TPP VII - Format Discussion

Which formats should be in TPP?

  • PokeBH

    Votes: 18 20.5%

  • Stab n Mega

    Votes: 21 23.9%

  • Camove Chaos

    Votes: 27 30.7%

  • AAA Ubers

    Votes: 19 21.6%

  • BWPUAAATD

    Votes: 30 34.1%

  • StAAAbmons

    Votes: 28 31.8%

  • Orre Colosseum (2x noodle’s post suggestions)

    Votes: 17 19.3%

  • SS National Dex DOU

    Votes: 25 28.4%

  • Other (post in thread)

    Votes: 6 6.8%
  • Total voters
    88
TheIronPikachu

TheIronPikachu

is a Tiering Contributor
This TPP will sadly be the last iteration of TPP, with the reward being a custom avatar, so we want it to be the most enjoyable version of TPP. With it on the horizon we figured we'd open a thread for more ease of discussion to decide on the formats for this years tournament.

TPP normally follows the following structure:
OMM -AAA related
OMM
OU tier -with an extra set of rules
Doubles tier
Rands tier -with an extra set of rules
NDubers - without obtainable formes
Same Six

Do you think this structure is correct? Should we pivot one OMM for another approach? Do we want to keep running NDubers !Obtainable forms? Looking forward to the discussion to set the stage for an amazing final year.
 
I don't really have much to say other than for the OMM formats since I'm mainly active within OMMs, the only ones I'd really say are probably in good enough shape are the 3 played last TPP (PokeAAA, LC mnm, Camove Chaos), PokeBH, Stab and Mega, and maybe TSAAA unless you're counting stuff as AAA Ubers. If you ask other OMMers, you'll probably get a longer list but those are the obvious ones to me as a guy who mainly plays LC oms and probably won't sign up unless LC mnm or SnM are selected.

I personally would love LC mnm to return but doubt it will just because the signups for it wasn't great, and I do not want to get my hopes up in the case of it not making it.
 
1-2 switch is a good dou format i swear BUT theres also reg i + megas which actually slaps. pic isnt bad either but pic has also had like 3 tours in the past 4 months + rn theres ompl lol so i would probably be more inclined to suggest reg i + megas

also i dont really think necessarily locking an omm slot to aaa is good, not many aaa oms are actually popular right now and pokeaaa is way too similar to regular aaa to recommend it currently (plus outdated). i would really say that snm + camove is best but you could probably change camove to something like pokebh if theres more interest for it. if an aaa tier is necessary then id probably want to suggest nd aaa ubers but that also doesnt even exist rn so uuuuuu
 
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Here's some data I've extracted from each iteration of Tours Plaza Premier(e)s; interpolating from this said data and coming from what I've seen from different experienced people, I come to suggest some of the metagames picked for this iteration of TPP:

AAA-related: This may be bonkers, but I think Frantic Fusions could be a good metagame to pick. It may be coming from OM (not OMM), but the metagame premise looked like Almost Any Ability depending on what Pokemon you're fusing it with; besides, there was Partners in Crime in TPP V before it popped off big time...
(>inb4 waffle04 suggested [Gen 5] PU + AAA + Twisted Dimensions here)

Camomons-related: I think keeping Camove Chaos would be best here since there is a solid playerbase in different small-scale tournaments since last year's iteration, unless you could probably ditch it with something else entirely from Monotype-, CAP-, or even STAB-related OMMs, which I definitely don't mind.

Doubles-related: Either you keep Orre Colosseum with more rulesets (Nnico Iosi could have a hand on that one) or you could just go towards either Doubles UU, Doubles Ubers, or Doubles LC (or... Doubles + CAP???); heck, what Clas said about VGC Reg I (+Megas) could be plausible.

Mix-and-Mega-related: As much as I (think I) put LC MnM as my tiers not played last year's TPP, working alongside Yoru97, zastra, and giove97 made me think this is actually a fun tier to play with; I'd not be surprised if a different MnM-related OMM would be placed over LC MnM, though...

OU-related: I have a suggestion: either make it all-out Iron Chef OU (and hosts must create secret ingredients), or just keep any ruleset for Mystery OU (just... no Freedom Cup please.)
 
