive bulk itself that Intimidate isn't as necessary.

alternative idea: Politoed is speed control, it's not about the rain at all, but I'll worry about that later
 

Bughouse

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The lack of a flying resist really concerns me with Mega Mence prowling around. These teams should really consider trying Metagross, Aegislash, and actually even Bronzong perhaps (has an emergency TR button) instead of their current bulky steels.
 

Laga

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I'd personally prefer just replacing the "grass spot" with pert, since I can't think of a rain team without a strong electric type. The offensive core is undoubtedly strong, but it's very far from unbeatable. It's hard to explain how, but (talonflame and skymin especially) all of the mons are extremely weak to proper plays (a bit like the above prediction ideas). Now before srk goes and quote-mocks me on this for the rest of his life, I'll try to explain. Once you have these mons in a checked position, they can't really accomplish anything more, and when you add the fact that a really good switch into one of these can put them in a situation like that, it makes this core slightly unsuitable for high level games. Something like a classic Rotom-W or Hitmontop hardly ever lands in this awkward situation.

Also, I don't think kale did a very good job at explaining why this core isn't as good as it looks, so I will now sarcastically mock his post.

———————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————
For one thing the core has absolutely no spread on it, and (depending on the Talonflame set) has no way to support the rest of the team
I fully agree 100%, as skymin clearly doesn't have access to twind



neither have I ever seen a mega swampert with eq,,,,
 
tbh even though Swampert is running around, I found that rain without Swampert is effective (yes other megas exist u know)

I tried out Diancie, Metagross and Sceptile. All of them work well, Mega Metagross can fit in the bulky steel role, sceptile in the grass type role. Diancie is a different case, as the best thing it has going in rain is Ludicolo, as Diancie + Ludicolo in Rain have INSANE offensive and defensive coverage.

What other megas do you guys use with rain?
 

Electrolyte

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Mega Metagross's problem is that it has trouble synergizing with Rain teams as well as the other Rain archetypes do. Now that Rain has things like Mega Swampert cores and Mega Diancie cores, Rain has the potential to become a dominating, well knit framework that's trouble to penetrate through without careful planning and specific counters. This is difficult for Mega Metagross to do because it is neither a full standalone sweeper nor something that can be easily fit into an offensive core. I mean, just look at what the other combinations offer:

Swampert + Flying Spam
"Rain Hyper Offense"

- Excels in pure offense. Swampert is a lot more powerful than Mega Metagross under Rain and a lot faster, too. Its coverage is also much more relevant - Waterfall is staple, and it can even provide very powerful spread in Earthquake to level many foes quickly. Swampert's Ice Punch is also great for nailing Grass- and Flying-types that fill the tier, making it easier for Rain to excel.
- Its coverage is almost completely solid. Swampert's pretty much only fears are Grass-types and Rotom-W, which the birds handle easily. Once those targets are removed, it is incredibly difficult to stop Swampert without crippling it (which is difficult to do because it's so fast and powerful) or removing the weather (which is tricky as you might risk losing your inducer. Or you could just not even be able to change the weather in the first place)


Diancie + Ludicolo
"Rain Balanced"

- Excels in specificity. Diancie + Ludicolo together are a star combination that can target and nullify almost everything Rain specifically has trouble with. Diancie herself is perfect; she counters Mega Charizard, Tyranitar, and Talonflame easily. She provides Speed, bulk, and power, with a typing that Rain has always been begging for.
- Requires a bit more team support because it can't just power through everything that isn't a roadblock. However; support required is minimal. Personally I like to use another Flying-type (Talonflame again) just to counter other Ludicolos and hit hard.
- Focuses more on sponging hits to regain momentum and then using super effective attacks to make up for lack of raw power. This framework is all about synergy.

Usually you'd see like your typical Toed + Diancie + Ludicolo + Intimidate (Steel counter) + Flying-type with Flying-STAB + Wild Card. When playing with this kind of team, predictions are important as it is necessary to be able to pivot between Pokemon and gain better ground without taking too much damage in the process.



Rain's biggest enemy is itself, to be honest, as many Rain archetypes naturally counter / check the others. Swampert's most scary foe is Ludicolo; Ludicolo's most scary foe is the Flying spam on Swampert teams.


Problems with Mega Sceptile:
Lack of good balance of bulk / power / speed

I have yet to see a legitimately usable Mega Sceptile team that has perks over other Rain frameworks. Shaymin-S just seems like a much better option, as it is more powerful, fast enough, and doesn't take up the mega slot.


