Ladder Tier Shift ORAS [Swift Swim Unbanned; Check Post #95 for some info]

Dr. Phd. BJ

aphasia
is a defending SCL Champion
OMPL Champion
SlaySlenderDragon XD Talpr0ne no it does not. According to some new rules, Wobbuffet with Shadow Tag gets +0. With Telepathy it gets +20, but that kind of ruins the point of using Wobbuffet.

ChrystalFalchion Sawsbuck is an amazing Sun Sweeper that is capable of setting up and sweeping with ease. It is also fast enough that it can keep its sweep going outside of sun. (It is especially good with PU boosts which we haven't factored into these viability rankings yet due to the small amount of experience we all have with them)

and plz stop one liners ;;;

Also, we really need to start nominating things for the B ranks. The point of this is to have the community participate in rankings, rather than a much smaller group of people.
That said, I have some nominations that I'll post right now. I know my descriptions aren't very good but I have trouble describing them so...

Gothitelle -> B+
Gothitelle is a great, although much hated, Pokemon. It recently got unbanned from Tier Shift, although it doesn't get any boosts while it has the ability Shadow Tag. Having no boosts doesn't mean it is unviable, however, as it still easily preforms the same role as it does in OU: trapping and killing threats to your team. It easily dismantles stall teams. However, it does have flaws. It has rather bad stats, meaning it doesn't always have the power to kill things or the speed to work against offense teams, which forces it to run Choice Scarf or Choice Specs, locking it into a move. Gothitelle also has a bad typing, being weak to Knock Off defensively and its STAB having an immunity offensively.

Togekiss -> B+
Togekiss is another Pokemon that is great against stall. Its ability to boost its stats with Nasty Plot and to get through walls with Air Slash flinches makes it extremely annoying. Like Gothitelle, it doesn't preform anywhere near as well against offense, which often has a lot of Pokemon that outspeed and can kill Togekiss.

Victini -> B+
Victini is a great wallbreaker. It has access to the strongest move in the game, which is V-create. It also has great coverage in Bolt Strike, a pivoting move in U-turn, and pretty good bulk. However, despite its great all around stats and movepool, it has a weakness to Stealth Rock, is forced to run a choice item most of the time, and has to suffer from the drawbacks of V-create.

Honchkrow -> B+
Honchkrow is a great Pursuit trapper and sweeper. With Moxie, each time it gets a kill its attack gets boosted one stage. Pair this with Pursuit to prevent weakened Pokemon from switching out and Sucker Punch for faster Pokemon, and you have very good chances of boosting your attack and sweeping. A lot of teams that I've come across are unprepared for this, and it is quite simple to set up a sweep with it. However, it is very fragile and quite slow, leaving it easy to kill. In addition to that, you often have to play mindgames with your opponent with Pursuit and Sucker Punch, as otherwise they could get a free switch or Honchkrow could faint.
I'd nom frogaider to B+ as well. Due to the fact it hits even harder and can outspeed stuff like Serperior, Starmie, Raikou and others now. It is like Greninja but not as overpowered.
 
Tbh I would say that Victini is worse than in OU, and its around B- to C+ iirc, but I definitely agree with the Honchkrow and Frogadier noms.

Something I would like to nominate for A- is Simipour, so far I have only used its Nasty Plot set but I think it can feasibly run a scarf set. It gets great coverage and can set up on a lot of the tier. Also it's speed tier is amazing, 121 is pretty much perfect combined with decent-ish bulk (with PU boosts) and great SpAtk, this monkey has a lot of potential to rip apart balance and offense teams.
 
I haven't used Victini for a while, so I might be a little off on the viability. Thank you guys for the input.

That said, I believe Frogadier should be above B+. Frogadier has almost the exact stats of Greninja, which was determined to be broken in OU. However, this is not OU. Frogadier has better walls in TS, and due to its lower speed tier than Greninja and everything else getting speed boosts it is no longer one of the fastest Pokemon. It is still extremely powerful as well as still having great speed and coverage, which is why I believe it is closer to the A/A- range than B+.
 
Nah I definitely think that B+ is a generous ranking for it, it doesn't have as good of a speed tier and there are far too many bulky waters it just can't break. It's a fantastic momentum grabber and can put some pressure on teams with few water or grass (or whatever coverage you're running) switchins but that's really te extent of its usefulness for me.
 
Sorry I haven't been posting, I spent last weekend in the hospital, and this week parts of my laptop all just collectively died.

