Battle Spot Thunder Wave is Great-Singles

[Omastar68]

This a team I've used quite a bit on PS and gotten a fairly good rating. This team is built around paralysis, which is a good choice for me since I typically favor slow bulky mons w/ lots of power over fast & frail sweepers. I should also note that I'm not looking to make huge changes to this team(would make changes to my last one, and that probably got confusing) since it's done quite well and I like it.

Cresselia@Rocky Helmet
Ability: Levitate
EVs 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
-Ice Beam
-Moonlight
-Lunar Dance
-Thunder Wave

Pretty straightforward Cress. She adds a bunch to my team, as she can handle Megamence-which plagues my mega and is a nuisance besides-provides paralysis support, which is greatly appreciated by my team, and can bring something back from death's door w/ Lunar Dance. Cress also more or less outclasses Clefable, which I've been using for a while w/ a very similar set-problem is I just don't have a decent Cress on cart.

Diggersby@Assault Vest
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 4 HP/ 252 Atk/ 12 Def/ 4 SpD/ 236 Speed
Adamant Nature
-Quick Attack
-Return
-Earthquake
-Knock Off

252 speed EVs accomplishes nothing that 236 doesn't, other than speed tying other 252 neutral speed Diggersbys. The HP and Def give a good chance to survive 244+Atk Talon's BB, while the extra 4 EVs are put in SpD so they're not wasted. Moves are pretty standard. It was kind of tough to pick the last move, but I decided Knock Off cause none of my other Pokemon have it and it's great for the odd NFE Poke. The reason I'm using Diggersby to begin w/ is that it's a safe switch in on Mega Gengar(unless it goes for Substitute,) easily taking a Sludge Bomb, and has a good chance to KO even when burned. Diggersbys also works well w/ paralysis support, and does a ton of damage. Synergy w/ my team is basically perfect, as it is immune to electric and ghost, while resisting rock and poison. The only place it bunches up weaknesses is ice w/ Noivern, and the two of them are the least common Pokemon for me to bring to battle anyways.

Venusaur@Venusaurite
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252HP/ 36 Atk/ 220 Def
Relaxed Natureeed
-Earthquake
-Sludge Bomb
-Synthesis
-Leech Seed

Slight variation on the Mega Venusaur spread I used to use. EVs survive 244+ Atk CB Talon's BB 100% of the time, while giving a good chance to avoid the 2HKO from 252+ Atk Mega Blaziken's Flare Blitz. The Atk EVs give EQ some more power, but it's still not really enough(Heatran is, embrassingly, not KOd.) I could maybe move them, but I'm sick of complicated EV spreads. Synthesis>Giga Drain because GG doesn't hit much, and is slightly redundant w/ Leech Seed since neither do anything to Grass types. Synthesis also provides insurance against stuff like Thundy which can't 2HKO, and some things that use recoil moves, as they'll now be eating quite a bit more recoil. I'm not sure if Chlorophyll is much, if at all, better than Overgrow for pre-Mega ability, but it can be nice for Char and stuff(less so now that I'm not using Sleep Powder.)

Gyarados@Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP/ 228 Def/ 28 SpD
Adamant nature
-Watefall
-Ice Fang
-Taunt
-Thunder Wave

Gyara is a beautiful switch in on a myriad of threats(like Blaziken) thanks to its ability and resistances. I'd rather go Rocky Helmet, but Item Clause. I figure Gyara is a better Lefties user than Cress because she has recovery and Gyara doesn't, and Cress only has one(weak) attack, and often likes to faint herself for LD, so it's not as important for her to hang around as long. Gyara also has a chance to take advantage of flinch turns for free recovery. Waterfall and Ice Fang provide relatively good coverage, and both have(small) flinch chances, for a very watered down paraffin have combo. Taunt stops lots of stuff like Pranksters and Aegi from using KS, and T-Wave is self-explanatory. The EVs are focused on physical defense, but the SpD gives a good chance to survive 252 +SpA Mega Gengar's Sludge Bomb, while WF is a likely 2HKO back even w/o investment. Gyara also doesn't miss spe because of its unique base speed tier.

