Resource USM Creative & Underrated Sets v2

Posted this in the Metagame Discussion thread, but I felt it could also fit in here.

3 Attacks Hidden Power Ice Mega Charizard X
006_xmega.gif


Charizard-Mega-X @ Charizardite X
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Earthquake
- Roost

Been playing with this set a bit on the ladder and it's surprising me, to be honest. People seem to forget that Zard X has a Special Attack stat that is also 130 like its Attack stat, and this allows HP Ice, with a hindering nature and no investment, to 2HKO defensive Lando-T, Gliscor, and Zygarde. For the record, with Stealth Rock up, Flare Blitz into HP Ice is a guaranteed kill vs defensive Lando-T, and even without rocks, it's still a pretty high chance to kill. Offensive sets are BTFO with the combination regardless. I've even had scenarios where I'd stay as base Charizard against Landos, as HP Ice can still 2HKO max HP variants without the need of Mega Evolution.

I haven't missed Dragon Claw yet despite it being the best move to hit the Latis on switchin, and the Water-type matchup gets a bit tricky as well without the good neutral damage, but that's why mons like Specs Dazzling Gleam Tapu Koko and Ferrothorn make for amazing partners to this set as they can handle those pretty easily (Ferro has to watch for HP Fire Mega Lati tho), and Zard X running HP Ice allows Koko to run HP Fire as a backup for opposing Ferrothorn and Mega Scizor. The only other common Dragon-type I can think of is Kyube but it just needs the smallest amount of chip damage to be killed by Flare Blitz after Stealth Rock anyways, and Garchomp, which is a rare mon at this point, is also hit hard by HP Ice thanks to 4x weakness.

I wish this mon got Ice Punch ;_;

0- SpA Charizard Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-Therian: 204-240 (53.4 - 62.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

-1 252 Atk Tough Claws Charizard-Mega-X Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Landorus-Therian: 133-157 (34.8 - 41%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
0- SpA Charizard-Mega-X Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-Therian: 236-280 (61.7 - 73.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

0- SpA Charizard Hidden Power Ice vs. 244 HP / 152 SpD Gliscor: 180-212 (51.1 - 60.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Poison Heal
0- SpA Charizard-Mega-X Hidden Power Ice vs. 244 HP / 152 SpD Gliscor: 204-244 (57.9 - 69.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Poison Heal

0- SpA Charizard Hidden Power Ice vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Zygarde: 176-208 (49.1 - 58.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
0- SpA Charizard-Mega-X Hidden Power Ice vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Zygarde: 204-244 (56.9 - 68.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Forgot to post replays last time, my bad >.> In the last replay, in particular, shows an example of having situations where you can potentially bluff a Zard Y when you use HP Ice as regular Zard to screw over your opponent.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-721678983

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-722133390

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-722137818

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-722008966

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-722142684
 
Last edited:
It's time for me to do something a little productive instead of 'advocating stale memes like Blacephalon' in Discord.

cloyster.gif

Cloyster @ Focus Sash
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Spear
- Liquidation / Explosion
- Spikes
- Shell Smash

Suicide lead Cloyster isn't really anything new, but I enjoy using this set a lot. Shell Smash Cloyster itself has lots of checks and counters available, but Cloyster manages to set up Shell Smash or set Spikes as it forces switches. What makes Cloyster good at this job is general prevalence of other Stealth Rock users such as Landorus-T and Heatran and the fact that it can pretty much pressure most Defog users, save Tapu Fini and Mega Scizor. Spikes is also helpful when the rest of the team appreciates Steel-types being weakened, and this leads to my explanation on the replay.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-723659609

Landorus-T sets Stealth Rock and essentially trades itself with Zapdos so that my Choice Scarf Kartana has a condition to clean up late game (until I realized Greninja is scarf) Cloyster comes in and finished Zapdos which is borderline dead, draws in Mega Scizor, and sets Spikes which help wearing down Magearna - another Pokémon that has to be gone for my Kartana and Victini to clean up. Spikes also secured 2HKO on Zygarde for Mega Gyarados.

Overall I find this set effective when paired with suicide lead Landorus-T - just watch out for Greninja lead. I am obviously nowhere close to being a good teambuilder but I hope the replay sorta gave a sense of how Cloyster can do a lot for offensive teams. Thanks for reading and have a nice day.
 
zygarde.gif

Zygarde @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Aura Break
EVs: 240 Atk / 88 SpD / 180 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Thousand Arrows
- Iron Tail
- Extreme Speed

This is a really interesting Zygarde set that I've been using lately that I wanted to share with everyone because I think it's better than anything else Zygarde can be running atm. The basic idea behind this set is that many of Zygarde's normal checks like Landorus-T and Clefable rely on super effective attacks that can't quite take out Zygarde in one hit to check it and Weakness Policy takes advantage of these attacks to make itself stronger. Iron Tail is used so that you can beat Zygarde because Outrage isn't really useful when you can smack everything with boosted arrows as is. Extreme Speed is also really nice because it blows up Greninja at +3 after rocks so you don't have to worry about getting Shuirken revenged after setting up against Clefable or Lando. The EV spread allows Zygarde to live any attack from Tapu Koko and outspeed Mega Lopunny at +1 while throwing the rest of the EVs into attack to make the most out of the increased power this has over other DD sets. Against Landorus-T, you can DD as they come in and get another boost as they HP Ice so that the Lando is forced out and you can pick up a kill or two before being taken down so that something else can sweep or straight up sweeping if the Landorus-T is down. Against Clefable, you can DD as they come in and hit it with arrows as they Moonblast because +1 arrows into +3 arrows takes it out. Obviously this set can't break past Mega Scizor unless it's heavily weakened unfortunately, but the fact that it can beat so many of its other normal answers while still beating everything it's supposed to is really nice. I recommend pairing this set with Toxic Spikes support so that you can deal with Tangrowth too, but this set's pretty self sufficient overall. Other good teammates include things that appreciate this set's ability to remove Clefable and Landorus-T like Hawlucha and Mawile respectively. BKC used this in an SPL tiebreak game recently and it performed really well, so this set is also proven to be good in tournament play. Overall, I think that this is a very good set that can be a potent sweeper against a myriad of playstyles and encourage you to use it as soon as you can because it's fucking fantastic.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen7ou-360338 - z0mog vs BKC, SPL tiebreak
 
