hotncold because i hate bp
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The Next Best Thing - Sawk [Voting]
- Thread starter skylight
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Hot n Cold cause less teammate reliant and cause I want a tie too!!
Just a few things. From now on to stop the "voting so there's a tie" votes, if there IS a tie, I will be picking a winner between the two. It's just that it's meant to be what the community prefers and agrees is best rather than getting a tie just to try and throw off valid votes. :(
Also, FLCL agreed to sit out (for the most part) for a few rounds to give other people a chance. :)
With that said, keep voting!
Also, FLCL agreed to sit out (for the most part) for a few rounds to give other people a chance. :)
With that said, keep voting!
FLCL
I still like a lot my set. But I'm not so self-centered. My vote is for FLCL
the quasar
FLCL: 11 + 1
HotNCold: 11
Treecko37: 2
TheQuasar: 2
As mentioned a few posts back, I decided that there will no longer be ties because of certain people voting just to get ties (looking at tennisace D<). With this in mind, there is indeed another tie again. After much consideration, I've decided to vote for FLCL - which can actually surprise people who could think it's the SubSalac set, as well as allowing it to bypass its counters as mentioned, which brings his total to 12, making him the winner of this round.
Next Pokemon!
ape
Keep in mind that the same thing applies with Scolipede, and any sets listed on-site for Primeape in RU don't count as that isn't very creative, nor the point of this. Anyway, you have three days.
HotNCold: 11
Treecko37: 2
TheQuasar: 2
As mentioned a few posts back, I decided that there will no longer be ties because of certain people voting just to get ties (looking at tennisace D<). With this in mind, there is indeed another tie again. After much consideration, I've decided to vote for FLCL - which can actually surprise people who could think it's the SubSalac set, as well as allowing it to bypass its counters as mentioned, which brings his total to 12, making him the winner of this round.
Next Pokemon!
ape
Keep in mind that the same thing applies with Scolipede, and any sets listed on-site for Primeape in RU don't count as that isn't very creative, nor the point of this. Anyway, you have three days.
Primeape! My man!
Primeape @ Expert Belt
Trait: Vital Spirit
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Jolly Nature
-Close Combat
-Punishment/U-turn
-Encore
-Ice Punch/Stone Edge
Alright, when considering Primeape's typical counters, you think of a) Pokemon like Musharna and b) anything that can take whatever it locks itself into. Basically, this set bypasses the worries of locking yourself into a move, and it allows you to bluff a choice set with Expert Belt. Once your opponent switches in his Scolipede on a Close Combat, you can Stone Edge or Ice Punch as he sets up Spikes. When they try to bring in Piloswine on an Ice Punch or Stone Edge, you can smack it with a powerful Expert Belt boosted Close Combat. This alone allows it to handle a lot more than it can with a typical Choice Scarf.
The real beauty of the set though is how it handles its number one counter, Musharna. If your opponent switched it in on a Close Combat, you can stay in anticipating a Calm Mind, Encore them into it the following turn, and then hit it with Punishment which gets stronger with every Calm Mind boost. The best part about it is that even if you Encore the Musharna into Moonlight, because you are faster, you can Encore it again once the first Encore ends and proceed to stall the Musharna out of all eight Moonlights should they choose to stay in. Also, Punishment allows you to revenge Musharna with some previous damage. So even if you don't feel safe switching in, allowing it to set up can actually be a good thing as the more it sets up, the more likely it is to be punished (get it... haha... no? k).
As Cherub Agent mentioned, U-turn can also be used in place of Punishment as Encore forces a lot of switches. This allows you to force switches against would-be counters and get your own switch initiative. Generally, if you are looking more to beat Musharna, Punishment is probably the better option in my opinion. Otherwise, U-turn works out really well it is spot. This way, you have the option to beat your counters in specific while also maintaining a really fun and viable set.
Encore comes in handy in many other niche situations as well. If your opponent is using Stealth Rock, you may choose to Encore the Pokemon into it, keeping you safe to wail on it or whatever comes in. Status moves such as Toxic and Will-o-wisp, which are unfortunate to take with Primeape, can be Encored, giving you the opportunity to hit until you die and can manage a safe switch or to switch into a Fire-type to take burns or a Steel or Poison-type to take a Toxic. You can even Encore Substitutes, giving you the chance to handle the Pokemon without giving it a free sub!