Victini is B rank in Ou and does seem to get worse. It really isn't the only good physical non-mega Fire attacker anymore. Rapidash is quite good with the new PU boosts. B- seems correct.

Goth should be much higher IMO, as TS has more stall then OU. Goth is most effective on or against Stall. This metagame trend makes Goth more viable. If you remember pre-STAG ban TS, ppl would just slide Goth on teams to beat stall. A- seems like a good spot.

Togekiss's stallbreaker set is pretty much dedicated to breaking stall only, and the rest of its sets are unreliable paraflinch sets or somewhat mediocre. I think B rank would be better.

I agree that Frogadier should be higher then B+. It can beat bulky waters with Grass Knot, and Gunk Shot is amazing coverage on it for Grass Types. So I'm not quite sure what you mean BIAF. Though all concede since it's brand new putting it a little lower is okay.

I'm a bit skeptical about Simipour. At first glance it seems frail and doesn't seem to pack a huge punch before boosts. I'll need to test it for myself.
 
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Yes, STag was once banned, as was chatter. This changed when PU boosts happened, because TI also implemented boosts by abilities. What I mean by that is if you have a low tier Pokemon with an ability that is banned to BL (Gothitelle and Ninetales are prime examples of this) they get the boosts from BL. So this means that Drought Ninetales and Shadow Tag Gothitelle get no boosts, while Flash Fire Ninetales gets the regular +20.
 
Yes, STag was once banned, as was chatter. This changed when PU boosts happened, because TI also implemented boosts by abilities. What I mean by that is if you have a low tier Pokemon with an ability that is banned to BL (Gothitelle and Ninetales are prime examples of this) they get the boosts from BL. So this means that Drought Ninetales and Shadow Tag Gothitelle get no boosts, while Flash Fire Ninetales gets the regular +20.
Well that explains why my drizzle politoed was getting shat on by everything. lol

  • Floatzel is pretty interesting as it is one of the fastest pokemon in the tier and has good HP and Great Attack.
  • I would like to see consideration of Banette-Mega - Base 175 attack with Sucker Punch and STAB Shadow sneak - with access to prankster will-o-wisp to help it take hits better - is ridiculous.
  • Avalugg - with access to stealth rock, recover, and rapid spin, - can switch in and spin/set up sr multiple times in a match due to it's amazing physical bulk. Even super effective physical attacks aren't hurting it. It reminds me of skarmory - with much better offensive stats - but slightly worse typing / but even super effective special attacks don't do too much to it, and it can have sturdy.

    *** Why isn't this on the rankings? - Been very viable for me as a calm minder/cleric, wish passer, etc. and that typing!!! Bulk better than ferrothorn? yes please!

    Mega Audino - NU | Normal/Fairy | Healer | 118/75/141/95/141/65 (635 BST)
 
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Well that explains why my drizzle politoed was getting shat on by everything. lol

  • Floatzel is pretty interesting as it is one of the fastest pokemon in the tier and has good HP and Great Attack.
  • I would like to see consideration of Banette-Mega - Base 175 attack with Sucker Punch and STAB Shadow sneak - with access to prankster will-o-wisp to help it take hits better - is ridiculous.
  • Avalugg - with access to stealth rock, recover, and rapid spin, - can switch in and spin/set up sr multiple times in a match due to it's amazing physical bulk. Even super effective physical attacks aren't hurting it. It reminds me of skarmory - with much better offensive stats - but slightly worse typing / but even super effective special attacks don't do too much to it, and it can have sturdy.

    *** Why isn't this on the rankings? - Been very viable for me as a calm minder/cleric, wish passer, etc. and that typing!!! Bulk better than ferrothorn? yes please!

    Mega Audino - NU | Normal/Fairy | Healer | 118/75/141/95/141/65 (635 BST)
It is important to note that the viability rankings are far from complete. We appreciate any help you can give us with the completion of this project. I must stress however, that you need to please test the Pokemon you are nominating. I actually agree with a pretty high rank for M-Audino, although the last time I used it was on stall without CM.
 