Euphonos said:
OU-related: I have a suggestion: either make it all-out Iron Chef OU (and hosts must create secret ingredients), or just keep any ruleset for Mystery OU (just... no Freedom Cup please.)
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freedom cup rn would be using reg i ruleset and, while i certainly am interested in hosting a tour for it at some point, i dont think it exactly follows the "ou-related" ruleset lol
 
Hey o/
Considering this as the last tpp we can probably go for all different tiers that is like 1 om which is not necessarily aaa(there are equally good ones out there) and opting over for a samesolo/mono 1v1/crazyhouse or even ttg I kinda hope that we get an extra slot for this tpp though would be fun,pic sounds a really solid doubles slot both 6v6, and 2v2 is really nice after reading the eu post for the rands format fusion rands might be fun it’s new for pretty much everyone it would be interesting to see how it pans out.
 
Personal ideal OMM tiers, in order of suitability. The general hierarchy is widely play(test)ed tiers with a properly maintained banlist > tiers not as far removed from standard > unmaintained obscure mashups. The reasoning should be obvious – the biggest risk is players constantly being incentivized to bring random bullshit that the tiers' respective banlists did not address. The less similar a tier is from standard tiers (and if we're being nice, core OMs), the more likely it is that unhealthy and/or overpowered bs is not taken care of through tiering, leading to a more matchup-fishing and less enjoyable experiences for players.

One of Camove Chaos/PokeBH (probably Camove because of overall better balancing and more consistent playerbase)
STAAAB (banlist was overhauled a while back, though ideally there would be a playtesting period in the OMM room at least a few weeks before the tour starts to iron it out)
LC MNM has a pretty good rep but I don't actually know anything about it so sticking it here
Some misc. 2-OM mashups between popular OMs that mesh well with each other (PokeAAA/STAB MNM/TSAAA etc.). As is, most of these aren't very well balanced though.
Don't consider 2-OM mashups between more obscure OMs (ex. Tradeabilities) or 3+ OMs (ex. Alphabet Soup/Ultra Mix), regardless of popularity. Non-mainers are inherently at a strong disadvantage, which makes for an uninteresting experience unless you spend significant amounts of time exploring and thoroughly skillgap your opponent. No strong opinion on NatDex/CAP OMs
 
Hi, last TPP, wow, how cool and quirky. My amazing and cool thoughts on each tier slot

OMM -AAA related - AAA is good, keep this in some concept
OMM - Rotating OM possible? I know OU rotates too but could work
OU tier - with an extra set of rules - Could maybe keep the same, does need to differentiate from same six though
Doubles tier - keep Orre Col!
Rands tier -with an extra set of rules - B16P6 Shared Power has to stay!
NDubers - without obtainable formes - possible get rid, this is the inventive slot imo, can go down a different, possibly more om-route?
Same Six - keep but don't let ipika roll the mons
 
For the OMM I’d like to advocate for PokeBH. (This probably has been advocated in this thread but I’m lazy and didn’t read any posts except the OP)

PokeBH is one of the most developed tiers in OMM, so I think we should add that. There are decently enough informational yaps on the OMM Megathread, and it’s not that hard to understand (imo).
 
Oculars said:
Here to vouch for B12P6 shared power rands one of the greatest formats to exist and a very easy to grasp concept for mainers/non mainers alike
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As my only comment about rands, I not only heavily support this but also want to highlight that this format has a permanent ladder, which didn't happen for rands' TPP since SM Battle Factory (ew). Let's run b12p6 shared power back, it was very fun last year.
 
Shame this is gonna be the last TPP. I was gonna skip it this year, but I thought I might sign-up since this could be the last team tour I'll be in for sometime.

Same 6 is non-negotiable. I would keep Rands tier and ND Ubers the same from last year. I would also prefer if we continue Mystery OU + Iron Chef and allow crazy metagame cooks within reason. I'll let the doubles players talk about the Doubles slot, but from what I've seen Orre Colosseum goes hard.

aerobee said:
Don't consider 2-OM mashups between more obscure OMs (ex. Tradeabilities) or 3+ OMs (ex. Alphabet Soup/Ultra Mix), regardless of popularity.
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Seconding this. I would be fine with ND and CAP OMs though, although I have no clue which ones I would suggest.