658.gif

Greninja (M) @ Groundium Z
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Spikes
- Ice Beam
- Gunk Shot
- Dig

Z-Dig is a pretty interesting lure on Greninja. It allows it to lure Pokemon like Toxapex and Magearna and OHKO them which permit Pokemon like Tapu Lele, Keldeo or Magearna to become extremely good.

252 Atk Protean Greninja Tectonic Rage (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Magearna: 374-444 (103 - 122.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Protean Greninja Tectonic Rage (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Toxapex: 290-344 (95.7 - 113.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Black Sludge recovery
252 Atk Protean Greninja Tectonic Rage (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Jirachi: 422-498 (104.7 - 123.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Protean Greninja Tectonic Rage (160 BP) vs. 168 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 390-458 (101.8 - 119.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
-1 252 Atk Protean Greninja Tectonic Rage (160 BP) vs. 40 HP / 0 Def Mawile-Mega: 234-276 (93.2 - 109.9%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO

Replays :

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-726558715
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-726560991
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen7ou-363399
 
798.gif

Kartana @ Fightinium Z/Grassium Z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Leaf Blade
- Sacred Sword
- Tailwind

This is a scary and cool set that can snowball and become a dangerous set really quickly, u set up as u normally would but it can be used as a wallbreaker and sweeper. For example, u don't have to always have to have +2 Atk and Tailwind up, u can just tailwind on the Ferrothorn Z-Sacred Sword it and then continue to wreak havoc on your opponents team. this set is especially dangerous if your opponent doesn't has something like a Zapdos or a Amoongus. a lot of teams answers to Kartana is to revenge kill it but this set takes advantage of that. Torn is a rising mon to check Kartana but unfortunately.

252 Atk Kartana Bloom Doom (175 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tornadus-Therian: 220-260 (73.5 - 86.9%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-726639711

Some good partners with this set are

AV Tapu Bulu
Tyranitar/Tyranitar-Mega
Slow Wallbreakers That Can Abuse Tailwind Such as Heatran/Kyurem/Offensive Landorus/Hoopa

Have a good one :]
 
Behold my set

zap2.png

Zapdos @ Electrium Z
Ability: Static
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Heat Wave
- Roost

I used to run roost+3 attacks Zapdos, but it was way too passive in my opinion. So ive searched a set with offensive pressure
With this set,you may have a worse bulk than Keldeo, but you have both offensive pressure and sustain with roost.
Currently, im using this set in a offensive team. It is in my opinion insanely good. It checks: every landot w/o stone edge+scarf/defensive spread;Hawlucha;Mega pinsir when its healthy;Ferrothorn;etc

The good thing about this set, is the combination between fire/ice/electric coverage+speed+roost. Its both an offensive and a defensive set
I use thunderbolt over discharge because I need thunderbolt rawpower, plus with Electrium,it has 175BP.
Z Thunderbolt Zapdos is, in my opinion, a very good lure. Behold some calcs:

252 SpA Zapdos Hidden Power Ice vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-Therian: 308-364 (96.5 - 114.1%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

252 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 144-169 (35.9 - 42.1%) -- 89.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
+252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 279-328 (69.5 - 81.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery+(optional)rocks/prior damage=KO

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Clefable: 303-357 (76.9 - 90.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+252 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Clefable: 156-184 (39.5 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery=KO


BONUS if you are afraid of Heat Wave miss:
252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Kartana: 334-393 (128.4 - 151.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Rotom-Wash: 262-310 (86.4 - 102.3%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Heatran: 264-312 (68.3 - 80.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+252 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Heatran: 136-162 (35.2 - 41.9%) -- 83.3% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery+rocks/prior damage=KO

252 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 96-114 (26.5 - 31.5%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
+252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 186-219 (51.5 - 60.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO+rocks twice/prior damage=KO

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Charizard-Mega-X: 159-188 (53.5 - 63.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO : it means if rocks are up, zard X cant use zapdos as a set up bait. If it uses roost, you will have time to deal with it.