Problems with Mega Metagross:
Trouble synergizing, faces a LOT of competition from Mega Mawile and Mega Scizor (the first checks Mega Salamence, the second checks Grass-types)


The best thing I could see for Mega Metagross is "Rain Bulky", where it could serve as the speedy check to more offensive frameworks. This kind of framework would probably require multiple Intimidates, more priority (again, Talonflame / Thundurus) and (maybe!) even Trick Room. Extra measures would be necessary to check Swampert, Salamence, and Ludicolo, which would probably be difficult without support from other field effects etc. Just a thought. To be honest I don't expect this to have major potential, at least not until Mega Salamence gets banned.
 
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Could people post the successful rain teams they've been using? I'm kind of curious how Swampert, Diancie and (to a lesser extent) Metagross and Sceptile have changed the standard archetype from XY. What new roles are popping up for rain teams and what types of roles are staying the same? I'll post mine when I get on my computer.
 
Mega-Metagross Formula

The Metagross sprites are all shiny because the other one messed up for some people
Apologies if I give credit to the wrong people, I've just assigned the team credit to people I saw using them. Here are the teams!
Goodstuffs
(Braverius)
(Braverius)
(Stratos)
(Kamikaze17/Quality Content)
(finally)

Slot 1. Mega Metagross
Slot 2. Landorus-T - Bulky pivot, provides Intimidate support as well as a Ground Immunity for Mega Metagross. Not all Landorus-T in this slot are scarfed.
Slot 3. Offensive water to check a wide range of threats, namely fire types and grounds. Keldeo provides a check to the standard Kangaskhan/Landorus-T/Heatran core (among other things) while Azumarill is a great late game cleaner to beat a wider range of threats providing it can get set up. Slot 3 also has a great matchup vs Kyurem-B.
Slot 4. Speed Control & Levitate in all cases but 1. Blaziken provides the check to the popular core I mentioned above that Keldeo covered in the other teams. It also gets around Tailwind / Icy Wind with Speed Boost. This lack of active speed control is somewhat compensated by priority from Azumarill as well as Speed Boost.
Slot 5. Bulky Support & TR check. Sableye and Amoonguss are obvious picks for this role with Taunt/Fake Out and Spore, Ferrothorn is a decent check to CM Cress as well if you can get up Leech Seed before it sets up too much, and all picks picks besides Sableye check Jellicent & Waters. This slot also serves as a Kangaskhan switchin (of varying effectiveness)
Slot 6. Filler. This slot is usually a catch-all Pokemon to cover the already strong 5 mons in the rest of the team. Hydreigon has access to a lot of coverage options and Tailwind, Victini has V-Create to destroy all non-resists and of course Final Gambit, and Rotom-W/Kyurem-B both cover a huge range of mons.

Semi Room
(finally)
(Stratos)

Unfortunately there aren't too many good examples of semi-room with Mega Metagross, but these 2 are pretty similar so you can get an idea of how to put a team together. There is definitely room for expansion here though.

Slot 1) Mega Metagross, both have Hammer Arm
Slot 2) Landorus-T again
Slot 3) Heatran, Heatran works as a great attacker in or out of TR and provides a fire immunity, as well as something to catch Will-O. Heatran is super common on semi room builds with all sorts of Megas so this isn't a surprise pick
Slot 4 & 5) These 2 slots accomplish 3 important roles between the Pokemon on each team:
  • Late game sweeper
  • Trick Room setter
  • Bulky Grass
Slot 6) Dragon, dragons have great coverage and great typing, Hydrei and cube are no exception
 
Last edited:

Arcticblast

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Just to demonstrate (for at least the second time in this thread) how a team built around a certain Pokemon can go outside the framework:



Here, Gyarados loosely covers three of the roles in the goodstuff teams above - it supplies Intimidate, it has Icy Wind for speed control, and it provides STAB Water. This leaves the team able to run Landorus-I, which murders Aegislash (a hard counter to Metagross) and provides the team with a fast and powerful special attacker. Kyurem-B serves the role of a Rotom-W counter, as all three members mentioned so far lose to it, and it is also a very powerful attacker capable of dismantling the more balanced teams that can take on Metagross and Landorus. Amoonguss serves as redirection, another Water/Fairy resist, and another TR check in tandem with Taunt Gyarados, and Rotom-H rounds off the team as a solid answer to Sun.

This team was built in the order of Metagross - Kyurem - Rotom-H - Gyarados - Amoonguss - Landorus, but it's whatever.
 

bunnyy

Formerly Elise
is a Tiering Contributor
hi maybe it's a good idea to update the thread and add the semi-room analysis, also maybe add hail, sand and full trick room ?_?
 

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