This set works arguably better than the Choice Scarf set anyways because locking yourself into Close Combat is fairly difficult to do with Alomomola, Misdreavus, Musharna, Scolipede, and Golurk all so common within the tier. It's much easier for a Choice Banded Sawk to do as it has so much power behind it alongside Mold Breaker that even things that resist it don't often appreciate taking a hit.
Primeape @ Expert Belt
Trait: Vital Spirit
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Jolly Nature
-Close Combat
-Punishment/U-turn
-Encore
-Ice Punch/Stone Edge
Alright, when considering Primeape's typical counters, you think of a) Pokemon like Musharna and b) anything that can take whatever it locks itself into. Basically, this set bypasses the worries of locking yourself into a move, and it allows you to bluff a choice set with Expert Belt. Once your opponent switches in his Scolipede on a Close Combat, you can Stone Edge or Ice Punch as he sets up Spikes. When they try to bring in Piloswine on an Ice Punch or Stone Edge, you can smack it with a powerful Expert Belt boosted Close Combat. This alone allows it to handle a lot more than it can with a typical Choice Scarf.
The real beauty of the set though is how it handles its number one counter, Musharna. If your opponent switched it in on a Close Combat, you can stay in anticipating a Calm Mind, Encore them into it the following turn, and then hit it with Punishment which gets stronger with every Calm Mind boost. The best part about it is that even if you Encore the Musharna into Moonlight, because you are faster, you can Encore it again once the first Encore ends and proceed to stall the Musharna out of all eight Moonlights should they choose to stay in. Also, Punishment allows you to revenge Musharna with some previous damage. So even if you don't feel safe switching in, allowing it to set up can actually be a good thing as the more it sets up, the more likely it is to be punished (get it... haha... no? k).
As Cherub Agent mentioned, U-turn can also be used in place of Punishment as Encore forces a lot of switches. This allows you to force switches against would-be counters and get your own switch initiative. Generally, if you are looking more to beat Musharna, Punishment is probably the better option in my opinion. Otherwise, U-turn works out really well it is spot. This way, you have the option to beat your counters in specific while also maintaining a really fun and viable set.
Encore comes in handy in many other niche situations as well. If your opponent is using Stealth Rock, you may choose to Encore the Pokemon into it, keeping you safe to wail on it or whatever comes in. Status moves such as Toxic and Will-o-wisp, which are unfortunate to take with Primeape, can be Encored, giving you the opportunity to hit until you die and can manage a safe switch or to switch into a Fire-type to take burns or a Steel or Poison-type to take a Toxic. You can even Encore Substitutes, giving you the chance to handle the Pokemon without giving it a free sub!
This set works arguably better than the Choice Scarf set anyways because locking yourself into Close Combat is fairly difficult to do with Alomomola, Misdreavus, Musharna, Scolipede, and Golurk all so common within the tier. It's much easier for a Choice Banded Sawk to do as it has so much power behind it alongside Mold Breaker that even things that resist it don't often appreciate taking a hit.
Primeape @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Vital Spirit
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature
-Close Combat
-U-turn
-Ice Punch / Stone Edge
-Toxic
Choice scarf ape is as standard as it can get (also its best set in my opinion) , but what separates this from standard scarf ape is toxic. Usually, ape just u-turns out from its check/counter, but having to cripple them in the long run is even better. Alomomola, non-heal bell misdreavus, and tangela - common switch-ins to ape - can be crippled by toxic which makes having another physical attacker like kangaskhan and/or physical samurott have an easier time to sweep. Rest of the set is standard, ice punch is preferred because it hits more accurately than stone edge, while stone edge can hit scolipede harder, and is generally a stronger move. EVs are to maximize attack and speed while a jolly nature is used to outspeed any variants of scarf sawk, braviary, gardevoir and rotom forms while also having a speed tie with opposing jolly apes and timid jynx. Vital spirit is the best ability for ape, but one can use defiant because it's a pretty solid ability too.
Is it alright if I change my post? Because I found a fantastic way to use Primeape to the best of its abilities.