252 SpA Zapdos Heat Wave vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Kyurem-Black: 123-145 (31.4 - 37%) -- 80.7% chance to 3HKO
+252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Kyurem-Black: 169-199 (43.2 - 50.8%) -- 3.9% chance to 2HKO+rocks=KO

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Tapu Lele: 246-291 (87.5 - 103.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 40 HP / 0 SpD Mawile-Mega: 291-343 (115.9 - 136.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock, since Heat Wave doesnt OHKO. Especially when offensive variant isnt expected

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. +1 0 HP / 4 SpD Volcarona: 178-210 (57.2 - 67.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO:if volcarona tries to set up 1 Quiver dance after rocks: KO


Carrying a Z crystal is also handy: you can switch against knock off plus, it baits knock off kartana
+1 252 Atk Kartana Knock Off vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Zapdos: 156-184 (48.5 - 57.3%) -- 94.1% chance to 2HKO. In case of scarftana tries to clean

Also, some replays
dspojfpo is ME(aka my tryhard alt account);http://prntscr.com/jcvp59
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-741457716
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-740796070
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-740531200
as ME
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-741482743
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-741486458
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-741512757
 
Last edited:
nofakethekairi78 said:
Behold my set

View attachment 113893
Zapdos @ Electrium Z
Ability: Static
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Heat Wave
- Roost

I used to run roost+3 attacks Zapdos, but it was way too passive in my opinion. So ive searched a set with offensive pressure
With this set,you may have a worse bulk than Keldeo, but you have both offensive pressure and sustain with roost.
Currently, im using this set in a offensive team. It is in my opinion insanely good. It checks: every landot w/o stone edge+scarf/defensive spread;Hawlucha;Mega pinsir when its healthy;Ferrothorn;etc

The good thing about this set, is the combination between fire/ice/electric coverage+speed+roost. Its both an offensive and a defensive set
I use thunderbolt over discharge because I need thunderbolt rawpower, plus with Electrium,it has 175BP.
Z Thunderbolt Zapdos is, in my opinion, a very good lure. Behold some calcs:

252 SpA Zapdos Hidden Power Ice vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-Therian: 308-364 (96.5 - 114.1%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

252 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 144-169 (35.9 - 42.1%) -- 89.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
+252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 279-328 (69.5 - 81.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery+(optional)rocks/prior damage=KO

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Clefable: 303-357 (76.9 - 90.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+252 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Clefable: 156-184 (39.5 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery=KO


BONUS if you are afraid of Heat Wave miss:
252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Kartana: 334-393 (128.4 - 151.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Rotom-Wash: 262-310 (86.4 - 102.3%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Heatran: 264-312 (68.3 - 80.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+252 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Heatran: 136-162 (35.2 - 41.9%) -- 83.3% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery+rocks/prior damage=KO

252 SpA Zapdos Thunderbolt vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 96-114 (26.5 - 31.5%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
+252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 186-219 (51.5 - 60.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO+rocks twice/prior damge=KO

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Charizard-Mega-X: 159-188 (53.5 - 63.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO : it means if rocks are up, zard X cant use zapdos as a set up bait. If it uses roost, you will have time to deal with it.

252 SpA Zapdos Heat Wave vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Kyurem-Black: 123-145 (31.4 - 37%) -- 80.7% chance to 3HKO
+252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Kyurem-Black: 169-199 (43.2 - 50.8%) -- 3.9% chance to 2HKO+rocks=KO

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Tapu Lele: 246-291 (87.5 - 103.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. 40 HP / 0 SpD Mawile-Mega: 291-343 (115.9 - 136.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock, since Heat Wave doesnt OHKO. Especially when offensive variant isnt expected

252 SpA Zapdos Gigavolt Havoc (175 BP) vs. +1 0 HP / 4 SpD Volcarona: 178-210 (57.2 - 67.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO:if volcarona tries to set up 1 Quiver dance after rocks: KO


Carrying a Z crystal is also handy: you can switch against knock off plus, it baits knock off kartana
+1 252 Atk Kartana Knock Off vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Zapdos: 156-184 (48.5 - 57.3%) -- 94.1% chance to 2HKO. In case of scarftana tries to clean

Also, some replays
dspojfpo is ME(aka my tryhard alt account);http://prntscr.com/jcvp59
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-741457716
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-740796070
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-740531200
as ME
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-741482743
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-741486458
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-741512757
Click to expand...
I do like the idea of offensive zapdos, but your set should have 28 defense EVs so it still tanks a +2 HJK from Hawlucha, which is beneficial as many offensive teams are heavily pressured by lucha and it seems a shame to have a zap that can lose to it after rocks.
+2 252+ Atk Hawlucha High Jump Kick vs. 0 HP / 28 Def Zapdos: 204-240 (63.5 - 74.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
 
BlueLobster said:
I do like the idea of offensive zapdos, but your set should have 28 defense EVs so it still tanks a +2 HJK from Hawlucha, which is beneficial as many offensive teams are heavily pressured by lucha and it seems a shame to have a zap that can lose to it after rocks.
+2 252+ Atk Hawlucha High Jump Kick vs. 0 HP / 28 Def Zapdos: 204-240 (63.5 - 74.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
Click to expand...


I appreciate the suggestion, i guess its worth even if it will bit a little bit more difficult to bypass Heatran and Band ttar.
Thank you for the concern :)
PS: I forgot, with z tbolt, you can ohko +1 sp def Lucha, which,otherwise, has a chance to beat Zap
 
Screech Mega Tyranitar

tyranitar-mega.gif



Tyranitar-Mega @ Tyranitarite
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 164 HP / 252 Atk / 92 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Screech
- Pursuit
- Stone Edge
- Crunch

Spread outspeeds Mega Venu and Mega Mawile, maximized attack and rest into Bulk.