Speaking personally as an OMM player, I'm burnt out with Camove and would prefer literally any format over it bar ridiculous metas like Alphabet Soup. However, even I can't deny that it has the most dedicated playerbase and the most up-to-date resources, thereby making it the most suitable for a tour like this. I think LC MnM and STAB MnM are also excellent choices, but there are noticeable gaps in the resources and they lack the same playerbase that camove has. PokeBH is interesting but it is a pretty specialised metagame.

I like PokeAAA since it casts the broadest net for potential players. It's probably the most straight forward OMM as anyone with even a passing idea of AAA will be able to get a handle on it fairly quickly. If PokeAAA is a bit stale, STAAAB and TSAAA could work. I'm not 100% sure if TSAAA has accurate resources but it did see a spike in development a couple of months back. I'm somewhat skeptical regarding STAAAB since it amplifies the issues in current-gen STAB and AAA, but it is definitely an interesting metagame to watch from the spectator's pov.
 
LogIce said:
Here to advocate for SS ND DOU, newer tier but it drew a lot of interest for recent inclusion of it in SS NDPL. I think the tier would be a good fit for this tour. Here’s the metagame thread: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threa...oubles-metagame-discussion-resources.3764717/
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Would like to second this as the premier yapper in the SSND thread— the tier is in a great spot and having another tour to explore it outside of SSNDPL would be amazing— Dynamax introduces such a unique dynamic (ha) to the tier that you cannot get from literally any other DOU metagame & it's a great builders' format because of how new it is. The meta is literally being redefined every other week by some of the best DOU players of all time, it incentivizes immensely skill based teambuilding and rewards prep and skill with Dynamax. An excellent tier and one that should definitely get another shot here!
 
Since Euphonos mentioned non-standard Orre Colosseum, I'd thought I'd list out what I consider to be the best options if people wanted to explore those more. The Orre community had a blast participating last time and if y'all would like to include us again we would certainly appeciate it. Here are what I consider good options if there is a desire to include Orre but have different rules:
  • Journey Across America (2006 Nintendo official tournament format that allows all restricted Pokemon)
  • GS Cup (two restricted allowed, just like in VGC GS Cup)
  • Limited (played at L50 and no Legendary Pokemon allowed)
  • Under (played at L50 and functions like the UU version of Orre)
While my personal interest is in Journey Across America and I might be able to finish a forum post soon for it which would give it easily accessible resources and info on it, admittedly I think it *initially* has the least appealing meta since a lot of the teambuilding decisions revolve around the diversity of the move pools of top tiers like Mewtwo and Lugia rather than diversity of the Pokemon themselves. However, I would push back and say that a recent Japan vs. The World exhibition back in January has further highlighted potential dviersity in team building in the format.

I was busy with work during our GS Cup phase and wasn't paying attention to it as much. Gonna need someone else to provide input on that alt format.

We just had a Limited tournament that was very well received. People are liking how the removal of legendries creates a more open metagame without it feeling random and uncompetitive. There's been a great enjoyment of the balance of power in the format and the different teambuilding options available. One of our longest tenured members and admins remarked after our tour last weekend that *this* format is what feels like "Gen 3 VGC" to him.

Under, functioning like an Orre UU tier, has been well received. Not only was it played in a major Orre tournament a year ago, a subset of the community has continued to play it. People last TPP seemed to enjoy when a dead Orre set got played with NFEs, this would be the closest viable equivalent to that.

I say "closest viable equivalent" regarding Under because while there is an Orre format that has had player interest and feature a lot of NFEs, there is currently disagreement over the ruleset and whether it should function as a NU tier or NFE tier (or split and do both). Additionally, that format as well as our Unlimited format (no Pokemon or items banned, mythics and Soul Dew allowed) and LC equivalent have yet to be played in a major tournaments.

EDIT: Is having a certain amount of existing/previous interest in a format important though?
 
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