Primeape @ Life Orb
Trait: Vital Spirit / Defiant
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Close Combat
- Taunt
- U-Turn
- Stone Edge / Ice Punch
Taunt and U-Turn is a combo most defensive pokemon dread, and Primeape is one of the few offensive pokemon with access to this combo (lol Persian). Its STAB Close Combat brings in defensive pokemon like Misdreavus, Alomomola or Weezing. From there, you can Taunt them to stop their status move and U-Turn out to easily sponge their STAB or gain the advantage should they switch. This makes Pursuit trapping or setting up loads easier as their defensive pokes remain sitting ducks while the more offensive switch-ins are hit by U-Turn and get instantly threatened by your countermeasure. It's quite simple, yet so effective. The last move is up to you: Stone Edge can nail Scolipede but Ice Punch doesn't have infamous accuracy while still getting good coverage, especially on Golurk.
Primeape @ Life Orb
Trait: Vital Spirit / Defiant
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Close Combat
- Taunt
- U-Turn
- Stone Edge / Ice Punch
Taunt and U-Turn is a combo most defensive pokemon dread, and Primeape is one of the few offensive pokemon with access to this combo (lol Persian). Its STAB Close Combat brings in defensive pokemon like Misdreavus, Alomomola or Weezing. From there, you can Taunt them to stop their status move and U-Turn out to easily sponge their STAB or gain the advantage should they switch. This makes Pursuit trapping or setting up loads easier as their defensive pokes remain sitting ducks while the more offensive switch-ins are hit by U-Turn and get instantly threatened by your countermeasure. It's quite simple, yet so effective. The last move is up to you: Stone Edge can nail Scolipede but Ice Punch doesn't have infamous accuracy while still getting good coverage, especially on Golurk.
Primeape @ Leftovers
Trait: Vital Spirit / Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Substitute / Encore
- Bulk Up
- Close Combat / Brick Break
- Payback / Punishment
A classy setup set. Substitute or Encore can be used depending of the player's preferences, in any case they allows Ape to starts Bulking Up and wrecking lots of threats thanks to his perfect coverage. Close Combat is for the strongest damage output, since the SDef drop don't matter a lot since Ape's SDef is pretty shitty anyway and the Def drop is nullified thanks to the Bulk Up boost(s), but you can always run Brick Break if you want to preserve the Def boost(s) and fear Double Screens Strategy. Last we have the choice between Payback and Punishment. Payback is a secure move to do damage, while Punishment depends more from the situation. Max Atk and max Spd for outspeeding most of the meta, but he can also runs a more HP based spread to outspeed only the faster of the wall and being bulky at the same time. Leftovers for obvious recovery and Vital Spirit is prefered over Defiant since Ape can come in on a sleep move and encoring it.
Primeape (F) @ Life Orb
Trait: Vital Spirit
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Screech
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Seed Bomb
It can work better with Entry Hazard support, taking full advantage of the good basic speed (he just become the fastest fighting-type in NU) with a Jolly nature and significant attack. The use of Screech forces (almost) the opponent to switch; while Close Combat and Stone Edge are "classic", highlighting the strength of Primeape, i set for the last slot Seed Bomb; this move also increases the PrimeApe's coverage on ground and water-type. If we consider using of Golurk or Alomomola stall team, we understand how it can be useful to have a weapon so unexpected and decisive.
treecko37 i really do like your idea of using encore on primeape, but I'd much prefer to use U-Turn over Punishment. Simply because Encore is so good at forcing switches, and you still maintain the super effective hit on Musharna, and can let something else deal with it that does a better job than Primeape. U-Turn mainly helps in keeping immense amounts of momentum for your team in conjunction with Encore, as once they switch you can simply bring in a counter to their counter for free. going to try that set
Primeape @ Fist Plate (Salac Berry is also a cool option)
Trait: Vital Spirit/Defiant
4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Bulk Up/Hone Claws
- Close Combat
- Foresight/Stone Edge
This set aims to set up in the face of silly things like Alomomola who wastes its time trying to use status moves. Instead, Prime is capable of setting up Bulk Up behind its sub, therefore increasing its decent attack while foresight removes Misdreavus of its stupid immunity. Ice Punch can be used so the low PP doesn't scare you to death, but this means Prime will lose to Misdreavus (but win against Golurk!). Salac is cool if you sub down to low health. In that case you have room for adamant nature too, although jolly is almost entirely preferred. I gave in and used BU since meditate is not good enough :[ Hone Claws is cool too for increasing stone edges poor accuracy though.
Btw +1 CC is a guaranteed 2HKO on Alom after rocks and guaranteed 2hko on Missy regardless.
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