Manectric@Manectite
Ability: Lightningrod<--Intimidate
EVs: 252 SpA/ 4 SpD/ 252 Spe
Timid Nature
-Volt Switch
-Thunderbolt
-Overheat
-Hidden Power Ice

Standard Mega Manectric. This thing has done really well for me. Gyara draws electric type moves, and Manectric can switch in and nab a boost. While Diggersbys is also immune to electric, it isn't nearly as good vs Rotom-W. MM is also my only Poke running fire coverage, which I think is necessary for all teams(fire coverage that is,) due to Scizor and Ferrothorn being ruined completely by fire, as they can be tough to take down w/o it. MM sole weakness in ground is also covered very well by my team since half of its immune.

Noivern@Life Orb
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 28 HP/ 20 Def/ 204 SpA/ 4 SpD/ 252 Spe
Timid nature
-Draco Meteor
-Air Slash
-Focus Blast
-Super Fang

Max speed is necessary to outspeed Greninja, but not running 252 SpA EVs is ok, especially since I'm using SF. The HP and Def make it so 244+Atk Talon's BB(yes I realize I base a ton of spreads on this move) only has 18.8% to OHKO, while the SpA investment is still sufficient to KO lots of stuff, particularly w/ Draco Meteor(Garchomp, Megamence, Talonflame, etc.) This set also lives 252+ Atk Landog's Rock Slide after a hot of LO recoil. Focus Blast>Flamethrower because I have nothing else w/ a fighting attack, and it's nice for Kang(which'll kill itself w/ DE recoil, or else fail to guarantee a KO if it lacks Ice Punch.) Super Fang is a nice move, and is great after a DM if you don't have a switch in. The main reason I decided to use Noivern is I wanted something that can deal w/ Mega Venusaur, but I also wanted it to be able to handle Gluscor. STAB Air Slash is also really nice, as it allows for the infamous para flinch combo.

So that's my team. If anyone wants calcs, I'm happy to oblige. Ibe tested this team a decent amount, and it has performed quite well(to be technical, I haven't lost a Single Battle w/ this team, but that's just cause I haven't done too many battles yet. Overall I'm not seeing any problems w/ this team right now, but hopefully someone else will(not that I want there to be problems, ofc, but, well...w/e.) If anyone has better suggestions for EV spreads, I'm all ears(or eyes, I guess...)

Don't forget to vote for what Mega you'd like!(kinda surprised no one wants Mega Regice. Maybe w/ Heatproof since it isn't actually supposed to melt?)

Also, sorry for editing the team a few times. But I guess it's not such a bad thing. It's like having a new team to rate, which anyone whose rating teams should like.

 

[cant say]

Hey Omastar, nice too see your teams slowing getting better! However, this one can still be improved. The most glaring thing is that Gyarados is your only answer to Talonflame, Mega Salamence, Aegislash and Mega Mawile. What's worse is that he's 2HKOed by all of them (Talonflame needs a Choice Band but it's its most common item soooo)(oh yeah and Aegislash technically doesn't but Shadow Sneak allows it to make up the difference). The simplest solution is to make Gyarados physically defensive with an Impish nature and max defense investment. It's also worth considering Taunt over Earthquake to help troll Aegi's King's Shields (as well as a bunch of other annoying moves), this does leave you with nothing to hit Mega Mawile with but if you get the Thunder Wave off you could get lucky with some paraflinches or at least make easy work of it with a teammate while it's para'd.

Encore is pretty cool on Togekiss, have you tried Flamethrower / Fire Blast on it though? Dazzling Gleam is really popular on that set too amongst high-ranking Japanese players for being able to take a huge chunk out of Mega Salamence / Garchomp etc. so you dont have to repeatedly flinch them (especially Salamence since it can fight though paraflinching with Double-Edge / Facade).

Also this is really important; we recently discovered that Secret Power Mega Kang doesn't work on cart, and that the PS mechanics are wrong and will be fixed soon enough. So you need to totally change your Kang's set if you ever plan to breed / train this team in-game. You could do Rock Tomb / Bulldoze with Rock Slide if you want to keep flinching stuff but that's pretty gimmicky! lol

 

[Omastar68]

Already bred for it in game, but re-doing the set isn't too much work. I didn't really think of those 4 as being problematic for me, but I see how they can be. Talonflame is something I try to prepare for a lot. I'm definitely short on counters to Talonflame(esppecially if it's CB), but everything except Clef and Champ is a check.

