The Future of Data Collection - What Should be Done?

[Machoke]

I've been discussing this topic with some friends in person and also on other sites like smashboards, so I thought I'd bring it here too.

Data collection is a huge business in the modern age. It never really occurred to me just how big data collection is until I read about this article about new cars about a year ago. According to the article, data collected from trips in the car could potentially be more valuable than the car itself!

Recently, there have been several controversies regarding data collection, privacy, and consent. To list a few:
- Facebook Paid Teens To Download Data Collection App
- Google Collects Location Data Even When Location Is Disabled
- Amazon and Facebook Reportedly Shared Data With Each Other

With the advent of the internet and social media, companies now have the ability to create detailed profiles on people. This information includes name, family, friends, locations, routines, products bought/sold, interests, demographics, etc. As the largest data companies grow larger and larger, even those not registered to their services can find their data collected. Some of this information is given consensually, but some is given with shoddy consent or without consent at all. It seems that as time passes there are fewer and fewer opportunities to escape having your data collected. Don't want your location collected? Good luck finding a phone that doesn't do that. Don't want your search history collected? Go out of your way to use a different search engine and avoid popular services. Don't want your product history collected? Avoid shopping at the largest supplier of goods online. Even indirectly, you must avoid being in friends' photos to avoid that data being collected, for example.

It seems data collection is growing more and more omnipresent. Data collection companies are making more money and expanding their reach, data collecting services are merging with others, and the Internet of Things is even bringing data collection into everyday gadgets like refrigerators, home locks, and televisions.

With the way things are going, I have a question:

- Is data collection becoming too intrusive? If so, what can we do to prevent this from continuing?

Additional areas to explore:
- Do we have a right to data privacy, or is our data free for anyone to collect?
- Should there be government/private intervention in companies collecting data?
- If data collection continues at its current rate, what do you think the future will look like in terms of how data is collected and how it is used?

 

[MikeDawg]

i dont have any strong opinions on the morality of data collection, but i always think it's funny when people want data collection abolished without replacement (e.g. paying for all of the free services they use daily that are funded by data collection).

ive worked in computational advertising, and the large majority of concerns you see from people about privacy (irt targeted ads in particular) are based in misinformation tbh.

personally, i'd pay to remove ads from something, but i wouldn't pay to opt out of data collection.

 

[Machoke]

i dont have any strong opinions on the morality of data collection, but i always think it's funny when people want data collection abolished without replacement (e.g. paying for all of the free services they use daily that are funded by data collection).

ive worked in computational advertising, and the large majority of concerns you see from people about privacy (irt targeted ads in particular) are based in misinformation tbh.

personally, i'd pay to remove ads from something, but i wouldn't pay to opt out of data collection.

I'm glad you brought this up because that really is something that I haven't seen many arguments for. If we are to cut back on data collection in some way, how will we be able to fund the things we use on a day to day basis?
In one instance, it seems fine. For example, if I use a news site regularly and I have to pay a certain amount a year to access it, it'd be manageable. But to pay to access every single site and every single app would be a large cost in terms of subscriptions.

 

[MikeDawg]

I'm glad you brought this up because that really is something that I haven't seen many arguments for. If we are to cut back on data collection in some way, how will we be able to fund the things we use on a day to day basis?
In one instance, it seems fine. For example, if I use a news site regularly and I have to pay a certain amount a year to access it, it'd be manageable. But to pay to access every single site and every single app would be a large cost in terms of subscriptions.

The only feasible alternative imo is adding more ads, but between the prevalence of ad block and the fact that ads will be less efficient without data collection... that route isn't looking good. Not to mention that sites like YouTube already have had to ramp up their ad quantity lately (and skimp on paying creators) to stay financially viable.

paid subscriptions definitely won't work considering the fit people throw about, for example, paid dlc and in app purchases, and their reluctance to even pay .99 for an app.

 

[Real PHeal Spheal]

- Do we have a right to data privacy, or is our data free for anyone to collect?

Data has always been collected and collectable by those who really wanted it. Spies, private detectives and similar have existed long before the advent of Big Data, collecting data for a living for those who pay the bills.
While the scale and cost of collecting such data has tremendously in- and decreased, respectively, I don't believe that the system as it is currently seen needs any kind of restrictions so far - mainly due to the rather simplistic nature of most algorythms so far. (It's essentially impossible to properly filter and sort out the exact data of each user - search algorythms may match up ads with your google history and similar, but the actual knowledge Google has about all of us to be grossly overestimated by many vocal anti-data people. The incredible masses of data google recieves each day are essentially impossible to sift through in a way which would make this approach reasonably realistic.)
If, and this is a big bold if, such data was to be properly sold on a more individual and precise basis than it currently is, though (Hello google, I'd like everything about my new boss I can't stand so I can blackmail him!), then this is obviously going to cause alot of trouble.
It's hard to draw an exact line at which I'd consider the data trade problematic, though.

Not that any kind of legality or morality would stop similar business going on in the dark, anyways. So if that more precise algorythms happens and google sells out everything they got, we're all doomed.


TL;DR: we're fine until google develops sci-fi-level computers and chooses to sell everything they got to anyone to maximize profit, at which point society collapses and humanity ends in fire. Since this is inevitable (even the current data masses Google holds suffice for this), we may as well milk the system for everything we can get out of it and keep our free, mot too ad-crowded internet.