It is important to note that the viability rankings are far from complete. We appreciate any help you can give us with the completion of this project. I must stress however, that you need to please test the Pokemon you are nominating. I actually agree with a pretty high rank for M-Audino, although the last time I used it was on stall without CM.
Sorry - I have tried to test these but it takes like 15 minutes to find a battle on TS and half the time they forfeit or time out before turn one. D;
 

LatiasDigs

formerly digitalson
i would like to nominate non mega audino for A, though mega is also good if you dont already have a mega(prob A too), but lacks regenerator, due to audino's insane bulk due to shift and is bulkier than aromatiese in TS, albeit does less damage, and aroma was A+ on old viability(and now A-)
 
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http://www.smogon.com/forums/thread...s-check-post-168.3556762/page-19#post-6568074

The OU suspect is now complete, and Shadow Tag has been banned from OU, while Sableye-Mega remains OU. I hope you had fun abusing Shadow Tag in TS for the short time it was unbanned. This change will take place as soon as it is implemented for OU.

Secondly there were some tier drops this month. The fulllist is here. The policy of separating Megas has just come into effect so we got some intresting ones. a few highlights are:

Audino- has also dropped to PU, but unlike the others, actually sees usage for its non-Mega Form in TS. Getting just a bit bulkier doesn't hurt, and it gives sightly bigger Wishes out.

Sceptile- at Nu with +15 to each stat, it gets a high 135 speed. But its still mono Grass-type, and its coverage is kinda lacking. It possible this thing is viable, but i doubt it.

There are a whole host of megas that get HP boosts now, so make sure you check the drops out!

Lastly, I've updated the viability rankings with all the nominations except Goth and Simipour. I'm still skeptical on Simipour. for reasons stated already.

PS:
i would like to nominate non mega audino, though mega is also decent if you dont already have a mega, but lacks regenerator, due to audino's insame bulk due to shift and is bulkier than aromatiese in TS, albeit does less damage, and aroma was A+ on old viability
When you nominate you need to include ranks, check Deathly ♛The King's post on the first page for a good example of how to write a good nomination post.
 
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LatiasDigs

formerly digitalson
just to clarify, the base forms of megas get the boost right, and the mega retains the hp boost (i.e. m altaria gets the HP boost)
 
So I was working on a om submission that involved lower tier pokemon, when I realised that a lot of the pokemon are just worse versions of their evolutions.
What I mean by this is there are many pokemon that perform the exact same role this is useful as it essentially doubles the strength of your win condition and allows you to play a lot more risky with each one.. Here are a few of those pairs.
+
Magnezone and magneton
Due to the fact that magneton gets a huge boost, 2 mag 2 drag can work far better than normal. The differences between these two are that magneton is faster by 20 points and is less bulky, meaning that it performs the role of a scarfer much better than magnezone, while magnezone's better bulk allows it to take a few hits form a number of steel types that don't have anything to hit steel types, and 2hko/1hko with specs. These 2 are both support roles for a team that has decided to only have these 2 pokemon to hit steel types. (if you are using them both on the same team then you may want to have one of them have hp fround and the other have hp fire.)

+
Talonflame and fletchinder
I know that many of you are of the firm belief that fletchinder is a terrible pokemon and isn't as good as talonflame in any regard. In saying this you are almost correct. There are a number of sets that talonflame is better at but there are a number of sets where the 2 are equals. Those 2 sets are sd acrobatics w/o flare blitz and spdef. However if you are using both of them on the same team then it is likely that you fill try and sweep with them, in which case fletchinder will probably be using sd acrobatics and talonflame could either use choice band or sd brave bird.

+
roserade and roselia
These two will actually have to perform two pretty different roles. The reason for this is that roserade outclasses roserlia offensively with both 10 higher speed and special attack. It also has 10 better special defense and 5 better attack. However roselia has higher hp and it can hold eviolite. All of this means that roselia will have to play a much more defensive role than roserade, which it can do while setting up hazards and healing with synthethis, and maybe even use aromatherapy, while being able to remain unpassive with giga drain and sludge bomb. roserade is still able to play a defensive role if you wish to (on the same team) but an offensive one is preffered, with acces to technician hp fire. If you have roselia with you can exchange what would normally be spikes with another offensive move like extrasensory or shadow ball or energy ball.

+
hoopa unbound and regular hoopa
If you already have hoopa unbound on your team, why not have some fun and add the other hoopa? While regular hoopa is outclassed by hoopa-u it still allows it to fill a lot of moveslots that the other one can't, due to the fact that hoopa unbound is able to use a whole host of moves. For this the 2 pokemon can pretty much run the same sets, however you should be more inclined to give hoopa-u the set that is more physically orientated.