I saw in a thread I think called "next best thing" Screech Tyranitar and I was inspired so much I built a team around this. I forgot who it was so shoutouts to you :)

Screech is an interesting move that drops your opponents defense by two stages. Compared to an boosting move, Screech hits the target and can thus overpower Unaware mons like Clefable or Quagsire. Screech+Pursuit can easily remove threats that love to scout. Examples include Zapdos, Chansey, Skarmory. Screech also punishes pivots like Tangrowth and Toxapex. Tapu Fini is an amazing partner to prevent status. Wishsupport is also very very good with this Set.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-742140183 Turn 3 and Turn 4 trapped Quagsire. Turn 57 and 58: Trapped SKarmory
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-742356590 Skarmory trapped Turn 3-5.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-742353134 Screech helps me beat Iron Defense Necrozma and Cosmic Power Clefable
 
Last edited:
Steel With It said:
Hey, robopoke, what's that Curse Gourgeist set in the replays? That looks fascinating.
Click to expand...
I am tired of all these Sash Landot Explosion Leads. Gourgeist resists Earthquake and is immune to Explosion. Frisk reveals my opponents item so it helps scout my opponents teamstructure very early in the game. This is extremly valuable information to craft a gameplan early on. It also helps counter all forms of Zygarde because Curse bypasses Substitute. It also switches well into Tapu Bulu and compared to other switchins like Mega Scizo, Gourgeist can just spam Leech Seed instead of clicking Recover. Madness does 50% dmg, I get 2 turns of Grassy+Lefties and Leech Seed on my opponents switch in.

I am not trying to be arrogant but unless you are a pro do not ever use this mon in OU if you are trying to win.
 
Last edited:
Supersonic Skystrike Azumarill

azumarill.gif


Z-Bounce (Azumarill) @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 12 HP / 252 Atk / 244 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Liquidation/Knock Off
- Bounce

I'm not gonna lie: Azu is pretty trash in today's metagame. Zygarde's presence basically forces most teams to run a grass-type that can hard-wall most Azu variants (Belly Drum included). However, I noticed that this thing has Bounce in its movepool, and thought about the great success of things like Z-Fly Lando. Now, of course, Azu doesn't get STAB on Bounce, but for what it's trying to break through, it really doesn't need it. Check out some calcs:

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Supersonic Skystrike (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 88 Def Venusaur-Mega: 328-388 (90.3 - 106.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Supersonic Skystrike (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 44 Def Amoonguss: 534-630 (123.8 - 146.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock and Black Sludge recovery

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Supersonic Skystrike (160 BP) vs. 252 HP / 28 Def Tangrowth: 340-402 (84.1 - 99.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Supersonic Skystrike (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 212+ Def Tangrowth: 270-318 (66.9 - 78.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

The only one of those that can really live to tell the tale after switching into an Aqua Jet is Phys Def Tangrowth, but if you can hit it on the switchin, it dies to Play Rough afterwards. Similar story with Tapu Bulu: It outspeeds Azu, but it 100% dies to Skystrike if you can catch it on the switchin. 244 speed EVs allow Azu to outrun up to uninvested Mega Venusaur (iirc people haven't started speed creeping with that thing yet for anything).

Furthermore, even without +6 from Belly Drum or a Choice Band, Azu's Aqua Jet can still be a valuable form of priority. For example, it does over 70 to Volcarona, meaning that it can't set up and win with Rocks on the field. Liquidation still has a solid 2HKO on defensive Lando through Intimidate, and Azu's great defensive typing allows it to still check mons like Ash Gren and non-Gunk Protean Gren, as well as making choiced Latios think twice about clicking Draco.

Of course, as with most lures, the biggest advantage is breaking through defensive cores for other Pokemon. Mons like Greninja and Zygarde love having their biggest checks destroyed, and Azu can easily dispatch the annoying Grass-Types that give them trouble.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-743654146

Low-ladder replay, sure, but it demonstrates what this Azu set does best: breaking through Ground checks (in this case, Mega Venusaur) and letting Scarf Drill destroy the opponent's team.
 
Miniature Pink Danger said:
Supersonic Skystrike Azumarill

azumarill.gif


Z-Bounce (Azumarill) @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 12 HP / 252 Atk / 244 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Liquidation/Knock Off
- Bounce

I'm not gonna lie: Azu is pretty trash in today's metagame. Zygarde's presence basically forces most teams to run a grass-type that can hard-wall most Azu variants (Belly Drum included). However, I noticed that this thing has Bounce in its movepool, and thought about the great success of things like Z-Fly Lando. Now, of course, Azu doesn't get STAB on Bounce, but for what it's trying to break through, it really doesn't need it. Check out some calcs:

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Supersonic Skystrike (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 88 Def Venusaur-Mega: 328-388 (90.3 - 106.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Supersonic Skystrike (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 44 Def Amoonguss: 534-630 (123.8 - 146.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock and Black Sludge recovery

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Supersonic Skystrike (160 BP) vs. 252 HP / 28 Def Tangrowth: 340-402 (84.1 - 99.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Supersonic Skystrike (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 212+ Def Tangrowth: 270-318 (66.9 - 78.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

The only one of those that can really live to tell the tale after switching into an Aqua Jet is Phys Def Tangrowth, but if you can hit it on the switchin, it dies to Play Rough afterwards. Similar story with Tapu Bulu: It outspeeds Azu, but it 100% dies to Skystrike if you can catch it on the switchin. 244 speed EVs allow Azu to outrun up to uninvested Mega Venusaur (iirc people haven't started speed creeping with that thing yet for anything).

Furthermore, even without +6 from Belly Drum or a Choice Band, Azu's Aqua Jet can still be a valuable form of priority. For example, it does over 70 to Volcarona, meaning that it can't set up and win with Rocks on the field. Liquidation still has a solid 2HKO on defensive Lando through Intimidate, and Azu's great defensive typing allows it to still check mons like Ash Gren and non-Gunk Protean Gren, as well as making choiced Latios think twice about clicking Draco.