244+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 68 HP / 236 Def Exploud: 130-154 (69.1 - 81.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

204+ SpA Choice Specs Exploud Boomburst vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 199-235 (125.1 - 147.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

244+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 196+ Def Togekiss: 96-114 (50 - 59.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

0 SpA Togekiss Air Slash vs. 44 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 67-79 (42.1 - 49.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Toge and Exploud can 1v1 Talonflame in most situations. Champ plainly loses, while Clef has to either switch or use Healing Wish. Mega Kanga can OHKO, too, and avoids the OHHKO from Talon. Still, it deals quite a bit of damage and makes me more reliant on HW to heal it off, which I don't like. Going physically defensive on Gyara is a good idea, so I'l do that.

Megamence is super annoying, especially if it has Facade. Defenses on Exploud mean it's never OHKOd by 252 Atk Megamence's DE, but that's assuming no DD boosts, ofc. Clef ignores the atk boost from DD, but not the spe which means Mence sometimes will be able to outspeed even after a T-Wave.

+1 252 Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 196+ Def Togekiss: 169-199 (88 - 103.6%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

This is bad. I was hoping Toge would fare better against it. Flinch hax can still see me through-doesn't take much luck to survive +1 DE and Mence shouldn't have a chance to get to +2, but it isn't a sure thing. It's actually more likely to work than not, but I'm not sure it's good enough considering Champ is hopeless against Megamence that aren't paralyzed(thinking I should maybe remove it from my team since flying is such a prevalent offensive typing these days, but first I'll make the revisions to Kang and Gyara to make sure.)

Aegi is far and away the yuckiest thing you mentioned. Togekiss and Clef are basically worthless against it. Champ might win if it doesn't have WP, but many do. Exploud will trash Aegi if it is the first turn and I can use Overheat w/ regular SpA, or I'm already locked into FB, but being locked in to anything else means I lose(bar an unlikely freeze/Aegi switching in on BB, etc.) Kang is pretty good against it, thanks to EQ and a ghost immunity(Shadow Sneak), but it can only switch in for free on KS or a ghost attack. While I would like a Taunt user, I'm not sure I should run it on Gyara. Maybe though, since Aegi'd get stuck w/ BF's crap defenses, so Waterfall would probably still do a lot of damage.

Mawile is a problem, now that I think about it. Still, it has a little something to fear from everything. Kang isn't OHKOd if Mawi has no atk boosts, and hits it hard w/ EQ(and smacks it for some damage the next turn w/ Sucker Punch. Hopefully that amounts to a KO.) Exploud ruins Mawi if it can use Overheat, but if it's already locked into something or at -2 SpA, that match up goes to Mawi so long as it has Sucker Punch(252+ Atk Play Rough is not an OHKO.) Clef is plainly KOd, but at the very least it can leave Mega Mawile paralyzed, or use HW. Absolute best case scenario I use T-Wave, Mawi goes full para, and then I usee HW. Toge dies to Mawi, however if Mawi just used SD I can Encore it. Otherwise just para it, though if I get really lucky and Mawi goes full para the first turn, I havve a chance to flinch it to death. Champ is obviously KOd by PR, but it outspeeds and can take a chunk of Mawi's health w/ Dynamichpunch, while also confusing it.

I used to use a Modest Trick Scarf Togekiss, but for w/e reason I decided to change it. I was trying to pick moves from Toge's giant movepool, and eventually just decided to only have AS for an attack, since that's what Toge uses most anyways, and focus more on bulk. Dazzling Gleam isn't bad, but I like to think I do good vs the premier dragons in BSS(except Mence, but I'll tinker w/ the Gyara set so it's at least a foolproof-assuming no more than 1 DD boost-check,) and fairy/flying coverage doesn't seem that good to me. Neither covers steel, and they're redundant vs fighting types, kinda like Lugia's STABs. Fire Blast/Flamethrower would also require giving up one of my four moves(actually least sold on T-Wave since I have plenty of users and Toge likes the opponent being parad before it enters the field,) and neither hits very hard w/ no investment.