+
Ferrothorn and ferroseed.
These two pokemon are fantastic. The two have even been used in ou by the teambuilder CTC but with ferroseed's stat boosts the pair become even better especially seems how a lot of teams struggle to deal with just one of them. The main differences between the two are that ferrothorn has higher attack and health. these two factors mean that it is much more beneficial for ferroseed to use leech seed as it gains more health and it's attacking options are worse. The two of the can share the plethora of support moves that each of them hold, with sr, spikes, thunder wave, power whip, gyro ball, leechs seed +protect and toxic it's a wonder that the pair haven't been used more.

honourable mentions
+
bisharp and pawniard
unfortunately for these two pawniard is far too weak to actually be used on a competitive team.

+
weavile and sneasel
the problem with these two is that sneasel isn't strong enough, although that isn't by much, I have used him in the past to great success when sneasel was in nu.

+
gengar+haunter
these two have almost identical stats, but their problem is that neither of them are very good, both their speed tier and special attack stat being pretty weak.

e: you can't use hoopa rip sorry.
e: apparently you can use gengar+haunter however I'm stupid and someone smarter than me should explain that.
 
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So I was working on a om submission that involved lower tier pokemon, when I realised that a lot of the pokemon are just worse versions of their evolutions.
What I mean by this is there are many pokemon that perform the exact same role this is useful as it essentially doubles the strength of your win condition and allows you to play a lot more risky with each one.. Here are a few of those pairs.
+
Magnezone and magneton
Due to the fact that magneton gets a huge boost, 2 mag 2 drag can work far better than normal. The differences between these two are that magneton is faster by 20 points and is less bulky, meaning that it performs the role of a scarfer much better than magnezone, while magnezone's better bulk allows it to take a few hits form a number of steel types that don't have anything to hit steel types, and 2hko/1hko with specs. These 2 are both support roles for a team that has decided to only have these 2 pokemon to hit steel types. (if you are using them both on the same team then you may want to have one of them have hp fround and the other have hp fire.)

+
Talonflame and fletchinder
I know that many of you are of the firm belief that fletchinder is a terrible pokemon and isn't as good as talonflame in any regard. In saying this you are almost correct. There are a number of sets that talonflame is better at but there are a number of sets where the 2 are equals. Those 2 sets are sd acrobatics w/o flare blitz and spdef. However if you are using both of them on the same team then it is likely that you fill try and sweep with them, in which case fletchinder will probably be using sd acrobatics and talonflame could either use choice band or sd brave bird.

+
roserade and roselia
These two will actually have to perform two pretty different roles. The reason for this is that roserade outclasses roserlia offensively with both 10 higher speed and special attack. It also has 10 better special defense and 5 better attack. However roselia has higher hp and it can hold eviolite. All of this means that roselia will have to play a much more defensive role than roserade, which it can do while setting up hazards and healing with synthethis, and maybe even use aromatherapy, while being able to remain unpassive with giga drain and sludge bomb. roserade is still able to play a defensive role if you wish to (on the same team) but an offensive one is preffered, with acces to technician hp fire. If you have roselia with you can exchange what would normally be spikes with another offensive move like extrasensory or shadow ball or energy ball.

+
hoopa unbound and regular hoopa
If you already have hoopa unbound on your team, why not have some fun and add the other hoopa? While regular hoopa is outclassed by hoopa-u it still allows it to fill a lot of moveslots that the other one can't, due to the fact that hoopa unbound is able to use a whole host of moves. For this the 2 pokemon can pretty much run the same sets, however you should be more inclined to give hoopa-u the set that is more physically orientated.

+
Ferrothorn and ferroseed.
These two pokemon are fantastic. The two have even been used in ou by the teambuilder CTC but with ferroseed's stat boosts the pair become even better especially seems how a lot of teams struggle to deal with just one of them. The main differences between the two are that ferrothorn has higher attack and health. these two factors mean that it is much more beneficial for ferroseed to use leech seed as it gains more health and it's attacking options are worse. The two of the can share the plethora of support moves that each of them hold, with sr, spikes, thunder wave, power whip, gyro ball, leechs seed +protect and toxic it's a wonder that the pair haven't been used more.

honourable mentions
+
bisharp and pawniard
unfortunately for these two pawniard is far too weak to actually be used on a competitive team.

+
weavile and sneasel
the problem with these two is that sneasel isn't strong enough, although that isn't by much, I have used him in the past to great success when sneasel was in nu.

+
gengar+haunter
these two have almost identical stats, but their problem is that neither of them are very good, both their speed tier and special attack stat being pretty weak.
While your post is interesting and all, using both Hoopa forms in the same team would be in direct conflict with the species clause since they have the same pokédex number (#720).
 