Of course, as with most lures, the biggest advantage is breaking through defensive cores for other Pokemon. Mons like Greninja and Zygarde love having their biggest checks destroyed, and Azu can easily dispatch the annoying Grass-Types that give them trouble.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-743654146

Low-ladder replay, sure, but it demonstrates what this Azu set does best: breaking through Ground checks (in this case, Mega Venusaur) and letting Scarf Drill destroy the opponent's team.
Click to expand...
this is pretty cool tbh, though I feel like:
1) PerishTrap 'lures' and removes Grass-types a lot better and in general will remove more Pokemon.
2) However, saying that, because of PerishTrap becoming as popular as it did, people aren't mindlessly send their Grass-types into Azumarill anymore.
3) Regular Gyarados does this much better, has Dragon Dance, STAB Bounce and Moxie; the only niche this set really provides is Aqua Jet, but at +1 or +2 Speed Gyarados is pretty damn fast anyway.
4) Without a boosting method like Choice Band or Belly Drum, Azumarill is still pretty weak as a wallbreaker, only beating out Adamant Lando by like, 9 points even with Huge Power, Lando also has access to Swords Dance and Z-Fly. +1 regular Gyarados' Attack is also 87 points higher.

What I'm saying is that Azumarill is just too weak to justify unboosted, and Bounce is definitely the move to go if you want to fit Belly Drum and Bounce can't be used with Choice Band because you need the Z-Crystal.

That's just my two cents, I'm not saying that this thing is totally deadweight or anything, just seems like a lot outclasses the niche it is trying to fulfill here, it even outclasses itself with PerishTrap and, like with Mega-Latios, it is just too common of a lure for any decent opponent not to be wary of from team preview, otherwise the surprise factor could have made this thing somewhat usable for a while at least.
 
Last edited:
Agility Drizzle Pelipper
pelipper.gif

Pelipper @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 104 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 148 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Surf / Hydro Pump
- Hurricane
- Agility
- Roost / Defog / U-turn

Like a mad-man, I'm currently looking to build a rain team without Koko/Lucha or Ash-Greninja, so I was looking for offensive pressure in unusual places. This Pelipper set was one of the ideas I came up with.

Speed EVs are there to outspeed Mega-Lopunny at the +2. More can be used to outspeed Mega-Alakazam, Mega-Beedrill or +1 Base 80s like Mega-Gyarados, but Mega-Alakazam will have often traced Swift Swim anyway and other Swift Swim mons can be used to handle the latter two, outspeeding +1 base 100s isn't possible unfortunately. It will also outspeed low/no investment base 80s like Mega-Venusaur, which is pretty handy.

Other than that it's all bulk and max Special Attack, with Roost to recover bulk against a foe that does less than 50%, Defog as an option if you don't have/can't fit any other Defog user on your team, or U-turn for the conventional pivoting. Hydro Pump can be used to hit hard but Surf is more reliable, with the potent Water/Flying combo turning Pelipper into a cleaner late game.

252+ SpA Pelipper Surf vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Tapu Koko in Rain: 247-292 (87.9 - 103.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Pelipper Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tapu Bulu: 332-392 (118.1 - 139.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Pelipper Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Lopunny-Mega: 326-386 (120.2 - 142.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Pelipper Surf vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Volcarona in Rain: 374-444 (120.2 - 142.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Pelipper Hurricane vs. 248 HP / 156+ SpD Venusaur-Mega: 218-258 (60 - 71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Pelipper Hurricane vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Medicham-Mega: 366-432 (140.2 - 165.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Pelipper Surf vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-Therian in Rain: 474-558 (124 - 146%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Pelipper Hurricane vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Kartana: 382-450 (146.9 - 173%) -- guaranteed OHKO
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745197362 - Here's a little bit of late game cleaning. Even though Mega-Medicham misses with HJK, it wouldn't have got the KO anyway in addition to the Toxic damage, so the outcome would have been the same.

CritSwim Kingdra
kingdra.gif

Kingdra @ Scope Lens
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 28 HP / 252 SpA / 228 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Focus Energy
- Hydro Pump / Surf
- Draco Meteor
- Surf / Ice Beam

Here's another weird set made for the same reasons as above. I'm sure most of you are familiar with CritDra, using Sniper and Focus Energy for big crits, however as far as I can remember really applied this to Swift Swim variants. After a Focus Energy, this set constantly scores crits, meaning it ignores the SpAtk drop from Draco Meteor, with a crits on all attacks equaling the power of a +1 SpAtk or Specs boost - but keeping the ability to change moves, and also not being affected by Unaware like the +1 boost.

Speed is for outspeeding scarfed 110s by a single point, then max Special Attack and a little bulk. A physical attacking set could also be used, as it would ignore Intimidate drops. Kingdra has abysmal coverage unfortunately, Surf is can be taken for the sake of reliability reliable and Ice Beam can be used outside of rain for Lando or for Bulu. The typing means at least Ash-Greninja has a hard time exploiting your rain with the x4 Water resistance.

