Torkoal [QC: 0/2]

[Hera]

[SET]
name: Sun Support
move 1: Lava Plume
move 2: Stealth Rock
move 3: Rapid Spin
move 4: Toxic / Body Press
Item: Heat Rock
ability: Drought
nature: Bold
evs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
As one of the two Pokémon with access to Drought, Torkoal has a unique niche within the tier as a Drought setter. With strong utility options, it is almost always a go-to lead and has great physical bulk. Lava Plume is chosen over more damaging moves like Flamethrower because of its ability to spread burns. The combination of Stealth Rock and Rapid Spin lets it set its own hazards and remove them in one teamslot. Toxic is able to cripple common switchins to Torkoal, such as Mantine and Vaporeon, while Body Press nails Snorlax and Gigalith, 2HKOing the former and having a good chance to 2HKO the latter after Stealth Rocks. Explosion is also an option to maintain momentum and maximizes Sun turns. Heat Rock is preferred on Sun teams due to lengthening the amount of turns to abuse sun. However, Eject Button gives instant momentum once at the cost of less Sun turns overall, and has a more niche use of making Torkoal immune to Poltergeist. A Bold nature and maximum investment in HP and Defense allow Torkoal to be as physically bulky as possible, and the remaining EVs go into Speed to creep uninvested Escavalier.

Torkoal doesn't like opposing weather setters, such as Gigalith, so teammates able to deal with those are crucial. Rhydon and Golurk force Gigalith out, and combined with prior chip from Torkoal, can wear down Gigalith to the point where Torkoal can shine again. In return, Torkoal can provide them with boosted Fire Punches or Heat Crashes via Drought to help them break through their standard checks, such as itemless Bronzong and Escavalier. Solar Power users, particularly Charizard and Heliolisk, heavily appreaciate the Sun boosting their special attack, which allows them to break through their standard checks, such as Vaporeon. Torkoal also synergies well with Chlorophyll sweepers, such as Vileplume and Leafeon, which can easily clean a weakened team or break through walls early on. Leafeon's defensive utility is also useful for dealing with Rhydon, which Sun teams and Torkoal can struggle with. Xatu also heavily benefits Torkoal by being able to keep hazards off the field, and gets a boosted Heat Wave to threaten those that resist its STAB moves.

CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Heracross2.0, 414072]]
- Quality checked by: [[username1, userid1] , [username2, userid2]]
- Grammar checked by: [[username1, userid1]]

 

[roman]

not qc

- body press / toxic for last moveslot, former 60% chance to 2hko gigalith with rocks up & 2hko snorlax, latter hits mantine which is important enough for a slash
- could mention explosion somewhere, maximizes sun turns if opp is attempting to stall them out
- heat rock / eject button for item, both are more important for sun for the support they provide. hdb not relevant because torkoal usually goes switch in -> switch out -> sack later for more sun turns. not really used for anything spectacular to need boots. you could argue a case for spinning, but it really isn't effective as a spinner because opponent will likely flat out win vs torkoal (mons like rhyp) or trade their (mostly useless) steel to get rocks up, burning sun turns in the meantime. hazard control like xatu is much more proactive for sun teams but leaving rapid spin on the set is fine on the off chance you can remove hazards
- wouldn't mention solar beam, torkoal is strapped for moves already + the targets both are crippled by toxic and toad hardly if at all switches into the sun abusers, gastro is not an amazing answer either
- mention potential speed creep for gigalith on body press sets in ev comments
- remove the vanilluxe mentions, hail teams aren't used and it can't switch into torkoal regardless
- mention the defensive utility leafeon provides, notably handling rhyperior which is otherwise threatening for sun teams
- add heliolisk as a sun abuser, sun gives it the power to break all switchins bar somewhat rare dedicated spdef walls (p2 for example). i would just remove centiskorch, turn it into a ' solar power abusers ' sentence, and replace centi with lisk. centi is fine, but solar power mons capitalize on sun much more. you could add a section about misc pokemon who appreciate sun and add lazzle and centi there, but they are tough to fit and stack weaknesses with charizard

 

[Hera]

Hey there, thanks for the feedback! Most of it was implemented, although I do have a couple of questions.

-I agree that HDB probably isn't worthy of a slash, but why Eject Button? I feel like the niche it provides (one free switchin) is heavily outweighed by the net gain Sun teams get with 8 turns of Sun. I just want to understand the thought process behind it.
-Wouldn't speed creep on Body Press sets cause Torkoal to lose the lead matchup or the 1v1 vs Gigalith due to Sand Stream coming after Drought, or is the speed creep generally worth it?

 

[roman]

Hey there, thanks for the feedback! Most of it was implemented, although I do have a couple of questions.

-I agree that HDB probably isn't worthy of a slash, but why Eject Button? I feel like the niche it provides (one free switchin) is heavily outweighed by the net gain Sun teams get with 8 turns of Sun. I just want to understand the thought process behind it.
-Wouldn't speed creep on Body Press sets cause Torkoal to lose the lead matchup or the 1v1 vs Gigalith due to Sand Stream coming after Drought, or is the speed creep generally worth it?

good questions, eject button is notable in the broad scope of sun because it gives free turns for an offensive archetype that generally struggles to fit pivots which can get in and out quickly so abusers can capitalize on sun. in a vacuum looking solely at torkoal it doesn't really make sense, but because tork is really only viable on sun teams i think it's important for a slash. you say that the 8 turns of sun outweigh eject button, but you'll be burning many of those turns trying to get your abusers in. for me it's like a trade- with heat rock you can sack torkoal at some point in the game and get a long stretch of sun, with eject button you can immediately pressure your opp from the get go, both are good options. fair point on the gigalith thing, no one leads gigalith because torkoal is typically slower though. the body press + speed evs combo is more of a tech for when gigalith switches in and is more relevant for eject button, idk what to do about this. could probably just remove speed creep, it's maybe over the top. idk

hope this helped answer your questions