Yes it is, bulk up is the best due to it's lower defense than special defense, the +20 stat boost is huge, so yeah, definitely viablee to say the least.
 
Vivillon----->A-
as a lead vivillon is absolutely fantastic it is extremely hard for your opponent to deal with and you will almost always sleep your opponent and then maybe do damage to another pokemon with quiver dance hurricane/bug buzz the main things that get around this will normally just result in you not leading with vivillon and trying to get a quiver dance in and doing damage when it suits you (the things that stop it being magic bounce)
gogoat----->B
gogoat is very strong when it does manage to set up, however you will often find that there are many pokemon that are able to beat it in ts, maybe the same amount that it's able to beat. Regardless it's still useful as a pivot and bulky set up sweeper.

I may or may not add more things to this list later.
 
Jolteon Unranked---->B+

The set I've been playtesting with is:

Jolteon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Signal Beam
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Jolteon has always occupied an unfortunate place in the normal tiers, but in tiershift it finally gets what its always needed and has become a monster that terrorizes most of OU. Outside of tiershift, Jolteon's base special attack of 110 and base speed of 130 comes up juuuuust short. In OU, Raikou gets base 115 special attack and while running a timid nature it gets 361 speed. Modest Jolteon gets 359 speed, worse bulk, and worse movepool. That water-heavy state of the UU metagame, meanwhile, usually makes Helio a more viable choice, cosigning this almost monster to the lower tiers.

In tiershift, however, everything changes. With a base speed of 140, Jolteon gets a blistering speed of 379 while running a modest nature. With 120 base special attack, and enough speed to afford running modest nature, specs Jolteon hits much harder than specs Raikou. Jolteon also gets an excellent ability in Volt Absorb, which gives it plenty of opportunities to switch in, somewhat making up for its pathetic bulk (even after the tiershift boost.) This thing leaves major holes in most teams, but there are a few things holding it back from S, or even A, rank.

1). Movepool. Jolteon's movepool is incredibly shallow. It gets no significant boosting move outside of Agility, which it couldn't need less. This means specs is the only viable set, which is fine, because it hits ridiculously hard. A bigger problem is its lack of coverage moves. Jolteon would kill for Extrasensory, or even Shadow Ball, like Raikou gets. After Volt Switch/Thunderbolt/HP Ice, Jolteon's best option is the near-useless Signal Beam, which I haven't used once in all my playtesting. HP Grass is an option to help deal with Quagsire (I'll talk about this more in a second) but lacking HP Ice opens up a host of other problems (notably TankChomp) and makes Jolteon's sweeping ability much more selective.

2). Quagsire. This thing is probably the most common wall I've seen in tiershift, and for good reason! Unaware + now decent bulk + recover + phenomenal water/ground typing. It walls Jolteon hard. HP Ice & Signal Beam do nothing and this, in combination with the electric immunity, simply means your opponent will switch in Quagsire over and over as long as they still have it. Trust me. I've seen it a lot in my playtesting.

3). Priority. Jolteon's pathetic bulk, especially on the physical side, means its sweep can be stopped in its tracks by sucker punch. At full health it can, however, survive a mach punch or bullet punch from some 'mons.

That said, all of that is a relatively minor obstruction to Jolteon's sweeping, at least in my experience. Thunderbolt is a OHKO or 2HKO on nearly everything it does neutral damage to, and I do mean nearly everything. Jolteon has worked best for me as a late game sweeper. After Quagsire is gone Jolteon will reliably sweep most teams.

Another great use for Jolteon is to scare stuff out and prevent setting up early game, not to mention momentum grabbing with volt switch (although, again, due to the prevalence of Quagsire in tiershift it will often simply be blocked.) Jolteon can also be used to punch big holes in walls like unaware Clefable (which it can inconsistantly 2HKO.)

All in all, thanks to Jolteon's blistering speed, sky high special attack, momentum grabbing volt switch, and ability to hit 99% of pokes for neutral or super-effective damage its worth consideration for every team. It does require some support, but if your team can provide it Jolteon will pay you back. Good partners in my experience are anything that can deal with Quagsire, reliable defogers/rapid spinners (Jolteon will want to switch in a lot if its being used to scare stuff out and its sad bulk means it really doesn't appreciate taking extra damage), and also hazard setters to take advantage of Jolteon's ability to scare stuff out and accumulate chip damage.
 