252+ SpA Kingdra Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Greninja-Ash on a critical hit: 373-441 (130.8 - 154.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Kingdra Surf vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Tapu Koko in Rain on a critical hit: 372-438 (132.3 - 155.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Kingdra Surf vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Kartana in Rain on a critical hit: 352-414 (135.3 - 159.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Skarmory on a critical hit: 316-373 (94.8 - 112%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Kingdra Surf vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Skarmory in Rain on a critical hit: 390-459 (117.1 - 137.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Kingdra Surf vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Quagsire in Rain on a critical hit: 414-487 (105 - 123.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Clefable in Rain on a critical hit: 390-459 (98.9 - 116.4%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Kingdra Draco Meteor vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Toxapex on a critical hit: 160-189 (52.8 - 62.3%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery
252+ SpA Kingdra Draco Meteor vs. 248 HP / 156+ SpD Venusaur-Mega on a critical hit: 195-229 (53.7 - 63%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 156 SpD Celesteela in Rain on a critical hit: 306-360 (77 - 90.6%) -- 25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
Same replay as above (http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745197362) shows the set, tanking a hit from Gren and setting up to score an OKHO (and obviously more if the timing of the rain had been different).

EDIT: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745229924 - Kingdra using both Draco Meteor and Surf to good effect (not sure what the opponent was doing with their AV Magearna though).

I'll upload so better/higher ladder replays for each if I get them, still ironing out the team tbh, but you get the idea.
 
Last edited:
In my time training in the mountains during my ban using exclusively dittotorn, I have created a set that perfects my team further and allows Scizor to deal with the rising Double Dance Zygarde which would beat it otherwise, this cuts through HO like a hot knife through butter too as they cannot deal with a Sciz simultaneously boosting Attack and Defense.

scizor-mega.gif

Scizor-Mega @ Scizorite
Ability: Light Metal
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Curse
- U-turn
- Bullet Punch
- Roost

Curse is huge for Scizor as it can bypass matchups that would be more difficult to handle like SubCoil Zygarde, opposing SD Scizors, SD Lando-T, Metronome Mamoswine, PuP Lopunny.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-744832174
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-744835109
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-744841239
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-744844973
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745540092
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745554473
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745607789
 
522.png

Victini @ Icium Z
Ability: Victory Star
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- V-create
- Glaciate
- Bolt Strike
- Power-Up Punch

This is a set I came up with a bit of theorymonning. With Z-Glaciate, Victini can lure in the ever-present Landorus-Therian and Zygarde. It learned Glaciate from an old event so that means you can only use Bolt Strike and not Fusion Bolt, but Victory Star increases the accuracy to 95%. Note that you have to be clever with V-Create because Lando-T outspeeds you after -1. Power-Up Punch is good if you are expecting a switch into something like Mew or Clefable.

4 SpA Victini Subzero Slammer (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-Therian: 416-492 (108.9 - 128.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Leftovers recovery
4 SpA Victini Subzero Slammer (120 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Zygarde: 360-428 (100.5 - 119.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745383125 - got Lando-T
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745520746 - got Chomp on the switch
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745617827 - got Zygarde
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-752775710 - with Power-Up Punch
 
Last edited:
Not from a high ladder rating, but had to share this, will hopefully post a higher replay soon but in the meantime maybe one of you guys can make use of it...

Psuedo Shift Gear Kartana
kartana.gif

Kartana @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Tailwind
- Leaf Blade
- Smart Strike / Night Slash
- Sacred Sword

So I was browsing through the sets in this thread, and saw Ske Mask The Slump God's Kartana set, and I dug it - it's a cool set, I guess think of this as an alternate version of that set. However my issue with double dance style sets is that they always they require quite a bit of set-up opportunity to obtain both boosts (granted not as much of an issue with Kartana due to Beast Boost, which is why Ske's set is still great), and more importantly they eat into coverage.

I recently had a Torn set on a team with Z-Hurricane and Tailwind, out of curiosity I looked Z-Tailwind does - +2 to the crit stage, like a Focus Energy - which means critting 50% of the time, not that great. So why is Z-Tailwind interesting to Kartana? Because Kartana has moves with an increased critical hit ratio (Night Slash, Psycho Cut and crucially Leaf Blade), meaning that these moves will score a critical hit every time when used. Why should you care? Because (a) critical hits naturally do more damage, equivalent to Band or +1 Atk, (b) critical hits ignore attack drops from Intimidate, in addition to defence boosts, (c) the crit damage will start stacking with attack gains from Beast Boost multiplicatively (which is insane, see below), and (d) your speed is doubled from Tailwind, making you outspeed pretty much every pokemon in the tier (Swift Swim users, the standard Lucha set, etc.).

The set is what you'd expect, Leaf Blade to abuse the increased crit ratio, Smart Strike or Night Slash (which deal equal damage, with either STAB or x1.5 from constant-crit, both at base 70), and Sacred Sword - giving necessary fighting coverage. Psycho Cut, while it also crits every time, doesn't provide much extra, as Leaf Blade still just about as hard against Pex. Remember moves that don't have an increased crit-ratio still crit half the time after the +2 crit from Tailwind, which is nice but a little unreliable.

-1 252 Atk Kartana Bloom Doom (175 BP) vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Landorus-Therian: 190-225 (49.7 - 58.9%) -- 75% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Landorus-Therian on a critical hit: 222-262 (58.1 - 68.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252 Atk Kartana Bloom Doom (175 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gyarados: 297-351 (89.7 - 106%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO
-1 252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gyarados on a critical hit: 345-406 (104.2 - 122.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Normal attack boosts stages:

252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 217-256 (77.2 - 91.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 324-382 (115.3 - 135.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 433-510 (154 - 181.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+3 252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 540-636 (192.1 - 226.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
...

Crit attack boosts stages:

252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko on a critical hit: 325-384 (115.6 - 136.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko on a critical hit: 486-573 (172.9 - 203.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko on a critical hit: 649-765 (230.9 - 272.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+3 252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko on a critical hit: 810-954 (288.2 - 339.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
...