I so wish they didn't do that w/ Secret Power. I guess a 30% chance to para applied twice alongside a 70 BP STAB move that is essentially always a crit(minus the special mechanics of crits, just the damage,) would be too good. As is I'm still tempted to use it, but w/ all my T-Wave users I think I can just go w/ DE. Also, what are your thoughts on special/mixed Kanga? Seems pretty silly at first, but I've seen at least one set for it on here somewhere, and it would better deal w/ Mence.

 

[cant say]

tl;dr...

lol nah, look, those calcs are nice but your opponent is gonna get so much free momentum since the best you can do is revenge. being able to beat a threat is cool but if you're so bruised and battered from it that you may as well have just used Destiny Bond to take them down then it isn't really so great for you.

You really just need that one defensive glue mon that can actually counter the scary guys rather than just having a bunch of (admittedly decent) checks. It's why so many teams have at least a Ferrothorn or a Rotom-W or something like that. Remember, in 3v3, needing to use 2 Pokemon to take down their 1, or having your 1 Pokemon so crippled from just beating one of theirs that they can use them as set up fodder, is a shitload of momentum in your opponents favour...

No, don't 'tinker' with Gyarados to just live one +1 Double-Edge, go max HP/+Def so you can do a whole lot more than just check Salamence. It's always nice when you can come up with a nice custom EV spread, but in BSS it's actually generally better to go with max/max spreads since you need your 3 Pokemon to beat their 3 Pokemon, even if they don't bring the thing you were expecting them to bring from team preview...

Togekiss cannot 1v1 Talonflame because Brave Bird has priority, so Talon will get its three Brave Birds in before Togekiss gets its three Air Slashes in unless you're lucky with paralysis. It also gets priority Roost so you'll be in for a bit of a stallfest unless the RNG is in your favour...

If you want to replace Machamp, then replace it with Rotom-H with Hidden Power Ice. It'll allow you to chunk Mega Salamence, Talonflame, Aegislash and Mega Mawile. It also gives you something to use against Thundurus, who I forgot to mention in my original reply. He can be problematic if Exploud is dead (or has Focus Blast).

I've been using MixedKhan and it's really fun. I run Naive with 100 SpA to guarantee the OHKO on Garchomp (and Mega Salamence) and have a really good shot at OHKOing standard Ferro.

 

[Omastar68]

Yeah, a Pokemon that tends to counter stuff rather than just checking things would be good. Was already on the fence about Champ-will definitely replace it now. Max HP/Def would've worked for Gyara, but the spread I found still avoids the 2HKO from megamence's DE and stuff like that, while also having a reasonable chance to avoid the 2HKO from Mega Gengar. I definitely try too hard w/ EV spreads.

Brave Bird has priority(even if it didn't, Talon would outspeed), but it also has recoil, meaning I can Roost the first turn(if I know it to be CB), and then AS the 2nd turn. All that recoil plus an AS means Talon is, at the very least, close to dead.

Rotom-W sounds like a great idea, and I have multiple perfect HP Ice ones in game. Interestingly enough, Rotom-W is one of the Pokemon that gives me trouble. Gyara and Toge totally fail against it, Kang gets burned, Exploud needs to be locked into BB(and Rotom-W will probably just VS out anyways,) and Clefable can't do much. I guess running my own Rotom-W might help against it...kinda

Also, would you run WoW on Rotom-W, or is it a bad idea w/ my team's focus on spreading paralysis?

 

[cant say]

Rotom-H so you can use Overheat against Aegislash and Mawile. You could go Overheat, Volt Switch / Thunderbolt, Hidden Power Ice, Will-O-Wisp, or use a more offensive set. He also gets Thunder Wave so that could be good to go with your team. Rotom-H is great against pretty much all the Steel-types that give your Fairies and Boomburst-locked Exploud, I think he'd be a great fit.

 

[Omastar68]

Smart. I was testing the team w/ Rotom-W and not doing that good. Rotom-h makes me even worse vs rotom-W, but hopefully that won't matter too much.

EDIT: Sorry I changed so much. That team wasn't doing very good even w/ the brilliant changes can't say suggested, so I figured I should just start fresh.

Testing on th iPad is hard, but here's a repeat where I make a mistake but barely win anyways:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battlespotsingles-316374141