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Jolteon Unranked---->B+

The set I've been playtesting with is:

Jolteon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Signal Beam
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Jolteon has always occupied an unfortunate place in the normal tiers, but in tiershift it finally gets what its always needed and has become a monster that terrorizes most of OU. Outside of tiershift, Jolteon's base special attack of 110 and base speed of 130 comes up juuuuust short. In OU, Raikou gets base 115 special attack and while running a timid nature it gets 361 speed. Modest Jolteon gets 359 speed, worse bulk, and worse movepool. That water-heavy state of the UU metagame, meanwhile, usually makes Helio a more viable choice, cosigning this almost monster to the lower tiers.

In tiershift, however, everything changes. With a base speed of 140, Jolteon gets a blistering speed of 379 while running a modest nature. With 120 base special attack, and enough speed to afford running modest nature, specs Jolteon hits much harder than specs Raikou. Jolteon also gets an excellent ability in Volt Absorb, which gives it plenty of opportunities to switch in, somewhat making up for its pathetic bulk (even after the tiershift boost.) This thing leaves major holes in most teams, but there are a few things holding it back from S, or even A, rank.

1). Movepool. Jolteon's movepool is incredibly shallow. It gets no significant boosting move outside of Agility, which it couldn't need less. This means specs is the only viable set, which is fine, because it hits ridiculously hard. A bigger problem is its lack of coverage moves. Jolteon would kill for Extrasensory, or even Shadow Ball, like Raikou gets. After Volt Switch/Thunderbolt/HP Ice, Jolteon's best option is the near-useless Signal Beam, which I haven't used once in all my playtesting. HP Grass is an option to help deal with Quagsire (I'll talk about this more in a second) but lacking HP Ice opens up a host of other problems (notably TankChomp) and makes Jolteon's sweeping ability much more selective.

2). Quagsire. This thing is probably the most common wall I've seen in tiershift, and for good reason! Unaware + now decent bulk + recover + phenomenal water/ground typing. It walls Jolteon hard. HP Ice & Signal Beam do nothing and this, in combination with the electric immunity, simply means your opponent will switch in Quagsire over and over as long as they still have it. Trust me. I've seen it a lot in my playtesting.

3). Priority. Jolteon's pathetic bulk, especially on the physical side, means its sweep can be stopped in its tracks by sucker punch. At full health it can, however, survive a mach punch or bullet punch from some 'mons.

That said, all of that is a relatively minor obstruction to Jolteon's sweeping, at least in my experience. Thunderbolt is a OHKO or 2HKO on nearly everything it does neutral damage to, and I do mean nearly everything. Jolteon has worked best for me as a late game sweeper. After Quagsire is gone Jolteon will reliably sweep most teams.

Another great use for Jolteon is to scare stuff out and prevent setting up early game, not to mention momentum grabbing with volt switch (although, again, due to the prevalence of Quagsire in tiershift it will often simply be blocked.) Jolteon can also be used to punch big holes in walls like unaware Clefable (which it can inconsistantly 2HKO.)

All in all, thanks to Jolteon's blistering speed, sky high special attack, momentum grabbing volt switch, and ability to hit 99% of pokes for neutral or super-effective damage its worth consideration for every team. It does require some support, but if your team can provide it Jolteon will pay you back. Good partners in my experience are anything that can deal with Quagsire, reliable defogers/rapid spinners (Jolteon will want to switch in a lot if its being used to scare stuff out and its sad bulk means it really doesn't appreciate taking extra damage), and also hazard setters to take advantage of Jolteon's ability to scare stuff out and accumulate chip damage.
generally electabuzz outclasses jolteon, it may have 15 less base speed but 120 is what you really need to outspeed which electabuzz does.
 
generally electabuzz outclasses jolteon, it may have 15 less base speed but 120 is what you really need to outspeed which electabuzz does.
Hmm, I haven't used Electabuzz, so can I ask why that is? Electabuzz also gets 5 less base special attack, and wouldn't Electabuzz have to run timid? As far as bulk goes, 80/77/105 is barely better than Jolteon's 75/70/105. What does Electabuzz bring to the table? Better movepool?
 
Question... HP is a flat increase, right? So a PU mon with a 95 HP as a stat (331 HP) would instead have 105 (351 HP) instead, yes?

Also, speaking of 95 HP, here's a mon that could use a mention...

Bouffalant @ Leftovers
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 144 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 108 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Return
- Earthquake

This thing's an absolute monster, sparring (105)/115/115 defenses, taking weaker attacks with its subs as well as blocking status. 130 attack is nothing to scoff at, especially when boosted by Swords Dance.
 
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