And just for fun:

+6 252 Atk Kartana Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Swampert-Mega on a critical hit: 4156-4896 (1218.7 - 1435.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

While there's buckets of decent Kartana sets out there, I think this combination of power (that Intimidate doesn't work against), blazing speed and the capability to get even more out of hand due to crit + attack boost multiplicity is really cool, with the real issue being the shortness of Tailwind - but 3 turns is still enough to wreck face, and 109 speed tier is reasonable afterwards. Hopefully someone can make a better team around it than my lazy attempts.

Here's a replay of it savaging a rain team: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745734527

EDIT: And murdering Koko: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745758873

EDIT 2: I'm now slowly climbing the ladder with it, here's a better replay (starts turn 31): http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745830828

Here's also an updated set (previous post here):

DefSeed Clefable MK II
clefable.gif

Clefable @ Electric Seed
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Cosmic Power
- Stored Power
- Charge Beam
- Soft-Boiled

This set amalgamates the idea in my previous set of running a seed with BanDisnDatnMe's choice of Charge Beam and Cosmic Power. ESeed tends to be better than Grassy Seed if running Screens Koko, which I'd recommend, as with Screens up the defences are pretty much impenetrable after a couple of boosts (the ESeed granting +1 Def off the bat, meaning steels coming in as you Cosmic Power face +2 Def/+1 SpDef behind a Reflect).

Players can outboost the set with SD, but short of that (which isn't so easy with Screens in play) you really need Haze/Phazing/a lucky crit. It's an absurdly strong wincon that's very hard to prepare for, with Charge Beam granting you coverage to move past most dark types after a few boosts and Stored Power taking care of everything else. Replay is the same one posted directly above this set, which is KOed only by a crit, and would otherwise clean the team.

EDIT: A much better replay for the Clef set, feat taking out Greninja with Charge Beam: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-748586152
 
Last edited:
1526151023486.png

Celesteela @ Fightinium Z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Autotomize
- Superpower
- Earthquake
- Heavy Slam

Flames.. Why do people ignore the fact that this thing has a 120 BP physical STAB against most of the meta again?
All out Pummeling/Superpower smashes Ferrothorn, Kartana, Greninja and weakened Rotoms. EQ is for netural coverage and for things like Koko and Heatran. This just straight up beats a lot of the usual switch ins to special Z or defensive and gets the +1 Attack boost pretty reliably as a result.

Here's some replays
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745782580
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745791567 - this one in particular is nice because dude thought he could beat this 1v1 with CM Mag only to get tossed by EQ
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745808799
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745895071
 
Lord Wallace said:
View attachment 115394
Celesteela @ Fightinium Z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Autotomize
- Superpower
- Earthquake
- Heavy Slam

Flames.. Why do people ignore the fact that this thing has a 120 BP physical STAB against most of the meta again?
All out Pummeling/Superpower smashes Ferrothorn, Kartana, Greninja and weakened Rotoms. EQ is for netural coverage and for things like Koko and Heatran. This just straight up beats a lot of the usual switch ins to special Z or defensive and gets the +1 Attack boost pretty reliably as a result.

Here's some replays
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745782580
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745791567 - this one in particular is nice because dude thought he could beat this 1v1 with CM Mag only to get tossed by EQ
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745808799
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-745895071
Click to expand...

Does Heavy Slam stay 120 BP after Automotize in most cases? I'd like to see some calcs for this for a lightened Celesteela, because otherwise this seems like a flames set.
 
Miniature Pink Danger said:
Does Heavy Slam stay 120 BP after Automotize in most cases? I'd like to see some calcs for this for a lightened Celesteela, because otherwise this seems like a flames set.
Click to expand...

Oh yeah lol the weight drop from Autotomize is actually pretty irrelevant in most cases since it only drops Celesteela from 2200 lbs to 2000. In order for Heavy Slam to NOT be 120 BP a Pokemon has to be at least 400 lbs. Not many Pokemon in OU are that heavy, and those that are get bopped by coverage (like Heatran or Tyranitar). It's actually astounding how little it ends up mattering, Steela is that (literally) fat.
 
mellowyellowhd said:
the set is pretty hard walled by toxapex and zapdos - have you considered something like grassium z kartana or stone edge mpins alongside it to lure zapdos and to pressure pex?
Click to expand...

Umm I mean the set isn't meant to cover everything. Literally what Steela set doesn't get bopped by Zapdos and Pex?
Obviously you need team support still for those blind spots like any mon.
You also can't run Grassium Kartana with this....for obvious reasons
 
Miniature Pink Danger said:
Does Heavy Slam stay 120 BP after Automotize in most cases? I'd like to see some calcs for this for a lightened Celesteela, because otherwise this seems like a flames set.
Click to expand...


No, Heavy Slam's BP changes. I've tried to spot any actual meta relevant pokemon.