 

[Siggu]

I frankly don't mind much about it, but I think some regulations should be made about Big Data.

Sure, data collection is nothing new, but now you can collect data passively, without even trying. As the algorithms to understand all this information get better and better, they can be powerful weapons, and at least some kind of effort should be done to try to stop it from spiraling out of control.

 

[fart]

So, this came out today: Feds share watch list with 1,400 private groups. When there's no due process to these watch lists to begin with and then they're shared to non-law enforcement, non-public entity groups.. I'd argue it's a tad too intrusive.

 

[Ohmachi]

I'm going to opt out of your data collection. Also your poll violates EU law

 

[Cresselia~~]

If you have nothing to hide, big data probably will do more good to you than bad.
The only problem I'm concerned is, if the government of some countries might use big data to track your political stance, or if you have joined a protest, and might make you disappear or something.

So technically, if you live in USA or the EU, big data will probably not do you any harm.

 

[Machoke]

If you have nothing to hide, big data probably will do more good to you than bad.
The only problem I'm concerned is, if the government of some countries might use big data to track your political stance, or if you have joined a protest, and might make you disappear or something.

So technically, if you live in USA or the EU, big data will probably not do you any harm.

I dont really like the "If you have nothing to hide" argument, because it tends to undermine the right to privacy. And of course, I do have some things to hide- I think almost everyone does, no?
I think political stance collection is a problem. I agree with that. Even in indirect ways political stances are being recorded by companies like facebook and I think that is contributing to the polarization of political stances we are seeing today. "Oh, you liked this conservative fan page? Why not like this one too? And this one? And this one?" Suddenly you have a moderate republican turned Tea Party simply because facebook wants to maximize engagement from the user.
That's one of the problems with data collection. There's an agenda. They want to sell you a product, or to keep you engaged in their service to shove ads at you and make money.
I think data collection could be great if done consensually and done scientifically for the purpose of analyzing trends and understand the "whys" behind things. Why do certain populations seem more susceptible to hypertension? Why is there a public opinion shift toward Topic X? Etc. But data being collected with the intention of "How can we use this to make more money?" I think may be my main gripe with data collection. Too much room for the negative consequences to be ignored so long as a profit is made.

 

[orch]

I'm not against data collection. In fact, it's helping me to recognize that I give out valuable information freely that should be monetized. For example, my school send me survey to mine my data to improve their business. Now, I know better than to freely give them the data.

 

[Machoke]

I'm not against data collection. In fact, it's helping me to recognize that I give out valuable information freely that should be monetized. For example, my school send me survey to mine my data to improve their business. Now, I know better than to freely give them the data.

How are you going to monetize your data? The only thing I can think of are online surveys that give peanuts for pay.
Also what about what data collection becomes so intrusive that you do not have a choice on whether your data is collected or not? What then?

 

[orch]

How are you going to monetize your data? The only thing I can think of are online surveys that give peanuts for pay.
Also what about what data collection becomes so intrusive that you do not have a choice on whether your data is collected or not? What then?

My university send me surveys. I inform them that I have a price. It'll be up to them if they want the data or not.
Services such as Google exchange data for products. It's monetized for me in that sense. So far, all of these internet products have alternative services if you would prefer to not have your data collected. I like my "free" stuff though.

 

[Alan]

Despite the fact I actively work in a field that handles so-called 'big data' I do think it's an issue. Nobody is really monitoring who is selling what data to who. A lot of the sales go to governments (both friendly and less than friendly). While the argument of "I have nothing to hide" might hold up, there are also people who may be doing perfectly legal things (protesting, for instance) but it disrupts [business/government interest]. These online companies know you. They know you better than you do. There's also the issues of passive collection, for instance the Facebook app (and I'm sure now WhatsApp as well) eavesdrops on your conversation. If it was the government doing it, I'd somehow be more okay with it, because at least they have to (in western countries) answer to the general populace if things go sideways. Facebook, Google, Amazon, they don't answer to anybody except shareholders, and as long as your data can be used to have a better fiscal quarter, those shareholders don't give a fuck.

I don't want to go all tin-foil hat because thus far it's mostly just used for advertisements, but if the greater part of human history has shown us anything, it's that humans are irresponsible and have shit foresight. There have already been examples of big data being 'weaponized' in the case of the 2016 US Presidential Election and Brexit being the two biggest examples, but I can assure you it is happening in other countries as well. Hell, the US has probably used it to get elections to sway our way as well, we just didn't get caught. Overall, I'm not massively in favour of a private board of directors I didn't vote for (or vote for someone to select) having control over my data, which is basically my identity. I don't see how the pros possibly can outweigh the cons. So I might get an ad for a Dyson vacuum cleaner on sale at Argos. Cool. I don't need that advert, if I need something I'll look it up on my own. It just doesn't seem like something that should be turned into a commodity. I'm kind of rambling, so I'll end it here.

 

[Cresselia~~]

Personally, while I think data can be collected, there needs to be laws as to what data and who the companies sell to.
I mean, if it's for psychological studies/ medical studies, then there shouldn't be any problem.
If it's for marketing, or for the government (of a country that respects human rights) , I'm personally ok with that too.

By the way, not sure if this is on topic, but I downloaded a browser called Brave, which claims that it doesn't collect data from users.
I don't know whether this is true. If it's true, how does this browser earn money?
Sounds too good to be true to me. However, I use this Browser because it has a built in ad-blocker.