Hoopa-Unbound -> 60BP to 40BP (Earthquake actually does more anyway)
Zygarde -> 80BP to 60BP (This is potentially significant)
Hippowdown -> 80BP to 60BP (Not particularly common, but could have an impact)
Gyarados -> 100BP to 80BP (As one of the mons who resist all coverage moves and packs intimidate, this could be significant)
Volcanion/Magnezone/Suicune -> 120BP to 100BP (You're never clicking HS)

I think that covers all of them, realistically only Zygarde is affected by the changes.*

252 Atk Celesteela Heavy Slam (80 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Zygarde: 93-111 (25.9 - 31%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
+1 252 Atk Celesteela Heavy Slam (80 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Zygarde: 141-166 (39.3 - 46.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+2 252 Atk Celesteela Heavy Slam (80 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Zygarde: 186-220 (51.9 - 61.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Celesteela Magnet Bomb vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Zygarde: 70-84 (19.5 - 23.4%) -- possible 5HKO
+1 252 Atk Celesteela Magnet Bomb vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Zygarde: 105-124 (29.3 - 34.6%) -- 8.1% chance to 3HKO
+2 252 Atk Celesteela Magnet Bomb vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Zygarde: 141-166 (39.3 - 46.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Zygarde Thousand Arrows vs. 0 HP / 0+ Def Celesteela: 178-211 (53.1 - 62.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

The real difference is getting a 2HKO at +2, which is essential considering Zygard's ability to 2HKO you back. However, the chances are that your opp isn't gonna wait until you're at +2 attack to bring this thing in so in reality that calc becomes a little redundant. Zygarde's probably a mon you're gonna want to use your Z on if they're not paired with a bulky steel/water, anyway. Obviously, you just pair with a mon that threatens Zygarde as you won't cover all threats with Steela. Still interesting to consider, however.

*As I don't consider Gyarados/Hippowdon relevant enough
 
Specs Tran

heatran.gif


Heatran @ Choice Specs
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 80 HP / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Eruption
- Flamethrower
- Flash Cannon
- Earth Power

Heatran, especially with Zard Y Sun support, 2HKOs everything that is not immune to it. It really is very enjoyable to click Specs Eruption in Sun. I def. relieved some stress that way. EVs make sure you tank Focus Blast from Zard Y and you outspeed Rotom-W. Quiet is the necesarry type for Eruption to be legal.

Common Tran switchins such as Gliscor, Gastrodon and Earthquake Mega Latios bow down to this Set. Gastrodon and Gliscor are extremly common on high ladder atm so this Set can work as a surprisefactor.
Sadly no Stall matchup today :(


252+ SpA Choice Specs Heatran Eruption (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Latios-Mega in Sun: 288-339 (95.6 - 112.6%)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Heatran Eruption (150 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Gastrodon in Sun: 246-291 (57.8 - 68.4%)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Heatran Flamethrower vs. 244 HP / 152 SpD Gliscor in Sun: 382-451 (108.5 - 128.1%)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Heatran Eruption (150 BP) vs. 244 HP / 12 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Sun: 382-451 (54.4 - 64.2%)

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-748203318
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-748210972
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-748195455
 
Magearna @ Choice Specs
Ability: Soul-Heart
EVs: 168 HP / 252 SpA / 88 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fleur Cannon
- Volt Switch
- Focus Blast
- Flash Cannon

this set lets you use big damage to lure in common magearna switch ins. I built it on a team with 2 atk roost volcarona/ttar because Volt+Pursuit catches pex for a kill, magearna can bait tran with a focus blast, and fleur cannon 2hkos gastrodon without sacrificing a moveslot for energy ball. 88 speed is just to beat out mantine/skarm as well as 0 speed scizor-mega.

replay vs awful th1ngs where i lure him turn 1.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen7ou-377058
 
217.png


Ursaring @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Facade
- Fire Punch
- Earthquake

If Gastrodon can rise from PU to OU, so can Ursaring! (sike). Unlike its PU fellow, Ursaring pretty much can only be used in Offensive Trick Room. Brave nature with 0 speed investment makes the big teddy bear slower than fat annoying mons like Toxapex and Tangrowth (who are somewhat a nuisance vs TR). Flame Orb with Guts is the perfect combo that required little setup for Ursaring under Trick Room since you don't wanna waste a turn setting up with other mons like Alolan Marowak (weak to rocks). In case you forgot what Guts does, with Flame Orb, it gives Ursaring a free Choice Band boost, and combined with Facade, any teams without Steel or Ghosts essentially get OHKO or 2HKO by a STAB Boosted Facade (140 BP if burned). Swords Dance grants the bear to nuke an opposing mon even if it resists Facade. Earthquake allows Ursaring to deal with Heatrans and Toxapexes, and Fire Punch gets it the coverage to deal with Steels.Mega Camerupt is one the best partners for Ursaring as it can deal with Steels that Ursaring might have problems with.

Here are some calcs as to how scary the bear can be:

With just Guts+Flame Orb:
-1 252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Landorus-Therian: 195-231 (51 - 60.4%) -- 90.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Toxapex: 248-294 (81.8 - 97%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery
252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Fire Punch vs. 252 HP / 200+ Def Ferrothorn: 336-396 (95.4 - 112.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Facade (140 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Kyurem-Black: 376-444 (96.1 - 113.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 684-808 (177.6 - 209.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gastrodon: 345-406 (80.9 - 95.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

With Guts+Flame Orb+Swords Dance:
+1 252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Landorus-Therian: 439-517 (114.9 - 135.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
2 252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Fire Punch vs. 248 HP / 104+ Def Celesteela: 432-510 (108.8 - 128.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Sableye-Mega: 294-346 (97 - 114.1%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Fire Punch vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 306-362 (91.8 - 108.7%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Guts Ursaring Facade (140 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gyarados-Mega: 349-412 (105.4 - 124.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO


Replays (will probably add more for more quality):
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-748594879 (OHKOs Kyurem-B from full, opponent didn't really have a switch in to the teddy bear)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-735228174 (against Snou as part of the Iron Chef challenge. Didn't win, but Ursaring was putting in work)
https://play.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-gen7ou-749010791 (cleans the rest of the team)
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top